View Full Version : Could be true?
seoirse2002
23-01-2014, 09:19
http://theartofsound.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=11419&d=1390468671
Gordon Steadman
23-01-2014, 11:37
How terribly politically incorrect and true.
Seems to smack (ha ha) of the old philosophical error post hoc, propter hoc. It would only be true if all children who were spanked went on to respect others, and if all children who were not spanked went on to disrespect others.
To illustrate the point further: all criminals drank milk as children. Therefore drinking milk makes people into criminals.
Gordon Steadman
23-01-2014, 14:38
Seems to smack (ha ha) of the old philosophical error post hoc, propter hoc. It would only be true if all children who were spanked went on to respect others, and if all children who were not spanked went on to disrespect others.
To illustrate the point further: all criminals drank milk as children. Therefore drinking milk makes people into criminals.
Absolutely, I used to drink gallons of the stuff. Case proven I think.:eyebrows:
The worst that's likely to happen is that the little darlings could develop a penchant, in later life, for being spanked... :eyebrows:
More seriously, I'm all for greater discipline being shown (fairly) to kids, as long as it's for the right reasons and has its limits. The worst thing they ever did was do away with the belt in schools!!
Marco (an abhorrer of political correctness).
The worst thing they ever did was do away with the belt in schools!!
Marco (an abhorrer of political correctness).
Absolutely I am sick of seeing kids wearing their trousers beneath their arses
seriously though hitting children is quite simply barbaric
I received the slipper on one occasion and several raps across the knuckles with a wooden rule for a couple of indiscretions at school and I'm none the worse for it. I deserved the punishment, accepted it without question and never felt the desire to acquire a semi-automatic weapon for a return match with the teachers involved. It taught me respect, doubly so in fact because when I got home I also got a wallop from the old man and was sent to bed with no telly for the evening. I was strangely reluctant to test the waters again after that...
Incidentally my old man was no monster, he was a decent bloke and a stickler for teaching right from wrong... ;)
Gordon Steadman
23-01-2014, 18:24
Absolutely I am sick of seeing kids wearing their trousers beneath their arses
seriously though hitting children is quite simply barbaric
It depends what you mean by hitting.
Watch any animal - and we are animals - and, if a youngster gets out of hand, a quick cuff is administered and said sprout learns what is acceptable in their little community. Every family I have known that believes in 'free expression' for their little darlings, has bought up spoilt brats who seem to have no sense of right and wrong behaviour. I accept that there are different standards of behaviour but there are a set that seem to have been proved to oil the wheels of human society reasonably successfully.
My parents used to administer a short sharp shock to the back of my legs if I transgressed. Of course, I couldn't understand what they were going on about half the time. I thought managing to hit my sister in the eye with my little bow and arrow from the other end of the garden warranted congratulations rather than a slap but there you go:rolleyes:
I haven't grown into an aggressive person who believes in violence, quite the reverse, I shrink from it.
seoirse2002
23-01-2014, 18:54
It depends what you mean by hitting.
Watch any animal - and we are animals - and, if a youngster gets out of hand, a quick cuff is administered and said sprout learns what is acceptable in their little community. Every family I have known that believes in 'free expression' for their little darlings, has bought up spoilt brats who seem to have no sense of right and wrong behaviour. I accept that there are different standards of behaviour but there are a set that seem to have been proved to oil the wheels of human society reasonably successfully.
My parents used to administer a short sharp shock to the back of my legs if I transgressed. Of course, I couldn't understand what they were going on about half the time. I thought managing to hit my sister in the eye with my little bow and arrow from the other end of the garden warranted congratulations rather than a slap but there you go:rolleyes:
I haven't grown into an aggressive person who believes in violence, quite the reverse, I shrink from it.
Hear Hear! The original point I was trying to make was that many children don't have respect for their elders whether it be parents and teachers.... There are 2 schools of thought about this. The ones who got the odd slap and say "It never done me any harm" and the ones who never chastise their offspring because they were spanked themselves as children.These are the ones Im referring to: Ive seen it many times and Im just back from a holiday where there were lots of kids around us,and I seen lots of tantrums,bad behaviour,and just pure spoiled brats. There were also many well mannered,polite,and nice ones that I never saw any problem with and they seemed to be amazed that the others ones were getting away with their atrocious behaviour.Because they were around us all the time we asked a few of each group had they ever got a slap. Pretty much all of the good ones told us shyly ermmm "only once" or words to that effect...ALL of the others(brats) told us no,one said they would call the police,and one told us to F off and mind our own business,and one ran to their parents,who approached us later,and explained "shes not like that at home" but seen the other kids getting away with it and she knows we wont do anything in public[/I[I]]..."But when we get home,the first thing I am going to do is take away her phone and ipad for at least a week"......Me? Im still gobsmacked,the little girl was EIGHT!!!!!:scratch:
I don't want to get into criticising anybody's upbringing and yes we are animals albeit the only ones I am aware of that can use language to communicate abstract ideas , therefore why would we need to resort to physical chastisement , it is simply the easiest option and a relic behaviour that
needs to be stamped out , hitting does not educate it simply instils fear and cultivates resentment. Also hitting kids does not make a bad parent a good one .
Paul
I received the slipper on one occasion and several raps across the knuckles with a wooden rule for a couple of indiscretions at school and I'm none the worse for it. I deserved the punishment, accepted it without question and never felt the desire to acquire a semi-automatic weapon for a return match with the teachers involved. It taught me respect, doubly so in fact because when I got home I also got a wallop from the old man and was sent to bed with no telly for the evening. I was strangely reluctant to test the waters again after that...
Incidentally my old man was no monster, he was a decent bloke and a stickler for teaching right from wrong... ;)
Hear, hear! :clap:
I was brought up the same way and experienced the same treatment in school.
All this mollycoddling and political correctness has achieved nothing but the creation of spoiled and obstreperous brats, who have no respect for any form of authority, and who more often than not grow up into similarly maladjusted adults, with little of worth to offer society other than a desire to look after No1.
Marco.
well so was I and frankly I could not bring myself to ever raise a hand to my children , it would seem to me to be crass disgusting behaviour and only my own failings as a parent . Its amazing what you can teach children when you talk to them properly.
Paul
I totally agree, but the odd gentle slap, when appropriate (as described by Dave), doesn't do any harm either!
Marco
Punishment should be well thought out beforehand and fit for purpose. I have hardly ever had the need to use corporal punishment on my children however I have done on the very rare occasion it was required and I make no apologies for doing so. I have a very close relationship with my kids (now grown up with kids of their own) and never had any major problems with them as they were growing up as I ran a tight ship. They never wanted for hugs and kisses and they knew they could talk to their old man about anything, and we frequently did. Sunday evenings were exclusively family affairs so there was no going out with friends or having friends over, a situation they never challenged even in their late teenage years because we all enjoyed these family get-togethers. There might be a game of Monopoly on the go, or perhaps I might read them a story or more often than not we'd just sit and yabber about the world in general with a bit of music on in the background.
One thing I count as vitally important is that post punishment, and after a reasonable period for reflection, I would always sit down with them and explain why it had been necessary to enforce the punishment and to stress that just because they had done wrong it did not mean I didn't love them, in fact quite the opposite. I stress, the need for me to use corporal punishment was very, very rare and as such my kids understood that they had really overstepped the mark when I employed it.
The only lesson that corporal punishment teaches is that it's OK to hit people who are smaller and weaker than you.
Sorry, Joe - totally disagree! I'm with Dave all the way on this. What he's just described above, IMO, is a text-book example of 'perfect parenting'.
The description of how Dave was brought up by his parents, and in turn how he's brought up his own kids, is no doubt the reason why he turned into such a well-adjusted and considerate human being, as no doubt his kids have, too!
Marco.
Hear, hear! :clap:
I was brought up the same way and experienced the same treatment in school.
All this mollycoddling and political correctness has achieved nothing but the creation of spoiled and obstreperous brats, who have no respect for any form of authority, and who more often than not grow up into similarly maladjusted adults, with little of worth to offer society other than a desire to look after No1.
Marco.
x2- oh and bring back the Birch while we are at it.
anthonyTD
26-01-2014, 12:01
Very even handed, and sensible approach, good post.
Punishment should be well thought out beforehand and fit for purpose. I have hardly ever had the need to use corporal punishment on my children however I have done on the very rare occasion it was required and I make no apologies for doing so. I have a very close relationship with my kids (now grown up with kids of their own) and never had any major problems with them as they were growing up as I ran a tight ship. They never wanted for hugs and kisses and they knew they could talk to their old man about anything, and we frequently did. Sunday evenings were exclusively family affairs so there was no going out with friends or having friends over, a situation they never challenged even in their late teenage years because we all enjoyed these family get-togethers. There might be a game of Monopoly on the go, or perhaps I might read them a story or more often than not we'd just sit and yabber about the world in general with a bit of music on in the background.
One thing I count as vitally important is that post punishment, and after a reasonable period for reflection, I would always sit down with them and explain why it had been necessary to enforce the punishment and to stress that just because they had done wrong it did not mean I didn't love them, in fact quite the opposite. I stress, the need for me to use corporal punishment was very, very rare and as such my kids understood that they had really overstepped the mark when I employed it.
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