Veneer or Avoid

[Bigman80]

Hi All, Me again lol

I am now turning my attention to the Turntable. It has a Birch plywood plinth which i am considering veneering with something exotic which means very prominent grain.

Does anyone have any experience veneering ? I am open to all advice available.

O

[struth]

Can be a difficult job if youve not done it before.. Expect to have some disasters. Using glue rather than iron on stuff will make a better job too.

[Bigman80]

Can be a difficult job if youve not done it before.. Expect to have some disasters. Using glue rather than iron on stuff will make a better job too.

Thanks Grant, That was my first thought lol. No experience but i am pretty handy with woodwork and my father in law is a carpenter type but he's never veneered either. know of anyone who does it as a job or hobby ?

[walpurgis]

Does anyone have any experience veneering ?

I've done loads. And I get a professional looking finish. Thing is, everybody seems to have their own pet way of doing it.

If you've not done any before, I'd suggest you avoid using hard, brittle wood veneers like Oak for instance. The sheets tend to have warps that make things tricky and they split easily, also getting decently smooth edge finishes is harder. Rosewood and Walnut can look very nice and are not too bad to work with.

I won't use 'iron on' veneer. It fails to stick properly in some instances, leaving 'bubbles'. I've always relied on Thixofix applied to the back of the veneer and the panel it's to be applied to, allowing about ten minutes to go tacky before laying the veneer on. I then rub the veneer down following the grain, using the end of a softwood block. Edge trimming I do with disposable scalpels and finish off with a fine sanding block.

As for polishing. (if you want to stain the veneer, do it before polishing) There are so many ways of tackling this. If you use a contact adhesive, don't oil the veneer. The oils acts as a solvent on the glue. White French polish works well. Many won't use lacquers, but I rather like the end result with Ronseal clear satin.

[struth]

Thanks Grant, That was my first thought lol. No experience but i am pretty handy with woodwork and my father in law is a carpenter type but he's never veneered either. know of anyone who does it as a job or hobby ?

If your handy with wood then it will go well... As Geoff says if you have a way with wood then its not brain surgery.. Just take your time and triple check everything. When ive done it i liked to leave each section to fully cure incase of shrinking b4 i did next bit

[The Black Adder]

I would love to learn how to veneer... it looks easy but... lol

[Wakefield Turntables]

Ive done it three times now and would agree that every wood is different to work with. I generally apply a panel, leave for 24 hours, then trim the sides with scalpal and then fine sand.

[RMutt]

Veneering, it brings me out in cold sweats when I recall my own attempts. There is a thread on the DIY section but I don't know whether I dare to find it! I would, as has been mentioned, avoid iron on types. They shrink when ironed and it is almost impossible to judge the amount they will shrink by and the various methods for dealing with this are difficult to use too. This is doubly difficult when trying to butt up pieces on large surfaces, although on a turntable each face will be covered by a single piece so not so much of a problem for you. What I would like to know, and it will be useful for you too Oliver, is what is the best way to finish the corner where a vertical section meets a horizontal one, i.e. where the front face meets the top. I tried putting the vertical piece on first and made the top piece sit over it. Unfortunately, there was still a visible line at the join. What do you experts think works best.

[awkwardbydesign]

I don't mind oak, but avoid anything like wenge. An absolute nightmare, IME.

[awkwardbydesign]

What I would like to know, and it will be useful for you too Oliver, is what is the best way to finish the corner where a vertical section meets a horizontal one, i.e. where the front face meets the top. I tried putting the vertical piece on first and made the top piece sit over it. Unfortunately, there was still a visible line at the join. What do you experts think works best.
I always try to put the most visible piece on last. On speakers that is generally the front, on a TT it could be front or top, depending on the height and viewing angle. And if the grain is running side to side on both surfaces, the join should be less visible than if they are in different directions.
And I generally use Evostik 528, as it is cheap in larger quantities. Thixofix would probably be better, as you can reposition slightly, but is too expensive when I am doing 3 or 4 square metres!

[karma67]

to be honest it doesn't get much easier than veneering 4 flat sides,if i were doing it i would use animal glue or pva, the animal glue method is old school,it has worked very well for hundreds of years and the best bit is if you bugger it up you can warm it up again and take the veneer off,you use a veneer hammer which is like geoffs method of using a scrap of soft wood only it has a handle and a flat brass insert which you push over the the surface to press out excess glue,it can get messy lol . pva method is too coat both veneer and surface with pva,let it go clear and then with a warm iron slowly go over the surface,a quick and easy method.

the order i would veneer would be front edges,then the sides and then the top and bottom, clean up over hang with a scalpel or file after glue has dried.
here's some pics of some examples of my veneering when i had my own cabinet making workshop,dont be scared have a go on some scrap to get used to the process,also reference books are your friends!

http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/jj548/jamiecreig123/img006_zpso9umixla.jpg

http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/jj548/jamiecreig123/img007_zpsfbgmdrt8.jpg

the last thing i ever made :(

http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/jj548/jamiecreig123/img010_zps1qcevfeu.jpg

[The Black Adder]

WOWOWOWOW!!! Really? - That is bloody lovely! Are you related to Sheratan or something?

[The Black Adder]

Ii would like to veneer my speaker cabs over the top of the Formica but I don't know if that would be a good thing or not. What do you recon Jamie?

[karma67]

hmm never done that before,is the formica original to the cabs or has someone done it in the past?
if the formica surface is keyed well with 60 or 80 grit paper i reckon you could do it using contact adhesive,coat both surfaces and wait to dry so that you can touch the glued surfaces and just feel a hint of tack,lay some batterns across the cab surface and then lay the veneer on top then working from the middle outwards remove the batterns one at a time pressing the veneer down as you go with a block off wood,working from the middle out to the edges. one tip when working with any veneer is to lightly dampen it the night before and weight it down so its flat before being used. :)

[karma67]

WOWOWOWOW!!! Really? - That is bloody lovely! Are you related to Sheratan or something?

ah thanks yes right period,10 out of 10 for you lol
i lived and breathed it for 10 years, also restoring antiques it was a lovely period of my life working along side my dad. it all died out after 9/11 no buyers were flying and the antique trade has never recovered.
the calton house desk in the last pic was kinda my swan song,a copy of one that took 3 days to find as they are very rare,richard courtney in the fulham rd back then let me come and measure it up so i could make one,the price tag on it was 95.000 iirc,mine was made using solid Brazilian mahogany then hand veneered in what was known at the time as cuban style maghogany,in laid with box wood lines.

[The Black Adder]

lol.. I like my furniture history!

Thanks for the advice... It's the original formica. I just fancy them as a different finish.

[karma67]

lol.. I like my furniture history!

Thanks for the advice... It's the original formica. I just fancy them as a different finish.
cool, have a go,if you've not done veneering before practice on some mdf off cuts to get your confidence up.

[Bigman80]

Ok. I'll start having some practice runs.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Well for what its worth I've just finished some work with Zebrano, it's not the easiest of veneers but you live and learn, next time around I'll pick something completely different. I've used iron on veneer for this job but I think I'll be using glue + veneer next time just to get a little more experience.

[Bigman80]

got any pics ?

[struth]

Just weight the bit down , loading from centre out. You can use pva that you let dry on both sides overnight. Then use an iron and something to protect the veneer and reactivate the glue. As you get glue on both sides it sticks better. A lot of contact adhesives work this way too. Saves working with wet tacky glue and does work well

[karma67]

Just weight the bit down , loading from centre out. You can use pva that you let dry on both sides overnight. Then use an iron and something to protect the veneer and reactivate the glue. As you get glue on both sides it sticks better. A lot of contact adhesives work this way too. Saves working with wet tacky glue and does work well
covered in post 11 grant :)

[struth]

Was it. Doh! Must have missed that lol...ah well its worth mentioning twice

[Bigman80]

Appreciated twice [emoji106]

[awkwardbydesign]

I'm lucky, in that I have made friends with someone in a shop with loads of old veneer. Some of it is very dry and brittle, but I get it so cheaply that I can experiment and waste a fair bit. I've cleaned out the ash, and the best of the oak, and the wenge breaks up into string, but I've definitely learned about overcoming problems! I use strong masking tape on the face of the veneer stretched across the grain to pull all the splits tight, and covering them in this way also minimises glue seepage. I know that gummed paper tape SHOULD work better, but the moisture in that causes the dry veneer to buckle. And masking tape has enough tension to close gaps. Anyway, it works well enough for me.
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m604/awkwardbydesign/JENZEN%20SEAS%20ER/P1000205_zps6dc054e9.jpg

[The Alchemist]

Hi Oliver,
I agree with Jamie that veneering 4 flat sides should not be difficult provided you use the right materials. I would strongly recommend you use a paper backed veneer which is much more user friendly if you haven't veneered before. As far as glue is concerned I like to use Scotchweld 30. This is a water based neoprene which can be rollered on to both surfaces and allowed to dry. (Careful use of a heat gun will accelerate this process). When dry the veneer can be applied and stuck down firmly by using a strong 3" roller. Be aware that this product has instant grab with no room for movement afterwards but for a small job like yours this will no be a problem. I admit that when I am veneering large speakers I have to be very careful to align the veneer properly! Practice on some waste material and I'm sure you will not find it too difficult. Have a look at Covanant's thread regarding his IPL speaker build. You will find some practical advice about veneering.
Regards,
Richard.

[danilo]

Veneering is an aquired skill. Kudos to those who have mastered it.

That said: a less than perfect job stands out like Dog's Balls.. until discarded/replaced.

I prefer Paint ie: 2 pack automobile type finishes or even Nextel because of it's texture.
Pro applied :_)

[Bigman80]

Hi Oliver,
I agree with Jamie that veneering 4 flat sides should not be difficult provided you use the right materials. I would strongly recommend you use a paper backed veneer which is much more user friendly if you haven't veneered before. As far as glue is concerned I like to use Scotchweld 30. This is a water based neoprene which can be rollered on to both surfaces and allowed to dry. (Careful use of a heat gun will accelerate this process). When dry the veneer can be applied and stuck down firmly by using a strong 3" roller. Be aware that this product has instant grab with no room for movement afterwards but for a small job like yours this will no be a problem. I admit that when I am veneering large speakers I have to be very careful to align the veneer properly! Practice on some waste material and I'm sure you will not find it too difficult. Have a look at Covanant's thread regarding his IPL speaker build. You will find some practical advice about veneering.
Regards,
Richard.

Thanks Richard. I'll try and find it [emoji106]

[Bigman80]

Veneering is an aquired skill. Kudos to those who have mastered it.

That said: a less than perfect job stands out like Dog's Balls.. until discarded/replaced.

I prefer Paint ie: 2 pack automobile type finishes or even Nextel because of it's texture.
Pro applied :_)

I did consider painting but I really want an exotic wood finish so it's going to be veneer I think. If I'm brave enough.

[The Alchemist]

Go for it! If you need any assistance send me a PM and I will do all I can to help.
Richard.

[Bigman80]

Go for it! If you need any assistance send me a PM and I will do all I can to help.
Richard.

Thanks Richard I will I think just dive in and have a go