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Ninanina
28-04-2014, 20:50
Can I ask what the criteria is for threads being closed? Thanks

Mike
28-04-2014, 21:06
Being very naughty! :D

walpurgis
28-04-2014, 21:16
I'd imagine, 'the topic going round and round in repetitive circles' and 'signs of strife or potential strife between members' may qualify, amongst other reasons Bev.

Ninanina
28-04-2014, 21:17
So can I open a new thread about the same?

AlanS
28-04-2014, 21:20
So can I open a new thread about the same?
Try it and see what happens or wait until a mod posts an answer to your question. An empty thread is hardly a source of strife is it?

Ninanina
28-04-2014, 21:21
Try it and see what happens or wait until a mod posts an answer to your question. An empty thread is hardly a source of strife is it?

I will definitely wait for a mod to post... but surely members should be made to behave rather than closing a thread ?

Mike
28-04-2014, 21:42
Marco and the Mod's tend to be pretty tolerant TBH... the old "circular argument" and folk being complete tossers tend to tip the balance though.

Ninanina
28-04-2014, 21:49
Marco and the Mod's tend to be pretty tolerant TBH... the old "circular argument" and folk being complete tossers tend to tip the balance though.

It seems a shame to NOT discuss a particular component or a particular subject, whatever that happens to be, just because some people don't know how to behave and should know better...

It makes me laugh that chaps say us women are supposed to be a bit catty!! but as I believe I'm one of the very few women on here some of the chaps really do take the biscuit..!! ;)

Mr Kipling
28-04-2014, 21:56
Well, it is a forum - after all! People have divergent views - which, at times, seems to be a problem, to some.

walpurgis
28-04-2014, 21:56
some of the chaps really do take the biscuit..!! ;)

You could be right Bev. Perhaps very forthright or confrontational attitudes are not the best thing, plus we may possibly have a few sensitive souls here. (glad to say I don't think I qualify in the foregoing, even if I'm not always the model of diplomacy)

Ninanina
28-04-2014, 21:59
divergent views

"divergent views" are fine but rudeness has no place whatsoever

The Barbarian
28-04-2014, 22:12
Bev:
People saying things that others don't want to hear ;)

Ninanina
28-04-2014, 22:15
Bev:
People saying things that others don't want to hear ;)

I totally agree Andre and that isn't the issue, it's people trying to scratch each others eyes out that should never be allowed on a forum of grown ups..:mental:

Ninanina
28-04-2014, 22:18
However none of that matters anymore

My question was can I make another post on same? :)

walpurgis
28-04-2014, 22:19
Interesting thread you now have going here Bev. :)

Ninanina
28-04-2014, 22:21
Interesting thread you now have going here Bev. :)

It wasn't really meant to be that interesting Geoff, I only asked a little question, and if the answer is NO then thats just fine too... it's not that important in my life ... ;)

Mr Kipling
28-04-2014, 22:23
Well, again, the question of ones' own perception enters into it.

The Grand Wazoo
28-04-2014, 22:26
I think you'd better go ahead and start your thread.
However, be prepared for it to end the same way as most of them do. Maybe yours will be different?!

The Barbarian
28-04-2014, 22:34
I totally agree Andre and that isn't the issue, it's people trying to scratch each others eyes out that should never be allowed on a forum of grown ups..:mental:

Well a lot of folk have ingrained belief's, anyone arguing the contrary will no doubt pay for it :lol:

However i put my hand up, ive learned how to be a good lad now.. :D

walpurgis
28-04-2014, 22:36
It wasn't really meant to be that interesting Geoff, I only asked a little question, and if the answer is NO then thats just fine too... it's not that important in my life ... ;)

I may get criticised, but I feel that contributing here and enjoying the posts/threads is all just a bit of fun and entertainment with some useful enlightenment thrown in and nobody should really take it too much to heart.

twickers
28-04-2014, 22:39
Cable threads always have people going mardy and getting all arsey for some reason. Just post another thread.:thumbsup:

What's the worst that can happen? :eyebrows:

The Barbarian
28-04-2014, 22:46
Cable threads always have people going mardy and getting all arsey for some reason. :thumbsup:


O that's only their way of trying to convince themselves they aint totally nutz

:lol:

Mr Kipling
28-04-2014, 22:46
Call me dense ( You dense sod! ), but I just find it a tad perverse that it's 2014 and you can pay thousands of £s for a metre of cable to link a source to an amp which can cost less than the cable. Some don't see a problem with that or why it should be questioned. A simple question: does the same thing happen in the Pro sector? Do studios spend such sums on cables, or does it go on equipment? Perhaps Paul Stewart can answer that. It just seems that when products migrate to the Hi Fi sector the price is automatically hiked; digital scales is an obvious example. The term "Rip-Off" automatically springs to my mind.

AlanS
28-04-2014, 22:47
Where is this new thread then?

The Barbarian
28-04-2014, 22:48
Stephen:
Id dearly love to truthfully answer that one but im sure this thread would get locked

:rfl:

Mr Kipling
28-04-2014, 22:53
I dare ya! I double dare ya!

twickers
28-04-2014, 22:54
Stephen:
Id dearly love to truthfully answer that one but im sure this thread would get locked

:rfl:

:lolsign:

The Barbarian
28-04-2014, 22:59
I dare ya! I double dare ya!


I promised id be a good lad :harp:

walpurgis
28-04-2014, 23:01
cable

Don't recall anybody mentioning "cable" Stephen. ;)

Mr Kipling
28-04-2014, 23:07
Wasn't it self -evident!?!

Mr Kipling
28-04-2014, 23:09
Time for me Ovaltine I think, Geoff.

walpurgis
28-04-2014, 23:14
Wasn't it self -evident!?!

Well, I knew we'd get there eventually. :)

The Grand Wazoo
28-04-2014, 23:16
Call me dense ( You dense sod! ), but I just find it a tad perverse that it's 2014 and you can pay thousands of £s for a metre of cable .......... The term "Rip-Off" automatically springs to my mind.

So has it actually started even before the thread has been started?

Mr Kipling
28-04-2014, 23:24
Is that what they call a "Pre-Emptive Strike"?

The Grand Wazoo
28-04-2014, 23:26
Guerrilla warfare, I reckon!

Mr Kipling
28-04-2014, 23:40
Time for bed, I think…

'Night Geoff.

'Night Chris.

Where's Jonboy when you want him?

istari_knight
28-04-2014, 23:40
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/istari_knight9/horse_zps85c07eb2.gif

Marco
29-04-2014, 05:19
Hi Bev,


Can I ask what the criteria is for threads being closed?

Well, one of the deciding factors is when folk get so pissed off (for whatever justifiable reason) that they decide to leave the forum! Another is when we feel that arguments and/or discussions are becoming circular, with the same points being regurgitated again and again, ad nauseum.

Both were catalysts for why the thread in question was closed. The fact is, every thread will eventually reach its 'sell-by date' - some sooner than others ;)


My question was can I make another post on same?


Of course - and how that one pans out will largely be in the lap of the Gods! More seriously, it's only right that you're allowed to express your thoughts on your new cables.

However, one thing we will be ensuring in future is that no trade member will be allowed to send products out to members for reviewing, with the intention of 'hyping up' that product, in an attempt to generate sales, whether that member ends up buying said product or not. In short, there will be no premeditated promotional selling allowed.

If someone buys some cables (or whatever) from a trader, and through their own volition, with no prompting by the seller, decides to review that product, then that will be allowed, but otherwise reviews will not be permitted. This new rule will be very strictly moderated, and any dealers caught flounting that rule will risk losing their trade membership.

Therefore, traders please take note!!

Furthermore, any member caught doing similar, to receive any form of material gain, will also be subject to punitive action.

Marco.

Joe
29-04-2014, 07:57
Is that what they call a "Pre-Emptive Strike"?

'Getting your retaliation in first' as one rugby union player put it.

Joe
29-04-2014, 08:10
However, one thing we will be ensuring in future is that no trade member will be allowed to send products out to members for reviewing, with the intention of 'hyping up' that product, in an attempt to generate sales, whether that member ends up buying said product or not. In short, there will be no premeditated promotional selling allowed.

If someone buys some cables (or whatever) from a trader, and through their own volition, with no prompting by the seller, decides to review that product, then that will be allowed, but otherwise reviews will not be permitted. This new rule will be very strictly moderated, and any dealers caught flounting that rule will risk losing their trade membership.

Therefore, traders please take note!!

Furthermore, any member caught doing similar, to receive any form of material gain, will also be subject to punitive action.

Marco.

Good call! I'm assuming this rule applies universally; ie you yourself won't be reviewing on AoS stuff that's been loaned to you by the manufacturer/distributor?

Gordon Steadman
29-04-2014, 08:14
Good call! I'm assuming this rule applies universally; ie you yourself won't be reviewing on AoS stuff that's been loaned to you by the manufacturer/distributor?
:sofa:

Marco
29-04-2014, 08:31
Good call! I'm assuming this rule applies universally; ie you yourself won't be reviewing on AoS stuff that's been loaned to you by the manufacturer/distributor?

Of course. I don't do that anyway. Any product I've ever reviewed on AoS has always been done because *I* wanted to do it, after having bought it due to being impressed with its effectiveness in my system, not because I was prompted to do so by the seller.

I also don't get involved in 'hype-type' threads, which is why I stayed out of the Slic cable discussion, and opted out of the TQ fad before it!

Marco.

Joe
29-04-2014, 08:43
Of course. I don't do that anyway. Any product I've ever reviewed on AoS has always been done because *I* wanted to do it, after having bought it due to being impressed with its effectiveness in my system, not because I was prompted to do so by the seller.

I also don't get involved in 'hype-type' threads, which is why I stayed out of the Slic cable discussion, and opted out of the TQ fad before it!

Marco.

Thanks for the clarification, that's good to know.

Marco
29-04-2014, 08:44
No worries, muchacho! :)

Marco.

julesd68
29-04-2014, 09:35
Hi Marco,

Just wondering how this new rule applies to reviews of demo units? Mostly these will have been requested by a potential purchaser, so a different scenario, but how do you feel about gushing reviews of such units that aren't subsequently purchased?

Cheers

Marco
29-04-2014, 10:36
Hi Jules,

There will always be grey areas, but essentially it boils down to this:

ALL reviews of products are welcome on AoS, as long as the products concerned have been bought by the reviewer, by the time that the review has been published, and that his or her intentions for posting the review are free from hidden agendas and/or personal gain, and produced solely to relate their experiences of that product (or products) for the benefit of the membership.

Therefore, in future all product reviews posted on the forum will be monitored (and if necessary, moderated) on that basis :)

Marco.

Effem
29-04-2014, 10:51
ALL reviews of products are welcome on AoS, as long as the products concerned have been bought by the reviewer, by the time that the review has been published, and that his or her intentions for posting the review are free from hidden agendas and/or personal gain, and produced solely to relate their experiences of that product (or products) for the benefit of the membership.

Marco.

Well then my views about this cable meet all the criteria Marco. I will quote the final line from my November review:

I will finally say that I don't intend to persuade anyone else to put their hand in their pocket to purchase one on my say-so alone, as I will be doing that myself - no matter what the final price tag is

and subsequently I DID put my hand in my pocket to buy one - I would be stupid not to. I also did it to benefit other forum members, not just myself.

AoS should be justly proud that I announced it on here first.

Like I said, we should be applauding the designer/inventor of this cable for creating a revolutionary and innovative product and the folks that are hearing the benefits of the cable. Mr MCRU are I only minor bit players in the scenario.

nat8808
29-04-2014, 11:10
and subsequently I DID put my hand in my pocket to buy one

Yes, but you've neglected to mention that moths then flew out of that pocket and you made some excuse about there being a hole and you promise you'd pay very very soon! :D

Marco
29-04-2014, 11:49
Sure, Frank. I completely agree, as we do on most matters :)

Just watch, mate, that you're not getting rather 'too close' to all of this, as some of your recent responses are bordering on the defensive. Therefore, it may be an idea to take of a back seat in the debate for a while, and move towards becoming a little more dispassionate.

As you know, I say that out of the greatest respect, as well as being frank and honest with you.

Marco.

Effem
29-04-2014, 12:13
Sure, Frank. I completely agree, as we do on most matters :)

Just watch, mate, that you're not getting rather 'too close' to all of this, as some of your recent responses are bordering on the defensive. Therefore, it may be an idea to take of a back seat in the debate for a while, and move towards becoming a little more dispassionate.

As you know, I say that out of the greatest respect, as well as being frank and honest with you.

Marco.

I agree Marco, but from my own perspective in this, the questions and queries always seem to be fired in my direction don't they? :)

I can't but help being caught in the crossfire because there seems to be little distinction amongst the membership here about what I actually hear from this cable and what I actually KNOW about this cable, which are two separate entities. Few (if any) have actually asked me about the cable's sound and they expect me to answer queries that I genuinely cannot answer. This then leads to frustrations to both themselves and me, which I believe is the main source of friction. This is notwithstanding the obvious piss-takers but let's leave them aside.

I will happily cool it if peeps do likewise :)

Gordon Steadman
29-04-2014, 12:25
I agree Marco, but from my own perspective in this, the questions and queries always seem to be fired in my direction don't they? :)

I can't but help being caught in the crossfire because there seems to be little distinction amongst the membership here about what I actually hear from this cable and what I actually KNOW about this cable, which are two separate entities. Few (if any) have actually asked me about the cable's sound and they expect me to answer queries that I genuinely cannot answer. This then leads to frustrations to both themselves and me, which I believe is the main source of friction. This is notwithstanding the obvious piss-takers but let's leave them aside.

I will happily cool it if peeps do likewise :)

What is this 'peeps' expression?? One of respect?

MartinT
29-04-2014, 12:42
The term "Rip-Off" automatically springs to my mind.

Haven't we been here before? There is no such thing (certainly not for luxury items like hi-fi).

It's for you to determine the value of something. If you consider it good value, you might purchase it - knowingly and in full possession of your impressions of it; in which case, you haven't been ripped off.

On the other hand, you might decide it's poor value or a bit too rich for you; in which case you haven't been ripped off.

Macca
29-04-2014, 12:45
What is this 'peeps' expression?? One of respect?

peeps = 'people'

Sadly we are well through the looking glass when it comes to the deployment of the English language these days although that should be a subject for another time and place. ;)

Gordon Steadman
29-04-2014, 12:49
peeps = 'people'

Sadly we are well through the looking glass when it comes to the deployment of the English language these days although that should be a subject for another time and place. ;)
I'll take your word for it. As ever words have meaning according to context.

Macca
29-04-2014, 12:53
I'll take your word for it. As ever words have meaning according to context.

Nouns don't. 'peeps' is a noun and there is nothing derogatory about it.

Joe
29-04-2014, 12:56
Nouns don't. 'peeps' is a noun and there is nothing derogatory about it.

Same here. It's a standard non-judgemental abbreviation. Not so sure about 'obvious piss-takers' though.

Macca
29-04-2014, 13:00
Same here. It's a standard non-judgemental abbreviation. Not so sure about 'obvious piss-takers' though.

We're leaving them aside. Apparantly.

Joe
29-04-2014, 13:01
We're leaving them aside. Apparantly.

Thank God for that! They were really getting on my tits.

Gordon Steadman
29-04-2014, 13:02
Nouns don't. 'peeps' is a noun and there is nothing derogatory about it.

Right. So if I call a part of the human body a four letter word but also call a person by that same noun, it can't be derogatory!! I must remember that:eyebrows:

Joe
29-04-2014, 13:03
Right. So if I call a part of the human body a four letter word but also call a person by that same noun, it can't be derogatory!! I must remember that:eyebrows:

Don't be such a knee!

Gordon Steadman
29-04-2014, 13:12
Don't be such a knee!
:ner:

Gordon Steadman
29-04-2014, 13:22
My wife has just informed me that 'peep' actually refers to baby chickens before they hatch!! There may be a connection...... but I can't hear it!

Roy S
29-04-2014, 13:34
Right. So if I call a part of the human body a four letter word but also call a person by that same noun, it can't be derogatory!! I must remember that:eyebrows:

Sounds a bit cock & ball to me

twickers
29-04-2014, 13:34
Don't think there is any connection Gordon, just an urbanised way of saying people.;)

twickers
29-04-2014, 13:35
Sounds a bit cock & ball to me

What the foot are you saying Roy!

Roy S
29-04-2014, 13:39
What the foot are you saying Roy!

Just my Fore.... Penneth :D

Gordon Steadman
29-04-2014, 13:59
Just my Fore.... Penneth :D

I had a feeling this could deteriorate:lol:

da2222
29-04-2014, 14:15
Of course. I don't do that anyway. Any product I've ever reviewed on AoS has always been done because *I* wanted to do it, after having bought it due to being impressed with its effectiveness in my system, not because I was prompted to do so by the seller.



Marco.


I think Frank would say the very same thing to be honest Marco...

Marco
29-04-2014, 14:19
Indeed, and we'd both be correct in saying so! :)

Marco.

twickers
29-04-2014, 14:38
AoS is very well behaved, and long may it continue. Threads very rarely descend into the realm of chaos and are usually only locked for other reasons as said elsewhere. I can only think of one person who has been banned since i joined! Which is good of course.

The Barbarian
29-04-2014, 15:09
2

:sofa:

walpurgis
29-04-2014, 15:32
Harry Enfield used to use "peeps" (as in people) all the time with his Stavros character years ago.

twickers
29-04-2014, 15:51
2

:sofa:

As many as that? This place is out of control. ;)

CageyH
29-04-2014, 16:17
Sure, Frank.
as well as being frank and honest with you.

I am confused now. Is Marco being Frank with Frank, so they are now both Frank? :ner:

More seriously, I'd like to hear a few other peoples opinions of this cable.
Not that I will ever buy one, but to see if they also think it really is that good. I'd also be interested to hear how it compares to other "decent" cables, leaving all the emotions (and bickering) behind.

Alex_UK
29-04-2014, 16:33
That reminds me of a saying an old boss used to say - "Should an engaged couple be frank and ernest, or should one of them be a woman?" :D

Barry
29-04-2014, 16:35
That reminds me of a saying an old boss used to say - "Should an engaged couple be frank and ernest, or should one of them be a woman?" :D

Where have you been Alex? You've been missed!

Alex_UK
29-04-2014, 16:41
Hi Barry - lots of changes at work, demanding kids, family disasters, a Land Rover to get rebuilt, learning new skills, trying to get healthy (well, healthier!) (and other stuff I can't remember no doubt) has meant precious little time for hifi - let alone the forum - but hoping one or two off that list are now moving into the past and I can hang around with my chums a bit more on AoS! Thanks for missing me, I have missed you all too - mostly! ;)

The Grand Wazoo
29-04-2014, 17:55
......... just an urbanised way of saying people.;)

Whoah there!
Let me get this right then. Am I allowed to say it if I live in the country?

Joe
29-04-2014, 17:57
Whoah there!
Let me get this right then. Am I allowed to say it if I live in the country?

Certainly not. You must say 'folk'.

CageyH
29-04-2014, 18:10
There's nowt so queer as folk.
Or use the term bumpkin?

Mr Kipling
29-04-2014, 18:12
Perhaps if people had been a bit more straight-forward, open and honest in the first place - we wouldn' t be at this point. So perhaps it's something to learn from.

Welcome back Frank. I was going to start a thread to show support for you - but now I won't have to. And that's not sachasm; I genuinely mean it. At times enthusiasm can be seen as something more than it actually is, and to some extent, this could be one. As I said previously you flagged everyone's attention to the Belkin speaker leads and I don't think most here doubt you're less than genuine, it's just the way events have developed.

Isn't there any room at AOS for some Marx Brothers-esque chaos and humour?

Gordon Steadman
29-04-2014, 18:15
There's nowt so queer as folk.
Or use the term bumpkin?

The whole world is queer save thee an' me

and even thee's a little queer

(I believe that was said sometime before the word got hijacked)

Mr Kipling
29-04-2014, 18:31
Frank, can I take you at your word and ask what the cable does ( or doesn't do) compared to others?

Effem
29-04-2014, 19:58
Frank, can I take you at your word and ask what the cable does ( or doesn't do) compared to others?

Thank you so much for asking Stephen, I do genuinely appreciate the sentiment :)

I have of course compared it to others - I would be foolish not to and have put that short list in the "other" thread if memory serves me well.

However, I think it wise at this late juncture to refrain from me commenting further for now, for the sake of forum harmony. However, from the people that have already purchased the SLICs and done their own comparisons in their own systems and rooms as in Bev (Ninanana), Martin (reallysm), Stephen (cyclopse) and shortly from Mike (Choirboy) all of which have provided (or about to provide, Bev) you all with the competition the SLICs have faced.

If agreed by others through showing their support, then I will reveal my own comparisons to other cables, but not unless and until invited to do so.

CageyH
29-04-2014, 20:12
I'm always interested to read peoples opinions about new things.
However, the engineer in me just wants to get hold of one and take it apart just to see how it is made. I have done this type of thing since being very young.


http://youtu.be/60P1xG32Feo

MartinT
29-04-2014, 20:15
LOL - great clip, Kevin. I know exactly how you and Dilbert feel.

StanleyB
29-04-2014, 20:27
I'm always interested to read peoples opinions about new things.
However, the engineer in me just wants to get hold of one and take it apart just to see how it is made. I have done this type of thing since being very young.
Taking it apart and seeing how it is made does not necessary tell you how it works and why it works the way that it does. I remember my former employer sending numerous samples to the Far East to be taken apart and see how they were made. The Chinese could make a copy, but more often than not I had to explain to them how many of them worked and why. The most obvious cases that spring to mind were items designed for use with Freeview. The Chinese had no digital Freeview transmissions to test the functionality of the samples that they copied. And in most cases they didn't work as they should.

CageyH
29-04-2014, 20:34
Agreed.
However, it gives you a good insight. We are not talking about a fully assembled PCB here with various IC's, but a cable that is complex to make, that sounds very good (from what I have been told).

Barry
29-04-2014, 20:36
LOL - great clip, Kevin. I know exactly how you and Dilbert feel.

This might be of relevance (or maybe not): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Knack_%E2%80%A6and_How_to_Get_It :lol:

MartinT
29-04-2014, 20:40
Hah Barry! I've never seen that one.

StanleyB
29-04-2014, 21:10
Agreed.
However, it gives you a good insight. We are not talking about a fully assembled PCB here with various IC's, but a cable that is complex to make, that sounds very good (from what I have been told).
I used to design leads of various types for a living, and the company I worked for then won numerous awards for my designs. Their sales in those leads plummeted after I left, and others have since copied or devised similar small touches that I initially came up with. I didn't take out any patents, so there is nobody to sue. But there are secrets behind the construction of an outstanding lead, which are not obvious from taking one apart. But when I read threads on AoS about leads I do have a small chuckle. It reminds me on how I ended up getting ejected from wigwam. I described the construction of a super duper lead that could be made up by even a novice from readily available bits for no more than beer money. Some cable traders were up in arms about it and saw my simple DIY chat as a severe threat to their sales. It was also the start of the long online friendship with Marco as it happens.

Bigandbouncy
29-04-2014, 23:51
I described the construction of a super duper lead that could be made up by even a novice from readily available bits for no more than beer money. Some cable traders were up in arms about it and saw my simple DIY chat as a severe threat to their sales. It was also the start of the long online friendship with Marco as it happens.

Have you posted it on here Stanley? I wouldn't mind a go at some home made stuff?

Dave

Ninanina
30-04-2014, 00:05
I didn't think this thread would be so popular as it was only a simple question in the first place ... :D

I have now started a new thread "SLIC Cable etc etc", which I trust will be a nice pleasant place to discuss this new product

PaulStewart
30-04-2014, 20:04
Call me dense ( You dense sod! ), but I just find it a tad perverse that it's 2014 and you can pay thousands of £s for a metre of cable to link a source to an amp which can cost less than the cable. Some don't see a problem with that or why it should be questioned. A simple question: does the same thing happen in the Pro sector? Do studios spend such sums on cables, or does it go on equipment? Perhaps Paul Stewart can answer that. It just seems that when products migrate to the Hi Fi sector the price is automatically hiked; digital scales is an obvious example. The term "Rip-Off" automatically springs to my mind.

Hi Stephen,

I only just saw this today, the answer is no but yes partly :lol: In a studio you tend to go for a good quality, low noise, undistorted cable. Mogami and the BBC's current standat Van Damme are popular choices. However the studio is not doing what we are doing with kit in a reproduction situation. In a studio, you are creating the sound, any changes brought about by cables etc., are part of the original sound as set down by the engineers, musicians and the producer. When it comes to reproduction, we are trying to accurately reproduce what was laid down in the studio/location. A different job and one that in a way requires a different approach. However having said that, I have some heavily silver plated OFC copper balanced mic leads that I use with a stereo pair of condenser mics and having compared them with straight copper cables they help capture more detail.

Cheers

Mr Kipling
30-04-2014, 20:23
I understand what you're saying, Paul.

Years ago Mogami used to get a mention in the hi-fi mags for use as an interconnect.

PaulStewart
30-04-2014, 23:15
I should have mentioned Gotham in the list of studio cables, I use their digital interconnects in the studio and while I have had one at home, I prefer the Chord one I use normally (sorry I forget the number). However the Gotham is damn good for the price. :)

Mr Kipling
01-05-2014, 07:13
The first issue on cd of Jeff Wayne's War of The Worlds had all the gear used, including the types of cables. It still sounded disappointing.

Joe
01-05-2014, 08:16
The first issue on cd of Jeff Wayne's War of The Worlds had all the gear used, including the types of cables. It still sounded disappointing.

With them SLICs in place it would have won Rolling Stone's 'best album of the century' award, nae bother.

walpurgis
01-05-2014, 09:13
Isn't this thread about closed threads? If not this thread about closed threads could end up being a closed thread.

Mr Kipling
01-05-2014, 11:51
True, Geoff. But I think we've more-or-less covered that now. Which leaves us with the infamous AOS Thread Drift Phenomena, which it is known for - accross the globe - if not the universe.

istari_knight
01-05-2014, 11:55
Speaking of WOTW, Justin Hayward lives not far from me... I keep meaning to ask him to sign my WOTW LP.

Macca
01-05-2014, 11:56
If this thread is closed then someone can then start an open thread to discuss the closed thread about threads being closed. if that thread is also subsequently closed we will then have three closed threads about open threads being closed.
In order to avoid this situation I really think we need some guidlines as to when an open thread about closed threads will be closed and if it is possible to get a closed thread about closed threads to be re-opened.

Or something like that.

Joe
01-05-2014, 13:44
If this thread is closed then someone can then start an open thread to discuss the closed thread about threads being closed. if that thread is also subsequently closed we will then have three closed threads about open threads being closed.
In order to avoid this situation I really think we need some guidlines as to when an open thread about closed threads will be closed and if it is possible to get a closed thread about closed threads to be re-opened.

Or something like that.

If a trade thread is closed, can non-trade members discuss it in the 'closed threads' thread, even if they haven't bought the item in question?

Mr Kipling
01-05-2014, 13:44
My feet are killing me.

Gordon Steadman
01-05-2014, 13:45
My feet are killing me.

Give them a good soak in Ovaltine.

And...have an exceedingly good cake just 'cos they are scrumptious.

Macca
01-05-2014, 14:01
If a trade thread is closed, can non-trade members discuss it in the 'closed threads' thread, even if they haven't bought the item in question?

They could discuss the thread in general and the circumstances of its closure but any reference to the item would need to be in general terms unless they can demonstrate that they have purchased said item but even then it is possible that the post might be removed or the closed thread thread closed on the grounds that said post was off topic or in the wrong thread or forum. this would also apply to trade members not associated with sale of the item but who had purchased it with the additional proviso that they cannot make more than four consecutive posts.

I think.

Mr Kipling
02-05-2014, 07:24
Hell's Teeth! What's going on here!?! I've never witnessed so many closed threads on AOS in all me born days. A sign perhaps that the end is nigh and that we are in fact living in the End Days: severe whether patterns, collapse of the Soviet Block, collapse of financial institutions, thread after thread after thread on AOS closed. Enough to turn a sceptic.

And no mention of Ovaltine.

The Grand Wazoo
02-05-2014, 07:38
I don't like closing threads Stephen, but when people carry on doing what they've been asked not to do anymore and it starts to become an attack on someone, then I'll do so.

If you start a thread by saying you're not going to give your view until the end of the thread, you shouldn't be surprised if things go off topic! When you invite others (& let's honest, there aren't many of them) to post their views on the subject and they largely refrain from doing so, then you've got to expect confusion and a little light hearted banter. That's what happened & I suspect that if the OP hadn't stamped her feet and cried foul, then the chat would have remained lighthearted and then fizzled out.

A mug of Ovaltine each would probably have helped everyone!

r100
02-05-2014, 07:39
.... And no mention of Ovaltine.

That can't be right !:eyebrows:

Joe
02-05-2014, 07:43
We need a new room for discussion of things we haven't made our minds up about yet. 'Vague doodlings' maybe.

MCRU
02-05-2014, 08:07
If this thread is closed then someone can then start an open thread to discuss the closed thread about threads being closed. if that thread is also subsequently closed we will then have three closed threads about open threads being closed.
In order to avoid this situation I really think we need some guidlines as to when an open thread about closed threads will be closed and if it is possible to get a closed thread about closed threads to be re-opened.

Or something like that.

:lol:

MCRU
02-05-2014, 08:10
I don't like closing threads Stephen, but when people carry on doing what they've been asked not to do anymore and it starts to become an attack on someone, then I'll do so.

If you start a thread by saying you're not going to give your view until the end of the thread, you shouldn't be surprised if things go off topic! When you invite others (& let's honest, there aren't many of them) to post their views on the subject and they largely refrain from doing so, then you've got to expect confusion and a little light hearted banter. That's what happened & I suspect that if the OP hadn't stamped her feet and cried foul, then the chat would have remained lighthearted and then fizzled out.

A mug of Ovaltine each would probably have helped everyone!

Ovaltine washed down with something from the top shelf I would say :)

Chicken and egg really, no sane person is going to post what they think of a cable when they can plainly see all the trolls lining up to destroy the thread afterwards, that is 3 closed threads on one subject, slightly pathetic really, not the action of closing it but the actions of those who have acted in a way to get it closed.

Markiii
02-05-2014, 08:29
that's the problem, no sane or insane person did post what they thought of it

Joe
02-05-2014, 08:37
Ovaltine washed down with something from the top shelf I would say :)

Chicken and egg really, no sane person is going to post what they think of a cable when they can plainly see all the trolls lining up to destroy the thread afterwards, that is 3 closed threads on one subject, slightly pathetic really, not the action of closing it but the actions of those who have acted in a way to get it closed.

A bit daft IMO to start a review thread that basically says 'I have nothing to say about this item yet', then post again to say 'I still have nothing to say about this item'. Why not wait till you've made up your mind one way or another, then post a full review?

Effem
02-05-2014, 08:43
I have stayed well out of the discussion for obvious reasons. Marco suggested that I take a back seat and that was wise given that apart from my own contributions not much else of real value or substance was being added to the discussion.

Sadly for us, Martin is heading for faraway shores, Stephen and Mike are otherwise very busy, although cyclops should he says hopefully provide us with his observations this weekend as he is very busy with his studies - understandable. I sent him a PM asking if he could give us even a snapshot first impression just to defuse what was becoming a potentially explosive situation with Bev as the blue touch paper was already well and truly lit, but regrettably she couldn't see it when I warned her it was coming. Yes indeed she virtually invited the comments that she received by her endless prevarication and grandstanding and I do not defend her as she frustrated me intensely too, but I was truly shocked at how the pack descended on her so rapidly and from people I thought had some civility and decency within their characters. It was a truly fearsome sight as it unfolded and well away from the genteel AoS forum that I have become used to.

Mention the words "Yannis", "Mark Grant", "RFC" and others yet there is not a word of dissent anywhere on the forum and you all nod sagely saying "great cables" and that is absolutely fine by me, but use the word "SLIC" and the sky falls in? FFS get a grip you lot. I have never once had a derisory word to say about any one of those products, because I accept that they are someone's CHOICES, the SLIC is my own choice which I have bought and paid for and was very fortunate enough to get a unique preview of what it was capable of, which I was and still am so enthused about. Now if that causes you bother, then it's YOU that has an issue to address not me.

I think the real issue that has come out of this right now is NOT whether this here cable can do any of the proverbial "veil lifting" (which I haven't said before some clown argues that I have) but the "veil lifting" of what lies beneath the erstwhile outwardly calm, reasoned, charming and polite AoS membership here are capable of, when given the right opportunity on a plate. Given that I am the very heart of this particular controversy. *I* have managed to be patient and have managed to take a back seat while waiting for others to make their contribution, so it baffles me how anyone else could not do likewise, especially when they DON'T have as much to lose as I have in the credibility stakes. No, this is just a game for you vile people and it is a very expensive game you are playing because it WILL turn this fantastic forum into nothing more than a playground for the bullies and abusers, as it has elsewhere.

Somebody mentioned the word "divisive" last week to me and I couldn't understand why that a mere length of cable could actually DIVIDE an entire forum with such hatred and bile, with the less mature members sniping at each other and generally behaving like juveniles. My respect for those people has hit rock bottom and what was intended as a temporary backing off while the heat died down is going to be hard to come back from, because I cannot see me discussing my favourite hobby with people I know have a very dark and nasty side to their character.

MartinT
02-05-2014, 11:10
Well I for one have reviewed cables on AoS in the past (including NVA) and I will do so again as and when there is something of interest. I am fairly thick skinned and couldn't care less about trolls. I do it for the sake of those wishing to shortlist cables for audition - and that's all a cable review can be, a guideline and nothing else.

Yomanze
02-05-2014, 11:41
"FFS get a grip you lot", Frank, it's just a wire... Shame it's caused so much conflict. The combination of MCRU's history and your revelation that an interconnect can totally transform a system is, you must admit, going to cause some backlash. The revelation that all cables are flawed except for the SLIC is going to get some people thinking that assertions are hyperbolic. Despite reading through 10s of pages trying to read about your thoughts on the REFFC Pluto mk2 that you were lent you've refrained from making any comparison, which in my opinion would have added some balance and a reference point for many of us. All in all I can understand how things have gotten so heated even if I don't endorse it.

Joe
02-05-2014, 11:49
I've only ever done one review on AoS, and that was a cable review. I didn't like the cable, and got some flak for saying so, which is fine, it was just my opinion from which anyone was entitled to dissent. What really pissed me off was a response from a 'believer' that said 'I simply don't believe you'.

Effem
02-05-2014, 12:09
"FFS get a grip you lot", Frank, it's just a wire... Shame it's caused so much conflict. The combination of MCRU's history and your revelation that an interconnect can totally transform a system is, you must admit, going to cause some backlash. The revelation that all cables are flawed except for the SLIC is going to get some people thinking that assertions are hyperbolic. Despite reading through 10s of pages trying to read about your thoughts on the REFFC Pluto mk2 that you were lent you've refrained from making any comparison, which in my opinion would have added some balance and a reference point for many of us. All in all I can understand how things have gotten so heated even if I don't endorse it.

Excuse me Neil, I have never once said that "all cables are flawed except the SLIC" so where on earth did you dream that one up? I did say that the SLIC too has it's own flaws but none that intrude on the listening experience. I knew full well and said so right from the outset that my opinions WOULD cause controversy and even this far down the line I still stand by every word because it HAS transformed my humble system, far beyond what any other cable I have listen to could possibly do. By all means argue and quizz me about those aspects, but Mr MCRU and his alleged reputation should not enter into that discussion at all.

I only had the RFC Pluto for a brief two days. I have not done either a review or comparison of it against the SLIC for very good reasons which I cannot disclose here. Before any of you jump to yet another incorrect conclusion, it was NOT because of any performance differentials between the two cables.

I, just like the rest of you were relying upon other people besides myself for their views of the SLIC and how it relates to OTHER cables some of you might be familiar with and Bev's fiasco served only to increase everyone's frustrations on that front.

That is not my fault, that is not the cable's fault and (rarely it seems) not Mr MCRU's fault either, so why all the unwarranted negativity when all of that is beyond our direct control? That really is illogical in the extreme, can you not see that?

Macca
02-05-2014, 12:22
Here is how to review a cable:

I am trying this cable in my sytem at the moment it is: not very good/ not bad/ good/ very good it is a bargain/reasonably priced/ a bit pricey/ very expensive

I suggest you: try it out/avoid it like the plague

if you look at previous cable thread s that is how they start then after while a few other people will try it and say yes it is good/ didn't work for me

And guess what never any problems previously. But this time we get the mystery cable, then the secret cable whose name may not be mentioned, the dance of the seven veils (as it has been referred to elsewhere) the procrastination, the teasing, the hinting and so forth and it is still expected that intelligent, educated people are supposed to not laugh and say 'this is a total farce'? Well it was and they did.

Markiii
02-05-2014, 12:37
not helped by the fact that Bev has somewhat a reputation for grandstanding and attention seeking, which probably didn't help?

Effem
02-05-2014, 12:38
Here is how to review a cable:

I am trying this cable in my sytem at the moment it is: not very good/ not bad/ good/ very good it is a bargain/reasonably priced/ a bit pricey/ very expensive

I suggest you: try it out/avoid it like the plague

if you look at previous cable thread s that is how they start then after while a few other people will try it and say yes it is good/ didn't work for me

And guess what never any problems previously. But this time we get the mystery cable, then the secret cable whose name may not be mentioned, the dance of the seven veils (as it has been referred to elsewhere) the procrastination, the teasing, the hinting and so forth and it is still expected that intelligent, educated people are supposed to not laugh and say 'this is a total farce'? Well it was and they did.

Well can you then qualify that by stating how far off your proposed route I deviated?

It had to begin with the title "mystery cable" because it your memory wasn't so lapse as you pretend, back in November that's exactly what is was to me and the rest of the world. It was a plain black shrouded cable I received with indeterminate plugs on, no name, no model, no labels, no info, no price, period. Should I have began my review with "Here is a plain black shrouded cable I received with indeterminate plugs on, no name, no model, no labels, no info, no price, review for you to read"? Use that sense of yours wisely and can you think of a better title in THAT situation?

I too wasn't all that impressed about the "secret" cable that mustn't be mentioned getting a mention, so you are not alone and again far from my influence, so why rake it up?

How many more times must I say that the pantomime we witnessed from a certain party was none of MY doing? In any event it's now water under the bridge and none of us can change that, least of all Bev. The mature adult (dare I say intelligent?) thing to do is to move on from that and hope that the pack animals have gone into hiding again.

Joe
02-05-2014, 12:48
Well can you then qualify that by stating how far off your proposed route I deviated?

It had to begin with the title "mystery cable" because it your memory wasn't so lapse as you pretend, back in November that's exactly what is was to me and the rest of the world. It was a plain black shrouded cable I received with indeterminate plugs on, no name, no model, no labels, no info, no price, period. Should I have began my review with "Here is a plain black shrouded cable I received with indeterminate plugs on, no name, no model, no labels, no info, no price, review for you to read"? Use that sense of yours wisely and can you think of a better title in THAT situation?

I wouldn't have reviewed it at all, given the lack of information on cost/availability.

Macca
02-05-2014, 12:49
Frank - Your original review was not far off a standard cable post except for the 'teaser' element released some months before which I think some made more of than was necessary, but if people have agendas then expect them to pursue them. As Martin T said earlier (and I'm paraphrasing here): 'F*ck the trolls'.

It was afterwards that things started to become farcical.

Marco
02-05-2014, 12:57
Here's how I introduced Yannis Tome cables to the AoS collective, which with being the big modest bastard that I am, I'd suggest is how 'wonder cable' threads should be started, with all the relevant info clearly stated at the beginning of the thread:

http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?17071-Could-this-be-a-giant-killing-tonearm-cable&highlight=tonearm+cable%3F+yannis

I don't remember that one descending into chaos! I wonder why - and it's not just because I started it! ;)

Marco.

Marco
02-05-2014, 13:00
I wouldn't have reviewed it at all, given the lack of information on cost/availability.

Precisely (although I understand why Frank did it), and there will be a new rule outlined on the matter shortly, as to what will be required in future when it comes to these situations.

Marco.

julesd68
02-05-2014, 13:00
I only had the RFC Pluto for a brief two days. I have not done either a review or comparison of it against the SLIC for very good reasons which I cannot disclose here. Before any of you jump to yet another incorrect conclusion, it was NOT because of any performance differentials between the two cables.

So Bev has a mystery cable to compare that she cannot reveal and Frank has a cable to compare he can reveal but can't tell us about ... :scratch:
This really is a very strange affair indeed.

Effem
02-05-2014, 13:02
Frank - Your original review was not far off a standard cable post except for the 'teaser' element released some months before which I think some made more of than was necessary, but if people have agendas then expect them to pursue them. As Martin T said earlier (and I'm paraphrasing here): 'F*ck the trolls'.

It was afterwards that things started to become farcical.

No Martin, you are transposing the facts here. My original review was back in November of last year when all I received was the prototype. I was "teasing" NOBODY because I knew so very little factual information, including but not limited to, the anticipated price.

I then posted up the thread "MYSTERY CABLE REVISITED" where the product now had a formal product name so the title "MYSTERY CABLE" was totally redundant and all the hassle and furore about it's price not being known, is now known.

Did it change any perceptions to all the little boys in short trousers? No it didn't, because the word "mystery" appeared in every corner of the forum, used as a derogatory term in a behind the bike sheds type of sniggering unfunny joke. And you are attempting to tell me now that was good behaviour from "intelligent and educated people"?

Gordon Steadman
02-05-2014, 13:15
There is still too much mud slinging going on here.

Calling those that disagree with you names helps no-one (short trousers etc). Those of us who find the whole cable thing to be hyped up beyond any definition of reality, find the language used in describing bits of wire excessive and worthy of some criticism.

OK we could just stay out of the situation and probably should. However, the way this one has been hyped up from the start has just made the whole situation worse.

I look forward to some definite guidelines regarding how we are to 'review' things. I have a project coming up that I will definitely wish to feature and I wouldn't want the sort of flack that this one has given rise to.

Effem
02-05-2014, 13:36
However, the way this one has been hyped up from the start has just made the whole situation worse.

I look forward to some definite guidelines regarding how we are to 'review' things. I have a project coming up that I will definitely wish to feature and I wouldn't want the sort of flack that this one has given rise to.

Pray tell how has it been hyped up?

I heard a cable that that I believe puts most if not all others in the shade. I strongly felt and still strongly feel that is worth shouting about. I decided that I would tell others just how excited I am about it. If YOU don't share my enthusiasm I care not one jot. I don't call you blinkered, I don't call you deaf, I don't demean your beliefs and if you have no interest at all in a new revolutionary product then that suits me fine. At a lesser price too than most of it's competition I might add.

I knew from the start it would cause controversy, I knew from the start it would be very hard for people to swallow, because they "have heard it all before . . . . . " Yawn. I take comfort that time will prove who is right.

To be honest, I am so tired of repeating myself over and over again, having to endlessly correct people who twist whatever I say for their own hidden agendas. I don't care, I really don't care right now.

Here's something for all of you to chew over.

I have exchanged some emails with the inventor of the cable which has been rather enlightening. All this focus on it being a "hi-fi cable" is a tiny fraction of what it will eventually be used for and don't be surprised if the word "SECRET" is once again involved in it's usage. It was NOT designed as a hi-fi cable at all, nor was the patent granted for this sole purpose, despite what the scoffers and cynics might think. I am looking forward to the day when egg lands on some faces.

Gordon Steadman
02-05-2014, 13:55
I have exchanged some emails with the inventor of the cable which has been rather enlightening. All this focus on it being a "hi-fi cable" is a tiny fraction of what it will eventually be used for and don't be surprised if the word "SECRET" is once again involved in it's usage. It was NOT designed as a hi-fi cable at all, nor was the patent granted for this sole purpose, despite what the scoffers and cynics might think. I am looking forward to the day when egg lands on some faces.

Some of us might suggest that this is the sort of stuff that might possibly be described as 'hype':lol:

Maybe its a language thing.

Effem
02-05-2014, 13:57
Some of us might suggest that this is the sort of stuff that might possibly be described as 'hype':lol:

Maybe its a language thing.

It is only "hype" when it isn't true

Gordon Steadman
02-05-2014, 13:58
It is only "hype" when it isn't true

As you are determined to have the last word, I'll leave you to it - for the sake of balance.

MartinT
02-05-2014, 14:07
As Martin T said earlier (and I'm paraphrasing here): 'F*ck the trolls'.

You got my precise meaning ;)

Markiii
02-05-2014, 14:09
True is a meaningless statement in view of it only ever being defined by opinion

Joe
02-05-2014, 14:21
True is a meaningless statement in view of it only ever being defined by opinion

True.

jandl100
04-05-2014, 07:46
:brickwall:

Sometimes forums just get me down. :lol:

CageyH
04-05-2014, 08:27
If this cable is a secret, or it's intended uses are secret, why is the patent in the public domain?
If the inventor has informed you of it's uses when it is supposed to be secret, he could be in hot water.

i find this a bit strange.

Effem
04-05-2014, 08:35
If this cable is a secret, or it's intended uses are secret, why is the patent in the public domain?
If the inventor has informed you of it's uses when it is supposed to be secret, he could be in hot water.

i find this a bit strange.

Nothing strange at all Kevin, if you saw and absorbed, instead of just "looking".

If you read exactly what I wrote, it wouldn't be strange at all:

"All this focus on it being a "hi-fi cable" is a tiny fraction of what it will eventually be used for and don't be surprised if the word "SECRET" is once again involved in it's usage." That was me taking the piddle out of those taking the piddle out of the word "secret". It has countless more applications it can be used in other than just audio.

jandl100
04-05-2014, 08:40
It has countless more applications it can be used in other than just audio.

Yeah, it's a bit of wire.

Securing the chicken coop, a flower pot hanger, bondage sessions, dog lead, necklace .... the list goes on. :lol:

jandl100
04-05-2014, 08:41
This is a thread about closing threads - why has it turned into another shill promotional thread for you-know-what? :scratch:

Effem
04-05-2014, 08:46
This is a thread about closing threads - why has it turned into another shill promotional thread for you-know-what? :scratch:

Simple, it obviously bothers you and the trolls FAR MORE than it bothers me. I haven't mentioned it, merely answering the trolls who ask irrelevant questions to score points and nothing else. I am happy to sit back and wait for other people to post their opinions who actually have the cable in question

Nobody is pulling my strings.

Effem
04-05-2014, 09:12
This is a thread about closing threads - why has it turned into another shill promotional thread for you-know-what? :scratch:

If we are talking about shills here Jerry, why is it that YOU can endlessly wax lyrical about your "fave cable" on forums and Hi-fi Pig to your heart's content unchallenged, yet when I do an honest appraisal of a cable that really has impressed me with the way it sounds, rather than it just being yet another bit of off the reel wire with plugs on, you get all sniffy and make snide remarks about "over enthusiastic beta testers" hyping a product when you haven't even heard it to comment about it's performance. This is from the man that not so long ago "trusted my hearing explicitly". Bit of a turn around isn't it?

Your behaviour in being so defensive about your own "fave cable" which don't forget I have actually heard, being so vitriolic and dismissive about my appraisal of a certain cable and taking every opportunity to snipe at me just lately, makes me begin to wonder old bean if your relationship to a certain dealer is a bit more than just a warm handshake.

John
04-05-2014, 09:20
Your behaviour in being so defensive about your own "fave cable" which don't forget I have actually heard, being so vitriolic and dismissive about my appraisal of a certain cable and taking every opportunity to snipe at me just lately, makes me begin to wonder old bean if your relationship to a certain dealer is a bit more than just a warm handshake.
Frank please refrain from these types of attacks unless you have proof.
And can both of you two cool it a bit

Gordon Steadman
04-05-2014, 09:23
:brickwall:

Sometimes forums just get me down. :lol:
Sometimes life just gets me down:)

I feel at times like I have the Watchtower brigade on my doorstep. Most of the time I can be my usual self and smile at them and politely say "no thanks" and close the door. But just occasionally the devil takes over :mad: and I just cannot resist showing that I know as much or more about the bible than they do and argue the toss. Its usually the language used that presses the buttons there too.

Marco
04-05-2014, 09:40
I think we've had enough now of this argumentative and repetitive pish. The initial enquiry has been satisfied long ago, so folks, it's time to say by bye-bye to this one! :wave:

Marco.