Tannoy Lancasters

[hermit]

I may have the opportunity to buy a pair of Tannoy Monitor Golds in Lancaster cabinets locally. A friend of a friend on another forum is selling them. I think I may have the chance to select from either 12 or 15" MGs. I have a price for the cabs with the 12" MGs but not the 15". I doubt I would be able to afford the 15" pair but would be interested as to which size is best suited to the Lancaster cabs in a medium sized room

I'm really rather ignorant of all things Tannoy so I'm wondering if there is anything in particular that I should be looking out for when I go to audition the speakers. Any advice is most welcome. Thanks in advance.

[Wakefield Turntables]

To get the best out of 15MGs you need a well sorted pair of lockwood or larger cabs and externalised cross over which ideally has been redesigned cos the original has been shown not to be of the best design. Your probably looking at £2k for your drivers, £1k for the cross overs and boxes, £2.5k for some new bespoke designed cabs. It can be done considerably cheaper but you won't get the best from them. If money is an issue then 12MGS in Lancaster cabs are ok, but again can be improved markedly with new cabs and cross overs.

CUE THE AVALANCHE......

[hermit]

Thanks for your reply. On that basis, I would really only consider the12" drivers in the Lancaster cabs. No way could I afford to do justice to the bigger MGs.

Is there anything in particular that I should be looking out for with regards to the drivers and crossovers?

[Wakefield Turntables]

Give Paul at RFC components a tinkle, he's the local guru.

[walpurgis]

Thanks for your reply. On that basis, I would really only consider the12" drivers in the Lancaster cabs. No way could I afford to do justice to the bigger MGs.

Is there anything in particular that I should be looking out for with regards to the drivers and crossovers?

Not entirely sure what you meant. The 12" and 15" Lancaster use the same cabinets, with porting variations. So if you can accomodate the 12" you'd be OK with the 15". Both work very well.

If you need something smaller the 12" Chatsworth might fit the bill. There's a beautiful pair on sale here in Private Exhibitions.

I love the look of the seventies Tannoy cabinets, so despite what some may say about them, I'd retain them and help them with some internal bracing and additional damping. They can actually work well.

[Reffc]

If going for 12 inch MGs, the Chatsworths are really the cabinet of choice, as Geoff suggests, but if you can pick up the Lancs at reasonable cost (really worth only the cost of the drivers and crossovers) then they'd be worth buying. I know that we spoke on the 'phone so you are aware of values. AFAIK, Lancs were designed for optimally sealed use with 15 inch MGzs (they are FAR too small in volume for anything like effective port tuning to match the 15 MGs) and optimally vented use for 12 inch MGs.

They were imho, amongst the worst sounding/designed of the range; the later Mansfield cabinet (used sealed) being the better cabinet for 12 inch drivers. The sweetest sounding for the 12 inch MGs for me would be corner Chatsworths. Good shape for stiffness and better acoustically than rectangular cabs for other reasons. Getting rarer, so DIY or commission build remains a good pathway if not always the cheapest. The latter does though allow for properly designed and braced cabinets finished to your personal preferences to be made as a future consideration.

[walpurgis]

As for the original question about room matching. It's rather strange with bigger Tannoys. They can work well in small rooms even though you'd expect them to overwhelm. I have a room just 10ft by 11ft and use largish Tannoy Cheviot II cabinets with 12" drivers and it sounds just fine. A darn sight better than the smallish Dynaudio Contour 1.3 Mk.II speakers I had in there some years ago. They boomed like mad.

[Macca]

It's counter-intuitive but it's true.

[Reffc]

As for the original question about room matching. It's rather strange with bigger Tannoys. They can work well in small rooms even though you'd expect them to overwhelm. I have a room just 10ft by 11ft and use largish Tannoy Cheviot II cabinets with 12" drivers and it sounds just fine. A darn sight better than the smallish Dynaudio Contour 1.3 Mk.II speakers I had in there some years ago. They boomed like mad.

They don't do too badly at lower volumes which I suspect is a big part of the equation as is the type of music played to an extent (ie most people I know who own Tannoys prefer Jazz/classical and vocals to heavy rock or similar, so volumes tend to be set into the more gentlemanly realm, lets say). Turn the wick up on a large Tannoy in a room whose frequency modes coincide with peaks in response and just about any Tannoy can overwhelm, especially if pushed into corners. That's just basic physics so has to be accounted for when deciding on them. They do tend to do better in larger rooms at more realistic volume levels, but yes, I've heard Tannoys sound pretty ok in smaller rooms providing the wick wasn't turned up. My Fidelios (which were sizeable) at full chat even in my generous room size could rattle windows, doors and the ceiling (the resulting crack is poorly covered up!)

[walpurgis]

The wick certainly gets turned up here. Maybe not as much as I used to though. Years ago I had a pair of very potent big 102 db/w full range horns in here and occasionally had them so loud you could see your clothes pulsating.:lol:

[Macca]

I've heard Tannoy fifteens blasting out rock in small rooms on a couple of occasions. It never overwhelmed.

[hermit]

Not entirely sure what you meant. The 12" and 15" Lancaster use the same cabinets, with porting variations. So if you can accomodate the 12" you'd be OK with the 15". Both work very well.

If you need something smaller the 12" Chatsworth might fit the bill. There's a beautiful pair on sale here in Private Exhibitions.

I love the look of the seventies Tannoy cabinets, so despite what some may say about them, I'd retain them and help them with some internal bracing and additional damping. They can actually work well.

Thanks for your reply. To clarify, I meant that I would probably go for the 12" MGs as I don't have the financial resources to get the bigger cabs, external crossovers that Rexton recommended to get the best from the 15" MGs. The impression I have is that the Lancasters are too small really for the 15" drivers and that the 12" MGs suit the cabs better.

Thanks for the tip with regard to Gordan's Chatsworths. They look lovely but transportation may be an issue. I've dropped Gordan a pm.


If going for 12 inch MGs, the Chatsworths are really the cabinet of choice, as Geoff suggests, but if you can pick up the Lancs at reasonable cost (really worth only the cost of the drivers and crossovers) then they'd be worth buying. I know that we spoke on the 'phone so you are aware of values. AFAIK, Lancs were designed for optimally sealed use with 15 inch MGzs (they are FAR too small in volume for anything like effective port tuning to match the 15 MGs) and optimally vented use for 12 inch MGs.

They were imho, amongst the worst sounding/designed of the range; the later Mansfield cabinet (used sealed) being the better cabinet for 12 inch drivers. The sweetest sounding for the 12 inch MGs for me would be corner Chatsworths. Good shape for stiffness and better acoustically than rectangular cabs for other reasons. Getting rarer, so DIY or commission build remains a good pathway if not always the cheapest. The latter does though allow for properly designed and braced cabinets finished to your personal preferences to be made as a future consideration.

Just wanted to thank you again for your time on the phone today Paul. It really was an education. Given my limited finances, if I do opt for the local Lancasters over Gordan's distant Chatsworths, I suspect the best course of action would be upgrade the cabs as you suggested on the phone and save up for a crossover recap.

I know that you are not a fan of the Lancaster cabs but is it safe to assume that once the crossovers have been refreshed and the Lancaster cabs have been upgraded that the MG12s can sound quite good or are they really a lost cause in the Lancaster cabs.

I should also add that I am slightly alarmed at the lack of bass that you mentioned. I'm spoiled in that department with my IMFs. Do others find this a notable problem with the MG12s/Lancs? It hadn't crossed my mind that I might prefer the IMFs to the Lancasters. Given the legendary status and relative cost of the MG12s I just assumed they would be better. Now I'm having second thoughts.

[walpurgis]

I am slightly alarmed at the lack of bass that you mentioned. Do others find this a notable problem with the MG12s/Lancs?

They don't lack bass, it's solid with great impact. It's just that the 15" Lancaster is (usually) a sealed cabinet that isn't port tuned for truly deep bass, but it goes down deep enough for most.

You may also want to consider the later HPD models. They offer the true Tannoy sound too. In good fettle they sound awesome. The cabinets are more solid and they cost less than the MG equivalent. There are the 10" Eaton, 12" Devon, 12" Cheviot, 15" Berkeley and 15"Arden.

[Reffc]

Paul

as discussed, the Lancasters are really a poor design, irrespective of their fan base. My advice is that if you can get a pair cheaply enough (don't pay much more than the worth of the drivers and crossovers) the 12's sound sweeter in Chatsworth cabinets. Lancasters are coloured sounding, do not have great bass quality (nothing in those cabs can!) and are easily bettered. You can of course fettle the cabs and improve them no end. You need to remove the drivers, ditch the original foam, bitumen damp front, side top and base panels, add a brace which ties front to rear panels (cut from 12mm or 19mm ply, this will do the trick) and re-foam using 40mm a coustic foam. Crossovers if original at the very least will benefit from a full switch clean up, and most certainly from better quality caps. Unlike the 12 inch HPDs 12 inch MGs dont really benefit hugely from going up to say 130 to 150 litre cabinets as bass impact will be lost and the response droops off sooner than the HPDs. You really want to consider 12 inch HPDs if solid low bass is a priority. 12 MGs dont do that well in any cabinet much below 45 to 50Hz but they can be made to have reasonable impact as Geoff suggests.

[southall-1998]

Someday, I wouldn't mind listening to 12'' Golds in Chatsworth cabs.

S.

[hermit]

After a couple of days of worry, I just pulled the trigger on a pair of Berkeleys from ebay. Now I only have to worry about their condition - are they as nice as they seem in the ad and will they work well in my room and with my system. Fingers crossed.

Here (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121668684101) they are.

Many thanks to everyone and especially Paul at RFC for the advice and help.

[The Black Adder]

Hi Paul.

Berkleys are good but could I ask what has put you off the 12" MG's?

I hope it wasn't any talk of 12" MG's in Lancasters sounding bad in any way... I've ran the very same speakers for quite a while and believe me the Lancaster cabs are super with the 12" drivers. They are actually worse with the 15" drivers.

You would be VERY happy with them after the crossovers have been fettled with and the controls taken out of the equation.

I do hope you haven't been worrying too much. :doh:

[walpurgis]

I take it you're collecting them Paul. That's a fair old trot from where you are. Worth it though. They look good

[hermit]

Hi Paul.

Berkleys are good but could I ask what has put you off the 12" MG's?

The Lancasters were £1400 so price was a consideration. Also they were proving tricky to audition quickly. I thought that I could be patient but then I saw the Berkeleys and got to thinking. Given the rest of my system isn't of the highest calibre, I don't think I would ever get the best out of the MG12s. The impression I have is that they respond to a better cabinet than the Lancaster and I really doubt that my funds would ever extend to the costs of custom cabs or that the rest of my system would be of sufficient quality to get full value from such an investment. I think that the Berkeleys are a more suitable choice for me and may be a better match for system and musical tastes. I do like the bass the IMFs provide and am not convinced that the Lancaster can begin to approach it.



I take it you're collecting them Paul. That's a fair old trot from where you are. Worth it though. They look good

Yes. I am collecting them but I'm hoping he'll meet me part way up the M6. I'm waiting for him to make contact. I'm hopeful that they'll be worth the trip. I've long fantasised about a proper pair of big wardrobes. A new flat and larger room makes it feasible.