View Full Version : Some advice needed please
Hi all, I have just joined (see my thread in the welcome section).
I have just acquired a set of (free) Kef C60's, see my hello thread for the story, and am now wanting to use them for listening to music, I have just bought some stands for them off Ebay and am looking at some 2nd hand amp's to use with it.
I have a rather eclectic taste of music, ranging from 80's rock, new wave, ballads etc through to dance music (house, techno etc) but I will probably be limiting my use of this system for the more older, laid back, well produced 80's and 90's stuff while reading.
I don't want to spend a lot on an amp, 50 quid or so (looking at what older amp's are going for on Ebay).
I have some that I am watching at the moment, a few NAD's, esp c320bee's, a couple of Marantz KI signature models etc.
I will be feeding the amp with either an MPS player via phone lead or maybe an old laptop with a DAC (if I can find one cheap enough!)
So what do people recommend, I like my music to be bright and defined with nice clear bass and top end, smooth mid.
When I listen to music in my living room, I have an Onkyo tx-nr636 and Dali Zensor 1 5.1 system, I tend to listen to it in stereo mode (which keeps the sub switched in) or sometimes in pure mode (if the source is very high quality and well produced) which just gives me the left and right front speakers. I like the way this sounds but the Dali's are only small (ish) so lack the bottom end and room filling sound that the Kef C60's have.
Wakefield Turntables
15-07-2015, 10:51
Your severely limited for £50 as to what you can get. I'd plump for the NAD 3020.
walpurgis
15-07-2015, 10:55
For the money you want to spend there are plenty of amps about. Me personally, I'd go for one of these: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-PMA-350SE-Amplifier-No-Remote-Control-/321802710290?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item4aecefad12
Brilliant amp for a cheap integrated. Powerful, clean sound and very musical.
Failing that, its baby brother the Denon PMS-250SE.
yes the 350 is a great amp for very little. should suit the kefs well.
I have looked at the 3020's but aren't they a bit weak power wise, the C60's are rated at 200watts each at 4ohms so I wanted something with a bit of kick to it. The c320bee's are 160w per channel at 4ohms, the 3020 is about 40w at 4ohms, or is this not something I should worry about? My Onkyo AV amp is 125w per channel and have had that wound up pretty high a few times!
£50 isn't my limit, I can go more expensive but looking at what a lot of auctions are ending at, a lot of stuff is going for around that mark, am more interested in what people would think would be a good match for the C60's and the type of music I listen to, I don't want an amp that is too laid back but then again I don't want something that is too clinical with no warmth, if that makes sense??
the c60 is quite a sensitive design so shouldnt need silly power to sing well. a good 50/60 watts should be more than enough unless you want to damage your hearing Andrew
For the money you want to spend there are plenty of amps about. Me personally, I'd go for one of these: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-PMA-350SE-Amplifier-No-Remote-Control-/321802710290?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item4aecefad12
Brilliant amp for a cheap integrated. Powerful, clean sound and very musical.
Failing that, its baby brother the Denon PMS-250SE.
Oh I hadn't actually considered looking at Denon's which is daft of me as I currently have them hooked up to my old Denon AVR-1804 and it really does seem to move them along, unfortunately it has other duties in the house and is a bit big for were the speakers are going to be used, I have popped that Denon on to my watch list, thanks!!
the c60 is quite a sensitive design so shouldnt need silly power to sing well. a good 50/60 watts should be more than enough unless you want to damage your hearing Andrew
I do tend to listen to things at pretty high volumes, I have very easy going neighbours thankfully, I have noticed I barely need the current amp they are hooked up to turned up much to get a good sound out of them!
the c60 is quite a sensitive design so shouldn't need silly power to sing well. a good 50/60 watts should be more than enough unless you want to damage your hearing Andrew
+1
How about a Marantz PM6010OSE KI Signature, I have read some good reviews of them, would this be a good match?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Teac-A-R300-Stereo-Integrated-Amplifier-3022856-/261961158316?_trksid=p2054897.l4275
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-PMA-450-Stereo-Integrated-Amplifier-/111714651468?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1a02b64d4c
There's a possibility of pinching this!
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PIONEER-A-204R-INTEGRATED-AMPLIFIER-/201386248969?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item2ee38e4b09
Not as reliable as the three makes above.
Teac owners tend to stay Teac owners for life.
Denon and Pioneer are work horses.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Teac-A-R300-Stereo-Integrated-Amplifier-3022856-/261961158316?_trksid=p2054897.l4275
I've no experience of Teac stuff, is it up to snuff sound wise?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-PMA-450-Stereo-Integrated-Amplifier-/111714651468?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1a02b64d4c
There's a possibility of pinching this!
Added to my watch list, thanks! :)
Not as reliable as the three makes above.
Teac owners tend to stay Teac owners for life.
Denon and Pioneer are work horses.
What sort of sound does a Teac amp give you, are they tight and controlled or more open and atmospheric?
Gordon Steadman
15-07-2015, 15:02
What sort of sound does a Teac amp give you, are they tight and controlled or more open and atmospheric?
I would disagree with this so you can see how difficult it is to offer sensible advice. The ranges of any manufacturer includes equipment at every level. We have both Sony and Pioneer amplifiers (TA-F300 and A757) and they are both brilliant, very far from mere workhorses. I have just sold a Teac (A-R600) as I found it uninvolving and sterile. Well enough built but musically second rate.
Stick with the Denon advised and you probably can't go wrong.
walpurgis
15-07-2015, 15:04
I've no experience of Teac stuff, is it up to snuff sound wise?
Teac has always been well made gear. It doesn't find so much favour in Hi-Fi circles as it used to. I can't comment on the sound of recent products.
I would disagree with this so you can see how difficult it is to offer sensible advice. The ranges of any manufacturer includes equipment at every level. We have both Sony and Pioneer amplifiers (TA-F300 and A757) and they are both brilliant, very far from mere workhorses. I have just sold a Teac (A-R600) as I found it uninvolving and sterile. Well enough built but musically second rate.
Stick with the Denon advised and you probably can't go wrong.
I am leaning towards Denon now, I am currently running the speakers on an old Denon AV amp and they sound wonderful (will be even better when the stands turn up and I get some decent speaker cables I'm sure) plus that old AV amp is a good 15 years old and worked faultless, been used every day up until just before xmas last year when it was replaced so I'm confident in their build quality
Would a Denon PMA-355UK be better or worse than the Denon PMA-350SE posted earlier?
Gordon Steadman
15-07-2015, 15:15
I am leaning towards Denon now, I am currently running the speakers on an old Denon AV amp and they sound wonderful (will be even better when the stands turn up and I get some decent speaker cables I'm sure) plus that old AV amp is a good 15 years old and worked faultless, been used every day up until just before xmas last year when it was replaced so I'm confident in their build quality
Would a Denon PMA-355UK be better or worse than the Denon PMA-350SE posted earlier?
I can't answer that as I have no direct experience of either. I know the 350 was well reviewed but I know nothing about the other one. If you want some decent speaker cable at a great price, try this lot. I have 10 metres of it to each Quad ESL and it sounds very good.Its quite thick but the Denon takes 4mm plugs so it will be no problem. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/270370467142?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
walpurgis
15-07-2015, 15:19
The PMS-355UK is I believe the model that superseded the PMA-350SE, whether it's as good, I don't know. Some later Denon stuff hasn't always lived up to former standards. The 350SE is a cracker and I've bought one or two myself to play about with in the past. It far outperforms its comparative position in the used Hi-Fi market and is good enough for use in a pretty serious system. Each time I've used one I've always been amazed at how capable they are. The sound is powerful, transparent and lucid, with no 'nasties'.
The PMS-355UK is I believe the model that superseded the PMA-350SE, whether it's as good, I don't know. Some later Denon stuff hasn't always lived up to former standards. The 350SE is a cracker and I've bought one or two myself to play about with in the past. It far outperforms its comparative position in the used Hi-Fi market and is good enough for use in a pretty serious system. Each time I've used one I've always been amazed at how capable they are. The sound is powerful, transparent and lucid, with no 'nasties'.
My main gripe with the 350 is the lack of tone controls, I like to have something to fiddle with!
Gordon Steadman
15-07-2015, 15:42
My main gripe with the 350 is the lack of tone controls, I like to have something to fiddle with!
I would suggest you fiddle with something else. Maybe whilst listening to the Denon:lol:
you could always put a graphi. equaliser in line. lots of fiddling available
I would suggest you fiddle with something else. Maybe whilst listening to the Denon:lol:
Indeed! lol
walpurgis
15-07-2015, 16:21
You shouldn't need tone controls with the Denon if the rest of your equipment is up to scratch.
I don't personally like tone controls, they're just another item interfering with and in the way of the signal. I sure as hell don't want or need them in my setup.
you could always put a graphi. equaliser in line. lots of fiddling available
Are they still a thing? Can't remember the last time I saw one, do they not just introduce interference and and jitter?
Gordon Steadman
15-07-2015, 16:28
Are they still a thing? Can't remember the last time I saw one, do they not just introduce interference and and jitter?
If they are well designed, probably no more than the tone controls on an amp. I haven't used tone controls since I had a yamaha receiver. That makes it 1980 something.
When I listen to music I do sometimes fiddle with a wine glass. That usually improves the sound.
Well it's ended now, went for 40 quid, bit miffed with myself for missing it! :(
Gordon Steadman
15-07-2015, 19:10
Well it's ended now, went for 40 quid, bit miffed with myself for missing it! :(
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-PMA-450-Stereo-Integrated-Amplifier-/111714651468?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1a02b64d4c
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-DRA-455-AM-FM-stereo-receiver-amplifier-/271927112454?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item3f501e7306
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-PMA-350II-PMA-350-MK2-Stereo-Integrated-Amplifier-/271927757448?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item3f50284a88
or get something like this and have Alan (Firebottle) make it work!! http://www.ebay.fr/itm/Denon-PMA-200-Vintage-Stereo-Amplifier-/391198128616?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_77&hash=item5b1539b9e8
I have a Teac 300 if you're interested - £40 + postage
It's this model:
http://s160.photobucket.com/user/SethKL/media/Teac%20A-H300/IMG_5667.jpg.html
Bought it while I fettled my Quad 33/303 combo...
PM me if you want details ;)
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-PMA-450-Stereo-Integrated-Amplifier-/111714651468?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1a02b64d4c
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-DRA-455-AM-FM-stereo-receiver-amplifier-/271927112454?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item3f501e7306
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-PMA-350II-PMA-350-MK2-Stereo-Integrated-Amplifier-/271927757448?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item3f50284a88
or get something like this and have Alan (Firebottle) make it work!! http://www.ebay.fr/itm/Denon-PMA-200-Vintage-Stereo-Amplifier-/391198128616?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_77&hash=item5b1539b9e8
Cheers for that, have added the top and bottom ones to my watch list, don't know why but I don't fancy a combined tuner and amp, only listen to the radio in the car anyway!
How about I go proper old school.......... http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pioneer-Sa-506-Amplifier-/141717577516?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item20ff069f2c
:)
walpurgis
15-07-2015, 19:25
If you want a PMA-350SE, three or four crop up on eBay each week.
walpurgis
15-07-2015, 19:26
How about I go proper old school.......... http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pioneer-Sa-506-Amplifier-/141717577516?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item20ff069f2c
:)
Limited power output.
walpurgis
15-07-2015, 19:26
How about I go proper old school.......... http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pioneer-Sa-506-Amplifier-/141717577516?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item20ff069f2c
:)
Limited power output.
Limited power output.
Damn!
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231621739395?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT ??
Gordon Steadman
15-07-2015, 19:36
Limited power output.
25 watts a channel but look at those lovely guages. And it has knobs to fiddle with:cool:
walpurgis
15-07-2015, 19:44
You could certainly do worse than these from Pete here on AOS:
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?39528-FS-Rotel-RC960BX-amp-RB960BX-Pre-amp-Power-combination
Nice versatile bits of kit. Well made and decent sound. 60 good solid watts per channel.
25 watts a channel but look at those lovely guages. And it has knobs to fiddle with:cool:
My thoughts exactly, but I think I do need a bit more power
You could certainly do worse than these from Pete here on AOS:
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?39528-FS-Rotel-RC960BX-amp-RB960BX-Pre-amp-Power-combination
Nice versatile bits of kit. Well made and decent sound. 60 good solid watts per channel.
Hmmm that is tempting, I shall keep that in mind, thanks.
I have a Teac 300 if you're interested - £40 + postage
It's this model:
http://s160.photobucket.com/user/SethKL/media/Teac%20A-H300/IMG_5667.jpg.html
Bought it while I fettled my Quad 33/303 combo...
PM me if you want details ;)
If I was you Griff I would buy this without hesitation!
Milky; as a Sounder, will have looked after it, it's good looking and has plenty of oomf.
Teac does not actually 'have a sound', think of it as a wire with gain.
Ok we now have a problem, the OH says I'm not to buy another amp and to just use the Denon AVR they are currently hooked up to and move it between using it for the Kef's and the other room were it's used, this isn't going to happen but I now need to be more sneaky, I either need to find something within spitting distance of Manchester so I can collect it in person or find a seller who will post it to the Post Office next to where I work, am thinking once I've got it, it will take a while before they notice and will lesson the moaning when they do! Grrrrr
Gordon Steadman
16-07-2015, 09:29
If I was you Griff I would buy this without hesitation!
Milky; as a Sounder, will have looked after it, it's good looking and has plenty of oomf.
Teac does not actually 'have a sound', think of it as a wire with gain.
Nah....that's a Quad:eyebrows:
The Teac I sold had a sound - thin and weedy. But then I only heard the one model in the range. Again...you can't generalise about a particular make, only the model.
Gordon Steadman
16-07-2015, 09:31
Ok we now have a problem, the OH says I'm not to buy another amp and to just use the Denon AVR they are currently hooked up to and move it between using it for the Kef's and the other room were it's used, this isn't going to happen but I now need to be more sneaky, I either need to find something within spitting distance of Manchester so I can collect it in person or find a seller who will post it to the Post Office next to where I work, am thinking once I've got it, it will take a while before they notice and will lesson the moaning when they do! Grrrrr
Tut tut:lol:
Tell me lies
Tell me sweet little lies :eyebrows:
...it ll be like that handbag youve never seen b4 or that pair of shoes etc
Tell me lies
Tell me sweet little lies :eyebrows:
...it ll be like that handbag youve never seen b4 or that pair of shoes etc
Kind of but the wrong gender I'm afraid! He went mad on the Amazon Prime day yesterday, we have coming a new Asus AC3200 router, garden secateurs and an extending tree trimmer, yet a new\used amp is a no no for me!
In other yet related news, my brother has just told me he has a Marantz KI Signature amp and CD player (unsure of the models but he paid a couple of grand for them and the speakers in the early 90's apparently) in his garage that he isn't currently using that I could borrow, the CD player isn't working, he doesn't know why, I do sort of remember him having it in one of his old houses a few years ago, he had it hooked up to some floor standing Mission's, I have arranged a temp (read perm) loan in exchange for the same to him of my Traxxas radio controlled nitro powered truck (which I haven't used for years and needs servicing!), no idea what model the Marantz stuff is apart from being KI stuff, I do remember the amp was on the large size though. So thanks for all your help and suggestions but I now am leaving the amp search alone, get ready for a "how do I fix this Marantz CD player" thread once I have managed to go get them (they live in North Wales and I'm working all weekend damnit!!)
Gordon Steadman
16-07-2015, 11:17
Kind of but the wrong gender I'm afraid! He went mad on the Amazon Prime day yesterday, we have coming a new Asus AC3200 router, garden secateurs and an extending tree trimmer, yet a new\used amp is a no no for me!
In other yet related news, my brother has just told me he has a Marantz KI Signature amp and CD player (unsure of the models but he paid a couple of grand for them and the speakers in the early 90's apparently) in his garage that he isn't currently using that I could borrow, the CD player isn't working, he doesn't know why, I do sort of remember him having it in one of his old houses a few years ago, he had it hooked up to some floor standing Mission's, I have arranged a temp (read perm) loan in exchange for the same to him of my Traxxas radio controlled nitro powered truck (which I haven't used for years and needs servicing!), no idea what model the Marantz stuff is apart from being KI stuff, I do remember the amp was on the large size though. So thanks for all your help and suggestions but I now am leaving the amp search alone, get ready for a "how do I fix this Marantz CD player" thread once I have managed to go get them (they live in North Wales and I'm working all weekend damnit!!)
:) Easy assumption to make I guess!! The Marantz sounds good - hopefully. The KI bit seems to indicate that it will be at least OK. Orf to Wales asap then.
:) Easy assumption to make I guess!! The Marantz sounds good - hopefully. The KI bit seems to indicate that it will be at least OK. Orf to Wales asap then.
Is no problem, always seems an awkward thing to correct!
Yeah I need to get down there asap, he did say he might want them back in the future (well the amp anyway) for the kids games room above the garage in the new house, is 12 months before that will be built and ready, I'll prob do a deal with him for me to buy a cheap amp for them and me keep the Marantz stuff, it would be a bit wasted on them! He really never listens to music so I have no idea why he bought them in the first place, would be interesting to find out what's wrong with the CD player!
The Teac I sold had a sound - thin and weedy. But then I only heard the one model in the range. Again...you can't generalise about a particular make, only the model.
Indeed you can't - - and there is no way the A-H300 could be remotely described as "thin and weedy" regardless of what a completely different model from the same manufacturer may have sounded like to you.
Sure it's not a Quad ... but is certainly doesn't bear any shame at all, particularly in its price bracket.
There are few critical reviews still existing online but here's a fair assessment from a user I would agree with - note the comparison to a Quad 34/306 combo:
http://www.audioreview.com/cat/amplification/amplifiers/teac/ah300/prd_130479_1583crx.aspx
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.