What Amp??

[Tom-Brown]

I'm sure this will open another can of worms :) But I'm on the look out for a new amp (solid state or tube) integrated, as my room is smallish it doesn't need to "rock da house" the main issue for me is that I like a rich sound!! Don't need a phono stage as I've got a long dog audio dual input/output phono stage coming in Jan :) :) Budget is a max of £1500 :) I've been looking but there are so many mixed reviews out there my mind is fried at the moment!!!! Help :lol: :lol:

[walpurgis]

One of these might suit.

http://www.hifichoice.co.uk/news/article/creek-destiny-2--pound;1749/9718

I've not seen a bad word said about it. Definitely on my shopping list if I ever need an integrated amp.

[Scooby]

When you say a "new" amp, does it have to be brand new? Your money wil go a lot further if buying used. That said, £1500 will still give you a great amp if you choose something you like. Best advice I can offer is go listen to a few amps if buying new. If buying used, you can always buy on instinct and re-sell at little or no loss if it's not your thing.

[PaulStewart]

Off the wall but in your budget and will give you a superb sound, way beyond anthing else at you price point in my opinion and all sourced from AoS

Gareth's Tissy http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?42152-For-Sale-Tisbury-Passive-Preamp-(latest-version)

Coupled with Colin's Art Audio Concerto Mk2 http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?40961-Art-Audio-Concerto-MK2-tube-amp-Definitive-Audio-upgrades

Great set up straight away and should you want to upgrade the pre amp in the future, real easy to do

Cheers

[Ninanina]

I think Graham was looking for an integrated amp...

I think a used Audio Note Oto SE or PP or maybe a Soro might be a good used buy, I say this not just because I own an Audio Note Oto SE but because they represent very good value for money on the used market. The Oto retails for about £2,300'ish and I think the Soro is about the same but on the used market you could pick up either amp for around £1,200 ' ish, for a good one. I believe at £1,200' ish there is nothing to touch them and I have used loads of amps over the years

As Graham is also using Rega RS3's, which is exactly what I am using at the moment (my new toy!) I absolutely guarantee either amp is ample to drive them and sound very nice as well. The Oto SE (like mine) is about 10w and the Soro about 20w which, believe me, is plenty to drive the RS3's as they seem such an easy speaker to drive, to very high volumes if required (which I don't however!)

Hope that helps Graham ;)

[Tom-Brown]

One of these might suit.

http://www.hifichoice.co.uk/news/article/creek-destiny-2--pound;1749/9718

I've not seen a bad word said about it. Definitely on my shopping list if I ever need an integrated amp.

Cheers Geoff, there are a couple of Destiny Mk1's on ebay at the mo..Manufacturers refrub with warranty for £700??

[Tom-Brown]

When you say a "new" amp, does it have to be brand new? Your money wil go a lot further if buying used. That said, £1500 will still give you a great amp if you choose something you like. Best advice I can offer is go listen to a few amps if buying new. If buying used, you can always buy on instinct and re-sell at little or no loss if it's not your thing.

No - just NEW to me so all options considered :) been looking at a copland?? on t'bay but reviews are mixed!!

[Ninanina]

Also as Andy has said if you buy a used amp and don't get on with it you can always re-sell it easily. I think buying used is a no brainer as long as you don't over pay for it. It's a great way of trying out various amps at home with little or no risk... just a thought ;)

[Tom-Brown]

I think Graham was looking for an integrated amp...

I think a used Audio Note Oto SE or PP or maybe a Soro might be a good used buy, I say this not just because I own an Audio Note Oto SE but because they represent very good value for money on the used market. The Oto retails for about £2,300'ish and I think the Soro is about the same but on the used market you could pick up either amp for around £1,200 ' ish, for a good one. I believe at £1,200' ish there is nothing to touch them and I have used loads of amps over the years

As Graham is also using Rega RS3's, which is exactly what I am using at the moment (my new toy!) I absolutely guarantee either amp is ample to drive them and sound very nice as well. The Oto SE (like mine) is about 10w and the Soro about 20w which, believe me, is plenty to drive the RS3's as they seem such an easy speaker to drive, to very high volumes if required (which I don't however!)

Hope that helps Graham ;)

Cheers, there are a couple (oto) on t'bay at the moment within the price you mention :) Bloomin cheapest is Collection only in Taunton - a big drive for me :(

[walpurgis]

Cheers Geoff, there are a couple of Destiny Mk1's on ebay at the mo..Manufacturers refrub with warranty for £700??

The Mk.I had excellent reviews too. Check online.

Creek amps always seem to have something a bit special. They're very musical.

[Ninanina]

Graham I owned a Copland CSA28 hybrid amp for many years

Would I own it again ? no definitely not

It is the most superb bit of engineering you will ever see in an integrated amp, it is quite special in it's build quality

However the sound is nothing special. I thought it was the bees knees when I had it but after listening to other amps, including my current Audio Note Oto SE, it lacks somewhat. It is a very 'cold' sounding amp; that's a tricky one to describe but the best I can do is say that it lacked 'emotion' and 'feeling' somehow

Don't get me wrong for a used buy at about £600'ish there is probably nothing better than the Copland but as you move up the integrated scale there are certainly much better amps to be had, in my opinion. For the record the other hybrid amp I had for a while was the superb Audio Analogue (I forget the model) with a wooden remote control and I think it sounded better than the Copland. Again, however, it still lacked the emotion and 'feel' of a full valve amplifier

I have owned my Audio Note Oto SE for so many years. I didn't use it for many of those years and it was packed away in it's box.... however when I 're-discovered' the amp and started using it again I absolutely fell in love with it..

I am quite sure you will find the Audio Note amps really 'like' the RS3's as they are a pretty easy load for the low power. I was quite amazed at how easily the Oto SE (at only 10w) drives the RS3's and in my room I never want to go beyond about 9/10 0'clock on the dial !

[Ninanina]

Cheers, there are a couple (oto) on t'bay at the moment within the price you mention :) Bloomin cheapest is Collection only in Taunton - a big drive for me :(

That Oto SE in Taunton is a slightly older model than mine; you can tell due to the side mounted connectors and the Audio Note lettering. That doesn't make it a bad purchase but that's probably why it is priced at just £900 or Best Offer.. and I think it's a Phono version which is worth more!

This is what mine looks like (although this is not my actual amp!). The connectors are at the rear... notice the difference in the Audio Note lettering..hope that helps..
http://i1036.photobucket.com/albums/a450/ninanina2/Oto%20SE_3.jpg (http://s1036.photobucket.com/user/ninanina2/media/Oto%20SE_3.jpg.html)

[Scooby]

I had a CSA14 and I found it a bit bland, but YMMV. I saw a CTA401 on Gumtree earlier. It's all valve so may be better if Copland's your thing.

Audio note is certainly a safer proposition financially. They are sought after so it's an easier sell if you don't like it. Buying anything used is the best way to the best sound IMO and it's also fun being able to try and sell on without losing a fortune.

[Tom-Brown]

That Oto SE in Taunton is a slightly older model than mine; you can tell due to the side mounted connectors and the Audio Note lettering. That doesn't make it a bad purchase but that's probably why it is priced at just £900 or Best Offer.. and I think it's a Phono version which is worth more!

This is what mine looks like (although this is not my actual amp!). The connectors are at the rear... notice the difference in the Audio Note lettering..hope that helps..
http://i1036.photobucket.com/albums/a450/ninanina2/Oto%20SE_3.jpg (http://s1036.photobucket.com/user/ninanina2/media/Oto%20SE_3.jpg.html)

It looks like both on ebay are older models as the lettering is different and they both have side mount inputs :( :(

[Audio Advent]

What does "rich sound" mean...

Many would consider a top-end classic 1970s receiver from Yamaha or Pioneer or Luxman as having a lush and rich sound. A Musical Fidelity A100 has a great rich sound too - about £200.

I don't think you need to spend as much as £1500 to get what you're after with careful choices..

[Tom-Brown]

Graham I owned a Copland CSA28 hybrid amp for many years

Would I own it again ? no definitely not

It is the most superb bit of engineering you will ever see in an integrated amp, it is quite special in it's build quality

However the sound is nothing special. I thought it was the bees knees when I had it but after listening to other amps, including my current Audio Note Oto SE, it lacks somewhat. It is a very 'cold' sounding amp; that's a tricky one to describe but the best I can do is say that it lacked 'emotion' and 'feeling' somehow

Don't get me wrong for a used buy at about £600'ish there is probably nothing better than the Copland but as you move up the integrated scale there are certainly much better amps to be had, in my opinion. For the record the other hybrid amp I had for a while was the superb Audio Analogue (I forget the model) with a wooden remote control and I think it sounded better than the Copland. Again, however, it still lacked the emotion and 'feel' of a full valve amplifier

I have owned my Audio Note Oto SE for so many years. I didn't use it for many of those years and it was packed away in it's box.... however when I 're-discovered' the amp and started using it again I absolutely fell in love with it..

I am quite sure you will find the Audio Note amps really 'like' the RS3's as they are a pretty easy load for the low power. I was quite amazed at how easily the Oto SE (at only 10w) drives the RS3's and in my room I never want to go beyond about 9/10 0'clock on the dial !

That description of the copland just about sums up all the reviews that I've seen!! Cheers

[Haselsh1]

For fifteen hundred quid you could buy a Croft pre/power combo or a Croft Integrated. Now that would seriously get my vote over an awful lot of average.

[Ninanina]

That description of the copland just about sums up all the reviews that I've seen!! Cheers

Graham I have not read the reviews on the Copland so I am just pleased that my own views were at least somewhere near to what others thought.... blimey I may be able to describe hifi after all... :doh:

[Ninanina]

For fifteen hundred quid you could buy a Croft pre/power combo or a Croft Integrated. Now that would seriously get my vote over an awful lot of average.

Shaun while I think that Croft do certainly make superb valve amps I have only had one encounter with a Croft integrated

This Croft integrated sounded very flat to me and was nowhere near as good as the Audio Note integrated which I guess is not surprising as it's new price is less than half that of the AN amp

The only other Croft I have had first hand experience of was the Croft Vitale Pre amp and that was very good indeed used with, amongst other amps, the Quad II's I had at the time

[Yomanze]

Not much solid state is as "lively" and "liquid" as valves, but some is. Like LFD.

[Tom-Brown]

I've also seen a Krell 400Xi some seem to think they are good???

[walpurgis]

Not much solid state is as "lively" and "liquid" as valves, but some is. Like LFD.

Mine are. But then my valve amps sound great too. :D

[struth]

Think any decent amp will work well with the regas. Sure you can get something nice without coming close to your budget should you wish

[Ninanina]

I've also seen a Krell 400Xi some seem to think they are good???

Sorry Graham I have no experience of anything Krell

The only solid state amps I've listened to with the Krells amount of output was a pair of Mark Levinson monoblocks. I have no idea of the model number but I know they were very expensive indeed... Seriously they did nothing for me whatsoever.... If I was the type of person that was impressed by the figures and the price I might have liked them, but I'm not so I didn't... I thought they were very ordinary and I wouldn't have taken them home even if the dealer would have given them to me... I know that might sound odd but it's the truth, I didn't like them at all

But like I say I have absolutely no experience of Krell stuff... however what I do know is that you absolutely do not need the vast amount of output of a Krell for your RS3's to work properly...I know the Audio Note Oto SE giving a mere 10w doesn't sound like it would work but believe me it does, and very well indeed...

[southall-1998]

Mine are. But then my valve amps sound great too. :D


SM-70 Pro, give me some sugar! :D

S

[Yomanze]

Mine are. But then my valve amps sound great too. :D
Think you have a good ear for analogue sound - no glare allowed - though. ;)

[walpurgis]

SM-70 Pro, give me some sugar! :D

S

And SM-70!

[southall-1998]

And SM-70!


Nope! She's far too explicit for my liking :)

S.

[Audio Advent]

For fifteen hundred quid you could buy a Croft pre/power combo or a Croft Integrated. Now that would seriously get my vote over an awful lot of average.

Integrated or Pre/Power - what's the difference if they're of the same make and sit one on top of the other? Might even take up less room, a matching pre/power.

Normally I'd expect a pre/power combo to out-perform an integrated simply because each has to stand up on their own as individual products! And two good products often add up to more than one good one.

Graham, I wouldn't limit yourself to an integrated if you can find a good pre/power combination that either looks good or takes up the same space. Depends on why you're specifically thinking about an integrated - my guess is that it's one less box. As I say, a matching pre/power looks like one box when stacked.

[vouk]

This one might be to your liking:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pathos-Classic-One-Integrated-Amplifier-/151913093547?hash=item235eb9d9ab:g:mnEAAOSwf-VWa0lB or
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PATHOS-CLASSIC-ONE-MKIII-INTEGRATED-AMPLIFIER-BOXED-/252214114093?hash=item3ab921f72d:g:B-UAAOSwnipWZa28

I could easily recommend any of these:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ayre-AX-7e-High-End-Stereo-Vollverstarker-/131671003314?hash=item1ea83410b2:g:ypYAAOSwYIdWFpx x
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Electrocompaniet-ECI3-Integrated-Amplifier-/172023088034?hash=item280d6003a2:g:PWoAAOSwf-VWZqwB
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Balanced-Audio-Technology-VK-300x-integrated-valve-amp-/111854458696?hash=item1a0b0b9748:g:1vcAAOSw3KFWdpl 5
http://www.guildfordaudio.co.uk/store/itemdetails.php?category=Turntables&section=Categories&cattitle=Used%20Items&page=used&recordid=2390

[jandl100]

Krell 400xi - I've had one and liked it a lot. Warm and yummy, I thought (and still do). But others report it as being shrill and shrieky. :scratch:

Personally, I don't see the need to spend £1k+ on an amp. Been there, done that, loads of times - I think a £hundred or three will get you all the amp you need.

I like the previous suggestion of a vintage amp or receiver.

My Rotel RA-1412 looks amazing and sounds lush and unfatiguing while still packing a wallop.
http://www.revisound.com/rotel_1412.jpg

My Marantz 4230 receiver is stunning also with yummy non-fatiguing sound.
http://www.radiomuseum.org/images/radio/marantz_itasca/marantz_4230_1283329.jpg

Loads of other similar choices. Budget £50-£100 to get a working example cleaned up and nicely sorted if you can't do it yourself or if it's not been done already.

Lovely :thumbsup: and the pride of ownership with that sort of thing is out of sight, for me anyway. :)

£300 each or less.

[twotone]

Nice amp here, I think, no connection with the seller.

https://www.avforums.com/threads/creek-evolution-2-amp-with-phono-board.1994042/#post-22997986

BTW, I use one of these below, comes with a remote and a phono stage and sounds great to me and it's only about £90 delivered.

http://cpc.farnell.com/1/1/78962-pulse-sra-160usb-hifi-amplifier-stereo-mic-usb.html

[Tom-Brown]

I knew I was going to get a lot of options, and I've now got loads to think about.....I think the sensible thing will be to wait for my Long Dog Audio phono stage and see what that brings to the party!! I believe it was commissioned by Montesquieu originally :)

[hayche]

Shaun while I think that Croft do certainly make superb valve amps I have only had one encounter with a Croft integrated

This Croft integrated sounded very flat to me and was nowhere near as good as the Audio Note integrated which I guess is not surprising as it's new price is less than half that of the AN amp

The only other Croft I have had first hand experience of was the Croft Vitale Pre amp and that was very good indeed used with, amongst other amps, the Quad II's I had at the time
I have to stick up for my Croft here as I am in Hifi heaven with it. As strange as it is true but I could never get it to sound right with the standard ecc83 valve, it sounded thin with lots of detail up top and little below. Stick a JJ ECC82 in it and everything comes to life, no thinness, lots of bass, whole tones and masses of funk.

Howard

[Haselsh1]

I simply have to agree with Howard on this one. Having changed the valves in my Croft preamp to Gold Lion ECC83's the sound improved massively especially the stereo imaging. I have heard Audio Note's cheapie integrated's before and always preferred Audion's 300B integrated over them. I guess it is always going to be the case that people hear different things but Croft amplifiers are some of the best pre/powers I have heard since about 1984.

[Haselsh1]

I have to stick up for my Croft here as I am in Hifi heaven with it. As strange as it is true but I could never get it to sound right with the standard ecc83 valve, it sounded thin with lots of detail up top and little below. Stick a JJ ECC82 in it and everything comes to life, no thinness, lots of bass, whole tones and masses of funk.

Howard

I may well be wrong here but I thought that Croft preamp stages were only designed to be used with ECC83 valves...?

[hayche]

I may well be wrong here but I thought that Croft preamp stages were only designed to be used with ECC83 valves...?
Mine is the integrated which is really the series 7 power amp with a passive volume pot, it takes quite a few different valve types to alter the gain.
I do not know about the active preamp micro25

Howard.

[Haselsh1]

Mine is the integrated which is really the series 7 power amp with a passive volume pot, it takes quite a few different valve types to alter the gain.
I do not know about the active preamp micro25

Howard.

OK Howard, just a thought there as I know nowt about their integrated.

[Tom-Brown]

Well!!!! I bit the bullet over x-mas and my new amp arrived this morning :) :) Direct from Creek a fully refurbished with new 2yr warranty - Creek Destiny :) :) Just got the turntable ploughing some "Philly" sounds through it now (as all the neighbours are at work :) ) and it sounds superb!!!! Well rounded and crystal clear sounds much, much better than my NAD!!
Just waiting for my longdog audio dual phono amp to arrive and I think I am done for this year :) :)

[walpurgis]

Ah. So you got one then. :)

[Ali Tait]

You will enjoy the phono stage, it's excellent.

[Tom-Brown]

You will enjoy the phono stage, it's excellent.

Cheers Ali,
Heard nothing but great things about it so far....It's on it's way from sunny Spain today....looking forward to playing with valves :) :) It'll be my 1st valve operated anything :lol: :lol: :lol: