Best Silver Solder?

[Ammonite Audio]

I'm confused about the different types of WBT silver solder (eg 800, 805), and interested to know what folks use for soldering silver wires, plugs etc. I have some Cardas Quad Eutectic solder, which has silver in it, but also lead - it's nice stuff to use but is there any point in going lead-free silver loaded for purely personal use?

BTW, I have a good Weller WSD81 soldering station, so it's easy to set the right temperature; something that might otherwise matter with a simple fixed temperature soldering iron.

Thanks in advance for guidance/experience

[The Barbarian]

I always used to use 'Wonder Solder' at one point, but been using WBT 0805 LMP Silver solder for quite some time..

[Reffc]

I'm confused about the different types of WBT silver solder (eg 800, 805), and interested to know what folks use for soldering silver wires, plugs etc. I have some Cardas Quad Eutectic solder, which has silver in it, but also lead - it's nice stuff to use but is there any point in going lead-free silver loaded for purely personal use?

BTW, I have a good Weller WSD81 soldering station, so it's easy to set the right temperature; something that might otherwise matter with a simple fixed temperature soldering iron.

Thanks in advance for guidance/experience

No...in a nutshell. For personal use, there is nothing whatsoever to recommend any lead free solders by. If you take care (use latex gloves or wash hands thoroughly after use and use a fume extractor when soldering), risks to health are manageable to perfectly acceptable limits. Lead free solders pose almost as much risk to health due to toxic fumes during soldering (very little difference from leaded in that respect).

Leaded solders offer lower melting points, less risk of longer term dendritic whisker formation (a well known phenomenon which has led to shorting between tracks in many pcbs with time) and decreased risk of dry solder joints. It's for that reason that critical apparatus for some medical and defence use has an exemption from lead free solder use.

Cardas quad eutectic is about as good as it gets although they seemed to have changed the formulation this past 12 months and not for the better. I think it was changed to reduce the amount of noxious vapours given off by the flux when soldering but I have found that it does have a slight tendency to clump and doesn't flow as well as older formulations.

Worth checking out RS Components own leaded silver solder. Lower silver content (which actually doesn't matter in the scheme of things since it is still suitable for soldering silver and silver plated connections). Their Multicore branded leaded solders also remain a firm favourite with me.

I tend to look for solders with low melting points, so they are encouraged to rapid melting (reducing component heat time and temperature which is a good thing), and which have a good rosin/multicore flux allowing for rapid spread of solder to joint surfaces and a good cleansing of the surface to be soldered.

[The Barbarian]

Completely rebuild my Ferrograph amp with 'Wonder Solder' it was a joy to use..I use Leaded version

[istari_knight]

Complete waste of money IMO but each to their own / its a free country etc :D

[Wakefield Turntables]

Complete waste of money IMO but each to their own / its a free country etc :D

Why?

[istari_knight]

What's wrong with bog standard 60/40 ?

4% silver content will not make a jot of difference, it just bollox like most stuff in this hobby which seems to attract a disproportionate number of gullibles. You'll be telling me you believe in god next :rolleyes: ;)

[Wakefield Turntables]

What's wrong with bog standard 60/40 ?

4% silver content will not make a jot of difference, it just bollox like most stuff in this hobby which seems to attract a disproportionate number of gullibles. ;)

That made me laugh :lol:

[istari_knight]

That made me laugh :lol:

I aim to please :D

[Reffc]

What's wrong with bog standard 60/40 ?

4% silver content will not make a jot of difference, it just bollox like most stuff in this hobby which seems to attract a disproportionate number of gullibles. You'll be telling me you believe in god next :rolleyes: ;)

Not necessarily so James. A mix of copper/silver/lead/tin in the right quantities will solder silver reliably whereas 60/40 tin/lead will not. 4% silver solder (leaded or not) is also required when soldering silver or silver plated connections to avoid cold jointing. The quad mixed solders also by virtue of their eutectic melting points have a lower melting point than a majority of 60/40 tin/lead solders, so again, this can be a distinct advantage. As to whether they're more conductive, well the differences are very small, so that's not an obvious advantage plus the joints if properly prepped should be joint to joint (firmly held with tweezers or similar) as the solder shouldn't be used as a gap bridger. The way that a quad eutectc solder solidifies also leaves it way less susceptible to cold joint formation, so there's yet another advantage.

[istari_knight]

If soldering silver yes, but when refurbishing an amp like Andr'e its pointless.

I'll never use it but then I don't use silver wire or connectors nor have any inclination to start.

[The Barbarian]

You just a skin flint admit it

:lol:

[NRG]

I've done a *lot* of soldering in my time and from a usability point of view a 2~4% silver loaded solder is very much worth it. The joint wets better and the small silver content moves the solder closer to an ideal eutectic solder helping more consistent joints.

[istari_knight]

You just a skin flint admit it

:lol:

Nah, I'm not from Yorkshire bud :eyebrows: :peace:


I've done a *lot* of soldering in my time and from a usability point of view a 2~4% silver loaded solder is very much worth it. The joint wets better and the small silver content moves the solder closer to an ideal eutectic solder helping more consistent joints.

Likewise, I solder a lot. I have tried silver solder and didn't feel there was any benefit whatsoever... If others feel differently that's cool, I was just expressing an opinion based upon my experience*.

* But as said previously to Paul I don't use anything involving silver be it wire or connectors so perhaps aforementioned experience is not relevant ? ... DOH !http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/istari_knight9/duh_zpsfcd0082b.gif

[istari_knight]

Interestingly Sony ES designer Takeshi Kanai believes different solders posses their own sonic properties...

"This is the solder we used to use, made from tin and lead. We used it for 30 years. [Breaks off a piece, holds it in his mouth, and moves the tip toward his fingers holding an imaginary soldering iron.] Of course, we can’t use it now because lead is poisonous. But with lead-free solder, the sound quality is generally very bad. I went through more than 50 samples of lead-free solder, and I found that the tin mined from a certain mountain gave good sound. But then if that mountain closes we cannot make good solder. So we analyzed that metal to find out which components of the metal were critical to sound quality. We ended up coming up with a combination of four-nines tin [0.9999% purity] and another compound that’s a trade secret. It’s like cooking!"

:lol:

http://www.soundandvision.com/content/mad-scientist-sony-audio

[NRG]

Well, yes, BS reigns supreme! It is Audio after all :D

[The Barbarian]

Top & Bottom of it James the 'Wonder Solder' i used seems to flow better & give a better finish solder joint than standard solder.The importantce to me is that the joint is 100% reliable, peace of mind if you like.

[Reffc]

I've done a *lot* of soldering in my time and from a usability point of view a 2~4% silver loaded solder is very much worth it. The joint wets better and the small silver content moves the solder closer to an ideal eutectic solder helping more consistent joints.

Exactly my thoughts although for general duties, the RS Components 60/40 Multicore takes some beating.

[Yomanze]

For non-silver solder I prefer using 63/37 solder over 60/40 as it is eutectic / doesn't have a 'pasty' range like 60/40.

My favourite overall solder is the Cardas Quad Eutectic solder, which does have some silver & copper in it.

[istari_knight]

Exactly my thoughts although for general duties, the RS Components 60/40 Multicore takes some beating.
That's all I use, good old RS :thumbsup:

If people are buying "fancy" solder as they find it easier to work with or gives better joints they are doing something wrong be it equipment or technique.

[Ammonite Audio]

Thanks for all the information and experiences. I am now very happy to stick with the Cardas Quad Eutectic stuff.

[Quadraphonic]

Here goes one problem I have..........:scratch:.

Re. silver solder, is it me, or is it a swine to work with? I tried it, and it just didn't seem to stick, and I am not talking about old solder joints either. I became really frustrated with it. So much for new work. What of older work? How are we supposed to restore older circuit boards when lead solder isn't widely sold anymore it seems. You can find it if you look hard enough, typically old stock, or via the internet, but why is it not sold alongside silver? What temperature does it have to reach to work? I have 30w, 40w irons, and a 175v solder gun. Any advice?

Thanks,

R

[Quadraphonic]

Here goes one problem I have..........:scratch:.

Re. silver solder, is it me, or is it a swine to work with? I tried it, and it just didn't seem to stick, and I am not talking about old solder joints either. I became really frustrated with it. So much for new work. What of older work? How are we supposed to restore older circuit boards when lead solder isn't widely sold anymore it seems. You can find it if you look hard enough, typically old stock, or via the internet, but why is it not sold alongside silver? What temperature does it have to reach to work? I have 30w, 40w irons, and a 175v solder gun. Any advice?

Thanks,

R

message above did not post properly?

[Reffc]

Here goes one problem I have..........:scratch:.

Re. silver solder, is it me, or is it a swine to work with? I tried it, and it just didn't seem to stick, and I am not talking about old solder joints either. I became really frustrated with it. So much for new work. What of older work? How are we supposed to restore older circuit boards when lead solder isn't widely sold anymore it seems. You can find it if you look hard enough, typically old stock, or via the internet, but why is it not sold alongside silver? What temperature does it have to reach to work? I have 30w, 40w irons, and a 175v solder gun. Any advice?

Thanks,

R

Errr, yes it is (leaded solder is freely available). If you're having issues with silver solder, the lead free stuff doesn't flow that well unless a higher temperature is reached and a decent iron that maintains temperature is a must. You do need to be a little more practised when using lead free solders. Joints also need to be scrupulously clean and separate flux cleaning agents do help here. Use of lead free solders isnt particularly recommended for old leaded boards as you'll likely get some dry jointing. Just clean the boards down, using a solder sucker to remove excess, and use a decent 60/40 multicore (RS Components Multicore is recommended). I would never ever recommend the use of lead free solders to DIY solderers when leaded solder can be bought from the likes of RS components.

[YNWaN]

I read this quite often that lead content solder is not available, but as Paul writes above that just isn't true. In fact I bought some 60/40 from RS Components just a few days ago - they have loads of choice.

[MCRU]

WBT have a lead version, have some audio note 6% silver solder on the way! Looking forward to that.

[UV101]

All mundorf solder smells nice :):lol: