Best Hifi setup position... front, side or back?

[The Black Adder]

Hi all.

Where do you find the best place is for your kit?

Quite a few have it centrally between the speakers but is there another position which you favor?

Having it central for me is a bit of a pain, so I have mine along the side wall which works but with that longer speaker cables are required. So is there a 'best' position for hifi?

Ta
Jo

[Wakefield Turntables]

Central for me. Altough I now have both system sitting centrally previously I had one to the left side (valve) and the solid state straight in front of me.

[Jimbo]

Side wall adjacent to the speakers with 4m speaker cables. Turntable is well isolated.;)

[karma67]

mine is side wall about 3 meters away from speakers although i have been thinking of putting the rack in between them,do you think my tt will suffer from being so close?

[trio leo]

I dare say it's room dependent really, with my system on the left wall of the room, I lay the needle on a still record to test feedback, I turned up the volume slowly until that woooooo sound came on, that happenned at about a 1/4 volume.

I put my system in between my speakers and repeated the test, I honestly thought it would be immediately worse, but, NO, I could turn the volume way past my loud listening position before it started to feedback.

I now have my system in a log cabin inbetween the speakers and it sounds great to me.

Enjoy your music :)

cheers Al

[Barry]

My system places the power amplifiers (they are monoblocks) directly behind each speaker, so minimising speaker cable length. The power amplifiers have balanced-line inputs and are connected by equal length (20m) balanced line cables to the preamplifier (which has balanced outputs).

The preamp, CD player, tuner and TT are located near my listening position, 5m from the speakers. The TT is situated on a brick extension to the fireplace and fortunately I don't have any problems with acoustic feedback.

[Spectral Morn]

Hi all.

Where do you find the best place is for your kit?

Quite a few have it centrally between the speakers but is there another position which you favor?

Having it central for me is a bit of a pain, so I have mine along the side wall which works but with that longer speaker cables are required. So is there a 'best' position for hifi?

Ta
Jo

Best option I feel.

[Arkless Electronics]

Other than keeping the TT as far as possible from speakers, and making sure it's well isolated on a wall shelf... it makes no difference.
Putting the TT in another room with cables through a direct conduit twixt walls even better of course. Not for those who find the lack of a remote control a problem already :eyebrows:

[danilo]

Cable lengths.. both in Interconnects And speaker feed wires is Important.
Shorter always being the 'better' solution.
Plan/position your gear accordingly.

[Oldpinkman]

I don't think position matters much for sound other than that I try for a turntable to be on a shelf on a solid wall. PT is pretty unfussed though. Since my 2 channel doubles as home cinema the centre position is out, and it's a wall to one side.
I don't think long speaker cables are a problem either, but having finally shelled out for an ahb2 of my own, which is tiny, noise immune runs cool and has balanced connections, I might put the power amp on the AV stand when we move to France and keep short tidy speaker cables.
The problem my set-up creates is the long run from the AV amp low level outputs to the 2 channel amp, the satellite ground, and the need to power 2 channel from a different socket to the AV gear. And keep noise out of the system. It needed monster chassis ground connections, until I used high quality signal transformers - an idea pinched from recording studios (I haven't yet encountered anyone else using them domestically)

[CageyH]

I don't think position matters much for sound other than that I try for a turntable to be on a shelf on a solid wall. PT is pretty unfussed though. Since my 2 channel doubles as home cinema the centre position is out, and it's a wall to one side.
I don't think long speaker cables are a problem either, but having finally shelled out for an ahb2 of my own, which is tiny, noise immune runs cool and has balanced connections, I might put the power amp on the AV stand when we move to France and keep short tidy speaker cables.
The problem my set-up creates is the long run from the AV amp low level outputs to the 2 channel amp, the satellite ground, and the need to power 2 channel from a different socket to the AV gear. And keep noise out of the system. It needed monster chassis ground connections, until I used high quality signal transformers - an idea pinched from recording studios (I haven't yet encountered anyone else using them domestically)

You bought the AHB2?

As for the original question, I have had the rack on a side wall, off to one side next to the speaker, and now in between the speakers. It has made no noticeable difference at my usual listening levels. Therefore I go for whatever suits my room the best.

[Oldpinkman]

You bought the AHB2?



Technically I have irrevocably committed to the purchase. I haven't quite parted with the funds, nor taken delivery - both expected next week. It's not the sort of thing that's easy to give back once you've had it. It is so invisible.

And "safe". I tripped all the protection circuitry last week hum-busting. I like a bit of protection!

I am working out a story for why I can afford it when the bloody exchange rate has taken a nose dive - something along the lines of "tempting fate" and other superstition. Anyway - she's had her duvet and duvet cover set...:D

[Spectral Morn]

Placing anything between the plane of the speakers, level with them or in front of them, will affect the ability of the speakers to create a convincing soundstage. If the equipment is on the floor, or well behind the speakers less so, but nothing between is best.

Yes interconnect and speaker cable lengths are important, but up to 5 or 6 m speaker cables of a quality cable is usually not a big deal, unless the amp speaker synergy is off.

That's been my audio lifetimes experience todate, avoid putting anything between the speakers.

[struth]

All my gubbins goes between the speakers and always has... Think in most houses thats going to be the only option.. It already takes up 1 whole wall. The gubbins are not out enough to affect what comes out of thespeakers imo.

[Jason P]

Placing anything between the plane of the speakers, level with them or in front of them, will affect the ability of the speakers to create a convincing soundstage. If the equipment is on the floor, or well behind the speakers less so, but nothing between is best.

Genuine question here. I'd always assumed that the stereo image was formed 'in the head' so, theoretically, you could have an acoustically inert divider all the way from a mid point between the speakers and your noggin and it would make little difference. I get that there can be diffraction between the speakers and this is undesirable, but I can't see how kit in-between can cause too much of an upset when it's the signals coming at us from the cones (and principally the tweeter) that build the stereo image in our mind? Am I being too simple/thick/missing something?

[Oldpinkman]

Genuine question here. I'd always assumed that the stereo image was formed 'in the head' so, theoretically, you could have an acoustically inert divider all the way from a mid point between the speakers and your noggin and it would make little difference. I get that there can be diffraction between the speakers and this is undesirable, but I can't see how kit in-between can cause too much of an upset when it's the signals coming at us from the cones (and principally the tweeter) that build the stereo image in our mind? Am I being too simple/thick/missing something?

I don't think that is correct. A pair of speakers is not a pair of headphones, and the imaging you get with headphones is quite different from speakers. Your left ear hears some of the right speaker as well as the left speaker and your right ear hears both too, and that is all part of the image.

Certainly "stuff in the room" can affect the sound. There used to be a lot of fuss at dems about removing speakers not being auditioned at one time - which is a bit of a joke in my place with the AV speakers, a spare set of Ventricals in the corner, and the TV itself. I have never particularly noticed or concerned myself about things between the speakers - but maybe I'll have a bit of a play when I have a decent living room in France

In my case the Quads need to be pulled as far into the room as I can manage to image - and that is going to apply even with nothing between them. By contrast, the Ventricals worked better, and imaged better, nearer the rear wall (and therefore with the TV between them). But the Ventricals, whilst they make a good fist of it, can't image like the Quads.

:cool:

[hifi_dave]

Having set up countless systems in various rooms, I can confirm that 'gubbins' between the speakers does mess with the stereo image, particularly the centre image. If the speakers are far forward, it isn't so much of a problem but 'gubbins' level with the speakers or slightly forward is a no, no.

For confirmation, sling a duvet over the 'gubbins' and hear how the images and sound stage improve.

[Oldpinkman]

You bought the AHB2?



Oh bugger. Now I've paid for it :D

[The Black Adder]

Oh bugger. Now I've paid for it :D

lol.. you daftee!

...whats an AHB2? :doh:

[The Black Adder]

With my setup I have a fireplace in the middle of the room so it's quite difficult to get everything in there as it's not very big.

I have thought of doing this but my turntable would have to be on a side wall somewhere. I suppose that's the end of that unless someone can reassure me know if a 3m run from my TT would be ok...

[Jason P]

I don't think that is correct. A pair of speakers is not a pair of headphones, and the imaging you get with headphones is quite different from speakers. Your left ear hears some of the right speaker as well as the left speaker and your right ear hears both too, and that is all part of the image.

Yes, I can see that now - propagation between ears from either speaker, as it were. I guess the purest form of this would be in an anechoic chamber, as you would truly hear the output and nothing else - so reflections and diffraction would be minimised or eliminated. I wonder though how much of our perception of depth in soundstage is due to these reflections?

I asked the original question because we recently re-arranged our room, and it's made the room a far nicer, more practical place to be - at the expense of the positioning of the speakers, which are either side of a large table now, and not symmetrical in the room. I thought it would destroy the imaging, but it's made far, far less of a difference than I expected - which surprised me.

[Dauntless]

I don't like gear etc between my speakers so have my equipment stand next to the TV and speakers on the adjacent window wall with nothing behind them but curtains. The disadvantage to this set up is long speaker cables.

[Oldpinkman]

lol.. you daftee!

...whats an AHB2? :doh:

It's an extra lovely power amplifier which a friend of mine (that one Marco goes on about) did most of the design work on. Although designed for professional use in studios, it almost immediately picked up audiophile interest in the USA, and I started reading stunning review after stunning review. He was given one by Benchmark, and asked me to listen to it for him and tell him what I thought of it. And what I thought was "I don't want to give it back". What with one thing and another, I have managed to avoid returning it for several months, but time was running out. It had to go back before I move to France. So I've had to buy one

This is one of the more recent ones, although it goes on a bit (skip to the conclusion) http://www.pooraudiophile.com/2015/07/benchmark-ahb2-power-amplifier-review.html

And this perhaps a bit easier to swallow http://www.stereophile.com/content/benchmark-media-systems-ahb2-power-amplifier#Ya43ol3KttVrs21S.97

But google, and you'll find review after review saying nice things. For me it's not an "impressive" amp. Its not "in your face" and so if I bought it round to dem for an hour or two, you might easily fail to be knocked over. It is VERY unusual, and takes a bit of getting used to, but once you do it is very hard (impossible in my case) to give up. It's so quiet - it vanishes, and all you are left with is the music.

[Oldpinkman]

Yes, I can see that now - propagation between ears from either speaker, as it were. I guess the purest form of this would be in an anechoic chamber, as you would truly hear the output and nothing else - so reflections and diffraction would be minimised or eliminated. I wonder though how much of our perception of depth in soundstage is due to these reflections?

I asked the original question because we recently re-arranged our room, and it's made the room a far nicer, more practical place to be - at the expense of the positioning of the speakers, which are either side of a large table now, and not symmetrical in the room. I thought it would destroy the imaging, but it's made far, far less of a difference than I expected - which surprised me.

For most of us our equipment is in our homes - not an idealised listening room (as we had in my days at PT) and that so compromise is necessary. The table presents no problem to me. Asymetrical would with the Quads, which are like a giant pair of headphones really. There is one spot for perfect imaging - and one spot only. But they are nice enough a bit off-axis if Sue and I are listening on the 2-seater together. Its just a bit different. :cool:

[CageyH]

That is why I am tempted to build a log cabin in the garden.
It could be built as the perfect listening room, and if I build it in the right place, it won't annoy the neighbours!

[Yomanze]

Having set up countless systems in various rooms, I can confirm that 'gubbins' between the speakers does mess with the stereo image, particularly the centre image. If the speakers are far forward, it isn't so much of a problem but 'gubbins' level with the speakers or slightly forward is a no, no.

For confirmation, sling a duvet over the 'gubbins' and hear how the images and sound stage improve.
Agreed. Not just HiFi, but things like fireplaces. I covered up my in-wall fireplace with acoustic panels, my HiFi racks are off to the side.

[CageyH]

That is why I am tempted to build a log cabin in the garden.
It could be built as the perfect listening room, and if I build it in the right place, it won't annoy the neighbours!

I was idly searching for a "chalet du jardin" for a listening room, and came across this - https://www.chaletdejardin.fr/le-chalet-toulouse-66mm-91m.html?gclid=CPXpgObLqcoCFSQYwwodP3kEIg

That would do it!

[Oldpinkman]

I was idly searching for a "chalet du jardin" for a listening room, and came across this - https://www.chaletdejardin.fr/le-chalet-toulouse-66mm-91m.html?gclid=CPXpgObLqcoCFSQYwwodP3kEIg

That would do it!

Perfect. Send the family out there to live, and keep the house for the HiFi :cool:

[Firebottle]

100 square metres is bigger than our whole house :eek:

[Hipper]

Firstly the image you get from stereo speakers is a phantom image - it doesn't exist between the speakers but is a construction by your brain. If you were to place an acoustic sheet from between the speakers to your nose you would prevent the sound from the right speaker reaching your left ear etc. and would get something more akin to headphone listening. This is known as Ambiophonics:

http://www.ambiophonics.org/

Equipment placed between the speakers may have two effects. Firstly it could reflect sound to your ears; this sound has mostly travelled direct from the speakers to the back wall, then from there to the front wall and your equipment, and then on to your ears. Secondly the fact that the equipment is there may take away from the impression of the music actually being played in front of you, not to mention reducing the impact of pesky LED lights. I would have thought another solution to reflections would be to angle the equipment so it is not at ninety degrees to you.

I found moving equipment to the side wall did improve the music image and also allowed me to put acoustic panels on the front wall.

[Jimbo]

Yes, I can see that now - propagation between ears from either speaker, as it were. I guess the purest form of this would be in an anechoic chamber, as you would truly hear the output and nothing else - so reflections and diffraction would be minimised or eliminated. I wonder though how much of our perception of depth in soundstage is due to these reflections?

I asked the original question because we recently re-arranged our room, and it's made the room a far nicer, more practical place to be - at the expense of the positioning of the speakers, which are either side of a large table now, and not symmetrical in the room. I thought it would destroy the imaging, but it's made far, far less of a difference than I expected - which surprised me.

You wouldn't want an anechoic chamber - it would just totally kill the sound. You definitely need reflected sound to give the music some life.

[Yomanze]

It seems silly to test a speaker in such an environment. Get a speaker that measures well in a chamber into a room and watch an Alpine landscape appear on the response curves.