A Warning about INR and Warfarin

[Colin Wonfor]

http://www.lifeextension.com/magazine/2007/6/report_vitamink/page-01

[Colin Wonfor]

https://scontent-lht6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15327404_1732624457055911_1752680709796458241_n.jp g?oh=62e6d73792bd04da725fb1b55221163f&oe=58B63EC4

60 of these injection over 30 days, not nice because Warfarin was stopped wrongly.These action caused me to have a heart attack, so if you are on Warfarin beware the bruises are shit.

[mikeyb]

Ouch!

[Colin Wonfor]

VERY Ouch mike and on the 20th DEC I have to start again for the heart op another op I hate it.

[Stryder5]

I was allergic to Warfarin and some alternatives.

No doctor or consultant made the connection between my reaction and Warfarin, took for two years regardless.

When my platelet count fell to 4 (normally for average person 250 ish), resulting in my inability to stop any bleeding, ( not to be recommended).

Over a year later, after an injection every five days (that made every bone in the body ache) was told that I would have to take these injections for life.

Cutting story short, my immune system suddenly decided that it was going to do something that no one can explain, my platelet count shot to 1900. Problem being that at that level blood clots could be an issue.

Over the next 3 months of no treatment my platelets are circa 200.

The global clinicians are all stumped and cannot explain this outcome.

Incidentally there are now alternatives to Warfarin, that work differently, and do not need periodic INR tests.

[Colin Wonfor]

I was allergic to Warfarin and some alternatives.

No doctor or consultant made the connection between my reaction and Warfarin, took for two years regardless.

When my platelet count fell to 4 (normally for average person 250 ish), resulting in my inability to stop any bleeding, ( not to be recommended).

Over a year later, after an injection every five days (that made every bone in the body ache) was told that I would have to take these injections for life.

Cutting story short, my immune system suddenly decided that it was going to do something that no one can explain, my platelet count shot to 1900. Problem being that at that level blood clots could be an issue.

Over the next 3 months of no treatment my platelets are circa 200.

The global clinicians are all stumped and cannot explain this outcome.

Incidentally there are now alternatives to Warfarin, that work differently, and do not need periodic INR tests.

I think I am have a similar reaction but with metal valves what the hell do you do, OH I hate the ticking noise, Mike Manning Joking asked me to leave his demo room in Yeovil and take the clock with me he he :lol:. I like him he can be fun.

[Stryder5]

I think I am have a similar reaction but with metal valves what the hell do you do, OH I hate the ticking noise, Mike Manning Joking asked me to leave his demo room in Yeovil and take the clock with me he he :lol:. I like him he can be fun.

Did you tell him to look for the crocodile.......or was it an alligator.....never can remember;)

[mikeyb]

I think I am have a similar reaction but with metal valves what the hell do you do, OH I hate the ticking noise, Mike Manning Joking asked me to leave his demo room in Yeovil and take the clock with me he he [emoji38]. I like him he can be fun.
Nothing worse than a dodgy ticker ;)

[hifi_dave]

Following my double Pulmonary Embolism last year, I was put on Dalteparin injections for 3 x months. I couldn't take Warfarin because of kidney problems but appears to be a better alternative anyway. With Dalteparin, there is no need for frequent tests to confirm levels as there is with Warfarin. Dalteparin was trouble free except that 50% of the injections stung a bit.

[AlfaGTV]

I do hope Warfarin is summat else than what it is to me... Warfarin is the trade name for a rat poison here in Sweden! But as i googled it it turns out that it actually is the active component in the blood thinning medical product called Waran!
Learning all the time!
Besides, i am currently on Eliquis which is a similar medication as i also suffered blood clots in both lungs very recently. And i am not the "usual suspect" for that as i am quite thin and exercise a lot. I ran a 90km race in August, all in the mountains and forests of mid Sweden.
Take good care of your health gentlemen, its our biggest asset while we have it!

[hifinutt]

ah yes, many folks joke about having to take their rat poison . of course it kills the rats by overdosing them and bleed to death

sorry to hear about all the problems , certainly there are many tablet forms now which is an improvement to some

so many things can affect your inr its a nightmare i.e antibiotics and so many ordinary tablets

[Stryder5]

ah yes, many folks joke about having to take their rat poison . of course it kills the rats by overdosing them and bleed to death

sorry to hear about all the problems , certainly there are many tablet forms now which is an improvement to some

so many things can affect your inr its a nightmare i.e antibiotics and so many ordinary tablets

And alcohol......which is the bugger:)

[rogerp]

Warfarin is a pain. I only took it for 6 months and it made me feel so cold and my joints very painful. This lasted for several months after stopping it, I'm not sure the cold feeling fingers and toes have gone away several years later. The regular INR tests were a nuisance too as I am needle-phobic.

If I ever need to be 'thinned' again my consultant has indicated I should be be prescribed Dabigatran, orally taken and requires no blood tests. Check with your GP's whether you are suitable for Dabigatran it could be a huge improvement.

[Clifford.T Ward]

Medical Warfarin is indeed Rat Poison BUT it is used in small controlled doses and has the effect of thinning the blood .

[walpurgis]

I get similar effects from blood pressure meds. I'm bloody frozen all the time. Concentration and energy levels are buggered up as well. No joint pain thankfully.

[rogerp]

I get similar effects from blood pressure meds. I'm bloody frozen all the time. Concentration and energy levels are buggered up as well. No joint pain thankfully.

Depends what you are on, there can be (often) inappropriate use of Beta blockers to lower BP. Beta blockers are truly horrible. ACE inhbitors like Candesartan are far better and have practically no side effects. Coming off Beta blockers needs to be done slowly and carefully.

[hifi_dave]

Having had uncontrolled Hypertension for decades, I have used just about every medication available. Doctors tried and failed over all these years despite high levels of the drugs and using combinations of up to six different drugs. So, I can say that the various drugs all have side effects. As several Consultants have been at pains to point out "all medicines are poisons" so expect side effects.

Certain drugs and in certain combinations will affect different people, differently. So, one drug which gives me few side effects might give someone else a lot of grief. In my case, Candesartan reduced my kidney function to dangerous levels. Beta blockers did nothing for the BP, just made me continually dozy.

I have discovered that the minimum dose of a drug will either do the job or not but higher levels will not help, just bring on more side effects.

Fortunately, I have great GPs who got me on a scheme with Addenbrookes Hospital to get my Hypertension under control. I saw Consultants specialising in Hypertension and also Nephrologists, as Hypertension is very often kidney related. After numerous tests, invasive and otherwise, they determined what was causing my Hypertension and one small pill, properly targeted to the problem was all it took to get it under control. Fingers crossed..:)

[rogerp]

Good points there Dave. GP's just do not have enough knowledge to treat all cases effectively. At least whoever put you on Candesartan was doing the right thing with regular blood tests.

[hifi_dave]

Candesartan was one of many, many drugs they tried but it reduced by kidney function to very low levels, so it was stopped. The drug which eventually did it for me and without noticeable side effects is Spironolactone, which blocks Aldosterone from the kidneys and very effective it is too. Only trouble was very sore nipples, so I am now on Inspra, which does the same job but without the side effect.

I saw many expensive Consultants over the years and none of them could get my BP lower than 165/85, which is not too clever but the Addenbrookes team have done the job. Mind you, I did have many scans, blood tests and Kidney samples taken, which was not pleasant but the result is 135/75 average.

[Colin Wonfor]

Thanks I will

[Colin Wonfor]

I do hope Warfarin is summat else than what it is to me... Warfarin is the trade name for a rat poison here in Sweden! But as i googled it it turns out that it actually is the active component in the blood thinning medical product called Waran!
Learning all the time!
Besides, i am currently on Eliquis which is a similar medication as i also suffered blood clots in both lungs very recently. And i am not the "usual suspect" for that as i am quite thin and exercise a lot. I ran a 90km race in August, all in the mountains and forests of mid Sweden.
Take good care of your health gentlemen, its our biggest asset while we have it!

Thanks for the tip

[Colin Wonfor]

Warfarin is a pain. I only took it for 6 months and it made me feel so cold and my joints very painful. This lasted for several months after stopping it, I'm not sure the cold feeling fingers and toes have gone away several years later. The regular INR tests were a nuisance too as I am needle-phobic.

If I ever need to be 'thinned' again my consultant has indicated I should be be prescribed Dabigatran, orally taken and requires no blood tests. Check with your GP's whether you are suitable for Dabigatran it could be a huge improvement.

Thanks for that tip, well Next week back to Bart's and injections they found a clot in the one of the pipe leading close to one of my mech valves which one I could not spell.
This is going to be fun not for a whole year I hate this crap, I just want to get Amps and new Cable out into the world, no time to be of sick.

And the bashing Wonf's pipes start Tuesday at 7.00AM and to get there by tube and I hate the pushing Wonf over game played by the passengers of London Transport.

https://tse2.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.M916c3bcbe88120b6d28452f56f9ec5f2o0&pid=Api

Hey give you disabled seat up arseholes and get of the GameKid Box.

[hifinutt]

Candesartan was one of many, many drugs they tried but it reduced by kidney function to very low levels, so it was stopped. The drug which eventually did it for me and without noticeable side effects is Spironolactone, which blocks Aldosterone from the kidneys and very effective it is too. Only trouble was very sore nipples, so I am now on Inspra, which does the same job but without the side effect.

I saw many expensive Consultants over the years and none of them could get my BP lower than 165/85, which is not too clever but the Addenbrookes team have done the job. Mind you, I did have many scans, blood tests and Kidney samples taken, which was not pleasant but the result is 135/75 average.

glad the old bp is down , i never knew spironolactone made your nipples sore !! i do know that lots of bp meds cause ED [google it !]

[Barry]

glad the old bp is down , i never knew spironolactone made your nipples sore !! i do know that lots of bp meds cause ED [google it !]

But then there are medications that can help with ED (erectile dysfunction).

[struth]

But then there are medications that can help with ED (erectile dysfunction).

And screw with something else ;)

Kinda catch 22 after a while with meds. Im on a scary amount just to keep me going :lol: to think i used to think the wife was on too much. Glad we get free prescriptions in Scotland

[walpurgis]

Bloody typical! Due to see the Doc for an assessment again tomorrow, 'cos the BP's been all over the place despite the meds and the meds have been giving me a bundle of none too good side effects. So what happens today? For the first time in ages, nearly all the side effects have subsided and my BP is back to near enough normal. Weird.

[Colin Wonfor]

Bloody typical! Due to see the Doc for an assessment again tomorrow, 'cos the BP's been all over the place despite the meds and the meds have been giving me a bundle of none too good side effects. So what happens today? For the first time in ages, nearly all the side effects have subsided and my BP is back to near enough normal. Weird.

Mine does that to, I think it's fear like going to a dentist with tooth trouble, and when you get there the bugger either fall out or stops hurting.

https://tse3.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.M0f6488a98f684bb907260c0cd2708d5cH0&pid=Api

[Neil McCauley]

Howard here. I've 'hijacked Neil's account, temporarily. Hello Colin. Looks like both of us are working the late shift tonight.

Odd thing re blood pressure. Right through my chemo, when i was told i had Leukemia and all the way through remission my bp stayed spot on; didn't vary at all. My GP and the Oncologist were puzzled. They asked how, and why - as you'd expect. All I could say in response was that I couldn't see how worrying would help. I still don't. But then again, all through that I had no pain and no discomfort for which I am truly appreciative. Confronting physical pain, as you do ..... I don't think I'd cope that well, if at all. You are an inspiration to me, and I suspect for many others too.

Looking forward to catching up with you and A soon.

[Colin Wonfor]

Howard here. I've 'hijacked Neil's account, temporarily. Hello Colin. Looks like both of us are working the late shift tonight.

Odd thing re blood pressure. Right through my chemo, when i was told i had Leukemia and all the way through remission my bp stayed spot on; didn't vary at all. My GP and the Oncologist were puzzled. They asked how, and why - as you'd expect. All I could say in response was that I couldn't see how worrying would help. I still don't. But then again, all through that I had no pain and no discomfort for which I am truly appreciative. Confronting physical pain, as you do ..... I don't think I'd cope that well, if at all. You are an inspiration to me, and I suspect for many others too.

Looking forward to catching up with you and A soon.

Thanks Howard, today is Pre-Amp day so I better get on with it. And injection start (MUMMY) but my cousin Pete is coming over and he will tell me stories about his day as a armed guard. And he loves Dire Straits cool cuz.

[hifi_dave]

glad the old bp is down , i never knew spironolactone made your nipples sore !! i do know that lots of bp meds cause ED [google it !]

Erection. What is that ? At least 4 of my medications have that as a side effect, so what chance do I have ?

[walpurgis]

The only thing that gets stiff at my age is me poor old joints! :rolleyes:

[Colin Wonfor]

Ditto