View Full Version : Isolation feet - what are you using under your gear?
RobbieGong
08-01-2017, 17:55
What are you using under your amp, cd etc ?
I like the idea of wood between the equipment and my glass shelves - any recommendations ?
I like the look of some panzerwood ones I've seen but daft money.
ElectricBeach Rockin Rollers
RobbieGong
08-01-2017, 18:11
ElectricBeach Rockin Rollers
Thanks Grant, those do look interesting.
Electricbeach Rockin Rollers eh, I thought you were taking the mick at first :lol:
Me? lol. I'm using the original ones. the version 2 can only be had from Mark Grant I think. They are excellent by way
Arkless Electronics
08-01-2017, 18:31
What are you using under your amp, cd etc ?
I like the idea of wood between the equipment and my glass shelves - any recommendations ?
I like the look of some panzerwood ones I've seen but daft money.
Nowt. It's unnecessary.
RobbieGong
08-01-2017, 18:38
Nowt. It's unnecessary.
Why Unecessary Jez ?
Wakefield Turntables
08-01-2017, 19:32
Nowt. It's unnecessary.
Yeah, I'd like to hear this explained Jez, could stop me wasting some money.
RobbieGong
08-01-2017, 19:40
Yeah, I'd like to hear this explained Jez, could stop me wasting some money.
Me too :lol:
Arkless Electronics
08-01-2017, 19:45
Oh I ain't going there :D
Wakefield Turntables
08-01-2017, 19:55
Oh I ain't going there :D
That's quite unfortunate.
Stryder5
09-01-2017, 08:02
Kinda pointless, being contentious then backing out!
RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 08:22
Kinda pointless, being contentious then backing out!
I didn't take it as Jez being contentious Gary.
It was pretty clear to me that he's saying he doesn't go for the idea, a bit like those who are not into the idea of cables etc and that's cool.
For that reason I don't feel he has to explain - its cool and life's too short :)
Stryder5
09-01-2017, 08:53
I didn't take it as Jez being contentious Gary.
It was pretty clear to me that he's saying he doesn't go for the idea, a bit like those who are not into the idea of cables etc and that's cool.
For that reason I don't feel he has to explain - its cool and life's too short :)
Then why did you ask for an explanation?
farflungstar
09-01-2017, 09:10
I think we shouldn't criticise those manufacturers who have a different opinion from our own regarding component isolation, mechanically or even magnetically. A lot of people, myself included think that adequate isolation of components us sensible, and more so with TT and valve amplification.
Although I haven't tried it I'm sure I might hear something if I sat there tapping caps or transistors while playing music - but resonance in room during play are of a magnitude smaller - but still worth avoiding if possible, especially depending on location in room and support material.
Adey
Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk
RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 09:11
Then why did you ask for an explanation?
Obviously because I was curious as to what his reasons might be.
It's clear by his later response (post 9) that he doesnt want to go there and as I say that's fine with me. There are plenty of other members on the forum..... ;)
Stryder5
09-01-2017, 09:18
Obviously because I was curious as to what his reasons might be.
It's clear by his later response (post 9) that he doesnt want to go there and as I say that's fine with me. There are plenty of other members on the forum..... ;)
I agree that everyone has an opinion and be beyond criticism, which is the case in this sequence.
RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 10:03
I agree that everyone has an opinion and be beyond criticism, which is the case in this sequence.
Not quite sure what you mean but what is there to criticize ? If he doesn't want to go into the whole explanation thing then that's fine (cables, isolation can be a bone of contention which he's probably trying to avoid - no probs) or do you want him hung drawn and quartered :scratch: :lol:
farflungstar
09-01-2017, 10:19
I was trying to avoid a potential repetition of the cable thread. Everyone has an opinion and asking for explanations and suggesting someone is being contentious sounded like it was going to escalate. I think we can all give our opinion based on 'our' experience but should avoid assuming it's true for everyone.
Peace, love and free marijuana for everyone man...
Adey
Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk
RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 10:23
I was trying to avoid a potential repetition of the cable thread. Everyone has an opinion and asking for explanations and suggesting someone is being contentious sounded like it was going to escalate. I think we can all give our opinion based on 'our' experience but should avoid assuming it's true for everyone.
Peace, love and free marijuana for everyone man...
Adey
Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk
Amen to that - well peace and love that is :lol:
Stryder5
09-01-2017, 11:47
:scratch:
Not quite sure what you mean but what is there to criticize ? If he doesn't want to go into the whole explanation thing then that's fine (cables, isolation can be a bone of contention which he's probably trying to avoid - no probs) or do you want him hung drawn and quartered :scratch: :lol:
I never said anyone was being criticised, quite the opposite, I havn't threatened anyone with violence, no idea where that came from, and I'm pretty sure people can speak for themselves.:scratch:
RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 11:57
:scratch:
I never said anyone was being criticised, quite the opposite, I havn't threatened anyone with violence, no idea where that came from, and I'm pretty sure people can speak for themselves.:scratch:
Gary, I didnt say you said anyone was being critised or that you've threatened violence either -Your communication is confusing - take a chill pill :rolleyes:
walpurgis
09-01-2017, 12:02
Steady lads. Keep it nice.
RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 12:06
Steady lads. Keep it nice.
Always the aim with me Geoff as you know - I do wonder sometimes though :)
Stryder5
09-01-2017, 12:08
Steady lads. Keep it nice.
No problem thanks:)
Spectral Morn
09-01-2017, 12:37
RDC cones and platforms. String Concepts platforms, Clear Light Audio Racks, BrightStar Audio Isonodes.
Ikea Bamboo butchers blocks have been written about as being good isolation platforms - read here http://www.theaudiobeat.com/blog/ikea_aptitlig.htm. I bought one to try but haven't got round to it yet.
2 schools of thought on this. One is that every component is capable of having its performance changed by what it sits on. The other is that only components susceptible to vibration - like a turntable - can be affected by what they sit on.
The second school of thought is the logical, textbook one. It is the one I am inclined to agree with. I mean how can what a solid state power amp, for example, sits on possible affect its performance? Except that in my own experience I reckon I have heard differences when siting components such as cd players and solid state amplifiers on various surfaces and materials. Not big differences, very subtle differences. Subtle enough that it could be imagination? Yes, maybe. Nevertheless it bugs me. I recall siting a power amp on some rubberised anti-vibration feet designed for washing machines. I quickly removed them as I was convinced It made the sound worse from the first few bars of the test-track.
In any case to answer the o/p - I currently don't use anything except the feet the equipment came with, but based on previous experimentation I reckon wooden supports of some type are the way to go.
RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 13:13
RDC cones and platforms. String Concepts platforms, Clear Light Audio Racks, BrightStar Audio Isonodes.
Ikea Bamboo butchers blocks have been written about as being good isolation platforms - read here http://www.theaudiobeat.com/blog/ikea_aptitlig.htm. I bought one to try but haven't got round to it yet.
Very interesting Neil and not daft money either...
RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 13:20
2 schools of thought on this. One is that every component is capable of having its performance changed by what it sits on. The other is that only components susceptible to vibration - like a turntable - can be affected by what they sit on.
The second school of thought is the logical, textbook one. It is the one I am inclined to agree with. I mean how can what a solid state power amp, for example, sits on possible affect its performance? Except that in my own experience I reckon I have heard differences when siting components such as cd players and solid state amplifiers on various surfaces and materials. Not big differences, very subtle differences. Subtle enough that it could be imagination? Yes, maybe. Nevertheless it bugs me. I recall siting a power amp on some rubberised anti-vibration feet designed for washing machines. I quickly removed them as I was convinced It made the sound worse from the first few bars of the test-track.
In any case to answer the o/p - I currently don't use anything except the feet the equipment came with, but based on previous experimentation I reckon wooden supports of some type are the way to go.
My thoughts exactly too Martin.
I really like the look of these Panzerwood pointy spikes for under my amp and cd and have a hunch they would be good but cant justify the price
My thoughts exactly too Martin.
I really like the look of these Panzerwood pointy spikes for under my amp and cd and have a hunch they would be good but cant justify the price
Yes the prices can be silly and are totally unjustified as there is no science to back them up, therefore no R&D costs and the actual material content is pennies. I've been intending to make my own supports by simply cutting blocks from a strip of 2x2, as soon as I find a suitable length of wood in a skip.
Isolation feet? Does 16 'phases' of Mana [and therein about 150 stainless steel spikes] count? :D
Marco.
RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 14:48
Isolation feet? Does 16 'phases' of Mana [and therein about 150 stainless steel spikes] count? :D
Marco.
:eek: Thats were ya going wrong Marco mate, all that steel ! - sonic nightmare fella :lol:
ha ha !! Just jivin wit ya :)
Just had these cable isolation supports made at work. Not sure if they will have an effect but worth a try as they cost nothing!
http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k424/Spendorsp2/image_zpszz8edpa6.jpeg (http://s326.photobucket.com/user/Spendorsp2/media/image_zpszz8edpa6.jpeg.html)
:eek: Thats were ya going wrong Marco mate, all that steel ! - sonic nightmare fella :lol:
ha ha !! Just jivin wit ya :)
Hehehehe... Non-magnetic SS spikes, I may add, as is the 6-tier stand that sits upon them - and yes, they all combine to provide a (clearly audible, easily repeatable) sonic improvement ;)
Marco.
Not sure if they will have an effect...
Oh the effect is guaranteed: they'll clutter up your floor nicely! :D
Marco.
RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 15:16
Hehehehe... Non-magnetic SS spikes, I may add, as is the 6-tier stand that sits upon them - and yes, it all provides a (clearly audible, easily repeatable) sonic improvement ;)
Marco.
When I have your dosh Marco it will be a tall version of one of these for my set up :D https://quadraspire.co.uk/xreference.html daft money but oh so nice :drool:
I think your right Marco:lol:
Nice one, Rob. They're good. I've used them before to great effect. Let me know before you order, as I'll get a discount from Larry (from The AudioWorks). He's the best guy to buy any QS stuff from :)
Marco.
RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 15:20
Nice one, Rob. They're good. I've used them before to great effect. Let me know before you order, as I'll get a discount from Larry (from The AudioWorks). He's the best guy to buy any QS stuff from :)
Marco.
Cheers Marco, I'll remember that :)
I think your right Marco:lol:
Lol... I've tried them before, when I used to experiment with stuff like that. Couldn't hear any difference, and the buggers would always keep falling over, when you walked anywhere near them, so they were eventually used for fire wood!
Marco.
Cheers Marco, I'll remember that :)
No worries, dude :cool:
Marco.
RothwellAudio
09-01-2017, 16:04
2 schools of thought on this. One is that every component is capable of having its performance changed by what it sits on. The other is that only components susceptible to vibration - like a turntable - can be affected by what they sit on.
The second school of thought is the logical, textbook one. It is the one I am inclined to agree with. I mean how can what a solid state power amp, for example, sits on possible affect its performance?
The second school of thought is the one I'm inclined to agree with too, but I must point out that solid-state electronic circuits are susceptible to vibration. Surface-mount electronic components seem to be more susceptible and that might be due to their construction and the way they're mounted to the circuit board - any flex that the board is subjected to produces a pulling/bending force on the component. It's possible to hear the effects quite clearly, but only if it's a high gain circuit and you're whacking the board with a pencil or lolly stick or something similar. The forces on the board from soundwaves must be millions of times less.
However, if the aim is to isolate a component from external vibration what use would a piece of bamboo or stainless steel etc. be? Try replacing your car's suspension with a rigid piece of bamboo and see how much isolation you get!
RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 16:45
The second school of thought is the one I'm inclined to agree with too, but I must point out that solid-state electronic circuits are susceptible to vibration. Surface-mount electronic components seem to be more susceptible and that might be due to their construction and the way they're mounted to the circuit board - any flex that the board is subjected to produces a pulling/bending force on the component. It's possible to hear the effects quite clearly, but only if it's a high gain circuit and you're whacking the board with a pencil or lolly stick or something similar. The forces on the board from soundwaves must be millions of times less.
However, if the aim is to isolate a component from external vibration what use would a piece of bamboo or stainless steel etc. be? Try replacing your car's suspension with a rigid piece of bamboo and see how much isolation you get!
Maybe I don't know what I'm doing :)
Basically my ss amp and cdp sit on seperate glass shelves.
My thinking is that it wouldn't be a bad idea to have them on something like wood isolation feet even for tiny benefit. That's my simple thinking anyway.
Like I said, the Panzerwood spike feet appeal but daft money for what they are in my opinion.
Indeed, a lot of amps dont sound good on glass ive found. Dont know exactly why but ive had a huge improvement when i had my mf a1000 on glass then up on feet
The second school of thought is the one I'm inclined to agree with too, but I must point out that solid-state electronic circuits are susceptible to vibration. Surface-mount electronic components seem to be more susceptible and that might be due to their construction and the way they're mounted to the circuit board - any flex that the board is subjected to produces a pulling/bending force on the component. It's possible to hear the effects quite clearly, but only if it's a high gain circuit and you're whacking the board with a pencil or lolly stick or something similar. The forces on the board from soundwaves must be millions of times less.
However, if the aim is to isolate a component from external vibration what use would a piece of bamboo or stainless steel etc. be? Try replacing your car's suspension with a rigid piece of bamboo and see how much isolation you get!
If there is an effect to be had on SS amplifiers I doubt that the cause is isolation from vibration. As I said earlier my own experience was that putting anti-vibration feet under the power amp seemed to degrade the sound when I expected no change or an improvement.
I've not messed about with this sort of thing for a few years now, preferring to concentrate on getting the basics right, but when I was poor but time-rich I experimented quite a bit with different ad-hoc supports, placing weights on top of kit, etc in the hope of getting a free upgrade.
I never discovered a miracle tweak but I did sometimes think I heard differences, That is what leads me to still think that there may be something in it.
Indeed, a lot of amps dont sound good on glass ive found. Dont know exactly why but ive had a huge improvement when i had my mf a1000 on glass then up on feet
Hmm I've got one of those glass chopping boards in the cupboard, could try sitting the power amp on that, if it will fit. I'm all in favour of trying tweaks like this so long as they cost nothing and I don't have to leave the house. :)
Hmm I've got one of those glass chopping boards in the cupboard, could try sitting the power amp on that, if it will fit. I'm all in favour of trying tweaks like this so long as they cost nothing and I don't have to leave the house. :)
Glass may need to be suspended for the effect to happen. Be interesting to see if just glass on floor has any, as its being damped by floor.
Think Gaz had his stuff on oak spikes on his glass shelves too and found it benificial
wee tee cee
09-01-2017, 17:26
I cut down the legs on Ikea Lack table to place my amp under the turntable recently. Just couldnt get the sound back to where I wanted it.
Was faffing about with speaker placement and tightened up all the speaker stand spikes-still no joy.
Thought I would try some oak cone feet that I had in a drawer under my amp/DAC-it sorted the problem!!
I try to keep an open mind and do my own experimentation.
A slate chopping board under the turntable improves things but under the amp makes things worse-go figure!
You really cant vouch for this stuff with different bits of kit!
My boxes all sits on isolated glass shelves in a wooden rack, one of those Stands Unique table jobbies.
Previous to that I had a couple of target shelve racks, which were MDF I think.
Different sound depending on what you plonk the boxes on for sure.
For the current setup I tried a fair few different feet, the best I for my glass rack was the Sound Damped Steel Isofeet plates.
http://www.sounddampedsteel.com/hifi.html
The turntable feet sit directly on them and the big valve amp sits on RDC cones on top of the SDS plates.
Ironically, the best equipment support I found for my Transporter digital source was the 3 rubber turntable feet off the old Rega Planar 2 I bought in 96! :mental:
Like I said, the Panzerwood spike feet appeal but daft money for what they are in my opinion.
have you got a link for them mate?
RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 21:06
have you got a link for them mate?
Here you go Jamie http://panzerwood.com/products/ - I'm tempted to get a set in the future to go at least under my amp.
However,any spare cash at the moment though has to go towards paying down on the Paul Hynes SR7 psu and triple stage regulator mods so it would have to wait.
farflungstar
09-01-2017, 21:21
Gulp. I've been known to spend silly money on accessories but €159 for 4 small wooden cones is daft. I'm sure African Blackwood or another wood would work equally as well and craftsman Steve at Magna Audio could turn them for less than that.
Adey
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RobbieGong
09-01-2017, 21:26
Gulp. I've been known to spend silly money on accessories but €159 for 4 small wooden cones is daft. I'm sure African Blackwood or another wood would work equally as well and craftsman Steve at Magna Audio could turn them for less than that.
Adey
Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk
Yep, Daft money (even if it is a nice product) and that did cross my mind as I've had dealings with Steve before, ebony armboard etc.
It does me good to hear from people who like to experiment with low cost solutions before dropping big money on a problem! I've been on other forums that ostracized me for even suggesting the use of a home made isolation device! On the same forum they were discussing getting perfect alignment on their cartridges, so I added that I had made my own templates and had great success, and got completely snubbed. They were going on about some $300 alignment tools, I guess if you're rich there's no need to make your own anything?
But I did read about some Myrtle wood blocks, so I made my own from some oak I had in the shop. They looked better than the store bought units, and were OK I guess. Honest I didn't hear any revelations but they didn't hurt either. I felt a lot better than if I had spent $80 on their blocks. I've also used some rubber biscuits made for roof top air conditioners as feet for a preamp. In fact I got many compliments on them! But how much good they actually did for the sound? I thought it may be slightly better, but again, it wasn't anything amazing. I've also tried store bought remedies such as sorbathane orbs and sandwiched rubber and MDF, and my home made remedies worked every bit as well.
Even if you want to go with some expensive panzerwood cones, there's no harm in experimenting with some wooden blocks you made in the shop first, to see if you're moving in the right direction. IMHO
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Wakefield Turntables
09-01-2017, 21:33
Well I've just ordered x3 bamboo chopping boards from IKEA £21 delivered. For £21 its a bit of fun and it might work.
farflungstar
09-01-2017, 21:38
To be honest the best isolation for my Vida has turned out to be those commonplace 2mm thick stiffened felt discs used for under furniture. They almost completely isolate the unit as the weave is very stiff but not dense. Saying that the feet that come with the Vida are pretty good so adding the disks ( conveniently the exact same footprint) was easy and cheap.
The feet on my Cary's are enormous soft rubber, 6 each monoblock. They absolutely kill vibration dead.
The feet on my Turntable cost me a packet (they retail for around £350) huge brass and steel adjustable spikes, that I bought from a member. They're fantastic. The investment for the turntable was, in my view, worth it.
Adey
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wee tee cee
10-01-2017, 17:54
Must admit I was mighty impressed when I visited Grants place-he had isolation feet that floated his turntable on the magnetic field between two magnets on each corner. Real Hifi support porn!!!
eisenach
10-01-2017, 21:38
I use a variant of these under everything:
http://www.cd-str5.com/eng/cd-str5.htm
http://www.cd-str5.com/eng/pics/Ring+2JPG.jpg
I find they make a real difference. I "heard" them at the Manchester Show years ago under Michell Alecto amps with John himself in attendance along with Graham Fowler in their demo room. We were all surprised to hear a noticeable improvement.
(I wish I could resize the picture !)
They look interesting but no prices on the charmingly antique website so I guess they are expensive?
eisenach
10-01-2017, 22:08
Hmm, the website is a bit clunky, isn't it, with several pages that don't open including the online shop! I paid around £60 per set of four.
Must admit I was mighty impressed when I visited Grants place-he had isolation feet that floated his turntable on the magnetic field between two magnets on each corner. Real Hifi support porn!!!
these Tony? they were excellent gadgets... cool too
http://imageshack.com/a/img923/655/o7uTHf.jpg
I was trying to avoid a potential repetition of the cable thread. Everyone has an opinion and asking for explanations and suggesting someone is being contentious sounded like it was going to escalate. I think we can all give our opinion based on 'our' experience but should avoid assuming it's true for everyone.
Peace, love and free marijuana for everyone man...
Adey
Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk
Where do I sign up for the free bag of weed?
For once I'm in agreement with Jez.
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