Advice on cheap streaming device outputting USB to DAC with USB input?

[montesquieu]

I never quite got along with the various incarnations of Squeezebox but I am finding myself in need of something that does more or less what the SB used to do before the plug got pulled by Logitech:


Streaming audio (for my purposes, nothing more than 192/24 is required and 96/24 is probably fine) from hard disk, usual file formats required - MP3, AIFF, FLAC are the main ones I think
In order of preference, USB, AES/EBU XLR or SPIDIF coax output ie digital output to my DAC
Able to be used with a NAS containing the media, and controllable by an iphone or iPad app as well as from my Macbook Pro even though the data won't be resident on any of these
If possible, able to be used with different databases as there are some specialist classical ones that handle metadata far better than the Gracenote rubbish used (for example) by iTunes.
If possible, able to stream radio (I'm really only interested in R3 & R4) though that's not really essential.



I have been following the Raspberry Pi thread but it seems to have gone off in the wrong direction for me, I'm looking for something essentially plug & play, and I have no interest in an inbuilt DAC, or in buggering around with settings, command lines etc (though as it happens I do have a Unix administrators certificate from the Dark Ages in a drawer somewhere). I owned both a SB3 and SBT and never really warmed to either.

Is there anything out there that will do the trick? Most of the digital files I have are historic recordings (78s and the like) either downloaded or digitised myself, or Amazon AutoRip files. I won't be mass-ripping 3000 CDs, so this will be a small adjunct to the main system (I listen 75% to vinyl anyway).

Any thoughts from the forum's experts? I think I may have asked this question a year ago and there wasn't anything to fit the bill IIRC.

[NRG]

Tom, don't dismiss the RPi too quickly, if you go with the Volumio image there is very little to do to get it pulling files from a NAS and out into your DAC of choice. There are a couple of SPDIF output board available with coax and Toslink connectors IE HiFiBerry or you could simply use USB as I'm currently doing. MartinT over on theaudiostandard.net BB has a very good thread running detailing the setup and use of Volumio with a HiFiBerry board....maybe worth a look...

Or if not maybe a Pioneer N30 or N50 may fit the bill but they are a bit more expensive But do come with an IOS or Android app....

[Marco]

Hope you find what you're looking for, Tom. However, just to address these points, in reference to the RPi:


I have no interest in an inbuilt DAC, or in buggering around with settings, command lines etc...

If you use the Hi-Fi Berry Digi+ output board (with the Raspberry Pi), you can connect your AudioNote DAC to it. No need whatsoever to use an inbuilt DAC! ;)

See here: https://www.hifiberry.com/digiplus

I suspect that the resultant sound (with your AN DAC) would be fab... Also, "buggering around with settings", if you're referring to what I've been doing recently with Alsamixer, is piss-easy to do and takes seconds - and once "buggered around with", and set, doesn't need to be buggered around with again.

By all means try to find another solution, if that's what you want, but IMO, and with respect, your dismissing of the RPi (especially as you don't have to use an inbuilt DAC with it) is rather hasty and ill-judged.

Marco.

[Rothchild]

I'm a big fan of either www.madsonic.org or www.subsonic.org

It's a good media player, supports a whole host of files, will stream at native resolution but is also capable of transcoding to smaller formats (in real time) for streaming over the internet etc controllable by phone/tablet, works on a Raspberry pi but if you don't want to faff about you could get a windows based 'net-top' type computer and run it on that, it's indifferent about where the files are as long as it has a path to them, does radio and podcasts and supports video too (if that floats your boat).

[montesquieu]

Hope you find what you're looking for, Tom. However, just to address these points, in reference to the RPi:



If you use the Hi-Fi Berry Digi+ output board (with the Raspberry Pi), you can connect your AudioNote DAC to it. No need whatsoever to use an inbuilt DAC! ;)

See here: https://www.hifiberry.com/digiplus

I suspect that the resultant sound (with your AN DAC) would be fab... Also, "buggering around with settings", if you're referring to what I've been doing recently with Alsamixer, is piss-easy to do and takes seconds - and once "buggered around with", and set, doesn't need to be buggered around with again.

By all means try to find another solution, if that's what you want, but IMO, and with respect, your dismissing of the RPi (especially as you don't have to use an inbuilt DAC with it) is rather hasty and ill-judged.

Marco.


Interesting ... I didn't really pick that up from the thread at all. I'll have a look at it again, TBH I find a lot of this a bit brain-hurty.


I'm a big fan of either www.madsonic.org or www.subsonic.org

It's a good media player, supports a whole host of files, will stream at native resolution but is also capable of transcoding to smaller formats (in real time) for streaming over the internet etc controllable by phone/tablet, works on a Raspberry pi but if you don't want to faff about you could get a windows based 'net-top' type computer and run it on that, it's indifferent about where the files are as long as it has a path to them, does radio and podcasts and supports video too (if that floats your boat).

Thanks I'll look at this as well. I had though of getting a MacMini for this as I'm a 30-year Apple guy (got my first MacPlus in 1985, and even worked for them for a while in the 90s - in the dark days after they fired Steve Jobs and before they hired him back) but it all seemed overkill for what I want which is essentially a simple thing really (or ought to be).

[Marco]

Interesting ... I didn't really pick that up from the thread at all. I'll have a look at it again, TBH I find a lot of this a bit brain-hurty.


No worries. I know exactly what you mean, as it was the same for me, before I was introduced to the RPi.

I just think, Tom, as an Mac user too, the combination of an RPi/Hi-Fi Berry (with Volumio), in conjunction with your AN DAC, and a USB drive or NAS, would provide you with exactly what you're looking for, and most likely sound better than any other available streaming device option.

There are also enough RPi users on AoS (and elsewhere) to provide you with all the help you need in setting it up - and once done, trust me, you won't regret the effort made putting it together! :trust:

Marco.

[Stratmangler]

I never quite got along with the various incarnations of Squeezebox

Why?


but I am finding myself in need of something that does more or less what the SB used to do before the plug got pulled by Logitech:

Irony strikes again! :eyebrows:

[montesquieu]

Why?


Irony strikes again! :eyebrows:

Didn't like the interface, didn't like Squeezeserver, didn't like the fact that it isn't very sensitive to wifi signals and regularly crapped out on me.

That enough?

[Stratmangler]

If I were to approach the streaming thing afresh then I'd probably go down the RasPi/Volumio route.
You'd have a device capable of pulling data off the NAS, and you'd also have the capability of driving it from a number of devices such as your computer (using the WebGUI via your web browser), or an iPhone/Android phone or an iPad/Android Tablet.

I have been looking at the possibility of using a RasPi as a Squeezebox player (I run a couple of Squeezebox Touch players on my network), but I will also look at using Volumio when I get around to doing something.
For me the ability to easily integrate with LMS is of greater importance - I've run Squeezeboxes for a very long time, and I have always been very happy accessing LMS from my web browser and Smartphone. My son can also access LMS from his Hudl (it's an Android device).

One thing that does intrigue me is the easy access to an I2S connection from the RasPi - my DAC has an I2S interface on it, and a RasPi with a little bit of cobbling together might well be the easiest method of playing with it.
I'd need to shop around for a connector from the Pi to interface with a RJ45 socket and then use a short patch cable between the 2 devices :)

[Stratmangler]

Didn't like the interface, didn't like Squeezeserver, didn't like the fact that it isn't very sensitive to wifi signals and regularly crapped out on me.

That enough?

If you didn't like the interface then that's fair enough.
The wifi thing has sod all to do with Squeezeserver, and everything to do with network issues at your end.

[NRG]

If I were to approach the streaming thing afresh then I'd probably go down the RasPi/Volumio route.
You'd have a device capable of pulling data off the NAS, and you'd also have the capability of driving it from a number of devices such as your computer (using the WebGUI via your web browser), or an iPhone/Android phone or an iPad/Android Tablet.

I have been looking at the possibility of using a RasPi as a Squeezebox player (I run a couple of Squeezebox Touch players on my network), but I will also look at using Volumio when I get around to doing something.
For me the ability to easily integrate with LMS is of greater importance - I've run Squeezeboxes for a very long time, and I have always been very happy accessing LMS from my web browser and Smartphone. My son can also access LMS from his Hudl (it's an Android device).

One thing that does intrigue me is the easy access to an I2S connection from the RasPi - my DAC has an I2S interface on it, and a RasPi with a little bit of cobbling together might well be the easiest method of playing with it.
I'd need to shop around for a connector from the Pi to interface with a RJ45 socket and then use a short patch cable between the 2 devices :)

I have one word to say to you Chris....SqueezeLite..... :D

[Gazjam]

Cant fault the squeezebox sound quality either, very impressed with mine after a number of years away.

[Gazjam]

I have one word to say to you Chris....SqueezeLite..... :D

+1

Couple of useful SqueezeLite links.
http://www.gerrelt.nl/RaspberryPi/wordpress/tutorial-installing-squeezelite-player-on-raspbian/
http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?97046-Announce-Squeezelite-a-small-headless-squeezeplay-emulator-for-linux-%28alsa-only%29

[montesquieu]

Aaaargh brain hurts already!!

[Marco]

Forget all this Squeezbox pish, Tom. Go Pi! :trust:

Marco.

[montesquieu]

The wifi thing has sod all to do with Squeezeserver, and everything to do with network issues at your end.

Not really. In the same rooms in two different houses, where my my iPhone, iPad and Macbook had no problems, the SB3 and SBT both struggled to keep signal. Tried the usual changing channel etc, no success.

[RichB]

Not really. In the same rooms in two different houses, where my my iPhone, iPad and Macbook had no problems, the SB3 and SBT both struggled to keep signal. Tried the usual changing channel etc, no success.

Hi Tom, as you might recall I'm now the current owner of your old SBT... I also find it craps out over WiFi when accessing LMS or the clunky squeezebox app. However I primarily use it as an internet radio to access Radio Paradise (naim 320k) and other hq radio stations. For this it's flawless and never misses a beat which is why I've kept hold of it as I play internet radio all day whenever I'm home.

Like you I don't get on with LMS and the various control apps so when it comes to wanting to play my own files I just lash the laptop to the USB dac and it's much easier. I'm still considering the Rpi route myself but until I know it's rock solid on Wi-Fi then I'm hesitant.

I also have a chromecast which gets used a lot for streaming files I've backed up to Google music and YouTube, the lack of Spotify support holds it back but there are ways around that. Another route would be to use your tablet device if it's Android lollipop or higher with a USB dac. This functionality finally came to Android with the last os update. You just need a USB OTG dongle (cheap) and off you go!:)

[RichB]

Forget all this Squeezbox pish, Tom. Go Pi! :trust:

Marco.

I'd like to compare it with a decent tablet and USB dac which seems more versatile.

[Stratmangler]

I'm intrigued by this poor performance over WiFi thing, especially with regard to LMS.
I run 2 SBTs, one wired and one wireless, and they're pretty well rock solid and dependable.
I've had just one incident where the wireless player wouldn't appear on network, and a hard reboot (power off & on) sorted it out.

LMS in my case is run on a Zyxel NSA310, and that is permanently connected via a wired connection.
If you look on the Squeezebox Wiki (http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.php/Beginners_Guide_To_Servers) you can see that they recommend having the device running LMS physically connected and always have done.

[User211]

I had a Squeezebox many years ago. Absolute POS at the time - buggy PC s/w to blame I think.

At the moment I have a Toshiba 1TB portable drive just plugged into my ASUS router in the lounge via my main PC (which is plugged into the telly). Super simple it is Wi-Fi network accessible as a result. It is also nice looking, super portable (easily fits in your jean's). No NAS drive required there.

Downstairs in the listening room I have a laptop. This runs JRiver (amazing compared to Raspberry resident s/w I suspect) and TIDAL.

I use USB async out directly to my Lampizator B7's Amanero USB card via a 5m lead. The PC uses this async driver: http://www.asio4all.com/.

That setup works very well indeed. If your AN 4.1 had async USB added as opposed to an early USB implementation I suggest you try and use the USB input. USB to SPDIF conversion I have had synching issues with.

There's very little wanking around with that setup and you could easily replace the laptop with an Apple effort if you like.

Don't underestimate JRiver. It is freakin' awesome I think for the money. You won't believe what you can do once you start delving into it. Or if you don't do that it is very simple to use as is.

[RichB]

I'm intrigued by this poor performance over WiFi thing, especially with regard to LMS.
I run 2 SBTs, one wired and one wireless, and they're pretty well rock solid and dependable.
I've had just one incident where the wireless player wouldn't appear on network, and a hard reboot (power off & on) sorted it out.

LMS in my case is run on a Zyxel NSA310, and that is permanently connected via a wired connection.
If you look on the Squeezebox Wiki (http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.php/Beginners_Guide_To_Servers) you can see that they recommend having the device running LMS physically connected and always have done.

That might be the issue, my files would reside in a PC in the other room wirelessly connected. It wouldn't explain why it does it with the Spotify app though. The touch would just hang then reboot itself. As such its faily clunky in use, however as an internet radio it is wonderful.

[User211]

Bit more info - all CDs are ripped to the laptop in FLAC format using JRiver.

All ripped CDs shared in a public drive on the laptop over the network - or from the Toshiba 1TB drive plugged into the router. The laptop backs up over Wi-Fi to the Toshiba drive, which all Wi-Fi enabled components can access too including my phone.

I'd rather not have a cable running from the laptop to the Lampi though. I'm looking for something to sort that out. A2DP to async USB would be cool and madly a PI maybe a solution for that. I might buy one just to see what can be done there, but I suspect getting it going and working well/reliably will be a problem.

Radio is simple just something like http://tunein.com/

[Stratmangler]

That might be the issue, my files would reside in a PC in the other room wirelessly connected. It wouldn't explain why it does it with the Spotify app though. The touch would just hang then reboot itself. As such its faily clunky in use, however as an internet radio it is wonderful.

My Spotify account is currently a free one, so it doesn't work with the SBTs at all.
Occasionally (when there's a load of new music around that I'd like to check out) I'll make the account a Premium one, and I've had no access issues. I will add that I use the Triode plugin, and I disable the built in plugin.

I tend to access the SBT players from a web browser on any of the computers on the network more than any other way, and I don't find that accessing the music I want to listen to clunky at all.
I'd hate to access Spotify via the touch screen on the SBT - too many slow responding menus :eyebrows:

I have tended to avoid the Logitech online server on www.mysqueezebox.com as it has historically been quite unreliable, but ironically enough it proved to be the saviour with the BBC's cavalier approach to rationalising their streaming services (aka the "fuck 'em all, let's just cut it off with no public notice" scenario), and for a while it was the only way I could access the live broadcasts.
I have since reverted to using Triode's iPlayer plugin now that it has been fixed for now. The BBC will fuck it all up again - it's only a matter of time, but for the moment it's all working again.

[Magna Audio]

Might not be relevant but, If you have I2S input to dac then consider WaveIO.
Very, very good SQ from laptop usb out and into your dac.
Some diy needed though as its just a board.
For front end, JRiver upsampled to 96khz is as good as any other player I've tried, including the hair shirt ones:)
Jriver interface is great. Control by Phone or pad, remote playback too if needed.

[slate]

A bit late to the party...

I am still a happy squezzebox user at home and at Work.
At Work I feed an old Caiman DAC directly from Squeezebox server+localplayer via USB.

At home I have played around with a Raspberry B with picoreplayer, Again feeding a Caiman via USB. Worked fine, but if needed I would likely go for a addon board with optical.. but so far my Touch and Receivers are still going strong.

https://sites.google.com/site/picoreplayer/home
http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?97803-piCoPlayer-Squeezelite-on-Microcore-linux-An-embedded-OS-in-RAM-with-Squeezelite