ATC SCM11 vs LS3/5A

[ludovico]

Hi everybody.

I am the owner of a pair of ATC SCM11 speakers (old version). I am thinking about bying a pair of LS3/5a, but I wonder if these would be a huge step forward the ATCs or not?

[Reffc]

Chalk and cheese. You need to audition a pair, but they're so far removed from SCM11's that it'll be quite a departure. Not quite as forward, but able to be driven with more modest amplification and have a lucid and wonderful mid range. Not a lot in it for the bass, both have adequate weight for their size, both are somewhat compromised in extension but for my tastes, the LS might be the more naturally voiced of the two.

[walpurgis]

I thought much the same Paul. Not done a direct comparison but I reckon the SCM11 will have a bit more weight, but the LS3/5a will surely offer better imaging and mid transparency. Both good speakers. Neither on my shopping list though.

[YNWaN]

I would agree with the majority of what Paul has written above. However, I would be tempted to add that a listener who really appreciated the strengths of one would be unlikely to similarly appreciate the other.

[Audio Advent]

but the LS3/5a will surely offer better imaging and mid transparency.

Why do you think that would be so? I'd assume the opposite.

[walpurgis]

Why do you think that would be so? I'd assume the opposite.

Having heard the smaller ATCs and LS3/5a speakers a good few times. That's my impression.

[Audio Advent]

Having heard the smaller ATCs and LS3/5a speakers a good few times. That's my impression.

That's a very good reason for supposing it then :) That post made it sound like a guess..

I've not heard ATC smaller speakers but do find the treble of the large 100s and 150s to be more detailed and faster than the LS3/5as and it's the same tweeter. My experience is that speed and detail makes for an expansive soundstage, same going for the midrange too.

But you only find out if it's true in each case from listening.

[walpurgis]

That's a very good reason for supposing it then :) That post made it sound like a guess..

I've not heard ATC smaller speakers but do find the treble of the large 100s and 150s to be more detailed and faster than the LS3/5as and it's the same tweeter. My experience is that speed and detail makes for an expansive soundstage, same going for the midrange too.

But you only find out if it's true in each case from listening.

I take it you are saying both ATCs use the same tweeter. The LS3/5a tweeter is totally different.

I've heard the SCM 100A more times than I can remember. A friend had a pair on the end of a Mark Levinson system. I'd say the top end was as revealing as the LS3/5a, possibly slightly smoother at the audible top extreme. The modified T27 still has the slightest characteristic dry 'sizzle' about it that the ATC unit does not.

[Reffc]

That's a very good reason for supposing it then :) That post made it sound like a guess..

I've not heard ATC smaller speakers but do find the treble of the large 100s and 150s to be more detailed and faster than the LS3/5as and it's the same tweeter. My experience is that speed and detail makes for an expansive soundstage, same going for the midrange too.

But you only find out if it's true in each case from listening.

What does "speed" of a tweeter mean, especially if we're comparing two of the same tweeters? I can understand one being voiced brighter (ie so called "smiley-face" tuning where bass and treble are tilted up at modest frequencies, not the slight tilt down in acoustic response which many good speakers are engineered for).

The problem with speakers that offer immediacy and brightness which are sometimes perceived as better imaging is that on extended listening and on higher volumes, fatigue soon sets in. Some companies deliberately do this (ie create an inaccurate response) for lower volumes to try and win over the listener at first audition, and hence buy brand X over brand Y.

Extended listening usually determines more accurately a loudspeaker's strengths and weaknesses, but for me, I turn off the instant I hear something which is too boom and tizz.

[ludovico]

That's a very good reason for supposing it then :) That post made it sound like a guess..

I've not heard ATC smaller speakers but do find the treble of the large 100s and 150s to be more detailed and faster than the LS3/5as and it's the same tweeter. My experience is that speed and detail makes for an expansive soundstage, same going for the midrange too.

But you only find out if it's true in each case from listening.

The tweeter on the old SCM7, 11, 19 and 40 is different from those on the bigger 50s, 100s and 150s.

[DSJR]

At this moment in time, I wouldn't have either! ATC's are silly inefficient, sound bland all too often if underpowered and seem to suffer an over projected upper mid these days. The 3/5A is an outdated squeak-box and vintage ones will ALL be out of spec now. Harbeth P3ESR's eat them alive!

Loads of small alternatives, but I was quite impressed with the Sonus faber Venere babies. Not perfect but good looking and fun to listen through to the music and musicians making it - far more 'transparent' in a musical-emotional sense to me. The Rega RX3 is another at similar price that gets the emotions going and the new more solid cabs inspire confidence.

[jandl100]

I've owned LS3/5a and ATC SCM10.

I really liked the LS for its natural tonality, relaxed musicality and good imaging. It really came into its own with a small subwoofer - quite stunning, imo, the sub made all the difference in the world to the presentation. Marvellous dynamics and a real sense of scale were added, quite an unexpected result, but marvellous synergy!

I hated the ATC. Horrid things that did hifi but not music. All false etch and bland colourless mids and 2D soundstage. Yuk.

[Reffc]

At this moment in time, I wouldn't have either! ATC's are silly inefficient, sound bland all too often if underpowered and seem to suffer an over projected upper mid these days. The 3/5A is an outdated squeak-box and vintage ones will ALL be out of spec now. Harbeth P3ESR's eat them alive!

Loads of small alternatives, but I was quite impressed with the Sonus faber Venere babies. Not perfect but good looking and fun to listen through to the music and musicians making it - far more 'transparent' in a musical-emotional sense to me. The Rega RX3 is another at similar price that gets the emotions going and the new more solid cabs inspire confidence.


I'm assuming that you've not heard the new Falcon Acoustics LS3/5A or you wouldn't have made such a remark David. Yes, there are plenty of average sounding small boxes these days but few that really impress. The only commercial offerings that have genuinely impressed me include the new LS3/5A, Harbeth's C7 ES3, Gamut's RS2s and I'm pretty sweet on the Raptors too!

[Gordon Steadman]

I've owned LS3/5a and ATC SCM10.

I really liked the LS for its natural tonality, relaxed musicality and good imaging. It really came into its own with a small subwoofer - quite stunning, imo, the sub made all the difference in the world to the presentation. Marvellous dynamics and a real sense of scale were added, quite an unexpected result, but marvellous synergy!

I hated the ATC. Horrid things that did hifi but not music. All false etch and bland colourless mids and 2D soundstage. Yuk.

Therein lies a constant argument. Nearly every modern speaker I have heard does impressive but I know that if I was foolish enough to take them home, I would find them deeply unsatisfying. As in all generalisations there will be exceptions but I have found it to be true regarding those I have heard.

My usual listen these days is the KEF101s with the LS35A grilles and felt. Very near field and they are great musical speakers, slightly better bass than the real thing. The big system gets switched on when I want to annoy the neighbours (ears no workee)

[ludovico]

Damn, so maybe I made a mistake to choose the SCM11, but I must say I've always been satisfied with the dynamics and soundstage they provide so far.

[Gordon Steadman]

Damn, so maybe I made a mistake to choose the SCM11, but I must say I've always been satisfied with the dynamics and soundstage they provide so far.

If you like them, I can't see that there is a problem. Your ears in your system etc....

However, I do wonder why you were considering the LS35A instead!! Or is it as well? It seems to be the common opinion that they are chalk and cheese so are the two a reasonable pair to choose between?

[jandl100]

ATC for rock/electronica where natural tonality is less important, and "exciting" dynamism and power handling is impressive.
LS3/5a for acoustic jazz / vocals / classical etc where naturalness is a big virtue.

Or something like that. :)