Firebottle AIR hybrid Power Amplifier loan unit [Archive]

Firebottle

08-01-2016, 11:09

There is an AIR power amp that is currently in Scotland, with wee tee cee, that is available on a try before you buy or just a loan status.

Please pm wee tee cee if you are interested in trying it out.

http://i601.photobucket.com/albums/tt97/Paramotorpilot/Firebottle%20Axolotl/Firebottle%20AIR/P1050189.jpg

Zoidburg

12-01-2016, 20:07

wee tee cee

12-01-2016, 21:00

PM replied to...

awkwardbydesign

13-01-2016, 14:34

I would also like to try this. Will there be a loan list, like the phono stage?

Firebottle

13-01-2016, 16:31

Looks like there might have to be.

Small problem is the postage is going to be more as it's somewhat heavy, about 6.5Kg.

awkwardbydesign

13-01-2016, 17:09

Still worthwhile to audition it, at least for me.

wee tee cee

13-01-2016, 18:20

All going well I will get it off to Ben Friday/Saturday morning.

mikeyb

13-01-2016, 19:43

Collect+ won't be too expensive

Zoidburg

13-01-2016, 19:52

Happy to post it onwards after a demo of a week or two. Looks like it's Richard after me so will contact by pm closer to the time.

awkwardbydesign

13-01-2016, 20:40

Yay!

wee tee cee

17-01-2016, 16:35

Posted the Air to Ben Saturday morning, so he should get it around Tuesday.

Enjoy chaps, its a cracking bit of kit.

CageyH

17-01-2016, 16:57

Enjoy chaps, its a cracking bit of kit.

+1

:carrot:

Elephantears

17-01-2016, 19:06

Very interested in trying this Alan, as I said last year. Glad to see it is now available.

Zoidburg

19-01-2016, 14:04

Amp has arrived at my offices today, will get it home and fired up this evening.

Big thanks to Tony for the swift postage too.

mikeyb

28-01-2016, 20:39

Any update on how it sounds?

I'm tempted to try it with my TQ Claymore as a pre.

Mike.

CageyH

28-01-2016, 20:44

It sounds great.
I bought the first production model after hearing it last year.

mikeyb

07-02-2016, 13:46

Hi,

Just realised this is the loan thread lol.

Can I be added to the list please.

Thanks

Mike.

Firebottle

07-02-2016, 14:27

OK Mike, it's with Zoidburg at the moment.

List is now:
Awkwardbydesign
Elephantears
mikeb

:)

awkwardbydesign

08-02-2016, 12:20

It arrived this morning, and is working. Which is a good thing!

awkwardbydesign

14-02-2016, 19:03

Ready to post it on now. Managed to not break it. :D

awkwardbydesign

15-02-2016, 13:38

Posted to Elephantears today.

Elephantears

18-02-2016, 21:41

Received, thanks very much. Clearly Alan has worked some magic again; it's an impressive little box.

Jimbo

19-02-2016, 07:26

Received, thanks very much. Clearly Alan has worked some magic again; it's an impressive little box.

Then you ought here his KIN preamp, there is certainly some magic in that.

Elephantears

19-02-2016, 09:40

Then you ought here his KIN preamp, there is certainly some magic in that.

Yes, I'd love to, as I've been saying for some time, but sadly no loaner available.

anthonyTD

19-02-2016, 12:06

Looking good Alan,
Clean and Simple. :)
There is an AIR power amp that is currently in Scotland, with wee tee cee, that is available on a try before you buy or just a loan status.

Please pm wee tee cee if you are interested in trying it out.

http://i601.photobucket.com/albums/tt97/Paramotorpilot/Firebottle%20Axolotl/Firebottle%20AIR/P1050189.jpg

Marco

19-02-2016, 12:23

I've heard it in my system, Anthony, and it sounds superb, too! :)

Marco.

Ali Tait

19-02-2016, 12:25

Yep, a good amp indeed.

Firebottle

31-03-2016, 07:14

This is available for loan if anyone wants to try it.

PM mikeyb with your details :)

WESTLOWER

01-04-2016, 09:33

HI I am very interested in your Firebottle Phono Stage.
Is there a way I could hear it? I am in North London / Barnet.
Best Regards

Simon_LDT

01-04-2016, 09:50

Would love to give this a go in my system. Can I be added to the list please?

Firebottle

01-04-2016, 10:37

Simon, just send a pm to mikeyb and he will send it to you :)

Simon_LDT

01-04-2016, 10:48

Will do, thanks Alan.

Never had/used a valve amp before and I know it's a hybrid but eager to hear how having a bit of valve in the design will sound in my system.

mikeyb

01-04-2016, 14:21

Will do, thanks Alan.

Never had/used a valve amp before and I know it's a hybrid but eager to hear how having a bit of valve in the design will sound in my system.
If the parcel I'm waiting on arrives before the post office closes I'll get it posted today.

mikeyb

01-04-2016, 19:08

Posted as promised :)

Simon_LDT

02-04-2016, 15:15

Arrived today, thanks Mike. Big thanks to Alan for the loan unit. :)

I've managed to plum it in and currently playing a couple of things. First impressions are very good. I'll need to do some A/B'ing against my Arcam mono's but I swear I can hear more through the Firebottle. It just sounds more 3D/real and I'm getting tighter, yet deeper bass. How is that possible?

Will do some A/B'ing over the next few days/week.

I do have 1 small issue though, getting the dreaded hum through the speakers (toriod hum it sounds like). Never got this from the Arcam's so it must be the AIR causing it. Would putting my DC blocker in front help at all?

Firebottle

02-04-2016, 15:54

Hi Simon,
Glad you are liking it. The AIR is earthed on the signal side so the hum maybe caused by an earth loop from other kit.

The DC blocker will stop any mechanical hum from the toroidal transformer.

:)

Simon_LDT

03-04-2016, 17:06

Is that different than earthing the chassis? I'd like to try figure out the problem if possible as my Arcam's don't hum and the system is exactly the same, the only thing different is I've taken out the P1's and plummed in the AIR - same cables, etc.

Is it worth me just unplugging everything except the amp and then seeing if the hum is still there or not - would that eliminate the ground loop issue if the hum remains?

I will try the DC blocker tomorrow - haven't had chance today as I've been busy. It works wonders on the P1's though as those tended to play up with loud hum at times and now it's just a low level normal hum.

Firebottle

03-04-2016, 17:40

Is that different than earthing the chassis?
No

Is it worth me just unplugging everything except the amp and then seeing if the hum is still there or not - would that eliminate the ground loop issue if the hum remains?
Yes

:)

Simon_LDT

03-04-2016, 17:43

Will try that tomorrow Alan and report back - gotta nip off the bed now as on shift tonight.

Had a good 4-5 hours listening yesterday afternoon and I'm very impressed. I'm actually chomping at the bit to throw more music at it tomorrow!

mikeyb

03-04-2016, 18:19

It was definitely nice and quiet in my system.

Simon_LDT

04-04-2016, 12:03

Alan, just tried that (amp and speakers only) and it doesn't make any difference. I've even tried the DC blocker and it lowers the hum from the actual transformer (when putting ear near it it's slightly quieter) but not what is transmitted through the speakers. The hum gets noticeably louder (especially from the tweeter) when the mute knob is turned to 'on'. I can hear it a good 2ft away and although listening position is much further away than that (1.5m) it's a niggle for sure.

Obviously, not too worried about it for the time being with the demo unit, but do you know what could be causing it?

Firebottle

04-04-2016, 15:36

Are your speakers particularly sensitive?

When you say the mute knob 'on', do you mean in mute mode, with the knob turned clockwise to the right?

Simon_LDT

04-04-2016, 16:22

I believe the speakers are around 87-88db sensitivity.

I'm not sure about the mode. When I turn the AIR on there is a hum, turning the knob I believe it's left makes the hum louder as I assume the mute is then turned off? Am I supposed to be hearing hum when the speaker output is muted?

Basically it hums in either position and is louder when not muted so that the music comes through. Make any sense? If it's not a ground loop - what could it be?

Shadow Moses

07-04-2016, 18:58

Would love to have a loan of this and try it in my system

alcarmichael

06-06-2016, 19:35

Or maybe I should be asking on this thread....

Firebottle

06-06-2016, 20:25

Would love to have a loan of this and try it in my system

Did you see my pm I sent 3 weeks ago?

Firebottle

06-06-2016, 20:26

Or maybe I should be asking on this thread....

Hi Alex, PM Simon LDT with your details and he will send it to you.

alcarmichael

07-06-2016, 08:34

Done :D

Simon_LDT

13-06-2016, 12:59

Just to update the thread - The unit is now on the way to Alex and should arrive tomorrow morning.

Want to say a big thanks to Alan for the loan unit, a cracking amp!

hifinutt

13-06-2016, 13:21

did you manage to fix the hum problem ?

Firebottle

13-06-2016, 13:45

I believe the hum problem is down to earthing issues. The AIR amp has the signal circuitry connected to earth so the problem could arise depending on the associated equipment.
With my setup I get zero hum.

Simon_LDT

14-06-2016, 08:14

did you manage to fix the hum problem ?

Nope. Tried everything I could. Very much doubt it's an earth problem (and if it is, it must be something to do with the amp and speakers only). Even got out my old Marantz integrated (pm7001) and no hum there, no hum on my current Arcam mono's either. Tried just the amp and speakers and still the hum. Doesn't sound like an earth loop hum either - it sounds like the exact hum (pitch) of the toroid and even with a dc blocker in place the same hum. Same equipment/cables - the only thing I was changing was the power amp.

Still - it does sound tremendous and I concluded that it beat my Arcam's for sheer musicality. Lovely weight to the sound, nice grunt but at the same time really easy to listen to. The midrange is really, really nice on the Air.

Firebottle

14-06-2016, 08:53

Simon, thanks for going to so much trouble with the setup to try and find the solution to the hum. I guess you could hear it because of the sensitivity of your speakers.

I still think it is due to the audio circuitry having an earth connection, but more to do with the way the valve heater is wired. I have an alternative scheme in the prototype and this doesn't give any hum.
I can/will change the arrangement in the AIR.

:cool:

Simon_LDT

14-06-2016, 09:01

Alan, if it helps further (think I already mentiond this but not sure which thread it was) the hum was very quiet when the amp is initially turned on (acceptable level) but soon as the knob on the front is turned to 'on' the hum gets much, much louder.

alcarmichael

14-06-2016, 17:23

Just to confirm I have today received the amplifier :)

Only now do I have the realisation that with football currently on daily my opportunities to listen through it are minimal :doh:

hifinutt

14-06-2016, 17:59

well thanks , good that various folks get to try it and try and iron out these issues of hum

mikeyb

14-06-2016, 19:35

Didn't hum when I had it

Firebottle

14-06-2016, 19:55

I'm getting to the bottom of it, it depends on the gain and sensitivity structure of the system as to whether it is heard or not.

I've now lowered it dramatically with an example I have here, cheers.

mayebaza

16-06-2016, 21:13

I have acquired a Music First Audio Classic Copper Passive. Pre, is it OK if I try it your power amp.

walpurgis

16-06-2016, 21:24

I can't think why not. Just keep the volume down to start off. But you could always try it into an integrated amp or a preamp feeding the power amp first.

The Music First should be a nice sounding unit.

alcarmichael

18-06-2016, 11:30

Just a quick update; I've managed to get round to connecting the amp up just now, currently streaming Spotify and it sounds very good. Amazing in fact. I'm very impressed.

alcarmichael

18-06-2016, 13:49

I love this amplifier, I've just sat for 2 hours listening to Spotify, this has never happened before! Since discovering vinyl, digital music often loses my attention.

Female vocals are absolutely stunning, the soundstage is great with precise instrument placement. The midrange is sublime, there's more drive here, it seems more 'meaty' than I'm used to and I like it. The treble seems much brighter too, this is possibly why I lost interest in digital music, I often felt it wasn't detailed enough compared to my vinyl set-up.

It's just ticking overly quietly while I watch the Ireland v Belgium game and then I'll play some vinyl, I'm excited.

Firebottle

24-01-2017, 13:16

Just resurrecting this thread as I am just updating the loan unit to a Mark 2 build, which will provide a 'dual mono' performance.

Next to trial it are:
REXTON

Cheers,
Alan

CageyH

30-01-2017, 12:17

"Dual mono" sounds interesting. The Air was already good, and I guess this will build on the performance?
It would be interesting to see a picture of the internals when it is finished.

Firebottle

30-01-2017, 12:51

The look of the internal arrangement isn't that different.
There is still one low voltage toroid transformer but the rectifier/smoothing capacitor scheme is now spit into two, thus providing separation of the two channels output stages.

The driver stages have a very good power supply rejection ratio (PSRR) so no improvements are needed in this area.

:)

CageyH

30-01-2017, 12:57

Ah, subtle changes in layout.
I would like to hear the Mk2 at some point.

andy335touring

24-06-2017, 16:20

I'm interested in trying/loaning this amp please ?

Is it still 100wrms in the mk2 version ?

How much does it cost to buy and do you have the dimensions please ?

Cheers

Andy

Firebottle

25-06-2017, 10:33

Hi Andy,

The AIR is 90W per channel and is 32cm wide, 8.5cm tall and 29cm deep including front panel knob and rear connectors.

The price is £650.

Cheers,
Alan