MM Carts

[oldius]

I really like them and I have four:

ADC ZLM
ADC XLM iii
Shure V15 iii
Ortofon VMS30ii

I have MC's mounted on my 401/Ace Anna but I always really enjoy listening to the other deck with the moving magnet carts. Do a lot of us ignore moving magnet designs at our peril?

[petrat]

System matching?
Now I come to think about it, in the past I preferred mm with various solid state amps, and now much prefer mc with recent valve set-ups.

[oldius]

I'm not saying that I prefer the MM cartridges, just that I enjoy them just as much. My Art1 is away for a retip so perhaps that will change my mind. I've not had it in my grasp for a good while.

[Wakefield Turntables]

I really like them and I have four:

ADC ZLM
ADC XLM iii
Shure V15 iii
Ortofon VMS30ii

I have MC's mounted on my 401/Ace Anna but I always really enjoy listening to the other deck with the moving magnet carts. Do a lot of us ignore moving magnet designs at our peril?

Shure v15 III is one of the best MM I've heard, would love to try the ortofon 2M black.

[oldius]

The VMS30ii is almost identical to the 2M Black but don't tell anyone as it's a trade secret!

The Shure is great but better than the others? No.

[Idlewithnodrive]

I love MM's too.

At the minute I have an IQ2 and IQ3, a G1042, 2 VMS30 MkII's and a Pickering XV-15 / 625e.

I also owned the 2M Black, which is an amazing cart but so set-up critical that it quickly becomes irritating.

The IQ2 is my daily user and is excellent, the IQ3 just a bit better but I only use it on new / mint vinyl.

The Black is about as good as the IQ3, just too fiddly, the VMS30 MkII, as Geoff says, a real sleeper and the 1042 a nice to have spare.

Never got on with the V15-III, hissy shouty thing.

I could happily live with any of them (except the Shure) :)

[struth]

got 3 in my stock. a vms20 which has a superb tone. an Acutex 410e that I have never used but told is wxcellent and my fav an AT95e fitted with a shibata stylus which is about as good as it gets

[walpurgis]

I have:

ADC 10E Mk.II (two of these)

ADC 10E Mk.IV

ADC 26

(and a spare ADC 27 stylus to fit the 10E Mk.IV and 26)

Shure M75/6 with Goldring made M75 stylus

Ortofon VMS30Mk.II

JVC Z1S

JVC Z1S with Z1E stylus


The ADC 10E Mk.II is my favourite. These are mega rare now!

[oldius]

I'm not familiar with other cartridges in ADC's range.

[walpurgis]

I'm not familiar with other cartridges in ADC's range.

They are superb, but getting hard to find now. Like most ADCs they need a low mass arm. The earlier brick shaped ADCs sound very like the XLM and VLM models. the 26 is a bit of a legend for its sound, but is unusable in most arms due to the huge 60cu compliance and ultra low tracking force.

The JVC Z1S sounds remarkable too considering the base 'S' version has a conical tip. It's a very lucid, open sounding cart, rather like a decent MC in presentation. Well worth keeping an eye out for and nobody seems to have latched onto them yet. They're a bit scarce with the original stylus though.

[Barry]

I have

ADC 25 (with three stylii)
ADC 10E Mk. IV (x2) (with three spare stylii)
AKG P8ES
Shure M55E
B&O SP6

plus

Decca Mk. III
Decca Mk. V (x2)
Decca Mk. VI

(All I need now to complete my MM collection is a B&O MMC20EN or MMC20CN. Plus of course a Decca 'Reference'!)

[kcc123]

I am insane and having roughly 40 MM cartridges, not to mention those MCs which are also part of my collection

[walpurgis]

I am insane and having roughly 40 MM cartridges, not to mention those MCs which are also part of my collection

Yes. Definitely! :D

[wiicrackpot]

I am insane and having roughly 40 MM cartridges, not to mention those MCs which are also part of my collection


Yes. Definitely! :D
Agreed with Geoff,i thought i was bad with 10 at the last count but 40 is ridiculous, :D
you don't happen stash cameras do you King?, am on the look out for a Fuji X-Pro1.......cheap.:eyebrows:

[Barry]

Agreed with Geoff, I thought I was bad with 10 at the last count but 40 is ridiculous, :D
you don't happen stash cameras do you King?, am on the look out for a Fuji X-Pro1.......cheap.:eyebrows:

I do - I have the following 35mm film cameras:

Leica M3
Leica M4

with 4 lenses,

a Zeiss 'Werra'

and

Exacta Varex VX IIa (x2)
Exacta Varex VX IIb
Exacta Varex VX1000 (x2)
Exa 500

with about a dozen lenses. :doh:

[struth]

sold all my cameras bar 1 film one and 1 digital...i feel better about it now:lol:

[kcc123]

Hahaha!

I think I have 27 cameras, mostly old Minolta and Konica film ones, but unfortunately I don't have a Fuji X-Pro1. I have lost count how many lenses I own, about 70-80 at least, including Minolta, Sony, Sigma, Canon, Konica, Yashica, Vivitar and Mitakon etc. :D

[walpurgis]

I do - I have the following 35mm film cameras:

Leica M3
Leica M4

with 4 lenses,

a Zeiss 'Werra'

and

Exacta Verex VX IIa (x2)
Exacta Verex VX IIb
Exacta Verex VX1000 (x2)
Exa 500

with about a dozen lenses. :doh:

I've got it down to a couple of Pentax cameras and a bunch of Tamron Adaptall 2 lenses. Trouble is I've got a huge case full of filters, flashes and other accessories. :rolleyes:

(not to mention the eight digital cameras)

I had a Zeiss Werra too. It took very good photos.

[wiicrackpot]

I do - I have the following 35mm film cameras:

Leica M3
Leica M4

with 4 lenses,

a Zeiss 'Werra'

and

Exacta Varex VX IIa (x2)
Exacta Varex VX IIb
Exacta Varex VX1000 (x2)
Exa 500

with about a dozen lenses. :doh:


Hahaha!

I think I have 27 cameras, mostly old Minolta and Konica film ones, but unfortunately I don't have a Fuji X-Pro1. I have lost count how many lenses I own, about 70-80 at least, including Minolta, Sony, Sigma, Canon, Konica, Yashica, Vivitar and Mitakon etc. :D
Are you guys are serious, :eek: Leica's are a pipe dream for me, seemingly the upper end X series Fuji's outperform Leica's equivalent in every way,
yes even in the lens department, hence i am thinking ''buy good,buy once''. :cool:

[Barry]

Are you guys are serious, :eek: Leica's are a pipe dream for me, seemingly the upper end X series Fuji's outperform Leica's equivalent in every way,
yes even in the lens department, hence I am thinking ''buy good, buy once''. :cool:

I don't know if the upper-end X series Fuji outperforms the Leica 240 digital camera. It may do, but I would be surprised if Fuji's lenses outperform Leica's.

In some ways I hope the Fuji digital camera at least matches the Leica, at £5000 for the latter (body only) buying a Fuji would save me a lot of money!


My Leica M cameras were the achievement of an ambition for me. I have taken thousands of photos with them, from all over the world under a range of climatic extremes. I have been in situations of extreme cold, extreme heat and dust, where other quality (Japanese) cameras have failed. Were it not for the non-availability of Kodachrome, I would continue to use them.

[wiicrackpot]

Barry, i was hankering over a Canon 5Dmk2 for a while but my head has been turned,
i think i definitely want a Fuji X series now, according to some reviews,
the Fujinon lenses really are stonking and some even say the equal of Leica's offering,
saying that if i was thrushed enought to not check price tags, i'd go Leica every time. :D

[walpurgis]

I'm happy with my Nikon P7100 as a useful all rounder that takes a decent photo. And it's got an optical viewfinder with dioptre correction, which is handy for my dodgy eyesight. (and it looks a bit like a Leica :D)

[ReggieB]

My camera is a Nikon D70 which is splendid.

However, I thought I'd add another comment on the subject of MM cartridges.

I'm going back to a Goldring 1042 from a spell of using a Denon DL110, and one of my main drivers is practicality. For me one of the main issues with using a turntable is keeping everything clean. With that in mind the sheer practicality of being able to easily remove the stylus for inspection/cleaning is a real boon.

Of course it helps that in the past when I've had the chance to compare the two cartridges I prefer the 1042, but I had been considering upgrading to a Dynavector DV10x5 (http://www.stereophile.com/content/dynavector-dv10x5-mc-phono-cartridge). However, a recent dirty problem when some gunge got onto the DL110 stylus, has made me rethink that idea.

We'll see. I'm starting to listen to records a little more, so perhaps I'll still be tempted to try the Dynavector. My recent Hi-Fi upgrades (Beard P35 and Pi streamer) have raised the bar on the sound quality I'm now looking for.

[walpurgis]

I doubt you'd find the 10X 5 much of an upgrade over the DL-110. If you have problems with dirt on the stylus, you could try one of these:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Polymer-Gel-stylus-needle-cleaner-for-safe-cleaning-and-long-stylus-life-/291417649635?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item43d9d871e3

I have one similar and it takes dirt off without having to remove the cartridge.

[ReggieB]

I have some similar gel, but it didn't shift the gunge.

[Clive197]

I use the VP Dust Buster. Similar product and works brilliantly with no fuss. Far safer than brushes and fluids though I do use them as well very very sparingly to keep the cantilever clean (LAST stylus cleaner). You only need to use a minuscule amount so as not to get any fluid migrating up the cantilever to damage the cartridge internals.

[twotone]

Barry, i was hankering over a Canon 5Dmk2 for a while but my head has been turned,
i think i definitely want a Fuji X series now, according to some reviews,
the Fujinon lenses really are stonking and some even say the equal of Leica's offering,
saying that if i was thrushed enought to not check price tags, i'd go Leica every time. :D

Best camera I've ever owned was an M3 and the lenses were all Leica, had a mint 1968 50mm Rigid Summicron, what a lens, absolutely beautiful photographs from it.

Sold my entire Leica collection last year for more or less what I paid for it, you really can't go wrong with Leica stuff.

Have a mate thinking about buying an M6 and two lenses from ffordes for about £6,000:eek:

http://ffordes.com/product/14090511574731

[struth]

Barry, i was hankering over a Canon 5Dmk2 for a while but my head has been turned,
i think i definitely want a Fuji X series now, according to some reviews,
the Fujinon lenses really are stonking and some even say the equal of Leica's offering,
saying that if i was thrushed enought to not check price tags, i'd go Leica every time. :D

SOUNDS PAINFUL :eyebrows:

[r100]

Best camera I've ever owned was an M3 and the lenses were all Leica, had a mint 1968 50mm Rigid Summicron, what a lens, absolutely beautiful photographs from it.

Sold my entire Leica collection last year for more or less what I paid for it, you really can't go wrong with Leica stuff.

Have a mate thinking about buying an M6 and two lenses from ffordes for about £6,000:eek:

http://ffordes.com/product/14090511574731

I also had a M3 and a M6. Sold both bodies but still have a couple of lenses. I am really regretting that I sold the bodies but luckily Sony has come out with a full frame body the A7 which I have been eying for a while now. Of course, it will never replace the feel of an authentic Leica body :(

[Barry]

Best camera I've ever owned was an M3 and the lenses were all Leica, had a mint 1968 50mm Rigid Summicron, what a lens, absolutely beautiful photographs from it.

Sold my entire Leica collection last year for more or less what I paid for it, you really can't go wrong with Leica stuff.

Have a mate thinking about buying an M6 and two lenses from ffordes for about £6,000:eek:

http://ffordes.com/product/14090511574731

My first Leica was an M3, fitted with the rigid 50mm f/2 Summicron. Later I bought a 90mm f/4 Elmar, a 35mm f/3.5 Summaron and a 280mm f/4.5 Telyt telephoto lense for 'shooting' wildlife in Africa. The M4 came later, as I found it convenient to have two camera bodies fitted with different focal length lenses.

Of the two I prefer the M3.

I'm not sure if the M6 + two lenses offered is good value. For that money o would buy a good used M240 (the Leica digital camera) with say a used 50mm Summicron.

[r100]

My first Leica was an M3, fitted with the rigid 50mm f/2 Summicron. Later I bought a 90mm f/4 Elmar, a 35mm f/3.5 Summaron and a 280mm f/4.5 Telyt telephoto lense for 'shooting' wildlife in Africa. The M4 came later, as I found it convenient to have two camera bodies fitted with different focal length lenses.

Of the two I prefer the M3.

I'm not sure if the M6 + two lenses offered is good value. For that money o would buy a good used M240 (the Leica digital camera) with say a used 50mm Summicron.

The offered M6 looks like a limited edition which would explain why it is so expensive. I wouldn't buy that unless I was expecting to make some money on a sale 10-20 years from now. Of course you wouldn't want to use it until then :eyebrows:

Sorry :offtopic: again !

[twotone]

My first Leica was an M3, fitted with the rigid 50mm f/2 Summicron. Later I bought a 90mm f/4 Elmar, a 35mm f/3.5 Summaron and a 280mm f/4.5 Telyt telephoto lense for 'shooting' wildlife in Africa. The M4 came later, as I found it convenient to have two camera bodies fitted with different focal length lenses.

Of the two I prefer the M3.

I'm not sure if the M6 + two lenses offered is good value. For that money o would buy a good used M240 (the Leica digital camera) with say a used 50mm Summicron.

Think the guy just wants a film camera now Barry, nice looking set that though I don't think I would buy a 35mm and 50mm lens set.

I had a 90mm Elmarit lens, pretty old one about 1962 or so, fantastic for taking potraits, also had a 135mm Elmar which was mint, hardly used that one though.

I've no idea why rangefinder cameras went out of fashion, they take much better photographs than SLRs IMO.

Actually Leicas are idiot proof regarding taking good photos, really difficult to take an out of focus shot unless that's what you want to do.

I loved using the M3.

[BTH K10A]

Tractor magazine has a good article on collecting Massey Fergusson's :rolleyes:

[Clive197]

How did this thread about MM cartridges turn into (admittedly interesting) discussion about cameras?

[r100]

:lol:

analogousness of the camera perhaps ?

[twotone]

Sorry double post

[struth]

How did this thread about MM cartridges turn into (admittedly interesting) discussion about cameras?

Its disgraceful, and if there is any more of it I will consider posting again :D

[walpurgis]

As this MM cart thread is so popular. I'm going to start an MC one to see how that goes.

(maybe we can use it to discuss cricket or motorbikes :lol:)


Why has nobody mentioned Deccas yet (as far as I'm aware). They may not be exactly MMs, but work on similar principles. As do ADC.

[twotone]

As this MM cart thread is so popular. I'm going to start an MC one to see how that goes.

(maybe we can use it to discuss cricket or motorbikes :lol:)


Why has nobody mentioned Deccas yet (as far as I'm aware). They may not be exactly MMs, but work on similar principles. As do ADC.

Never seen or heard of a Leica Decca Geoff:eek:

[BTH K10A]

Did Leica ever make Tractors? I know Porsche did and Lamborghini still do.

[twotone]

Did Leica ever make Tractors? I know Porsche did and Lamborghini still do.

Nope but they did make scopes for tanks in WW2 and for rifles etc

http://uk.leica-camera.com/Sport-Optics/Riflescopes/About-Leica-Riflescopes

http://uk.leica-camera.com/World-of-Leica/100-Years-of-Leica-Photography/Leica-100-years

http://uk.leica-camera.com/World-of-Leica/100-Years-of-Leica-Photography/Leica-100-years/Iconic-photos

[wiicrackpot]

SOUNDS PAINFUL :eyebrows:

Arrgh naw.....didn't realise the typo, must have been thinking about the thing we alpha males think about every 2 seconds eh Grant. :lol:

[BTH K10A]

Nope but they did make scopes for tanks in WW2 and for rifles etc

http://uk.leica-camera.com/Sport-Optics/Riflescopes/About-Leica-Riflescopes

http://uk.leica-camera.com/World-of-Leica/100-Years-of-Leica-Photography/Leica-100-years

http://uk.leica-camera.com/World-of-Leica/100-Years-of-Leica-Photography/Leica-100-years/Iconic-photos

OK, so did they make any audio equipment like Ziess Ikon

http://www.klangfunken.de/cat.htm

[twotone]

OK, so did they make any audio equipment like Ziess Ikon

http://www.klangfunken.de/cat.htm

Don't think so but they sent Jewish staff members to the USA at the start of the WW2.

https://fstoppers.com/historical/how-leica-freedom-train-saved-hundreds-jews-holocaust-50656

[Barry]

Never seen or heard of a Leica Decca Geoff:eek:

To my knowledge Leitz never made any audio equipment, but during WWII the British precision instrument company Reid and Siegrist made a 'chinese copy' of the Leica IIIF camera and fitted it with a Taylor Hobson f/2 2" lens. Both lens and camera body were thought to be superior to the Leica, and now command very high prices on the second hand market.

Reid and Siegrist also made the original 'Professional' pickup arm for Decca.

[twotone]

To my knowledge Leitz never made any audio equipment, but during WWII the British precision instrument company Reid and Siegrist made a 'chinese copy' of the Leica IIIF camera and fitted it with a Taylor Hobson f/2 2" lens. Both lens and camera body were thought to be superior to the Leica, and now command very high prices on the second hand market.

Reid and Siegrist also made the original 'Professional' pickup arm for Decca.

I've seen a few of those Taylor Hobson lenses for sale from time to time, you should go onto the Leica forums, speciffically the Leica Historica forum if your not already a member, there are some great posters on there with loads of info on Leitz stuff going back to the very early years, one of the mods has a site showing all of the Leica cameras produced and inc all of the accessories for each camera.

[VesaLato]

Don't know anything about camera's :) but I have a Goldring 1042 and have been very satisfied to it.

[anubisgrau]

what tonearms you run both your MMs and MCs to an optimal performance?

[Barry]

Don't know anything about camera's :) but I have a Goldring 1042 and have been very satisfied to it.

The diversion into discussion of cameras was an example of thread drift, for which AoS is famous (notorious?)!

Anyway back to cartridges - the Goldring 1042 is a good example of fine sounding MM device; as was their IGC 900 design. :) What arm do you use your 1042 on, Vesta?

[VesaLato]

^ [emoji3] It's on a Origin Live Silver mk3 that sits on Rega Planar3.

[Floyddroid]

I often wonder what Glanz cartridges sound like. I have never owned one. Iv'e heard theyr'e pretty darn good though
I love MM's too.

At the minute I have an IQ2 and IQ3, a G1042, 2 VMS30 MkII's and a Pickering XV-15 / 625e.

I also owned the 2M Black, which is an amazing cart but so set-up critical that it quickly becomes irritating.

The IQ2 is my daily user and is excellent, the IQ3 just a bit better but I only use it on new / mint vinyl.

The Black is about as good as the IQ3, just too fiddly, the VMS30 MkII, as Geoff says, a real sleeper and the 1042 a nice to have spare.

Never got on with the V15-III, hissy shouty thing.

I could happily live with any of them (except the Shure) :)

[petrat]

I was so inspired by this thread that I went out and bought a Leica ... sorry, no, I meant ... an Audio Technica 440MLb.
For £130, I am more than impressed, which I put down to it having a fine-line stylus.
https://www.divineaudio.co.uk/audio-technica-at440mla-moving-magnet-cartridge
TBH, I'm not sure it loses anything much of importance to more expensive mm carts I've owned in the past. Nice top-end, plenty of detail, reasonably dynamic, goes deep, if a tad soft in the bass.

[KONDO]

Tractor magazine has a good article on collecting Massey Fergusson's :rolleyes:

nice one

[helma]

I often wonder what Glanz cartridges sound like. I have never owned one. Iv'e heard theyr'e pretty darn good though

I have the MFG-31E nude elliptical which I got NOS sometime ago, so it's nowhere near their top of the line but a very fine cartridge and I like it the best of all the MMs I've had. 2nd and 3rd place would go to Ortofon VMS30FL and VMS20E mkII, so I do rate it. I just find the Glanz is the most neutral and natural sounding and in someways sounds more like an MC. It has a relative low inductance (for an MM anyway), around 100mH if I recall correctly, so it's not overly sensitive to capacitive loading and has a nice and peak free treble response. I also have a pair of Esoter Azzurras which was a rebranded bottom of the line Glanz model, 0.5mil bonded spherical. It find it retains most of that naturalness of the bigger brother, but sounds a bit more stuffy overall and the treble response seems to drop somewhat, but still a very nice entry level cart.

The bad thing about these is there doesn't seem to be any sources for replacement styli, even aftermarket ones. I imagine someone would do a retip though.

[DSJR]

We liked Glanz at the time, but styli may be very difficult to source now. The cheaper, more 'raw' sounding ones were great value I remember.

I'm out of date - have AT changed the 440MLa to an MLb? The tone of the AT120E and 440MLa is light and airy - a bit like an OC9 possibly, but they only seem to work best in low mass arms, the bass then integrating better - the bass sounds 'detached' in higher mass tonearms I find.

[petrat]

Yes, it's now the b version of the 440ML ... seems no-one can figure out what the 'upgrade' is, as AT claim identical spec and it looks exactly the same. I am using it on a lightweight arm, and it seems pretty well integrated as far as I can tell.

[DSJR]

I remember a story about Dynavector. The 10X has been around on one form or another since the mid 70's. Once the contract to make them at a fixed price is made, it stays at this price - I suspect this may be one reason how the Denon 103 and 110 stayed so cheap for so long (until the mid noughties anyway). Changing the model slightly means a re-negotiation of the price and may help explain in this case anyway, why the DL110 stayed at £60 from early 80's to 2007 or so, yet the 10X went from £60 in the early 80's or so to £350 or so by the same time..