Mastersound Due Trente or Croft Acoustics Micro 25/Series 7

[gazcarts]

Hi all,

It has been a while since I posted on here, but due to a house move a couple of years ago, my hifi gear has been boxed up with no room for me to use it. I had to downsize, so instead of using my Gyrodec, Tag PPA20, Tag DPA32R, Tag CDt20R, Tag 100x5R and Monitor Audio GR20s, I was using a Denon DP-300F connected to an Onkyo CR515 UK, along with a Logitech Squeezebox Touch, fed into Monitor Audio BR2 speakers. I've managed to improve my listening room (by removing the dining table and chairs!) and recently unboxed the PPA20, which made a big difference to the built in amp of the Denon. I've also bought some PMC Twenty 22 speakers, which are superb.

I now want to replace the CR515 with something worthy of the Twenty 22's, so was considering a Croft Acoustics phono integrated or Micro 25/Series 7 power. I was really hoping to buy used or ex-demo but so far nothing is available. On Hifi Wigwam, someone is selling a Mastersound DueTrenta SE amp for about the price of the Croft Micro 25/Series 7, and I'm quite tempted. I've posted on that forum asking for opinions, but thought I'd also post here as I know there are a lot of Croft users here. I'm hoping someone may have heard both the Mastersound and Croft offerings who can offer their opinion.

Many thanks
Gareth

[gazcarts]

After speaking to Adrian at Audioflair I managed to get a great deal on a Croft Micro 25 (Line Only) and Series 7 Power Amp, which should be here with me on Wednesday. I'm still interested if anyone has any opinions on the comparison above, but from all I've read I doubt I'll be left wanting with the Croft combo.

Adrian is very knowledgeable and was a great help. Looking forward to hearing the amps in my "downsized" system :-)

Gareth

[Reffc]

I've heard both the amps you mention (in my own system) and also owned croft amplification (pre/power) and a Mastersound 845SE.

Which one suits depends largely upon music preferences and tonal characteristics you value. The Dueo Trente is a single ended design and has a lovely mid range (don't they all?). Very spacious imaging/separation, and lovely and smooth and detailed. HF is also very nice. That's really where the positives end. It doesn't have much in the way of low frequency extension or control, unlike designs such as the EAR single ended amps (which use just enough feedback to keep things stable and under control). In fact, the WAD SE amp (300B) I heard into my speakers alongside the Mastersound was better by a huge margin, so if going down the SE route, I'd go for a well assembled WAD design (most of which have been assembled by the DIY community in kit form). Great bass control from the WAD SE design unlike the Mastersound. Cheaper too.

If you want more grunt at the expense of some finesse and mid resolution, then the Croft is better imho.

[DSJR]

The Croft amps show up the inexpensive bass-mid driver in the PMC's as a coarseness in the upper midrange so be warned not to use 'sharply defined' ancilliaries with them as you'll almost certainly end up keeping the speakers (which are at fault) and begin replacing everything else around them. We all do this and I've been there myself on a few occasions! I really don't mean to pee on your parade, but be forewarned is forearmed in this case..

[gazcarts]

The Croft amps show up the inexpensive bass-mid driver in the PMC's as a coarseness in the upper midrange so be warned not to use 'sharply defined' ancilliaries with them as you'll almost certainly end up keeping the speakers (which are at fault) and begin replacing everything else around them. We all do this and I've been there myself on a few occasions! I really don't mean to pee on your parade, but be forewarned is forearmed in this case..

Thanks. Can you expand on what you mean by 'sharply defined' ancilliaries?!

Gareth

[DSJR]

I mean 'highly etched detail' in a sonic description of a source component. You may also prefer a gentler sounding (vintage Mullard?) valve complement in the Crofts as well for similar reasons although after hearing many examples of both now, they're pretty damned 'right' as supplied and should stay stable for decades I reckon.

[Ali Tait]

I've heard both the amps you mention (in my own system) and also owned croft amplification (pre/power) and a Mastersound 845SE.

Which one suits depends largely upon music preferences and tonal characteristics you value. The Dueo Trente is a single ended design and has a lovely mid range (don't they all?). Very spacious imaging/separation, and lovely and smooth and detailed. HF is also very nice. That's really where the positives end. It doesn't have much in the way of low frequency extension or control, unlike designs such as the EAR single ended amps (which use just enough feedback to keep things stable and under control). In fact, the WAD SE amp (300B) I heard into my speakers alongside the Mastersound was better by a huge margin, so if going down the SE route, I'd go for a well assembled WAD design (most of which have been assembled by the DIY community in kit form). Great bass control from the WAD SE design unlike the Mastersound. Cheaper too.

If you want more grunt at the expense of some finesse and mid resolution, then the Croft is better imho.

WAD never did an SE 300b, I take it you mean the original stereo chassis PP, or the PSE monoblocks?

[gazcarts]

I mean 'highly etched detail' in a sonic description of a source component. You may also prefer a gentler sounding (vintage Mullard?) valve complement in the Crofts as well for similar reasons although after hearing many examples of both now, they're pretty damned 'right' as supplied and should stay stable for decades I reckon.

Ok, thanks. I don't want to get too wrapped up in the intricacies. Considering how nice they sound with my current sources, I'm sure they'll be fine. Nothing seems to be perfect in this game.

Regards
Gareth