Thorens TD160 Restoration Project

[Wakefield Turntables]

I decided to buy a Thorens deck as a little side project whilst I waited for some upgrades to be done to my valve system. This example came from eBay.

16651

I decided to take things slowly and have done this work over several weeks.

A quick speed check revealed it was spinning at 33.9 RPM :eek: or 1.77% too fast.

16655


I decided to see how old the deck was.


16653


1974 vintage, so the deck is nearly 42 years old.

16652

Firstly the deck needed removing from it's plinth. I decided to give it a clean. This was just some IPA over the top plate. Yuck.

This TD160 had a SME 3009 fitted and is missing the Thorens arm-cue mechanism, a bit of a blessing as this makes things easier on the underside.

The plinth externally was in very good condition but internal inspection shows a plinth with compromised integrity.

16654

It looks like this deck was removed from a radiogram, I wonder what the additional sockets are in the back of the plinth. It makes no different to be honest as the plinth is going to be replaced.

[walpurgis]

A well set up TD160 can sound remarkably good.

[Wakefield Turntables]

I stripped the suspension springs out and assessed them. The original foam dampeners were removed but saved.

16656

The rubbers, springs and nuts were then cleaned. Firstly in warm soapy water and then with cotton buds and IPA.

16657166581665916660

As we can see they had 42 years worth of grime. These will be massaged with KY jelly to re-lubricate and keep them supple. They are still in good order.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Attention was paid to the belts. I decided to clean them and then do a fresh speed check. The belts were pretty scuzzy.

16661

Things did not improve and the deck was still running at 33.9RPM. I decided that the best thing to do was to simply bin the belts and order new. I decided to order a Thakker belt. OK, it's not Thorens but this project is fun and I intend to keep costs down. I'm still waiting for the belt.

I decided to strip out the cabling. On examination it looked pretty good so I decided to simply give the cable a good wipe, replace the plug, resolder and tin the ends and add an additional new fuse. I had a Bussman silver fuse and a silver plated Tough plug floating around so these got added onto the cable. A small upgrade but one which will hopefully improve the sonic. The old plug and fuse were kept.

1666216663

The cable was re-tinned and new plug fitted. Now it looks much smarter.

1666416665

That's enough for tonight, more tomorrow.

[struth]

Start of a nice walk through for folks Andy

[Wakefield Turntables]

Well I hope someone can benefit Grant. These are not hard decks and are quite easy to work on.

[skimminstones]

I decided to see how old the deck was.


16653


1974 vintage, so the deck is nearly 42 years old.



My platter doesnt have a date on it, looks like its either worn out or been scrubbed off. Anyway of checking the age based on the serial number? Cant seem to find it on google.

Look forward to your thread though, i love my TD160. Will you be adding separate rca sockets or keeping it original?

[Wakefield Turntables]

Mine dosen't have any RCA's so I'll have to use the ones which arrive with the tonearm cable when I buy a new tonearm.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Tonights pictures detail a little work on the bearing spindle.

16680

Removal of the inner platter reveals a spindle thats been pretty badly beaten up, in ground oil, ? a little rust. I wiped the spindle down with IPA to remove grease and oil and then prepared a soak to try and remove further dirt and grime.

16681

The spindle got soaked in warm soapy water to remove excess oil. I dried the spindle with cotton wool. I then lightly polished the spindle and after polishing I cleaned the spindle down again with IPA. The spindle was then reoiled by simply dribbling oil down the shaft of spindle. I'll probably end up sub merging in an oil bath for 24 hours when I ready to finalise the suspension springs.

16682

The spindle is damaged but a hell of a lot cleaner than when I first got my hands on it. I've done some platter spinning tests and that platters spinning like a good 'un. This deck is only going to be used for old charity and second hand shop records so I'm not that bothered if things don't sound perfect. The outer platter now needed some attention. A quick inspection revealed years of wear and tear from old belts, the outer platter had some pitting and what felt like calcium deposits (probably dirt and grime). The outer platter was IPA prepped, washed down with warm soapy water, dried, cleaned with IPA and then polished. I was left with a very very smooth to the finish outer platter and considerably cleaner than when I started.

16683

Finally the inner rim of the inner platter was polished.

16684

And that is the inner platter serviced. More tomorrow night.

[struth]

a couple of cheap but big improvements can be made by fitting a thick base of mdf. and adding either cork or that sticky black stuff to the underneath of the motor plate and inner platter... i prefer cork.
also SRM Tech do platter sorbothane tripods for about £7 pounds.. these really bring the deck up a fair bit Andy, and for maybe £25 pounds is cheap as chips.

[Wakefield Turntables]

a couple of cheap but big improvements can be made by fitting a thick base of mdf. and adding either cork or that sticky black stuff to the underneath of the motor plate and inner platter... i prefer cork.
also SRM Tech do platter sorbothane tripods for about £7 pounds.. these really bring the deck up a fair bit Andy, and for maybe £25 pounds is cheap as chips.

Already done, Grant! I'll be posting some pix at some point.

[danilo]

Wondering about the rpm variance. My old Thorens tachs 'perfectly' ... Still.
Thickness of the rubber belt impacts on Rpm though... totally counterintuitive, but True.
An Oem belt might be the RPM solution?
Could one fit an earlier sub-platter/spindle ?
Never a big fan of the ones that had a pointy end rather than the earlier captive ball bearing

[Wakefield Turntables]

Wondering about the rpm variance. My old Thorens tachs 'perfectly' ... Still.
Thickness of the rubber belt impacts on Rpm though... totally counterintuitive, but True.
An Oem belt might be the RPM solution?
Could one fit an earlier sub-platter/spindle ?
Never a big fan of the ones that had a pointy end rather than the earlier captive ball bearing

Danilo,

I've got the RPM down to 33.7 rpm which is still some way away from 33.3rpm this was achieved by simply cleaning the belt and platter. My new belt hasn't arrived and I've still not set the suspension up properly so I think I should be able to improve on 33.7rpm!! This is only a fun project and if it runs a little quickly that's ok.

[struth]

I doubt you would hear that tbh.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Only a very minor update tonight, the electrics! This TD160 is about as simple as it gets. Basically I have the on/off switch and then the 33/45 selector. I firstly tested the 3 resistors in the little white plastic box, this is the rectangular box on the left of the picture below. All resistors tested within 5% tolerance of the stated values with the TD160 manual, so I'm happy and whilst this might explain why the TD160 runs a little quick I'm happy that I only had to get my multimeter out and not the soldering iron. :)

16691

The next thing to be dismanted was the 33/45 selector.

16692

Solder joints looked to be in fantastic order, no loose wires and both 33 and 45 rpm work when requested. I decided to dismantle and clean anyway.

16693

Putting this back together again was a complete PITA! I did eventually manage to get it all together again.

16694

That's it for tonight. Tomorrow's update is base board upgrade! Till tomorrow, see yeah.......

[Wakefield Turntables]

I doubt you would hear that tbh.

I've heard quite a few run too quick @ 33rpm, this example I own seems to spin at 33.7 rpm & 45.3 rpm!!!!!

[struth]

Most non vernier decks like thorens run slightly fast. they are designed that way

[Wakefield Turntables]

BASEBOARDS BASEBOARDS BASEBOARDS!!!

The standard baseboard supplied by Thorens is pretty flimsy. It's 3mm chipboard and has more holes in it than a Swiss cheese.

16702

The feet are also pretty useless, they are simple rubber feet with a small hole in the middle which hides a 3mm by 30mm screw that fits the baseboard to the TD160's plinth. Over time these feet warp and can lead to the deck being unlevel.

16703

Thorens realised the baseboard was pretty poor and offered a thicker upgrade which was also included in the TD160 super, the feet unfortunately remained. The interner usually suggested replacing the original baseboard with birchply or MDF. I choose MDF due to the additional weight, easy ability to drill and better finish when spraying with paint. I hate working with birchply.

16704

I used the original baseboard as a template and simply cut a new baseboard, this was an old piece of MDF salvaged from the garage. All holed were filled in with wood filler. I wanted the ability to level the TD160 so I found some spiked feet and fitted them to the new baseboard. I also decided to use x4 35mm 4mm screws which are beefier than the old Thorens offerings and should hopefully improve the union between the baseboard to the plinth.

16705

The baseboard was sprayed satin black.

16706

[Wakefield Turntables]

BASEBOARDS PT2


16707

A close up of the new thicker improved baseboard with beefier screws, adjustable spiked feet and 12mm MDF.

16708

The new baseboard fitted with just one hole for the power lead, the baseboard will be modified when I purchase a tonearm for the deck.

16709

A final photograph showing a front on view of the new thicker baseboard.

Tomorrow's update details replinthing the TD160.

[helma]

Most non vernier decks like thorens run slightly fast. they are designed that way

A Thorens with the right (original) belt should run spot on, I don't think they were designed crippled from the get go :) As they didn't use a standard size, the original belt is the only one I've found with the thickness just right. All the aftermarket belts I've seen have been either too thick (running fast) or too thin (slow). Haven't tried the Thakker belt though. After two different aftermarket belts I figured might as well get the original since it will last years anyway.

[Wakefield Turntables]

A Thorens with the right (original) belt should run spot on, I don't think they were designed crippled from the get go :) As they didn't use a standard size, the original belt is the only one I've found with the thickness just right. All the aftermarket belts I've seen have been either too thick (running fast) or too thin (slow). Haven't tried the Thakker belt though. After two different aftermarket belts I figured might as well get the original since it will last years anyway.

Kai, you are probably correct and if this was my only deck I would have spent the extra money on an original Thorens belt. This is my 4th turntable!! I decided I needed a third to save the wear and tear on the other decks as well as additional hours on my valves :). I'm not that bothered if the deck runs a little fast/slow, this project has been fun and has passed the days away whilst I've been waiting for my valve amps return.

[HackneyRF]

Thanks so much for sharing your work Andrew. I've made some changes to my 160 already with the help of AoS members but your walk through is invaluable.

Cheers

Loz

[YNWaN]

Unfortunately I would say that bearing shaft is buggered - not by you, by the original corrosion. However, I would also say that my own experience of the TD160 is that the bearing liners are not very high tolerance items and quite a lot of slack exists in the bearing - so the corrosion damage may not be as big a deal as it could be.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Unfortunately I would say that bearing shaft is buggered - not by you, by the original corrosion. However, I would also say that my own experience of the TD160 is that the bearing liners are not very high tolerance items and quite a lot of slack exists in the bearing - so the corrosion damage may not as big a deal as it could be.

Hi Mark,

I'm sad to say I came to the same conclusion. As stated, it's only a bit of fun. This isn't a bad little deck and will function perfectly to play charity shop / car boot finds. I'm sure it'll make a fine noise when it's finished!!

[Wakefield Turntables]

THE PLINTH

This is the old plinth that my TD160 was housed in. It's in very good condition externally but looks are deceptive.

16722

A quick look inside reveals some nasty modifications.

16723

I have no idea what these are but they are none standard and have compromised the integrity of the plinth. The old plinth looked quite flimsy.

16724

A quick plea to fellow AOSer's for a new plinth garnered the follow results (BIG THANKS TO GRANT)! A deal was done and a new plinth arrived.

16725

Externally and internally much better. And I note an additional wooden mounting block for the wiring. The old plinth was removed by simply unscrewing the four outer most (and largest) screw on the top plate of the TD160. You should be left with something which looks like this.

16726

[Wakefield Turntables]

PLINTH PT2

You should have x4 large screws sitting around and also x4 mounting columns. They looks like this
. 16728

These now need to be cleaned. I choose to clean with ultrasonic cleaning and then metal polish. You then need to insert one mounting column on each triangular corner strut in the new plinth, like so...

16729

You now need to mount the TD160 on top of the new plinth and make sure that each of the four corner screw holes align with the mounting columns and then simply screw each corner down with the screw saved over from when you demounted the TD160.

16730

The TD160 now looks like this..

16731

We have come a long way. Tomorrow we talk about cable management under the TD160.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Over the next few days/weeks I shall be discussing.

Dampening the subplatter
Install a new tonerarm
Fabricating a new tonearm board
Installation of a simple VTA adjuster for the tonearm
Production of a simple platter mat.

[Wakefield Turntables]

I decided to keep the original platter mat, this saves time and money.

I ordered some Dynamat on Sunday so I should have some fun dampening the sub-chasis at some point this week. :eek:

Tonights update is quite minor and boring but also important.

CABLE MANAGEMENT

My TD160 has only three pieces of wiring.

1. The PSU.
2. The tonearm cabling (Non existant at the moment due to no tonerarm)!!!
3. The 33/45 selector switch

Removing the base plinth reveals the cabling looking something like this.

16736

This is the new plinth from Grant and it differs from the old one in that it has a mounting block and bracket for wiring, bonus! The wiring needs to be attached to the wiring block so a quick rummage finds three screws of appropiate length to fix the PSU cable and junction.


16737

Care should be taken that no wires get caught in the sub-chasis or place any excessive drag on the sub-chassis.

16738

The underside of the TD160 now looks neat and just awaits the Tonearm cabling to be installed. I'll write about this another time. Over the next few days I hope to cover suspension tuning and dampening of the sub-chasis.

The journey continues. :eek:

[Wakefield Turntables]

I'm getting a little stuck now as some of the parts I've ordered havent arrived. I decided to read through the TD160 super conversion manual. Thorens realised the pressed metal sub chassis was a bit pants and very resonant so they decided to offer an upgrade where you could dampen the underside of the sub chasis. Dynamat was ordered of Sunday so before it's arrival I made a very simple paper template yesterday evening and here are the results.

16744

I also made another slight modification. I decided to mount the resistors controlling the 33/45 speed selection onto the plinth with bluetac you can probably see two very large blobs holding the plastic case in position. I did this mainly to stop any vibration travelling down the grey wires into the sub chasis. Hopefully by using blutack and mounting on the plinth I sunk as much motor vibration as I could away from the sub chasis. The paper template will be used to cut the dynamat I really want to cover as much surface area as possible. I may even put a little under the bearing housing. There is no point is fine tuning the suspension until I've finished dampening the platter. The hunt for a semi-decent tonearm continues. I'd really like a cheapo rega unit if I can find one.

Hopefully we can progress tomorrow. ;)

[killie99]

Hmm, dynamat is very heavy and you may run into problems getting the suspension set up as the sub chassis will now be waaaaaaay out of balance rather than just a bit out of balance. You might end up with little or no spring travel or the other option is to use Nirvana springs which have a higher force. I ended up using cork on the sub chassis to still achieve a nice piston bounce. Use the dynamat on the underside of the top plate.

I should have some pics somewhere, I'll see if I can find them and post them.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Hmm, dynamat is very heavy and you may run into problems getting the suspension set up as the sub chassis will now be waaaaaaay out of balance rather than just a bit out of balance. You might end up with little or no spring travel or the other option is to use Nirvana springs which have a higher force. I ended up using cork on the sub chassis to still achieve a nice piston bounce. Use the dynamat on the underside of the top plate.

I should have some pics somewhere, I'll see if I can find them and post them.

Good point Stuart, I might just do as you've advised.

[Qwin]

If this model is anything like the TD-150 the springs are all the same rating but the amount of weight each sees, due their position relative to the centre of gravity, is very different. They end up at different lengths and tensions. I fitted lead weights to my 150 chassis so the springs were all seeing the same weight when fully loaded including arm, mat and a record, it gave it a nice even bounce by doing this, very piston like.

Is the Platter two piece and the same as a TD-150? The reason I ask, is that I have a spare inner platter off a TD150 with a good spindle, if it would fit the 160 you can have it at postage cost.

[walpurgis]

It could be argued that by evening out the weight distribution, the mass resonances the springs are working with are closer. Hence, they may add together and at particular frequencies the resonance amplitude will be greater. Not desirable.

[killie99]

Good point Stuart, I might just do as you've advised.

Here's a pic of what I did to dampen a TD160 - cork on the subchassis, dynamat on the top plate and a load of blutak (except it's white :) )

http://stuartlittlejohn.f2s.com/topplate3.jpg

[Wakefield Turntables]

I'll not be doing the blutack as its an additional expense to a deck that only going to be used occasionally. The dynamat is on order and I already have some cork in stock so I think I'll probably go ahead and use Dynamat on top plate and cork on the sub-chasis.

[killie99]

the whitetak was £1 from a local discount store - Home Bargains.

[Wakefield Turntables]

If this model is anything like the TD-150 the springs are all the same rating but the amount of weight each sees, due their position relative to the centre of gravity, is very different. They end up at different lengths and tensions. I fitted lead weights to my 150 chassis so the springs were all seeing the same weight when fully loaded including arm, mat and a record, it gave it a nice even bounce by doing this, very piston like.

Is the Platter two piece and the same as a TD-150? The reason I ask, is that I have a spare inner platter off a TD150 with a good spindle, if it would fit the 160 you can have it at postage cost.

That's a very kind offer Ken, I'm in the process of organising a tonearm. I've decided to restrict the budget to £300 on this project, the tonearm is probably going to take up the thick end of what's left over, I'm at about £170 so far. I'll give you a shout when the tonearm arrives.


the whitetak was £1 from a local discount store - Home Bargains.

yep, that's another quid towards the cost of the tonearm.

[walpurgis]

You have to be careful with cheap 'BluTak' alternatives. If used on porous surfaces, they impregnate them with oil. Even proper BluTak does this eventually.

[Wakefield Turntables]

You have to be careful with cheap 'BluTak' alternatives. If used on porous surfaces, they impregnate them with oil. Even proper BluTak does this eventually.

I did think about this and didn't want the hassle of removing the blutack or the oil damage.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Looks like the project hasn't stalled.Dynamat arrived today, more cork for the subchasis, a new tonearm sourced and potentially a better spindle. Just need the belt!

[Wakefield Turntables]

No pix tonight. I'm messing around with Dynamat. I've half covered the underside of the top plate and managed to get a cork template cut for the underside of the sub-chasis. I'll post some pictures when it's finished. Tonearm has been paid for, now to bag that spindle.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Finally finished the Dynamat which has now been cut and applied to the top plate. The suspended inner sub-chasis has been lighted dampened with 3mm cork which only adds several grams to it's weight. Everything has been re-assembled.
16759

I've been messing around with the suspension of the motor and managed to slightly improve the speed of the platter to 33.7rpm

16760

The new belt and suspension fine tuning will hopefully improve the final RPM value.

The project is moving along nicely. I have a new inner platter a big thanks to KEN. I have a new tonearm on it's way, a vintage Rega (never owned a vintage version). I also have a new belt on it's way. Sadly, the project is coming to an end. The two biggest challenges are fine tuning the suspension and fabricating a REGA tonearm board. Right that's it for tonight. I'm off to do a little research on the tonearm board.

[Jimbo]

Finally finished the Dynamat which has now been cut and applied to the top plate. The suspended inner sub-chasis has been lighted dampened with 3mm cork which only adds several grams to it's weight. Everything has been re-assembled.
16759

I've been messing around with the suspension of the motor and managed to slightly improve the speed of the platter to 33.7rpm

16760

The new belt and suspension fine tuning will hopefully improve the final RPM value.

The project is moving along nicely. I have a new inner platter a big thanks to KEN. I have a new tonearm on it's way, a vintage Rega (never owned a vintage version). I also have a new belt on it's way. Sadly, the project is coming to an end. The two biggest challenges are fine tuning the suspension and fabricating a REGA tonearm board. Right that's it for tonight. I'm off to do a little research on the tonearm board.

Looking good Andy, I have been thinking of adding a bit if dynamat to my Lenco as a bit of stealth internal damping!

[Wakefield Turntables]

Jim,

This is just a side project till the Croft and Sondex come back. Dynamat is pretty easy to work with. I have no idea if this has made any improvement what so ever to this deck. I've done my usual "do all the upgrades at the same time" thing. Pretty sad really as I wont be able to enjoy each incremental improvement. This project will be undergoing some pretty big changes in next 7-14 days. :eyebrows:

[Wakefield Turntables]

It's been a bit quiet lately but today I recieved 2 packages. A new inner platter thanks to Qwin (Ken) and an old Rega R200 tonearm from RodgerDodger (Roger), thanks chaps. This has meant the the deck has come on leaps and bounds. Ken supplied a replacement inner platter from the TD150 which is a direct drop in replacement for the TD160 inner platter the only difference being the TD160 uses a hardened spindle end whilst the TD150 platter utilises a ball bearing. I must say that the platter is quiter and seems to get to speed slightly quicker. Ken also supplied an upgraded thrust plate which is now sitting in the bottom of the platter spindle housing on the sub-chasis.


16767

This upgrade and the better thrust plate has increased the speed stability of the deck by a further 0.1 rpm, I'm now down to 33.6 rpm, I've actually had it at 33.5rpm a few times so I'm still hopeful that I should be able to hit 33.3rpm with further suspension tweeking and the replacement belt. I'm still running 0.9% too fast, this still a big improvement from when the deck was running 1.8% too fast:eek:.

16768

The baseboard needed to be modded again to accomodate the new tonearm. I decided to spray the inside of the base board as well to improve the cosmetic appearence of the deck.

16769

Now that I have a tonearm I need to start thinking about fabricating a new tonearm board. I've decided to use black 3mm homocopolymer its stiffer than the old Thorens jobby and quite easy to work with. I've managed to find x3 long threaded bolts which will be modified so the tonarm's VTF can easily be changed. I've also donwloaded the R200 manual and shall begin designing the tonearm board over the next week, should be pretty easy once I've had a good read, I just need some nuts and washers to match the bolts.

16770

Finally, heres a cheeky peek at what the finished deck will look like, i've loosely fitted the Rega tonearm in place. The plinth will get a polish and the platter mat will get a decent clean to removed the ingrained crap.

16771

The last job willl be suspension tuning i can't see the point in doing that until I have the tonearm properly mounted.

[struth]

Going to look rather good Andy. Should sound very decent too

[Jimbo]

Just as a matter of interest Andy, how are you going to clean the platter mat. I have an old Lenco Mat that is in fairly good nick but would like to get it looking as new.

There must be a technique:scratch:

[Wakefield Turntables]

Just as a matter of interest Andy, how are you going to clean the platter mat. I have an old Lenco Mat that is in fairly good nick but would like to get it looking as new.

There must be a technique:scratch:

Mildly warm soapy water and a tooth brush, gently scrub the grooves and then wash the mat with clean water and then simply allow to dry.

[Qwin]

Glad the platter/spindle arrived ok Andrew and more importantly that it works well in your bearing.
Coming together nicely.
After many years in the vinyl wilderness, a renovated Thorens TD-150 with Roksan Tabriz tone arm is what got me back on track, these old Thorens decks are capable of impressive performance.

[helma]

Just as a matter of interest Andy, how are you going to clean the platter mat. I have an old Lenco Mat that is in fairly good nick but would like to get it looking as new.

There must be a technique:scratch:

I've used dishwashing soap with good results with many mats, the kind for hand washing of course. What I do is rub the whole mat with generous amount of the stuff, put it in some kind of container, add some more dishwashing soap and just enough water so that the mat is fully submerged. Let it sit overnight and then rinse with plenty of water to get all the remaining soap off. With most rubbery mats this works wonders, makes the mat soft and supple again and restores some color if it was gray and dried out to start with. I think I also did this with my Lenco mat, with pretty good results, though it didn't respond to the treatment quite as well as some other mats. Try at your own risk obviously, though I have to say I haven't yet encountered a mat where harm was done, they've all benefited from it more or less. The more 'rubbery' the mat the more it will usually benefit from this.

[Jimbo]

I've used dishwashing soap with good results with many mats, the kind for hand washing of course. What I do is rub the whole mat with generous amount of the stuff, put it in some kind of container, add some more dishwashing soap and just enough water so that the mat is fully submerged. Let it sit overnight and then rinse with plenty of water to get all the remaining soap off. With most rubbery mats this works wonders, makes the mat soft and supple again and restores some color if it was gray and dried out to start with. I think I also did this with my Lenco mat, with pretty good results, though it didn't respond to the treatment quite as well as some other mats. Try at your own risk obviously, though I have to say I haven't yet encountered a mat where harm was done, they've all benefited from it more or less. The more 'rubbery' the mat the more it will usually benefit from this.

Thanks for the suggestion, I will give it a try.

What I would really like to achieve is that glossy new look! I wonder if there is anything you can use on the mat after washing to give it that glossy appearance.

I know WD 40 works well but not too good for vinyl!:lol:

[struth]

Maybe those back to black type products may do that nicely.

[Jimbo]

Maybe those back to black type products may do that nicely.

Ah yes, brilliant idea Grant! :thumbsup:

The sort of stuff they use on car rubber trim and tyres may do the trick. Might test it out on the back of the mat first!

[Barry]

Taken from The Knowledge: http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?7659-On-the-cosmetic-refurbishment-of-used-classic-or-vintage-audio-equipment

Rubber
The rubber mat of turntables can be cleaned and refurbished using car tyre cleaner such as

http://www.cleanchem.co.uk/autoglym-...s-5l-811-p.asp

or Demon Products CS C6430 ‘Tire Clean Fix’ tyre cleaner. See also: http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/accesso...yre-shine-2015.

[YNWaN]

The rubber may well benefit from these products but I wouldn't let them come into contact with any of my records.....

[Wakefield Turntables]

TONEARM Board fabrication

Today I will start rough fabrication of the tonearm board. I have some of the materials and will begin to produce what will be one of the last jobs on this project. It's drawing to an end. :wah:

[helma]

What I would really like to achieve is that glossy new look! I wonder if there is anything you can use on the mat after washing to give it that glossy appearance.


My original Thorens TD-160 mat basically looked like new (or at least very close to it) after the treatment - The Lenco mat looks ok, definitely better than before but not exactly glossy (nor black for that matter), then again I'm not sure what it has looked like originally. The material on the Lenco mat might probably benefit more from something else, not sure what though... I've heard brake fluid can work wonders on some rubber stuffsies, but haven't got the courage or need to try it on anything... There are all kinds of car related products that might help, but the problem with those is they often have stuff you don't really want on your TT mat. Like some of the revitalizers or "blackness enchancers" seem to be silicone based, leaving a shiny but slick coating I wouldn't want on my mat.

[Wakefield Turntables]

TONIGHTS UPDATE - PREP WORK - :(

I always hate doing prep work but tonight has all been about getting things together so that i can start the final push on this deck. So, tonight I got my Rega Baerwald protractor sorted for cartridge alignment. I ordered a step drill for finishing off the tonearm board, I need a 23mm hole in the Polypropylene I'm using. I also intend to make the Rega tonearm spacers from EVA for several main reasons, firstly is costs nothing as I have loads around, secondly it's good at vibration absorption so should add some dampening to the tonearm pillar, thirdly it's very easy to work with. I need to produce 17mm of spacers so that should be pretty easy to do. I took a walk down to the local Maplins and bought some isolation grommets and some M2 nuts.



16809

So this is the newly fabricated tonearm board. I managed to find x3 75mm M2 bolts in my garage but no M2 nuts or washers :doh:. VTA of the tonearm should be very easy now and its just a matter of altering the height of the tonearm board on the bolts. The tonearm board will be held into place along the shaft of the bolts with M2 nuts height adjustment is simply a case of altering the nuts position. I have not altered the screw holes in the subchasis but I may add some isolation grommets just like SME on there 3012 tonearm board. At the moment the x3 M2 bolts screw directly into the subchasis (it's an easy life)! I managed to mount the new tonearm board on the TD160 and prepared the drill hole for when the Step drill arrives, this is 222mm from bearing spindle to Tonearm pillar. I'll be using 3mm black polypropylene which is very easy to work with and again free, I have sheets of the stuff at work, it's slightly thicker and stiffer than the Thorens version it probably weighs no more either. I have tried to keep weight to a minimum as I dont wont to overload the sprung suspension, hence EVA & polypropylene for the tonearm spacers and tonearm board.

16808

I should be getting the Thakker belt tomorrow so I'll have some fun and games with the platter speed. I'm hoping for a decrease from 33.6rpm if not then ho-hum! Right I'm off.

[MarginWalker]

Thanks for the suggestion, I will give it a try.

What I would really like to achieve is that glossy new look! I wonder if there is anything you can use on the mat after washing to give it that glossy appearance.

I know WD 40 works well but not too good for vinyl!:lol:

When i had my car serviced they put tyre dressing on, which gave them a really glossy, new look so i guess that would work on a platter mat. Again, I'm not sure how good it would be for your records!

[Jimbo]

When i had my car serviced they put tyre dressing on, which gave them a really glossy, new look so i guess that would work on a platter mat. Again, I'm not sure how good it would be for your records!

I am going to try some anyway.:)

[MarginWalker]

I am going to try some anyway.:)

You're a braver man than me! Good luck.

[walpurgis]

I am going to try some anyway.:)

Don't do it! Never apply anything to a mat that could contaminate records.

[Justjon]

I'm a tech at a main dealer and our valeters love covering everything in that orrible stuff, trouble is when I'm working on the car I get covered in it too.
Why on earth you'd want to put any audio equipment/records near it is way beyond me :mental:

[Wakefield Turntables]

The only thing you should really apply to a turntable mat of this age is simple soap and water and then massage water based lubricant on the reverse side to keep the plasticity.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Two nice surprises this morning! The Thakker belt has finally turned up and the step drill bit has arrived. The project can now continue. ;)

[Wakefield Turntables]

MASSIVE UPDATE TONIGHT!

The Thakker belt has been a huge upgrade and now gives me 33.3 rpm, a massive upgrade from the very early 33.9 rpm :lol:

1685216853

The tonearm board has been fabricated and the new step drill bit has been put to good use. I have also setup the tonearm board with isolation gromets.

1685416855

I have finally made a spacer for the tonearm, it's still rough and really to be finished properly I may need to just grind a little off the bottom for the locking nut of the tonearm to fully work. This can all be done at work tomorrow.

16856

The tonearm spacer has been made from medium density EVA and will hopefully add some absorption of stray resonance into the tonearm. There are still many things to do. The tonearm geometry will need setting up, cartridge VTA and tracking will need setting up as well. Several areas of the TD160 will need a fresh oil change and that's pretty much it.

[walpurgis]

Nice to see your project coming together Andy. I reckon it'll sound surprisingly good. That armboard looks rather like some I've made from Tufnol/Paxolin. What headshell do you plan to use?

[Wakefield Turntables]

Nice to see your project coming together Andy. I reckon it'll sound surprisingly good. That armboard looks rather like some I've made from Tufnol/Paxolin. What headshell do you plan to use?

Well i probably use my ortofon magnesium headshell and the Shure v15mk3 to start with and just to make sure that the thing actually makes a noise, I've not tested the tonearm yet. When time permits I intend to mess around with other carts so I will probably be using a mixture of carts and headshells.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Well the old buggers working. Now just to set the thing up. Ah the joys of 1970's suspended decks. Platter needs levelling, tonearm board needs levelling and then tonearm geometry. All probably do this over next few days. It dosen't sound too bad (considering nothing was properly setup), a little lazy in presentation and anaemic compared to the 301 and 1210 that I own. I'm sure things will improve!!

[TAD12]

Andrew, do you still need the setup instructions for the R200 as per the other thread in this forum. I have found the original rega R200 instructions. Please pm me with your e-mail and you can have them.
T:)

[Wakefield Turntables]

Andrew, do you still need the setup instructions for the R200 as per the other thread in this forum. I have found the original rega R200 instructions. Please pm me with your e-mail and you can have them.
T:)

Ive managed to get thing up and running, thanks anyway.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Hmmm, they say that setting up belt drives is an art form and I would have to agree. Just taken best part of an hour to get the platter level and sitting 10mm from the top plate on the deck there is one tiny section where its sitting 9.5mm :steam: . The tonearm board is now fitted flush to the deck and the bearing to apex to tonearm apex is 223mm when it should be 222mm. These are tiny small little differences and I'm not that worried about sound replay as it's only going to be used as a test deck. I'll be messing around with the tonearm geometry. Hopefully should have the deck sounding better on Sunday.

[Virtual-Symmetry]

Hi Andrew
I avoid Suspended Belt drives like the plague. No suspension is the best suspension imho :eyebrows:

[Wakefield Turntables]

Hi Andrew
I avoid Suspended Belt drives like the plague. No suspension is the best suspension imho :eyebrows:

Welcome back. I agree, that's why the 301 and 1210 are my reference decks. This is just a little project to pass time whilst i wait for some kit to be finished and also an reminder of why I stopped using certain designs of deck (LP12, Alphason sonata).

[Wakefield Turntables]

Well the tonearm is mounted and cartridge roughly setup and low listening levels would seem to suggest that the TD160 is not a bad little deck. I've got the Shure MM cart running through the ATC speakers and Sugden phonostage. Bass is a little light but the deck sounds less anaemic than before and has a laid back attitude to the way it plays music. Perfect if all you wanna do is listen to a little music and drink whisky (like I'm doing now). Tomorrow see's the last of the tweaking, I think I need to lower the platter a little as I'm getting some "cogging" noise from the belt. I'll finalise the tonearm geometry tomorrow and then that's it finished!!!

[walpurgis]

I'm getting some "cogging" noise from the belt.

Are you sure it's not just the belt rubbing against the speed change guide?

[Virtual-Symmetry]

There should be a stiff black spring around one of the motor fixings which allows you to tilt the motor by tightening the mount screw.You line the belt up that way.

Remove the platter, turn it upside down & refit it. That way you can see its aligned while you alter it.

[Re:The triangular layout of the motor mount. The spring should be around the inside mount closest to centre of the TT if the motors been put back on correctly]

[Wakefield Turntables]

Are you sure it's not just the belt rubbing against the speed change guide?

I think it's this, the platter does seem a little high and I certainly didn't have this problem before I messed with platter height.


There should be a stiff black spring around one of the motor fixings which allows you to tilt the motor by tightening the mount screw.You line the belt up that way.

Remove the platter, turn it upside down & refit it. That way you can see its aligned while you alter it.

[Re:The triangular layout of the motor mount. The spring should be around the inside mount closest to centre of the TT if the motors been put back on correctly]

I never dismanted the motor and I'm aware of the screw your talking about, I'll have a play tomorrow. I'm enjoying a bit of Focus right now ;)

[YNWaN]

No suspension is the best suspension imho :eyebrows:

I couldn't disagree more :).

[Virtual-Symmetry]

I though you might say that ;)

[Wakefield Turntables]

I couldn't disagree more :).


I though you might say that ;)

+1 to that guys, suspended suspension decks are pants, why do you think it's relegated to playing charity/car boots finds.

[YNWaN]

Disagree, not agree.

[danilo]

Always amusing as what we Zero in on as 'important'.
I used the Rubber feet "suspension :eyebrows:
Taken from my broken for bits Techie 1200, under my ancient Thorens.
It seemed to help a bit.. certainly for foot fall issues.
Think I'll one day buy some genuine Sorbo feet destined for Optical research instrument fitments.. But these are a bit pricey.
MY Records, sadly, are not actually worth the trouble/expense TBH.

[Wakefield Turntables]

I've not touched the deck in a few days. I really must finish tweaking the torque in the nuts on the suspension springs. I'll get some finished pictures up at some stage.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Now up for sale, I need funds for my next project a LENCO!