where to go next with speakers

[Zoidburg]

Hi all I'm looking for some advice on some new (to me) speakers. My current IPL TL speakers are great but I've had them about 3 years now and I fancy a change, however im not sure what I should be thinking of auditioning. So here's a few statements on my current set up

My room is approx. 5 x 4 m with a 2.8m high ceiling.
The speakers will fire down the longer length of the room
They will need to function well with minimal space behind them (600mm max maybe).
It would be ideal if they were no more than 300 to 400mm wide due to constraints of surrounding kit.
I am open to the use of floor or stand mount speakers. Ideally they would be visually appealing too.
I listen to a wide variety of music from jazz to funk to rock to hip hop and dance.
I do not listen at terribly loud levels due to thin walls / neighbours.
Id like a realistic presentation with nothing OTT but good soundstage and imaging.
Speakers will be used with a big S/S amp (jungson JA88d) initially though this may also change in time.
My budget is £800 for new or 2nd hand but must include stands if necessary. If I could find a new speaker offered on a 0% interest deal id happily go north of £1200 but not by much.

Sorry if this is all rather general but I guess im just looking for some decent pointers so ive got an idea what to consider. So far been scanning the classifieds and ebay but apart from some local PMC floorstanders I've not seen much that's really floated my boat. I do like the look of the Quad S4 speaker but don't know if they are any good, my local hifi shop is trying to get a demo pair in for me to listen to but they are not sure when that will be.

Anyway any advice will be of great help.

cheers,

Ben

[Sherwood]

Hi all I'm looking for some advice on some new (to me) speakers. My current IPL TL speakers are great but I've had them about 3 years now and I fancy a change, however im not sure what I should be thinking of auditioning. So here's a few statements on my current set up

My room is approx. 5 x 4 m with a 2.8m high ceiling.
The speakers will fire down the longer length of the room
They will need to function well with minimal space behind them (600mm max maybe).
It would be ideal if they were no more than 300 to 400mm wide due to constraints of surrounding kit.
I am open to the use of floor or stand mount speakers. Ideally they would be visually appealing too.
I listen to a wide variety of music from jazz to funk to rock to hip hop and dance.
I do not listen at terribly loud levels due to thin walls / neighbours.
Id like a realistic presentation with nothing OTT but good soundstage and imaging.
Speakers will be used with a big S/S amp (jungson JA88d) initially though this may also change in time.
My budget is £800 for new or 2nd hand but must include stands if necessary. If I could find a new speaker offered on a 0% interest deal id happily go north of £1200 but not by much.

Sorry if this is all rather general but I guess im just looking for some decent pointers so ive got an idea what to consider. So far been scanning the classifieds and ebay but apart from some local PMC floorstanders I've not seen much that's really floated my boat. I do like the look of the Quad S4 speaker but don't know if they are any good, my local hifi shop is trying to get a demo pair in for me to listen to but they are not sure when that will be.

Anyway any advice will be of great help.

cheers,

Ben

Superb speaker! Owned a pair before I purchased my Maggie 1.7s. Assuming your amp is OK with low impedance speakers it looks as if it has the muscle to drive them. They will work fine with 2 feet of space behind them and being a panel will not project as far into the room as a box speaker. You may even find you can pull them a bit further into the room. If not they respond well to a bit of simple room treatment on the wall behind (i.e. curtains or an inexpensive Ikea rug as a wall hanging). The owner has followed my Magnepan upgrade path and looks to have taken care of them well. With the original packing and an outer cocoon of bubble wrap they should ship safely.

https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-anzeige/magneplanar-magnepan-mg12-erstbesitzer-sehr-guter-zustand/584978678-172-1794

[Sherwood]

Hi all I'm looking for some advice on some new (to me) speakers. My current IPL TL speakers are great but I've had them about 3 years now and I fancy a change, however im not sure what I should be thinking of auditioning. So here's a few statements on my current set up

My room is approx. 5 x 4 m with a 2.8m high ceiling.
The speakers will fire down the longer length of the room
They will need to function well with minimal space behind them (600mm max maybe).
It would be ideal if they were no more than 300 to 400mm wide due to constraints of surrounding kit.
I am open to the use of floor or stand mount speakers. Ideally they would be visually appealing too.
I listen to a wide variety of music from jazz to funk to rock to hip hop and dance.
I do not listen at terribly loud levels due to thin walls / neighbours.
Id like a realistic presentation with nothing OTT but good soundstage and imaging.
Speakers will be used with a big S/S amp (jungson JA88d) initially though this may also change in time.
My budget is £800 for new or 2nd hand but must include stands if necessary. If I could find a new speaker offered on a 0% interest deal id happily go north of £1200 but not by much.

Sorry if this is all rather general but I guess im just looking for some decent pointers so ive got an idea what to consider. So far been scanning the classifieds and ebay but apart from some local PMC floorstanders I've not seen much that's really floated my boat. I do like the look of the Quad S4 speaker but don't know if they are any good, my local hifi shop is trying to get a demo pair in for me to listen to but they are not sure when that will be.

Anyway any advice will be of great help.

cheers,

Ben

Sorry, just noticed they are only for collection. You might see if the owner will ship or why not have a trip to Germany!

[Firebottle]

I've got these for sale at the moment:
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?48739-FS-Magneplanar-MS1-6QR-(quasi-ribbon)

Within budget and exceptional imaging :)
Will work well with 600mm space behind them.

:)

[Zoidburg]

cheers for the suggestions so far...............I know nothing about the Maggie's so I'm off to investigate further.

Keep em coming folks:D

[Sherwood]

cheers for the suggestions so far...............I know nothing about the Maggie's so I'm off to investigate further.

Keep em coming folks:D

They suffer from the usual problems of stupid US exchange rates and shipping costs. However, even then, they are one of the best bargains in Hifi! With adequate amplification they offer a phenomally realistic presentation. Superb detail, lightning fast transients, class leading imaging, and realistic tonality. With a good amp, bass is solid and of good quality with excellent presentation of timbre. The MG12 is about 2/3 of the size of the 1.6 and more domestically acceptable to some. However, the 1.6 is the better speaker if your room can accommodate it.

[ianlenco]

My recommendation would be a pair of Neat Motive SX2 speakers.

http://www.neat.co.uk/p_pages/images/MotiveSX2pair.JPG

I've had quite a few speakers through here over the years including Proac Responses (SC1, 2.5, 1.5) and big Dynaudios but the Neats are the first to achieve two things, great sound and wife approval :)
The top is sweet, detail superb and even the bass is a surprise from such small cabinets. Downward firing ports mean they work well not far out from the wall, mine are about 60cm out and have a superb soundstage, deep and wide. My room is a little bigger than yours so should work fine for you.
Dimensions are (HxWxD) 765/160/200mm so well within your requirements.
OK, new they are nearly £1500 but they pop up on ebay from time to time and I paid considerably less than that last year. (Mine are not for sale :) )

Good hunting

[Zoidburg]

My recommendation would be a pair of Neat Motive SX2 speakers.

http://www.neat.co.uk/p_pages/images/MotiveSX2pair.JPG

I've had quite a few speakers through here over the years including Proac Responses (SC1, 2.5, 1.5) and big Dynaudios but the Neats are the first to achieve two things, great sound and wife approval :)
The top is sweet, detail superb and even the bass is a surprise from such small cabinets. Downward firing ports mean they work well not far out from the wall, mine are about 60cm out and have a superb soundstage, deep and wide. My room is a little bigger than yours so should work fine for you.
Dimensions are (HxWxD) 765/160/200mm so well within your requirements.
OK, new they are nearly £1500 but they pop up on ebay from time to time and I paid considerably less than that last year. (Mine are not for sale :) )

Good hunting

I must admit that the Neats are something im v interesting in hearing so thanks for the recommendation.

[plastic penguin]

Hi all I'm looking for some advice on some new (to me) speakers. My current IPL TL speakers are great but I've had them about 3 years now and I fancy a change, however im not sure what I should be thinking of auditioning. So here's a few statements on my current set up

My room is approx. 5 x 4 m with a 2.8m high ceiling.
The speakers will fire down the longer length of the room
They will need to function well with minimal space behind them (600mm max maybe).
It would be ideal if they were no more than 300 to 400mm wide due to constraints of surrounding kit.
I am open to the use of floor or stand mount speakers. Ideally they would be visually appealing too.
I listen to a wide variety of music from jazz to funk to rock to hip hop and dance.
I do not listen at terribly loud levels due to thin walls / neighbours.
Id like a realistic presentation with nothing OTT but good soundstage and imaging.
Speakers will be used with a big S/S amp (jungson JA88d) initially though this may also change in time.
My budget is £800 for new or 2nd hand but must include stands if necessary. If I could find a new speaker offered on a 0% interest deal id happily go north of £1200 but not by much.

Sorry if this is all rather general but I guess im just looking for some decent pointers so ive got an idea what to consider. So far been scanning the classifieds and ebay but apart from some local PMC floorstanders I've not seen much that's really floated my boat. I do like the look of the Quad S4 speaker but don't know if they are any good, my local hifi shop is trying to get a demo pair in for me to listen to but they are not sure when that will be.

Anyway any advice will be of great help.

cheers,

Ben

Used to know a person who owned IPL speakers. Deffo dem, if in budget, ATC new range of SCMs. I've heard the previous models and they are great with a gutsy amplifier.

[paulf-2007]

Zu omen or the more expensive models. I have mine in a tiny room less than a foot from back wall and almost touching the side walls. Room is well treated mind but is very small. Contact Zu and tell them the size of your room and amplifier and they will tell you what will work best. Quite rare used and not cheap new but well worth buying.

[nthall]

The Klipsch RF-82 ii is hard to beat for the price. They work for music and AV, and don't need a ton of power. The price has came down on new ones considerably too.

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[alphaGT]

I've always admired the Quad 22L2 and now the 23L, great sound and gorgeous cabinets, decent prices on used ones. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170123/3bde27e114a6de05bbab026e7a98e5f7.jpg


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[Zoidburg]

I've always admired the Quad 22L2 and now the 23L, great sound and gorgeous cabinets, decent prices on used ones. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170123/3bde27e114a6de05bbab026e7a98e5f7.jpg


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I heard the Quad L22 a few years ago and didn't really get on with them, at the time they were ex demo and the price reflected that, but I found them a bit dull and uninteresting. Great looking speakers though.

[alphaGT]

I heard the Quad L22 a few years ago and didn't really get on with them, at the time they were ex demo and the price reflected that, but I found them a bit dull and uninteresting. Great looking speakers though.

That may be, I heard them powered by a rather large amp, 200 or 250 watts per side. So perhaps it takes a bit to wake them up? Demos and salons can be tricky to get a good reflection of a speaker, you never know until you get it home. Another speaker I actually owned was the Vandersteen 2C's and they were larger than the speakers being suggested in this post, but they were very good! I lived with them happily for many years with several different amps.


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[walpurgis]

I heard the Quad L22 a few years ago and didn't really get on with them, at the time they were ex demo and the price reflected that, but I found them a bit dull and uninteresting. Great looking speakers though.

I have to agree. I've not heard any non electrostatic Quad speaker that I've liked so far.

[Spectral Morn]

I would stick with stand mount speakers, I think your room is too small a space to use floor-standers I think there will be bass/imaging issues if you do.

You should never buy speakers without trying them in the room and on the end of the amp/system, to not do so is asking for trouble. Theory is great but often doesn't work and all rooms/system behave differently, what works in one space may well not in another.

Concrete floor and a high ceiling/solid walls might help a bit, but if suspended and boast walls then there will be more potential issues.

[struth]

Had a set of quad floorstanders.. single driver version. 21l i think...i thought them quite good on a big amp like my mf. Not so good on others. Need a bit of driving i guess. And yes they look fab too but easy to damage and show every fingerprint

[Sherwood]

The suggestions made so far are extremely diverse: at one extreme the Klipsch model the other the Maggies. I think you need to clarify what you are looking for in a speaker. Your IPL transmission lines will have a weighty low end response but like most TL designs are probably not that agile in the bass. I have found Klipsch speakers to be impressive on first hearing but could not live with their "shouty" dynamics. I disagree with the comment that you should avoid floor standers. In reality, they take up no more floor space than a "bookshelf" on substantial stands. Yes your room is not that big but it is large enough to accomodate any of the speakers suggested here. If I were starting out in hifi again I would probably go for the modern equivalent of my 40 year old Rogers LS35a speakers and choose something like the Kef LS50s. These will sound completely different from your IPLs but come very close to the best features of panel and electrostatic speakers in a box design. Even if you do not go for the LS50s it is worth trying to get a home demo to determine whether you can get on with a fast detailed modern speaker compared to your current speakers. I would also see if you can hear a pair of Maggies with your own amp.

[Haselsh1]

Agreed that floorstanders take up the same floor space as stand mounts but floorstanders can have serious integration issues in smaller rooms. That is one of the reasons I am now considering stand mounts in my 14' by 20' room. I do not consider this room OK for floorstanders.

[Sherwood]

If a pair of transmission line speakers works in that room then I reckon that other floorstanders will too. More about the specific speaker than it being a floorstander per se!

[Zoidburg]

The suggestions made so far are extremely diverse: at one extreme the Klipsch model the other the Maggies. I think you need to clarify what you are looking for in a speaker. Your IPL transmission lines will have a weighty low end response but like most TL designs are probably not that agile in the bass. I have found Klipsch speakers to be impressive on first hearing but could not live with their "shouty" dynamics. I disagree with the comment that you should avoid floor standers. In reality, they take up no more floor space than a "bookshelf" on substantial stands. Yes your room is not that big but it is large enough to accomodate any of the speakers suggested here. If I were starting out in hifi again I would probably go for the modern equivalent of my 40 year old Rogers LS35a speakers and choose something like the Kef LS50s. These will sound completely different from your IPLs but come very close to the best features of panel and electrostatic speakers in a box design. Even if you do not go for the LS50s it is worth trying to get a home demo to determine whether you can get on with a fast detailed modern speaker compared to your current speakers. I would also see if you can hear a pair of Maggies with your own amp.

I guess the highlighted text above sums up the IPS' reasonably well, id like to hope that I could get something that has a slightly tighter more controlled bottom end and that are possibly smaller in size and visually attractive.

[Sherwood]

I guess the highlighted text above sums up the IPS' reasonably well, id like to hope that I could get something that has a slightly tighter more controlled bottom end and that are possibly smaller in size and visually attractive.

In that case I would suggest you start by hearing a pair of LS50s on good stands in your room. They are polar opposites to your IPLs and in that respect will help you better determine what is important to you in a speaker.

[nthall]

Floor standers work fine in a small room. Having forward firing woofers makes dealing with bass response easier in my opinion.

That said. I'm not a big fan of transmission line speakers. I think it's an interesting gimmick, but doesn't compare to actually moving some air. Multi driver speakers are easier to tune to compensate for imbalances in frequency response.

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[struth]

Rega rx3 gets a good name as does the sonus faber toy towers

[Spectral Morn]

Agreed that floorstanders take up the same floor space as stand mounts but floorstanders can have serious integration issues in smaller rooms. That is one of the reasons I am now considering stand mounts in my 14' by 20' room. I do not consider this room OK for floorstanders.

Exactly my experience too, in the past.

Plenty of enthusiastic suggestions that have worked well for folks in their environments and systems, that is not necessarily going to work in yours.

[nthall]

14' x 20' isn't exactly a small listening room. Which wall are you planning on putting the speakers on? I'm assuming the 14' one.

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[wee tee cee]

Ben,
What about Frugel 3s that Steve at Electric beach makes. Would fit your parameters regards placement and your music taste/cost. Steve makes them to order finish wise.

They do sound staging and delicacy very close to 57s with a bass quality and quantity that is way beyond what you would expect.

[pgarrish]

Ben

I can ask the people coming to mine next month if they have any speakers they would bring, it might be useful for you.

[Zoidburg]

Yes speakers will be on the slightly smaller wall firing down the longer length of the room.

[Macca]

The room is 18 x 12 isn't it? That is not that small in UK terms. If it will take big IPLs then it will cope with most floorstanders. A lot of them go no lower in the bass than a big standmount anyway. I don't agree that you can just lump speakers into floor or stand mount anyway. Way too much variation.

You could consider some Yamaha NS1000M. In budget, agile bass, need to be close to a wall.

I'd avoid a two and a half way like the Klipsch. I think you will find that a step back from what you have in terms of midrange clarity.

[Zoidburg]

Ben

I can ask the people coming to mine next month if they have any speakers they would bring, it might be useful for you.

That would be amazing thanks Paul I'd be very interested in hearing / seeing some options if other members are up for it.

[Zoidburg]

The room is 18 x 12 isn't it? That is not that small in UK terms. If it will take big IPLs then it will cope with most floorstanders. A lot of them go no lower in the bass than a big standmount anyway. I don't agree that you can just lump speakers into floor or stand mount anyway. Way too much variation.

You could consider some Yamaha NS1000M. In budget, agile bass, need to be close to a wall.

I'd avoid a two and a half way like the Klipsch. I think you will find that a step back from what you have in terms of midrange clarity.

Iv just run a tape over the room and it's a bit smaller than I thought :D it's actually 3.8m x 4m but one end of the room has a large arch in it leading to the dining room.

I'd really be v interested in the ns1000m but I think I'd maybe struggle to get them in here. Probably a narrower floorstander would be an easier proposition. However the yamahas I heard at a bake off last year sounded very good indeed.

[struth]

Yes thats not big, and arch could cause some issues depending. I,d probably go for standmounts tbh with front ports. Used to have a nice set of focals that would likely have been ok

[Zoidburg]

Ben,
What about Frugel 3s that Steve at Electric beach makes. Would fit your parameters regards placement and your music taste/cost. Steve makes them to order finish wise.

They do sound staging and delicacy very close to 57s with a bass quality and quantity that is way beyond what you would expect.

Very interesting suggestion cheers Tony, I've seen various pairs of the fugelhorns but never thought they might suit me. Il have to try and track some down.

[wee tee cee]

Ben,
Mine are bespoke keepers.

I use 57s in my main set up.

Spendor SP1s in my front room(again keepers but maybe too bass light for you) sublime lifetime speakers-just gorgeous sonically.

Had the Frugels in play over Christmas-they do bass VERY well indeed.......just a thought!!!(my son loves them to bits and has a shit fit when I borrow/blag them from his room)

[Macca]

Iv just run a tape over the room and it's a bit smaller than I thought :D it's actually 3.8m x 4m but one end of the room has a large arch in it leading to the dining room.

I'd really be v interested in the ns1000m but I think I'd maybe struggle to get them in here. Probably a narrower floorstander would be an easier proposition. However the yamahas I heard at a bake off last year sounded very good indeed.

Sorry man I struggle with metric, doesn't your tape measure have feet and inches on it? ;)

So with the arch into the other room you actually have quite a big space for the speakers to 'see', as it where. That is why the IPL work I guess. Brick up that opening and they would be too much in the bass. So you don't need to worry on that score. It is the slim and close to wall requirement that narrows the field.

[RichB]

Hi, I'm selling these which may fit the bill.

If you're in Liverpool I could meet you halfway with them.

http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?47891-FS-Rega-RS5-loudspeakers-in-Cherry

[Gazjam]

Wonderful sounding speakers, heard them at the last NEBO meet and were one of the highlights for me.
Had their baby brothers the RS3's and had to dig deep to substantially improve them, the 5's will be even better.

[Zoidburg]

Hi, I'm selling these which may fit the bill.

If you're in Liverpool I could meet you halfway with them.

http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?47891-FS-Rega-RS5-loudspeakers-in-Cherry

Cheers Rich I will give them some consideration, I think a place local to me has rega speakers so il try and pop in at the weekend for a listen if possible.

[paulf-2007]

Floor standers work fine in a small room. Having forward firing woofers makes dealing with bass response easier in my opinion.

That said. I'm not a big fan of transmission line speakers. I think it's an interesting gimmick, but doesn't compare to actually moving some air. Multi driver speakers are easier to tune to compensate for imbalances in frequency response.

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I agree, the room size has nothing to do with whether it's floor standers or stand mounts. My room is 9' X 7' with a vaulted ceiling and room treatment. The Zu omen look huge but sound wonderful. I had a visit from a friend on lenco heaven who uses BD design front horns and large bass speakers and he commented on how surprised he was to see my small room and how good it sounded. I know most people can't get away with room treatment in their living rooms but it can done discretely and be the best money you could ever spend.

[nthall]

I think you could get away with just about anything other than open baffles in a room that size.

If your set on stands I would try some type of forward ported MTMs.

The Klipsch speakers have a very detailed mid-range. They just aren't light on the highs and lows. It's nothing like the sound out of a pair of TLs. They can be harsh with certain cartridges. Particularly the AT ones

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[nthall]

I agree, the room size has nothing to do with whether it's floor standers or stand mounts. My room is 9' X 7' with a vaulted ceiling and room treatment. The Zu omen look huge but sound wonderful. I had a visit from a friend on lenco heaven who uses BD design front horns and large bass speakers and he commented on how surprised he was to see my small room and how good it sounded. I know most people can't get away with room treatment in their living rooms but it can done discretely and be the best money you could ever spend.
My room treatment is floor to ceiling shelves full of vinyl on every wall other than the one the speakers are on.

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[Zoidburg]

Thanks for all the suggestions so far folks.

At the weekend I have an appointment at my local dealer to audition a few pairs of stand mount and floor standing speakers. Im veering towards stand mounters but really this is just to give me an idea of what to expect / if I actually like the sound of them. They offer home demo too so I might see if I can blag something for a long weekend maybe.

I'm certainly not going to rush into actually buying anything as in few weeks I will also hopefully get a chance to hear a selection of speakers at Paul NW bake off.

Anyway its a start and its better than sitting at work looking at pictures of speakers all day:D

[alcarmichael]

I absolutely love my B&W 805N's. They sound great, allowing me to listen for hours and they look nice too - even my girlfriend likes the look of them.

Think you'll have to be lucky to try a set in your system before buying though.

[Lawrence001]

I got a pair of Celestion A1s a few weeks ago, totally blown away by their smooth but detailed treble from the titanium tweeter and good bass for standmounts (of the bigger variety, 8" cones). Rear ported but 24" of space behind them shouldn't be a problem. A pair in great condition should be under £300.

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[Zoidburg]

Jbl l40 are next up, collecting in a couple of weeks.

[WAD62]

Jbl l40 are next up, collecting in a couple of weeks.

Which IPL speakers do you have?

I have a pair of S5tl mk2s, and will not be looking to replace them for some considerable time...if ever! :)

[Zoidburg]

Which IPL speakers do you have?

I have a pair of S5tl mk2s, and will not be looking to replace them for some considerable time...if ever! :)
Mine are the s2tl I think. Have a look in the sales section for more details!


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[WAD62]

Mine are the s2tl I think. Have a look in the sales section for more details!


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How big is your listening room?

[Zoidburg]

How big is your listing room?
About 4.5m square, the wall opposite the speakers has a large opening into our dining room though.

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