View Full Version : how to make tannoy xt6f speakers sing on the cheap
hello everyone,
there are two items in my system that i certainly wont be changing in the near future as im more then happy with them.
these are my technics sl1500 mk1 with denon dl110 cartridge and my tannoy xt6f speakers.
my question is this, to people in the know,dealers etc and who have experience with the newer tannoys , what amplifier works well and which really gives great synergy with these speakers.
the parameters im setting are these...
must be a intergrated,could be a pre and power if small enough.
must come in around 500 to 700 quid,doesnt matter if its new retail price or second hand golden oldie classic,im after the best sound and a item thats gonna really show off and bring out the many talents and magic of these speakers....that magic synergy moment.
doesnt matter the type of technology....hybrid,valves,mosfets etc.
the sort of sound i like is a detailed exciting fast sound that has a good sound-stage and depth,along with detail,along with micro and macro details that make instruments and voices sound more believable and real,and have a air and space around them.....a tall order i know,moreso maybe at that sort of money,but would love to hear peoples views on it that have such experience and knowledge with these speakers.
im using a a yamaha as 501 integrated at the moment,its quite entertaining, a solid amplifier,but it seems very flat and 2 dimensional and doesnt create that believable texture that makes a instrument or voice seem more life like,i never expected it to,it is just my get it up and running amp,for which its been great,and although i cant afford bugger all at the moment to replace it im looking for thoughts and opinions for in the future and what to look out for and path/route to go down,on the cheap of course:)to make these speakers really sing.
amps im thinking of at the moment are....
rega brio r
copland csa28
Primare A30.1
Unison Research Unico
Heed Audio Elixir.
i listern to any and everything,,,except opera.
my room size is around 12 by 14 ft.
i mainly listen to pc music files in j-river through a little akm dac,but i do alot of records to,at present this is just running through a cheap Chinese phono stage.
so any takers,help,pointers and guidance?
as always ,it would be much appreciated
regards
smithie
walpurgis
01-10-2016, 22:28
You missed one amplifier off your list. The Sugden A21a. At 90 db sensitivity your Tannoys should work well with the Sugden, which is a lovely sounding pure Class A amp.
thanks warpurgis
ill add it to the list and read up:cool:
regards
smithie
What's the deal with having the speakers tilted upwards?
Love the look of those Yamaha amps in black, much better than the silver.
hi martin
im going through a stage of playing with positioning and adjusting the speakers to suit mt room and ears:D
ive tilted them right back as far as the spikes will allow to try and bring the tweaters firing up at ear height,when the speakers are level they are about four inchs under ear level,its all work in progress and mad experiments,more so when fueled by a nice bottle of red wine:)
bare in mind im now 50 plus,i find with these speakers i get a killer lower treble but am finding the very top treble rolled off to these ears,of course thats proberly just my knackered ears,i think the yam is quite extended at the top end and hence the reason im playing with placement and angles etc.....or maybe its just the drink making me do it:D
the black yammy amps do look good...but Jesus....they sure attract dust and finger prints/ marks etc:lol:
Diagnosing system problems at a distance is dodgy at the best of times, but in my experience a rolled off top end is rarely if ever down to the speakers, unless you have them very badly sited (behind a settee, facing the wall, etc). Do you have a digital source or is your only source the turntable? I'd recommend 'calibrating' the system with a digital source as there are too many potential variables with vinyl. When it is right with digital it will be right with vinyl too. but it doesn't always work the other way round.
In any case I think you are correct to be looking at the amplification. The speakers, as a consequence of their design, will be quite current-hungry and if the amp cannot deliver this it can result in poor bass and a dull mid/top. Almost all of what we call the 'top end comes from the midrange or bass/mid in a 2-way, not from the tweeter. That is why attempting to solve this problem with speaker positioning (angling, toe-in etc) or messing about with different cables almost never works.
Bear in mind that when designing and developing the speakers Tannoy almost certainly didn't use a budget integrated amplifier. If you swap out the Tannoys for a speaker that is much easier to drive (say a little Wharfedale or similar) you should, if I'm right, get a much better quality of sound in the mid and top. If not, then back to the drawing board :)
maybe i shouldn't have described the treble as rolled off:)
its all there im guessing,certainly to what my ears can hear to these days,maybe i should of wrote "my preference" , and my preference is for a little more bite and decay at the very top end of the spectrum:)
this is achievable with toe in and adjustment,the trouble is we hit that whole compromise thing,and that takes the shape of pronounced sibilance on voices,this could be caused by the quality of amp,cables,room and furnishings or just the way speakers are.:D
its certainly not a problem,i love these speakers and there sound,ive been using these type of tannoys for a fair few years now,would love the 8" versions but my room size just doesnt allow for that big a speaker(otherwise i would of still been using my hawthrones open baffled speakers:()
i always set up stuff via pc/music files,you cant see in the pictures,but behind the amp is a usb akm dac modual/mad experiment :) that im using via usb with my pc,i also find that if i set it up using roger waters q sound amused to death tracks so i get all the effects panning and placed where they should be , then im usually good to go:D
regarding the yamaha amp,i think afew people would be surprised just how good these can sound for the money,the only real fault i can pick with it in the context of my system and to my ears is that it lacks the "shades of colours" found in the music and notes,the macro and micro details that seem to make the music and instruments more believable . but then again thats just my preference and what i look for from my system.
but that was the reason of this post,i realise the stuff im using is just run of the mill grade,its all i have and can afford at the moment,so i play and make do and try to get the best out of what ive got to these ears:D
i was mainly asking about the sort of amps that come up at good prices around the £500-750 price range(new/secondhand) that works well and gives that magic synergy with the tannoys,so they both work together and become more then the sum of it parts....or something like that:lol:
im down in the land that time forgot,i have no real dealers close to listen to any stuff,and as im a full time carer i would never have spare time to be able to travel and listen anyway,plus i have no money half the time,which is another reason i was hoping that some people in the know and have experience could share there views and opinions.
i realise any amps can usually work with alot of speakers,the yamaha amp is one such thing,what im curious with are the ones that seem to sound and sing like a match made in heaven with these tannoys,if in fact any exist :)
regards
smithie
walpurgis
02-10-2016, 10:37
at present this is just running through a cheap Chinese phono stage
Have you considered that this is not likely to be doing you any favours?
It may be that a phono stage upgrade will give you what you are after. Rather than replacing what is probably a decent amp.
jollyfix
02-10-2016, 10:52
Depends on the make, but some cheap Chinese phono stages can be upgraded/ modded to good effect. Maybe give Jez a shout for upgrading. I bought a Audio experience plus for well under £100.00. stock form nothing special, but a few simple tweaks it comes on song. Link to something similar to mine here.
http://www.tnt-audio.com/ampli/audio_experience_e.html
maybe i shouldn't have described the treble as rolled off:)
its all there im guessing,certainly to what my ears can hear to these days,maybe i should of wrote "my preference" , and my preference is for a little more bite and decay at the very top end of the spectrum:)
That is what I assumed you meant, I didn't think that you had no top end at all. Getting that last bit isn't easy, plenty of really expensive systems don't manage it. The only thing harder is getting proper bass. You've got the problem that you have had better in the past than you have now, at least that is how I'm reading it, so you know what is missing. I still say that it is the amplification at fault, and I say this because I had the same issue bugging me for years, until I tried passive pre-amps. Yes the quality of the speaker will still be a limitation, as will the quality of the source. Once all the bullshit is said and done this game is simply all about reducing noise and distortion (of all types). You may think the issue is only in the top end but of course it affects the whole sound, it is just easier to notice it in the top end, things like a lack cymbal shimmer and decay tend to be immediately obvious to any listener.
hi guys
thanks for the response.
i think im not getting my idea/question across:)
i know my phonostage isnt nothing to write home about,it was cheap and a stepup sound quality wise regarding the in built one on the yamaha,i know thats holding me back,and its something that certainly shall be tackled at a latter date,either through replacement or mods.
my focus at present is getting some idea of past masters or present day amps that will really gel with and work with the tannoys i have to show off there many talents and make them really sing,maybe i may already have it in the shape of the yamaha as501,thats the problem,i have no point of reference or a idea of a path i need to take,maybe a more expensive amplifier at the price range i stated wont offer much more then what im already hearing,but then again,maybe if i set my sites or goals for that more expensive amp it might just show up what im missing and how compromised or not the yamaha amplifier amp is....thats what im really trying to suss out.
so let me put it another way....
ive noticed the little rega brio r seems to get alot of love,also seems a good price,more so s/h,even been mentioned that it has a good phonostage,so to me looking at that,im thinking....mmmm,i wonder how that would sound with the tannoys,would it be a better match and show off the virtues of the speaker more then my yamaha and give me afew steps up sound quality wise for not much money if i was to then sell the yamaha on,plus if the phono stage is how people say,then i would also have a better phono stage over what i have has well:)
im only using the rega as a example to try and share my thoughts and reason behind my questions,it could equally apply to copland,premire,niam,quad etc.
regards
smithie
heres some of the stuff ive been looking at and wondering...:):)
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/191979732307?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/222267964338?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/172330730726?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/262646694267?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
i dont know any of them sound,even less how they sound with tannoys,but i like the look of them and the fact that alot of them are a fraction of the price they where because there s/h and getting on,but to me,good sound quality doesnt stop because its just got old:)....its the allure of a better built more expensive ranking up the food chain amplifier that appealing to me i guess(bragging rights:D)
so any views or opinions on the ones ive listed would be a good starter maybe:)
regards
smithie
jollyfix
02-10-2016, 12:51
Hi Paul, i have no experience of those amps, so can't comment, sorry, only read the good reviews. I am sure someone will be along soon ( after Sunday dinner/lunch) who has experience.
what about AVI-lab, seen these go for around £600, loads of power should drive most speakers and good phono too
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AVI-Laboratory-Series-Integrated-Amplifier-S21-M1-with-MM-MC-Phono-Stage-/222264619405?hash=item33c000f18d:g:BasAAOSwaB5Xp56 N
walpurgis
02-10-2016, 13:56
A bit of lateral thinking.
If you want to try other amps. Why not do it on the cheap and still get superb sound quality?
Extremely good sounding and punchy Denon integrated amps can be bought for less than £100. That way you can keep the existing Yamaha and experiment. I'm betting a Denon PMA-350SE or PMA-100M will beat the Yamaha though.
I had a couple of PMA-350SE amps and driving my big Tannoy Cheviots they sounded startlingly good. Near enough matching my TVC pre-amp and Class A power amps.
fatmarley
02-10-2016, 15:25
Aren't Yamaha amps known for being smooth and Denon a bit more lively?
Sounds like a good idea to get some cheap amps of ebay or the classified section, just to give a point of reference. Sell them after for little or no loss (or keep the best one for a reference).
The dirt cheap Cambridge audio AM1 would also be worth trying. They go for peanuts on ebay. Bass is tight, mids are clean and project well, and the treble is nice and smooth. Hard to believe it's a budget amp and I can honestly say I'd take one over some very expensive Naim pre/power amps I've owned in the past.
hi guys
thanks for all the suggestions and ideas,
what i did forget and just found in my cuboard are a couple of audioselector lm 3875 kits,was going to give them a bash afew years ago,but obviously i then promptly forgot about them:).
still gonna have to get acouple of transformers for them,which i guess could work out quite expensive,but it could make up a fairly " cheap amp" to try:D
anyone got any thoughts regarding sound quality and how they compare to more commercial stuff on offer???
i know theres plenty written online about them,but its always good to get proper decent opinions from the crew on this forum:D:scratch:
regards
smithie
Jeff Wood
04-10-2016, 08:32
I've got a Rega Brio R, and it is an incredible amp.
For the price it's just unbelievable.
It sounds superb, and it's built in phono stage is really good !
I use an LFD MMO phono stage with mine which is better, but not by much..
I think you'll love the Rega !
Give it a bit of time to break in, and also leave it switched on all the time, definitely sounds better that way.
Jeff Wood
04-10-2016, 08:35
Another thing with the Rega is that if you didn't like it, they're very easy to sell on.
They do get good prices on ebay, you wouldn't lose much, but I'm sure you'd love it :)
hi jeff
thanks for your input,and of course your glowing review of the rega brio-r:D
the trouble is ,for every glowing review of a amplifer,theres just the same amount going the other way:scratch:,although from what ive read,the rega does seem to have more positive reviews then against,but like any amplifier it comes down to how well it fits in and suits the speakers/system.
and thats the problem for me,all the reviews ive read,i havent seen much mention of a rega/tannoy match made in heaven kind of post:):)
the best plan would be to get one i guess,suck it and see,at least it would give me a nice point of reference,and as you say,if it doesnt work out then at least it should give me some direction with which way to go,and should be able to sell it on ok:)
what sort of price do these go for second hand,and whats a good price,and anything to watch out for?? any leads to a bargain?/:):)
another amp i really like the look of,love half size stuff :) is this...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/222264619405?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
avi S21 M1,really like the look and build,and the fact its a power house,the trouble is,there isnt really much discussion on them,and very few reviews other then the usual suspects,plus avi no longer support them,so i guess you would be stuffed if it develops a faults.....anyone got any views/opinions on these,from what ive read ,the view seems they can sound abit dry??.....still,it does look quality,and really love the looks:):)
regards
smithie
Jeff Wood
04-10-2016, 09:32
I really cant see you being disappointed with the Rega.
And I think secondhand, around £350 ish, but if you could get one at that price, then even if you didn't like it, you'd probably get that amount back.
Just don't judge until and its fully warmed up, and definitely leave it on all the time..
walpurgis
04-10-2016, 09:38
Here's another option, just to add to the dilemma. Have you looked at Creek amplifiers?
A Croft integrated with a ECC82 in it made my tannoy DC6 sing. Huge soundstage with depth you could walk around in. I massively miss this setup and will return to it again in the future maybe with the newer ones like yours. I was running it with a mdac. Although a rega was also good.
i had a creek 5250se back in the day,had alot of exposure/musical fidelity(i still remember what that a1000 amp cost me with the electric bill:)) stuff to:),along with sonys heavy hitters which i use to get for peanuts because i worked for them....god bless graded stock:)....happy days indeed:D
im talking 90s/early 2000 stuff,then i switched heavily to valves,since then i got heavily into diy and building my own stuff,and i guess thats my main problem,ive been swimming around in my own little pond and haven't of late heard how good,or bad the newish commercial stuff is.
the speakers i have was a very expensive present from my good old mum and dad,bless them,but what they highlight to me is that the modern sound seems to be alot brighter and forward,nothing wrong with that,and i love these speakers,more so as there from my sweet mum and dad,but this sort of sound to my ears needs alot more care regarding striking a good balance regarding synergy,and i just dont know what any of this later stuff sounds like anymore,with no real option to get out and get a listern,i dont move in any circles where i can borrow beg or steal to see what i like and what suits me,like in the good old days...hence all my questions:):):)
regards
smithie
i had a creek 5250se back in the day,had alot of exposure/musical fidelity(i still remember what that a1000 amp cost me with the electric bill:)) stuff to:),along with sonys heavy hitters which i use to get for peanuts because i worked for them....god bless graded stock:)....happy days indeed:D
im talking 90s/early 2000 stuff,then i switched heavily to valves,since then i got heavily into diy and building my own stuff,and i guess thats my main problem,ive been swimming around in my own little pond and haven't of late heard how good,or bad the newish commercial stuff is.
the speakers i have was a very expensive present from my good old mum and dad,bless them,but what they highlight to me is that the modern sound seems to be alot brighter and forward,nothing wrong with that,and i love these speakers,more so as there from my sweet mum and dad,but this sort of sound to my ears needs alot more care regarding striking a good balance regarding synergy,and i just dont know what any of this later stuff sounds like anymore,with no real option to get out and get a listern,i dont move in any circles where i can borrow beg or steal to see what i like and what suits me,like in the good old days...hence all my questions:):):)
regards
smithie
Aye, the big A1000 was a super thing...did make the meter run though lol, but aided the central heating. If speakers are a little warm then you will want to avoid anything like that, amp wise. Yeah, perhaps a big creek evo 2 might be worth a listen. A top of range class d maybe as well might be the ticket. The good ones are very good
haha,sounds like someone else whos had experience with the A1000:),to me that was musical fidelity's finest moment,did love that amp,something you dont see come up much these days,not that i would contemplate such a beast now,and proberly go for abit more then the £500 i paid for it back in the day:):)...but they sure where 50 sweet watts:).
i think the speakers i have sound fairly neutral and quite detailed,ive used a tda3116 digital amp with these,i thought it was quite good for such a cheap item,had a nice warmth to the sound to,the trouble with that type of amp is....you can go quite mad adjusting the output filters to match your speakers if there impendance is alittle rocky,i think the tannoys are:)
regards
smithie
Yup, had one for many years. Best amp ive heard tbh, and dunno why i sold it. Could drive anything... you wont get one for a grand now . I sold mine for about £800 a number of years ago. Tannoys are usually a fairly easy drive watts wise, with probably 20 to 40 depending on the type, being ideal, but will run well on a lot less.
Using my own speakers now that only need a few watts to sound good, so any amp will run them, but you need to keep volume down or they will blow captain, as Scotty would say.
Hope you find your ideal amp
i sold mine because i was starting to listen to music alot more,and alot longer...i was living in a cold damp flat,so the mf1000 was a god send on that side of things with the heat it chucked out,alas,as stated,the electric bill wasnt:):):)....but i totally agree,it certainly had great sound quality,and im with you on the regret front for selling it to,saying that,my music is on 24/7 so that may not be the ideal amp for me these days:lol:
i also agree with regards the tannoys being a easy load,i have a little tripath amp that throws out a max of around 22watts,and thats more then enough for this room and ears....although ive always found it nice to have plenty of headroom power wise:)
i had and built some hawthrone 15" coaxial open baffle speakers,complete with active 15" augie bass drivers,they where around 94db sens if i remember right,they where the same regarding power( "it just cant take it captain":)),to be fair they could take afair bit,but they only really needed 4-5 clean watts to really sing in this room,loved those,and with that sensitivity it certainly opens alot more choices to you regarding amp tech and choices,alas i have to small a room for that style of speaker......theres near field listening,and then theres very very near field listening :lol:
once i get into it im sure ill find that perfect amp that suits me/my needs,im not un happy with the yam,have alot of respect for it,it has a dac and phonostage to,remote,good power,so for some it could be a answer to alot of peoples needs all rolled in one,i certainly recommend one if the sound suits you ,i have a sickly yamaha as500 one to that i should sort out and give a listen,has thats ment to be sound balanced differently...hell its a whf 5 star award winner for heavens sake:lol::lol:
maybe first,i should dig out all this crap i have lurking around and give it all a bash through this system....saying that im now very curious to hear a brio r in my system....thanks jeff:lol::)...now,whos got one going cheap:eyebrows::)
regards
smithie
In MY experiences the Lm1875 Chip amp can be decent but lacks welly and the top end while decent... should be better :-).
Lm3886 Does a bit better sound quality imo, fitted with a deep cap bank the bass is surprising.. similar top end limits tho.
My cheap Chi Fi 3116 type was poor.. period. Sqwaacks at turn on And turn off. Sadly the sounds in between were of the table radio variety, quickly relegated the trash bin.
Dunno What it would take to make a 6" driver produce 38hz bass.. clearly the Brochure Babble on those 'tannoys' is optimistic
thanks for the input danilo
isnt the lm3875 ment to sound abit better,smoother out of all the lm amps? i dont know as ive heard none of them,when i can find acouple of suitable trxs then ill build up the ones i have and give them a listen and find out for myself.
funny you should mention the chi-fi 3116,im just using it now,and must confess that im not having the same experience that you had,i have replaced the input caps,but only with some silmics,havent got any film caps that will fit,also replaced dc power caps for some decent nichecon ones,other then running it off a sony laptop 19.5v 5a power supply it pretty standard,,in fact i think alot of people would be quite impressed with the sound this thing chucks out.
i know...send around the men in white coats,bring the straight jacket etc:):),im just telling it as im hearing it,sure,its a bit brash at times,but it sure is musical,detailed and extended:scratch:
so why dont i put my money where my mouth is if its that good and use it all the time??? i would but for the fact it only has one input and i need three,plus i need remote control,and the other thing is it looks like about £10 worth of amp....which funny enough is what it cost,delivered:lol:
ok,time for my meds:cool::cool:
regarding the tannoy specs,i never take much stock in manfactures specs or spill,but i can safely say i have no need for a sub,and at the end of the day its the room that has the final say regarding bass performance,and these can set off the room quite easily:) what i do like with these is the bass seems a extension of and a very coherent part of the music......that works for me:smoking:
regards
smithie
i sold mine because i was starting to listen to music alot more,and alot longer...i was living in a cold damp flat,so the mf1000 was a god send on that side of things with the heat it chucked out,alas,as stated,the electric bill wasnt:):):)....but i totally agree,it certainly had great sound quality,and im with you on the regret front for selling it to,saying that,my music is on 24/7 so that may not be the ideal amp for me these days:lol:
i also agree with regards the tannoys being a easy load,i have a little tripath amp that throws out a max of around 22watts,and thats more then enough for this room and ears....although ive always found it nice to have plenty of headroom power wise:)
i had and built some hawthrone 15" coaxial open baffle speakers,complete with active 15" augie bass drivers,they where around 94db sens if i remember right,they where the same regarding power( "it just cant take it captain":)),to be fair they could take afair bit,but they only really needed 4-5 clean watts to really sing in this room,loved those,and with that sensitivity it certainly opens alot more choices to you regarding amp tech and choices,alas i have to small a room for that style of speaker......theres near field listening,and then theres very very near field listening :lol:
once i get into it im sure ill find that perfect amp that suits me/my needs,im not un happy with the yam,have alot of respect for it,it has a dac and phonostage to,remote,good power,so for some it could be a answer to alot of peoples needs all rolled in one,i certainly recommend one if the sound suits you ,i have a sickly yamaha as500 one to that i should sort out and give a listen,has thats ment to be sound balanced differently...hell its a whf 5 star award winner for heavens sake:lol::lol:
maybe first,i should dig out all this crap i have lurking around and give it all a bash through this system....saying that im now very curious to hear a brio r in my system....thanks jeff:lol::)...now,whos got one going cheap:eyebrows::)
regards
smithie
Nice speaker Paul. I like them a lot
hi grant
i take it your referring to the hawthornes,if so,then yes i really liked those,but they really do need a big room to get the best out of them,or at least bigger then i have.
the "augies" are really impressive,these are the bass units,being open baffle design they dont have the impact of a box design,there more like a planner/maggies kind of bass,but impressive when you get use to them,for what was on offer and a little diy work they where a good price to,providing you dont get hammered with import/tax rubbish,nice freindly helpful couple that run the company to....highly recommended.
regards
smithie
Arkless Electronics
04-10-2016, 14:57
I've got a Rega Brio R, and it is an incredible amp.
For the price it's just unbelievable.
It sounds superb, and it's built in phono stage is really good !
I use an LFD MMO phono stage with mine which is better, but not by much..
I think you'll love the Rega !
Give it a bit of time to break in, and also leave it switched on all the time, definitely sounds better that way.
Don't leave it switched on all the time. Unless you want to make repair work for the likes of me....
Arkless Electronics
04-10-2016, 15:01
"gain clone" amps, (a term I can't stand cos there was loads of chip power amps around for decades before the one it was a clone of came out) can sound very good. Nothing wrong with treble at all. Obviously the IC used will massively influence things.... I have a LM3886 based one I made years ago which still gets some use now and then.
hi grant
i take it your referring to the hawthornes,if so,then yes i really liked those,but they really do need a big room to get the best out of them,or at least bigger then i have.
the "augies" are really impressive,these are the bass units,being open baffle design they dont have the impact of a box design,there more like a planner/maggies kind of bass,but impressive when you get use to them,for what was on offer and a little diy work they where a good price to,providing you dont get hammered with import/tax rubbish,nice freindly helpful couple that run the company to....highly recommended.
regards
smithie
Big girls at 15" hat size :eyebrows: i am using twin 10" fullrange vintage alnico telefunkens in reflex boxes . They are about 97/8 db and as they are doubled up in series give a nice big soundstage. Bass is adequete, well it is for me. Im not into huge bass lines, but i could integrate a sub if i wanted. They are getting driven by a single monoblock in stereo mode. Class D but heavy unit. Its fine although i hanker for some class A again
Jeff Wood
04-10-2016, 15:27
Don't leave it switched on all the time. Unless you want to make repair work for the likes of me....
Your cheque's in the post Jez :)
Seriously my view on the subject is that it's better for electronic items to be left on, less stress on the components due to no hot-cold cycling.
My Brio R has been on pretty much continuously for several years btw and still it's alive and kicking.
Arkless Electronics
04-10-2016, 15:34
Your cheque's in the post Jez :)
Seriously my view on the subject is that it's better for electronic items to be left on, less stress on the components due to no hot-cold cycling.
My Brio R has been on pretty much continuously for several years btw and still it's alive and kicking.
My professional opinion is the opposite and I can offer plenty of proof to back it up.. but as this subject come up so often I'm sick of explaining it.... do a search for past discussion folks if you want to see all the reasons. I would expect most gear to work fine for a few years if left switched on... but for nowhere near the 20 years or so life one could expect from an amplifier and with performance tailing off after a couple of years tops...
jez
any recommendation regarding transformers for the lm3875 monos i have?
i was thinking a long 400 va toridals with 22x2 or 24 x2 secondaries?
my friend built some using maplin toridals trx but he finds these quite noisy,for whatever reason.....just wondered if you knew of a good company,manufacturer,at a good price:)
on the one you made,did you use a passive volume pot and selector,or did you go via a buffered input as some seem to recommend? i supose i could just keep it all simple to start out,then play with different options if i feel its worth taking further ....hey,im answering my own question now:lol:
the hawthrones use to come in 10" versions to,i dont know if they still do them,maybe thats the way i should of gone as they would of been alot more managable in my room,if so i would of kept them:mental:
sounds like you have a killer setup there struth,great sensitivity to,must be a good class d amp noise wise as im sure those speakers would show off any such trait if it existed.why dont you build acouple of mr hoods class a amps of old,shouldn't be a to costly exercise:rolleyes:
regards
smithie
is that why we all get the urge to change stuff after a while.....we know we,ve worn it out and need to move it on quickly?:lol::lol:
Wouldnt leave any amp on 24/7 .. safety alone says its a bad idea. Its not unknown by any means for amps to ignite.
Arkless Electronics
04-10-2016, 16:45
jez
any recommendation regarding transformers for the lm3875 monos i have?
i was thinking a long 400 va toridals with 22x2 or 24 x2 secondaries?
my friend built some using maplin toridals trx but he finds these quite noisy,for whatever reason.....just wondered if you knew of a good company,manufacturer,at a good price:)
on the one you made,did you use a passive volume pot and selector,or did you go via a buffered input as some seem to recommend? i supose i could just keep it all simple to start out,then play with different options if i feel its worth taking further ....hey,im answering my own question now:lol:
the hawthrones use to come in 10" versions to,i dont know if they still do them,maybe thats the way i should of gone as they would of been alot more managable in my room,if so i would of kept them:mental:
sounds like you have a killer setup there struth,great sensitivity to,must be a good class d amp noise wise as im sure those speakers would show off any such trait if it existed.why dont you build acouple of mr hoods class a amps of old,shouldn't be a to costly exercise:rolleyes:
regards
smithie
400VA is rather excessive! Won't do any harm except to your wallet though.... If building monoblocks then 100VA per channel more than enough. 24V more appropriate for 3875. I've used mine via passive and via active pre amp. Mainly with passive though.
fatmarley
05-10-2016, 06:05
just wondered if you knew of a good company,manufacturer,at a good price:)
Cantubury windings (http://www.canterburywindings.co.uk/standard_range.html) seem quite popular.
hi jez
thanks for your input regarding va size and voltage,much appreciated.
thanks fatmarley,cantubury windings had come up quite abit in my search and wondered if they was ok,may send them a email.
of course i may go no further and bite the bullet on a used brio r to try,if i can find one at the right price:) so any leads would be much appreciated to,ive stuck a wanted ad in the forum to get the ball rolling:).
thinking i need a reference first,something thats known to sound really good and see if im happy with that,and also to see if im moving up,sideways or backwards regarding sound quality within my system:)
regards
smithie
Arkless Electronics
05-10-2016, 12:28
http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/toroidal-transformers/6719047/
Thats about the cheapest you'll get a decent transformer for it. This will power two channels. Canterbury Windings are excellent and I use them myself but they are not cheap so for something stock/off the shelf like this the RS option would be at least half the price.
your the man jez
they do look ideal,thanks for that....i should really build these things as i have most of the stuff here,just dont know what there gonna sound like,and times precious and hard to find these days....emmm,decisions decisions:scratch::)
regards
smithie
Arkless Electronics
05-10-2016, 13:33
I use the LM3886 myself (very similar) and can report that you are unlikely to be disappointed in the sound;)
many thanks jez
you,ve swung me,i think ill give them a try....foolish not to really:)
regards
smithie
fatmarley
05-10-2016, 13:45
just dont know what there gonna sound like,and times precious and hard to find these days....emmm,decisions decisions:scratch::)
regards
smithie
According to Teddy Pardo, It should be sound even better with a PowerReg (http://www.pinkfishmedia.net/forum/showthread.php?t=39306) (He sell his chip amps for around £3000 IIRC). Teddys claims wouldn't surprise me one bit because I use the standard TeddyRegs in a DAC and they work far better than anything else I've tried (ALW Super Reg, Shunt regs etc)
ok...
quick change of plans,got a rega brio r winging its way to me for early next week to listen to for a while,thanks to one very kind soul:),so if nothing else i will have a reference and something to judge within my system,ill still be building the lm3875 mono blocks/integrated amp after i have a handle and view on what the rega brings to the party and to my system:D
if i haven't made everyone's eyes glaze over or driven them to drink with this thread,then im more then happy to post a small review on how the brio r sounds and performs within the context of my system and to these ears:cool:
fatmarly,thanks for your input regarding the regs use with the lm3875 chips,when i get to building them in earnest i shall have a good read up and workout a game plan for my build.
regards
smithie
Jeff Wood
08-10-2016, 01:14
looking forward to reading your review of the Brio R ..
ok jeff
will do,in case you haven't guessed,ill be quite interested to find out how it sounds within my system to,looking forward to hearing the phono stage as well:)
proberly be middle of next week before i write my scrible if it arrives as agreed:wave:
regards
smithie
its been awhile but i thought i would update how i got on with the rega....
its never a easy transition just swapping one amplifier for another in your system,more so when your system has been built around the original gear,and things tweaked and adjusted to get the best out of what you have and to suit your own ears:)
needless to say i really struggled with the rega brio r when it was just exchanged for the yamaha 501,intital impressions was...wheres all the detail gone,the top end has disappeared and vocals sound like there singing with grit in there teeth,and as for the bass,impact and punch had been replaced waffled over hang and no impact or definition ....i had to re-read some of the glowing reviews again because i wasn't hearing any of the stuff they where banging on about,let alone thinking like some do that this amp could be a future classic:scratch:
now i dont believe theres that much crap out there sound wise when you get to a certain level and a reputable manufacture,its more a question of how stuff interacts with the rest of the equipment and room acoustics you have,its just striking that balance of kit that gives you the sound you like and want,so with those thoughts in my head...i didnt panic(much)and just let it play for a week to see if things improved or i could get a handle on what was going on:D
things wasn't improving any after a weeks warm up and listening,and at this point i really had enough of the swamping over hanged bloated bass and muffled highs....time for action:)
now i dont consider the yamaha amp lean,but it does have a little dryness in the bass in this system,i remember countering that by pushing my tannoys closer to the boundarys to add alittle fill in to the bass,so first job was to pull them back out....bingo,i have a half decent bass back again thats no longer one note,in fact its quite fleeting and punchy,maybe not as impactful as the yam,but seems more integrated and not so flat sounding,didnt think the rega went as low as the yamaha until i played afew yello tracks....i think the yamaha gets abit more congested down below so it always seems as if it has abit more thump going on lower down,as where the rega just gives you the lows as and when they happen....hopefully that makes sense:D
i think there is abit of "past neutral" added warmth added by the rega,but its something i dont mind in this system and room,and lets not forget,although the bass is good,im using that description in the context of the value of this amp,ive certainly heard alot better,but at the price this rega goes for i dont think your feel short changed with the bass performance:cool:
the treble aspect that i was suffering was once again sorted by attacking my speakers positioning again,this time it was just a case of altering the toe in alittle more,all this brings me back to the short falls of just slotting a replacement amp into your system and judging it like that,my system was all tweaked out and adjusted to the merits and short falls of the yamaha 501.
i like the rega,its a honest decent product with a great sound,is it a giant killer?for me no,ive heard and had alot of great diy gear to know better sound can be had for around this price,but thats not comparing apples to apples,and some people wouldn't dream of "having a go,building or tweaking something",and to them the rega will be a blessing and great value,for me it lacks the detail i like and the the pronounced treble i seem to enjoy to my sound:)
so to sum up my views on the rega brio r in my system and to my ears.....
this is a great musical little amplifier,it tends to paint the musical picture with big watercolour brush strokes rather then a fine detailed digital picture quality which makes for one very enjoyable musical experience,plenty of power and finesse for most normal type setups,and comes at a great price to....of course,this is just my opinion,and to these old ears,and in my system....so proberly worthless and take it all with a big cube of salt:lol:
forgot to mention,gave the rega phonostage a bash to,and enjoyed that alot to.
right,i think im gonna have a flirt with a valve amplifier next....audioromy fu29 has caught my eye:lol::lol:anyone have one?any good?any views and comments?
wee tee cee
09-11-2016, 17:56
Aint read the whole thread but have you considered Temple audio mono blocks.
Partnered with a suitable pre (tisbury audio or the Temple which I havent tried) are really bang for buck good.
I had a pair of I think f3 Tannoy floor standers and the Temples played nice with them....class d amps can be real giant killers-your description of what youre after sonically is right on the money for the Temples. I know the sound of the Rega amp reasonably well and your ears are pretty much hearing what I do.
Anybody near you that could let you hear a mini t or temple amp in your system-you may be pleasantly surprised.
hi wee tee cee
thanks for the heads up on the temple audio gear,i shall have alittle read up on them,sounds intresting,and do love to play and listen to new stuff,
i was quite impressed with afew cheap 3116 and 3118 d amps i had,i have no problem with what technology is used,its the sound quality that counts at the end of the day:)
regards
smithie
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