View Full Version : Cool Gales Bath Audio Fest 2016
Well it was cool, but not much in the way of a gale.
I've never been to this, so I thought since I live close by, I should make the effort. I've missed it for years.
The show was decidedly empty, which must be a bit heartbreaking for the organisers. Bearing in mind Scalford is a long way from Bath, I doubt it'd have much affect on attendance here. But maybe not.
Anyway, a few photos and a few thoughts coming up. No serious review and these are only my opinions, to be taken with a pinch of salt, as usual, based on what I heard at the time I was in the room.
The venue. Actually in two buildings within about 500 yards of each other.
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02538_zpsipxkjhv1.jpg
The best SQ - the street busker?
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02536_zpsynmgllou.jpg
Actually probably not. Using a very small PA I could sense more than a few % distortion to say the least. Pretty OK though and he could certainly play & sing.
The Thomas Meyer room. I looked at the chap, and thought I recognised him from Munich 2014. I asked him if he was there and yup, he said he was.
It was Thomas Meyer - I'd spoken to him about ELROG 211s at Munich 2014 as I was considering buying a quad.
I asked him about ELROG 300B reliability. He reckons he told the man himself to make 300Bs after the 211 and 845 came out. He also reckons the thoriated tungsten filament is very thin and subject to breakage in enviroments where switch on is particularly harsh on the valves. He also cited the thinness of the filament as being responsible for the sound quality.
He had spoken to Richard (awkwardbydesign) the day before about his preamp, as Richard is attempting to build one.
The phono stage, preamp and power amp you see in the pics are all between 9-10K, so we're not talking cheap here. It does look very nicely made, though.
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02533_zpsa9pqp0ow.jpg
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02527_zps414ipdzd.jpg
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02524_zpsvilt16ou.jpg
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02525_zpsvcw9kcnx.jpg
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02521_zpseq9z1uzp.jpg
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02523_zpsgiagkk1q.jpg
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http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02520_zpslkqvdkj8.jpg
The preamp uses GE 10Y - which is nice and unusual. Can blame Richard for wanting to build one, really.
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02532_zps3gxjt024.jpg
The sound in the room was pretty good. In contrast to the Sonus Faber system I'll talk about later, it was highly resolved and quite upfront. The Wolf von Langa field coil speakers employ a ribbon treble unit, and, being an Apogee user myself, returned decent levels of treble resolution that I'm fairly comfortable with.
Good room. Maybe the best in the sense that it was probably the one that would appeal to enthusiasts the most. However, the only room in the show with a decent level of visitors was the German Physik based one.
Somus Faber Amanti, Clearaudio, DS Audio, Aesthetix.
Overall a very warm sounding system. Quite a "thick" mid-band with good bass weight. Didn't really dig deep enough for my tastes, but I can imagine some really liking the easy going nature of this system, which can only be described as very pleasant.
The Clearaudio kit looks killer as usual. Overall I found the system a little hazy, but this level of mid-range warmth can't really provide high levels of clarity. This warm attribute has to be down to both the Aesthetix and Sonus Faber kit, IMHO.
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02500_zpshrpi7nad.jpg
The DS Audio optical cart HAS to be used with their phono stage, which is part of the £6K price.
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02497_zpsk9fzs5jx.jpg
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02498_zpssm2tjyws.jpg
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02496_zpskzfs9dic.jpg
awkwardbydesign
19-03-2016, 18:52
Actually I'm building a type 26 preamp. It's what I heard when a friend brought his round to my house, and what I have read up on. All 381 pages on DIY Audio, and I'm getting help from the guy who improved it. It looked like this, but my wife and I are "in discussions" about the appearance.
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m604/awkwardbydesign/foto4_zpsfoduqz33.jpg
Closeish...:) More tomorrow on the show but there isn't much more to cover.
awkwardbydesign
19-03-2016, 19:25
You could do a critique of the coffee and sandwiches. :D
I was very taken with the sound of the Mayer room, but when he put on Dark Side Of The Moon, I thought it really showed up the age of the recording. A comment that shocked his lady, it seemed. But I spoke as I found; it's probably her favourite LP! The amps seemed really transparent to me, but the speakers were so vivid that multi-tracked studio recordings probably get harshly treated.
Unfortunately I don't have the level of knowledge needed to have a serious conversation with Thomas, or Frank Schroder who was also there. But that phono amp is making me twitch; maybe I should see if I can actually make the line stage first?
I tried all the other rooms (all 5 of them!), and the best I can say is that the coffee was welcome! The Eclipse speakers sounded like shouty little boxes, the Sonus Fabers were thick sounding, and they all seemed to be trying too hard with little result. But hey, we all listen differently, and like Justin I like ribbons, in fact I just hate boxes! That's why my boxes are so heavily damped. I would do without them if I could, but in my room that would be hard to do.
The atmosphere was really friendly, I think it was quite a family affair, so if I was local I would go again, but a five hour round trip was too much! For one room I actually enjoyed.
Justin I think I speak for everyone if I say that we all really enjoy your show reports and excellent pictures.
Many thanks for taking the time to post these and your commentary.
What sort of music where they playing? As in, were they playing it safe or taking requests?
Justin I think I speak for everyone if I say that we all really enjoy your show reports and excellent pictures.
Many thanks for taking the time to post these and your commentary.
+100 (with ding-dongs on). Top man! :thumbsup:
Marco.
What sort of music where they playing? As in, were they playing it safe or taking requests?
The German Physik room was controlled and the CAD/Brinkmann/Eclipse room seemed so. Anywhere else was pretty easy going. I was making vinyl selections in the Sonus Faber room. Wish I had picked the new James album (which looked really nice on vinyl - ace cover recommend buying) as I really I liked it when I got back home via TIDAL.
You could do a critique of the coffee and sandwiches. :D
I was very taken with the sound of the Mayer room, but when he put on Dark Side Of The Moon, I thought it really showed up the age of the recording. A comment that shocked his lady, it seemed. But I spoke as I found; it's probably her favourite LP! The amps seemed really transparent to me, but the speakers were so vivid that multi-tracked studio recordings probably get harshly treated.
Unfortunately I don't have the level of knowledge needed to have a serious conversation with Thomas, or Frank Schroder who was also there. But that phono amp is making me twitch; maybe I should see if I can actually make the line stage first?
I tried all the other rooms (all 5 of them!), and the best I can say is that the coffee was welcome! The Eclipse speakers sounded like shouty little boxes, the Sonus Fabers were thick sounding, and they all seemed to be trying too hard with little result. But hey, we all listen differently, and like Justin I like ribbons, in fact I just hate boxes! That's why my boxes are so heavily damped. I would do without them if I could, but in my room that would be hard to do.
The atmosphere was really friendly, I think it was quite a family affair, so if I was local I would go again, but a five hour round trip was too much! For one room I actually enjoyed.
I agree about DSOM it does sound dated these days. In fact as a recording I don't believe it is really that great though it still sounds nice. Quite a bit of weird LF on it too.
Big planars have a similar problem to boxes. They need to be super rigid IMHO - especially Apogees. If the frames don't stay put and hold the huge bass panels still, there's a loss of definition.
I think I'll leave this thread as it is folks. Can't think of much else interesting to say.
Spectral Morn
20-03-2016, 15:55
Justin I think I speak for everyone if I say that we all really enjoy your show reports and excellent pictures.
Many thanks for taking the time to post these and your commentary.
What sort of music where they playing? As in, were they playing it safe or taking requests?
Yes indeed :cool:
Oh go on then... the "too much Disaronno" hangover has cleared:)
CAD/Brinkmann/Eclipse
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02502_zpsilonadjz.jpg
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02504_zpshqw3zfdp.jpg
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http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02506_zpszb7ykixy.jpg
I'm going to have to disagree with Richard. This is the best I have heard Eclipse loudspeakers sound, and I have heard them a few times.
All in all, pretty damned clear and uncoloured sounding. And pretty spacious to boot in the large room. Nice big sub too, not that the material played was exercising it when I was in there, which is a shame.
The sub is an Eclipse one, and it looks pretty damned nice. TD7255WKM2. Nice, unpretentious model number then. Probably quite expensive looking at it. Some Mateo Monero, Maurizio Belladona or Trentemoller at 95DB would most definitely be in order here, I thought. But would the crowd in there have even vaguely appreciated it? Faces and appearance wise, maximum stereotyping applied, I think not. We're talking Bath here. It is quite posh and cultured;):lol:
Little Brinky mono. Quite cute, really.
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02505_zpsxsuhpa2q.jpg
Actually, stepping in from the Sonus Fibber room's dense, thick, warm mid-band into the Eclipse room could not really have been more of a contrast. Whilst spacious and quite precise in its imaging, the soundstage was ultimately quite thin. Which is to be expected given the tiny nature of the Eclipse satellite's driver's, I suppose.
And onto the German Physik's. I have heard various models and they always sound almost squeaky clean and clear, to the point of sterility. I am not a fan of anything Chord - one of my least fave manufacturer's, and I don't think it the two are a match made in heaven.
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02516_zpsipxdwjiu.jpg
Dave DAC in use, so serious money, and some digital server the salesman was talking bollocks about. In fact, the bollocks factor was so high, I had to walk out. And when I was outside, another chap came out complaining he was talking utter bollocks too, completely unprompted by me. Not only me then! I didn't ask but it was obvious from what he said he was a software engineer.
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02517_zpsksouvod9.jpg
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02518_zps0fr8eh4v.jpg
I was impressed by the quadraspire x ref. rack. Had a chat to he who builds them and was most impressed. Should I need another stand....
I was impressed by the quadraspire x ref. rack. Had a chat to he who builds them and was most impressed. Should I need another stand....
And from your sig surely the Lyra in use in the Meyer room LOL.
http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g436/User_211/Bath%20Audio%20Fest%202016/DSC02531_zpszpfjph45.jpg
awkwardbydesign
20-03-2016, 20:45
I was impressed by the quadraspire x ref. rack. Had a chat to he who builds them and was most impressed. Should I need another stand....
Many many years ago, someone I didn't like was demoing Quadraspire racks at a show. He lifted a CD player, while it was playing, form a steel stand (Target?) and moved it to the Quadraspire. I wanted him to fail, but damn! The improvement was obvious. And repeatable. I still haven't got over it! :D
anubisgrau
21-03-2016, 09:17
Actually I'm building a type 26 preamp. It's what I heard when a friend brought his round to my house, and what I have read up on. All 381 pages on DIY Audio, and I'm getting help from the guy who improved it. It looked like this, but my wife and I are "in discussions" about the appearance.
a good choice. actually, possibly the best you can get for your money. i am too a sucker for DHT preamps, whatever i brought into my house wiped the floor with anything i put against it (my current pre is dave slagle AVC). just yesterday i had a session with a friend's 4P1L built following a huge DIYaudio thread (and bartola's blog) and it's certainly amazing preamp, especially given the price of the parts which is around 300 pounds without chasis (it's still on a wood board). 4P1L is horribly microfonic but the way it portrays music is way behind anything non-DHT on the market and if you want a properly done DHT preamp than it's pretty much nailed to thomas mayer's designs. i really need to pull myself together and get someone to knock me a 4P1L, it's insane what achievement this collective DIY collaboration has made.
it could be that my system is biased towards DHT in general (horns and thomas mayer 300b) but there it is...
Gordon, Richard heard Keith's 26 preamp which I got from Rui :-)
After a few tweaks it really did turn into something very special, still microphonic but not as bad as the 4P1L
I have a bunch of 26 and 80 rectifiers, plus some custom made otx, I should get around to building myself one at some stage
Shame Bath is such a trek from Manchester as I would have liked to hear more if Thomas' kit.
awkwardbydesign
21-03-2016, 10:21
especially given the price of the parts which is around 300 pounds without chasis (it's still on a wood board).
I'm up to £320 without valves, sockets, caps volume control, et al! I'll make the chassis myself. I did get permission to go to £1000, but with Simon's advice I've kept it down. Need to source decent valves now.
Gordon, Richard heard Keith's 26 preamp which I got from Rui :-)
After a few tweaks it really did turn into something very special, still microphonic but not as bad as the 4P1L
I'm nervous of messing up my build, as it is at a level above what I am used to building. And what I saw of Thomas' amps, the bar has been set high!
anubisgrau
21-03-2016, 11:42
Thanks Simon, shame I didn't have money at the time you sold that piece. I have no doubts about it given my experience with 45 and 4P1L preamps.
Thomas used to sell some of his products in a kit form. I don't know if it applies to DHT preamps but it would be worth of checking. Still I doubt it will be cheaper than what you are doing.
awkwardbydesign
21-03-2016, 11:59
I'm up to £320 without valves, sockets, caps volume control, et al!
Let's hope my calculations are better than my addition; it's £420!
But back to the Audiofest, it's interesting how Justin's impressions differed from mine. Up to about 25 years ago I was serious about hifi. Poor but serious! Then I spent 20 years messing around wih motorbikes, and only got back into hifi recently. So my experience of "modern" equipment will be much less than Justin's, and my interest is in older technology (with a modern twist), making me perhaps overly dismissive of stuff that doesn't fit my prejudices. He got much more out of the Audiofest than I did, it seems; I was focussed on getting a half decent coffee and sandwiches without meat in them! And I was there early on Saturday, it felt like some of the rooms were just waking up.
I have heard Chord and Eclipse before, and didn't like them much, but not the German Physiks and Sonus Faber speakers, so maybe I should have given them more time. But after nearly 3 hours in traffic I wasn't in the best mood to be generous, and anyway I heard the Mayer room first!
We all hear and listen differently, depending on various physical, cultural and emotional factors, so perhaps it not surprising we rarely agree on what works best.
anubisgrau
21-03-2016, 12:14
ah, don't go there. it's usually not that we have different ears but a different brain. anyway you are on the right path:)
There's something very good about DHT done right... the output stage of my DAC is such a beast. I rate it way up there....
Anyway, I don't really use modern kit Richard - a revised by me 30 year old speaker design, some 40 year old amps, nearly a 30 year old record player (when in use) but I have been to an enormous amount of shows over a few decades, I suppose, so have that experience to draw on. I've also been into the hobby since I was 15.
I'm not sure I got more out of it than you TBH. I just took more pics and came out with a bit more verbal diahorrea:D;). As some kind of show report, if I was being serious about it, it could be a lot better.
awkwardbydesign
21-03-2016, 14:24
ah, don't go there. it's usually not that we have different ears but a different brain. anyway you are on the right path:)
The different ears question is one that gets some people quite angry, which is strange, as our eyes are all different and measurably so. I have a measured peak at 8kHz, which greatly affects what I hear. Sibilance being a particular problem. But there are many who won't accept that we are physically different. I don't know why that is.
awkwardbydesign
21-03-2016, 14:26
There's something very good about DHT done right... the output stage of my DAC is such a beast. I rate it way up there....
Anyway, I don't really use modern kit Richard - a revised by me 30 year old speaker design, some 40 year old amps, nearly a 30 year old record player (when in use) but I have been to an enormous amount of shows over a few decades, I suppose, so have that experience to draw on. I've also been into the hobby since I was 15.
I'm not sure I got more out of it than you TBH. I just took more pics and came out with a bit more verbal diahorrea:D;). As some kind of show report, if I was being serious about it, it could be a lot better.
Yes, I've seen (and heard) some of your old junk! :lol:
I think you may have got more of the show than I did because you put more into it. My stomach was grumbling too much.
If you'd had a substantial breakfast at home before you left, to set you up for the day, that wouldn't have happened ;)
Best to fed yourself before going to these events, as it'll usually be cheaper and better! Plus it saves time, as time always flies by.
Marco.
awkwardbydesign
21-03-2016, 15:47
Are you my mum? I always have a good breakfast. But it was 4 hours later! I found some real coffee and sandwiches in the end.
Lol... Yesh, it's your mummy speaking, shweety :D
Well, if I have a big cooked breakfast in the morning (as I usually do before going to these shows, which my wife makes), I don't need anything else until teatime! :ner:
Marco.
southall-1998
21-03-2016, 16:02
Are you my mum? I always have a good breakfast. But it was 4 hours later! I found some real coffee and sandwiches in the end.
Marco in a dress! :stalks:
S.
It's not an uncommon occurrence on Sundays... :eyebrows: ;)
Marco.
Well the one beef & mustard sarnie I had in the Physik room was OKish. But the pasty I got in the high street was excellent. Good pasty shops in Bath. Some good street nosh too.
Yeah, the point is, I'd never feed myself at a hi-fi show, as the food available is usually no more than edible, and almost always ridiculously overpriced! ;)
Best eat before or afterwards :)
Marco.
awkwardbydesign
21-03-2016, 19:42
The sandwiches and coffee were free.
Oh right, that's unusual :)
Marco.
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