View Full Version : The importance of cleaning NEW vinyl..Doh!
my lovely low hrs Nagaoka MP-500 has gone from this,
http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/jj548/jamiecreig123/jpeg_zpsxt5ks84x.jpg
to this :(
http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/jj548/jamiecreig123/Mon%20Nov%2023%2019-38-49_zpsq1ygihh5.jpg
http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/jj548/jamiecreig123/Mon%20Nov%2023%2019-31-56_zps86mqqols.jpg
i reckon the tips come off,ok so whats my options? buy a new stylus or go second hand and try another cartridge?
i really pissed off about this as i dont need the expenses and its not done many hrs so perhaps build quality is poor?
what do you think?
daytona600
23-11-2015, 19:59
If a failure you will get a new one under warranty just contact your dealer sold dozens & no faults
unless you bought a imported one then no warranty
i bought it second hand on here from bob4333 so no warranty.what would make the tip shear off? all i noticed was a some distortion.
The Black Adder
23-11-2015, 20:11
Regardless, you should contact Nagaoka. That looks like a flaw in the tip so you might get lucky and they might replace it for you. I've never seen that before to be honest.
thanks,worth a go so ive just sent them an email. :)
RobbieGong
23-11-2015, 20:42
thanks,worth a go so ive just sent them an email. :)
Blimey Jamie ! That's proper 'broken off' :eek:. If you are not aware of doing anything that might have caused it then you are doing the right thing giving Nagaoka a shout, it really cant do any harm. Never heard one but a very good mm I'm led to believe. All the best with it :)
cheers,yep it sounded lovely,one minute then the next pants which lead me to get the microscope out.
Firebottle
24-11-2015, 07:28
Maybe it was your avatar wench clicked her fingers a bit too much or too low :lol:
Good luck with Nagaoka.
Ammonite Audio
24-11-2015, 08:20
I once had a tip of an AT33PTG snap off in much the same way. ESCo said it was not unusual with such slim profiles, so I got them to put a new Paratrace tip on it, but it never sounded any good from that point. I still have the AT33PTG and may yet get it tipped with something close to the original MR profile.
there is light at the end of the tunnel!
i have contacted Nagaoka japan and they have told me along with paul (rfc) to contact tonar international who are the eu importers,i spoke with a guy called Glenn who was very helpful and has asked me to send him the stylus for inspection,then hopefully a replacement will be sent under the warranty.id also like to thank Bob who has been so helpful in providing me with original receipts etc.
so watch this space and keep your fingers crossed for me! :)
well today ive received a reply from tonar international regarding my stylus,i have copied it below.
Dear Jamie,
We have just received the stylus you sent us and checked it.
It turns out the stylus was just very dirty.
The stylus is glued to the cantilever with a large amount of special glue as this is the only way to fix the tip to the Boron cantilever material. The flats on the tip that you see are not signs of wear but are specific to the Shibata type stylus cut which creates a very short radius in the length of the groove and a big line contact surface area in the vertical direction of the groove so as to strongly reduce the pressure of the stylus on the groove. In fact the contact surface of this type of stylus is much larger than the contact surface of a conical shaped stylus.
We have cleaned the stylus first with Nagaoka AM-801 stylus cleaner.
http://www.nagaoka.eu/index.php?item=nagaoka-am-801_ii-stylus-cleaner&action=article&group_id=10000002&aid=17&lang=en
After inspection under the microscope we can see nothing wrong with the stylus.
So any sound deterioration you may have experienced ad/or skipping out of the groove was caused by the heavy accumulation of dirt on the stylus tip.
The dirt accumulation causes the stylus not to fit properly in the groove and by miss tracking causes distortion.
We recommend you clean your stylus regularly using a carbon fiber stylus brush in combination with the Nagaoka stylus cleaning fluid.
http://www.tonar.eu/index.php?action=search&lang=en&srchval=4250
But even more important is that you should clean your records regularly and in some cases, especially older records, you should actually wash them.
This can be done with a simple washing machine like the Knosti Disco Antistat or more professional machines if you wish to spend the money.
http://www.tonar.eu/index.php?action=search&lang=en&srchval=3508
We look forward to your reply and after that we will return the stylus to you.
best regards
Glenn
Interesting ah, i may be going mad but in the photos does it not look like the tips sheered off and is missing? wouldn't dirt build up on top of the tip making it bigger in profile?
ive been looking at the pics below again and too me the profile of the tip in the second pic looks a lot smaller.
All my records are vacuum cleaned so im a bit confused,the only thing ive done recently is play a lot of uncleaned new records,would that perhaps do it?
what do you guys think?
http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/jj548/jamiecreig123/jpeg_zpsxt5ks84x.jpg
http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/jj548/jamiecreig123/Mon%20Nov%2023%2019-38-49_zpsq1ygihh5.jpg
Photograph it when it comes back... they may be like Rolls Royce of old who wouldnt charge for a repair and said, sorry sir our cars dont go faulty;)
that did cross my mind too Grant,im just composing an email to them now saying much the same as ive wrtten above,do you think i shouldn't bother and just say thanks and wait and see when it comes back?
that did cross my mind too Grant,im just composing an email to them now saying much the same as ive wrtten above,do you think i shouldn't bother and just say thanks and wait and see when it comes back?
i wouldnt say anything ther than thanks and see how it looks and performs. it is always possible that what they say is right.
cool,yep i certainly respect that they know far more about cartridges than me :)
My tuppence worth.
Glenn is probably right in what he says. He's an honest and decent chap and has real integrity. I can say that as I have met him and know him personally.
Look more closely at the two photos. Now check the angle that they were taken at...then angle is subtly different. I can see that clearly when I look at the glue ridge line on the mass holding the tip in place.
What you perceived as part of the tip missing is in fact the tip viewed from a slightly different angle, that's all.
As the diamond tips are amongst the hardest and toughest substances on the planet, It would be more likely for the glue bond to fail than part of the tip to shear off bearing in mind it is unlikely that the diamond tip would have any sort of discontinuity (grinding and polishing would have shown that up if there was a problem).
Cheers paul, words of wisdom and i take your point the angle is slightly different,id better get myself some better stylus cleaner then! :) i wonder if there's anything in the mould release agent story/myth? perhaps i should clean my new vinyl too?
Cheers paul, words of wisdom and i take your point the angle is slightly different,id better get myself some better stylus cleaner then! :) i wonder if there's anything in the mould release agent story/myth? perhaps i should clean my new vinyl too?
I'd be careful Jamie about using anything solvent based as a cleaning agent where bonded stylii are concerned. Just keeping records clean will prevent the gunk building up and all that's needed is a brush with a carbon stylus brush. These are much stiffer than ordinary stylus brushes so do a good job of gently scrubbing the tips; either that or a so called "Magic Eraser" type of cleaner. I never bother to clean new vinyl personally unless static is an issue (and has already gathered dust on the surface). I just put them into anti-static sleeves and only clean once in a blue-moon. It's all that's usually needed. I always clean used vinyl that I buy with my own solution of distilled/de-ionised water and IPA with a little wetting agent added. They then get put into anti-static sleeves. Works a treat.
Im using this
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/12/03/9f4c82263ccfe95a9469c981a029f8bb.jpg
From the makers of your stylus. [emoji12]
Ta,
i have to say with the new vinyl the static is a nightmare,even after zapping with the zerostat before play 9 times out of 10 it lifts the matt when changing sides,re the cleaner i was going to play safe and by Nagaoka's brand of stylus cleaning fluid.
Hi,
Zooming into photo 2 you can see the build up on the rear of the stylus quite clearly, the right hand edge of it if you like, the stylus shape can be picked out no problem and that's just by using my smartphone to view the image.
https://mikeyb.smugmug.com/Other/Odds-and-Sods/i-Q88FP88/0/O/IMG_20151203_191420.jpg
Not sure if this will work but I've cropped the image on my phone and upped the contrast to show the dirt on the right edge of the stylus, upping the contrast shows the dirt in the shadow and you can see the edge if the stylus quite clearly.
Hopefully my edit of the photo is good enough for my post but using my smartphone and Tapatalk I'm not sure.
Mike.
I was bored and made this before seeing that Nagaoka had told you the same thing my gif shows!!
I had a very similar thing happen to me with a NAG200, so I understand how awful it feels to think you have broken an expensive stylus.
http://i.imgur.com/9upsUHJ.gif
Good news that the stylus is okay after all.
I would clean all your vinyl before playing it, new or old. I don't play anything that hasn't gone under the Moth cleaner at least once. New vinyl is not pressed in a laboratory and there is no reason why it would be 'virgin clean' - someone has to handle it too and put it in the sleeve, then you get grease which attracts dirt and so on. I've got a pot of the magic gunk that you can lower the needle into to clean it but it is very rarely needed.
At £220 for a new stylus it is well worth the 3 minutes required to clean a new LP. I don't buy new vinyl but one of my brothers bought me a brand new LP at Xmas and it was minging, needed a good go over before it played quietly.
I clean all new stuff as a matter of course now. I often play a track first and then relisten after a clean. It is surprising how much improvement can be got from even brand new vinyl. If your needle is still picking up gunk from the grooves then your machine/cleaner is not working right. My needle rarely has anything on it now although it was not always that way.
its on its way back now chaps, yes agree with you both,i always clean second hand vinyl before playing,without any problems,this only happened after i bought some new vinyl,first thing im doing this weekend is cleaning them!
Good service from Nagaoka though. That's worth noting.
yes very good,quick reply's from Nagaoka Japan who put me in touch with their EU importers who are Tonar International based in the Netherlands.
Im glad it turned out to be just very dirty,i feel a bit silly for not knowing and thinking it was broken but in my defence it did look that way in the photos
:doh::D
walpurgis
08-12-2015, 19:17
Strange how things go.
I'm not that fussy about record cleaning, but don't seem to get excess surface noise and have never had a gunged up stylus. In fact, the only time I really clean a stylus is before using a freshly bought second hand cartridge.
Clive197
10-12-2015, 10:33
I've found that dipping the stylus into the little tub of 'dust buster' after each session and then carefully brushing with a small carbon fibre brush once every coupe of weeks keeps my stylus pristine. It also has a Shibata tip on a Boron cantilever.
Ali Tait
10-12-2015, 11:17
W
Ta,
i have to say with the new vinyl the static is a nightmare,even after zapping with the zerostat before play 9 times out of 10 it lifts the matt when changing sides,re the cleaner i was going to play safe and by Nagaoka's brand of stylus cleaning fluid.
Try a Resomat, completely cured my static problems.
hi,yep ive got one but it doesn't fit the lp12 unless you turn it the other way up and also it took ages to get the tonearm height where i like it so theres no way im going through that again! lol. i reckon a good clean should sort them out as i have no problems with vac cleaned used vinyl.
Ali Tait
10-12-2015, 17:08
Here's another possible solution-
http://www.tnt-audio.com/clinica/stat_trap_e.html
cheers,but like i said i dont get any static with my vacuum cleaned vinyl its just the 3 new lp's i play a lot that it happens with. :)
Maybe your stat gun is not working properly, or you may have a nylon carpet which can cause a lot of derived static. I have noticed new 180gm vinyl is bristling with static out of the bag. you can hear it crackle and feel it on the hairs on you hand
yep thats the case with me too,the nag has arrived back but i was at work,delivery tomorrow.
All's well that ends well! ive got my tip back !:D
http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/jj548/jamiecreig123/Fri%20Dec%2011%2018-55-51_zps1x1r7pac.jpg
All's well that ends well! ive got my tip back !:D
http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/jj548/jamiecreig123/Fri%20Dec%2011%2018-55-51_zps1x1r7pac.jpg
Still doesn't look right, send it to me and I'll check it for you [emoji6]
just a little update,i have cleaned all my new vinyl today and after the first play i have no static build up like before.
who would have thought that new vinyl would cause so much gunk build up on a stylus tip eh,lesson learnt me thinks!
Ali Tait
13-12-2015, 14:53
Good you got sorted. Yes it's surprising how much crap there is in new records at times.
topoxforddoc
13-12-2015, 21:53
It's not just the stylus tip, where you get crap build up. The crud can also be attracted to the coils and magnets on your generator assembly, which makes the whole assembly stiff. leading to mistracking etc.
Nice service from Nagaoka it has to be said- all too rare nowadays.:)
yes im very impressed with them,quality service!
Im using this
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/12/03/9f4c82263ccfe95a9469c981a029f8bb.jpg
From the makers of your stylus. [emoji12]
Lol - was that before or after I got mine? :ner: ;)
Everything Nagaoka make is just brilliant! They are one of the few 'proper' (in the traditional sense) hi-fi companies around today, selling not only superb cartridges, but genuinely useful turntable accessories that work :)
Marco.
yes im very impressed with them,quality service!
All's well that ends well, Jamie! Yup, a harsh lesson to learn about just how important cleaning even new vinyl can be... Nope, it's not in any way 'pristine' as some folk (mistakenly) think! ;)
Marco.
Great news that your stylus isn't damaged! It's also refreshing to hear of a company that offers great customer service! There really is no better ending to a story like this.
Most of my vinyl comes from used sources and it ALL (even the brand new stuff) gets a trip through my SpinClean record cleaner before it hits the turn table.
15868
Above is what the bottom of my cleaner looks like after cleaning 10-15 second-hand albums.
15867
This image shows the vinyl debris that was removed from virgin vinyl. There were about a dozen little "strips" of scrap vinyl like this down in the grooves (not obviously just laying across the surface of the album) from two still sealed albums.
After seeing these results, NOTHING goes on the turntable without being washed first. It also does a great job at removing static from vinyl. After a cleaning and a new sleeve, I've NEVER had a problem with static again when using either a cork mat or an oyaide mat. The Technics heavy rubber mat seems to be a very effective static generator when used by itself.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2026 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.