View Full Version : Must Have Recordings
Born from the "what are you spinning right now" thread, can we identify those seminal albums that if you're "into" music & hi-fi you just *have* to own? wonder how many albums we could find, if any, that EVERYONE has got...
The one that started me thinking was Jeff Wayne's War of the Worlds - DanJennings suggested Dark Side of the Moon - good one, I've got it on vinyl, CD & SACD!
Any other suggestions?
It would be easier to mention artists/bands than specific lps, I'm pretty sure we've all got stuff by the likes of Van the Man, Dire Straits, The Eagles, Stones, Rammstien (wot no Rammstien?:lol:) and so on but I'll put my money on Ricky Lee Jones' eponymous first album, come on 'fess up:smoking:
The best 'Floyd on CD IMO are the Doug Sax remastered issues from the early nineties. The SACD DSOTM is godawful and muffled to me, only worth it for the surround re-mix if that floats yer boat...
One disc I've been listen to is Ozric Tentacles' Dove Records release of "Erpland." The later mastering got the absolute phase inverted and it sounds thin-toned and sucked out by comparison.
Two other oldies - the first Tracy Chapman album (good on vinyl too if you can get an original pressing from the US metalwork) and the 1976 recording from Joan Armatrading - I have a dire UK LP pressing, a superb Nimbus remaster on LP and of course the CD as well - guess which LP release sounds like the CD?
Joe Cocker - Sheffield Steel (if you get the right LP cut)
Robert Plant - Now and Zen (LP cut as above)
Fleetwood Mac - Tusk (needs a good system to truly shine - don't bother with Rumours, it's a cr@p recording unless it's been dealt with now)
Camel - Snow Goose remastered (all of Paschal Byrne's remastering is good IMO).
Voyage of the Acolyte (remastered) on CD - the LP and first CD issue sounded distorted and thin toned by comparison.
Rage Against The Machine CD - the one with a pic of the burning Monks on the back - incredibly angry performance and the recording lets the passion through.
Erikah Badu - Baduism - I once heard some huge Wilson Benesch speakers fart like crazy on the bass notes at the beginning of the first track. A great one for checking room acoustics and bass "tunefulness." Don't play on Linn Keilidh's or Linn's passive 5140's/Espeks ;)
More to come from the archives..
Beechwoods
21-08-2009, 17:53
Don't forget this thread as well!
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=42
Thanks for the heads up on that Nick, I think slightly different (enough to keep this one going, anyway!) in that I'm trying to identify the definitives, that we've all discovered - (perhaps the lowest common denominator?) - as opposed to the hidden gems we might not know about... Though that said, Dave (DSJR) has come up with some there I don't have or know...
Beechwoods
21-08-2009, 20:33
:) That other thread is for the 'lifetime loves' and this one's more dynamic - they compliment each other! Go for it chaps :)
Spectral Morn
21-08-2009, 20:56
Stanley Clarke-East River Drive
Saga-Behaviour
Pat Metheny-As Falls Wichita So Falls Wichita Falls.
Hawkwind-Warrior on The Edge Of Time.
Hawkwind-Quark Strangness and Charm.
Just a few to be starting with...
Regards D S D L
The best 'Floyd on CD IMO are the Doug Sax remastered issues from the early nineties. Maybe I'm missing a trick, but usually I run the proverbial mile from anything with the subtitle "Remastered" or "Digitally Remastered" - I don't want to hear an interpretation of the events so far removed from the energy & passion of the original even... discuss! ;)The SACD DSOTM is godawful and muffled to me, I've only listened to the SACD version a couple of times, and never A/B'd my vinyl or normal CD version... guess what I'll be doing sometime this weekend (hopefully!) only worth it for the surround re-mix if that floats yer boat... It doesn't! ;)
One disc I've been listen to is Ozric Tentacles' Dove Records release of "Erpland." The later mastering got the absolute phase inverted and it sounds thin-toned and sucked out by comparison. Sorry Dave, I don't know this album...
Two other oldies - the first Tracy Chapman album only got the cd - brilliant - played it Wednesday night, even better through the Caiman...(good on vinyl too if you can get an original pressing from the US metalwork) and the 1976 recording from Joan Armatrading - I have a dire UK LP pressing, a superb Nimbus remaster on LP and of course the CD as well - guess which LP release sounds like the CD? I've got the CD, but no basis for comparison... played this one post-Beresford, too
Joe Cocker - Sheffield Steel (if you get the right LP cut)
Robert Plant - Now and Zen (LP cut as above)
Fleetwood Mac - Tusk (needs a good system to truly shine - don't bother with Rumours, it's a cr@p recording unless it's been dealt with now)
Camel - Snow Goose remastered (all of Paschal Byrne's remastering is good IMO).
Voyage of the Acolyte (remastered) on CD - the LP and first CD issue sounded distorted and thin toned by comparison.
Rage Against The Machine CD - the one with a pic of the burning Monks on the back - incredibly angry performance and the recording lets the passion through.
Erikah Badu - Baduism - I once heard some huge Wilson Benesch speakers fart like crazy on the bass notes at the beginning of the first track. A great one for checking room acoustics and bass "tunefulness." Don't play on Linn Keilidh's or Linn's passive 5140's/Espeks ;)
*hangs head in shame* don't own any of those you mention - except Rumours! :doh::lol:
More to come from the archives..
Look forward to learning how much more of a Philestine I am! ;)
It would be easier to mention artists/bands than specific lps, I'm pretty sure we've all got stuff by the likes of Van the Man, of course!Dire Straits, Brothers in Arms on LP, CD, SACD - others on LP, some others CDThe Eagles, who wouldn't!Stones, Naturally! great SACD back catalogue too, if that's your bag Rammstien (wot no Rammstien?:lol:) WHO? seriously!and so on but I'll put my money on Ricky Lee Jones' eponymous first album, come on 'fess up:smoking:And it was all going so swimmingly to start with, wasn't it? :eyebrows:
Oh dear! :doh:
Remastering isn't a problem if it's done right.
Many discs in the early days were made from any old tape they could find in the vaults, transferred "flat" with often the built in upper mid and treble boost done for LP's and often listened to on B&W 801's..... the result could be thin, hard-toned and bright!
Today, not everyone has been given 801's free gratis to use and engineers worth their salt take trouble to get the best and earliest master generation they can. the current 20 bit plus editors aren't just chosen for sound quality, the extra "bits" allow editing and subtle eq to be done without harming the fidelity of the original signal. There still seems to be some varience from the glass master to the CD finished product, but I don't know enough about that side of things to make any comments. lifting levels in remastering is fine as long as the loudest bits aren't chopped off in level. many early masterings were done too low in level and lifting volume in the digital domain back then would have ruined the sound for sure - not today if the analogue original tapes are knackered and un-playable as many are now I understand after their one and only baking...
I appreciate that some "remastering" has been disastrous and I understand that the popular Amy Wino album has been released in at least three different versions, with different compression levels on each. the "Audio Archiving Company" has done some great work for the likes of Steve hillage, Camel and ELP and the chap who engineered and subsequently re-mastered Tubular Bells - Simon Heyworth, has transformed this old recording, along with many others done for Virgin Records (the Tangerine Dream and Gong's Virgin catalogue I believe)
I forgot another old demo classic - Simply Red, itself inaudibly remastered some years ago.
Ricky Lee Jones with her block busted blond which he loved free parts and labour but she broke down and died and threw all the rods he gave her........
Remastering isn't a problem if it's done right.
Many discs in the early days were made from any old tape they could find in the vaults, transferred "flat" with often the built in upper mid and treble boost done for LP's and often listened to on B&W 801's..... the result could be thin, hard-toned and bright!
Today, not everyone has been given 801's free gratis to use and engineers worth their salt take trouble to get the best and earliest master generation they can. the current 20 bit plus editors aren't just chosen for sound quality, the extra "bits" allow editing and subtle eq to be done without harming the fidelity of the original signal. There still seems to be some varience from the glass master to the CD finished product, but I don't know enough about that side of things to make any comments. lifting levels in remastering is fine as long as the loudest bits aren't chopped off in level. many early masterings were done too low in level and lifting volume in the digital domain back then would have ruined the sound for sure - not today if the analogue original tapes are knackered and un-playable as many are now I understand after their one and only baking...
Dave, when you "tell it how it is" it seems to make more sense... I've suddenly had a "eureka" moment - I'm confusing "remixing" with "remastering" - in other words, my prejudices are more to do with creative rather than technical reasons - the skill in "mastering" (ergo, remastering) is to get the best from the original recording, not to deliberately alter the original? Or am I still missing the point?
Some twats at record companies want maximum volume at any cost and this often ruins an otherwise good recording. Most of the current bands have been annihilated this way - Kasabian, Keane and Linkin Park are some off the top of me noddle..
Sometimes, the artists are big enough to fund a decent quality re-jig of their work and, at it's best, I still personally feel that what you're hearing from good old 16 bit red-book CD is about as good as you're ever going to get from these recordings. I also still think that some SA CD masterings are a good excuse to have yet another go with the digital equaliser - Miles Davis' Kind of Blue was an early victim IIRC - Martin Colloms checked a few of the first releases and they'd all been equalised to give more bass and top, so a direct comparison with the CD was unfair as they weren't the same...
Miles Davis' Kind of Blue was an early victim IIRC - Martin Colloms checked a few of the first releases and they'd all been equalised to give more bass and top, so a direct comparison with the CD was unfair as they weren't the same...
Glad I've resisted the temptation to go SACD on that one, then - but then the CD is awesome, for me, at any rate.
aquapiranha
21-08-2009, 22:59
Solid air as to be up there...
There is a clear and obvious difference between recordings that you like to listen to, and are enhanced by being played on 'good' sound systems, and those recordings which are recommended and frequently played during demonstrations, simply to 'show off' how good a particular sound system is.
Having got the difference between remixing and remastering out of the way, then certainly Floyd's DSOTM and some of John Martyn's back catalogue must be contenders.
Agree with the inclusion of Ricky Lee John's eponymous album and maybe Fleewood Mack's 'Rumours' (not sure now, but it did used to hold the record for being the most popular record sold in the UK, with something like 1 in 3 households owning a copy) - yes I know that 'Tusk' was meant to be the 'saviour' of the record industry in the '80s but in my opinion it simply failed to deliver.
Beware 'test' or demonstration records, there are many: such as the direct cut Thelma Huston's 'I've got the music in me' vinyl and Vinyl Cowboys 'Trinity Sessions' CD. The first has enormous presence but is the the sort of well polished funk-jazz that has had all of the raw emotion removed, the second is wonderful for capturing the atmosphere of the church acoustic in which it was recorded, but is a pretty mournful sounding recording nonetheless.
Miles's 'Kind of Blue' definitely, if it is the early Columbia recording before Sony emasculated it.
This is an excellent thread Alex - I shall be really interested to know if there is a single recording in common amongst members who reply to this thread, and exactly what that recording is.
Regards
DanJennings
22-08-2009, 04:55
maybe Fleewood Mack's 'Rumours' (not sure now, but it did used to hold the record for being the most popular record sold in the UK, with something like 1 in 3 households owning a copy
again, I'm not sure about 'now' but I'm pretty sure it was surpassed by Brothers in Arms
Haselsh1
22-08-2009, 07:52
Hmmm... Seminal, must have albums...
Genesis... Selling England by the Pound. Vinyl only. CD is awful/latest remasters are truly appalling.
Pink Floyd... Wish You Were Here. Vinyl only. I can't help but think of those two aeroplanes gliding around the sky at 1980's airshows to this album.
The Beatles... Revolver. Vinyl only. A classic if ever there was one.
Ozric Tentacles... Pungent Effulgent. Brings back many memories of a friends HiFi business in the 80's. I lost track of those friends when I moved away.
The Who... Who's Next. Vinyl of course.
Pink Floyd... The Wall. Vinyl again. Brings back memories of my Logic DM101.
Haselsh1
22-08-2009, 07:56
yes I know that 'Tusk' was meant to be the 'saviour' of the record industry in the '80s but in my opinion it simply failed to deliver.
I think if memory serves me right, Tusk was one of, if not the first ever digitally recorded albums. It was made using the now famous Sony PCM1610 system.
Wish You Were Here on original LP is small sounding with no bass - so was the CD at first. Doug Sax made so much more sense out of this recording and, to me, it's so much better now..
The old Genesis LP's and CD's were made from master copies (the band holding the originals). The remasters are supposed to be from the original tapes, although the earliest albums have had a good bit of eq added to the kick drums to give them more weight. I've not heard Selling England, but Trick of the Tail sounds excellent in remastered form to me.
I had a master copy of the track "Many Too Many" which I thought sounded great and better than LP/CD, until I realised it was a pre-Dolby A dub with no calibration tones. Amazing how good a compressed tape sounds, makes the real thing sound rather washed out by comparison.
Wish You Were Here on original LP is small sounding with no bass - so was the CD at first. Doug Sax made so much more sense out of this recording and, to me, it's so much better now..
Strange how we all hear things differently.
I have 3 different vinyl pressings.Original Harvest from 1975,a Columbia pressing from 1975 and the digitally remastered pressing that appeared in a limited edition box set,released in 1997.
None of them appear 'small sounding with no bass'.In fact Richard Wrights organ at the beginning of 'Shine On' goes extremely low,especially on the original Harvest release.
As to CD versions,IMHO the first pressing was probably the best version,with Doug Sax remasters coming second.I'd avoid the Mastersound,to me it's quite thick sounding and a bit bloated.
All IMHO.
No, no, you're completely wrong :) :)
The Doug Sax mastering has a scale and level of involvement lacking in the originals to me. I still have the original CD release and it's BORING........ I have Animals from this mastering session and it's the same, but I don't like the music enough to buy another copy.
Mind you, it's a year or three since I played WYWH and the system has almost totally changed. I'll play it again and see...
No, no, you're completely wrong :) :)
I'm not wrong.It's my opinion.
I still have the original CD release and it's BORING........
I'll buy it from you,if you're willing to sell.
The Grand Wazoo
24-08-2009, 09:59
This thread really is a red rag to a bull!
100 lp's that I'd make a Martian take home with him!
I don't care what pressing, format or whatever they're on - couldn't live without 'em!
1 1 Tim Hardin
2 4 Led Zeppelin
3 A Nod's as Good as a Wink
- The Faces
4 Abraxus - Santana
5 Aftermath Rolling Stones
6 Aja Steely Dan
7 American Recordings - Johnny Cash
8 Are You Experienced? - The Jimi Hendrix Experience
9 Aretha '69 Aretha Franklin
10 Argus Wishbone Ash
11 Astronauts & Heretics Thomas Dolby
12 At Fulsom Prison Johnny Cash
13 At Last Etta James
14 Bad Company Bad Company
15 Ballad of the Broken Seas Isobel Campbell & Mark Lanegan
16 Black Sabbath Black Sabbath
17 Blind Faith Blind Faith
18 Blonde on Blonde Bob Dylan
19 Blue Train John Coltrane
20 Catch a Fire Bob Marley & the Wailers
21 Complete Recordings Robert Johnson
22 Crosby Stills & Nash - Crosby Stills & Nash
23 Dark Side of the Moon Pink Floyd
24 Dιjΰ Vu - CSNY
25 Desire Bob Dylan
26 Dire Straits Dire Straits
27 Doolittle The Pixies
28 Dusty in Memphis Dusty Springfield
29 Electric Ladyland The Jimi Hendrix Experience
30 Exile on Main Street Rolling Stones
31 Fire & Water Free
32 Folk Singer Muddy Waters
33 Forever Changes - Love
34 Foxtrot Genesis
35 Fun House The Stooges
36 Giant Steps The Boo Radleys
37 Go! Dexter Gordon
38 Grace Jeff Buckley
39 Grand Prix Teenage Fanclub
40 Green River Creedence Clearwater Revival
41 Harvest Neil Young
42 Highway 61 Revisited Bob Dylan
43 Home & Away Clive Gregson & Christine Collister
44 Hot Buttered Soul Isaac Hayes
45 Hot Rats Frank Zappa
46 Hunky Dory David Bowie
47 If Only I Could Remember My Name David Crosby
48 In the Court of the Crimson King King Crimson
49 It's Hard Muddy Waters
50 Joni Mitchell Blue
51 Kick Out the Jams The MC5
52 Kind of Blue Miles Davis
53 LA Woman The Doors
54 Layla & Other Assorted Love Songs Derek & the Dominos
55 Led Zeppelin Led Zeppelin
56 Live at Leeds The Who
57 Live at the Regal BB King
58 London Calling The Clash
59 Maggot Brain Funkadelic
60 Marquee Moon Television
61 Music From the Big Pink - The Band
62 No Frontiers Mary Black
63 Offramp Pat Metheny
64 Otis Blue Otis Redding
65 Patti Smith - Horses
66 Peggy Suicide Julian Cope
67 Pet Sounds - The Beach Boys
68 Pink Flag Wire
69 Pink Moon - Nick Drake
70 Piper at the Gates of Dawn Pink Floyd
71 Pronounced Len-nerd-skin-nerd Lynyrd Skynyrd
72 Radio City - Big Star
73 Revolver The Beatles
74 Rust Never Sleeps Neil Young
75 Sgt Pepper The Beatles
76 Sketches of Spain Miles Davis
77 Smoke & Strong Whiskey Christy Moore
78 Something Else Cannonball Adderly
79 Something Else The Kinks
80 Space Ritual Hawkwind
81 Surf's Up - The Beach Boys
82 Take Five Dave Brubeck
83 The Atomic Mr Basie - Count Basie Orchestra
84 The Captain & Me The Doobie Brothers
85 The Doors The Doors
86 The Greatest Cat Power
87 The Harder They Come (OST) Jimmy Cliff
88 The Nightfly Donald Fagan
89 The Rise & Fall of Ziggy Stardust & the Spiders.... David Bowie
90 The Twelve Dreams of Dr Sardonicus - Spirit
91 The Velvet Underground & Nico The Velvet Underground
92 Third / Sister Lovers Big Star
93 This Is Hope - Mull Historical Society
94 Tomorrow The Green Grass - The Jayhawks
95 Transformer Lou Reed
96 Unhalfbricking - Fairport Convention
97 Unplugged Eric Clapton
98 Welcome to LA Tim Buckley
99 What's Going On? Marvin Gaye
100 Who's Next The Who
Good to see you back Chris.
No complaints about your list either - well apart from Genesis :doh:, though there are another 10 titles that I haven't heard.
How did the move go? Tell us all about it.
Regards
The Grand Wazoo
24-08-2009, 10:46
Good to see you back Chris.
No complaints about your list either - well apart from Genesis :doh:, though there are another 10 titles that I haven't heard.
How did the move go? Tell us all about it.
Regards
Welllll........I'm still not really properly saddled up on the Information Superbridleway, as yet, so I just dipped in for a mo'. The BT Bandits are still not exactly bending over backwards to help (truth be known, if there's anyone being bent over - it's me!)
Got the main system up & running late last night. Records stowed away (well most of 'em!) CD's still in boxes. No decision made yet on which speakers to use or where to stick 'em! Speaker placement is going to be interesting.
Anyway there's a proper place for all this stuff & all will be revealed!!
Back to Must Have's folks
Wow Chris - that is some list. Going to take some digestion I think, and there's a lot I haven't got on there - the funny thing about joining this forum is that I've learned so much more about new (to me) music - I thought I'd end up becoming festidious about speaker placement, equipment support etc., lusting after mega-money mega-watt equipment, but mostly I've just ended up trying new music - and thank the Lord (and Spotify/Last FM!) for that!
Good luck with the continued moving in and setting up.
The Grand Wazoo
24-08-2009, 13:36
Recordings owned by everyone? I'd guess that the following would stand a chance of being in the running (and mostly already pointed out by others) but I'd bet none of them are owned by all of us!
Thriller Michael Jackson (has to be a runner, just because so many people bought it but not me!)
Dark Side of the Moon Pink Floyd (sheer weight of sales, good music, impressive on a ½ decent system, played to death by salesmen & exhibitors)
Love Over Gold Dire Straits (most of the above!)
Brothers in Arms Dire Straits (ditto)
Rumours Fleetwood Mac (ditto)
Rickie Lee Jones Ricky Lee Jones (mostly owned by hi-fi show-goers of a certain age!)
Tubular Bells Mike Oldfield (ditto)
The trouble is most of the best music suffers from overexposure to the point that I can barely hear the first few notes of some tracks without cringing.
Am I alone in 9 times out of 10 preferring to hear the following?
Pictures of Home to Smoke on the Water
Going to California to Stairway to Heaven
Tuesday's Gone to Freebird
Satellite of Love to Perfect Day
Key to the Highway to Layla
Remember to All Right Now
..etc etc etc
- the funny thing about joining this forum is that I've learned so much more about new (to me) music - I thought I'd end up becoming festidious about speaker placement, equipment support etc., lusting after mega-money mega-watt equipment, but mostly I've just ended up trying new music -
The musical compositions area is the best wheel within the series of wheels that is the AoS - mostly due to John's efforts........and enhanced by your own arrival and contributions, may I say!
Cheers
Welcome back Chris.
Great couple of posts, a big (where's the thumb up emoticon when you need it) yes to #83 on your top list and yes agree we are likely to come up with a long list of musical cliches but with any luck there will be some gems thrown up that have either been forgotten/not played for years.
Thinking about it led me to dig out my only Eagles lp Desperado, the title track is surely one of the best written/performed/recorded pieces of music ever. I haven't heard it in years but I think it's more moving now than when I first heard it all those years ago, amazing.:smoking:
Cheers
The Grand Wazoo
24-08-2009, 14:18
Welcome back Chris.
Great couple of posts, a big (where's the thumb up emoticon when you need it) yes to #83 on your top list and yes agree we are likely to come up with a long list of musical cliches but with any luck there will be some gems thrown up that have either been forgotten/not played for years.
Thinking about it led me to dig out my only Eagles lp Desperado, the title track is surely one of the best written/performed/recorded pieces of music ever. I haven't heard it in years but I think it's more moving now than when I first heard it all those years ago, amazing.:smoking:
Cheers
Ralph, That is as spooky as hell!
.........On my list of tracks I'd rather listen to, number 2 was Desperado instead of Hotel California, but I deleted it because they're not on the same album!! AoS serendipity strikes again!
....and yes I forgot, Hotel California should be on the list with Thriller, DSOTM, RL Jones etc
It's great you're still liking the Basie lp!
Haselsh1
24-08-2009, 14:30
Strange how we all hear things differently.
I have 3 different vinyl pressings.Original Harvest from 1975,a Columbia pressing from 1975 and the digitally remastered pressing that appeared in a limited edition box set,released in 1997.
None of them appear 'small sounding with no bass'.In fact Richard Wrights organ at the beginning of 'Shine On' goes extremely low,especially on the original Harvest release.
As to CD versions,IMHO the first pressing was probably the best version,with Doug Sax remasters coming second.I'd avoid the Mastersound,to me it's quite thick sounding and a bit bloated.
All IMHO.
I couldn't agree more with your comments regarding the Pink Floyd CD issues.
They're like the new Genesis re-issues... bloody awful. The Genesis albums are now an exact example of how not to remaster an album... Massive eq, very thin, very strident and far to toppy.
Yo, Chrissy, baby...
Where've ya been, daddy-o? :cool:
Missed ya!
Marco.
Recordings owned by everyone? – I'd guess that the following would stand a chance of being in the running (and mostly already pointed out by others) but I'd bet none of them are owned by all of us!
Thriller – Michael Jackson (has to be a runner, just because so many people bought it – but not me!) Not me either
Dark Side of the Moon – Pink Floyd (sheer weight of sales, good music, impressive on a ½ decent system, played to death by salesmen & exhibitors)
Love Over Gold – Dire Straits (most of the above!) Not got I refuse to buyBrothers in Arms – Dire Straits (ditto) ditto
Rumours – Fleetwood Mac (ditto) Not got
Rickie Lee Jones – Ricky Lee Jones (mostly owned by hi-fi show-goers of a certain age!) not got either
Tubular Bells – Mike Oldfield (ditto)
The trouble is most of the best music suffers from overexposure – to the point that I can barely hear the first few notes of some tracks without cringing.
Am I alone in 9 times out of 10 preferring to hear the following?
Pictures of Home to Smoke on the Water
Going to California to Stairway to Heaven I go for Kashmir
Tuesday's Gone to Freebird In total agreement
Satellite of Love to Perfect Day
Key to the Highway to Layla
Remember to All Right Now
……..etc etc etc
The musical compositions area is the best wheel within the series of wheels that is the AoS - mostly due to John's efforts........and enhanced by your own arrival and contributions, may I say!
Cheers
My own choices
Jeff Buckley Grace
Nick Drake 5 Leaves Left
Miles Davis A Kind of Blue
John Coltrane Ballards
Al Di Meola Anything recorded on vinyl sounds awesome
After that it rather becomes obscure If you want the list I will post
:lolsign:
The Grand Wazoo
24-08-2009, 14:43
Yo, Chrissy, baby...
Where've ya been, daddy-o? :cool:
Missed ya!
Marco.
You're hallucinating Marco, I'm just a mirage - a pigment of your machinations....a naughty scarlet pimpled hell.
Spectral Morn
24-08-2009, 15:15
I couldn't agree more with your comments regarding the Pink Floyd CD issues.
They're like the new Genesis re-issues... bloody awful. The Genesis albums are now an exact example of how not to remaster an album... Massive eq, very thin, very strident and far to toppy.
I have to disagree with Shaun's opinion of the Genesis reissues...I think they are very good and better than any of the previous releases. I haven't heard the original vinyl but have a few copies of some of the albums through out their digital life and the SACD/CDs are fab.
All IMHO of course.
Regards D S D L
I couldn't agree more with your comments regarding the Pink Floyd CD issues.
They're like the new Genesis re-issues... bloody awful. The Genesis albums are now an exact example of how not to remaster an album... Massive eq, very thin, very strident and far to toppy.
I said elsewhere that I had no idea that Genesis has been "done" again recently. "Why?" comes to mind, as the masterings done ten or so years ago were quite adequate...
I had an original copy of WYWH but am not sure if I still do. I should still have an original CD release and personally thought the Doug Sax mastered CD from the early nineties sounded so much clearer and not obviously doctored or compressed. I'll listen again and if Mr Snapper still wants the original CD (I'll photo it first as some had silver lettering on black labels followed by black printing on the silver backing) he's welcome to it :)
Maybe Pink Floyd have been "done" again, but until this weekend I'd never heard of criticism of the "Shine On" box set era before.. I'm genuinely interested, honest guvs..
P.S. My original copy of WYWH on CD is a Japanese made one.
Spectral Morn
24-08-2009, 17:38
I said elsewhere that I had no idea that Genesis has been "done" again recently. "Why?" comes to mind, as the masterings done ten or so years ago were quite adequate...
Hi Dave
The Genesis catalogue has been redone starting about 2 years ago with the middle albums, then the last ones and the albums we (Me) had been waiting for the first ones (but sadly no Seconds Out )was done last. They were mastered for SACD/CD hybrids with extra features on extra DVDs (which come with the SACDs)...rare concerts videos interviews etc. In away the concerts are worth the cost of the discs alone as many have not seen the light of day in many/many years.
They have also been released as 180gram vinyl as well, not heard those but HFW thought they were excellent and the SACDs have had good write ups too. I am at a loss to understand why Shaun thinks they are poor as in my system they are excellent....go figure !?
Regards D S D L
Ralph, That is as spooky as hell!
.........On my list of tracks I'd rather listen to, number 2 was Desperado instead of Hotel California, but I deleted it because they're not on the same album!! AoS serendipity strikes again!
....and yes I forgot, Hotel California should be on the list with Thriller, DSOTM, RL Jones etc
It's great you're still liking the Basie lp!
That must be the (Pendle) Witchy Woman casting the spells then:lol:
Talking of Hotel California I can't listen to it without thinking of Peter Sellers doing his Richard 111 act to it Clicky (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLEMncv140s).
:lolsign:
From Neil
They have also been released as 180gram vinyl as well, not heard those but HFW thought they were excellent and the SACDs have had good write ups too. I am at a loss to understand why Shaun thinks they are poor as in my system they are excellent....go figure !?
I bought the vinyl box set as the PB era Genesis is all that interests me, however in between ordering and taking delivery I discovered they hadn't just been remastered but re-mixed too:(.
Any idea if the SACDs are the same as the lps as I haven't been able to bring myself to break the seal, I don't think I could take hit of £100 worth of disappointment ATM. Why on earth do they think they need to mess about with classic albums like this? Couldn't be anything to do certain peoples' egos could it, I'd dread to play the lps only to find Collins' drums drowning out Gabriels' vocals:steam:
Would appreciate your thoughts.
Cheers
Spectral Morn
24-08-2009, 19:10
From Neil
They have also been released as 180gram vinyl as well, not heard those but HFW thought they were excellent and the SACDs have had good write ups too. I am at a loss to understand why Shaun thinks they are poor as in my system they are excellent....go figure !?
I bought the vinyl box set as the PB era Genesis is all that interests me, however in between ordering and taking delivery I discovered they hadn't just been remastered but re-mixed too:(.
Any idea if the SACDs are the same as the lps as I haven't been able to bring myself to break the seal, I don't think I could take hit of £100 worth of disappointment ATM. Why on earth do they think they need to mess about with classic albums like this? Couldn't be anything to do certain peoples' egos could it, I'd dread to play the lps only to find Collins' drums drowning out Gabriels' vocals:steam:
Would appreciate your thoughts.
Cheers
Hi Ralph
Yes they have, same as the vinyl.
I think/feel that the sound is more open and detailed, detail shines through but is not bright. Its like the window has had a clean and the view you had got used to looking through a murk is now clear. The bass is full but open and articulate and areas of thickness in the past are gone. I think its an improvement, but as with all things IMHO. I like the SACDs and I am sure I would love the vinyl but I can't justify spending £100 on the box set now.
Regards D S D L
Genesis had a problem - truly dynamic music (loud to quiet) but long LP sides. I found a fair bit of either compression, bandwidth limiting and low level cuts right in the middle of the oil crisis (and sh*t vinyl for record production).
A mate who's a manic fan has just told me that he believes these albums have been re-mixed. I know the band held on to their tapes, so maybe they had all the session multi-tracks and re-did them from there.
Haselsh1
26-08-2009, 08:00
For anyone that may be interested, here is my input on what has always been to me, my No1 band:
Taking a normal middle album like Trick of the Tail I honestly find that the drums are superb. There are little inflections within the mix that I have never heard before on ANY version. Steve Hacketts guitar work is truly amazing and much more obvious now than ever before.
My problem with these albums still remains the same. They are very bright and toppy and it is very obvious that there has been eq. piled onto these recordings simply to make them sound impressive. They do sound impressive until of course you play a modern album of some quality which then shows up the Genesis recordings as having practically no bass, a very thin weedy midrange and an excessive treble. May I suggest you read some of the reviews of these albums on Amazon...? OK, I've done one of them but there are many more.
If you wish to compare like for like, compare the quality of Dire Straits debut album with Trick of the Tail or Wind and Wuthering for overall sound quality. They are all from the late seventies and show how to produce an album and how not to.
Spectral Morn
26-08-2009, 08:59
For anyone that may be interested, here is my input on what has always been to me, my No1 band:
Taking a normal middle album like Trick of the Tail I honestly find that the drums are superb. There are little inflections within the mix that I have never heard before on ANY version. Steve Hacketts guitar work is truly amazing and much more obvious now than ever before.
My problem with these albums still remains the same. They are very bright and toppy and it is very obvious that there has been eq. piled onto these recordings simply to make them sound impressive. They do sound impressive until of course you play a modern album of some quality which then shows up the Genesis recordings as having practically no bass, a very thin weedy midrange and an excessive treble. May I suggest you read some of the reviews of these albums on Amazon...? OK, I've done one of them but there are many more.
If you wish to compare like for like, compare the quality of Dire Straits debut album with Trick of the Tail or Wind and Wuthering for overall sound quality. They are all from the late seventies and show how to produce an album and how not to.
Hi Shaun
I am still at a loss. However I will re-listen to a few today and report later what I hear. I don't have any Dire Straights...while I appreciate the Knofler's brothers talent, bar a few tracks I am not into D S.
Having looked at the Amazon write ups your review, and one other are the most negative...everyone else likes the sound (so it seems)but complain about tracks that could have been there and not etc. My biggest complaint is no Live or Seconds Out.
Regards D S D L
A mate who's a manic fan has just told me that he believes these albums have been re-mixed. I know the band held on to their tapes, so maybe they had all the session multi-tracks and re-did them from there.
They are definitely re-mixes as this from the ClassicLPs site clearly says:-
God bless Genesis. Love 'em, hate 'em, decorate the walls with 'em, they're an international institution and no mistake. And this fabulously lavish, superbly re-mastered collection of their first five Charisma LPs - Trespass, Nursery Cryme, Foxtrot, Selling England by the Pound and The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway, all freshly mixed by Nick Davis - has sleevenotes by Jeremy Clarkson and everything. Selling England... was their critical breakthrough, but its three predecessors are also glorious reminders of a time when prog. rock ruled the earth, Peter Gabriel was breathtakingly cutting edge and Phil Collins a genuinely brilliant drummer. Times change and haircuts move on, but there's still something enduringly reassuring about Genesis in their full pomp, with packaging to die for. But only on vinyl, good people, only on vinyl .
The sleeve notes by Clarkson (the sad git must still have been in short trousers when Trespass came out so what will he know FFS!) can be simply ignored not so the fact that these are re-mixes. They might be very good but then again, maybe not, so I was just wondering if anyone had actually heard both the original and the new releases. It's a bit like a photographer reprinting his old B&W work and saying 'I got so-and-so to tint it all in photoshop to make it better...' wouldn't really happen, would it?
Cheers
Spectral Morn
26-08-2009, 09:25
They are definitely re-mixes as this from the ClassicLPs site clearly says:-
God bless Genesis. Love 'em, hate 'em, decorate the walls with 'em, they're an international institution and no mistake. And this fabulously lavish, superbly re-mastered collection of their first five Charisma LPs - Trespass, Nursery Cryme, Foxtrot, Selling England by the Pound and The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway, all freshly mixed by Nick Davis - has sleevenotes by Jeremy Clarkson and everything. Selling England... was their critical breakthrough, but its three predecessors are also glorious reminders of a time when prog. rock ruled the earth, Peter Gabriel was breathtakingly cutting edge and Phil Collins a genuinely brilliant drummer. Times change and haircuts move on, but there's still something enduringly reassuring about Genesis in their full pomp, with packaging to die for. But only on vinyl, good people, only on vinyl .
The sleeve notes by Clarkson (the sad git must still have been in short trousers when Trespass came out so what will he know FFS!) can be simply ignored not so the fact that these are re-mixes. They might be very good but then again, maybe not, so I was just wondering if anyone had actually heard both the original and the new releases. It's a bit like a photographer reprinting his old B&W work and saying 'I got so-and-so to tint it all in photoshop to make it better...' wouldn't really happen, would it?
Cheers
I have early digital versions from about 12 years ago ish, can't remember exactly. The vinyl I have is not close enough to the original releases to be of much use I would have thought. I will have a listen today and report back later what i think. Shaun has me questioning my hearing, but if the SCAD discs were as he suggests I would not like them and would moan about it too.
Regards D S D L
Recordings owned by everyone? I'd guess that the following would stand a chance of being in the running (and mostly already pointed out by others) but I'd bet none of them are owned by all of us!
Thriller Michael Jackson (has to be a runner, just because so many people bought it but not me!)
Dark Side of the Moon Pink Floyd (sheer weight of sales, good music, impressive on a ½ decent system, played to death by salesmen & exhibitors)
Love Over Gold Dire Straits (most of the above!)
Brothers in Arms Dire Straits (ditto)
Rumours Fleetwood Mac (ditto)
Rickie Lee Jones Ricky Lee Jones (mostly owned by hi-fi show-goers of a certain age!)
Tubular Bells Mike Oldfield (ditto)
The only one of those I've got is 'Rumours' and I got that for nowt from someone who was 'upgrading' to CDs.
I like your 100 'must haves' (of which I own 47), but would respectfully suggest that 'The Band' is a better album than 'Music From Big Pink'.
Haselsh1
26-08-2009, 15:25
Hey, I'm really not trying to cause aggro here just for the sake of it and to be honest, I never really realised that these are all re-mixes but as they are, it kind of explains my findings over and above the original vinyl LP's. The vinyl was a much better balance in the same way as DSOTM on vinyl was and still is much better than the SACD. I guess in terms of early Genesis that the vinyl mix covered up a multitude of sins and also quite a bit of the music but at what cost do we now have this clarity...? I know my hearing is very sensitive at high frequencies as it's been tested many times but these Genesis re-releases are tragic.
Spectral Morn
26-08-2009, 15:40
Hey, I'm really not trying to cause aggro here just for the sake of it and to be honest, I never really realised that these are all re-mixes but as they are, it kind of explains my findings over and above the original vinyl LP's. The vinyl was a much better balance in the same way as DSOTM on vinyl was and still is much better than the SACD. I guess in terms of early Genesis that the vinyl mix covered up a multitude of sins and also quite a bit of the music but at what cost do we now have this clarity...? I know my hearing is very sensitive at high frequencies as it's been tested many times but these Genesis re-releases are tragic.
Hi Shaun
No aggro :)...I am just curious to hear what you have heard...thats all.
Regards D S D L
The Grand Wazoo
26-08-2009, 16:09
The only one of those I've got is 'Rumours' and I got that for nowt from someone who was 'upgrading' to CDs.
I like your 100 'must haves' (of which I own 47), but would respectfully suggest that 'The Band' is a better album than 'Music From Big Pink'.
I actually agree with you about 'The Band' being a better album, but I have a strangely indescribable affinity with Big Pink - it's more of 'an event' than an album, if you know what I mean.
As for the others I guess Bat out of Hell & Hotel California should've been in that list along with Thriller, Rumours & Bros. in Arms
I actually agree with you about 'The Band' being a better album, but I have a strangely indescribable affinity with Big Pink - it's more of 'an event' than an album, if you know what I mean.
I do know what you mean. I also prefer The Band because I bought it when it came out, whereas Big Pink was a later purchase. For similar reasons, Countdown to Ecstasy would replace Aja on my own list.
Spectral Morn
26-08-2009, 16:35
Heres more..
Alan Parson's Project---Tales of Mystery and Imagination.
Propaganda--A Secret Wish.
Both excellent IMHO.
Regards D S D L
Which version of the Alan Parsons disc Neil? I love the original, but the re-do does sound better to me on a good system, the orchestra being well spread out with room to breathe and the drum kit being set well back. I've got to buy the parsons re-mastered CD with both versions on...
Spectral Morn
26-08-2009, 17:44
Which version of the Alan Parsons disc Neil? I love the original, but the re-do does sound better to me on a good system, the orchestra being well spread out with room to breathe and the drum kit being set well back. I've got to buy the parsons re-mastered CD with both versions on...
Mobile Fidelity version, Dave.
Regards D S D L
oooh yes, Bat out of Hell! And Propaganda--A Secret Wish yes, classic album one I have on vinyl and cd - which seems to be a reasonable personal barometer of "classicness!"
The Grand Wazoo
26-08-2009, 19:10
oooh yes, Bat out of Hell!
What 'appened there guvnor?
I could've swored I wrote some stuff 'bout Bat Out of Hell, just up there above Alex.
Wezzit gone then?
Chris - I was referring to post #49 where you mentioned it. Have you been sticking carpets down with some dodgy glue? ;)
The Grand Wazoo
26-08-2009, 22:30
Chris - I was referring to post #49 where you mentioned it. Have you been sticking carpets down with some dodgy glue? ;)
I know!!!!
When I last looked it'd gone!
But now it's back!!
When I last looked it'd gone!
But now it's back!!
Yup, definitely too much glue! ;)
Haselsh1
26-08-2009, 22:41
Hmmm... I think what we're asking here is for our very own 'Desert Island Discs'.
Mine would be:
Genesis, Selling England By The Pound on vinyl.
The Who, Who's Next on vinyl.
The Eagles, Hotel California on vinyl.
Pink Floyd, The Dark Side Of The Moon on vinyl.
Boston, Boston on vinyl.
Be Bop Deluxe, Modern Music on vinyl.
Jose Feliciano, Feliciano ! on vinyl.
Bill Nelson, The Love That Whorls on vinyl.
I should be OK on a desert island with that few discs and provided I have mains power and a valve amplifier I would be OK during a nuclear explosion as well. Well, at least the equipment would be OK. I may not fair as well.
EMP does affect valves or vinyl...!!!
Haselsh1
26-08-2009, 22:48
Davros... I especially like the album 'Tales Of Mystery And Imagination' by The Alan Parsons Project. The binaural recording of the thunder storm is in my own opinion, one of the finest pieces I have ever heard. I am lucky enough to have this album on original vinyl with no bloody barcodes or other such nonsense. That is one of the benefits of living in a sleepy little backwater full of junk shops.
The Grand Wazoo
26-08-2009, 22:57
I should be OK on a desert island with that few discs and provided I have mains power and a valve amplifier
Desert Island Discs doesn't allow for albums, only individual pieces of music
The Grand Wazoo
27-08-2009, 17:30
So, to refer back to Alex's original question................
Born from the "what are you spinning right now" thread, can we identify those seminal albums that if you're "into" music & hi-fi you just *have* to own? wonder how many albums we could find, if any, that EVERYONE has got...
................????
So, taking all things into consideration, here are my 'must haves'
The Beatles: Everything, the lot.
The Stooges: The Stooges
The Stooges: Fun House
Iggy and The Stooges: Raw Power
Rolling Stones: Let It Bleed
Rolling Stones: Sticky Fingers
Rolling Stones: Exile on Main Street
The Velvet Underground: Velvet Underground & Nico
The Velvet Underground: White Light/White Heat
The Velvet Underground: The Velvet Underground
Love: Forever Changes
Bob Dylan: Highway 61 Revisited
Bob Dylan: Blonde on Blonde
The New York Dolls: The New York Dolls
The Band: The Band
David Bowie: Hunky Dory
David Bowie: Station to Station
David Bowie: Diamond Dogs
Eno: Another Green World
Mothers of Invention: Absolutely Free
Mothers of Invention: We're Only In It For The Money
Steely Dan: Countdown to Ecstasy
Steely Dan: Pretzel Logic
The La's: The La's
Big Star: Radio City
Alex Chilton: Like Flies on Sherbet
Art Pepper: Smack Up!
John Fahey: Death Chants, Breakdowns & Military Waltzes
John Fahey: Blind Joe Death
Nick Drake: Pink Moon
Ry Cooder: Into The Purple Valley
Ry Cooder: Paradise & Lunch
Half Man, Half Biscuit: This Leaden Pall
Half Man Half Biscuit: Cammell Laird Social Club
Half Man Half Biscuit: Achtung Bono
Echo and the Bunnymen: Heaven Up Here
Roxy Music: For Your Pleasure
Fleetwood Mac: Then Play On
Syd Barrett: The Madcap Laughs
Julian Cope: 20 Mothers
Julian Cope: Fried
Sonny Rollins: Saxophone Colossus
The Boo Radleys: Giant Steps
The Boo Radleys: Wake Up!
Fairport Convention: Liege and Lief
Mazzy Star: So That Tonight I Might See
The Flying Burrito Brothers: The Gilded Palace of Sin
Little Feat: Sailin' Shoes
John Cale: Paris 1919
John Cale: Fear
John Mayall: Bluesbreakers
Jimi Hendrix: Electric Ladyland
Dexter Gordon: Go!
Scott Walker: Drift
Lemonheads: Come On Feel The Lemonheads
The Stone Roses: The Stone Roses
Lou Reed: Berlin
Lou Reed: Transformer
Captain Beefheart: Trout Mask Replica
That's enough for now. If in doubt, take along Raw Power and any Beatles record except Let It Be to your desert island. Your book should be 'Ulysses' and your luxury item should be whatever takes your fancy.
Gong - Shamal
Joan Armatrading (did I mention her before?) - the 1970's Glynn Johns produced ones are great and apparently "Me, Myself, I" has amazing dynamics (if the current issue hasn't had them sapped away..)
I was refraining from reminding everyone of that Chris, mainly 'cos a lot of people are having some fun with the thread, but that said, it could get rather tedious if I say "I've got Dark Side of the Moon" - 20 people say "me too" until one person says "I haven't" ... but I have got "Brothers in Arms" 20 people say "me too" until (repeat to fade...) So, anyone NOT got DSOTM? How's that for a start...?
(great list, BTW Joe, thanks.)
I was refraining from reminding everyone of that Chris, mainly 'cos a lot of people are having some fun with the thread, but that said, it could get rather tedious if I say "I've got Dark Side of the Moon" - 20 people say "me too" until one person says "I haven't" ... but I have got "Brothers in Arms" 20 people say "me too" until (repeat to fade...) So, anyone NOT got DSOTM? How's that for a start...?
Me!
Whilst fascinated by the prospect of possibly knowing that there is a single recording that all members of AoS posses, I realise that this is a somewhat futile pursuit.
[1] All members of AoS would have to take part,
[2] Some members are keen classical listeners, so it will be not just a particular composition but a particular recording,
[3] How are we going to know, unless a list is drawn up (and those lists that have been drawn up are indeed valiant attempts) and we go through the (laborious) process that Alex has alluded to.
It would be nice to know however ..............
Regards
(Looks like DSOTM has been kicked out!)
Me!
That went well then! :lol: back to the lists, everyone! :eyebrows:
The Grand Wazoo
27-08-2009, 22:47
Yeah,
OK, I know, I know! Half a millisecond after I posted that I asked myself how would you do it?
...............but I've done my list
Yeah,
OK, I know, I know! Half a millisecond after I posted that I asked myself how would you do it?
...............but I've done my list
I've been thinking about it for a couple of days now, but can't work out a logical way of doing it. Fustrating isn't it?
I think I'll have a glass of whisky and look at the 'swirly whirly' stuff.......!
Regards
this is a somewhat futile pursuit. yup - see post above!
[1] All members of AoS would have to take part, Aint gonna happen, is it?
[2] Some members are keen classical listeners, so it will be not just a particular composition but a particular recording, And those of us not into classical won't know our Abel from our Elgar, anyway
[3] How are we going to know, unless a list is drawn up (and those lists that have been drawn up are indeed valiant attempts) and we go through the (laborious) process that Alex has alluded to. ooh, we don't want laborious on this forum!
It would be nice to know however .............. Aren't we nosey - someone will ask about our shaving habits next, you watch! ;)
All good clean fun!
Whilst fascinated by the prospect of possibly knowing that there is a single recording that all members of AoS posses, I realise that this is a somewhat futile pursuit.
[1] All members of AoS would have to take part,
[2] Some members are keen classical listeners, so it will be not just a particular composition but a particular recording,
[3] How are we going to know, unless a list is drawn up (and those lists that have been drawn up are indeed valiant attempts) and we go through the (laborious) process that Alex has alluded to.
It would be nice to know however ..............
Regards
(Looks like DSOTM has been kicked out!)
I don't think there is one; I'd have said 'Rumours' but I see from further up the thread that John hasn't got a copy, and I haven't got a copy of 'Thriller' which I believe is the biggest selling album of all time ...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_albums_worldwide
I don't think there is one;
It was a nice idea in principal, the closest we will probably get is an artist, (ABBA, everyone?) - some great lists though!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_albums_worldwide
I daren't click on that link - List of bums worldwide - this is a work friendly forum, Joe! ;)
interesting reading i can't beleive Backstreet Boys is there along with Whitney bloody Houston:confused:
The Grand Wazoo
28-08-2009, 17:44
It's interesting to see the best sellers by country. - Boy the Aussies didn't half go for John Farnham!
...........why........?
What depressing statistics! -
Celine Dion
Mariah Cary
Enya
Britney Spears ...........
Aghhh! :wah:
Spectral Morn
28-08-2009, 18:31
Davros... I especially like the album 'Tales Of Mystery And Imagination' by The Alan Parsons Project. The binaural recording of the thunder storm is in my own opinion, one of the finest pieces I have ever heard. I am lucky enough to have this album on original vinyl with no bloody barcodes or other such nonsense. That is one of the benefits of living in a sleepy little backwater full of junk shops.
I Shaun
Yes on vinyl would be very nice indeed, its a great album. Its funny how some are snobby about the Alan Parson's Project. Not every album is stunning in fact a few are weak, but on the whole they are mostly great. Hes also a very good producer too.
Like your list by the way....
Regards D S D L
........
Yes on vinyl would be very nice indeed, its a great album. Its funny how some are snobby about the Alan Parson's Project. Not every album is stunning in fact a few are weak, but on the whole they are mostly great. Hes also a very good producer too.
Like your list by the way....
Regards D S D L
Pretentious, pompous, self indugent and yet some tracks are useful to 'show off' one's system to the impressionable and are well produced.
There is a scream on 'Tales of Mystery and Imagination', which is so awful I never want to hear it again.
Personally I prefer 'Eye in the Sky', though I no longer have a copy: it wasn't good enough to keep.
Beechwoods
28-08-2009, 20:02
I have never been moved to check out Alan Parsons. He was a good engineer on Dark Side but it seems he went on to 'dine out' on that particular project for the next few decades! It's not like he called his band something that didn't trade on the fame he got having worked with the Floyd. I guess that's why people treat his 'Project' with suspicion.
I have never been moved to check out Alan Parsons. He was a good engineer on Dark Side but it seems he went on to 'dine out' on that particular project for the next few decades! It's not like he called his band something that didn't trade on the fame he got having worked with the Floyd. I guess that's why people treat his 'Project' with suspicion.
Spot on - couldn't agree with you more.
The Grand Wazoo
28-08-2009, 20:14
Me also, I have always been totally unmoved by everything he's done.........
Except for one track - 'Old & Wise' for the way that Colin Blunstone expressed the feeling in the lyric.
NLtFsiOFn-4&feature=related
It makes me very sad about a friend of mine whom I lost.........
Haselsh1
28-08-2009, 20:25
Pretentious, pompous, self indugent and yet some tracks are useful to 'show off' one's system to the impressionable and are well produced.
There is a scream on 'Tales of Mystery and Imagination', which is so awful I never want to hear it again.
Personally I prefer 'Eye in the Sky', though I no longer have a copy: it wasn't good enough to keep.
It's funny how we all differ. I always thought that 'Eye in the Sky' was probably the biggest commercial dross Alan Parsons ever did.
It's funny how we all differ. I always thought that 'Eye in the Sky' was probably the biggest commercial dross Alan Parsons ever did.
Maybe that's why I got rid of it?
Haselsh1
28-08-2009, 20:31
Yeah... Could well be...!!!
DanJennings
29-08-2009, 06:21
oh well, I'll come out and say it.... I like The Alan Parsons Project
I don't know why, my Dad used to play 'I Robot' a lot, and I think it is a very varied and nice sounding record. I'm also very fond of 'Turn Of A Friendly Card' especially 'Time' and the title track.
I will be the first to admit that 'Tales of mystery and imagination' is very pretentious, I still own it however... I will also admit that his albums started to sound like he was just following a formula after a while, but it was a damn good formula!
I also quite like the Alan Parsons (not project) album 'Try Anything Once' which features some vocals from 10cc'er Eric Stewart, and has a couple of very gratifying instrumentals on it, that remind me of lively Mike Oldfield
but yeah, I can appreciate why many wouldn't like him, but never mind.
Haselsh1
29-08-2009, 14:30
I guess in historic terms the Alan Parsons material could loosely be termed 'Prog' largely due to its conceptual albums and fairly complex musical passages. In that respect it has all of the hallmarks that people have given it on this forum: pompous, self indugent etc etc. I guess if one is not a 'Prog' fan then one is never going to be very fond of this type of music of which for me, the ultimate expression of pompous, self indugent dross had to be Emmerson, Lake and Palmer.
DanJennings
29-08-2009, 14:41
the ultimate expression of pompous, self indugent dross had to be Emmerson, Lake and Palmer.[/COLOR][/CENTER]
Oh well, I guess I like pompous, self indulgent dross then! Brain Salad Surgery and Tarkus are awesome... I found a mint copy of Tarkus in a charity shop about 6 months ago, I was chuffed.
Talking of prog self indulgencies, I've always thought that the worst offenders were Yes - Tales from topographic oceans (four 1 track sides of vinyl about buddhism) which I love, and that flaming lips thing, which has four CDs, which all have to be played at the same time (which I haven't heard.... I don't have 4 hifis)
Haselsh1
29-08-2009, 14:57
Oh well, I guess I like pompous, self indulgent dross then! Brain Salad Surgery and Tarkus are awesome... I found a mint copy of Tarkus in a charity shop about 6 months ago, I was chuffed.
Talking of prog self indulgencies, I've always thought that the worst offenders were Yes - Tales from topographic oceans (four 1 track sides of vinyl about buddhism) which I love, and that flaming lips thing, which has four CDs, which all have to be played at the same time (which I haven't heard.... I don't have 4 hifis)
I couldn't agree more.
I adore prog rock in all it's musical offence and I adore the sheer complexity that is wasted on many people. Seldom have I heard popular music be as complex and intricate as prog rock quoting 'Close To The Edge' as a notable point. Pompous, self indulgent and dross it certainly is by todays standards but then by todays standards we have overcompressed shite like Duffy and Adelle that are so badly recorded they are almost unlistenable. We have utter rubbish like the Sugarbabes whose album may as well be used as a coaster for what it is worth musically so as far as I am concerned, I will stay with my prog rock recordings that actually have a lot of dynamics, are very well recorded and mixed and have a decent level of complexity within the music.
As for Jon Anderson's lyrics... Jesus...!!!
DanJennings
29-08-2009, 15:20
I adore prog rock in all it's musical offence and I adore the sheer complexity that is wasted on many people. Seldom have I heard popular music be as complex and intricate as prog rock quoting 'Close To The Edge' as a notable point.
As for Jon Anderson's lyrics... Jesus...!!!
musical offence! Now there's a good term, I shall have to remember that.
I love close to the edge! In fact, if I may be so bold as to actually go back on topic, I would probably consider that one of my must haves.
I nearly bought tickets to see Yes for about the fourth or fifth time at symphony hall this autumn, when I noticed that not only is there no Rick Wakeman (to be expected I suppose) there is also NO JON ANDERSON!!! I'm not sure that really counts as yes does it?
The Grand Wazoo
29-08-2009, 17:04
I heard they were going to rename themselves 'Maybe'
My Yes taste are few
The Yes Album
Drama
90125
I heard they were going to rename themselves 'Maybe'
:lolsign:
I saw 'Yes' as a student in '69 or '70 or '71. ( Don't ask me - if you can remember, you weren't there!). But John Anderson! Hated his weak and weedy voice with 'Yes' and 'The Alan Parson's Project', but somehow accepted and liked him working with Vangelis: 'State of Independance' and 'The Lives of Johnny Cairo' (?).
Discuss..............
Regards
DanJennings
30-08-2009, 09:16
:lolsign:
I saw 'Yes' as a student in '69 or '70 or '71. ( Don't ask me - if you can remember, you weren't there!). But John Anderson! Hated his weak and weedy voice with 'Yes' and 'The Alan Parson's Project', but somehow accepted and liked him working with Vangelis: 'State of Independance' and 'The Lives of Johnny Cairo' (?).
Discuss..............
Regards
Well each to their own, but I always thought his distinctive voice was integral to the sound.... Especially with 40 years of service under his belt, I'm surprised he was replaced.
having said that, there have been instances where a replacement singer has been good or even better, Dio with Sabbath and Bruce Dickinson with Maiden being two of the more obvious examples
Jon Anderson with the Alan Parsons Project? Are you sure? I've never heard that... I've heard the Jon and Vangelis stuff, and him singing with Mike Oldfield, but never Alan Parsons, but I'm sure you're right...
Haselsh1
30-08-2009, 14:45
Dan Jennings I'm so sure you're right... Jon Anderson was crucial to the overall uniqueness of the Yes sound. Had Yes not had Jon's voice I'm sure they would have just been another mediocre prog rock band. I'm sure a similar situation existed with Rush and Geddy Lee. When Rush ditched the Rickenbacker bass for the Wal they lost a great deal of their uniquness and impact. When Peter Gabriel decided to ditch Genesis, that band was irretrievably lost.
I never recall Jon Anderson working with Alan Parsons but never ever became a fan of that awful mundane Vangelis work. State of Independence just goes on and on and on and on and on and on and on.....
having said that, there have been instances where a replacement singer has been good or even better, Dio with Sabbath and Bruce Dickinson with Maiden being two of the more obvious examples
Yes Dio has a better voice than Ozzy and love his stuff with Ritchie but with Sabbeth it just does not sound right for me; the music Sabbath played had so much of Ozzy in its working class routes it no longer sounded like Sabbath with Dio
Agree with Bruce on Maiden
Well each to their own, but I always thought his distinctive voice was integral to the sound.... Especially with 40 years of service under his belt, I'm surprised he was replaced.
having said that, there have been instances where a replacement singer has been good or even better, Dio with Sabbath and Bruce Dickinson with Maiden being two of the more obvious examples
Jon Anderson with the Alan Parsons Project? Are you sure? I've never heard that... I've heard the Jon and Vangelis stuff, and him singing with Mike Oldfield, but never Alan Parsons, but I'm sure you're right...
Sorry Guys,
I was mixing up Jon Anderson with Colin Blunstone. Dislike both of them.
Still each to their own.
Haselsh1
31-08-2009, 21:24
Sorry Guys,
I was mixing up Jon Anderson with Colin Blunstone. Dislike both of them.
Still each to their own.
At least Jon Anderson has/had an iconic voice.
I'll listen again and if Mr Snapper still wants the original CD (I'll photo it first as some had silver lettering on black labels followed by black printing on the silver backing) he's welcome to it :)
Hi Dave
Any further news on the WYWH CD?
Hi Dave
Any further news on the WYWH CD?
?
Give me until the weekend, as the listening sessions haven't included this one.
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