Bought some Hypex nCORE modules!

[Audio Advent]

With my Meridian 605s needing a bias voltage tweek and so out of the system for too long and me being a restless soul sometimes, I've dipped my toes into Class D land with some Hypex nCore 400s! My aim is to move over to more DIY [sic - apparently these modules still count as DIY] stuff like this eventually, keeping classic gear for the sake of beautiful classic gear.

I managed to find a guy selling some unused, unopened units for a good price so bought 2 x ncore 400 modules and 2 x SMPS600 modules, was about £680 all in including shipping from Sweden and a £25 IBAN transfer fee (though was supposed to be a free SEPA transfer :( ) . That's less than half price with VAT from the new price. Wish I could have afforded 4 of each..

So, has anyone else made some ncore monoblocks/stereo amp? What are people's experience with certain cable dressing/twisting, speaker cable/input cable choices, binding posts, XLR socket choices?

(P.S. I realise I'll soon get some "this thread is worthless without pics" replies... am a bit busy this week but might get around to taking some).

[occamsrazor]

Hi,

Yes I built a pair of Ncore monoblocks, having come from a non-DIY background. It's relatively simple so long as you follow Hypex guidelines regarding earthing and wiring etc.

Unless you have a case already or have plans to make one, I'd highly recommend the Ghent cases from China. They make the job very easy, are well-designed, and good quality. Ghent is very nice to deal with and sells both monoblock and stereo cases that come with all the needed parts, as well as corresponding cable sets (although those weren't available when I did mine).

http://www.ghentaudio.com/kit/index.html

When I started out I created a thread on the PFM forum, and some more experienced people helped me along the way with some great advice. If you can wade through the 400ish posts, there's lots of good info in there (especially from user "Julf"). I'm really happy with my Ncore monoblocks....

http://www.pinkfishmedia.net/forum/showthread.php?t=164826

Cheers....

[Audio Advent]

Thanks for the post.

I was looking at the Ghent cases but because I see the price in dollars I subconciously think how expensive they are.. I guess in some senses they are a fair bit more than the average £50 small case. But they do look that little bit better.

Of course really want someone to CNC some solid alli for me but that's a financial step too far.


I've got a little way into the thread, tips about the speaker cable. Are there any later tips about input cabling? I'm wondering if shielded cables inside the case effect the sound at all ( I was looking at some specialised, heatshrink tubing which has a good RF shield within it - might be expensive though).

[occamsrazor]

Re: the Ghent cases.... I'm sure one can make a setup for less, but for me they were worth the money as came with all the parts needed including terminals and sockets and generally look professional, as well as having all the holes pre-drilled in all the right places to mount the modules.

Re: the input cabling. I do remember some people trying alternative input cabling and reporting good results, can't find the post now, but I just used the cables that came with the amp modules.

Cheers

[thommy]

I also built a pair of nCores and am very happy with them even though they cost £1125 delivered from Hypex 2 years ago when the Euro was so much stronger.

I used 8x 12cm pieces of 0.5mm pure silver wire twisted together to connect the amp to the binding posts.

The box was made on my CNC machine. ProtoCNC are offering solid aluminium nCore cases but at the price you paid for your amps it's not worth the asking price.

I chose CMC silver binding posts and Neutrik silver XLR connectors (the gold ones didn't sound as good). The supplied balanced signal cable is very high quality and sounds pretty good. Mine are only about 6cm long. The hassle of recrimping those tiny pins onto new cable wasn't worth it.

Definitely twist everything as tightly as possible. The amps have such a low noise floor that its worth being meticulous to get the best out of them.

Would be nice to see some pics :)

[Ali Tait]

How do they compare to other amps you have used?

[thommy]

Music is always, to my ears, going to sound better when played through valves because of the added second order harmonics.

However the Hypex are the best transistor based amps I have ever heard and I have yet to find those amps to be the weak link in my hifi chain.

[Ali Tait]

Been interested in these modules for a while, yet to hear them though.

[Audio Advent]

Mine are still in their boxes.... shame on me!
Been too busy.

However, I did buy some cases so am on my way! I went for these : http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/14170315121

http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NjUzWDcwMQ==/z/ivYAAOSwyQtVjP5T/$_12.JPG

They have "Cello" screen printed on the front (as in the old high end Cello brand from 80s/90s) but the screen print is the only bad quality bit - is coming off. I'll get rid of it all at some point.

Other than that, they are really good quality and I was surprised at the weight of the box when they arrived. Nice anodizing, nice finish and nice big thick facia. Did work out at about £120 though after shipping and adding some feet. And I'll have to tap and cut my own holes.... so bought a tapping kit. Oh, and some kind of air venting..

Next is to choose connectors.

I think I am going to go for Mundorf Copper binding posts - I like their shape, feel good quality and the design allows more torque by hand than a round shape. And they are neither too blingy or overly fussy looking like modern WBTs.

http://www.dynabel.no/file/thumb/file/7/700315&width=400&height=301&resize_mode=fill.jpg

XLR sockets I am going to choose black switchcraft ones because they mount easily from the rear (just got to check on the thickness of the case backplate). Choose between silver or gold plating.

http://www.actionhardware.co.uk/parts-online/image/cache/data/XL-8347W-228x228.jpg

IECs I really wanted something with screw-terminals so will have a look around - saves crimping spades on. I guess there is no advantage with IEC filters or even a integrated fuse holder? There's one on the SMPS600 isn't there (can't remember).

[Audio Advent]

Where can I find sheets of self-adhesive insulating material to place above and below the power supply? (I've not looked yet though).

[Audio Advent]

I also built a pair of nCores and am very happy with them even though they cost £1125 delivered from Hypex 2 years ago when the Euro was so much stronger.

I used 8x 12cm pieces of 0.5mm pure silver wire twisted together to connect the amp to the binding posts.

The box was made on my CNC machine. ProtoCNC are offering solid aluminium nCore cases but at the price you paid for your amps it's not worth the asking price.

I chose CMC silver binding posts and Neutrik silver XLR connectors (the gold ones didn't sound as good). The supplied balanced signal cable is very high quality and sounds pretty good. Mine are only about 6cm long. The hassle of recrimping those tiny pins onto new cable wasn't worth it.

Definitely twist everything as tightly as possible. The amps have such a low noise floor that its worth being meticulous to get the best out of them.

Would be nice to see some pics :)

Shame about the balanced cable supplied - forgot it came with one and has the plug on the end. I was hoping to go all foo as I have a very short length (15cm) of fancy Siltech cable which came with something which I can't envisage using for anything else. Speaker cable, I'll probably use some thick braded copper cable I think is from Russ Andrews' DIY catalogue from the 90s, again came with something.

[occamsrazor]

Indeed, shame on you :-)
If I remember correctly, in amongst one of the 10000 nCore posts on the diyaudio forum, Bruno Putzeys specifically recommended against using IECs with filters...

[Audio Advent]

OK, got some parts on order! The Mundorf Copper posts, Switchcraft XLRs and some fancy looking Schurter IEC sockets with switch (no fuse).

When it all arrives and I start to mark out the case, I'll take some photos which this thread is lacking..

Now, do I need a standby switch for the SMPS600 and is it a momentary switch needed (so the SMPS toggles in and out of standby) or is it a normal make/break switch? I forgot about the standby.. Might put the standby switch somewhere unconventional to both keep it accessible and to keep the front facia unfussy and clean.

[User211]

I have heard NC400 and NC1200. NC400 was better to my ears as it used a linear, not SMPS, power supply and some JFETs somewhere along the line.

So as a future upgrade I'd defo scour the DIY forums forums for more info. No small difference. The NC400 implementation really was leagues better IMHO.

[Audio Advent]

I have heard NC400 and NC1200. NC400 was better to my ears as it used a linear, not SMPS, power supply and some JFETs somewhere along the line.

So as a future upgrade I'd defo scour the DIY forums forums for more info. No small difference. The NC400 implementation really was leagues better IMHO.

Very interesting - was the NC1200 one of the commercial, expensive offerings?

I've read a little about the differences sonically between linear and the Hypex SMPSs and many say they don't hear a difference but that must depend on how they've made their linear supplies.

[Audio Advent]

On another note, do people know which of the leads are most susceptible to EMI interference?

I was thinking of using some EMI shielding tape wrapped around the most susceptible connections and then sealing it in place with heatshrink tubing. I've some tape from inside of old external harddrive enclosures, usually covering some of the leads, or from computer case EMI shield seals. Would it need to be grounded to work?

[User211]

Very interesting - was the NC1200 one of the commercial, expensive offerings?

I've read a little about the differences sonically between linear and the Hypex SMPSs and many say they don't hear a difference but that must depend on how they've made their linear supplies.
Yes. I had heard Hypex won't let you sell a commercial NC1200/SMPS1200 for less than 9K dollars.

The guy that did the NC400 was adamant the SMPS NC1200 would not be as good. I have to agree. The NC1200 had a theoretical advantage of an extremely expensive valve based preamp, but both setups were heard in my system, albeit with a gap of a couple of years probably.

Another possibility is that the NC1200 just doesn't sound as good as the NC400 irrespective of power supply. I can't say for sure.

I am going with what the NC400 chap said he found when creating said amp i.e. that he found the linear solution much better.

Much will depend on the resolution of your system, especially the speakers you use.

[thommy]

I am going with what the NC400 chap said he found when creating said amp i.e. that he found the linear solution much better.


Have I misunderstood this, or are you saying that Bruno Putzey does not like the SMPS he developed specifically for the nCore, and prefers the sound of the previous Hypex linear supplies?

[User211]

Have I misunderstood this, or are you saying that Bruno Putzey does not like the SMPS he developed specifically for the nCore, and prefers the sound of the previous Hypex linear supplies?
Yes - I wasn't talking about Bruno.

In the right system with the right ears and preferences/bias some may well prefer SMPS.

[Audio Advent]

Have I misunderstood this, or are you saying that Bruno Putzey does not like the SMPS he developed specifically for the nCore, and prefers the sound of the previous Hypex linear supplies?

The "NC400 guy" Justin mentioned was the just the guy who had built the NC400 amps he had heard, not Putzey himself! I guess Putzey will be busy doing Children in Need again soon, around this time of year isn't it?

[thommy]

Ah the word 'creating' got me confused.

I don't know about nCores with a linear supply but I've heard UcD400s with both (SMPS400A400 & trafo/hypex HG supply) and the SMPS was a clear winner. Dynamics and frequency response were obviously better.

[Audio Advent]

Yes. I had heard Hypex won't let you sell a commercial NC1200/SMPS1200 for less than 9K dollars.




Such a shame - You can pick up secondhand ones for nearer $5k but the real deals (but still expensive in my view) is if you can find someone who DIY'd some NC1200s with evaluation units. They appear to go for nearer £2000 or so but you have to be super quick before someone else steps in.

[Audio Advent]

Ah the word 'creating' got me confused.

I don't know about nCores with a linear supply but I've heard UcD400s with both (SMPS400A400 & trafo/hypex HG supply) and the SMPS was a clear winner. Dynamics and frequency response were obviously better.

Interesting. I also have some UCD400OEM modules I bought cheap for a 6 channel amp for active speakers - project on the back-burner - and was toying with the idea of linear supplies.. but then flipping to just a massive 3000W SMPS from hypex too to save all that effort and money.

[thommy]

Interesting! I have 6x 180OEM for the same purpose. Couldn't say no at £32 each but done nothing with them in 2 years. I was going to use 2x 600w SMPS, dual mono style but shelved it after finding limited options for the DAC array required.

An 8ch ESS9018 (read TP Buffalo III) coupled with a MiniDSP 4x10 seemed to be the only option and that's not really what I want (the Buffallo).

On another note I have just reconnected my nCores after a forced break (warranty claim), to a newly modified DDDAC and remembered why I spent all that money on the amps & SMPS :D