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David Price
10-08-2009, 22:08
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/TECHNICS-SL-120-OLD-SKOOL-RECORDS-DECK-DIRECT-DRIVE_W0QQitemZ320410596986QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_A udioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Turntables?hash=it em4a99f5b67a&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14#ht_500wt_1182

chris@panteg
11-08-2009, 00:52
Hi David

You are not becomming a techy fanbois are you perchance;)

Beechwoods
11-08-2009, 04:32
Hmm - before anyone gets carried away with the moment, beware that the seller's got some pretty crap feedback and can't even come up with a picture of the actual deck he's selling. A sure-fire way to a disappointing purchase.

twelvebears
11-08-2009, 06:41
Hmm - before anyone gets carried away with the moment, beware that the seller's got some pretty crap feedback and can't even come up with a picture of the actual deck he's selling. A sure-fire way to a disappointing purchase.

My thoughts exactly! I've managed 108 feedback without putting a foot wrong, and I've not done anything out of the ordinary, so how crap must he/she be?

I wouldn't care how long the barge-pole was!

Dave Cawley
11-08-2009, 07:54
It came with a factory fitted Technics SME armplate, back to the future?

Dave

DSJR
11-08-2009, 10:07
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/TECHNICS-SL-120-OLD-SKOOL-RECORDS-DECK-DIRECT-DRIVE_W0QQitemZ320410596986QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_A udioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Turntables?hash=it em4a99f5b67a&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14#ht_500wt_1182

Feedback special - those feet have GOT to be replaced (same thing for SL110). My BC2's were used with one of these as source with SME and either V15 III or ADC XLM II

REM
11-08-2009, 18:25
Forget that one, the real deal at a bargain price is HERE (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Technics-SL-110-With-Wooden-Armboard-And-SME-3-Arm_W0QQitemZ220426639445QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Aud ioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Turntables?hash=item 3352739855&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14):lolsign:

Cheers

Marco
11-08-2009, 18:42
Now that's more like it!!!

Marco.

hifi_dave
11-08-2009, 19:09
Forget that one, the real deal at a bargain price is HERE (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Technics-SL-110-With-Wooden-Armboard-And-SME-3-Arm_W0QQitemZ220426639445QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Aud ioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Turntables?hash=item 3352739855&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14):lolsign:

Cheers

The price is steeeeep. I bought one of those a few weeks ago, with an SME Series 2 Imp and Shure M75ED for £400 'Buy it now'.....:scratch:

Marco
11-08-2009, 19:45
Yes, dahling Dave, and you've kept rather quiet about how it's performing ;)

Come on, spill da beans!

Marco.

hifi_dave
11-08-2009, 21:14
I just haven't found the time. I almost fitted an Ortofon SL15 to it yesterday but something more important came up. All I can say, with some certainty, is that it revolves at a steady speed and it looks bloody wonderful.:smoking:

Spectral Morn
11-08-2009, 21:46
The price is steeeeep. I bought one of those a few weeks ago, with an SME Series 2 Imp and Shure M75ED for £400 'Buy it now'.....:scratch:

Having looked at audiogold on and off over the last few years, and IMHO of course, I think that their prices on much of what they do is very dear. Gold in their name says it all.

Regards D S D L

Barry
11-08-2009, 22:03
Forget that one, the real deal at a bargain price is HERE (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Technics-SL-110-With-Wooden-Armboard-And-SME-3-Arm_W0QQitemZ220426639445QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Aud ioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Turntables?hash=item 3352739855&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14):lolsign:

Cheers

Interesting - I think it was precisely this deck that the Linn loonies would cite as an example of what is bad about the turntables de jour, and why the LP12 was the only deck that could play records!! (??????????...)

Know which of the two I would prefer!

Regards

Marco
11-08-2009, 22:21
I just haven't found the time. I almost fitted an Ortofon SL15 to it yesterday but something more important came up. All I can say, with some certainty, is that it revolves at a steady speed and it looks bloody wonderful.:smoking:

Nice one! *But* do let us know how it performs against those flimsy rubber band things that you sell :lol:

;) ;)

Marco.

DSJR
11-08-2009, 23:27
The SL110/SME wasn't as musical or clear as an LP12 with SME and same cartridge at the time and that's before changing the SME for a Grace 707. I suspect that today and with different support and better feet, the SL110 and 120 may perform better. They have VERY lively plinths though (speaking as someone who changed an SL110 for a Linn and with a mate who changed his SL120 for a TD160 Super and claimed an improvement in sound at the time [30 years ago]).

Marco
12-08-2009, 07:47
Interesting, Dave.

I've not played around with one, but I would've thought that an optimally functioning SL-110 (with a decent arm and cartridge) was as good as or if not better than a SL-1200/1210 (or even a PL-71), which even when un-modified, doesn't display the traits you mention...

I look forward to reading what t'other Dave thinks when he gets a chance to post something a little bit more in-depth on the matter :)

Marco.

David Price
13-08-2009, 01:22
Scary - I've 'been through' 3 SL110s in my time; all good but not great. Amazing that they're going for this sort of money, and ridiculous too. A Timestep SL1200 would annihilate it, for a lot less money, and still be working in 20 years! Still, you pays your money...

Marco
13-08-2009, 06:47
Hi David,

This is intriguing... I've not heard an SL-110, but Time Step PSU aside, why, given the same arm and cartridge, would it not sound just as good as a stock SL-1200/1210?

The motor unit is the same, is it not? (or better, if as quoted in the ad it's the same as the one used in an SP10).

And the wooden plinth looks as 'substantial' to me as the plinth used on the SL-1200/1210, therefore I'm just trying to understand the rationale as to why the 110 is apparently so inferior... :)

Can someone else or you help me out?

Marco.

chris@panteg
13-08-2009, 08:17
I think Dave has stated , it appears very feedback sensitive and highly resonant '
if you look at the history of Panasonic/Technics turntables 'you will see around the late 70's they started looking at ' and dealing more effectively with damping and feedback.

Its a bit like the Lenco's and Garrard's ' today we have better understanding of what sort of plinth they need to work at there best .

Marco
13-08-2009, 08:41
Hi Chris,

I suspected that's what it might be, however looks most certainly are deceiving, as the plinth on the 110 looks pretty good from here! Given your perfectly logical rationale, one wonders though why then the Pioneer PL-71 (of a similar vintage) is already 'sorted' in that area - or at least ecstatic reports from users have never indicated any problems with plinths.

This would suggest that Pioneer were more ahead of the time with their designs than Technics...

I think you're right though, which makes one wonder what the 110 motor unit would sound like housed in a better plinth. Looking at the motor unit alone, platter, etc, it does look 'chunkier' than that of the SL-1200/1210, from the pictures at least :)

If I owned an SL-110 like Dave's I'd certainly be optimising it to within an inch of its life, whereby I reckon it would sound as good as any SL-1200/1210 - and you'd also have the benefits of its gorgeous 'classic' (non-'DJ deck') looks into the bargain! :smoking:

Marco.

Dave Cawley
13-08-2009, 08:49
The SL-110 is a sort of early SP-10MkI but without quartz lock or even any sort of feedback. It's just an electric motor really!

So it's not a SL-1200 sort of thing and not a SP-10MKII, hence it's in no mans land.

Looks nice though!

Regards

Dave

chris@panteg
13-08-2009, 09:26
Hi Marco and Dave

Dave are you saying then that timing ' and rhythm ' is all over the shop, hence why so many traded up to the LP12 ' .

I remember Guy saying it had a strange Grey blandness to its tone .

Marco regarding the PL71 ' i would take everything so far stated with a pinch of salt until you hear it for yourself ' i don't see Steve trading up his SP10 for one ' i am sure it is very good and am very keen to hear one ' but it is pretty rare ' and there may be a synergy going on with Richard 's amps perhaps ?

Marco
13-08-2009, 10:08
Interesting stuff, chaps.

Dave,


The SL-110 is a sort of early SP-10MkI but without quartz lock or even any sort of feedback. It's just an electric motor really!

So it's not a SL-1200 sort of thing and not a SP-10MKII, hence it's in no mans land.


That explains a lot - cheers. With that and the plinth I can now see why the 110 wouldn't be as good :)

There's definitely potential there, though!

Chris,

Don't worry, the jury is still out on the PL-71 until I hear one for myself. Like you say, it could be a synergy thing, but if fundamentally the plinth is 'wrong' and resonant like that in the SL-110 (which I'm not saying definitely that it is) then as far as I'm concerned it's broken from the off, regardless of the effects of any 'synergy'.

Time will tell when I everntually get to hear one :smoking:

No wonder though given these suggested limitations, that Jap direct-drives of the era were slated so much compared to the old fruitbox!! If only the sceptics (and cynics) of the time had heard what they were really capable of... But, would the flat-earth mafia of the day merely have covered it up to protect their dogmatic agendas?

Mmmm......

Marco.

Beobloke
13-08-2009, 10:50
Well my recently acquired SL110 sounds very nice to my ears, thanks very much, when loaded up with Jelco SA750-D and Goldring 2500! :ner:

It's going to stay that was as I'm not interested in 'maxing' it and I'm on the hunt for an SME3009 to match it for the ultimate retro effect, but I agree the plinth isn't all that great and is definitely holding it back from greatness.

RobHolt
13-08-2009, 22:52
The price is steeeeep. I bought one of those a few weeks ago, with an SME Series 2 Imp and Shure M75ED for £400 'Buy it now'.....:scratch:

Just need so sell that dreadful, atrocious, music-killing, vile excuse for a tonearm. People pay huge sums for 'the worst tonearm in the world'.

David Price
14-08-2009, 23:55
Why don't you purloin the Quartz Lock from one of your SL1200s, Adam? That might put a tiger in the SL110's tank!

DSJR
15-08-2009, 20:00
Now look 'ere fella's...

The SL110/120 series were designed in the days of 1 gramme trackers and these motors were torquey enough as it was, so not having quartz lock is irrelevant to the period. the SL1700 version of this motor (cannot be that different apart from simpler build) showed no slowing under load with their test cart (DV20A?), unlike all the belt drives, so even then, it cannot be that bad. I have to dsay that up-market from that, we were selling the Dual 701 (OK, I use one still) fitted with either V15III or Ortofon M15e Super/M20FL Super - the 701 being one deck that could make a V15III sound sweet toned..

Apart from the motor torque and speed locking, the main difference with those decks and the current model is that the old 'uns were hollow inside and the 110 and 120 had very solid looking feet with little isolation. On a shelf, feedback (as in "howlround") was easy to achieve, hence my recommendation for better feet and support in general..

Regarding the LP12, the early versions of this deck were basically "blue-printed" TD150's and sounded that way. The juicy bass wasn't so bad until the Ittok appeared and otherwise band-limited 1970's prog and jazz-rock LP's had more "swing" to them via the LP12 - pr@t and musicality had nothing to do with it back in 1976.

I must add that in it's price range, the SL1700 was a good seller for us, having superior isolation (due to its sprung sub-chassis) and the arm happily took the more basic MC cartridges of the day - the Dynavector (Ultimo) 20A and 10X being a popular choice with it. The mk2 versions tended to compete with tweaked TD160BC with third party arms as well as the LP12 and after the late seventies, Technics seemed to go down-market in the UK, Sony following ten to fifteen years later, their better models not being imported by then.

chris@panteg
16-08-2009, 12:26
Dave ' fantastic post ' your knowledge and experience is almost overwhelming , the late 70's and early eighty's must have been the golden age of vinyl playback and hifi in general ' arguably ! .

Mike Reed
16-08-2009, 19:19
Dave ' fantastic post ' your knowledge and experience is almost overwhelming , the late 70's and early eighty's must have been the golden age of vinyl playback and hifi in general ' arguably ! .

Go back a decade and you may be right.

David Price
16-08-2009, 21:16
hmmm... not sure about quartz lock being irrelevant!

Quartz-lock dramatically improved speed stability of direct drives; just because it's a DD doesn't mean it's necessarily speed-stable (it just means it's more speed-stable than belt drive!). You mustn't underestimate the importance of Quartz Lock; all the Jap super decks had it; that's no coincidence. The golden age of DD was from 1977 onwards, when QL was fitted to top decks, but they hadn't been cost cut. In 1977 £1 bought you 600 Yen, by 1982 it was closer to 300. All Jap stuff started getting de-engineered from around 1981 onwards. So you want to be aiming at 1978-80 decks ideally; top build, no cost cut, but QL used as a matter of course.

Anyone who's got a DD deck with switchable QL can soon hear whether it's 'irrelevant' or not!

chris@panteg
16-08-2009, 22:05
David

I prefer QL but there are a number of DD fans that dislike it and prefer non QL '

David Price
16-08-2009, 22:24
fascinating - I'd be interested to know why and on what decks?

Marco
16-08-2009, 22:36
Yes, Chris, I've seen 'he of NVA' mention something about that when waxing lyrical about the PL-71, which I believe is non-QL.

I'd like the rationale behind such assertions explained - and in some detail before I'd attach any credibility to it.

Until then, I'm with David on the (to me) obvious sonic benefits of QL :)

Marco.

Mike
16-08-2009, 23:29
I believe my DP-3000 is 'lacking' QL... I'm in no hurry to change it though. :)

Marco
16-08-2009, 23:53
Are you sure, Mikey? I thought all Denon D/Ds were QL...

Marco.

Mike
17-08-2009, 09:26
Can't be certain, but I'm pretty sure it's servo controlled. And it's got that tape head thingy under the platter.

Dave Cawley
17-08-2009, 09:55
The DP-3000 is not quartz locked, but it is frequency locked (sort of). Almost, but not quite the same thing. Very few people really understand DD systems I'm afraid.

Regards

Dave

Mike
17-08-2009, 10:13
Here's a bit of gumpf I purloined fro elsewhere...

With the DP-3000/6000 direct drive turntable's Denon developed advanced servo mechanisms, high quality AC servo motors and implemented precise manufacturing techniques which allowed them to accomplish high speed accuracy and a high S/N ratio which allowed the tables to deliver high sound quality.

With the succeeding generation of tables (the DP-75/80) Denon focused on dealing with the problem of acoustic feedback and external vibrations created by the motor and other sources. Extraneous vibration can inject "echoes" or "ringing" which is conceptually similar to the "smearing" introduced by some digital technologies.

Denon dealt with the problem through a multi tiered approach. The platter was designed with two separate pieces each with a different mode of vibration so that they worked together to cancel out any vibration from reaching the record. In addition they are separated from each other via springs and dampers which isolate the record from any motor or cabinet vibration. The Mat was developed with laser holography to work in concert with the platter to further reduce vibration.

The quartz magnetic detection system uses 1000 pulses recorded on the inner rim of the platter which is read by a magnetic head whose reading is compared to the reference signal and speed is adjusted accordingly.

The DP-75 weighs 10 kg which is the same as the DP-80. A bi directional servo allows electronic braking without reversing. The DK-110 base was intended for the DP-75 but bases made for the DP-3000/6000 can be used as well.

The DP-75/80 was developed to a very high level and was Denon's last attempt at a high quality platter system. They are currently in demand on the used market.

DSJR
17-08-2009, 10:20
Quartz locking isn't everything and can have difficulties, as Dave Cawley has found with the 1210, there being (according to a page he posted) some sort of slight high frequency varience (or summat) in standard form, adding a sort of "zing" to the proceedings - please verify Dave. Non quartz decks shouldn't have this as long as they don't hunt all round the nominal speed. Denons were pretty good as I remember, there being other arm and plinth related issues instead. The better Technics non-quartz motors were ok as well, although I remember they made at least one stinker - the SL2000, which hunted all over the place at anything over 1.5 grammes playing weight. The poor quality arm didn't help either, as it wouldn't take more delicate cartridges..

Dave Cawley
17-08-2009, 11:56
some sort of slight high frequency variance (or summat) in standard form, adding a sort of "zing" to the proceedings - please verify Dave. Non quartz decks shouldn't have this

No, there is no zing, not sure where this came from? I dare say that the DP-3000 has the reference frequency superimposed on the motor power feed, but to what degree, and in this case does it mater?

I know and understand the SL-1200 series and the SP-10 MkII

Quartz doesn't do anything, but the design does. I simply can't explain this in less than 4+ 20 minute lectures! and even then we would not cover everything.

One simply cannot generalise or over-simplify, each turntable has a different design and approach.

Regards

Dave

DSJR
17-08-2009, 15:45
I should bloody well check the relevant website pages and link to them, shouldn't I?

http://www.soundhifi.com/sl1200/SL1200%20PSU.htm

That explains my half-baked reasoning... Supply ripple, not a "zing....." Can't even blame alcohol consumption either ;)

Hopefully not a problem to offer this link.

David Price
17-08-2009, 22:07
that's right - the pre-78 Denons weren't quartz locked, but frequency locked, and they had a tape head under the inner platter periphery, with a magnetic pulse encoded. Similar system to the Sony, and a very good one. High end Denon DDs are *very* well regarded in Japan; they were almost all used by NHK (Japanese version of BBC), whereas commercial radio tended to use Technics. Sadly my DP3000 died, so I gave it to Denon UK. Maybe I should ask for it back, if Dave can fix it??? Maybe a feature beckons?

NRG
18-08-2009, 09:28
No, there is no zing, not sure where this came from? I dare say that the DP-3000 has the reference frequency superimposed on the motor power feed, but to what degree, and in this case does it mater?

I know and understand the SL-1200 series and the SP-10 MkII

Quartz doesn't do anything, but the design does. I simply can't explain this in less than 4+ 20 minute lectures! and even then we would not cover everything.

One simply cannot generalise or over-simplify, each turntable has a different design and approach.

Regards

Dave

Oh go on Dave, give it a try. I for one would be very interested to read about this. I studied servo systems and PLL ccts years ago and have some theories why QL is not prefered by some and why it could be inferior if not implemented correctly. QL IMHO is not the be all of DD as DavidP seems to suggest...

Marco
18-08-2009, 09:45
I agree, Neal. However, the operative words are "implemented correctly", which most certainly is the case in the SP10 and SL-1200/1210 :)

Marco.

NRG
18-08-2009, 09:53
I agree, Neal. However, the operative words are "implemented correctly", which most certainly is the case in the SP10 and SL-1200/1210 :)

Marco.

How do we know its implemented correctly? That's why I hope Dave can spread a little insight... Remember I have an SP10 on Slate plinth and while I love what it does a PL71 and G99 idler are keeping it away from my system at the moment.

Dave Cawley
18-08-2009, 10:06
I'll do a lecture at an event, but not a 'trial by news list' !!

David, recover your DP3000, if the motor isn't burnt out, and I very much doubt it, I'll have a go?

Regards

Dave

DSJR
18-08-2009, 15:11
I don't think you'd be "tried" here at all.. By the way, the "zing" I was w@nking on about was referred to in Mr Price's review - ahem - ........;)

The trouble with these direct drives is that they take all the fun out of the religious aspects of record playing - you know, you lightly press a button and the thing springs almost instantly to speed. Dab this button again and it stops almost instantaneously (well, the SP10 does). Once set up there's no faffing around with suspensions, cords or rubber bands, turning belts and mats upside down, you know what I mean. Even the Denon 103's don't favour one kind of cut over another - they just play the record as best as their conical tips will allow..... How boring :D

Seriously, I'd love an SP10. It just takes over so brilliantly from where the 301/401's and TD124's leave off and does its job without looking like a blingy cutting lathe replica as so many far eastern and US top end decks do.

For now, I look forward to getting the pre-drilled TD125 board and fitting the R200 on it (I've never owned a TD125 or used one for any length of time, so here goes). One day, I'll also get the SL150 going with the Grace, which should be a fair combo I think and in the meantime, the lightly tweaked old Dual 701 sounds better than ever :) :)

CD? never heard of it.........

Clive
19-08-2009, 08:30
How do we know its implemented correctly? That's why I hope Dave can spread a little insight... Remember I have an SP10 on Slate plinth and while I love what it does a PL71 and G99 idler are keeping it away from my system at the moment.
Interesting Neal that you're still not 100% happy with the sound from your SP10. I know someone else who's compared an SP10 to a couple of other decks which happen to be idlers, one Versus driven. I'm told the SP10 in was a tad tiring to listen to whilst still being excellent in many areas.

Dave Cawley
19-08-2009, 08:42
As with any turntable, the SP-10 is dependant on the plinth, arm and cartridge, also almost every one out there has slipped out of specification, hence our restorative service!

My SP-10 on a solid wooden plinth, SME V and Shelter 501 is lovely. Other prefer slate................

Regards

Dave

NRG
19-08-2009, 14:20
Dave, if my SP10 is out of spec. how would I tell? IE what would the symptoms be? All voltages are spot on and clean...

Dave Cawley
19-08-2009, 14:57
What does the waveform on the motor drivers look like? Did you adjust the PLL setting?

Regards

Dave

NRG
19-08-2009, 19:03
From memory Dave I think it was OK, however I may not be interpreting it correctly so could next week take a 'scope shot and post it for you to take a quick look at, if that's OK....

Dave Cawley
19-08-2009, 19:42
Did you check both?

Dave

David Price
21-08-2009, 23:06
Hi Dave - yep, I'll try to grab it back, assuming Denon UK haven't chucked it in a skip by now.

Please everyone, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying every QL deck is better than every non-QL. I am not that stupid. Life isn't ever that simple. But all other things being equal, properly implemented QL is better than no QL. The problem was of course that most 1980 onwards decks had QL, even at the bottom of the range, which gave great measured performance, but didn't actually sound as good is it should because of the overly 'stiff' servo (and all sorts of related things, almost all of which were related to designers making the deck more cheaply by using inferior motors, and using the QL to cover their tracks, at least as far as basic measured performance was concerned).

My point was simply that if you're going for a high end Jap DD, it's generally preferable to aim for a QL one. Hence the PL600X over the PL71, DP2000 over DP3000, etc. I repeat that I never said, nor implied, that QL is a universal panacea. It's just the better place to start from, all things considered.

Mike
21-08-2009, 23:15
Just get a DP-100 and be done with it! :lol:

Err, no pun intended with the 'DP' bit! :)

Alex_UK
21-08-2009, 23:24
I thought of an entirely different "DP" with that comment, Mike, with your new avatar. Spit roasted rabbit, per chance? :lol: Sorry, too many sherberts!

Mike
21-08-2009, 23:34
Oh dear... settle down now! Have you been looking at too many 'left handed websites'? :lol:

Alex_UK
21-08-2009, 23:36
www.typewithonehand.com? :D I'm off to bed. to sleep! :lol:

Mike
21-08-2009, 23:44
Night night. :)

NRG
25-08-2009, 16:46
Did you check both?

Dave

Hi Dave, I've gone back and checked a few things, the voltages are all spot on and without any noise.

The VR101 and 102 control board adjustment 'scope traces are below:

First at 33.3rpm, near enough 6.3ms but there's not more adjustment left on VR101...2ms / div

http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l82/_NRG_/other/33rpm_6_3ms.jpg

45rpm is in spec and here is the 78rpm VR102 trace, just about spot on for 2.7ms....1ms / div

http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l82/_NRG_/other/78rpm_2_7ms.jpg

However, of more concern is the trace from test point C2:

http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l82/_NRG_/other/C2_motor_drive_T1.jpg

2v / div and 5us / div. The manual states 180us and 10vpp but mine seems to be just under 9v and 18us.....is the 180us a misprint?

And lastly, a trace from the logic board P1 0.5v / div and 0.2us /div, this does not look good to me either....

http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l82/_NRG_/other/P2_p5v_p2us.jpg

Your thoughts / comments would be most welcome....thank you.

NRG
26-08-2009, 09:37
I've now adjusted T1 to give the 10vpp at C2 and double checking the P1 o/p is looks to be very close to the 0.29uS stated in the manual....so I'm assuming the deck is now in spec.....

Dave Cawley
26-08-2009, 09:54
Hi Neal

Yes, your deck is OK and well done! T1 does drift and it causes all sorts of seemingly unrelated problems. What is the motor drive like? the output of one of the three pairs of complimentary drivers, and under a little load? any noise?

Regards

Dave

NRG
26-08-2009, 09:58
Hi Dave, thank you! I'll check a little later... :)

NRG
26-08-2009, 10:29
OK here's the o/p from A1, A2 & 3 are very much the same.

I don't know if this is good or bad....the wave form gets worse with a little load....

http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l82/_NRG_/other/Motor_A1.jpg