WANTED - Integrated Amp with phono stage

[786]

Hello, Looking for a good quality integrated amplifier, with 100W RMS minimum. Must have a good phono stage, prefer one compatible with low output MC carts, but will consider MM versions. I can travel within a reasonable distance of Bedford for the right amp, but would obviously prefer with original packing for postage.

I like the Marantz PM11, Luxman, Accuphase and similar. Please message me with what you have, thank you. Shaid

[johnny reggae]

Hi Shaid,
I have a Luxman L-85v in near mint condition, recently serviced, £350

[walpurgis]

Hi Shaid,
I have a Luxman L-85v in near mint condition, recently serviced, £350

Lovely amp that. Good price for a decent one too.

[786]

Lovely amp that. Good price for a decent one too.

Hi Andy, I appreciate the offer, looks to be a good amplifier, but I would like to stick above 100W/channel as a minimum, I have sold some kit so have some cash for a well priced Marantz PM11 or similar spec Luxman etc I wish you well with your sale :)

[struth]

Bare watts doesnt tell the whole story tbh, ; there are watts and there are WATTS;)

[SLS]

Sorry, but watts are watts. Found that out at considerable expense. Forget those brands. A Yamaha R-N500 for £290 on Amazon new gives you a quality 160 watts plus streaming and AirPlay etc. Get a Schiit Mani phono for £130 and if/when you give up on vinyl you can sell it. Pal of mine replaced an expensive Leben with the Yamaha (driving Harbeth) and never looked back.

[walpurgis]

160 watts only gives you 3db more achievable loudness than 80 watts. Hardly noticeable.

If you're talking about punch and grip, that'll be (often) down to current delivery. Aim for an amp that can put out a regular 20 amps or more and you'll be just fine with most 'normal' speakers.

[mad-moon]

160 watts only gives you 3db more achievable loudness than 80 watts. Hardly noticeable.

If you're talking about punch and grip, that'll be (often) down to current delivery. Aim for an amp that can put out a regular 20 amps or more and you'll be just fine with most 'normal' speakers.

Yep totally agree..my pal has a Musical fidelity AMS35i...which is rated at 35 watts per channel of pure class A....driving a pair of B&W 804s speakers...can't get the volume past 9 o'clock without ear defenders...silly silly volumes...it's the current that's delivering those watts that's important..

[alcarmichael]

I'm in a similar situation with my Sugden at 25 wpc driving B&W 805's, not a great deal of wattage for these apparently watt hungry speakers but plenty of current.

I have to admit I was sceptical at first but it works and works very well :D

[Xapito]

Best SS amps I ever heard were on the 15 > 35 watts range, some of them trully unbelieveble and couldn't go past 11'clock with the volume, most better then their TOTL models which all sounded a bit artificial / compressed when compared side to side.

[walpurgis]

I'm using 25 watts of solid state Class A which used to grip and drive my old Celestion SL600Si speakers with a low 83db sensitivity just fine.

[twickers]

Didn't Jerry have a Mini-T driving his JBL's to decent levels?

[SLS]

The volume level is not the issue. The issue is dynamics, especially at low volume. This is the requirement for precise control of the drivers at speed. My Art Audio 40wpc valve mono blocks with massive Sowter transformers cannot do it with the Radial 2 driver in Harbeth speakers, rated at 86db. The amp just needs more sensitive speakers. They go loud enough to call the police, but when it comes to the control needed, for example, in Hindemith's sonata for bass tuba or the transition between the 3rd and 4th movements in Shostakovich 8, they fall down. It is a shame as for most listening they are superb amplifiers.

It was only when I plugged in 200w of Plinius and then 300w of Quad that difficult to control passages, particularly on brass and piano (e.g. Liszt) came to life.

It is a far greater issue in classical music, about 70% of my listening.

[786]

Very nicely articulated Steven, my experiences are similar. I am not looking to use all of that RMS, just need it to drive difficult speakers at reasonable listening levels, I have neighbours and family, just like many. This discussion does bring out a lot of very interesting experiences we have all had, and some great amps along the way, but our results have always involved a compromise somewhere when pairing with speakers. Current and Watts, just looking for a decent compromise :)

[SLS]

Very nicely articulated Steven, my experiences are similar. I am not looking to use all of that RMS, just need it to drive difficult speakers at reasonable listening levels, I have neighbours and family, just like many. This discussion does bring out a lot of very interesting experiences we have all had, and some great amps along the way, but our results have always involved a compromise somewhere when pairing with speakers. Current and Watts, just looking for a decent compromise :)

It does make me wonder sometimes. I was very happy with a low powered amp and convinced myself that it was producing the marvellous midrange. Problem is, over years I had avoided listening to music that was too difficult to reproduce at home. I go to a lot of concerts, opera, ballet and dance and just didn't find it satisfying listening at home, so I didn't listen much other than to a fairly limited range of music and through headphones. Had a room built for music 15 years ago and then it became a playroom, but after various expensive "audiophile" mistakes I can now listen to pretty much anything with a lot of satisfaction. I've yet to get into opera at home, I just like it live. A real result requires little more than a superb pair of speakers (Harbeth SHL5+), lots of power and a good clean digital source. I am slowly selling expensive kit that does a fine job in some systems, but not for me.

The problem is that as I had so much difficulty listening to classical music at home, for example because piano just did not have sufficient weight, I was listening more to jazz and 'popular' music (for want of a better word) where the issues of dynamics are often less apparent. I have a lot of that on vinyl, mainly because so many transfers are so poor. I've also found some great old classical recordings, such as Richter playing Prokofiev sonatas 7 and 9 on Melodia. Now that I've got the audio system doing classical properly, the turntable is collecting dust.

[SLS]

Following on from the above, I still prefer smaller scale vocal works. I've listened to John Elliot Gardiner's recent release of Bach's Mass in B Minor 4 or 5 times (streamed on Qobuz). It's small scale, intimate and ravishing, compared to his much larger scale recording from 30 years ago. I tried listening to the older one (ripped from the CD set), still too big for home.

I went with the wife to Gardiner's production of Gluck's Orphee at Eurydice at the Royal Opera House last October and it was beyond wonderful. Even though it's not a particularly visual opera (the French version is as much a ballet) I wouldn't even want to try and listen to it at home.
http://www.roh.org.uk/productions/orphee-et-eurydice-by-hofesh-shechter-and-john-fulljames

[786]

My tastes are "eclectic" from industrial metal Rammstein to 70's funk, to Pop, to Opera, classical and beyond... If you can find decently recorded source music, and there is oceans of dross, then you are pushing it through compromises between reliable but cold(personally) CD even SACD (haven't gotten into FLAC and such) or the spine tingly, Bach organ hugging fullness of vinyl, with its twitches, crackles and ever so careful calibrations...can you feel me pulling my vinyl loving, and greying, hair out!! I have resorted to two vinyl collections, the acceptable and the 'Superheroes' pile, which are testaments to recording artistes and the wonderful sound engineers who were on the top of their game. I suspect thats why a lot of serious vinyl collectors, I am not one, find labels and record engineers they like and go on the hunt accordingly, seems to be a decent formula. Either way, I am going to find an integrated I can feel confident is on the right side of the compromise line, can take hold of difficult speakers by their swan like necks and waltz them around my room with confidence and full dynamics all at comfortable volumes :)....I HOPE.

[SLS]

Well, Shaid, I would look at the more powerful Pioneer, Yamaha or Onkyo, great values and features. You are welcome to my Plinius P10 for £1400.

I do favour labels that I know are very well engineered, like Hyperion and Alia Vox. Currently listening to Shostakovich's preludes and fugues, produced by ATMA Classique, another label that takes production values very seriously. Worth checking out.

[786]

Hello Steven, thanks for the label tips, I will definitely look to source some of their recordings. Regarding the Plinius, I had actually tried to purchase an integrated Plinius. I am trying to avoid the multiple boxes route, but if I end up with that option, and yours is still available, I shall contact you.

[SLS]

Hello Steven, thanks for the label tips, I will definitely look to source some of their recordings. Regarding the Plinius, I had actually tried to purchase an integrated Plinius. I am trying to avoid the multiple boxes route, but if I end up with that option, and yours is still available, I shall contact you.

Anytime. M1/J2. Best of luck in your search.

[loonytunes]

Sorry, but watts are watts. Found that out at considerable expense. Forget those brands. A Yamaha R-N500 for £290 on Amazon new gives you a quality 160 watts plus streaming and AirPlay etc. Get a Schiit Mani phono for £130 and if/when you give up on vinyl you can sell it. Pal of mine replaced an expensive Leben with the Yamaha (driving Harbeth) and never looked back.

The Yamaha R-N500 must be one of those overlooked gems for it to be superior to an expensive Leben! Is there a special sound to the Yamaha or could you just find other similar lower cost amps around the same wattage (i.e. Marantz) that would perform just as well?