View Full Version : A Sub For the Klipsch Heresy
Ninanina
20-08-2014, 23:39
Don't get me wrong I am REALLY VERY happy indeed with my current set-up which includes a lovely pair of Klipsch Herseys...(well that's what 'I' think of them!!)
As I love my neighbour and I don't want to upset them I am just THINKING if I could 'tweak' the sound a little bit by including some form of sub..... Don't get me wrong I am really happy with my system at the mo but I am just wondering whether a little help in the bottom end (oooo are!!) might just tweak things a little bit up the 'ladder' sound wise??? !!
Someone has a Klipsch sub for sale on the bay....
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Klipsch-KG-SW-Passive-Subwoofer-/221511030277?pt=UK_AudioVideoElectronics_HomeAudio HiFi_HiFiSpeakers&hash=item3393161605
Does anyone think this might tweak my system 'without' overpowering the system? Seriously I know NOTHING about subs.... :D
Thanks for any help anyone can give... ;);)
I don't want to spend a fortune on any upgrade at the mo as I am really enjoying my system the way it is.....however you know how things are.... if things can be improved, for not TOO MUCH outlay, then this should always be considered...
Thanks to all those that MIGHT respond with their thoughts.... thanks all for ANY help in this subject I know NOTHING about... a real gap in my knowledge!!!
Also how 'ON EARTH' does one plumb a sub into my system as it is now ?? I really have NO IDEA...
This may be a case of the blind leading the blind, (I know as much about subs as you know of 15th century Indian rope dancing). But I can make a few generic comments.
First up: that sub on ebay is passive. So you will need an amplifier to power it. Most subs these days are active, powered by an internal Class D amplifier.
Second, my experience with subs is that the cheaper ones tend to be a bit muddy (on the not-strictly-logical basis that cheap = poor quality). So you have to splash out to get something that will actually improve your sound. I have had subs where, frankly, the system was better off without it.
Third, order to get some decent advice from those more knowledgeable than myself you should (i) describe your listening room - especially dimensions, but also furnishings (no need to mention pets); (ii) say how low (in hertz) your current speaker / amp combination goes.
Ninanina
21-08-2014, 00:11
Hi Andrei
Thanks for your initial response
As we agree it's a bit of a minefield .. !!
PaulStewart
21-08-2014, 00:54
Hi Bev,
Like Andrei I know little of 25th C Indian rope dancing, subs on the other hand. :) the Klipsch subs are not at all bad. You would need an amp but as I think your Oto has pre out if you get a power amp with level controls, balancing should not be a problem. I love the Heresy's sound but they can sound a little bass light in small rooms so the sub could well be the answer.
Stratmangler
21-08-2014, 00:56
http://www.klipsch.com/kg-sw
Ninanina
21-08-2014, 01:08
Thanks Paul
That's kinda what I thought too...
Failing that Bev do a little research on Quake and REL subs, they are very highly regarded for both audio and home cinema use plus a good, second-hand example from either manufacturer won't exactly break the bank ;)
To get the passive sub to integrate properly may not be easy. An active sub will give you control over the frequency that it will go up to e.g 40Hz, 50Hz, 60Hz etc and it may either give you an in-phase or out of phase switch. The best phase control is a pot that gives you a sweep between 0 - 180 degrees. It is surprising how effective and important getting the phase right is. The early REL or MJ Acoustics subs can sometimes be found going Cheep (no not actually) on ebay.
I am a die-hard sub user. I don't think any system sounds as good without one - even with big main speakers:sofa:
It looks to me as though this sub is intended to work in series with ones speakers. That is, the speaker cables go from the amp to the sub and then from the sub to the speakers. So, you don't need a separate amplifier as such.
Strictly speaking it isn't a sub at all though as the stated lowest frequency is only38Hz. I suspect this design is intended as part of a budget AV system where it will connect with small speakers.
Firebottle
21-08-2014, 06:37
+1 for the active sub Bev. I have a REL and along with other powered subs it has controls for the volume level and the frequency at which the sub works up to.
This gives complete control of how you integrate the subs performance with your own speakers. It can lead to a lot of f*rting and fiddling about but when set properly a sub will give more 'heft' to the bass without attracting attention to itself.
If you go down the 2nd hand route and don't get on with it you won't loose much (if any) by moving it on.
Good luck with your quest,
Alan
Gordon Steadman
21-08-2014, 06:59
+1 for the active sub Bev. I have a REL and along with other powered subs it has controls for the volume level and the frequency at which the sub works up to.
This gives complete control of how you integrate the subs performance with your own speakers. It can lead to a lot of f*rting and fiddling about but when set properly a sub will give more 'heft' to the bass without attracting attention to itself.
If you go down the 2nd hand route and don't get on with it you won't loose much (if any) by moving it on.
Good luck with your quest,
Alan
So.....edited for spelling huh!!!:eyebrows:
Just can't get the spelling checkers these days!
jandl100
22-08-2014, 06:23
It looks to me as though this sub is intended to work in series with ones speakers. That is, the speaker cables go from the amp to the sub and then from the sub to the speakers. So, you don't need a separate amplifier as such.
Strictly speaking it isn't a sub at all though as the stated lowest frequency is only38Hz. I suspect this design is intended as part of a budget AV system where it will connect with small speakers.
+1
be careful, for several reasons.
Firstly, what Mark said - also note that the crossover freq is fixed and high at 150hz. That's way up in the mid bass.
I really don't think it's intended for use with the Heresy series.
Also, the Heresy (love them or loathe them) have a very distinctive bass sound - lively and bouncy, as their fans might see/hear it. A REL or BK active sub will not, imo although I've not tried it, match that very well. I suspect you'd lose a lot of what you like about the "Heresy sound".
And thirdly - to be brutally honest, looking at the auction pics, it looks like a cheap and nasty passive sub intended to go with cheap and nasty AV system with tiny speakers.
There's no level control and only speaker cable inputs, if that is correct then the sensitivity has to precisely match your Heresy's or the sound level will just be wrong.
Get a decent, proper active sub from Klipsch, assuming they make them, is my advice.
Just my 2p worth. :)
Another alternative might be to hunt down a pair of horn based speakers which do bass. Always fancied a pair of Horning Agathon's myself but then again I don't think I'd get the mortgage to buy a pair at my age... :lol:
Horn loaded subs do exist - but they are absolutely massive!
Have you thought about auditioning a pair of Paul@RFC's Rhapsody's Bev?
You don't want a crappy passive sub. What you want is something that will fill in the lower bass, ideally from 30Hz up to about 45 Hz. Anything higher than that you will start to hear the sub and it will ruin the fast presentation of the Hereseys. Most A/V type powered subs that you can pick up new for around £200will do that job once you have set up and tuned in optimally. That's what I'd go for.
hard1175
22-08-2014, 16:08
I would have a look at the BK Electronics subs without a doubt brilliant sub at a very competitive price.
Bernie
Klipsch quote a -3dB point of only 63Hz for the Heresy so no wonder Bev would like a touch more bass weight. That is quite high for a sub to go though.
Even putting a better sub in a system is not always the answer especially for music getting a sub that can keep up with your speakers and not just turn your system into a bass fest with bloated bass is a big ask from the cheaper subs and sometimes even for the better subs the effect can be great for films but with music you are usually better to look at more powerful speakers
PaulStewart
22-08-2014, 17:58
Klipsch quote a -3dB point of only 63Hz for the Heresy so no wonder Bev would like a touch more bass weight. That is quite high for a sub to go though.
Which is kinda why the Klipsch sub which goes quite high ie 150Hz would be better than most active subs....... Bev if you get the Klipsch sub they roll in at 150Hz quite gently and I think with a bit of tuning it will work with the Heresies. You would need to use a separate power amp with it's own level controls, fed from the pre out outs on the Oto
At the price for that sub and say a T Amp, it's wort a try
Ninanina
22-08-2014, 22:04
I must say that it seems much more complicated than I thought to add a sub successfully.... and I definitely do not want to ruin the sound of the Heresy's as I love what they do with my current set-up
I have to say that at no other time have I been more happy with my system/set-up as I am at the moment, so it might be that it is best left well alone... the sub idea was maybe just a bit of icing on the cake type thing
However on second thoughts I think I might leave well alone .... I can think of no other tweaks I could make...
The feeling of having a system that I am completely at ease with has been a long time coming
I know that you will all rubbish me with my next statement, but I don't care; I believe the SLIC interconnect was the missing link in my system and it has made the whole system gel together somehow .. and I love it just the way it is
Phew it's taken me a long time to get to this position believe me but I am so happy with the sound at the moment .... :D
... the sub idea was maybe just a bit of icing on the cake type thing
Or in the case of a sub: under the cake.
I know that you will all rubbish me with my next statement, but I don't care; I believe the SLIC interconnect was the missing link in my system and it has made the whole system gel together somehow .. and I love it just the way it is
Actually I agree (even though I will never hear Slics). There is a sense of a chain being as strong as its weakest link.
Klipsch quote a -3dB point of only 63Hz for the Heresy so no wonder Bev would like a touch more bass weight. That is quite high for a sub to go though.
That's why I was suggesting a cheap A/v sub would do the job but I wouldn't use it that high up (they usually run 40 hz to 150 hz or thereabouts, not being 'proper' subs but more of a bass reinforcement speaker). If you want it to do midband then yes you will get into difficulties but keeping it low it will just add a bit of warmth and depth to the bottom end, not boom or sludge. Personally I find 'satisfying' bass depth to be quite important to my overall listening pleasure, it doesn't have to be subterranean low bass to give this effect.
Spectral Morn
23-08-2014, 14:47
Failing that Bev do a little research on Quake and REL subs, they are very highly regarded for both audio and home cinema use plus a good, second-hand example from either manufacturer won't exactly break the bank ;)
+ 1
Rel make excellent subs - slightly more blingy looking these days than in the past - both for AV and two channel music and a Rel Quake would be a good option hooked up via the speaker outputs on your amplifier to the Hi Level input on the quake. Of course one of the dearer ones (R Series or Q Series) might be available S/H too - the quake was originally £350
http://radeon.ru/articles/sound/subs/rel.jpg
In my opinion among the best subs for music use and fairly easy to integrate into a hifi set up, because Rel started of with music as the design goal not AV and they have never abandoned music theirs are the subs to go for in a music set up.
Regards Neil
Gordon Steadman
23-08-2014, 15:06
+ 1
Rel make excellent subs - slightly more blingy looking these days than in the past - both for AV and two channel music and a Rel Quake would be a good option hooked up via the speaker outputs on your amplifier to the Hi Level input on the quake. Of course one of the dearer ones (R Series or Q Series) might be available S/H too - the quake was originally £350
http://radeon.ru/articles/sound/subs/rel.jpg
In my opinion among the best subs for music use and fairly easy to integrate into a hifi set up, because Rel started of with music as the design goal not AV and they have never abandoned music theirs are the subs to go for in a music set up.
Regards Neil
This is what I use with the Quads. For the size of box, it goes remarkable deep and its pretty easy to adjust.
istari_knight
23-08-2014, 16:16
I've used many REL subs over the years & found the Storm & Q series integrated best with stereo whereas the Strata, Stentor & Stadium worked best with films. Theres a pretty cool looking Stygian for sale at the moment on eBay but IIRC its the Stadium's predecessor so probably at bit "much" unless your listening room is a village hall :D
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-REL-STYGIAN-Subwoofer-Working-Very-Rare-Subwoofer-Bass-Speaker-XLR-/201146379832?pt=UK_AudioVideoElectronics_HomeAudio HiFi_HiFiSpeakers&hash=item2ed5422e38
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