View Full Version : Sommer Carbokab 225 (with silver-plated MS Audio non-metallic POM RCAs)
I've just taken delivery of these from Kevin, CageyH, (a 0.5m and 1m pair) enabling me to hook up any source and preamp (passive or active)/power amp in my system, and thus assess them on that basis:
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/xq90/924/7h9aMB.jpg (https://imageshack.com/i/po7h9aMBj)
Technical details here: http://www.broadcastlines.com/Sommer%20Carbokab%20225.pdf
I shall be comparing these professional studio/broadcast cables directly with my Klotz MC5000s, and so will report the results in due course. Initial impressions are very encouraging! More later :cool:
Marco.
:)
I'll be interested to hear your thoughts on them.
It's a more expensive cable and is wired up differently as well (as you know).
I'll certainly let folks know, Kevin. In the meantime could you please outline how these cables have been wired, and in that respect how they differ from the MC5000s? :)
Marco.
The cables are wired up the same way as the Epiphany Acoustics Atratus III.
That is that both conductors are used for the +ve and the screen is used as the -ve - as recommended by Sommer for this particular cable.
The MC5000 cable most people have (through Brian) have used one conductor for +ve, the other for -ve and the shield is left disconnected at one end.
Ammonite Audio
06-04-2016, 11:02
The cables are wired up the same way as the Atratus III.
That is that both conductors are use for the +ve and the screen is used as the -ve - as recommended by Sommer for this particular cable.
The MC5000 cable most people have (through Brian) have used one conductor for +ve, the other for -ve and the shield is left disconnected at one end.
Does the Atratus III use this Sommer cable? I quite like the Atratus III, but it's stiff and unwieldy, so the same thing in a more flexible form would be very welcome.
No.
The Atratus III (which is a bright green colour as can be seen through the jacket) used a different cable from a different manufacturer. The Sommer (a graphite grey colour) seems pretty flexible.
brian2957
06-04-2016, 11:21
The cables are wired up the same way as the Epiphany Acoustics Atratus III.
That is that both conductors are use for the +ve and the screen is used as the -ve - as recommended by Sommer for this particular cable.
The MC5000 cable most people have (through Brian) have used one conductor for +ve, the other for -ve and the shield is left disconnected at one end.
The shield is connected at the source end Kevin . This was the result of feedback from Marco and others and from my own experimentation . I look forward to your findings on these cables .
I quite like the Atratus III, but it's stiff and unwieldy, so the same thing in a more flexible form would be very welcome.
I can confirm that these cables are indeed very flexible :)
And they appear to sound quite remarkable, too... Aside from anything else, I suspect that the non-magnetic Polyoxymethylene-bodied plugs are having a notably positive sonic influence.
Marco.
Iniial impressions are good then?
I will be interested to know how you feel after having listened to the MC5000 again.
brian2957
06-04-2016, 12:12
Me too :) :popcorn:
I looked at Sommner cable some time ago and was discouraged by the mixed reviews it received. And since I could not find a way to just buy a few metres, I abandoned the idea.
To date I use balanced cables by Gotham (Swiss), Chord, Van Damme, Klotz and Proel.
I looked at Sommner cable some time ago and was discouraged by the mixed reviews it received. And since I could not find a way to just buy a few metres, I abandoned the idea.
Given what I'm hearing at the moment, that was a mistake ;)
Marco.
I looked at Sommner cable some time ago and was discouraged by the mixed reviews it received. And since I could not find a way to just buy a few metres, I abandoned the idea.
Some here http://www.thomann.de/gb/sommer_cable_carbokab_225.htm in small quantities and a Paypal friendly site.
It's available on eBay as well.
Thomann have loads of stock, but their customer service is a tad strange, relying on experts to verify that the Cordial 6mm2 speaker they sent me was in fact not the Sommer Peacock AES/BEU cable I had ordered. :scratch:
I had to ship it back (pre-paid by Thomann) and on receipt of it, an inspection was performed before they sent out the cable I had actually ordered...
It was sorted in the end, but it was a lengthy process.
It's available on eBay as well.
Thomann have loads of stock, but their customer service is a tad strange, relying on experts to verify that the Cordial 6mm2 speaker they sent me was in fact not the Sommer Peacock AES/BEU cable I had ordered. :scratch:
I had to ship it back (pre-paid by Thomann) and on receipt of it, an inspection was performed before they sent out the cable I had actually ordered...
It was sorted in the end, but it was a lengthy process.
Cheers for that, I'll go the Ebay way then.
Just curious if you or anyone else tried wiring up the Klotz the same way as the Sommer cable (both conductors for +ve and the screen for -ve)? I've just used the last of my Klotz and MS Audio plugs for a friends ICs so can't experiment further 'til the slow boat gets in again.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sommer-Carbokab-225-Balanced-Microphone-Cable-/172097694199?hash=item2811d269f7:g:DaYAAOSwPc9WvG1 i
brian2957
06-04-2016, 18:39
Cheers for that, I'll go the Ebay way then.
Just curious if you or anyone else tried wiring up the Klotz the same way as the Sommer cable (both conductors for +ve and the screen for -ve)? I've just used the last of my Klotz and MS Audio plugs for a friends ICs so can't experiment further 'til the slow boat gets in again.
Yes , I sent Marco a set wired like this and he wasn't keen on it , and I agreed but as ever YMMV .
Yes , I sent Marco a set wired like this and he wasn't keen on it , and I agreed but as ever YMMV .
I''ll take your word for it Brian, if you and Marco don't rate them on your systems I'll try some of the Sommer cable.
Already got a set of Sommer Polaris and they are very revealing and not too pricey, but there's something about making your own ICs that's very rewarding not to mention the savings involved.
Thanks guys,
I've ordered 1m to try out between the CD player and my preamp, fully balanced.
Ammonite Audio
07-04-2016, 17:07
Does the Atratus III use this Sommer cable? I quite like the Atratus III, but it's stiff and unwieldy, so the same thing in a more flexible form would be very welcome.
I've found the answer to this for myself - the Atratus III used Yarbo screened cable, with multiple twisted solid core conductors, so that explains why it's not very flexible! Details here
http://www.yarboaudiophile.com/en/displayproduct.html?proID=101318957 . I can't find a price for it, but Epiphany Acoustics certainly weren't making a good living out of selling the Atratus III with this stuff and KLE silver plugs, at just a whisker over £100!
That aside, I have some of this Sommer Carbokab cable coming, and I'll make up some interconnects to compare with the Atratus - it would be nice to have some screened cables for use with the SUT that are very flexible and as good as the Atratus. It's a shame that the excellent NVA SSC is not screened in the normal sense and therefore unsuitable for tonearm connections.
I've just about reached a conclusion now on these cables, compared with the MC5000s, which has proven once again that you can't make snap judgments with these things, and must always return to your established reference, as it were, after a period of time 'acclimatising' to the new sound provided by something else. It's the ONLY way any real differences properly hit home!
More later... :cool:
Marco.
How long does it take to say "they are crap" or "they are good".
:lol:
Lol - I don't make snap judgments on any aspect of hi-fi. Any conclusions I reach (and opinions formed) are always very carefully considered! ;)
Marco.
brian2957
07-04-2016, 20:19
Aye , he's the same with his flowery frocks I believe :lol:
Does my bum look big in this?
I've just about reached a conclusion now on these cables, compared with the MC5000s, which has proven once again that you can't make snap judgments with these things, and must always return to your established reference, as it were, after a period of time 'acclimatising' to the new sound provided by something else. It's the ONLY way any real differences properly hit home!
More later... :cool:
Marco.
I agree that it's the best way.
I didn't really get to listen to the effect them much in my system before I posted them.
I've just about reached a conclusion now on these cables, compared with the MC5000s, which has proven once again that you can't make snap judgments with these things, and must always return to your established reference, as it were, after a period of time 'acclimatising' to the new sound provided by something else. It's the ONLY way any real differences properly hit home!
More later... :cool:
Marco.
Spot on.
Simon_LDT
10-04-2016, 08:09
Fallen asleep at the wheel Marco...? ;)
I've found the answer to this for myself - the Atratus III used Yarbo screened cable, with multiple twisted solid core conductors, so that explains why it's not very flexible! Details here
http://www.yarboaudiophile.com/en/displayproduct.html?proID=101318957 . I can't find a price for it, but Epiphany Acoustics certainly weren't making a good living out of selling the Atratus III with this stuff and KLE silver plugs, at just a whisker over £100!
That aside, I have some of this Sommer Carbokab cable coming, and I'll make up some interconnects to compare with the Atratus - it would be nice to have some screened cables for use with the SUT that are very flexible and as good as the Atratus. It's a shame that the excellent NVA SSC is not screened in the normal sense and therefore unsuitable for tonearm connections.
Yes, the Atratus 3 was a Yarbo cable. At the time of its release Epiphany Acoustics sent it to me wired in a number of different ways and I preferred the version where both centre conductor sets were combined as the + and the braid used as the return. Since the demise of Epiphany Acoustics I have tried to purchase this Yarbo cable but with no success. HiFi Collective do sell some Yarbo cables but not this one.
Fallen asleep at the wheel Marco...? ;)
Lol - just been really busy! Will post an update later :cool:
Marco.
Ok, the Sommers were listened to 'as is', wired as outlined earlier by Kevin, and whilst I could hear some significant promise, in terms of a potentially even more open sound, with tighter bass, than that offered by the MC5000s, there was also a slight 'opaqueness' and veiling present in the midrange and top-end.
That got me thinking that based on what I'd experienced before, in that respect, with how cables respond to being wired differently, in terms of where the shield is connected, etc, I sent them to Brian, in order to have them wired the same as the MC5000s.
It was interesting that Brian initially had the same criticisms as me, when listening to the Sommers first. wired as they were, but later after they had been rewired (as per the MC5000s, with the shield connected at the 'source' end), he noted a significant transformation in the sound for the better, with the veiling/'opaqueness' being removed and the latent sonic potential I had identified previously, now being realised in all its glory. I think he was suitably impressed with the Sommers! :)
Therefore, the cables are on their way back to me now, and I should get them tomorrow. When they arrive, I'll post my detailed thoughts of them accordingly... I *suspect* that we may have a new 'SPPV champion' on our hands to rival the MC5000s :cool:
Marco.
Some folk are gonna feel like right clotz then:doh: i'll get me coat
Lol... Things move on, new discoveries are made, etc. However, as ever with these things, it's all very system dependent, so not everyone's going to prefer the Sommers to the MC5000s, and some may not at all.
Ultimately, you just have to listen and judge for yourself, but choice is always good! :)
Marco.
The MC5000 still works very well.
The Carbokab may be slightly better, but then its slightly more expensive.
I am not sure I can be bothered to change across, as there are still some interesting alternatives to play with. :eyebrows:
I may make the change if I move my equipment around and need some longer cables, but until that point the MC5000 is good enough.
I shall be making up a 0.5m long pair, fully balanced. Owing to the Sommer cable having a larger than usual OD, Neutrik XLR connectors cannot be used as the cable is too fat for the cable clamp collet. I shall use Cannon style XLR connectors, which have a simple cable cleat to clamp the cable.
The Sommer cables will be tried against Klotz MC5000 and Van Damme XKE (these two are also 0.5m long and wired in balanced configuration) connecting between the CD player and preamp.
I'm not expecting to hear any difference, but if I do I'll be sure to let you know.
One question: how can a cable sound more open, yet display "opaqueness and veiling" at the same time? Does 'open' refer to the imaging and soundstaging?
One question: how can a cable sound more open, yet display "opaqueness and veiling" at the same time? Does 'open' refer to the imaging and soundstaging?
Lol, indeed... It's a difficult one to describe, Barry: almost as if, under the 'veiling' (as it were) one could hear a really good sound trying to 'escape'. And yes, the cable's prowess, in terms of imaging and sounstaging, is part of that :)
You say that you're not expecting to hear a difference, why's that? You may not, of course, but you've been able to hear differences between cables in the past, as detailed on the forum after a large cable comparison you conducted once, so why would this occasion be any different? ;)
Marco.
Neutrik XLR connectors are supposed to take 8mm cables.
The Carbokab is 7.6mm OD. You may just need to break of the first part of the cable clamping mechanism.
Lol... All good things come to those who wait! ;)
Marco.
Does that mean you think they are better than the MC5000? :eyebrows:
I'll get to it as soon as I can, daftee. At the moment I'm up to my eyes in work-related stuff and other things.
Marco.
cyclopse
19-04-2016, 17:13
I'll get to it as soon as I can, daftee. At the moment I'm up to my eyes in work-related stuff and other things.
Marco.
The suspense is killing me.
Aye,
spill Marco or the kitten gets it!
:popcorn:
Is the kitten still with us?
Hanging on by its claws...just!
In the meantime, I have the cable here actually and think its SLIGHTLY more transparent at the top end than the Klotz, but not shiny sounding if you know what I mean.
Treble seems to have a more defined character.
Cable sounds slightly louder too?
Both great sounding cables, be happy with either, but the Sommer just gets the prize because of the extra air at the top
Whats your take on it Kevin?
I have only heard them in the initial configuration suggested by Sommer.
Just waiting for some feedback before I order any more cable and plugs. ;)
Sounds pretty good.
Think Brians wired them in the "standard Klotz" way, with shield tied in at the source end.
brian2957
21-04-2016, 21:12
Aye , they're wired the same way as the MC5000s .
Hanging on by its claws...just!
In the meantime, I have the cable here actually and think its SLIGHTLY more transparent at the top end than the Klotz, but not shiny sounding if you know what I mean.
Treble seems to have a more defined character.
Cable sounds slightly louder too?
Both great sounding cables, be happy with either, but the Sommer just gets the prize because of the extra air at the top
That's a pretty good synopsis, Gary, and one that I'd concur with :)
Off to hit the sack now, after a busy day, but will *definitely* comment more on this tomorrow :cool:
Marco.
Ok, just a quick one, as I don't have a lot of time at the moment... Gaz pretty much nails it.
If there is a small criticism of the MC5000s, it's that they have a slight midrange richness/warmth that isn't entirely neutral. However, it's one that seems to be compatible with most systems (as is evidenced by how many different people with different kit have said that they rate them), especially where the main source used is digital, and as such, the MC5000s help reduce any likelihood of the presentation of the partnering system verging towards brightness.
Well, the Sommers completely remove that subtle 'thickening' effect from the equation, adding a soupçon more resolution and openness in the process, and also tightening up, again a very slight looseness in the bass, with the MC5000s (perhaps not noticed in systems with small speakers), whilst retaining all their 'fun factor' and relaxed musicality - and they do all that without drawing attention to themselves or ever introducing listener fatigue.
Whether the Sommers are 'better' than the MC5000s is of course subjective and very much system dependent. The reality is that they are both excellent cables, capable of astonishing performance for what they cost, so which ones you prefer will simply be down to what works best in your own system.
In short, in terms of the Sommer Carbokab 225 (with silver-plated MS Audio POM RCAs), this is a tonally neutral, musically rewarding cable, which simply 'gets out of the equation', as all the best cables do, to allow the music to speak for itself. As such, it comes highly recommended and certainly qualifies as representing another AoS 'SPPV special', which I thank Kevin (Cagey) very much for introducing me to, and Brian for rewiring and releasing its latent sonic potential!
Cheers, guys :cool:
Marco.
brian2957
22-04-2016, 15:53
You're welcome mate . Thanks for the feedback on these .
I am glad they are hitting the spot. :thumbsup:
I am glad they are hitting the spot. :thumbsup:
Nice one Kevin:pat:, just knocked up a set of these and while not a night and day difference between these and the Klotz, I definitely prefer the Carbokab top end and slightly leaner upper mids, so won't be going back to the Klotz.
Am I imagining it or is there a tad more bass extension:confused:?
Anyhoo thats me sorted for cables:), well done all at AOS for another truly excellent cable.
Nice one Kevin:pat:, just knocked up a set of these and while not a night and day difference between these and the Klotz, I definitely prefer the Carbokab top end and slightly leaner upper mids, so won't be going back to the Klotz.
Am I imagining it or is there a tad more bass extension:confused:?
Anyhoo thats me sorted for cables:), well done all at AOS for another truly excellent cable.
Me too, and when you 'nail it', the effect is clearly audible, as is the superior midrange lucidity of the Carbokabs. For me, there isn't more bass extension, as such, but what's there has better definition and texture.
However, you can be guaranteed that in some systems, the MC5000s will still be preferable ;)
Marco.
Interesting Brian that the Sommer cable seems to perform best with the silver MS audio plugs and shielding configured as I specified on my Klotz cable.:)
Me too, and when you 'nail it', the effect is clearly audible, as is the superior midrange lucidity of the Carbokabs. For me, there isn't more bass extension, as such, but what's there has better definition and texture.
However, you can be guaranteed that in some systems, the MC5000s will still be preferable ;)
Marco.
Yours is definitely a better description of the bass characteristics, I presume the effect in my system is partly down to the extra "air" which for some unfathomable reason(to me) gives better bass definition.
Would someone care to enlighten me as to why this happens, in lay-mans terms please, or point me to a thread where somebody already has.
brian2957
08-05-2016, 19:42
Interesting Brian that the Sommer cable seems to perform best with the silver MS audio plugs and shielding configured as I specified on my Klotz cable.:)
Sorry James , missed this post . TBH I preferred the Sommer cable with the good quality heavier gold plated plugs which I have here .
brian2957
08-05-2016, 19:49
Interesting Brian that the Sommer cable seems to perform best with the silver MS audio plugs and shielding configured as I specified on my Klotz cable.:)
Sorry James , missed this post . TBH I preferred the Sommer cable with the good quality heavier gold plated plugs which I have here .
On extended listening I have gone back to the MC5000 cables . Firstly , the MC5000s have a slightly more relaxed sound with a '' fruitier '' midrange and bass which I really like . Secondly , the Sommer cables are very difficult to work with and seem to be more prone to fail . It's early days and I have already had two '' faliures ''with the Sommer cables , with all the repair work which that entails .
Sorry James , missed this post . TBH I preferred the Sommer cable with the good quality heavier gold plated plugs which I have here .
On extended listening I have gone back to the MC5000 cables . Firstly , the MC5000s have a slightly more relaxed sound with a '' fruitier '' midrange and bass which I really like . Secondly , the Sommer cables are very difficult to work with and seem to be more prone to fail . It's early days and I have already had two '' faliures ''with the Sommer cables , with all the repair work which that entails .
I still like the MC5000 cable but the one you made for me I had to let go as someone liked it so much they asked me to sell it to them! I have another MC5000 with some nice Linn plugs on doing sterling duty on the output of my SUT into the Croft 25r and it sounds very good indeed!:)
brian2957
08-05-2016, 20:02
Horses for courses James . I really think that my ears have become tuned into what the MC5000s do well and it's going to take something pretty special ( and expensive ) to dislodge them from my system .
Do you have a link to the plugs James ?. I'm always on the lookout for something different .
Horses for courses James . I really think that my ears have become tuned into what the MC5000s do well and it's going to take something pretty special ( and expensive ) to dislodge them from my system .
Do you have a link to the plugs James ?. I'm always on the lookout for something different .
Sorry Brian, the cable came from Josie and the plugs were already fitted so not sure where there from?
brian2957
08-05-2016, 20:09
Not a problem , thanks James .
On extended listening I have gone back to the MC5000 cables . Firstly , the MC5000s have a slightly more relaxed sound with a '' fruitier '' midrange and bass which I really like .
Agreed (I hear the same thing), although I attribute it to coloration, with the Sommers being more neutral in that area - and certainly with speakers like mine, "fruitier" bass isn't something you'd want :)
Therefore, with more 'normal' (smaller) speakers, that extra weight could be desirable, which is precisely what you've reported.
Secondly , the Sommer cables are very difficult to work with and seem to be more prone to fail . It's early days and I have already had two '' faliures ''with the Sommer cables , with all the repair work which that entails .
:o What's the verdict on mine then, doc? ;)
Marco.
Is this the sommertime blues?;) I'm sticking with what Ive got; just dont ask what it is :D
Expose your 'length'! :eyebrows:
Marco.
Audio Al
09-05-2016, 01:35
Sommer Carbokab 225
Marco , Looks like a spelling mistake
Should this read " Summer Carboot 2016 " ?
:D
brian2957
09-05-2016, 07:01
Marco , you have PM .
Sommer Carbokab 225
Marco , Looks like a spelling mistake
Should this read " Summer Carboot 2016 " ?
:D
Lol - you've got car boot on the brain! Cheers, Brian :thumbsup:
Marco.
The Sommer cables will be tried against Klotz MC5000 and Van Damme XKE (these two are also 0.5m long and wired in balanced configuration) connecting between the CD player and preamp.
How did you rate the Van Damme sound against these two? I like the XKE as it's easy to get ordered bt the metre through Maplins....
Cheers
Bryan
Any update on the Carbokab?
Is that directed at me, daftee? :)
Marco.
Any update on the Carbokab?
...going by Marco's signature (or rather the lack of change of his signature?)
Ah, that's only because I like BOTH of them, in different applications! :eyebrows: ;)
Marco.
Is that directed at me, daftee? :)
Marco.
Well yes, if you have some. ;)
I am also interested in feedback from anybody else who has tried them.
Well, if you scroll back, I've already commented on the Sommers [see posts #31 and #50), and compared them to the Klotz, so my feelings there still stand :)
Overall, I'd say that for my tastes, the former just edge it, but in some applications (RPi to preamp), I prefer the Klotz. Thanks again for introducing us to the Sommers. They are undoubtably another high SPPV option to add to the list of 'AoS approved' cables :cool:
Marco.
Thanks guys,
I've ordered 1m to try out between the CD player and my preamp, fully balanced.
Has this arrived yet, Barry, and if so have you tried it? :)
Marco.
I was just interested in your little issue you had with them, and if Brian had managed to fix them ok?
One of the weaknesses in the plugs is that the stress relief is a bit poor.
Ah, that. Yes, all been resolved :)
Wasn't sure what the issue was. Interesting you say it was plug related. Brian also said that the cable itself was a PITA to work with!
Marco.
It's not the easiest of cables due to the "carbo" insulation, but a good set of Knipex strippers made light work of it.
Ah, is that what it is...? I believe the 'Carbo' thing is also partly responsible for their sonic signature. One important thing to consider with the Sommers (probably any cables, actually) is how they are wired.
The first time, the way you'd done it according to what the manufacturer recommended, they sounded ok, but nowhere near as good as they did when Brian rewired them 'a la Klotz', with the shield connected only at one end.
The initial way produced a rather veiled and subdued mid and top end, which completely opened up once Brian had rewired them. I couldn't have lived with them before, so it's important folks know that, and don't dismiss the Sommers for that reason.
In summary, I'd say that they're now my main interconnects, as they're being used both between my CDP and DAC, phono stage and preamp, and preamp and power amp, so yes, wonderful sounding cables when you get it right! :cool:
Marco.
walpurgis
02-06-2016, 09:09
As a little aside. Audio Note AN-C copper litz interconnect cable gives very nice results at a comparatively low price.
http://www.audionote.co.uk/comp/cables.shtml
The pricing for their more exotic items may come as a bit of a shock though.
Has this arrived yet, Barry, and if so have you tried it? :)
Marco.
Yes it arrived some time ago - I have just been too busy to fit them to the XLR connectors. Will try to do it this weekend. :)
Cool... Be curious to know what you think, when you have a listen, although you're not renowned for identifying many differences with cables ;)
Marco.
Cool... Be curious to know what you think, when you have a listen, although you're not renowned for identifying many differences with cables ;)
Marco.
Agreed (;)) - and, IMO, any differences in SQ tends to be reduced when cables are wired for balanced line operation.
I would agree, although unless done properly (i.e. balanced throughout via every selected input and output), I'm not a fan of balanced line operation. Done properly, however, it's a different matter. Therefore for me, it's one of those things that you either do right, and go the whole hog with fully-balanced circuits throughout, or not at all!
Marco.
Agree, and have to confess I'm only in that happy position with CD input, though I'm getting close to fully balanced line operation with vinyl playback. That leaves the tuner, which while it forms a large part of my listening pleasure, I'm unlikely to be replacing it with one offering a balanced output.
Ammonite Audio
17-08-2016, 10:38
I finally got around to making up a set of cables using Sommer Carbokab 225 and 'MS Star Style' silver plugs. They were wired in the same way as the Atratus III, eg both centre wires connected to signal, and the braided screen to ground. The result is pretty dull - way short of the Atratus III in every respect. So, I suspect that I've re-discovered what Marco experienced earlier, and these things need to be wired more conventionally, with the screen connected at the source end only.
Incidentally, I did look into buying the Yarbo cable that the Atratus III used, directly from the manufacturer in HK. It's quite expensive and would work out at around £20 per metre once import duty etc are included; however it's possibly still worth it since I've not found another cable at an affordable price that comes close.
ive made some of these up today,going from the klotz theres a nice improvement or difference,hard to describe but i noticed it straight away.
if you run klotz give them a try,mine are staying in the system.
sommer cable here, https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sommer-Carbokab-225-Balanced-Microphone-Cable-/172097694199
ms plugs here, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Star-Line-Rhodium-Plated-Tellurium-Copper-RCA-Plugs-connectors-2-Pair-4pcs/252929673820?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
Looks nice stuff. Kudos to folk who can make them up neatly not my ability tho
ive made some of these up today,going from the klotz theres a nice improvement or difference,hard to describe but i noticed it straight away.
if you run klotz give them a try,mine are staying in the system.
Lol - are you copying me now? ;)
Yup, great cables!
Marco.
Haha I’m surprised more haven’t switched.
The Black Adder
15-01-2018, 21:23
Currently looking in to some new IEC's myself.
Sent from my 9001X using Tapatalk
Bigman80
15-01-2018, 21:27
Currently looking in to some new IEC's myself.
Sent from my 9001X using TapatalkI've got some floating around for feedback purposes. Welcome to be added to the list!
Sent from my EVA-L09 using Tapatalk
im interested! do tell me more :)
Bigman80
03-03-2018, 16:49
I'll be knocking up another cable soon with the intention of sending it on to Marco.
It could drop by your place on the way back to France.Would you mind it passing by Wolverhampton on its way to France?
I'll be knocking up another cable soon with the intention of sending it on to Marco.
It could drop by your place on the way back to France.
that would be great,thank you :cool:
Pepperamip
17-09-2018, 11:36
Hope all involved don't mind me reviving this thread?
Going from Pre to power amp would you still only terminate the -ve at one end and if so which end would this sit once complete?
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Personally I would try it connected at the pre end have a good listen, then swap the cable round so it is at the power amp end and see which I preferred.
You could also try it with the shield completely disconnected.
Pepperamip
17-09-2018, 14:17
Personally I would try it connected at the pre end have a good listen, then swap the cable round so it is at the power amp end and see which I preferred.
You could also try it with the shield completely disconnected.
So no adverse effect to be had leaving the negative totally disconnected? Think I'll keep it available but taped up just in case I want to experiment. Cheers Cagey.
By the negative, I assume you mean the braided screen?
You still need to connect the two wires inside the screen to each RCA plug.
Personally, I would try all three configurations, and see which I preferred.
Pepperamip
17-09-2018, 17:40
Yeah I did mean that. I've read both cores to be used as positive and the braid as negative to one side only. Just gotta wait a month now for the Star Line RCA's to turn up from Taiwan
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That won’t work.
If using both cores as positive, the braid needs to be connected at both ends, otherwise the cable will not pass a signal.
Pepperamip
17-09-2018, 18:43
You can tell i don't normally do this.
So either use the two cores alone (one to centre pin one to outer) or use the braid with the outter wire. Please tell me that's right.
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Stryder5
17-09-2018, 19:04
You can tell i don't normally do this.
So either use the two cores alone (one to centre pin one to outer) or use the braid with the outter wire. Please tell me that's right.
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Yep, it's right.
Gary
Connect one wire to the centre pin, one to the outer body of the RCA plug, and connect the screen at the pre amp end only.
That is how most people who like them have them wired up.
If you are not used to doing this, it will be a good idea to check the finished cables for a short using a cheap multimeter.
I have made-up three sets of these cables which sound very good but I found the soldering to be a nightmare, especially to the centre pin of the silver-plated MS Audio non-metallic POM RCAs. Simply put, it would not stick to the pin, despite using rosin etc., and when it finally does the mechanical strength is very poor. I used silver solder and the RCA plugs were inserted in an old amp to prevent them getting too hot. Does anyone have any tips?
Stryder5
04-10-2018, 18:56
I have made-up three sets of these cables which sound very good but I found the soldering to be a nightmare, especially to the centre pin of the silver-plated MS Audio non-metallic POM RCAs. Simply put, it would not stick to the pin, despite using rosin etc., and when it finally does the mechanical strength is very poor. I used silver solder and the RCA plugs were inserted in an old amp to prevent them getting too hot. Does anyone have any tips?
By silver solder I assume you mean a tin/silver solder, which has a melting point around 220-240 degrees C, depending on the mix.
So your solder tip could be the wrong shape, low temperature or not enough power to maintain the temperature of the tip and the pin.
Added....I never insert into a socket as this may conduct away the heat you need
Gary
I first tin the cable.
Then I heat the centre pin, add the solder and while it is still molten, fit the cable, maintaining the heat to ensure that the solder on the cable flows, and then remove the heat and let it cool.
The issue with the MS Audio plugs is the stress relief. You may need to build up the exterior of the cable to allow the single screw to work effectively.
Thanks guys. I tinned the cable but maybe the problem was conducting the heat away as suggested. I'll try redoing one to see if it makes a difference.
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