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View Full Version : Heybrook TT2 vs Linn LP12 (A/B comparison... almost)



bubba45
14-06-2009, 13:40
Opinions and/or questions would be most appreciated.
I have owned an LP12 for a little under a year now. It has a Cetech subchasis, Hercules/MOSE power supply and an Origin Live fully modded RB300 with AT440Mla cartridge.
It took an age to set up properly as the OL RB300 causes untold problems with its cable but set up it is and unlike ordinary RB300`s these do play on LP12`s especially with a Cetech subchasis.
It sounds fantastic - depth & breadth of sound staging superb; high, mid and bass tones are wonderful and balanced, timing and seperation excellent, etc etc. (bearing in mind I came from a fairly mediocre starting point.)
I have recently finished restoring a MK1 TT2 and fitted an unmodded RB300 with AT110e and run it through the same system. A lovely piece of turntable kit in itself.
Today out of interest I have run a side-by-side A/B comparison and found that there is literally a hairs breadth of difference between the 2. The TT2 set up has a slightly `boomier` bass, a little less seperation and the timing is not quite so precise.
However I know from running A/B comparisons of both the carts and arms that these differences are predominantly down to these 2 factors and that if I swap the OL RB300 & AT440MLa over to the TT2 I`m sure most of the differences would disappear.
My questions are:
Has anyone else ever run an A/B comparison of these 2?
Or even owned them in the past and found the same as me?
Does anyone with a good knowledge of these 2 have an opinion about these 2 TT`s, eg ex-dealers, people used to set up and servicing of both?
Is there something glaringly obvious or subtle I`m missing with either the LP12 or the Heybrook TT2?
Is this a case of the `emperors new clothes` and actually the LP12 with or without all it`s mods is simply not as wonderful as it`s reputation deserves?
By the way I have also posted this in VE so I can hopefully get broad opinion base.
Cheers in advance.

Beechwoods
14-06-2009, 14:40
Hi Bubba :smoking: interesting first post, welcome to the forum. Stop by the 'Welcome' area to say hello and a bit about you when you get the chance. What's your proper name? Assuming it's not 'Bubba' - my apologies if it is!

DSJR
14-06-2009, 15:06
Hi Bubba,

I have set both up with identical arms and done many comparisons.

The mk1 TT2 did have a "boom" problem, not at all like the bloat of the eighties LP12, but just as harmful to correct reproduction of vinyl LP's. The mk2 version of the TT2 had an aluminium casting for the sub-chassis and this was very much better and a serious contender in the mid-price turntable arena, along with the Systemdek IIx/900, AR Legend (as called in the UK), Manticor Mantra and LPT. Heybrook ran into difficulties I think just after this and the Mantra basically took over as a bridge between Rega's and the LP12.

I was always able to get a good sound out of an LP12/RB300 combination and the cartridge used plays a very important part in this I've found (same as with using an SME V on an LP12 - which could be done with care. The 440MLa should be a great match for these turntables IMO, without spending more than twice as much on a OC9 or AT33PTG for instance. Just don't be tempted by the beefier sounding Dynavectors or, heaven forbid, a Grado or Goldring, which probably won't be as good as what you're using.

pure sound
14-06-2009, 15:22
When you look at the construction of the two decks, there's no real reason why an LP12 should be better. I think the TT2 subchassis (I think you have the cast ali version) is a good deal better than the pressed metal type in the LP12 and I suspect that the all brass bearing housing is also possibly preferable to the nylon lined LP12 bearing (provided the oil is chosen carefully). The plinth construction is also better conceived imho on the TT2.

I was looking today on some 80's HFC scans on Pink Fish where the TT2 and LP12 of the time were tested. The TT2 was 265 at the time while the LP12 was 470. I suspect the enhanced expectation due to price would have been the answer back in the 80's although materially the TT2 is much better value.

DSJR
14-06-2009, 15:58
I agree, looking back. The AR deck was amazingly good as well, once the iffy bearing of the first ones was sorted out.

Trouble was, these decks sounded a bit light-weight compared with the LP12 and if you've read RD's views of the market at that time, we were so blinkered and ignorant of what was right (relatively speaking). It took Richard Black's comparison of some of these decks compared to master tape to start to bring some sense back into things (he loved the PT Anniversary as I recall).

As a separate issue, it wasn't until the mid eighties that myself and colleagues in the other shop started getting technics and similar direct-drives in for cartridge/stylus changes and it came as a surprise that many of them, set up on proper supports, actually sounded really good (this was before the SL1200 mk2 came along I think).

I think that unless you were there in the scene at the time, just how much Linn ruled the UK turntable market.

bubba45
15-06-2009, 01:21
Cheers for your views gents.
I gave them a very good A/B comparison today and I must say that strangely enough I`m leaning towards the TT2.
It may well be because I put so much effort (for a novice) into restoring it rather than the LP12 which I essntially bought as a kit and simply assembled.
The sound on the TT2 is very appealing to me and to be honest I think that a lot of the `boom` can be tempered when I switch in the OL RB300 & 440MLa from the LP12. They both bring in a great deal of clarity and definition that should give more focus to the bass on the TT2.
Hi Guy how are you? I was going to PM some photos and thanks for the plinth when I have finished painting up the armboard I made. The subchasis is the box steel welded cross shape with the MDF fill and you are right it makes for a hugely more substantial subchasis than the LP12. Did the cast aluminium type make any difference on a TT2?
The tolerances of the inner platter spindle and bearing housing are amazingly precise and it runs so smooth. Altogether the TT2 is a lovely, well engineered turntable and I have been well impressed so far.
My leaning at the moment is to actually sell the LP12, keep the TT2 and use the money for some other hifi gear, though other than a decent TT shelf and a good DAB tuner I`m fairly happy with what I have.
I have never heard any of the AR tables nor a Manticore or LPT. Are they all much of a muchness or are there noticeable differences?
Jason

Peter Stockwell
15-06-2009, 02:04
I had a TT2, but 3000 miles in theback of my car, without tightening the chassis lock bolt did it in, it was never the same afterwards. I sold it for about $180 in 1988/1989.

DSJR
15-06-2009, 07:00
IMO, the cast sub-chassis improved the TT2 out of all recognition and this refinement took it to another level. Sadly, this was around the time that turntable sales took a nosedive and Heybrook had also lost the momentum they had in the early eighties. Perhaps there's a light-weight fill that can go in the tubular sub-chassis to damp it down?

I believe that later ones had an external power supply and the main bearing and platter system were always beautifully done.

bubba45
24-06-2009, 00:07
Well I swapped the OL modded RB300 / AT440MLa into the Heybrook and if there`s a difference it`s minor and the bass boom is massively limited with the bass as a whole a helluva lot more defined.
The TT2 is a little warmer than the LP12 which I like and I can get a decent price for the LP12 so it`s all good.
The TT2 is all painted and the veneer oiled and to me the deck looks and sounds great so when I get chance at the weekend I`ll take and post some snaps of it and the Ariston RD40 I restored at the turn of the year. The RD40 is on my 2nd system and at some point I will get round to rewiring the tonearm it just to see how good the sound can get on these Jelco arms.
As both the TT2 and the RD40 have taken many long hours to complete I guess you could say they are my pride and joy.....
In the photos you`ll see that the armboard for the TT2 is a little too small but for a 1st attempt it ain`t bad but even so I will undoubtedly make another.

Not sure what my next restoration should be? Any suggestions welcome.
Jason

DSJR
24-06-2009, 07:24
Try dressing the RB300 cables this way on an LP12 (like we used to do the Grace 707)

Use a cable tie to tie the cable to the arm pillar, giving it some height (essential with a 250). Pre- squeeze the P clip (use a new one each time, they're cheap enough from RS components) in a small bench-vice to the right size so it tightly grips the cable without crushing one edge. I used match-sticks to aid the RB250 wires, not elegant, but it worked for me).

More bass than an LP12 is a very risky thing (ok, yours has the cetech). The LP12 isn't known as "the fruitbox" for nothing. As I said previously, the juicy, organic bass from a standard LP12 is totally WRONG, despite how tuneful and involving it is. The bass in recordings (and from better turntables) is dryer and firmer.

Me? I'd sell both turntables, keep the OL arm if it's finished to a good standard (not all are apparently, so I've been told by one who should know) and put it on a NAS Spacedeck (or a Techie, although I feel in my bones that a Rega sibling isn't the best choice for one of these). You'll get tunes, rhythm and a clarity you never thought LP's could give - and that's only the beginning!!!!!!!!! :)

bubba45
28-06-2009, 12:12
Cheers for the advice Dave.
I may try dressing the cable that way in the future but for now I`ve gone with using two `P clips` to dress the cable on the TT2. One is bolted to the bottom of the armboard and the other at the `p clip` / cable fixing block on the plinth itself. This has removed the bass boom an turned the TT2 into a really lovely musical sounding deck.
It will hopefully improve further when mounted on a wooden base wall shelf.
It may be sacrilege to some but I`ve actually gone ahead and replaced the LP12 in my main system with the TT2. A side-by-side A/B comparison with friends as well confirms that there is virtually no difference in quality between a modified LP12 and a regular TT2.
There is a little more musicality (some would say colouration?) to the TT2 but it gives a warmth to the sounds I really like. Same detail, seperation, soundstaging etc.
The TT2 is a keeper I think. (but I can never rest on my Hifi laurels)
Hopefully these picks will come out? as you can see the home made armboard is a few mm`s too narrow and too short, but I don`t think that will maks any sonic difference will it?

shane
28-06-2009, 21:06
Sorry I missed this thread until today. I have a particular and quite unreasonable affection for the TT2 since I designed it. I was with Heybrook from '79 to '84, although the TT2 actually pre-dates Heybrook, as it started out as a bedroom project about 2 years earlier.

The version you have is puzzling me. Would it be possible to take a picture of the underside to see which chassis it has? The oldest versions had the fabricated steel chassis, and were distinguished by a rather clunky mains switch which was bigger than the one on yours, and sat beside the nameplate, rather than being mounted in a hole in it. This was replaced by a switch similar to yours, but it was illuminated and had a red translucent rocker. This change was made at about the same time as the change to the cast chassis, so yours could be either. I don't remember any of them having the switch yours has, so it could be a replacement, but equally well it could be that we made a few with your switch if the illuminated one was out of stock; it was the same size and shape. (There was a school of thought that said that he neon in the switch affected the sound. Frankly, I doubt it.)

The change to the chassis was by far the biggest change made in the lifetime of the TT2. It was generally held to be better, but I don't think it was all that clear-cut. Unfortunately it's over 25 years since I heard them side by side, so I'm not going to attempt to describe the difference, and I've always been crap at describing the sound of equipment. I just know if I like something better or not, and leave the analysis to others (If you work with Peter Comeau, you really don't need to worry about things like that, since his ears are probably the finest analytical instruments ever to be loosed on the hifi industry!). Interestingly, I was discussing the TT2 with him a couple of years ago and he surprised me by saying that he always preferred the earlier chassis, but since we were committed to the tooling costs of the ally chassis we had to go with it. It has to be said though that neither version ever persuaded him to give up his beloved LP12.

My own TT2 (ally version) now resides under my daughter's bed, having been displaced by a slate based idler drive device using an Akai 4000DS motor and a TT2 platter and bearing that I happened to have lying around... Tonally, it's probably not a accurate as the TT2, but for drive and slam, it leaves it for dead, I'm afraid!

I'll be more than happy to answer any questions as far as I can, but I've been out of the industry for a very long time, so I can't promise historical accuracy!

bubba45
29-06-2009, 01:03
(There you go that`s twice now I've been writing a post on here and it`s got lost when I come to submit. Pain in the rear.)
Anyway hi Shane and many thanks for designing a great turntable that to my ears just sounds lovely.
As this post suggests I think foe ease of use and sound it beats an LP12.
My TT2 is an amlagam of 2 Heybrooks.
The 1st I bought from our friendly neighbourhood auction site for a few quid as the previous owner had hacked and chopped and cut the plinth apart to make it look like an LP12. But he / she had made a real Bodgit & Scarper job so I bought a plinth from Guy on here and simply transferred the mecahnics / electrics from the 1st to the 2nd. The switch you see here came fom the plinth I got from Guy. The 1st switch was a big red thing that was also hacked to pieces.
Anyway the subchasis is the original welded steel cross shape but I have no photos at the moment.
My friend who was subjected to the A/B comparison with a Linn has asked me to find her a TT2. I`ve seen one up for auction that needs a bit of work - which I like doing.
It has the black outer platter which I know from an earlier post suggests it is of a poorly finished 1st batch which were all painted. Is the quality so bad that I won`t be able to even polish the outer rim of this outer platter? If so do you have an old outer platter lying around I could take of your hands? if not do you know anyone who might have one?
Thanks again for such a great design. These are seemingly rare and overlooked TT`s which is a damn shame as they are such a great quality sounding deck that for musicality and ease fo use beat LP12`s and Ariston`s hands down.
Hopefully I`ll come across a MK2 at some point and then I can do a side-by-side A/B comparison and let you know which I think is better. (my money is on a MK1 having a better sound, but that`s just a hunch and a little bit of prejudice for my latest restoration project.)
I`ll post pics if / when I next remove the baseboard.
Cheers
Jason

pure sound
29-06-2009, 10:25
Hi Jason,

That's scrubbed up nicely! For Shane's benefit, that plinth was used in a rather odd display piece which had a section of the cast subchassis sawn away aswell as a large section of the brass bearing housing machined off leaving the shaft visible. I'm not sure quite how this piece would ever have been displayed without lifting the front of the plinth right up but there it is! The switch is as it was on that display item. I suspect this was made late in the Mk1 period.

Here's a pic of it underneath complete with 'sawn away' parts before I removed those & sent the plinth to Jason.

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh107/pure_sound/Walnutbeneath.jpg

I may have some spare silver outer platters. I'll need to go up in the loft again to look. Bear with me!

Marco
29-06-2009, 10:35
(There you go that`s twice now I've been writing a post on here and it`s got lost when I come to submit. Pain in the rear.)


Hi Jason,

Not sure why that's happened, but a good tip is always to copy and paste your posts to a Word document before sending them, as if anything happens you've at least got back-up :)

Marco.

shane
29-06-2009, 16:13
Blimey, someone put a lot of effort into that! As you say, I can't quite understand why because you couldn't see any of the cut-away portions unless it was standing on a mirror. We did put together a demo turntable for exhibitions, with the suspension springs standing on a piece of board. I dug it out a while ago to try out a home-made arm, see here: http://www.thepippin.plus.com/Unipivot/DSCF0403.JPG . I was particularly pleased with the arm rest. :lol:

Going back to Jason's TT2, yes, the first batch of 100 platters had to be sprayed black because the platter castings were less than wonderful. The problem was that they had loads of little voids. They were perfectly good in every other way, but looked awful, although some were worse than others so you may be OK if you try to polish yours. The platter, suspension rubbers and springs and the later cast chassis are about the only parts that can't be replaced. All the other mechanical parts (bearing, shaft, motor pulley, sub-platter and the original steel chassis were made for us by a local machine shop from standard tube or bar stock. There were no magic ingredients or multi-million-pound ultra-precision tooling, just a couple of blokes with a lot of common sense and a decent lathe.

Couple of points: I see you've made your own arm board.This was one area where we tried a lot of different approaches and ended up using two pieces of 9mm birch ply glued together and fixed to the sub-chassis by only one of the two bolts (the one nearest the bearing). The other bolt served only to locate the board. The slightly lossy coupling this gave between the chassis and board gave the best sound. The Impex motor (now called Airpax, but it's the same thing) benefited greatly from the addition of a sprung thrust pad pushing against the bottom of the shaft, but if your turntable has been chopped about this could be easily have been lost. Have a look and see if yours has a white nylon cup push-fitted over the bottom bearing. If not, I may possibly have one knocking around somewhere. Apart from that, I can't think of any parts that are likely to have suffered much over the years. The bearing and motor were very lightly stressed, and there aren't any other moving parts to wear out and there's no electronics to burn out. The later versions with the dedicated PSU are prone to burning out a chip which is now unobtainable, so may be best avoided, but could always be easily converted to original spec. I don't know if they were a significant improvement since I never heard one, but most turntables using that motor seemed to benefit from a clean supply wave-form so it could be a worthwhile area for experimentation.

It's really nice to know that people are still out there getting enjoyment from what started out as a DIY project in my bedroom nearly 30 years ago. I think Heybrook made about 4000 over the years so, whilst they're not exactly common, they do pop up quite regularly on Ebay, and since Heybrook were never quite so adept as Linn at whipping up media frenzy, they usually go for around 200. Something of a bargain, really.

bubba45
29-06-2009, 21:18
Hi gents

Cheers for the tip Marco, I think I have learnt the hard way about cutting and saving a post before I submit. Doh!:doh:

Hi again Guy.
Yeah it has scrubbed up well and I am quietly (well maybe not so quietly) proud of it.:):champagne: The armborad needs remaking at some point. Unfortunately I live in a lovely but modest sized 1 bed flat so all sawing etc is done by hand on a B&D workmate in the hall or the bathroom. The accuracy suffers a little as I have absolutely no training in carpentry so i just kinda do my best with modest space, tools & skills. If I do win this other TT2 (which my friend & I are determined to do) then an outer platter I could polish would be great. Did you manage to come away with a stock of spares for TT2`s then?

Hi Shane.
The motor I`m using has the white nylon cup on the bottom and the spare has an SRM tech motor thrust pad which works very well on Airpax / Phillips motors. I had thought of trying to fit the Hercules / MOSE PSU from my LP12 to the TT2, but to be honest it would have required some cutting and chopping of the plinth with uncertain success to achieve this. Even little things like having to widen the switch hole, extend the wires of the motor to reach the interface board, etc counted gainst it. I don`t yet have the skill or tools to attempt some things like that.
I will have to remake the armboard and try the Plywood you suggest and also ebcause I have actually used 2 counter sunk M4 nuts on the underside to firmly clamp the armboard in place as per Linn boards. What in laymans terms was the difference with only one nut / bolt to clamp the board in place?
This still sounds very good to my humble ears.

Any of you gents any experience with the Mission 774SM Tonearm or is that a whole new thread?

Cheers
Jason

bubba45
06-07-2009, 01:53
Hi Gents
Just picked this up earlier. As you can see it`s in a bit of a state, but the motor still works and the plinth is solid. Needs some re-wiring I think and the tonearm at leasst needs cartridge clips adding if not the full re-wire job.

Shane I think that the outer platter is actually a DIY job rather than an actual Heybrook re-spray to cover a shoddy casting.
I see what you mean by the arrangemnet of the bolts for the armboard. Kinda confused me as the armboard I got with the 1st TT2 was a very poor homemade effort by the previous owner.
This a very early MK1 - serial no. 485 and it still has Mecom Ltd on the backplate.
Cheers for looking and I`ll post some pictures as I go along but this will be a much simpler restore than the 1st one I did.
Jason

pure sound
06-07-2009, 07:46
Looks ok! Let me know if you need new springs, belt etc. I'll also have a look & see what outer platters there are.

shane
06-07-2009, 20:38
That's a really early one. I probably put it together! It's even got the ply plinth top plate, so one of the very first. looks basically good though. That black platter I'm pretty sure came out of the factory like that. it was an emergency measure and did look a bit home-made, exactly like the photo.

Marco
06-07-2009, 21:57
Hi Shane,

Forgive my ignorance, but I had no idea you had something to do with Heybrook. What was your role their exactly and why haven't you mentioned this much before (unless I've missed it all)? :)

Cheers!

Marco.

The Grand Wazoo
06-07-2009, 22:30
Hi Shane,

Forgive my ignorance, but I had no idea you had something to do with Heybrook..............

Cheers

...........insert 'you little tinker' comments as applicable.

bubba45
07-07-2009, 07:26
Hi again gents.

Hi Shane
You are right about this being an early version but still absolutely solid as a rock though, despite being left in a loft for a few years.
I`m going to re-spray the plinth top plate and armboard then re-oil the wood surround. Th egrain on the wood for this looks lovely and shouls come up very well.
From a bit of researching I`ve found that the arm is a bit of a keeper too and seems like a rare quality arm from Mission that is just a very small step down from the Mission Mechanic. So a good result for the money really.

Hi Guy
I could do with a couple of belts actually as I always like to have one spare and if you have an outer platter that would be great and PM me a price as before.
So far all the pther parts seem fine the bearing and housing are all intact and unmarked, rubber bushes fine, though the suspension bolts are a little rusty around the top I can soon clean them up.

If the grain on this one`s plinth comes up as clean and clear as I imagine then I may keep it for myself and passmy 1st one onto my friend.

I`ll let you know how it goes.

Jason

bubba45
15-08-2009, 20:37
Just finished restoring the Heybrook & Mission 774SM. Looks great IMHO and sounds fantastic.
There`s an album of photos running from latest back to oldest (oops!!) if anyone is interested.
The Mission 774SM is a stunning arm. Absolute quality and I think I have a set up for keeps in the current TT2 so I`m going to sell the 1st one I restored..
Thanks for advice Shane & Guy. As you cn see from the photos the outer platter cleaned up beautifully with casting faults evident at all Shane.
Cheers

shane
16-08-2009, 21:57
There`s an album of photos running from latest back to oldest (oops!!) if anyone is interested.

Where?

DSJR
17-08-2009, 08:49
Wasn't the 774SM a Jelco made product?

bubba45
18-08-2009, 14:54
Hi DSJR
No the 774SM was built by GB Tools who built the Mision Mechanic and the Zeta arms.
The 774SM was the forerunner to the Mechanic and seems to be pretty rare or at least comes up rarely for sale from what I can gather.
The 774LC was built by Jelco and is essentially a Jelco 250st precursor ar at least looks like one.
The SM is a different beast entirely to the 774 Original & the 774LC.
The SM is a cracking arm, best I`ve heard but then I have had very limited experience of tonearms. The rewire by Audiorigami is a class piece of work.

http://i623.photobucket.com/albums/tt320/bubba45_01/TT2%20and%20774SM%20vol2/DSC00046_edited.jpg

http://i623.photobucket.com/albums/tt320/bubba45_01/TT2%20and%20774SM%20vol2/DSC00045_edited.jpg

http://i623.photobucket.com/albums/tt320/bubba45_01/TT2%20and%20774SM%20vol2/DSC00005_edited.jpg

http://i623.photobucket.com/albums/tt320/bubba45_01/TT2%20and%20774SM%20vol2/DSC00003_edited.jpg

http://i623.photobucket.com/albums/tt320/bubba45_01/TT2%20and%20774SM%20vol2/DSC00002_edited.jpg

AlfaGTV
27-02-2012, 13:56
Thanks for great info and pics! Have just got my hands on a pretty nice TT2 bearing a Rega RB-250 and i am pleasantly surprised with the audio quality and overall impression. Mine is a steel subchassis item and i will make a new tone arm board with a better machined hole for the Rega Arms.

http://www.ollars.net/hififorum/TT2_S_1.JPG (http://www.ollars.net/hififorum/TT2_1.JPG)

http://www.ollars.net/hififorum/TT2_S_2.JPG (http://www.ollars.net/hififorum/TT2_2.JPG)
Both images are clickable!

The TT is making music using a DL-103 at the moment, but i will dress it up using my Benz Micro Ace SL, when the armboard is finished.

Any suggestions on armboard construction? I was thinking a glued sandwich of marine plywood or MDF or perhaps a combination?

Best regards
Micke from Sweden

snapper
27-02-2012, 14:01
Hello Micke

Before you go any further, could you please pop into the Welcome area and introduce yourself to our community, as you were asked to do in the registration email you received - ta!

AlfaGTV
27-02-2012, 14:31
Hello Micke

Before you go any further, could you please pop into the Welcome area and introduce yourself to our community, as you were asked to do in the registration email you received - ta!

Been there, done that! ;)
Thanks for Heads Up!
BR /Micke

Rare Bird
27-02-2012, 16:42
Nice Decks, i used have the version with the box section sub..

DSJR
27-02-2012, 21:39
I'd like to try a TT2 (ally sub chassis for me I think) with an Alphason arm. Still a great looking turntable that unless really wrecked, still looks good. Mind you, the box chassis could possibly be filled with a lightweight damping solution perhaps?

pure sound
28-02-2012, 19:54
I'd like to try a TT2 (ally sub chassis for me I think) with an Alphason arm. Still a great looking turntable that unless really wrecked, still looks good.

It does work well, that combination.

http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i318/murrayjohnson/Xenon.jpg

Darren
29-02-2012, 22:39
Hifi Review Hated that combination.... they said that they had heard the TT2 sound so much better with a linn LVX......

pure sound
01-03-2012, 13:56
Hifi Review :lol:

shane
01-03-2012, 14:25
Any suggestions on armboard construction? I was thinking a glued sandwich of marine plywood or MDF or perhaps a combination?



The original armboard was made up from two layers of 9mm birch ply glued together. We tried many combinations of ply and MDF, and this came out best. The armboard was held in place by a pair of m4 studs inserted through the bottom layer of ply before the layers were glued together, but note that only one of the bolts was fastened to the chassis with a nut, the other simply locating in a hole to stop the board rotating. Adding a second nut tended to de-focus the sound. On steel chassis models, the second stud was cut off so it wouldn't reach all the way through the chassis.

You can see what I mean comparing this one on Ebay to Guy's alloy chassis above:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HEYBROOK-TT2-TURNTABLE-VERY-GOOD-CONDITION-/251000149318?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_Turntables&hash=item3a70c65546

freefallrob
01-03-2012, 15:39
Hifi Review Hated that combination.... they said that they had heard the TT2 sound so much better with a linn LVX......

Sounds superb with a boggo standard RB300/Goldring 1012GX...

DSJR
01-03-2012, 16:08
Hifi Review :lol:

I shall not say, I shall not say........... :rfl:

AlfaGTV
01-03-2012, 18:59
The original armboard was made up from two layers of 9mm birch ply glued together. We tried many combinations of ply and MDF, and this came out best...

Thx for the info Shane, any particular glue used for bonding the two plates? I assume some sort of viscoelastic could prove useful?

And while investigating the tonearm i also discovered the reason for it skipping on some tracks... :steam: The vertical bearing has got a thorough beating obviously and is sticking or "cogging" if you get me... :mental:

I'm looking into another arm right now, any suggestions? Ittok LV II, RB250 or what?
Good value for money is always appreciated! ;)

Br Micke

Darren
01-03-2012, 19:03
Hifi Review :lol:

They put the 20 something me right off loads of good kit and when I finally bought some Linn and Naim I absolutely hated it.

DSJR
01-03-2012, 19:04
Both the Rega AND Ittok sounded fine on this turntable, it's lack of fruity bass causing it to not be favoured to an LP12 of the period! I bet they'd sound a lot closer now, especially with an external motor supply for the TT2 :)

A system Peter C was playing at an early show, the sound of which on "Cantate Domino" brought me to tears, was a TT2/Ittok/Asak T (I think the cart was - before the Karma I'm sure), can't remember the preamp - possibly a Naim 32.5/Hicap, a pair of EAR 509's and some HB2's with their stands. My God it was wonderful (I was and still remain an HB2 fan - another closet-classic).

shane
02-03-2012, 11:06
(I was and still remain an HB2 fan - another closet-classic).

My sister-in-law has a pair of HB2s. It still amazes me how good they are at conveying the space and emotion in a piece of music. Far better than the HB1, but they seem to go for peanuts on ebay for some reason.


Thx for the info Shane, any particular glue used for bonding the two plates? I assume some sort of viscoelastic could prove useful?

They were put together for us by Greaves, who also made the plinths. We didn't specify any particular glue. I imagine a bog-standard PVA wood glue would do.

I have in my shed a spare TT2 cast alloy chassis. Would anyone with a steel chassis TT2 care to try it out and report back on perceived differences? (I would like it back again at some stage!).

Rare Bird
02-03-2012, 11:10
Is that Greaves in Sheffield Shane?

I loved the old HB1,2 & 3..

Macca
02-03-2012, 13:34
They put the 20 something me right off loads of good kit and when I finally bought some Linn and Naim I absolutely hated it.

I have some old isues of Hi-Fi review I was re-reading last year. It was not as Linn/Naim biased as everyone thinks they remember it being

AlfaGTV
02-03-2012, 15:13
Well, while fabricating a new tone arm board at home my defect RB-250 is taking a trip to Glasgow for complete rewiring as well as exchanging the bearings and getting a strip down (perhaps something for me to? :eyebrows:) ang buffing along with foam filling/inserts!

I'll fill you in on the results in a couple of weeks! And Shane i'd surely take you up on that tryout with the cast subframe if it wasnt for the shipping hassle and costs! But i hope someone takes you up on it!

:cool: Now its friday and i'm off to our liquor monopoly; Systembolaget
Cheers!

DSJR
02-03-2012, 15:17
I have some old isues of Hi-Fi review I was re-reading last year. It was not as Linn/Naim biased as everyone thinks they remember it being

I had some "Flat Response" mags (I think I gave them to Alex_UK). They were so awful to read these days I felt sick - and I partly believed all the bullsh*t contained within at one point...

shane
02-03-2012, 16:43
Is that Greaves in Sheffield Shane?

I loved the old HB1,2 & 3..

That's them. Did the cabs for HB2 and HB3 as well as the TT2 plinth. HB1 was made by a little company in Liskaerd.

Darren
02-03-2012, 17:18
I have some old isues of Hi-Fi review I was re-reading last year. It was not as Linn/Naim biased as everyone thinks they remember it being

Really Macca? I remember they liked Some other bits of kit but always damned it by saying it was good but not as good as Linn/Naim.
They hated the American high end brands with a passion as I recall.

Macca
03-03-2012, 09:29
Really Macca? I remember they liked Some other bits of kit but always damned it by saying it was good but not as good as Linn/Naim.
They hated the American high end brands with a passion as I recall.

Things got toned down when the title changed from TFR to HFR. Exposure amps were always rated (Ian Rankin) and I don't think Noel Keywood ever mentions Linn or Naim and a lot of the reviews are his. Speakers and CD players they are pretty agnostic about. They liked Rega as well. I have an issue where a full QUAD system is reviewed very favourably. They also print quite a few letters slagging them off for Linn/Naim bias -example 'If the Linn LP12 is so good how come your classifieds are full of people selling them?'

chris@panteg
05-03-2012, 23:01
Things got toned down when the title changed from TFR to HFR. Exposure amps were always rated (Ian Rankin) and I don't think Noel Keywood ever mentions Linn or Naim and a lot of the reviews are his. Speakers and CD players they are pretty agnostic about. They liked Rega as well. I have an issue where a full QUAD system is reviewed very favourably. They also print quite a few letters slagging them off for Linn/Naim bias -example 'If the Linn LP12 is so good how come your classifieds are full of people selling them?'

And do you remember Chris Frankland making the statement and i quote ' If a component does not work in a known good system then it will never work ! '

He was of course referring to the ideas and system matching put forward by Peter Qvortrup , they hated each other !

Macca
05-03-2012, 23:17
And do you remember Chris Frankland making the statement and i quote ' If a component does not work in a known good system then it will never work ! '

He was of course referring to the ideas and system matching put forward by Peter Qvortrup , they hated each other !

I don't but then I was only twenty and not really clued up about the whole thing. I'm not defending anyhting Chris Frankland wrote or said, it was just re-reading 5 or 6 issues I uncovered last year ( I am still unpacking after 13 years:rolleyes:) it just stuck me that there was not as much bias as some people now make out. There was some bias, from some contributors, that I agree.

DSJR
06-03-2012, 09:11
And do you remember Chris Frankland making the statement and i quote ' If a component does not work in a known good system then it will never work ! '

He was of course referring to the ideas and system matching put forward by Peter Qvortrup , they hated each other !


Well, Chris Frankland's "known good system" was nothing of the sort, as history has shown.

I love a comment made by an old industry friend regarding PQ as well - he caused havoc over here, then moved to the US and did the same there. is he back here again, trying to make his millions?

Macca
06-03-2012, 09:16
Well, Chris Frankland's "known good system" was nothing of the sort, as history has shown.



LP12, Naim Aro, Trokia, top of the range Naim amps, don't know what his speakers were but it couldn't be that bad, could it? What did history show?

Audioman
14-05-2012, 10:39
Well, Chris Frankland's "known good system" was nothing of the sort, as history has shown.

I love a comment made by an old industry friend regarding PQ as well - he caused havoc over here, then moved to the US and did the same there. is he back here again, trying to make his millions?

I noticed he had a website peddling his ideas a few years ago. Think he was in UK. As for Mr Frankland - If it wasn't Linn / Naim it was crap - honourable exceptions to Roksan Xerxes and Inca Tech Claymore.

AlfaGTV
14-05-2012, 12:29
Well, i've actually assembled my TT2 with a fine RB301 bought from a forum colleague, thanks Hamish! :) A very nice combo, but i couldn't resist trying
an Origin Live Silver Mk III recently aquired (not 'a' or 'c') and after a little trouble dressing the cables properly it really sounds awesome!
http://www.ollars.net/hififorum/TT2_OLS.JPG

I like it so much i've actually bought another Heybrook TT2! This time it's a Mk II with a reputedly bad TPS, and this time with the aluminium subframe.
(Still with the CNC-processesd MDF base though, hollowed out to accomodate the subframe only.)

Will be sticking my nose into the motor/psu tonight i think!

BR /Mike

pure sound
15-05-2012, 15:30
I love a comment made by an old industry friend regarding PQ as well - he caused havoc over here, then moved to the US and did the same there. is he back here again, trying to make his millions?

When did he move to the US? News to me, he's been living in the UK for about 30 years!

Still, never let the facts etc....:)

DSJR
15-05-2012, 16:14
I must have been misinformed then :)

DSJR
15-05-2012, 16:20
LP12, Naim Aro, Trokia, top of the range Naim amps, don't know what his speakers were but it couldn't be that bad, could it? What did history show?

The ARO on the old LP12 from the 80's wasn't a very happy match IMO. In terms of truth to the vinyl source, it was way coloured and ill defined, although later on, the LP12 improved enough to make the ARO really sing - IMO. the Naim amps he had were CB types - nuff said on that one, especially with the flat and veiled 72 preamp of the period. Les W and Neil Jadman have both shown what can be done with Naim preamps at least and of course Teddy Pardo has some well received power supplies - all of this was before the 52 pre came along remember. I believe CF was well out of it by then.

As for his speakers, I think CF was a 'Brik fan - passive of course, so rather limited in being able to discern what was really right and what was personal opinion, since he was so single minded of their excellence.

All twenty five or more years ago now. The LP12's of that period are on their second or third owner by now and totally rebuilt and updated for the most part, any surviving original CB Naims will be in their death throes by now without a full service to bring them back to spec and as for 'briks, I rest my case :rofl:

YNWaN
15-05-2012, 16:24
There's so much I feel I should write - but I won't.

Marco
15-05-2012, 16:27
Please do, as we all benefit from each other's experiences... :)

Marco.

Rare Bird
15-05-2012, 16:31
:popcorn:

bert2
29-09-2012, 15:05
Can anyone tell me how to tell if my TT2 is series one or two without taking it apart? Its serial number is 1533.
I may sell it as my old ears can't tell the difference between it and my Pioneer PL12D now. It is fitted with an Aurum arm by Helius Designs and a Denon DL304 MC cartridge and I would welcome any guidance as to a reasonable price to ask.

sq225917
29-09-2012, 20:57
The sub-chassis is alloy on the mk2

YNWaN
29-09-2012, 21:07
Yeah, look at the gap between the armboard and the top plate - if you see a black chassis it is the powder coated steel one and a MK1, if it is silver then it is aluminium and the MK2.

shane
29-09-2012, 22:20
Yeah, look at the gap between the armboard and the top plate - if you see a black chassis it is the powder coated steel one and a MK1, if it is silver then it is aluminium and the MK2.

Alloy chassis were usually sprayed black on top to stop the chassis showing in the gap! All you need to do is put in the transit bolt, tip the TT on it's side and take the base off. It's very obvious whether the chassis is cast alloy or fabricated steel.

YNWaN
29-09-2012, 22:22
Oh were they - oh well - seemed lke a good idea :).

mimoser
20-08-2013, 18:44
Being well aware this is an old thread I nonetheless want to add my experiences with an A-B comparison between a TT2 and an LP12:
A) TT2 cast chassis, Heed Orbit, DIY armboard, RB251, Expressimo Heavyweight, Stanton 681EEE Mk2 with Pickering XV-15 625e stylus,
B) LP12 pre-circus, Hercules/Mose, OL Armboard, OL vta adjuster, RB250, no-name underslung counterweight, Pickering XV-15 625e.

results:
- without underslung counterweights rather boomy bass from the LP12, gets well under control with lower center of gravity,
- LP12 gives a little bit more "drive" to "modern" music, but less details in the mids,
- TT2 has less "drive", but a lot more details in the mids and the "background", you hear more of single instruments in classical recordings,
- Hendrix sounds better on the LP12, but classical has a large margin on the TT2,
- All taken into account, the TT2 has more detail and a more laid back presentation.

Which is better? depends on your taste …
We will keep both, as the LP12 was a fleamarket bargain at EUR 10,– (incl. Valhalla, LVV), but the TT2 will go into the main system again, as the wife and I prefer "laid back" and "detailed" to "prat" …

accessories used: Trichord Dino Mk1, VSPS, Yamaha RX-460, Monitor Audio 7

lessons learnt:
- putting the LP12 on a wall shelf is imperative to crisp sound,
- the TT2 cares less for shelfing, but profits nonetheless,
- a VSPS on a breadboard is a very good phonostage, but the Dino definitively has an edge on it, though not x10 as the price suggests …

links:
- my thread about "boomy bass" on the official LP12 forum (http://forums.linn.co.uk/bb/showthread.php?tid=17982)
- about me on this forum (http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?26578-Hi-from-Austria-Europe&p=459429#post459429)

some pics from the A-B comparison:
http://i408.photobucket.com/albums/pp164/mimoser67/_MG_6217.jpg (http://s408.photobucket.com/user/mimoser67/media/_MG_6217.jpg.html)
http://i408.photobucket.com/albums/pp164/mimoser67/_MG_6216-1.jpg (http://s408.photobucket.com/user/mimoser67/media/_MG_6216-1.jpg.html)

LP12 fresh from fleamarket:
http://i408.photobucket.com/albums/pp164/mimoser67/_MG_5879.jpg (http://s408.photobucket.com/user/mimoser67/media/_MG_5879.jpg.html)

;-)
Michael

AlfaGTV
20-08-2013, 19:17
Damnit, 10 euros for a Sondek???? :scratch:
A similar Sondek would fetch at least 750 here in Sweden! :stalks:

Nice to read your impressions on these two classics, though a very nice Heybrook would only be about the third of the price of a Sondek so it's the underdog for me!

Regards Mike

mimoser
20-08-2013, 19:31
to assess priceworthiness look at the fungus growing on the armboard in the last pic, not at the pics after restoration. Until I had taken it home, there was no way to test this LP12 for function …
:)
… and I paid EUR 300,– for my TT2 in 2008. Including a knackered RB250 I had to send for repairs immediately.
So grab a TT2 as long as they go cheap.
Michael

julesd68
20-08-2013, 19:56
Well you've done a beautiful job with the LP12 restoration Michael - looks in 'showroom' condition to me ...

I must admit to never having heard an LP12 and actually would really like to hear an 80's version with Ittok or something, as this was what my current deck was 'competing' with at the time. Sadly I was traumatised in my childhood by listening to a Linn Axis & Naim Nait which was so bright & thin sounding, blood nearly came out of my ears - put me off all things Linn & Naim for life ... :lol:

walpurgis
20-08-2013, 20:04
I was traumatised in my childhood by listening to a Linn Axis & Naim Nait which was so bright & thin sounding, blood nearly came out of my ears - put me off all things Linn & Naim for life ... :lol:

That's why the early LP12's were a good match for the Naims. The Naim amps sounded so ruthless that the Linn's soggy, wooliness was the logical choice to balance this out. These days it's almost the other way round, Naims getting more refined and the Linn having the warmth and 'character' evolved out of it.

synsei
20-08-2013, 20:13
That's why the early LP12's were a good match for the Naims. The Naim amps sounded so ruthless that the Linn's soggy, wooliness was the logical choice to balance this out. These days it's almost the other way round, Naims getting more refined and the Linn having the warmth and 'character' evolved out of it.

Ah 'character', that fine Linn euphemism for 'not very accurate'... :D

julesd68
20-08-2013, 20:25
- my thread about "boomy bass" on the official LP12 forum (http://forums.linn.co.uk/bb/showthread.php?tid=17982)

Just finished reading this thread and it's quite amusing ...

Full of the usual stuff about the dark arts of setting up the LP12, get an expert dealer to do it etc etc
And then there's all the 'attitude' you get if you stray from the party line. :doh:

mimoser
20-08-2013, 20:46
tbh the thread was rather helpful. You just have to ignore the usual missionaries.
I also found some very pragmatical information in threads dealing with basic setup procedures.
especially recommended: http://forums.linn.co.uk/bb/showthread.php?tid=9941
The German turntable fora I frequent are much less informative and much more djihadistic …
:)
Michael

Audiovista
23-11-2013, 17:27
That looks like Alien Intervention. Have you seen those photo's of unexplained animal mutilations?

Hi Jason,

That's scrubbed up nicely! For Shane's benefit, that plinth was used in a rather odd display piece which had a section of the cast subchassis sawn away aswell as a large section of the brass bearing housing machined off leaving the shaft visible. I'm not sure quite how this piece would ever have been displayed without lifting the front of the plinth right up but there it is! The switch is as it was on that display item. I suspect this was made late in the Mk1 period.

Here's a pic of it underneath complete with 'sawn away' parts before I removed those & sent the plinth to Jason.

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh107/pure_sound/Walnutbeneath.jpg

I may have some spare silver outer platters. I'll need to go up in the loft again to look. Bear with me!

Audiovista
23-11-2013, 17:46
Great Stufff!!


Being well aware this is an old thread I nonetheless want to add my experiences with an A-B comparison between a TT2 and an LP12:
A) TT2 cast chassis, Heed Orbit, DIY armboard, RB251, Expressimo Heavyweight, Stanton 681EEE Mk2 with Pickering XV-15 625e stylus,
B) LP12 pre-circus, Hercules/Mose, OL Armboard, OL vta adjuster, RB250, no-name underslung counterweight, Pickering XV-15 625e.

results:
- without underslung counterweights rather boomy bass from the LP12, gets well under control with lower center of gravity,
- LP12 gives a little bit more "drive" to "modern" music, but less details in the mids,
- TT2 has less "drive", but a lot more details in the mids and the "background", you hear more of single instruments in classical recordings,
- Hendrix sounds better on the LP12, but classical has a large margin on the TT2,
- All taken into account, the TT2 has more detail and a more laid back presentation.

Which is better? depends on your taste
We will keep both, as the LP12 was a fleamarket bargain at EUR 10, (incl. Valhalla, LVV), but the TT2 will go into the main system again, as the wife and I prefer "laid back" and "detailed" to "prat"

accessories used: Trichord Dino Mk1, VSPS, Yamaha RX-460, Monitor Audio 7

lessons learnt:
- putting the LP12 on a wall shelf is imperative to crisp sound,
- the TT2 cares less for shelfing, but profits nonetheless,
- a VSPS on a breadboard is a very good phonostage, but the Dino definitively has an edge on it, though not x10 as the price suggests

links:
- my thread about "boomy bass" on the official LP12 forum (http://forums.linn.co.uk/bb/showthread.php?tid=17982)
- about me on this forum (http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?26578-Hi-from-Austria-Europe&p=459429#post459429)

some pics from the A-B comparison:
http://i408.photobucket.com/albums/pp164/mimoser67/_MG_6217.jpg (http://s408.photobucket.com/user/mimoser67/media/_MG_6217.jpg.html)
http://i408.photobucket.com/albums/pp164/mimoser67/_MG_6216-1.jpg (http://s408.photobucket.com/user/mimoser67/media/_MG_6216-1.jpg.html)

LP12 fresh from fleamarket:
http://i408.photobucket.com/albums/pp164/mimoser67/_MG_5879.jpg (http://s408.photobucket.com/user/mimoser67/media/_MG_5879.jpg.html)

;-)
Michael

Audiovista
23-11-2013, 18:26
Just purchased a TT2 for the Akito2 that was stuck to it. Sadly that had got a bit crushed and the plastic body was broken and armlift bent. Partially fixed now as it was jammed with broken plastic.

So first thing first was to stick one of my old Akito 1's in its place while inspecting the TT innards.
Thoughts:
Wow - It's got a Keel already!!!
Wow - It's already got a Hercules electronic 33/45 PSU!!!
Wow - The plinth top plate is rock solid and doesn't need to be stressed to the correct tension to avoid ringing or mis-aligned spring mounting bolts.

Someone's thought about this turntable from the ground up and corrected the flaws of the LP12 or TD150.

I feel from a design point of view that Linn have been very successfully doing something likened to polishing Thora Hurd (doo doo). How convenient that you have to be a qualified Linn eggspurt to polish her correctly $$$$. Only now are they ironing out some of those design flaws at incredible cost. Still they haven't fixed the top plate. Someone else has made a stiff CNC aluminium one but maybe Linn will make it their own invention soon.

Congratulations to Shane for ironing out some basic flaws 20 odd years ago ;) :clapclapclap:

Sound:
Not compared it directly to my LP12 but feel it sounds similar but lacking in some bass weight. It defo has loads of insight and detail in the midrange and is very musical.

11059110601106111062

I'm rather enamoured with the Garrard 401 Idler sound and the Direct Drive SP10mk2. Was good to read that Shane was also spinning his own Idler.
Somehow I would like to get more of the Belt Drive mid range transparency and blackness while keeping the steady pitch and slam of the Idler. I think the DD is sitting in between Belt and Idler sonically.

Audiovista
23-11-2013, 19:14
Wow! I just posted without reading this. So funny! My staple HiFi was an Axis/Akito/K18 through a Nait2 & Arcam Two's from 1994 till about 2001 when I got some studio gear.
Now I've resurrected it I'm finding the Nait2/Arcam2 too bright with a modern Adikt or G1042 and the old K18 sounds dull. I thought it was worn but thinking logically it all balanced out perfectly. I guess nowadays stuff has to match the EQ of a red book CD and carts will match that. I remember borrowing a CD player once and the 1st piano note on Division Bell distorted the tweets on my Arcams. Perhaps the Nait2 was not tuned to that gain and frequency curve.


That's why the early LP12's were a good match for the Naims. The Naim amps sounded so ruthless that the Linn's soggy, wooliness was the logical choice to balance this out. These days it's almost the other way round, Naims getting more refined and the Linn having the warmth and 'character' evolved out of it.

Audiovista
23-11-2013, 19:30
Great Stufff!!

Just seen your link to the Linn forum. I'd better not join that or I'll end up in a geek fight ;)
Had a quick read.

My LP12 is a 75/6 ish spot welded girl with a prop up lid and no plinth corner bracing. Plus it had Hercules 2 PSU. Couldn't deal with changing pulleys. That's just Linn being tight!!!

When I realised I could twist the spot welded subchassis by hand I bought a later glued one with the black PEEK bearing. It was a lot stiffer and you cannot really twist bend it. The bass tightened up massively and stopped sounding like a ride in the back of a 1950's American Classic Car.

It had the nimbleness of the Axis with the weight of the LP12 and none of this 1970's, Velour HiFi Stodge.

Essential eBay bargain upgrade!!!!

As for buying a Keel? Yes the TT2 already has one!!! haha

I heard the Keel and it's killer but is a bleetin rip off. I'd rather carve my own with a spoon than pay Linn 2k plus for one!!!

walpurgis
23-11-2013, 19:40
Just finished reading this thread and it's quite amusing ...

Full of the usual stuff about the dark arts of setting up the LP12, get an expert dealer to do it etc etc
And then there's all the 'attitude' you get if you stray from the party line. :doh:

Quite so. I'd better not add my views, I'm bound to piss somebody off. ;)

mimoser
24-11-2013, 09:39
[…]
Sound:
Not compared it directly to my LP12 but feel it sounds similar but lacking in some bass weight. It defo has loads of insight and detail in the midrange and is very musical.
[…]
I'm rather enamoured with the Garrard 401 Idler sound and the Direct Drive SP10mk2. Was good to read that Shane was also spinning his own Idler.
Somehow I would like to get more of the Belt Drive mid range transparency and blackness while keeping the steady pitch and slam of the Idler. I think the DD is sitting in between Belt and Idler sonically.

Using a really rigid arm with a countersunk balance weight improved things on the TT2 as well as the LP12 for me. Without losing the midrange details this cleans up the bass a lot. It did not bring forward the midrange details on the LP12 though- That’s why we kept the TT2 and I sold the LP12 …

present state of the TT2:
http://i408.photobucket.com/albums/pp164/mimoser67/_MG_7988_zps55281ee4.jpg (http://s408.photobucket.com/user/mimoser67/media/_MG_7988_zps55281ee4.jpg.html)
16mm birchply fixed through with two stainless screws, rewired RB250, Michell VTA and fingernut, steel stub, Expressimo heavyweight, Stanton 681eee with Pickering 625e stylus, Tonearm cable by back25beat10.

Heed Orbit2 and Trichord Dino Mk1:
http://i408.photobucket.com/albums/pp164/mimoser67/_MG_7989_zpsf9c60692.jpg (http://s408.photobucket.com/user/mimoser67/media/_MG_7989_zpsf9c60692.jpg.html)

Result: detailed mids, fast and controlled bass, detailed treble (as far up as I stil can hear with 47 :-)); dynamics are absolutely on par to my dynamics refernce, a Yamaha CDP-930 from 1992.

YMMV, but this is it for me at the moment, need nothing "more"
Michael

shane
25-11-2013, 12:10
Congratulations to Shane for ironing out some basic flaws 20 odd years ago ;) :clapclapclap:



Awwwww shucks! :whistle:

The idler's very much a back-of-the-mind project I'm afraid, so Don't hold your breath!

I did have a go at cobbling one up from a couple of bits of slate and an Akai 4000DS motor (story here http://www.world-designs.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=1894 ), and was very much seduced by the drive and slam that came with it, but then I found a really early TT2 on Ebay and had to buy back a bit of my history. It may not have the sheer balls of the idler, but it's musically more complete.