Turntables for 78rpm. Any experience or recommendations?

[Landloper]

Lately I've been listening to a lot of historical recordings - either on CD or 33rpm vinyl - many taken from original 78 rpm recordings and re-presented in those later formats. As I generally prefer direct transcriptions from 78s rather than digitally remastered versions, I thought I might be better off buying a turntable dedicated to 78 rpm or with a 78 rpm ability. I currently have a Rega deck and know they market a single speed RP78 deck and a RB78 mono cartridge. Perhaps an older deck with 78rpm capacity might be a cheaper way of going?

If anyone has experience of 78s or has any suggestions to make, I'd be glad to read them.

[struth]

Lencos will happily do 78 at not to high a price

[hifi_dave]

To do the 78 thing properly, you need a deck which has variable speed, as not all 78s run at 78. So, you need a vintage deck of some sort such as a Lenco or Garrard.

[Clive]

I can appreciate the the OP wants to transcribe 78s so the effort to get the speed correct would be worthwhile. More generally speed and EQ is somewhat variable. Given that 78s play for a short time who actually corrects speed and EQ? It'll take way longer to get this right than listening to the record. It's not like you can tell what setting to use from a visual examination. Just wondering...

[daytona600]

Use one of these myself £230 Reloop RP-4000M with 33/45/78 & variable speed (±10%/±20%)
with mono cartridge with selection of stylus - 0.7 to 4.0 to suit historic recordings
& plug in a stereo cart with 0.7/1.0 for modern stereo & microgrove mono recordings
plus a fantastic sounding deck for the money

you also get a USB version as well for connection to a PC

The generally accepted tip radius for playback of 78 RPM records is 3.0 Mil (0,003 inch).
Due to the playback in the past of these very old records with very high stylus pressure or even
with steel needles a lot of damage has been caused to the grooves. This damage is
the cause of a lot of distortion and back-ground noise. Sometimes better results can
be achieved by playing the record either on a lower part or a higher part of the groove
which may have been damaged less than the average height. To play-back at a higher
level, use either the 3.5 mil, 4.0 mil. To playback at a lower groove level use either
the 2.0 mil, or 2.5 mil tip. When you have found the best height affix a sticker to the
record so you will know the next time which stylus tip to use for best results.

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http://snvinyl.co.uk/WebRoot/Daily/Shops/eshop943300/5586/E505/B0FC/D1E9/86A4/0A0C/05E0/122D/334844.jpg

[walpurgis]

If you want to try 78s very cheaply, get a Garrard SP25.

[Geoff101]

Dual CS-5000 also has 78rpm speed although they're not cheap and the speed is fixed.

[Landloper]

Thanks, Struth. Given the exorbitant price of 78 records - they seem to start at £25 - perhaps the cheaper the deck the better.

[Landloper]

Thanks, Daytona600. Rather more complicated than I had imagined. Looks like I'm going to have to do a little research. Thanks for mentioning the usual state of a lot of 78s and how to try to offset the inevitable damage to such old and fragile objects.

[Landloper]

Thanks for the links, hi-fi dave.

[struth]

Thanks, Struth. Given the exorbitant price of 78 records - they seem to start at £25 - perhaps the cheaper the deck the better.

I had a go at it years ago, but gave up as it was a lot of work for not great results... I just buy the cd already done now. some of them are quite well done and still retain a fair bit of the nostalgia

[Landloper]

Quite, Clive. I thought of recording some to CDR myself, perhaps for the ones in poorer condition I might record to computer and then apply as minimal an amount of manipulation as possible.

[Landloper]

Thanks, Walpurgis. That Garrard might be a decent starting point to see how I get on with 78s.

[Landloper]

Struth - The subject is more complicated than I realised at first, and I fear you may be right: a lot of effort for middling results at best. Some companies specialize in direct transcriptions, such as Prima Voce, and do it to a standard I couldn't match at home.

[Landloper]

Thanks, Geoff101.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Lenco GL75. Pick one up for < £100.

[spendorman]

I was also going to suggest a Garrard SP25, cheap and should do the job. There are other very similar Garrard turntables too, the AT60 and the AT6 and 2025 for a start.

These could be bargains:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Garrard-Transcription-turntable-AP76-Idler-Mechanism-Lid-Tonearm-WORKS-/162199331360

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Dual-1219-HiFi-automatic-turntable-/182277165541

[Landloper]

And it has pitch control...thanks, Rexton. Shortlisted.

[Landloper]

Thanks, Spendorman. I assume the '17-25-30' markings on the front right of the Vintage Dual deck is some kind of pitch presetting function?

[Barry]

If you want to try 78s very cheaply, get a Garrard SP25.

I once transcribed some early 1950's 78s of my parents to cassette tape, using a Garrard SP25 and a fairly massive crystal/ceramic cartridge (who's name I have forgotten). Think it tracked at 3g, and I have no idea of the tip radius, but it was probably 65um.

Couldn't fuss with the equalisation as the cartridge was fed directly to the "XTAL" input of the amplifier (a Teleton SQ 203, I think).

[Barry]

Thanks, Spendorman. I assume the '17-25-30' markings on the front right of the Vintage Dual deck is some kind of pitch presetting function?

No, the "17 - 25 - 30" denote the diameter 9in cm) of the record being played. I think they might be for the auto-return mechanism of the arm. DSJR is a fan of Dual decks, so he might be able to advise.

[Clive]

I once transcribed some early 1950's 78s of my patents to cassette tape, using a Garrard SP25 and a fairly massive crystal/ceramic cartridge (who's name I have forgotten). Think it tracked at 3g, and I have no idea of the tip radius, but it was probably 65um.

Couldn't fuss with the equalisation as the cartridge was fed directly to the "XTAL" input of the amplifier (a Teleton SQ 203, I think).

Any chance it was a Sonotone 9TAHC with flip stylus?

[Landloper]

Oh - thanks, Barry.

[Landloper]

Following the well-informed responses to the OP I ended up deciding that 78s are perhaps best transferred to CD by companies like Nimbus and Presier rather than at home by me. It was a more complicated proposition than I had first supposed. Thank you to everyone who took the time to offer advice and suggestions or who messaged me on the matter. The money I set aside for a turntable has been spent on recordings of 78s on CDs and 33rpm vinyl instead.

[struth]

result.. more time to enjoy the tunes:) some are very good.