View Full Version : Advantages of Monoblock amplifiers
Can anyone tell me what the advantages are of using monoblock amplifiers.
For me and compared to an integrated I get much greater clarity and definition from my A40s, more 'air' I guess you could call it but with the overall sound being more authoritative.
I think this comes as a result of each having bigger power supplies than the integrated and benefiting from a circuit which just does less.
I also like that when people see them they go, 'what are those???' lol:lol:
walpurgis
12-04-2015, 09:43
Apart from being able to get them and their big hum fields away from stuff that handles low level signals and nearer to the speakers, I can't think of any major benefits.
wee tee cee
12-04-2015, 10:49
One component doing one job.
Impedance matching to speakers.
Flexibility in matching a passive or active pre.
Flexibility in running long ICs as opposed to long speaker cables.
Haselsh1
12-04-2015, 11:07
From my own experience of using a Rotel RB850 as a stereo amplifier and of using two RB850's as bridged monoblocks, the monoblocks have a massive stereo soundstage whereas the stereo one doesn't. The soundstage is just so deep and wide in comparison.
occamsrazor
12-04-2015, 12:26
I have Hypex Ncore monoblocks and I really like being able to use long (like 10m) cheap balanced XLR interconnects, with only 1m of speaker cable to the speakers.
hifinutt
12-04-2015, 18:26
Can anyone tell me what the advantages are of using monoblock amplifiers.
having used monoblocks for some years I guess there must be some who use nearer the speakers but I never did .
you can get more powerful amps in easier to move boxes I guess
I use a stereo power amp in one box now . less mains leads , less boxes and the sound is much better than any monoblocks I have had
For me and compared to an integrated I get much greater clarity and definition from my A40s, more 'air' I guess you could call it but with the overall sound being more authoritative.
I think this comes as a result of each having bigger power supplies than the integrated and benefiting from a circuit which just does less.
I also like that when people see them they go, 'what are those???' lol:lol:
I think the separate Power supplies will make the make the biggest difference - thinking of going down the Croft monoblock route with S7 mono's.
The Barbarian
12-04-2015, 18:51
Has some naughty boy been deleting my posts in true dictatorship style?
Clive197
12-04-2015, 18:59
I think the separate Power supplies will make the make the biggest difference - thinking of going down the Croft monoblock route with S7 mono's.
I tend to agree re the seperate power supplies. I've been using mono blocks for about eight years now, first Cyrus Mono X's and as of yesterday a lovely pair of 225 watts each Cyrus Mono X 300 Signatures.
hifinutt
12-04-2015, 19:02
congrats , as a very active member of the cyrus forum , I hear good things about them
Besides, why make do with one amplifier when you can have 2 or 3 or 4!
orbscure
12-04-2015, 19:09
Its always good to get feedback from those who operated monoblocks especially as I have an itch to scratch with regards operating them in my system... so much so that when funds allow (after the restoration of my JBL4311's by Paul/RFC) I really fancy having a go with the NVA A-series monoblocks...
Its always good to get feedback from those who operated monoblocks especially as I have an itch to scratch with regards operating them in my system... so much so that when funds allow (after the restoration of my JBL4311's by Paul/RFC) I really fancy having a go with the NVA A-series monoblocks...
I really like mine... work a treat with that icon passive.
talisman2
12-04-2015, 19:28
i have a pair of Beard P100 Monoblocks and i find that that seperation and ease of driving my speakers is one advantage over my single stereo Beard power amp plus the looks of admiration from fellow audiophiles when they spy them on my rack !! disadvantage is lifting the 'bloody things'
trio leo
12-04-2015, 19:31
Not sure if crosstalk is a problem with some integrated amps, but it's non existent in mono-blocks, the individual power supplies and capacitors can be huge, offering peak power flexibilty.
Short interconnects, long speaker cables or the other way round should you choose to experiment with amp positioning.
I feel that the articulation and beautiful separation of instruments and artist is due to my mono-blocs.
A pair of my mono-blocs side by side are smaller than some stereo power amps.
I like the look of my mono-blocs red glow in the evening.
Some times it's just personal preference.
Enjoy your music :)
cheers Al
Not sure if crosstalk is a problem with some integrated amps, but it's non existent in mono-blocks, the individual power supplies and capacitors can be huge, offering peak power flexibilty.
Short interconnects, long speaker cables or the other way round should you choose to experiment with amp positioning.
I feel that the articulation and beautiful separation of instruments and artist is due to my mono-blocs.
A pair of my mono-blocs side by side are smaller than some stereo power amps.
I like the look of my mono-blocs red glow in the evening.
Some times it's just personal preference.
Enjoy your music :)
cheers Al
Aye, them albarrys look darn sexy I'll give you that.
One day...
Floyddroid
12-04-2015, 20:27
I would have to agree. I find that i get greater accuracy and separation both back to back and side to side with my mono's. It's very subtle but there nevertheless. Rich, i must get up there and have a listen to yours matey!
Audio Advent
13-04-2015, 02:49
It must depend on the stereo amp though - there are many stereo amps which are completely dual mono inside, with the only thing each channel shares being the power inlet and the case. So unless there is crosstalk due to magnetic induction or some other kind of interference between channels, then the only advantage should be their physical positioning.
In other words, differences between monoblocks and stereo amps is probably no more than of two stereo amps of different circuit typologies. Monoblocks look better though in my opinion.
It must depend on the stereo amp though - there are many stereo amps which are completely dual mono inside, with the only thing each channel shares being the power inlet and the case. So unless there is crosstalk due to magnetic induction or some other kind of interference between channels, then the only advantage should be their physical positioning.
In other words, differences between monoblocks and stereo amps is probably no more than of two stereo amps of different circuit typologies. Monoblocks look better though in my opinion.
Would I be correct in thinking you also have more controlled power on tap!
Possibly ... all a power amp does is shape the mains electricity into music .... for valve amps, monoblocks usually allow bigger power supplies without the need for a forklift ... which is a good thing. Mostly. Plus, the evil manufacturers can sell you two instead of one :eyebrows:
Audio Advent
13-04-2015, 14:37
Would I be correct in thinking you also have more controlled power on tap!
With monoblocks? Not if the monoblocks are smaller and less powerful than the stereo amp you're comparing it with! Comparing like with like they'd be the same else you won't be comparing like with like..
Also, with Class D amps like the Ncore mentioned above, heat and weight and case size no longer come into it at all. With class A or any other hot, high-powered amp, the question is only one of practicallity.
Personally I do think there is a bit of a marketing at work with new, commercial monoblocks - you can get people to pay a lot more for the priveledge of two cases and the perception of getting more than if you built the exact same thing within a single case. But what they'll do in reality is make sure the stereo version has some deliberate compromises (e.g. shared power supply) so that you're forced to move "up" to the monoblocks to get the full implementation of their design. I'm afraid to say, that is probably why on the whole monoblocks are better because commercially you'd be shooting yourself in the foot to make your stereo amp as good as the more expensive to produce monoblocks.... sad but likely true. Go DIY to solve that problem!
Audio Advent
13-04-2015, 14:47
I guess you could look at some pre-amps to make the point too: top of the line Gryphon pre-amps (maybe only ones from 80s/90s) are some I can think of which are completely monoblocked with seperate power inlets to each channel. Yet they are connected by a single face plate... and are never refered to as monoblocks, only as "dual-mono". It's semantics and psychological. It's the internal design which matters.
Ali Tait
13-04-2015, 14:47
Yep definitely. They can't make their cheaper gear sound too good, or nobody would move up the range..
Audio Advent
13-04-2015, 15:01
When taking that into account, then it brings us full circle to the answer..
The advantage of commercial monoblocks is that they are deliberately designed better than their stereo offerings (but there should be no difference outside of commercial designs).
If you're boxswapping though, it's better to simply try different amps of all kinds than pay too much to get the desirable monoblock version of something.
I have a dual mono amp, so the "separation" and "power supply" advantages of dual mono with the space saving benefit of a stereo amp.
Monoblocks can look cool though. Am not convinced that I would be able to tell any sonic difference if I split my amp into two boxes.
Haselsh1
13-04-2015, 16:02
Both of my Rotel RB850 power amplifiers have dual power supplies and are totally dual mono in construction but they still sound a helluva lot better as bridged monoblocks. The stereo is massive and the depth is stunning as mono's.
Floyddroid
13-04-2015, 16:57
Mmmm, very deep!
With monoblocks? Not if the monoblocks are smaller and less powerful than the stereo amp you're comparing it with! Comparing like with like they'd be the same else you won't be comparing like with like..
Also, with Class D amps like the Ncore mentioned above, heat and weight and case size no longer come into it at all. With class A or any other hot, high-powered amp, the question is only one of practicallity.
Personally I do think there is a bit of a marketing at work with new, commercial monoblocks - you can get people to pay a lot more for the priveledge of two cases and the perception of getting more than if you built the exact same thing within a single case. But what they'll do in reality is make sure the stereo version has some deliberate compromises (e.g. shared power supply) so that you're forced to move "up" to the monoblocks to get the full implementation of their design. I'm afraid to say, that is probably why on the whole monoblocks are better because commercially you'd be shooting yourself in the foot to make your stereo amp as good as the more expensive to produce monoblocks.... sad but likely true. Go DIY to solve that problem!
Audio Advent
13-04-2015, 18:41
Mmmm, very deep!
haha... :lol: A generalisation of course too.
Audio Advent
13-04-2015, 18:44
Both of my Rotel RB850 power amplifiers have dual power supplies and are totally dual mono in construction but they still sound a helluva lot better as bridged monoblocks. The stereo is massive and the depth is stunning as mono's.
Is that more of a question of what higher power does and what bridging does? There are a couple at least ways of bridging, one which gives you also a kind of semi-balanced operation with floating earth and so may bring with it lower noise. Not sure I know what I'm talking about there for sure...
hifinutt
13-04-2015, 18:48
Would I be correct in thinking you also have more controlled power on tap!
maybe but I am quite happy with 200 watts of class A from my stereo amp . plenty enough I think
Haselsh1
13-04-2015, 19:27
Is that more of a question of what higher power does and what bridging does? There are a couple at least ways of bridging, one which gives you also a kind of semi-balanced operation with floating earth and so may bring with it lower noise. Not sure I know what I'm talking about there for sure...
Yeah, to be truly honest, I'm not really sure. There are of course two variables here in my case and it could be either of them. By bridging I am tripling the output of each amplifier turning it from 50 Watts to 150 Watts and also going from two stereo amps to two mono amps. Also of course, as bridged amplifiers they are less capable of driving difficult loudspeakers. Mmmm... not too sure anymore :scratch:
Audio Advent
14-04-2015, 14:03
Yeah, to be truly honest, I'm not really sure. There are of course two variables here in my case and it could be either of them. By bridging I am tripling the output of each amplifier turning it from 50 Watts to 150 Watts and also going from two stereo amps to two mono amps. Also of course, as bridged amplifiers they are less capable of driving difficult loudspeakers. Mmmm... not too sure anymore :scratch:
Is it tripling the power? Or is that power stated is now into a different load so is a different spec?
Power ratings are a slight mystery to me (max possible power from an amp is max possible power from an amp, whatever the load surely? ) But I guess standards for stating amp power are not about the maximum but the max for each static load? Seeing as the load varies in a speaker, it seems a bit daft. Would be better to state max possible power and at which load that occurs, much like a car's engine e.g. 150bhp@ 5400rpm - that might help people pick the right amp for the right speaker.
Anyway, that's off topic I guess.
Clive197
14-04-2015, 18:33
.............Would be better to state max possible power and at which load that occurs, much like a car's engine e.g. 150bhp@ 5400rpm - that might help people pick the right amp for the right speaker.
That is how amps are specced. i.e. 100watts into 8Ohms/200watts into 4Ohms with 0.05 THD. (example only)
Audio Advent
15-04-2015, 21:23
That is how amps are specced. i.e. 100watts into 8Ohms/200watts into 4Ohms with 0.05 THD. (example only)
That's slightly different because it states the max power at specified loads.
What I mean is to state max power total and where that happens, so say 650Watts @ 2.3ohms. Actually, that's just as meaningless as the other - you need the whole graph and the impedance graph of your speaker.
I guess what is slightly confusing me is how suddenly the amp can deliver more energy per second through it's power supply at low loads, seemingly endlessly up to it's breaking point. Does that mean amps get more efficient the lower the load?
What I'm expecting in my mind is to see voltage swing and current to be one thing at 4ohms and current and voltage swing to be different at 2 ohms (more current, less voltage swing) whilst the energy supplied per second (power) remains the same. But as you've pointed out with the common figures of power increasing with lower load, that's not the case...
And that's why I don't understand amp power too much, nor electronics!
Clive197
17-04-2015, 20:54
Does that mean amps get more efficient the lower the load?
YES..................Until they blow up because there is little to no resistance.
Audio Advent
17-04-2015, 23:15
Ok, well that was holding back my understanding! Thanks.
walpurgis
17-04-2015, 23:22
Some opinion has it that high sensitivity and high impedance speakers, not only give the amplifier and easier time, but tend to sound rather good too. That seems to reflect my experience too. That's not to say low impedance speakers or those with low sensitivity can't be good, but I've had some lovely sounds out of vintage high impedance speakers, which tend to have high efficiency.
Clive197
18-04-2015, 10:31
If I recall correctly there were speakers in the fifties and sixties which had 15Ohm impedance and high sensitivity. Sounded very good back in the day. Many valve amps had speaker taps specifically for them.
Audio Advent
18-04-2015, 13:32
And 70s and 80s via the LS3/5a at least (then went 11ohm)
walpurgis
18-04-2015, 15:22
And 70s and 80s via the LS3/5a at least (then went 11ohm)
Er, was that a high sensitivity speaker? :D
Audio Advent
18-04-2015, 16:57
I don't know, you'd have to check the specs.
walpurgis
18-04-2015, 17:00
I don't know, you'd have to check the specs.
Without looking. I'd guess somewhere around 83db sensitivity. About the same as the Celestion SL6/SL600. In other words, notoriously low. :)
Haselsh1
19-04-2015, 17:11
Not sure it is relevent here but I remember way back when listening to a pair of Audio Note ANE's with a big tranny amp and the sound was bloody effortless. Huge breathy vocals and some nice gut wrenching bass power. Of course a nice gut wrenching price too.
Drenalin
30-04-2015, 01:49
Hi all.
I think that one also have to take in speaker effiency to account when comparing.....
Mening that i hear a bigger difference with a harder load than with say speakers of + 95db
I have just made this test with audio research M300 monoblock compaired to Audio Research D 250 mk2
And ofcourse theres a difference in power, but i realy felt that the step upwards was quite a jump.
More clarity and a little more space around instruments.
But if i haven't compaired the 2 (3) of them i could had live'd happily ever after with the 250.
René
337alant
30-04-2015, 06:06
Mono Blocks add a 3rd dimension to the sound IMO and some subtleties of weight and detail that I like.
That said A good stereo amp is still very good indeed and only marginally different.
You can also get poorly designed mono blocks that would sound inferior to a good stereo amp :rolleyes:
Alan
I have had my mono blocks for a few weeks now "sublime"
Never go back to single stereo amp now
A lot more of everything
The advantage of using monoblock power amplifiers is three-fold:
(1) improved stereo separation since each amplifier has its own power supply,
(2) the ability to locate each monoblock as close to the speaker as possible, thereby maximising the damping factor of the amp/speaker, by minimising the length of the speaker cable,
(3) moving any hum-inducing heavy power supplies away from sensitive circuitry of sources, such as pick-ups.
I use a pair of Mark Levinson ML-2 Class A monoblocks, situated directly behind the speakers and connected to them with less than 30cm of cable. The amplifiers are connected to the preamplifier using 12m lengths of balanced-line XLR cables. As a backup, I shall soon be acquiring a pair of Quad 510 monoblocks with balanced line inputs.
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