Isolating a turntable - the definitive word?

[Phil Lawton]

Looking to isolate my turntable after I build a rack for my whole set up.

I've read that spikes for a TT are good, but then I've also read that sorbathane hemispheres or the likes are better, preferably under a separate platform with the TT itself spiked or also sorbathaned (is that even a verb?) atop the platform.

What's the actual lowdown? I know there's a difference between coupling and decoupling of TTs, but I find the contrary advice somewhat bewildering.

My TT is an Acoustic Research "The Turntable", with a suspended deck (if that makes any difference) and my floors are solid with next to zero thru-traffic in the vicinity of the gear.

Aesthetically, a spiked TT is very pleasing, but I want to achieve performance over looks, primarily...if I can tart it up in the process, all the better, but the focus has to be the sound.

Any sage advice, folks?

[karma67]

stick it on a wall mounted shelf/rack is best for suspended turntables,you dont really want anything bouncy supporting it as it fights the springs in the turntable,failing that an ikea lack table is great so i hear. i have mine on top of a rack on 2 boards with plasticine in between. i plan to make a mana wall mounted shelf when i can be arsed :)

[struth]

Aye i had one on a wall shelf.. Ive just taken it down from the shed wall actually... Someone asked about it a while back but you know my memory..lol..... Best with a fairly solid wall but i had mine on plasterboard and it was fine

[SquireC]

Best solution I've found is a bamboo butchers block (Mason Cash) - check you turntables dimensions to make sure it will fit - An LP12 does.

Put some form of feet under the block, acrylic is best (IMHO), and not at the corners ( not under the turntables feet). You can secure the acrylic with a tiny bit of blu tack.

Controls the bass, cleans the bass up. Allows your turntable to perform at its best (IMHO)

Mine is on top of Atacama glass shelves.

[lovejoy]

How about this for slightly off the wall? Those silver pucks are 'Spike Sound Will' isolating magnetic levitation discs from Korea. It took me some time to get them spaced correctly to get an equal amount of weight from the deck onto each puck so that they all floated, but it works amazingly well. You won't get much more isolated than that. I had them lying around after a failed experiment with trying them under my CD a good while back. The magnets caused havoc with the toroidal transformer, so in a drawer they went. I forgot about them for ages, then when I dug them out, I thought 'I wonder...'. My concern was that they'd cause havoc with my cartridge, but no problems there at all. I guess it's far enough away from the magnetic field to not be affected by it.


http://i609.photobucket.com/albums/tt177/lovejoy23uk/Well%20Tempered%20Classic/IMG_20160502_145329539.jpg (http://s609.photobucket.com/user/lovejoy23uk/media/Well%20Tempered%20Classic/IMG_20160502_145329539.jpg.html)

[struth]

I used mag levs under my last TT. worked well sound wise for me. They were uk versions

[StuN]

The conventional starting premise seems to be that if it is a suspended deck (ie, sprung) then couple it (spikes, solid feet etc) and if it is a non-suspended deck, then decouple it (springs, levitation, sorbothene etc).

Then experiment to find what sounds better for you!

[struth]

I got it all wrong then:) and still have lol

[Oldpinkman]

As others have noted, squishy feet are a (poor) substitute for a sprung suspension, and would not be how I will mount my tt (if it ever comes back). The hard rubber feet on a hardboard Base were deliberate termination on that deck. Solid is what's needed for sitting it on, and mine is going on a rigid shelf (which has made it here) on a solid outside wall. A solution I have used before, a long time ago, in a universe (Kent) far far away...

[Phil Lawton]

As others have noted, squishy feet are a (poor) substitute for a sprung suspension, and would not be how I will mount my tt (if it ever comes back). The hard rubber feet on a hardboard Base were deliberate termination on that deck. Solid is what's needed for sitting it on, and mine is going on a rigid shelf (which has made it here) on a solid outside wall. A solution I have used before, a long time ago, in a universe (Kent) far far away...

The AR already has solid rubber feet on it - so is it safe for me to assume I don't need to do anything else to/with it?

A wall-shelf would be great, but I'm not sure that the wall it would need to go on would take the weight.

[walpurgis]

Isolation is good. More isolation can be better, but then results start becoming unpredictable. Sympathetic resonances can appear between the various 'compliances', producing undesirable effects. Unless one possesses measuring equipment, experimentation is the only way to sort out what works.

I like wall shelves for turntables. There is usually a way to produce a solid wall fixing, but establishing the type of wall construction is best of course.

[MarginWalker]

it all rather depends on your floor. If you have concrete floors you should be OK. i have suspended floorboards and the only way to avoid my Thorens skipping when anyone went near it was to have it on a wall shelf.

[The Chronicals]

Ive tried a couple of things, and noticed

Granite (30mm suspended on Vibrapods) gave more bass extension

Acrylic (suspended on Vibrpods) gave my top end and seperation

I went with 20mm acrylic on Vibrapods for my Gyrodec, but if I was using a more clinical solid state system I would probably prefer the granite.

[CornishPasty]

My own opinion is that some turntables need connecting to the shelf they are sat on either by hard feet or whatever so that energy built up in the plinth has somewhere to go. This can be a two way thing ie energy can travel either way so a light lossy shelf on a decent frame mounted on a substantial solid wall will hopefully keep energy from the outside world from disturbing your turntable and allow energy from your turntable to drain away. My own turntable is supported on a wall mounted shelf but also sits on ball bearings in machined cups. The idea is that they work as a mechanical filter. The deck is free to float around on these and it did take some getting used to but it seems to work. I'd rather have them than not. I don't think there's any hard and fast rule, just some guidelines and you really have to try things out for yourself and use your own judgement.

[walpurgis]

My setup is different. I have a rigidly mounted arm on a hefty and solid turntable, which sits on typical Japanese turntable feet with minimal isolation. This sits on a thick, solid, shelf mounted on heavy steel wall brackets using rubber bushes between the shelf and brackets. Not much give anywhere really. Sounds sublime.

[Haselsh1]

Way back around '97 or so, I had a good long chat with Tom Fletcher and his advice was to buy a huge solid pine table as a support and not waste lots of money on irrelevant turntable supports. I still have my pine table all these years later.

[Haselsh1]

it all rather depends on your floor. If you have concrete floors you should be OK. i have suspended floorboards and the only way to avoid my Thorens skipping when anyone went near it was to have it on a wall shelf.

LOL... I used to have the exact same problem but I now have concrete floors.

[CornishPasty]

Way back around '97 or so, I had a good long chat with Tom Fletcher and his advice was to buy a huge solid pine table as a support and not waste lots of money on irrelevant turntable supports. I still have my pine table all these years later.

That may have been ok for one of Tom's turntables.

[Virtual-Symmetry]

I use a solid base but sit the turntable on stiff/low mass platform ie: Torlyte.

[moffer]

My own opinion is that some turntables need connecting to the shelf they are sat on either by hard feet or whatever so that energy built up in the plinth has somewhere to go. This can be a two way thing ie energy can travel either way so a light lossy shelf on a decent frame mounted on a substantial solid wall will hopefully keep energy from the outside world from disturbing your turntable and allow energy from your turntable to drain away. My own turntable is supported on a wall mounted shelf but also sits on ball bearings in machined cups. The idea is that they work as a mechanical filter. The deck is free to float around on these and it did take some getting used to but it seems to work. I'd rather have them than not. I don't think there's any hard and fast rule, just some guidelines and you really have to try things out for yourself and use your own judgement.

Similar mode of thought here. I improved the sonics of my turntable by replacing the stock feet with aluminium and brass spikes, which significantly lowered the noise floor. I thought that coupling the deck to a heavy, inert support would be best at transferring and dissipating resonances from within the deck and chose a homemade sandbox, which seems to work just fine.

As you say, there's no hard and fast rules, it's just a matter of experimenting as the end result may not be favourable in all set-ups. Definitely worth trying though as some spikes are not expensive and you can attach them with double sided sticky pads, at least as a temporary measure. I bought cheap spikes to try out then got something more substantial, and expensive.

[CornishPasty]

The sand box is a good idea. Unlike a heavy solid shelf which can store energy the sand box really does allow energy to dissipate. I'm going to replace my wall mounted racking soon with something a bit more substantial so I might just try a sand box.

[Saber]

Got my dual on an skyline platform, Kinda lucked out £5 from gumtree. the spikes are sittign on a sanwich of black rubber furniture feet with a 2 pence peice between them so it doesnt scratch the Ikea Kallax below it. Not the last word in isolation but even with old bouncy wooden floors and my son runnign round cant say ive had any problems.

http://i870.photobucket.com/albums/ab261/empire2600/WP_20160529_001.jpg (http://s870.photobucket.com/user/empire2600/media/WP_20160529_001.jpg.html)

[Phil Lawton]

Chuckling to myself...so the definitive word is spikes....or hard rubber feet...or a pine table...or a wall shelf...or a granite plinth.

This is why I love this place.

Thanks for all the input, chaps. I'll probably just carry on without doing anything.

[Saber]

Phil Lawton

"Chuckling to myself...so the definitive word is spikes....or hard rubber feet...or a pine table...or a wall shelf...or a granite plinth". :) True True

I Would just buy the first Plinth, or wall shelf or isolation thingy that you see for under a £10 then If it has spikes get a set of cheap isolation rubbers or vise versa so you can try both, most people who have been in this for a long time seemed to have tried every combination going and ultimatly you will never know untill you hear them yourself.

mind you I find the Tweaking and swapping Half the fun :)

[Virtual-Symmetry]

Chuckling to myself...so the definitive word is spikes....or hard rubber feet...or a pine table...or a wall shelf...or a granite plinth.

This is why I love this place.

Thanks for all the input, chaps. I'll probably just carry on without doing anything.

:lol:

[Virtual-Symmetry]

John
You wont go far wrong with that 'Skyline' jobbie.

[CornishPasty]

Phil, we don't all have the same turntable, many are modified, so there can be no definitive word though I think most of us agree that a decent wall mounted turntable support is a good starting point.

[Saber]

John
You wont go far wrong with that 'Skyline' jobbie.

Yeah I did get lucky there. Mad thing is I nearly didnt send the seller a message as it had been on Gumtree for a week and I figured for a £5 it would be long gone.

[daytona600]

bamboo chopping board & Minus K
£15 or £ 10k+ depends on budget

http://www.minusk.com/img/bm8_minus_k_simon_yorke_turntable_audio_vibration_ isolator.jpg

[harc]

Bought some extra large Isonodes for my Technics SL1000/2 and Garrard 401/bamboo plinth.No more worries with the grandkids jumping on the old floor boards now.And they sound better.
http://www.brightstaraudio.com/isonode.html

[danilo]

That's Great! As close to a Steampunk build turntable as I've ever seen.
Hopefully the sonics equal the looks?

Lookit at this Exquisite Zepplin style desk lamp ~2500$ on bespoke order last time I saw

17180

[Phil Lawton]

Phil, we don't all have the same turntable, many are modified, so there can be no definitive word though I think most of us agree that a decent wall mounted turntable support is a good starting point.

Ralph, I get that, I really do, but part of my original question regarded coupling and decoupling of turntables. I've read that people have done both and wondered what was the generally accepted scientific (stop laughing at the back there) opinion.

[Woodhead]

Eyup Phil, this is worth a read:
http://www.barrydiamentaudio.com/vibration.htm

[Phil Lawton]

Eyup Phil, this is worth a read:
http://www.barrydiamentaudio.com/vibration.htm

Thanks, David...I don't really understand what he's describing (specifically, marbles in pine "Easter egg holders"), but interesting all the same.