Advice re staining a Linn LP12 black ash plinth

[Ducatiist]

Hi Chaps,

I know the LP12 is not the most popular vinyl spinner with you, but here goes!!!

I've recently picked up a black ash plinth that's had some of the stain removed, which has left some bare patches.:doh: (not done by me...honest)

I'm just wondering if anyone might have any suggestions as to what type of stain to use to restrain the ash back to a nice deep black colour.

I can already hear the advice...get an SL1200 instead of the fruit box;)

It's just a little project I want to try, nothing fancy, just a different plinth on the LP12.

Cheers, Stu

[orbscure]

Just in case you don't get anywhere here Stu, I'd recommend take a look and possibly posting on the Linn forum here (http://forums.linn.co.uk/bb)... :)

[struth]

depends on what you mean by bare patches. if there is wood missing youd be better building it back up finishing with black hard wax , then staining....if you just want to give it a refresh then there are a few wood dyes on the market for black ash.

this stuff is concentrate but you can get ones ready to roll

http://www.amazon.co.uk/LIBERON-CONCENTRATED-WOOD-BLACK-15ml/dp/B005940TP8/ref=sr_1_1?s=diy&ie=UTF8&qid=1435162642&sr=1-1&keywords=liberon+wood+dye+black

[struth]

This is what I use on speakers etc. nice stuff; I use a cloth to apply(wear a glove or your hand will be stained). It dries nice and even and quite quickly. a couple of coats and then some wax and your like new again.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B001GU4CBQ?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00

[Ducatiist]

Wow, that was a quick response :eek:

Thanks Grant for the advice re the stain and thanks Pete for the link.

Just to clarify, the stain has been removed by sanding :doh:

The result is some of the wood showing through, but the original stain has penetrated so deeply, they gave up on the idea of stripping it back.

I think the stuff you mention Grant, is the stuff I'll try.

I might try staining some old Celestions someone passed onto me....they have been stripped as well:mental:

Thanks ever so much for the sound advice, I'll try and post some pics, when I get it done...but don't hold your breath, I'm slower than James May!

Stu

[Stratmangler]

Do we get the chance to see the "work" the plinth's previous owner has done?

[Ducatiist]

Do we get the chance to see the "work" the plinth's previous owner has done?

I'll certainly have a go at taking a few pics, so there can be a before and (usually a very long) after shot!

I'll have to read up on how to post pics, as it's a while since I posted any photos!

I kind of fell out with hifi for quite a while after a couple of burglaries at my home, but can feel a bit of enthusiasm re-surfacing!

Give me a little time and I'll get a few pics up, but I'm not naming and shaming!

Cheers Stu

[Ducatiist]

As promised, heres a couple of pics of the plinth as it came...the front edge is a bit overly rubbed which has taken the square edge off it a bit.

I intend to try and square it up a bit with a long sanding stick my brother gave me (its only a long piece of plywood with garnet paper glued to the plywood...its great for simple sanding, which should rejuvenate the edge to an acceptable standard;))

http://i1241.photobucket.com/albums/gg520/Ducatiist/P1130337_zps2ppumdtp.jpg (http://s1241.photobucket.com/user/Ducatiist/media/P1130337_zps2ppumdtp.jpg.html)

http://i1241.photobucket.com/albums/gg520/Ducatiist/P1130341_zpsmuw6k51n.jpg (http://s1241.photobucket.com/user/Ducatiist/media/P1130341_zpsmuw6k51n.jpg.html)

[DSJR]

Linn's 'Black Ash plinths used to be reject afromosia ones back in the day, carefully filled, dressed and painted black. You can use black shoe polish to fill most minor scratches and blemishes but this needs rather more ;)

I think the cure here would be to lightly spray the whole thing again with some satin finish paint. make sure the screws fixing the blocks are firmly tight (no need to over-do it, but worth checking) and then when lowering the chassis back in, use both hands to gently lower the top plate back into position...

[Stratmangler]

What got into the previous owner's head? :doh:
It's fixable to a degree, but it'll never be a silk purse again.
DSJR's suggestion of spraying it satin black is the best approach IMO.

[walpurgis]

DSJR's suggestion of spraying it satin black is the best approach IMO.

Yes. I did a TD160 plinth in satin black and it came up like new.

Just prepare it well and dab a bit of wood hardener on any porous looking areas first.

[Ducatiist]

Thanks for all the advice chaps, I'm going to do my best with it and see if I can get it back into a reasonable state.

It's never going to be purrrfect and I know that, but it wasn't a lot of money and if I can't make it look half decent, I might go a bit Leftfield and get it sprayed white!!!!

I've never seen a White LP12, so might be interesting (I've got a white Achromat too which might look cool).:eyebrows:

Whatever happens, if all else fails, I'll just sand it right back until it's properly square and adapt it for a Thorens TD 150 I've been meaning to make a plinth for, for as long as I can remember....well maybe not that long, but a really long time!

I'll post some pics with my results...if it's rubbish, it may be a white LP12 plinth!!!!

I bet that would put the cat amongst the pigeons on the Linn forums!!:D

Stu

[Ducatiist]

Well, Ive managed to get the front of the plinth square again and looking fairly good. I had to sand some of the sides too, to help keep everything looking right.
Theres still a couple of little nibbles that I'm going to leave, as it would require too much sanding. Ive finished the sanding. I tried using wood stain, but wasn't happy with the finish, so ended up using satin car spray, which looks good, but isn't quite finished, I just need a few good sunny days to get another coat or two on...but living in one of the wetter suburbs of Manchester, that could be a while.
Got my Linn set up again and have been fettling it a bit, Id forgotten how good they sound (its been out the system a while).
I think the springs might need replacing, but I'll sort that when its in the new plinth...which will be black.

A couple of photos of the sanded finish Ive achieved.

http://i1241.photobucket.com/albums/gg520/Ducatiist/P1130344_zpshu7dcgti.jpg (http://s1241.photobucket.com/user/Ducatiist/media/P1130344_zpshu7dcgti.jpg.html)

http://i1241.photobucket.com/albums/gg520/Ducatiist/P1130343_zpsltapys1z.jpg (http://s1241.photobucket.com/user/Ducatiist/media/P1130343_zpsltapys1z.jpg.html)

http://i1241.photobucket.com/albums/gg520/Ducatiist/P1130342_zps0rspbyqg.jpg (http://s1241.photobucket.com/user/Ducatiist/media/P1130342_zps0rspbyqg.jpg.html)

http://i1241.photobucket.com/albums/gg520/Ducatiist/P1130341_zpslxz3kttl.jpg (http://s1241.photobucket.com/user/Ducatiist/media/P1130341_zpslxz3kttl.jpg.html)

[struth]

you can fill the nibbles with black wax Stuart. if they are not too deep and not on a stress point then soft wax is easy to apply. otherwise use hard wax melted in.

[Ducatiist]

Cheers Grant,

If I'm honest, I've sprayed the plinth with satin automotive spray and it looks pretty nice, even with the odd nibble!

The nibbles are very minor now and are in spots that I'm not sure the wax would cope...the worst are the one on the left corner and a couple on the front upper edge corner around the middle (they show up as little black marks in the sanded wood).

I was almost happy with the plinth, but, I noticed a couple of little runs I'd created, so I gave it a little sand on the areas where the runs were. It's not been dry enough since to get another couple of coats of spray on or take photos.

I think the plinth will look fine, but rest assured I'll take a couple of photos when I'm happy with it and let others comment.

If it's not right, I can always go down the white route (I've just seen an Inspire modded all white Thorens 150 on HiFi For Sale, which looked great...and believe it or not I've got a very old Td 150 that been waiting for a plinth for years! I think that might become an option...although the front left corner brace fouls the Thorens on/off switch) and leave the Linn in its Fluted Walnut plinth.

Cheers, Stu

[YNWaN]

DSJR's suggestion is definitely the right one IMO. I've seen hundreds of 'black ash' speaker cabinets and plinths and without exception they were actually sprayed black and not stained in the proper sense of the term. Satin black car spray from Halfords gives exactly the same result (not just similar) - I say this as I have done it a number of times myself.

The previous owner has tried to sand of the black paint finish but found it has taken rather too well to the grain. What you could do is finish the sanding so and then actually stain it black. The black stain will really look dark grey on the wood and the grain will still have the black paint in it so it will look like black grained dark grey wood - then wax it.

-----

Oh, sorry - just read your post above.

[DSJR]

Check the tightness of the four screws holding the main mounting blocks in place - should only be an eighth of a turn absolute maximum. Something else is to consider the 'motor mounting area' top-plate screw that was added in the early 90's. Drill a suitable hole as small as a 2BA threaded rod will go, through the centre of the corner fillet adjacent to the motor. A suitable nut is glued firmly (metal epoxy?) to the underside of the top plate directly above the hole. The threaded rod then passes through the fillet, is screwed firmly into this nut and when reassembling is 'just' nipped up with a mudguard washer and nut underneath the fillet - nowhere near enough to flex the top plate but enough to stabilise the plate and couple it to the plinth better in that area. Hope I've got it right - I'm sure there are pics online to show you what to do...

[Ducatiist]

Thanks for all the really good advice.
I've found a useful set up guide on the Russ Andrews website.
It's pretty helpful if you need to set one up. I'd put a link up, but that's beyond my computer skills.
I think it's a PDF but is on his main website.
As soon as this rain stops and I'm off work, I'll give the plinth another couple of light spray coats and take a couple of photos.
Then I can just swap the main chunk of the LP12 into it for the time being.
I think it may need some new springs as it's quite saggy on the left side.
I've not messed about with it before now, as I was a big frightened of mucking up the settings, but having looked into it, I don't think it's ever been set up that well since I bought it (about 10 years ago), which is probably why I've never seen much of the attraction to the Linn!

I've had a fiddle with it and have to say I'm pretty impressed!
It's only got a Valhalla board and Linn basik LVX fitted with a Dynavector 10x4, but it's sounding better than I've ever heard it! And that's with my ham fist attempts at setting it up!

It's currently in its walnut/afromosia fluted plinth with smoked lid guise, looking very 70's/80's playing some of my fave tunes from being a teenager....Van Der Graaf Generator "the quiet zone".

I'll keep you updated with the progress, which will probably be a bit slow!
Stu

[struth]

Thanks for all the really good advice.
I've found a useful set up guide on the Russ Andrews website.
It's pretty helpful if you need to set one up. I'd put a link up, but that's beyond my computer skills.
I think it's a PDF but is on his main website.
As soon as this rain stops and I'm off work, I'll give the plinth another couple of light spray coats and take a couple of photos.
Then I can just swap the main chunk of the LP12 into it for the time being.
I think it may need some new springs as it's quite saggy on the left side.
I've not messed about with it before now, as I was a big frightened of mucking up the settings, but having looked into it, I don't think it's ever been set up that well since I bought it (about 10 years ago), which is probably why I've never seen much of the attraction to the Linn!

I've had a fiddle with it and have to say I'm pretty impressed!
It's only got a Valhalla board and Linn basik LVX fitted with a Dynavector 10x4, but it's sounding better than I've ever heard it! And that's with my ham fist attempts at setting it up!

It's currently in its walnut/afromosia fluted plinth with smoked lid guise, looking very 70's/80's playing some of my fave tunes from being a teenager....Van Der Graaf Generator "the quiet zone".

I'll keep you updated with the progress, which will probably be a bit slow!
Stu

to do that all you need do is click on the address bar at top of page containing the page in question. it will go blue. then right click to get a box of options. select copy....then just right click in your post here and select paste. the software here will turn it into a link.

[Ducatiist]

Cheers Grant,

I've done as described, so the link should be below!

http://www.russandrews.com/downloads/LP12booklet2a.pdf

I found the advice pretty good and I feel a lot better able to get the Linn in some kind of fettle.

If you think the guide is any good, it might be good in the Tech section or somewhere everyone can use it.

Thanks for the little computer advice too!
Stu

[YNWaN]

Peter Swain of the shop Cymbiosis has also written an extensive guide to setting up the LP12 - it's pretty easy to find on the Linn forum. This isn't meant as a criticism of the RA one as I haven't read it - it's probably good too (but I do know Peter does it all very similar to how I would).

[Ducatiist]

Thanks Mark,
I'll have a look at that one too!
I have to admit that I was a bit frightened to touch the thing initially as it seems such a black art to set the Linn up, but having had a play with it, it's not that mystical!
You can never have too much information in my opinion!
Many thanks for the input,
Stu

[YNWaN]

It's only a black art in that many fail to appreciate the balance of compromises and cut corners - the mystique is that people don't bother to understand why things are done in the manner they are. It's all simple engineering sense and equally applicable to most suspended decks.

P.S. You are most welcome - enjoy :).

[walpurgis]

Never had any problems refinishing plinths or anything else. It's just largely confidence and common sense!

(mind you. If you're no good at practical stuff, you'll never be any better at it unless you have a bash)


Oh. And setting up suspended TTs is just patience and again, common sense, there's no 'black art' involved.

[struth]

Never had any problems refinishing plinths or anything else. It's just largely confidence and common sense!

(mind you. If you're no good at practical stuff, you'll never be any better at it unless you have a bash)


Oh. And setting up suspended TTs is just patience and again, common sense, there's no 'black art' involved.

as the actress said to the Bishop;)

[Elephantears]

I've a funny feeling that might be the plinth from my old LP12, which did end up near Manchester. The little nick in the left hand corner looks familiar. Is the SN late 80,000s?

[Ducatiist]

Hi Andrew,
The plinth serial starts with 85 I think...I've got masking tape over the plate at the moment waiting for a day off when it isn't raining!
I got it from a really nice guy called Paul, from Chorlton.
I just need to give it a final coat of satin black spray.
I've managed to pick up a nice Ittok LVII and arm board, to compliment the deck and have an Asaka lying around.
I'll put a couple of pics up when I get the plinth done, then once I get round to transferring everything into the freshly painted plinth.
I reckon the Ittok will be a big leap up from the Basik currently fitted.
Cheers, Stu

[Ducatiist]

Well I managed to get in the garden today and get a couple of final coats of satin black on the plinth, so I think I'm happy with the finish, as I've just given it a couple goes over with an antique finishing wax!
I reckon I've done a reasonable job of turning a sows ear into a nice silk purse!
It's not perfect, but I think it passes muster!
I wasn't able to get photos, as the light was fading, but I promise I'll get some up ASAP!
The only problem is, I've been playing my Thorens TD 165 with a newish A & R Cambridge P77 cartridge and I think it sounds better than the LP12!
I did put new oil in the 165 and change the belt and check the alignment, which was a little off, but I can't believe how good the 165 sounds!
I think it must be a synergy thing, coz it's only running through a moth phono stage into a Linn classik, but it sounds fabulous!
Much better than the LP12 in fact! Maybe I haven't got it set up quite right!
I'll get some photos of the LP 12 plinth and the little Thorens 165 as soon as the sun comes out!
I'm now worried that fitting the new Ittok isn't going to give the sound I want!
Stupid bloody hobby!
Cheers, Stu

[struth]

Nice one Stu. Knowing the British weather it may be some time .....up here it would be next year:doh: worst summer I can remember temp wise, and lack of sunshine

[Ducatiist]

Hey Grant,
It's not quite so bad here! But I do seem to get worse weather than most places in Manchester, which is already a wet city!
I know my thread has dragged on a bit, but work and weather have been against me!
Problem is, now my TD165 sounds so good, why am I chasing the LP12 sound!
I'm not really sure I've had the LP12 set up quite right yet!
I'll get it in the new plinth and see how I go!
However the TD165 does sound awesome at the moment!
The 165 is still set up as from the dealer and it does show how good it was set up! (Bounces very pistonic)
I've just tweaked the cart alignment very slightly and it sounds superb!
Pictures to follow!
Stu

[Marco]

Nice one Stu. Knowing the British weather it may be some time .....up here it would be next year:doh: worst summer I can remember temp wise, and lack of sunshine

Should I tell you that we were basking in the sunshine at 22°C here at lunchtime? :ner: ;)

Marco.

[struth]

My heating is still on....cold, damp miserable God forsaken country this year. ..but I'm really pleased for you mate ;)

[Marco]

Lol... Wish I could pick you up and bring you down here! :)

It is amazing though, how much the temp seems to vary around the UK... We've not had a great summer here in North Wales, by any means, but most days we've been able to enjoy our meals outside on the patio, dressed in summer clothes (shorts, t-shirts), and we haven't lit the fire since the end of May.

Marco.

[struth]

Like a good vintage Port, I dont travel well these days. Nice thought though :)

[Ducatiist]

dressed in summer clothes (shorts, t-shirts), and we haven't lit the fire since the end of May.

In Manchester, summer clothes are a lightweight anorak!
I think I've got about 12 coats, all waterproof! What am I doing here in the damp, dank, wet northwest!
At least my music is sounding good at the moment!

[struth]

TBH since they reinstalled the cavity insulation, the house has been a lot warmer, so should save me a lot of dosh. of the 3 walls the 2 that get the weathering, the old stuff had gone pretty much completely. the east wall was still in decent condition, due to lack of weather in that direction(where my back door is). I usually can stand at the door and tay dry and not frozen in storms lol.
Still clearing up the mess though....THERE WAS DUST ON MY TURNTABLE :stalks:

[Ducatiist]

http://i1241.photobucket.com/albums/gg520/Ducatiist/linn/R1032476_zpsly7e3zin.jpg (http://s1241.photobucket.com/user/Ducatiist/media/linn/R1032476_zpsly7e3zin.jpg.html)

First photo of my efforts...looks better in the flesh, but I think Ive improved it a little bit:)

[Ducatiist]

http://i1241.photobucket.com/albums/gg520/Ducatiist/linn/R1032479_zpsmdhjtapb.jpg (http://s1241.photobucket.com/user/Ducatiist/media/linn/R1032479_zpsmdhjtapb.jpg.html)

It was so warm(ish) today I even had my flip flops on and managed to get them in the shot too!

[struth]

looks very good. Well done

[Ducatiist]

http://i1241.photobucket.com/albums/gg520/Ducatiist/linn/R1032480_zps2n9cfyua.jpg (http://s1241.photobucket.com/user/Ducatiist/media/linn/R1032480_zps2n9cfyua.jpg.html)

And another...I think it looks ok now.

Just need to put some innards into it now

[Ducatiist]

Cheers Grant, I'm pretty pleased with my efforts.
I think the photos are a bit harsh really! the dink on the corner isn't as noticeable in real life.
Its still there, but I can cope with that. Just fancy a change from the Afro plinth.

[Elephantears]

Hi Andrew,
The plinth serial starts with 85 I think...I've got masking tape over the plate at the moment waiting for a day off when it isn't raining!
I got it from a really nice guy called Paul, from Chorlton.


Yep, that is my old one! Great to see that you've done a really nice job on that plinth. The LP12 of which it was taken was a pretty important part of my life for over 20 years. I still have great memories of when I first heard Coltrane on that deck. It went through numerous house and flat-shares, hence the few scrapes, so its great to see you have taken it back in the Tardis to 1990 (which was a good year!).

[Ducatiist]

Hi Andrew,

1990... God I wish I was still there! I was having so much fun then and life was great!
I've been putting the deck back together tonight, with a fresh arm board, Ittok, fresh interconnect and an Asaka.
Its not quite ready to play, but not far off!
It's looking great, just need to source a nice clear lid!
I'll get some photos of the finished deal when I can!
I am impressed with its look so far though! I'm really happy with my attempt at getting the plinth back in shape!
It does look good in my opinion and a few little marks doesn't detract from its history, which is why I didn't try to cover any of the dinks with filler!
I'll post some pics when it's back together fully.
it looks much better than it did in the Afro plinth in my opinion!

Cheers, Stu