View Full Version : Which step next??
Hi all. I have a SL-1200MK2 with a few mods (listed below) and it sounds quite nice. Even with a humble AT-120e cart, I've been amazed at how good a nice clean record sounds. Thanks to Qwin and Andrei for their pioneering on the tonearm and platter mods and 6L6 for the PS mod.
Given what's been done already, I've come to the experts to ask for recommendations on what upgrade to add next. Up for consideration are a better outboard PS, a tonearm damper or a set of Isonoe's. Of course, any other recommendations will be considered as well.
Stock tonearm modded with the addition of a straight carbon fiber/aluminum tube. Wired with Litz wire and lightly stuffed with cotton.
Stock platter modded with a layer of Dynamat Extreme to the bottom side in place of the stock Technics rubber.
DIY external PS with the stock transformer.
Halved Racquetballs replacing the stock Techie feet.
IANMAC bearing.
Res-O-Mat
https://photos.smugmug.com/ComponentMods/SL-1200Mk2/i-PSzf5QL/0/M/104_1305-M.jpg
https://photos.smugmug.com/ComponentMods/SL-1200Mk2/i-v7BP4xB/0/M/104_1256-M.jpg
https://photos.smugmug.com/ComponentMods/SL-1200Mk2/i-66nvbTX/0/M/104_1247-M.jpg
At some point in the near future I hope to add a Denon DL-110 to see how I like the MC sound.
TIA for any help rendered :)
I think the bjggest gains will be had by changing the tonearm and/or cartridge.
The basics of the deck seem OK and changing the feet may give you s slight improvement.
After that you can look at an aftermarket platter.
I can't comment on the tonearm damper, as I have never tried one.
It seems that those who've added the tonearm damper are quite taken with it. Also the Denon DL-110 seems quite popular.
The external PSU is the single biggest improvement you can make to the table. I doubt that a 'better' external supply will be any better, as 95% of the mod is removing the vibrating transformer from the TT chassis.
I'd suggest Isonoe feet. Big improvements from anything else used.
Of course, changing cartridges will make huge differences in sound, they are as unique as speakers, being transducers. I used the DL-110 as my primary cartridge for a couple of years, it's quite nice and can unashamedly recommend it.
That said, I'd re-wire the tonearm cables with the lowest capacitance cables you can find. (And a exhaustive look will show that Bluejeans Cable LC-1 is an amazingly low 12pF/ft) Most cartridges (especially MM) get too loaded by capacitance, usually due to cabling, and can cause a rising in response of 8-10K on up. Low capacitance cables will allow you to load as necessary.
Wakefield Turntables
25-09-2016, 08:25
External PSU and then Isonoe feet.
It seems that those who've added the tonearm damper are quite taken with it. Also the Denon DL-110 seems quite popular.
I love my DL-110 on the Techie.
I love my DL-110 on the Techie.
Does your wife know ?;)
walpurgis
25-09-2016, 09:55
It seems that those who've added the tonearm damper are quite taken with it. Also the Denon DL-110 seems quite popular.
Having used a Denon DL-110 in a Mission 774 arm, I can say it definitely seems to behave better with fluid damping applied. The discontinued DL-160 is a nicer sounding MC high output though. Worth looking out for a good second hand example.
Does your wife know ?;)
We have an understanding ;-)
Does she give you more or less 'needle'? :eyebrows:
Marco.
Packgrog
26-09-2016, 19:36
On my previous Technics, I had the fluid damper and a DL-110. It was a nice combo. I was actually able to dial back the VTF a bit with the damper installed, which had a nice effect, but you really do need to be careful of how much fluid you add to the trough (1/3 seemed about right, more caused too much damping), and be careful not to over-tighten the paddle to the arm. I imagine the fluid damper would work well on most (though not all) Technics clone arms, so long as they have the little side extension for the cueing level where the paddle gets attached (the Audio Technica AT-LP120 arm does NOT have this, and thus is not compatible). I'm curious how other people with straight arm mods have enjoyed the fluid damper.
The DL-110 is still a good buy for the money if you know where to look. $175 is a good target price right now. FWIW, cable capacitance shouldn't matter with the DL-110, being HOMC, but it absolutely would matter if you stick with MM.
Despite the sex appeal of a nice new MC cart, I think I'll go with some Isonoe feet as I believe they'll do a better job of supporting the deck than the halved Racquet balls. After that I'll go for the DL-110.
Packgrog
29-09-2016, 17:41
FWIW, Steve at Herbie's Audio did recommend the Big Tall Tenderfeet as being better than the Isonoes, though I'd already bought the Isonoes by that point, and the Tenderfeet aren't really adjustable without shimming. Can't actually speak to which is better for sound. The Isonoes are a lot cheaper right now direct from the UK post-Brexit, which is why I started tinkering with the Technics again. Racket balls and sorbothane domes sound like crap.
Still haven't found time to make an grungebuster armboard gasket to see if that improves the etchy highs and flat soundstage that I experienced on my first try with the Origin Live armboard, though. Hopefully soon. :/
FWIW, Steve at Herbie's Audio did recommend the Big Tall Tenderfeet as being better than the Isonoes, though I'd already bought the Isonoes by that point, and the Tenderfeet aren't really adjustable without shimming. Can't actually speak to which is better for sound. The Isonoes are a lot cheaper right now direct from the UK post-Brexit, which is why I started tinkering with the Technics again. Racket balls and sorbothane domes sound like crap.
Still haven't found time to make an grungebuster armboard gasket to see if that improves the etchy highs and flat soundstage that I experienced on my first try with the Origin Live armboard, though. Hopefully soon. :/
Isonoes cheaper you say? Hmm.
Packgrog
30-09-2016, 16:40
I don't remember if there are rules against external links, but I got my Isonoes from Analogue Seduction. You pay shipping, but you don't pay VAT. Substantially less than current US list prices at the moment, but still over $100 ($118.86 + shipping as of this posting). Big Tall Tenderfeet would be $65.96 + shipping from Herbie's Audio. The Isonoes are definitely prettier, but at half the price, maybe the Tenderfeet are the better buy. Which would actually do a better job for sound quality I don't know. If some kind soul wanted to send some BT Tenderfeet to me to demo, I'd gladly provide recordings using each set of feet to help show the actual differences. :P
The kab fluid dampner stopped me changing arms and fitting Isonoes made a improvment also what effect did the dynomat have been thinks of doing it ?
Packgrog
06-11-2016, 01:47
If sticking with the stock arm, the fluid damper is essential. Probably a rewire as well, though I never tried that.
The kab fluid dampner stopped me changing arms and fitting Isonoes made a improvement. Also what effect did the Dynamat have, been thinks of doing it ?
The Dynamat mod has the effect of unmasking a lot of detail in the music. All the notes and sounds sound more realistic because I now hear more of the harmonics of instruments and voices. Sort of like installing a better cartridge. A few days ago I took my platter damping even further. There is a channel at the outer edge of the underside of the platter. I filled this channel with siliconized acrylic caulk. The result? Applying the Dynamat reduced the platter "ring" by a huge amount. Adding the caulk took the effect to an even higher level. Personally, I think this is one of the best bang-for-the-buck mods you can do on the Techie. Less than $30 in parts, you can't beat it.
Now about the fluid damper. You say it stopped you from changing arms? Hmm, adding a damper to the straight arm mod idea I got from Qwin might just make things world class :cool:
;) was the Kool Aid at least tasty?
;) was the Kool Aid at least tasty?
Thread crap much?
Rickey I made my own fluid damper same principle as the KAB.
In my case it worked very well on the std techie arm.
I have my prototype here if you fancy some DIY/ play with it (and some thick silicon fluid) before making a major spend.
Indeed, I'd fancy a look at that :hmm:
A few days ago I took my platter damping even further. There is a channel at the outer edge of the underside of the platter. I filled this channel with siliconized acrylic caulk. The result? Applying the Dynamat reduced the platter "ring" by a huge amount. Adding the caulk took the effect to an even higher level.
In case anyone wanted to experiment with this, here is a pic of what it looks like. The caulk is the stuff that comes in a squeeze tube used to seal around sinks & tubs. I used the edge of a credit card to remove the excess and smooth it out some. Yes, it could be neater but it's hidden in use so I don't worry about it.
https://photos.smugmug.com/ComponentMods/SL-1200Mk2/i-L7gHDxZ/0/L/100_1386-L.jpg
In case anyone wanted to experiment with this, here is a pic of what it looks like. The caulk is the stuff that comes in a squeeze tube used to seal around sinks & tubs. I used the edge of a credit card to remove the excess and smooth it out some. Yes, it could be neater but it's hidden in use so I don't worry about it.
And... somehow? That load of goop.. doesn't ruin the platter's balance ?
I think there's an equally sized load of goop on the other side, to make it all work out.
That said, the -1200 never had a balanced platter, that was reserved for the SP's. Also, the Techincs rubber damper was just glued in at the factory; only manufacturing tolerances kept it centered, and remember we're talking about glue and rubber.
I've had some at-length conversations with people who have filled their platters with lead and glued (epoxy) it in, and a guy who has just filled the inside with a never-gets-completly-hard epoxy, and in all cases they have not reported any issues with balance. It's just not an issue if you take rudimentary precautions to keep it from getting grossly off-balance.
And... somehow? That load of goop.. doesn't ruin the platter's balance ?
Don't forget that the goop is applied to the entire channel around the underside of the platter ;)
The stock Techie platter makes a right nice gong. Just hold it by one of the finger holes and strike the rim with a wooden spoon or some such and you'll hear what I'm talking about.
Maybe someone will do the "Goop Mod" to a stock platter and report back?
Ever grab a ringing bell or gong by the rim and see how fast the sound stops? That's the principal at work here. Applying a layer of Dynamat Extreme and a bit of goop (tub & tile caulk) absolutely leaves the pitiful damping of the stock undermat in the dust. Does this work as well as a good aftermarket platter? I doubt it, but I spent less than the cost of a good mat for a very good improvement :cool:
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