Quad pre & power thoughts [Archive] - The Art of Sound Forum

Jimbo

04-10-2016, 20:53

Anyone have any thoughts on a Quad 99 pre & 909 power amp combo, one of several routes I am thinking of going down at the moment?

cheers
Robin

Well build stuff, solid and safe bet. I ran all the Quad amps previous to these and they were good but not particularly exciting. Last for donkeys of years with no bother and do the business well. I always thought their power amplifiers were better than the pre amps but they are general a good combination. 909 I believe is just a further reiteration of the 606?

rmcin626

05-10-2016, 09:11

I've not had much experience with the quad amps apart from the Concordant quad IIs which I had for several years. I believe they are pretty solid but just looking to see if anyone else has opinions.

Clive

05-10-2016, 09:20

I have a Quad 306 which I've serviced and updated some of the circuit to use the component values from the 606/909, the 306 is simply a lower power version of the bigger amps. The power amp is excellent. The received wisdom on the preamps in general is that they can be updated to sound better but maybe the 99 is new enough to be good in it's own right.

rmcin626

05-10-2016, 09:34

Thanks Clive

hifi_dave

05-10-2016, 10:19

Quad is generally well made, practical, reliable, sounds good and able to drive any load without stress.

The current Elite range is as good as some of the expensive imports for a fraction of the price. The Artera is excellent.

rmcin626

05-10-2016, 10:41

Thanks Dave, one of the reasons I was looking at the 99/909 was the solid power amp and the pre amp has a built in mc stage

hifi_dave

05-10-2016, 10:54

It's good, sensible stuff and the Service department is in Huntingdon, able to service and repair just about everything they ever made.

I do have an Elite pre and QSP at a good price.

rmcin626

05-10-2016, 11:20

Thanks Dave, will have a wee look at those only they might be over my current budget, just looking for good value 1/2 box solution to partner my Nottingham analogue and goldring elite combo

prestonchipfryer

05-10-2016, 13:00

Ran a 909 for many years and still have it stored away. Previously a 606 and before that a 405, and before that a 303. Good, solid and reliable. The Quad Huntingdon service department is also able to service the amps, which is always a plus point.

Arkless Electronics

05-10-2016, 13:15

Just to go a touch of topic here.... Many are mentioning the continued existence of a service department, able to repair etc all their models as a big plus point, and with maybe a read between the lines hint that they would be difficult/impossible to have serviced if this was not the case. Hence I want to point out that repair services are not exclusive to manufacturers and that people such as myself (other repair services are available:D) can repair not only Quad but pretty much all makes of hi fi equipment. As you were...

hifi_dave

05-10-2016, 13:47

Arkless Electronics

05-10-2016, 14:14

Undoubtedly, you would be able to service Quad amplifiers and do an excellent job, that is not in question. I was pointing out that Quad do have a fully staffed service department and can service/repair just about everything they have ever made. I could name many companies (but I won't) which would struggle to repair what they made 2 years ago.

Indubitably so. It's just that as someone who (amongst other things) does repairs I often get the feeling that people feel only the manufacturer can do a proper job, or even fix it at all and this is totally untrue! As you say there are companies who cannot repair something they made only two years ago... also one may get the most junior of engineers or technicians doing the repair work at many companies (not always by any means!) and often a component the same as the faulty one will be fitted as a "standard/stock part" whereas someone such as myself would think "that part failed so I'll fit a heavier duty version".

So often one reads on here of someone contacting a manufacturer to have a repair done and finding they no longer exist or no longer support older models... they often then seem to give up... it doesn't seem to occur to them that there are independent repair services can do just as good a job.

Firebottle

05-10-2016, 17:11

I'm going to stick my neck out here and say that any audio engineer worth his salt can fix almost anything........

There are a few on here that fit the bill.

Macca

05-10-2016, 17:54

Unless it's got those j-FET things in it

Arkless Electronics

05-10-2016, 17:58

Unless it's got those j-FET things in it

Eh?:scratch:

Macca

05-10-2016, 18:27

Those Sony and Yamaha amps, that use some transistor that isn't made anymore. Something fet in any case, you know what I mean.

You'll have to excuse me, have a bad cold and my brain is clogged more than usual.

Arkless Electronics

05-10-2016, 19:45

Ah power fets... yes virtually unobtainable.

rmcin626

05-10-2016, 21:12

Any chance of getting back to the original subject, there is a very good repair guy in Glasgow so not a major concern for me.

Jimbo

06-10-2016, 06:10

Why are you thinking of going down the Quad 99 -909 route?

rmcin626

06-10-2016, 07:29

Jimbo

06-10-2016, 08:59

I have seen a set for sale at a reasonable price, I just need a better amp and mc phono stage. The 99/909 just caught my eye. There are a couple of other integrated and pre/power amps that I have looked at but struggling to make my mind up.
I am like a lot of people just now re-discovering my vinyl collection but need to update the Copland amp and the Project phono box - just looking for a good value solution.

When I went back to vinyl recently I first used a Quad 606 with a Croft 25R preamp but found the Croft Series 7 power amp sounded better than my Quad 606 so went down this route. The 25R is a far superior preamp to anything Quad make and the Series 7 power amp sounded more transparent. I had a 606 for 30 years but it was not in the same league as the Croft amps when playing vinyl. I would recommend you consider this combination as they are truly fabulous with vinyl. There is a second hand 25R preamp going for sale on this site!

If you don't want to go down the Croft route may I suggest you try the Firebottle pre and power amps, again I find them far superior to the Quad amps with vinyl.

Wakefield Turntables

06-10-2016, 10:51

I had a full Quad 77 setup, loved it to pieces silly to sell really. I now own a 405-2 which is a stunning little amp "when seen to".

rmcin626

06-10-2016, 12:46

Thanks James, I have been considering Croft, it's a pity no one up here stocks them as far as I know, so probably would be buying without hearing them.

When I went back to vinyl recently I first used a Quad 606 with a Croft 25R preamp but found the Croft Series 7 power amp sounded better than my Quad 606 so went down this route. The 25R is a far superior preamp to anything Quad make and the Series 7 power amp sounded more transparent. I had a 606 for 30 years but it was not in the same league as the Croft amps when playing vinyl. I would recommend you consider this combination as they are truly fabulous with vinyl. There is a second hand 25R preamp going for sale on this site!

If you don't want to go down the Croft route may I suggest you try the Firebottle pre and power amps, again I find them far superior to the Quad amps with vinyl.

Bluedroog

06-10-2016, 22:17

I owned a 909 for years and absolutely loved it, the midrange in particular is so sweet, the built quality is superb and it has the power to just take everything in its stride. I don't know the technical side of things but the current dumping tech is supposed to be very good and quite unique.

I agree with others posts the power amps are far superior to the pre-amps. I used mine with a Croft 25, I did need the gain reduced to get useable volume control but once done the combination was superb, I always described the sound as the iron fist in a velvet glove.

I would note the 909 is always touted as being a power amp which works well with passive pre-amps and given I originally found the gain on the Croft way too much I suspect this is true.

Another point I'd make is there was a point when the manufacture of the 909 shifted from Huntington to China with supposedly cheaper capacitors when bought out, the earlier ones are more sought after but I had one of latest productions and never felt it to be inferior.

Bellossom

14-10-2016, 05:46

Despite its diminutive size, the 99 Series preamp is a true full-featured control unit that will accept four line level inputs (including tape recording with monitoring), each with separately adjustable sensitivity, plus Quad’s proprietary Quadlink bus for Quad CD players and FM tuner (appropriate cables are supplied); it has an excellent built in mm/mc phonostage, superb tone controls and filtering (all defeatable), and Quad’s unique (and uniquely effective) tilt circuit (which shifts the 20Hz–20kHz response from +/- 1, 2, or 3dB about an axis centered at 1kHz) (likewise defeatable); the handset duplicates all the controls on the chassis including volume, balance, and all tone, tilt, and filter functions.

rmcin626

14-10-2016, 09:14

Thanks Hugh, I am aware of those facts, I was looking for those with first hand experience of using the Quad amps.

Cheers
Robin

Despite its diminutive size, the 99 Series preamp is a true full-featured control unit that will accept four line level inputs (including tape recording with monitoring), each with separately adjustable sensitivity, plus Quad’s proprietary Quadlink bus for Quad CD players and FM tuner (appropriate cables are supplied); it has an excellent built in mm/mc phonostage, superb tone controls and filtering (all defeatable), and Quad’s unique (and uniquely effective) tilt circuit (which shifts the 20Hz–20kHz response from +/- 1, 2, or 3dB about an axis centered at 1kHz) (likewise defeatable); the handset duplicates all the controls on the chassis including volume, balance, and all tone, tilt, and filter functions.

Roy S

14-10-2016, 09:43

I've been using Quad amplification for some time now and am very happy with the Elite monoblocks currently in my main system (with a Krell pre).

I've not heard a 909 but have had a 606, 405-2, 306 (sold on) & still have (and use in other systems) a 77 & 303. They've all sounded very good and are quite cheap to try out as you can usually move them on for more or less what you've paid for them :)

Gordon Steadman

14-10-2016, 10:10

Probably something to do with being an old git but my favourite Quad amp is still the 303.

I have the 306, have owned various iterations of 405 and had a 606 in for repair (thanks Alan) recently. All are good in their own way but the 303 just has a beguiling quality about its midrange. If the Leak Stereo20 dies then the 303 would take its place - well, one of them, I have a brace.

rmcin626

14-10-2016, 10:50

One of the actractions is that they do seem to hold their value and of course they do stay the course well.

I've been using Quad amplification for some time now and am very happy with the Elite monoblocks currently in my main system (with a Krell pre).

I've not heard a 909 but have had a 606, 405-2, 306 (sold on) & still have (and use in other systems) a 77 & 303. They've all sounded very good and are quite cheap to try out as you can usually move them on for more or less what you've paid for them :)

rmcin626

14-10-2016, 10:52

I've always had a soft spot for quad amps ever since I owned the Concordant Quad IIs

Probably something to do with being an old git but my favourite Quad amp is still the 303.

I have the 306, have owned various iterations of 405 and had a 606 in for repair (thanks Alan) recently. All are good in their own way but the 303 just has a beguiling quality about its midrange. If the Leak Stereo20 dies then the 303 would take its place - well, one of them, I have a brace.

SLS

14-10-2016, 13:01

Used the same CD audio system for 13 years. Changed it for a digital streaming system in 2011. Have been through a few power amps, solid state and valves. In the last couple of years have settled for Quad, initially a 909 stereo, then 909 mono and now QMP. Used the 909 stereo in the office until recently, sold it simply to have the practicality of an all-in-one with an auto-standby function (purchased the Audiolab M-One).

I honestly wished I'd gone with Quad in the first place. Their accuracy/neutrality is what does it for me, and the fact that they do not need to warm up.

On the subject of repairs, bought my son a TEAC NP H750 and CD 750 from Richer Sounds when he went to Uni. It was ex-demo and got it for £220, was originally £600. Brilliant little system. Something went wrong, took it back to Richer a week before the warranty expired. They fixed it with new circuit boards. No hassles. Now perfect. Have always been a big fan of Richer Sounds, customer service second only to Radlett Audio.

rmcin626

14-10-2016, 13:18

A lot my listening is now done in short bursts maybe a hour or so at a time, can't really wait for the amps to warm up, also I mainly listen at low volume now and although the music might be turned down low I like to hear what's going on.
I am moving towards the quads as they tick a lot of boxes for me.

southall-1998

14-10-2016, 14:14

I might plan on getting a ''Huntingdon made'' 909 in 2017.

Had a 44/405 combo in 2009. That sounded very good indeed!

S.

hifi_dave

14-10-2016, 15:54

I place the latest Quad amps up there with a lot of expensive imports at a fraction of the price.

http://i1058.photobucket.com/albums/t406/hifi_dave/006_zpshblnaz3o.jpg

IHP

14-10-2016, 17:14

It could be argued that at the power end a 405-2 is all you'll ever need !

rmcin626

14-10-2016, 17:19

They look very nice David

I place the latest Quad amps up there with a lot of expensive imports at a fraction of the price.

http://i1058.photobucket.com/albums/t406/hifi_dave/006_zpshblnaz3o.jpg

SLS

14-10-2016, 17:20

I was fortunate to pick up the QMPs ex-demo for not a lot more than I sold my 909 mono's. They sit in an enclosed unit. They do not run hot at all, which is good for me as I don't like to look at my audio and I can use them with the audio/AV unit doors closed. There is a remote sensor bottom left attached to the pre-amp and that's it. I've accidentally left the amps on overnight with the doors closed and the unit did not get hot inside.

hifi_dave

14-10-2016, 17:41

They look very nice David

They are nice. QMP mono blocks. 260 watts each, capable of driving a rusty nail into a barn door without breaking sweat and just (!) £1200 each.

SLS

14-10-2016, 18:01

There is of course the QSP, but the QMP with the extra power really are a class act. Even with the allegedly "easy to drive" Harbeth (from Dave), the extra power does pay down at the low end of things. So it does depend on your speakers and your budget.

If you want to drive rusty nails into barn doors, I would recommend one of these. I have one and it works admirably.

18194

rmcin626

14-10-2016, 20:52

Much as I would like to drive a few rusty nails into a barn door, might be a bit of overkill in my loft(listening room)

There is of course the QSP, but the QMP with the extra power really are a class act. Even with the allegedly "easy to drive" Harbeth (from Dave), the extra power does pay down at the low end of things. So it does depend on your speakers and your budget.

If you want to drive rusty nails into barn doors, I would recommend one of these. I have one and it works admirably.

18194

Macca

14-10-2016, 21:40

Since when has overkill been a bad thing?

rmcin626

14-10-2016, 21:42

It's. A small loft Martin

Since when has overkill been a bad thing?

southall-1998

14-10-2016, 22:28

Martin, go and learn how to visualize :D

S.

walpurgis

14-10-2016, 22:29

I'm just 'visualising' Martin's reply! :eek:

SLS

15-10-2016, 07:25

Since when has overkill been a bad thing?

It's not overkill with some speakers. You can drive a pair of Harbeth SHL5+ with a 25w stereo amplifier. They will sound better with a 60w Croft. They sound better still with a 909 (or equivalent QSP I suppose) and even better with 260w QMP. More power just means more control over the bass. The 25w amp provided plenty of volume, just a very flabby bass.

p.s. Dave may know his audio, but his joinery is lacking. Currently replacing rotten timber on the front of my house. Put the QMPs in the front garden. Played a bit of Mettalica. Did not good at all. (Last time my English builders just filled the cracks and painted over. My Polish builders have cut out all the rotten wood and are replacing it with new. They know how to do a proper job.)

hifi_dave

15-10-2016, 09:12

Macca

15-10-2016, 09:33

Martin, go and learn how to visualize :D

S.

I'll see if there is a night school class I can sign up to.

Arkless Electronics

15-10-2016, 12:24

SLS

16-10-2016, 19:53

You can never have too many (good) watts - that's where the volume control comes in. The extra power provides grip, punch and control especially at the bottom end.

Using the QMP, even at low volume levels, you get that sort of visceral bass with punch, crunch and kick - solid, no flab.

Exactly, as long as you have speakers that can do dynamics at low volume - like my PMC's couldn't - which is why they went.

SLS

16-10-2016, 19:59

I 100% disagree with the last few posts. Power makes precisely zero difference to grip, control etc provided that the amps are operating within their power rating.
This is a very common misconception.

Not according to my ears. It was blatantly obvious with my speakers (Harbeth from Dave) that more power increased the level of control at low frequencies.

Arkless Electronics

16-10-2016, 20:10

Not according to my ears. It was blatantly obvious with my speakers (Harbeth from Dave) that more power increased the level of control at low frequencies.

low power amps often have low spec power supplies etc. That is where the misnomer comes in... try comparing a 50WPC Krell or a 25WPC Mark Levinson or one of my low powered amps to a 200-300 WPC amp and I'm sure you will find that so long as all the amps are working within their power ratings there will be no increase in bass control, grip , slam, whatever from the more powerful amps...

Pieoftheday

16-10-2016, 21:38

low power amps often have low spec power supplies etc. That is where the misnomer comes in... try comparing a 50WPC Krell or a 25WPC Mark Levinson or one of my low powered amps to a 200-300 WPC amp and I'm sure you will find that so long as all the amps are working within their power ratings there will be no increase in bass control, grip , slam, whatever from the more powerful amps...

Hi Jez, do you make amps to order then?

Arkless Electronics

17-10-2016, 15:15

Hi Jez, do you make amps to order then?

It is a service which I offer yes.... but I don't expect to ever get a customer for this as obviously a one off amp built to order can't be heard before it is built! If anyone ever wants to order a particular amp/preamp/phono stage/PSU/W.H.Y then yep I can do it and would consider building clones of stuff that is no longer manufactured... no doubt another non starter as a second hand unit would be much cheaper than a new hand made clone...

I make all sorts of gear intended for my own use only though and it is these amps I was referring to. I have had sales from these in the past though when people have heard a prototype unit and offered me silly money for it!!

Pieoftheday

17-10-2016, 15:28

It is a service which I offer yes.... but I don't expect to ever get a customer for this as obviously a one off amp built to order can't be heard before it is built! If anyone ever wants to order a particular amp/preamp/phono stage/PSU/W.H.Y then yep I can do it and would consider building clones of stuff that is no longer manufactured... no doubt another non starter as a second hand unit would be much cheaper than a new hand made clone...

I make all sorts of gear intended for my own use only though and it is these amps I was referring to. I have had sales from these in the past though when people have heard a prototype unit and offered me silly money for it!!

Good to know if ever I have the coin for something not of the usual suspects :)