New CD player or a new lead?

[Bonky]

I have 'upgrade-itis', and was wondering about upgrading the CD player (a Linn Mimik v2). It works perfectly but surely technology has moved on since 1995 (?). It does however have a BNC output and as I have the latest Beresford DAC I was wondering whether a BNC to usb lead would improve SQ. (Both RCA inputs on the DAC are already used).

Has anyone done this, and, if, so wonder whether it has indeed increased SQ?


The BNC to USB cable is proving a nightmare to research. Those I've 'googled' seem more appropriate for video recordings. The 'plain' ones seem only to be mono.

Can anyone point me in the right direction please to buy such a lead?

Many thanks,

Richard.

[roob]

Is there any such thing as a bnc to usb lead for audio use?
I doubt it very much.

[Bonky]

Is there any such thing as a bnc to usb lead for audio use?
I doubt it very much.

See: http://www.ambery.com/cobncsautous.html

would this suit?

Thanks,
Richard

[agk]

I can't comment on the quality but I'd be looking at something like this.
http://TeraLink X2 USB Spdif Audio Converter BNC Support 24Bit 96K With U9 Power Supply https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00KFARRB0/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_7W9hvb1A3Y3EV

[StanleyB]

I have 'upgrade-itis', and was wondering about upgrading the CD player (a Linn Mimik v2). It works perfectly but surely technology has moved on since 1995 (?).
I would seriously consider trying the Linn CDP with a Caiman MKII with Super Firmware for comparison. PM me if you would like too borrow my own personal CII to give it a try. I know where you live so I am not worried that you might run away with it :D.

[DSJR]

The Mimik should make for an excellent transport, but the sonics of the complete player can easily be bettered these days IMO. Hope Stan can get you properly sorted :)

[Darren]

There are those who will tell you cd players/dacs all sound the same or very similar. How interesting for you to be able to try new vs two decades old. How far have we really come?
Looking forwards to your report.

[StanleyB]

How interesting for you to be able to try new vs two decades old. How far have we really come?
Looking forwards to your report.
We have come a long way. In another thread I mentioned how I still use some original audio discs that were amongst the first to be released when CD players first appeared in the shops. I am always impressed by the amount of extra data that shows up in these old discs when played by more up to date D to A processing.
I rate the old Linn and Naim CDP, along with the Philips CD8xx/9xx and Marantz CD94, as some of the best transports money can buy. Mate them with a more modern day DAC and these old players really show how far ahead their mechanism is compared to the rest.

[struth]

A good oldie is often better than a dear newie :eyebrows:

[Darren]

We have come a long way.

I'm glad to hear that Stanley. Hope Richard confirms your view when he come back to us.

[StanleyB]

I'm glad to hear that Stanley. Hope Richard confirms your view when he come back to us.
Many have confirmed that over the years so one more won't make a difference. Certain types of CD players are highly sought after on eBay for use as a transport since DAC owners with a decent CD collection discovered the connection.

[Desmo]

Didn't the OP say he already has Stan's latest DAC - presumably a Caiman II. The problem he has is that he does not have a spare input on the DAC in order to connect his CD player, hence the need for a 'special' lead.....

[DSJR]

There are those who will tell you cd players/dacs all sound the same or very similar. How interesting for you to be able to try new vs two decades old. How far have we really come?
Looking forwards to your report.

Darren, there's one certified objectivist who argues the toss over amp sonic differences, totally dismisses cable differences if they're within certain parameters, yet apparently got in a twist recently because he could hear differences in DAC's :rolleyes:

The Mimik was designed to reproduce the 'architecture' of a recorded mix which it did very well indeed, but tonally, I always found it a little grainy and dirty, something I also heard on the Wakonda and LK100, as well as the earliest Klout amps. Simple modern DAC chipsets offer less for amateur designers to get wrong, the main benefits seemingly more in power supplies rather than custom output stages I think (I'm stunned how a power supply can influence a low voltage and low consumption set of IC's!).

[StanleyB]

Simple modern DAC chipsets offer less for amateur designers to get wrong, the main benefits seemingly more in power supplies rather than custom output stages I think (I'm stunned how a power supply can influence a low voltage and low consumption set of IC's!).
I don't know what you call simple modern DAC chips. Some of these chips have in excess of 100 pins to contend with. And DIY forums such as diyaudio have done a lot to attract people interested in designing their own equipment and get help with complicated stuff.
Power supplies have always had an influence on integrated circuits, but it wasn't given much attention after the three pins regulators started appearing in many circuits. Many designers considered the issue to have been put to bed once those 78xx and 79xx regulators showed up. But 50mV ripple might have been a major technical breakthrough three decades ago. The satellite industry has now given us regulators with less than 1uV of ripple and noise. This has opened up a new area of audio research and experimentation.

[Bonky]

Demo wrote:
"Didn't the OP say he already has Stan's latest DAC - presumably a Caiman II. The problem he has is that he does not have a spare input on the DAC in order to connect his CD player, hence the need for a 'special' lead....."

Yes Desmo, that's exactly it. I'll PM Stan soon to see if he can offer any further advice.

This link (http://TeraLink X2 USB Spdif Audio C..._7W9hvb1A3Y3EV) from AGK (thanks)) didn't open for me.

Richard
(just bought a 2nd hand Rega Brio-R for my second system)

[orbscure]

Try this link Richard :)

http://www.amazon.co.uk/TeraLink-Spdif-Converter-Support-Supply/dp/B00KFARRB0

[Bonky]

Thanks Pete, yes that works...but wow...I wasn't expecting it to be so expensive.

I should have mentioned earlier that I emailed Linn to ask them for their advice - but they don't open again until April the 9th.

BW

Richard.

[Darren]

Thanks Pete, yes that works...but wow...I wasn't expecting it to be so expensive.

I should have mentioned earlier that I emailed Linn to ask them for their advice - but they don't open again until April the 9th.

BW

Richard.

Before you spend a penny Richard why don't you have a bit of a temporary swap round and connect your Linn to the Beresford DAC via a simple coaxial lead and see how they sound together? If its a big improvement you might well feel like investing the money required to connect them in the way you want. In lots of ways it doesn't matter what Linn or anyone here think - only your ears can judge performance and value in your system.

[Bonky]

Before you spend a penny Richard why don't you have a bit of a temporary swap round and connect your Linn to the Beresford DAC via a simple coaxial lead and see how they sound together? If its a big improvement you might well feel like investing the money required to connect them in the way you want. In lots of ways it doesn't matter what Linn or anyone here think - only your ears can judge performance and value in your system.

Thanks Darren, I did this some time ago but of course I was connecting the output from the DAC inside the Linn to the Beresford. What I'd like to do is to by-pass the Linn DAC and serve the external DAC with a raw signal from the Linn CD player.

Thanks,

Richard

Btw ...quite impressed with the new Rega Brio-r in my secondary system.

[Darren]

Thanks Darren, I do this some time ago but of course I was connecting the output from the DAC inside the Linn to the Beresford. What I'd like to do is to by-pass the Linn DAC and serve the external DAC with a raw signal from the Linn CD player.

Thanks,

Richard

Btw ...quite impressed with the new Rega Brio-r in my secondary system.
Ummm...... i dont think you have this right richard or im misunderstanding you. If you use the coax digital out this doesnt go via the Linns dac because if it did it wouldnt be a digital signal anymore.

[StanleyB]

Thanks Darren, I do this some time ago but of course I was connecting the output from the DAC inside the Linn to the Beresford.
Can you put a pic up of the lead that you are currently using to connect the LINN to The external DAC? I think that would answer quite a few questions for me.

[mikmas]

The BNC to USB cable is proving a nightmare to research. Those I've 'googled' seem more appropriate for video recordings.

A BNC to coax adapter and then something like this:
http://www.adventuresinhifiaudio.com/28/04/2014/the-m2tech-hiface-two-usb-to-coax-converter-its-all-in-the-flavour/

[Bonky]

Many thanks for all the replies so far.

There's a little confusion here and there, for which I take full responsibility, so here goes at attempting to explain myself more fully:

The Linn CD player has an old inbuilt DAC which I wanted to bypass using the BNC socket at the rear. The sockets on the back of the CD player can be seen on Page 6 of the manual (http://linfo.linn.co.uk/binaries/769AE6D2-11EA-11D4-8DFF009027D395C0/mimik_user_manual.pdf).

At present, the CD player is connected to the amp using, unsurprisingly, RCA phono plugs/leads.

I have a Caiman 2 (unmodified with any further firmware updates as I believe these may compromise the Apple Airport Express which is connected to the Caiman).

I was searching for a lead that would allow me to connect the Linn via its BNC socket to the Caiman. I am/was taken aback at a) the absence of suitable leads and, b) the expense (I naively didn't know there was so much electronic jiggery-pokery in the connectors). I note that on P7 of the aforementioned Linn manual that the local Linn dealer should be able to supply such a lead - but that was back in 1995+.

The digital coax socket on the Caiman is in use but of course could be used for the purposes outlined above. The USB socket is unused at present. So, very broadly, does anyone know of an easy and relatively inexpensive way to connect a BNC plug/socket to a Caiman2?

Thanks.

Richard
.

[StanleyB]

The digital coax socket on the Caiman is in use but of course could be used for the purposes outlined above. The USB socket is unused at present. So, very broadly, does anyone know of an easy and relatively inexpensive way to connect a BNC plug/socket to a Caiman2?

.

You need one of these: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1M-Metre-Short-BNC-To-RCA-Phono-Video-CCTV-Coax-Cable-Lead-Plug-Adapter-Camera-/400778366660?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item5d50408ec4
You connect the phono end into the coax socket on the Caiman.

[Bonky]

You need one of these: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1M-Metre-Short-BNC-To-RCA-Phono-Video-CCTV-Coax-Cable-Lead-Plug-Adapter-Camera-/400778366660?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item5d50408ec4
You connect the phono end into the coax socket on the Caiman.

Thanks again Stan,

Excuse my ignorance ...but this will pass a stereo sound signal won't it? (i.e. it's not just mono?)

BW

Richard.

[struth]

www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TeraLink-X2-USB-Spdif-Audio-Converter-BNC-Support-24Bit-96K-Hz-ASIO-AC3-RCA-/271650733671?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item3f3fa53e67

[Bonky]

Thanks Grant.

I may give Stan's suggestion a go first as it's so much cheaper. If for any reason it doesn't then I'll certainly consider your box of tricks. However, at the back of my mind is the feeling that I could be better off plumping for another CD player with a digital output.

A CD player just for use as a transport mechanism could be the start of another thread... But I believe others have been there before me.

Thanks again,

Richard

[StanleyB]

From the Linn manual that you linked to:

CONNECTING TO A DtoA CONVERTOR
The Digital to Analogue convertor in the MIMIK gives very high sound quality, so to upgrade
your MIMIK requires an even better external DAC such as the Linn NUMERIK. Be sure to audition any upgrade to your system. To connect an external DAC use a BNC lead from the MIMIK ELECTRICAL DATA
OUTPUT to the DAC input. If necessary, use a BNC/phono adaptor at the DAC. Your Linn retailer will supply you with the correct lead.

[Bonky]

Thanks Stan.
I've ordered one.
BW
Richard.

[MikeMusic]

You can't go wrong with a mains upgrade
Great VFM
Even a simple unswitched socket or bank of them.
Call a sparky to check the earth maybe go for a separate feed

There forever for all the kit

[Bonky]

The story so far:

I have a Linn Mimik2 cd player with a BNC output. I wanted to by-pass the Linn’s DAC and use a Caiman2 DAC instead. AoS members, as usual, have been very helpful and have prompted me in the right direction for a suitable lead, which I bought. (I later found I had one in an old cupboard!).

So this is my report:

The waters are somewhat muddied by:
I replaced the wall socket with a MK unswitched one (The 2 neutral wires were loose in the old socket), and I cleaned all the prongs on the mains plugs.
I bought a 2nd hand Rega Brio-R so was keen to see if the SQ was better/different cf my Sugden A21A amp.
I should also add that Stan’s firmware upgrade came this morning so yet another variable into the mix!

Using the Sugden: At first I could detect no difference between the normal CD output (via the Linn DAC) and Stan’s. This says, I believe, a lot for the oldish (1995) design of the Mimik2.
Slowly and gradually I could hear that female vocals were more open and less sibilant. Violin strings too showed a small improvement. I could detect no differences in the bass. Surprisingly, when I used the Rega amp I could detect NO difference at all between the two sources. Make of that what you will… I repeated the experiment this morning (no alcohol) and came to exactly the same conclusions.

I must tell a tale against myself here… I plugged in Stan’s new RiSC chip and sat back and listened…yep…it was all that people had said… better, more affirmative bass, less of a veil etc etc. It was after 20 mins or so that I realised that the sound wasn’t going through the Caiman2 at all but from the Linn to the Rega! What I was hearing was the wishful thinking/others’ reports/placebo effect.

When I did sort myself out , as I said above, I could not discern any differences between the CD output and the BNC to the Caiman2 and then to the Rega.

So, back to the Sugden…
(Would Stan’s upgrade make an impact?)

Yes; Stan’s DAC was slightly more open and transparent; not ‘night-and-day’ by any manner of means, but an improvement.

Using high-def files streamed to the Squeezebox Touch I was able, again, to hear that Stan’s firmware upgrade made a difference - with better definition of instruments and vocals. (BTW I should add here that I’m 67 years old so my HF must be compromised somewhat).

Tonight’s experiments (my wife is away for the weekend), will involve comparing the phono inputs on the two amps. The one in the Sugden (both MM and MC) is not given the plaudits it deserves. (Patrick of Sugdens told me this(!)…and I agree.) However, this is outside the title of this thread so I will stop here.

I expected there to be significant differences in SQ between the two amps. I found this not to be so. Did I read somewhere that the Rega has some sort of quasi Class A output stage?

Thanks for anyone’s interest and help.
BW

Richard

[Darren]

I've never heard large differences between solid state amps in good condition or for that matter affordable dacs. So you are not alone. But value is very much in the eye and ear of the beholder.