Thorens TD160 rca cable replacement

[MarginWalker]

Hi all. I have inherited a Thorens TD 160. I have tried it out and everything appears to be in good working order - the motor runs silently and the speed is bang on. The only issue is that there is intermittent sound from each channel. This can be rectified by moving the cable around a bit but any further movement can result in the channel dropping out or a very noticeable hum. I guess that I need to replace the cable - can anyone advise on the best way to do this? Should I just cut down an existing cable or buy a purpose made one from ebay? Do I need one with an earth wire?

Are there any other cheap and easy mods that anyone can recommend that will lift the performance if this lovely old table?

Many thanks,
Phil

[walpurgis]

It would be handy if you bought a cheap meter to check continuity. Check the headshell wires going to the cartridge are not loose (very gently with small tweezers). The signal cable is probably OK. Take the phono plugs apart and check they are soldered properly. A break at that point could be the problem. Just a case of using a smallish soldering iron to remake the joint. If that's not the cause, take the main platter & mat off. Tie the arm safely in its rest and turn the turntable over being careful not to put weight on the arm. Take the base board off and check the soldered joints where the cable meets the tag strip and remake any bad or broken soldered joints.

[MarginWalker]

Thanks, Geoff. I should be able to borrow a meter to check but I'm pretty sure it is the cables. They feel pretty brittle and when I move the rca connectors around at the end of the cable the signal comes and goes. The phono plugs are the originals so one formed piece of plastics it's integrated plugs so I'm not sure how I would go about taking those apart?
Phil

[walpurgis]

I'm assuming the plugs must be the moulded on type then. Putting a decent new phono cable on is an easy and cheap job. A new cable and good plugs would probably improve the sound quality too.

Where in Surrey are you? You're probably not that far from me. I could bung one on there for you if you brought it over.

[DSJR]

You could replace the RCA's, which were a weak point as I remember. A new 'original spec' belt is mandatory here and I'd probably suggest a different mat too, either a cheap cork one from eBay (one or two sellers do a large centre hole version for these Thorens decks), or an NAS SpaceMat, both types offering good sound IME and not costing the earth. The TD160 Super heavy mat is good too, but you may need to lift the suspension to deal with the extra mass and this could lead you into trouble if the deck you have has the black cam washers below the springs, which are used for centring it all up and are usually locked in place with blue? paint...

As for tweaks, there are loads and far more than can be got in a reply such as this... One for best hum-free reproduction could be to look underneath (clamp the suspension up first with the transit screws) at the audio terminal block, disconnect the tie-wire that links the chassis earthing to the audio returns/screens and then run a separate wire from the chassis to the amp earth connection. Loads of European turntable-arm combinations did this in the 70's and it was as much to do with cost cutting, as well as the horrible DIN connections as much as anything else I think.

Be VERY careful should you want to tinker with the suspension as it'll take you ages to sort it out if you're not experienced in this sort of thing. I promise I'm not being patronising here, but I used to set these up with different arms and my Linn training came in VERY handy, as well as the Linn set-up jig which the deck fits (just).

[MarginWalker]

Thanks for the advice guys. I am in Reigate so I guess not too far from you but I quite fancy trying my hand with a soldering iron for the first time in 20 years! Many thanks for the offer though, Geoff.
I will have a look at cork mats on ebay, thanks for the tip. I have no intention of messing with the suspension so no worries there.
I have found the following cable on ebay...
http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/400674215253?nav=SEARCH
Is it a good idea to get something like this of just strip a set of shop bought cables? Do you know of I need something with an earth attached at both ends for this deck? The ebay seller has cables with and without.

Thanks again
Phil

[walpurgis]

It won't hurt to have an earth flylead. After all, you don't have to connect it if you don't want to and it could be handy if you get a hum problem.

[Mr Kipling]

You could simply cut two of the plugs off a RCA lead that is flexible. It would be cheaper than the item linked. If you're not in a rush, I'll see what I have, if you'd like.

[The Barbarian]

Which model is it & is it a Thorens arm?

[MarginWalker]

Barbarian - it is a mk1 with a tp-16 arm. Everything about the deck appears to be stock. I can post up some pics if that would be of any use?

Stephen - thanks for the kind offer, everyone on here seems very generous! I think I will go for the ebay cables just as they are already stripped and have the earth cables. This is my first foray into any sort of electronics since GCSE physics so I am aiming for the simplest procedure possible. Once I have done this one perhaps I will be more adventurous on my next project!

Thanks all,
Phil

[Mr Kipling]

You could just buy some buy some wire strippers! I know the seller mentions Thorens in his ad but you could replace that with numerous others that have an integrated arm and use a terminal strip. It's your choice, however.

[struth]

You could just buy some buy some wire strippers! I know the seller mentions Thorens in his ad but you could replace that with numerous others that have an integrated arm and use a terminal strip. It's your choice, however.

Yep, any decent tonearm rca cable will do; whatever tickles your fancy.:)

[The Barbarian]

No need Phil i know the deck

Easiest way if you keeping it original is make up a brand new interconnect lead from the white plastic terminal strip out. Id also remove the earth from the Sub Chassis to top plate, make new ones with new solder lugs, clean around the fixing holes & refit them.. see how it goes.

[MarginWalker]

Sounds like I am being a bit of a wimp when it comes to the cables and that I should just buy some and strip them myself? Any suggestions for a half decent but flexible cable? I would call myself a beginner when it comes to soldering and after looking inside the TT it looks like a bit of a tight fit in and around the strip..

Also, forgive my ignorance but what materials will I need for a new earth?

Thanks,
Phil

[struth]

There is nothing wrong with the ones you selected on Ebay so by all means go with them if you dont have the tools and practice etc. they are a reasonable price even taking postage into consideration. If you fancy doing it yourself from scratch then you'll need a soldering iron, solder and a few hand tools. Wire strippers side snips etc. also if just buying bare cable, you would need 2 rca's. It is not difficult but can be fiddly. as an aside to that fitting a thicker bottom plate would make a terrific difference. you can use the old one as a template. something like 10/15 mm board would be good. You can usually buy them ready made on the bay.

[walpurgis]

How about this:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Van-Damme-Shotgun-Audio-Twin-Interconnect-Audio-Cable-by-the-metre-/200984731042?pt=UK_Computing_Sound_Vision_Audio_Ca bles_Adapters&hash=item2ecb9f9da2

Good cable Van Damme.

As for an earth flylead, pop into Maplins and get some thin stranded wire and a smallish spade connector.

Plenty of phono plugs on eBay and in Maplins (Maplins do silver solder and irons too).

You could use a bit of heat shrink sleeving to keep the earth wire tight to the phono cable so it looks tidy.

[MarginWalker]

Hi again all. I have taken the bottom plate off to have a look and the rca cables are attached to the strip via some sort of right angle spade attachments. Should I be removing these along with the cables and then just attach directly to the metal post or should I be re using the right angle attachment?


13830


Thanks
Phil

[struth]

I doubt you would get the old cable out and still be able to use them tbh. Probably best just to solder them direct on to the strip. or if you wanted you could buy new spades although you then need a crimper. I'd solder them and you'll get a good connection. fit some kind of outercable grip if there is not one there to the tt somewhere as you would in a plugtop so the cable wont get yanked.

[walpurgis]

You may find it easier just to use an alternative tag strip.

Something like this:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Solder-Tag-Strip-Board-Epoxy-Single-Double-Row-3-5-Contacts-Model-Railway-Signal-/251557104505?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Suppl ies_ET&var=&hash=item3a91f8cb79

The single row five terminal one should do.

[MarginWalker]

Thanks, Grant. Good tip about the grip - I hadn't thought about that. I will give it a go tomorrow I think. I am going to buy some RCA cables and strip one end and see how I get on. I'll let you know the results!

Thanks again to everyone for all your help!
Phil

[struth]

PS, always draw a diagram b4 you remove anything, that way if you get confused as I do you can look and see where everything was originally.

[MarginWalker]

Will do, Grant. Diagrams and pictures galore for when I inevitably forget what goes where. By the way I saw your thread on your Mk2 TD160 - very impressive. It seems there is lots that can be done to improve these TTs, once I have got mine up and running I will see if I have inspiration to try any of the mods and upgrades.

Ta,
Phil

[MarginWalker]

All done. The Thorens is all set up and sounding great. It has taken the place of the Rega RP3 for the moment.

13834

Thanks again to everyone for all the advice, just need to work out which TT stays in the living room and which is used for the bedroom system.

Phil

[walpurgis]

That's good.

If it was me. I'd have the Thorens in the main system. I prefer them to the Regas.

I don't think you mentioned what cartridge you were using, but that TP16 arm has the right sort of mass for a Moving Coil cartridge and the cast headshell is reasonably rigid and inert. If you only have an MM input, you could try a Denon DL-110 or something else in the way of a high output MC. That could make an improvement.

[struth]

Looking good Phil. :)

http://theartofsound.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=13834&d=1421961458

[MarginWalker]

Just using an ortofon om10 at the moment. I've never tried a MC cartridge before so would be keen to try one. Any recommendations for a reasonably priced one?

Thanks, Struth. I'm liking having a more vintage looking TT on the go. The sound is very different to the Rega too so it is making a nice change.

P

[walpurgis]

Just using an ortofon om10 at the moment. I've never tried a MC cartridge before so would be keen to try one. Any recommendations for a reasonably priced one?

P

As I suggested. Denon DL-110, it's a good High Output MC. Ask Grant (struth), he got one recently and I believe he's rather fond of it.

They are not too expensive, around £160 new from the right seller and good used ones, less than £100.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-DL-110-moving-coil-cartridge-In-the-UK-for-next-day-delivery-/261724569113?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_Turntables&hash=item3ceffffe19

I've had a couple myself, so I know what they're like.

[struth]

As I suggested. Denon DL-110, it's a good High Output MC. Ask Grant (struth), he got one recently and I believe he's rather fond of it.

They are not too expensive, around £160 new from the right seller and good used ones, less than £100.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-DL-110-moving-coil-cartridge-In-the-UK-for-next-day-delivery-/261724569113?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_Turntables&hash=item3ceffffe19

I've had a couple myself, so I know what they're like.

Yes, I actually have 2 now although one is just a sitting in the box as I have not used it yet. Very good cart for the cash, and work nicely through a mm stage. They like to be set up pretty exact though, especially azimuth wise.

[MarginWalker]

Thanks fellas - I will give one a go when funds allow.
P

[MarginWalker]

I have had a check and this turntable appears to be running with next to no bearing oil. Any recommendations for a good brand to use?

Thanks,
Phil

[struth]

This (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111334073285?_trksid=p2060778.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT) is good, but gearbox oil will do as well and even clock or gun oil. Just dont overfill. only needs a little

[The Barbarian]

I always use those little bottles of J.A Michell oil.

[MarginWalker]

I have had a look at gear oil as I would like to pick something up tomorrow. Everything I have looked comes in litre bottles. I have seen 3 in 1 oil recommended elsewhere. Will that do the job do you think?

[struth]

I have had a look at gear oil as I would like to pick something up tomorrow. Everything I have looked comes in litre bottles. I have seen 3 in 1 oil recommended elsewhere. Will that do the job do you think?

It is a light oil and should be ok I'd think, although not tried it.

[MarginWalker]

Cheers, Grant. I'll see what they have to choose from at Halfords tomorrow.
P