Cartridge/SAS Shenanigans

[rdpx]

Hi,

I seem to have found myself with £75 credit at a US www.turntableneedles.com (http://www.turntableneedles.com/) and am wondering what to do with it.

My TT is a Thorens TD 150 mk2 with [for the moment at least] the TP13A arm.

Currently using the original Shure M75 cart with a £15 needle on it, and it sounds good.
I also have a Nagaoka MP-200 cartridge, but no stylus for it [long story].

I tried out a friend's MP11 Boron needle on the Nag cart and it sounded good, but not remarkably better than the Shure with the cheapo needle in it, otherwise I would be all over just getting the JN-200.

Next week I am being lent a Denon 160 as well, just for laughs



So I am wondering what I should get....here are some current thinking:

1. Just get a JICO SAS stylus for the M75EJ2 [£100] and sell the empty NAG 200

2. Get a SHURE V15 III on eBay [£50-120?] and a JICO SAS for it [£110]

AND/OR

3. Get a stylus for the NAG [£120] and either use it, or sell the whole lot on

4. Get an AT150MLX [£200]

5. Something totally different


I have been advised by DECO that a Goldring G1006 would be spot on (£150) but then again reading the web it seems there is a lot of love for fairly cheap options for this deck/arm, like the Shure M97XE etc etc.
I could just get a refund from the site, but they will take a restock fee of £15 so basically anything I get from these guys is £15 off....

Anyway - I know its dull as all hell, but I was wondering what you all thought. I know there is some love for Jico SAS on here, and I also think maybe the old carts have that magical synergy with the old TT/arm. I really want the AT150MLX because it is shiny and gold, but deep down I think it is probably not the best decision.

Robert

[karma67]

save the money and keep the denon 160 or buy at95SA :)

[rdpx]

save the money and keep the denon 160 or buy at95SA :)

Sadly the 160 is just a loaner, and will not be mine to keep.

[walpurgis]

Next week I am being lent a Denon 160 as well, just for laughs. Robert

I have a feeling the DL-160 may give you a shock. It's a very good cartridge. Notably smoother and more full bodied than the DL-110. It will stomp all over the M75 you have.

[struth]

They do at95 he, and Sa stylii. They are superb; and have tried both. It is an amazing combo especially the jico shibata version, but the he is very good too. Got a denon 160 as well and I like it too. Don't think you would be disappointed in any of the 3.

[rdpx]

They do at95 he, and Sa stylii. They are superb; and have tried both. It is an amazing combo especially the jico shibata version, but the he is very good too. Got a denon 160 as well and I like it too. Don't think you would be disappointed in any of the 3.

AT95 better than the M75/V15 with SAS ?

[struth]

I have done comparisons between the HE and Shabata versions of the AT95 and although both are very very good the shabata is best and only got moved out of my system when I got the Ortofon mc25fl ...... IME it is better than the dl160,'...sure plenty will recoil in horror but thats my position:)

[paskinn]

It is always the same problem....in the highly subjective world of audio, what are terms such as 'better' supposed to mean?
Really, it is just someone saying they happen to like something. I suspect the Shure 97xe is, objectively, the equal of many expensive cartridges. Some of the others may be to. But it depends on system and tastes. Every item of hi fi has people who love it, and people who loath it. That's the hobby , and ultimately you are on a personal journey.

[pcourtney]

Option 2 - V15 Type III with Jico SAS, it's what I had on my SL-120 and when I sold it I kept the V15 ( it was that good )

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJduxLTeh5w

[rdpx]

Option 2 - V15 Type III with Jico SAS, it's what I had on my SL-120 and when I sold it I kept the V15 ( it was that good )


I was leaning towards this option, or maybe just get the SAS for the M75 which does seem to suit the TT/arm very well.
Yesterday I ended up winning a low hours Goldring 1042 with a speculative bid on eBay, so may well go for a new stylus for the Nag and just sell it on as it seems a shame to have an empty cart sitting around with nothing to do.

Anyone likely to be interested in a Nagaoka MP-200 with a brand new stylus sometime in August?

[pcourtney]

you did well with the 1042, let's hope it is nearer 50 hours than 100, anything below £150 is great value for the 1042 IMHO

[rdpx]

you did well with the 1042, let's hope it is nearer 50 hours than 100, anything below £150 is great value for the 1042 IMHO

Yes, thanks Peter I am really looking forward to trying it out on my 150. Fingers crossed.

I had a look at the guy's feedback and it is all solid "perfect as described" and "trust this seller". He also just upgraded to £4,000 worth of Origin Live/Dynavector set up so I can't imagine he needs to be conning anyone for a couple of quid.

[rdpx]

It arrived.
It is f@cked.
He is going to refund me but it's the last time I buy a cartridge off eBay.

[rdpx]

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06/03/5d4932a27b4993b75200f5fbab031f1b.jpg

[DSJR]

I have a 1042 where the cantilever fractured right at the pivot. I don't know (never asked) how much it would cost to splice it back together, but I dare say the cost wouldn't be too different from a trade price on a new stylus.

The DL110 sounded good in a TP13A I remember, as did a K9 (thereby meaning the AT95HE would too :)). The Shure 97XE should NEVER be ignored either and it appears here that the SAS stylus genuinely improves it, on measurement as well as listening...

[rdpx]

Thanx man, that's great to have some tp13a specific advice. I'm wondering whether I should just save my cash and get the SAS for the M75, as it sounds pretty good with just a cheap needle in it.
Is there any reason why I'd be better off with a modern cartridge? The M75 is probably about fifty years old. I love the idea of keeping it going, but do cartridges deteriorate over time? I've had a couple of people tell me they do, but they both were retailers who wanted to sell me a cartridge....

[Kvaal]

I have tried the M 95e. I bought it new. It is in a drawer somewhere in the house. I tried the Dl 160. It is sold now. I am using an 45 years old M 75 with Jico N 70e stylus. I love the fullbodied, transparent sound. This stylus is a steal!

http://www.jico-stylus.com/product_info.php?products_id=1017

I have heard that a stylus can deteroirate at the point of suspension.

[Listener666]

Thanx man, that's great to have some tp13a specific advice. I'm wondering whether I should just save my cash and get the SAS for the M75, as it sounds pretty good with just a cheap needle in it.
Is there any reason why I'd be better off with a modern cartridge? The M75 is probably about fifty years old. I love the idea of keeping it going, but do cartridges deteriorate over time? I've had a couple of people tell me they do, but they both were retailers who wanted to sell me a cartridge....

I have this combo (M75ed with SAS)......really like it and have used all sorts in the past. I also have a cheap stylus from somewhere or other for it with about 10hours on it and it really is crap...it may have broken in with a bit of play ....but I gave up.

Be aware that the sas ( in my experience) shows any minor imperfection in the record and is a bit subjective to surface noise....I had to mess about with the platter mat a bit. I may buy a Jico (non SAS) stylus for older worn records. I wonder if there is much of an upgrade going down the 97xe or V route?.....I would like to hear it

On another note I have a Nagaoka MP11 Boron. I managed to get a NOS stylus a few years back and this was superb....until about 50hours ...when it had a little accident. I was by far more to my taste than the G1042. I have tried a couple of non boron replacements but they are not in the same league.

Hope you get sorted!!!!

[walpurgis]

When not using an MC, I install a late sixties ADC 10 Mk.II (or slightly later 10E Mk.IV). The sound is outstanding. I've used the various M75 versions and the similar M91ED and still own an M75S fitted with an elliptical stylus (Goldring made M75E copy). They are good, but try and get your hands on a 10 series ADC. They have a sound of their own and non MC cartridges really don't come much better (yes, I have run them alongside Deccas).

[struth]

yes no one can get there hands on an adc cart of quality coz youve got them all

[kininigin]

I've been thinking about getting an SAS for my Shure SC35C.Would it be a suitable match for my Jelco 750D arm? Hope the op doesn't mind me jumping in here.

[walpurgis]

yes no one can get there hands on an adc cart of quality coz youve got them all

Shhh!:exactly:

[Barry]

yes no one can get there hands on an adc cart of quality coz youve got them all

Pehaps - but I have three with five spare stylii. :D

[walpurgis]

I've got two 10E Mk.II, either one or two (can't recall) 10E Mk.IV, and a 26.

Two spare 10E Mk.II styli, one 27 stylus and a 10E Mk.IV stylus

(I think)


The only other non MC's I have are a pair of JVC Z1S MM's, with one spare new conical stylus and one spare new elliptical. If you've not heard one of these keep an eye out, they sound excellent and don't command high prices yet (but they're scarce).

[Barry]

I've got two 10E Mk.II, either one or two (can't recall) 10E Mk.IV, and a 26.

Two spare 10E Mk.II styli, one 27 stylus and a 10E Mk.IV stylus

(I think)


The only other non MC's I have are a pair of JVC Z1S MM's, with one spare new conical stylus and one spare new elliptical. If you've not heard one of these keep an eye out, they sound excellent (but they're scarce).

I once heard a JVC X-1 MM. It was excellent.

My ADCs are:

1 x ADC25 (with three sylii, having different profiles: two elliptical, one spherical)

2 x ADC 10E Mk. IV (with three spare stylii)

I used to have an ADC26 - sold it "for a song" (£15), as I didn't use it.

The body of the 26 is identical to the 25; just coloured white instead of black. The 27 stylus ought to fit the 26, and in fact could well be identical to the R-26.

[walpurgis]

I once heard a JVC X-1 MM. It was excellent.

My ADCs are:

1 x ADC25 (with three sylii, having different profiles: two elliptical, one spherical)

2 x ADC 10E Mk. IV (with three spare stylii)

I used to have an ADC26 - sold it "for a song" (£15), as I didn't use it.

The body of the 26 is identical to the 25; just coloured white instead of black. The 27 stylus ought to fit the 26, and in fact could well be identical to the R-26.

27 has slightly lower compliance. 50 cu I believe as opposed to the 60cu of the 26. It does fit though and fits the 10E Mk.IV too.

There's been a 26 with dud stylus on eBay for a while and the asking price is £175! Daft.