View Full Version : Top ten cars sales 2013
MikeMusic
08-01-2014, 14:30
Surprised me on some
UKs best-sellers in 2013
Ford Fiesta: 121,929
Ford Focus: 87,350
Vauxhall Corsa: 84,275
Vauxhall Astra: 68,070
Volkswagen Golf: 64,951
Nissan Qashqai: 50,211
the next 10 would be interesting
Mark Grant
08-01-2014, 15:00
That's the top 6 ;) which are the next four. :)
MikeMusic
08-01-2014, 15:10
That's the top 6 ;) which are the next four. :)
Duh
They say top ten and show 6 !
I used to be able to count .......
BMW 3 Series 43,494
VW Polo 42,609
BMW 1 Series 41,883
Peugeot 208 38,616
BMWs are getting common.........
It doesn't surprise me that the Fiesta is at the top of the tree, it is good VFM and fun to drive, even in its cheaper incarnations... ;)
BMWs are getting common.........
Indeed, the choice of chavs these days ;)
Marco.
Indeed, the choice of chavs these days ;)
Marco.
:lol:
I am glad I have none of the top 10!
Ali Tait
08-01-2014, 18:11
Me too!
MikeMusic
08-01-2014, 18:23
It doesn't surprise me that the Fiesta is at the top of the tree, it is good VFM and fun to drive, even in its cheaper incarnations... ;)
Could be a good motor.
I would consider a Focus if my Saab gives up
MikeMusic
08-01-2014, 18:24
Indeed, the choice of chavs these days ;)
Marco.
I have a special relationship with BMWs
Keep well out of the way, especially on the bike
MikeMusic
08-01-2014, 18:25
:lol:
I am glad I have none of the top 10!
Focus is a good motor
Focus is a good motor
Yeah but they are as ugly as sin... :lol:
walpurgis
08-01-2014, 18:34
I like vans and old cars! :)
Yeah but they are as ugly as sin... :lol:
Lol - I wouldn't be seen dead driving anything like that!
Marco.
walpurgis
08-01-2014, 18:38
I could buy something fancy and new even, but I just don't need it. :)
Lol - I wouldn't be seen dead driving anything like that!
Marco.
To be honest one of the best and most reliable marques these days is Skoda if one is after a general runabout, especially the Octavia and Yeti which are beautifully built and offer an understated feeling of class behind the wheel. In 4WD diesel form the Yeti is a very capable offroader incidentally ;)
Yeah, I'm sure that Skodas are good cars.
The biggest consideration for me, car wise, is that I hate anything boring and soulless! It doesn't need to be expensive, simply fun to drive, probably stylish, perhaps a little quirky, but most importantly, a bit different from what every other bugger has!!
In that respect, I can relate to Geoff's love of old cars and vans.
Essentially, I must have something that puts a smile on my face (for whatever reason) every time I get behind the wheel. Driving Del's old Morris Minor Traveller used to give me that feeling, as does my Mercedes, but for rather different reasons! :)
Marco.
Ali Tait
08-01-2014, 19:29
Yep, seconded, I love my Alfas for those very reasons. Very reliable too.
Yeah, Alfas have soul :smoking:
As the kids say: "YOLO" - or life's too short to drive boring cars!
Marco.
julesd68
08-01-2014, 19:52
The biggest consideration for me, car wise, is that I hate anything boring and soulless! It doesn't need to be expensive, simply fun to drive, probably stylish, perhaps a little quirky, but most importantly, a bit different from what every other bugger has!!
You'd love my '97 Honda Civic then Marco! :lol:
Funnily enough we're rather attached to it - just done over 100K trouble-free miles and am hoping for plenty more ...
Hehehehe... It's probably part of the family now, Jules!
When I hear the words 'practical and reliable' - I just think boooooorrrrrinnnngggggg..........
Marco.
julesd68
08-01-2014, 20:40
Nothing boring for me about the fact that it stays on the road where it belongs and not getting repaired in the garage!
I'd prefer to spend money I don't have on other things, like er, hi-fi and vinyl ... ;)
Yerse... But you *can* have exciting and reliable! ;)
Marco.
Yerse... But you *can* have exciting and reliable! ;)
Marco.
...and you don't need to spend wads on a luxury car to achieve that aim either thankfully, which is why cars such as the Fiesta should be celebrated as they bring driving satisfaction to the masses ;)
Yes, I guess it's a bit like Bose bringing 'hi-fi satisfaction' to the masses! :eyebrows:
Marco (who will never be part of the masses/herd).
I have a special relationship with BMWs
Keep well out of the way, especially on the bike
It's the other way round in my Pre-Cambrian Nissan. I love BMWs, at the least the new ones, Mercs, basically anything that is expensive & shiny. You can push in front of them and they always back off!
julesd68
08-01-2014, 21:23
...and you don't need to spend wads on a luxury car to achieve that aim either thankfully, which is why cars such as the Fiesta should be celebrated as they bring driving satisfaction to the masses ;)
I have a real soft spot for Fiestas - me and the mrs used to rent them before we got our first car and always really enjoyed them. Not the best quality interior but always fun to drive ...
RobbieGong
08-01-2014, 21:27
...and you don't need to spend wads on a luxury car to achieve that aim either thankfully, which is why cars such as the Fiesta should be celebrated as they bring driving satisfaction to the masses ;)
+1 The Fiesta is a great little car for not daft money. Perfect for people who aint got money to burn but need a good car as a necessity that drives well, carries a small family comfortably, doesn't cost bucket loads of money you haven't got to run or repair. Is it the car we'd have if we didn't have young daughters - For the wife yes, it's fun and practical too, for me, no I'd have something like a Golf R32 or Golf R, metallic black, with all the toys of course :)
+1 The Fiesta is a great little car for not daft money. Perfect for people who aint got money to burn but need a good car as a necessity that drives well, carries a small family comfortably, doesn't cost bucket loads of money you haven't got to run or repair. Is it the car we'd have if we didn't have young daughters - For the wife yes, it's fun and practical too, for me, no I'd have something like a Golf R32 or Golf R, metallic black, with all the toys of course :)
When I met my missus she owned a Mark 1 Focus 1.8 Zetec. Now, I had not driven a Focus up to that point, I owned a 61 plate Renault Grand Scenic 1.5DTi at the time which is quite a fun car to drive for a people carrier, however her Focus was an absolute hoot to drive and I nabbed it whenever I could. Ford have got the handling/practicality/reliability equation figured out IMO :)
MikeMusic
09-01-2014, 09:30
It's the other way round in my Pre-Cambrian Nissan. I love BMWs, at the least the new ones, Mercs, basically anything that is expensive & shiny. You can push in front of them and they always back off!
It was ironically, or not a Merc that took me off on the bike, and a Merc Sprinter van that turned from stationary at some traffic lights, knocked me over and bent the same bike beyond repair
BMWs I keep well clear of
For a bit of fun, let's extrapolate the discussion a little....
I appreciate that being sensible and practical is sometimes unavoidable, but does no-one possess the desire to be an individual anymore, and stand out from the crowd, rather than simply homogenising one’s individuality, in order that it merges with the behaviour of the masses?
No doubt that Ford makes some good cars, but I’d no sooner buy a Ford Focus (or something so resolutely devoid of 'personality') than I would, for example, take all-inclusive package holidays to beach resorts in Tenerife, live in a soulless modern housing estate in some dreadfully bland 'new-town', obsess over the private lives of 'celebrities', buy chart pop music, or own a 'hi-fi system', purchased in a supermarket.
In effect, I’ve always been a 'free-thinker' and hated conforming to the norm, so I go out of my way to shun the mainstream and seek to make different choices in life from those of the masses.
Can anyone else relate to those feelings or am I being a little too 'out there'?
Please note that this is nothing to do with wealth, but simply the desire to be different. In that respect, since we're talking about cars, I'd rather drive about in an old Morris Minor (or some other cool classic car), at a fraction of the price of a new Ford Focus, simply because it's quirky, different, and says something valid about my identity...
Marco.
MikeMusic
09-01-2014, 09:56
I've driven a Focus and was very impressed
What it looks like is of marginal interest, but I thin kit looks ok.
Only came on my radar as so many people rate it as a driver's car
Will I get one ? maybe. 2nd hand though certainly never a new car of any sort.
Looking like lots of other people is a good thing in my book. Stealth technology at it's best :)
What I really can't understand are the plethora of shapeless blobs like Renault Scenic, Citroen Xsara, Ford C-Max and other uninspiring crap. Bad enough to buy such a car second hand, but whenever I see one I think someone actually went to a showroom and bought it brand new!
Audioman
09-01-2014, 10:05
To be honest one of the best and most reliable marques these days is Skoda if one is after a general runabout, especially the Octavia and Yeti which are beautifully built and offer an understated feeling of class behind the wheel. In 4WD diesel form the Yeti is a very capable off roader incidentally ;)
I would agree as they are budget VW with the same engineering under the skin. The equivalent VW do maintain a superior quality of build / finish though. Can't understand the numbers buying bottom end BMW range though. Obviously misguided badge snobbishness. :). Popularity of Qashqai is a bit of a mystery as it is pricey for what you get and most models are not 4WD -only look like one. At least it is UK built.
What I really can't understand are the plethora of shapeless blobs like Renault Scenic, Citroen Xsara, Ford C-Max and other uninspiring crap.
Indeed, but aside from CAD removing the ability of automobile designers to express their creativity (witness how different cars once looked from one another before such (controlling) computer software was invented, especially if one examines the best of car design from the 60s, or some of the amazing 'standout' American cars that existed in the 50s), why do you think those "shapeless blobs" now exist?
It's simply because 'Joe Public' just accepts what they're given! Most folk also lack any sort of desire to stand out from the herd. I’ve never understood that 'conforming to the norm' mentality. The fact is, that sheep-like behaviour has slowly eroded our level of choice.
One of the magazines that I think best sums up the times we live in is 'Which?' It's the perfect doctrine for the brain-dead, and reflects the current maliase in our society, born from a distinct lack of imagination, willingness to think for oneself, or desire to be different.
I wonder just how many people are influenced by what is recommended in 'Which?', and simply buy what they are told is 'best', with cars or whatever? Like I said, what's happened to all the free-thinkers of our world??
Marco.
Yep, a Which? recommendation is a negative mark in my book.
walpurgis
09-01-2014, 11:56
Yes, I guess it's a bit like Bose bringing 'hi-fi satisfaction' to the masses! :eyebrows:
Marco (who will never be part of the masses/herd).
He He, I like that!
A nice ring of cynical truth. :)
walpurgis
09-01-2014, 12:00
Essentially, I must have something that puts a smile on my face (for whatever reason) every time Marco.
That would be a motorcycle. ;)
Works for me. A bike always puts me in a good mood. Cars are just transport.
Lol... I used to think that way, Geoff (and have had many motorbikes in the past). These days, however, I like my creature comforts too much, especially considering the UK weather!
In Italy, for example, my approach to this matter would be rather different.
Marco.
I could never quite grasp the concept that if some sheet metal is bent one way, or if it is bent another way it becomes the difference between "desirable" and "a munter" because at the end of the day that is mostly the difference between a £10,000 car and a £40,000 car in my experience. I have great respect though for the hand built bespoke cars that do have individuality and performance, so I am not bashing every sector of the car industry.
In my mind you can keep "image" because that is a total fallacy and a complete waste of money - as I found out after making the mistake of buying a brand new BMW 7 series a few years back. An arsehole is still an arsehole no matter what car they drive and I particularly loathe the people that feel somehow "superior" because their car has a certain badge on it. I also find it bizarre that people should lust after a car with a top speed capability of 200 mph plus when there is no road in the country where it is safe and legal to do that kind of speed. Couple that with our government doing it's level best to empty our pockets at every opportunity and there is not much fun or pleasure these days in car ownership and that is partly the reason why we have a plethora of boring vanilla cars that are able to sip fuel rather than guzzle it and get the driving juices going.
Don't run a car but have worked in the trade on a couple of occasions. If I was going to get a car I'd probably go for an old Lexus LS400 or similar.
Covenant
09-01-2014, 14:01
I have to change my car soon or lose the company car allowance. As I am feeling poor atm ( daughters university accommodation is £140 a week) I am thinking of getting a second hand fairly cheap car that will be easy to flog in a year or two. Anyone got a Honda Civic (diesel), if so, is it ok?
Beobloke
09-01-2014, 14:46
For a bit of fun, let's extrapolate the discussion a little....
I appreciate that being sensible and practical is sometimes unavoidable, but does no-one possess the desire to be an individual anymore, and stand out from the crowd, rather than simply homogenising one’s individuality, in order that it merges with the behaviour of the masses?
No doubt that Ford makes some good cars, but I’d no sooner buy a Ford Focus (or something so resolutely devoid of 'personality') than I would, for example, take all-inclusive package holidays to beach resorts in Tenerife, live in a soulless modern housing estate in some dreadfully bland 'new-town', obsess over the private lives of 'celebrities', buy chart pop music, or own a 'hi-fi system', purchased in a supermarket.
In effect, I’ve always been a 'free-thinker' and hated conforming to the norm, so I go out of my way to shun the mainstream and seek to make different choices in life from those of the masses.
Can anyone else relate to those feelings or am I being a little too 'out there'?
Please note that this is nothing to do with wealth, but simply the desire to be different. In that respect, since we're talking about cars, I'd rather drive about in an old Morris Minor (or some other cool classic car), at a fraction of the price of a new Ford Focus, simply because it's quirky, different, and says something valid about my identity...
Marco.
AHEM! Speaking as the owner of one for two weeks now, could we stop with the digs at the Ford Focus, please?! :steam:
I've just replaced my beloved Range Rover with a 2005 Focus 2.0 Titanium and I have to say it's very nice. It drives well, is nice and perky, has ridiculously comfortable leather seats with great heating in them and the computery thingy says I'm doing 35mpg.
Yes, I miss my Rangey like crazy but, frankly, 15mpg was becoming a bit wearing and the use of the word "corrosion" in 5 out of the 7 advisories on the last MOT made me decide it was time to part with it whilst the going was good (as an aside, apart from the advisories, it flew through the MOT with no issues!). Yes it was far more characterful and made a fab noise but, on the other hand, even after the recent monsoons we've been experiencing, the Focus's carpets are still nice and dry!
The idea of something like a Morris Traveller may be nice in theory but I can assure you that I much more relish the though of jumping into the Focus at 3:30am on the morning of the 15th May when I head to Gatwick to board a plane to the Munich Show, than jumping into some old relic that doesn't like motorways and I won't have to worry about rust (or woodworm!) as MOT failure points for a good while yet. Cars like the Focus may be dull, but there's a time and place for them.
Finally, in case you're thinking I've turned into a boring old git, all the money I shall be saving on fuel will be going towards saving for a second car which will live in the garage and come out to play at weekends. I'm currently thinking British, two seats, V8 engine, fibreglass bodywork, no traction control and shoddy build quality! :eyebrows:
Gordon Steadman
09-01-2014, 16:02
I hope Ford has improved it lately.
I drove a new Focus just before I came out here seven years ago and found it bland, boring and unsatisfying. I seemed to perch on it rather than sit in it and all the controls seemed connected with rubber bands. The press reckoned it was dynamically outstanding!! Maybe they hadn't tried the old Peugeot 309GTi I was driving at the time or the Alfa Bertone GTVs that were my usual transport in those days.
I thought things had gone backwards but then, maybe after the years have passed, they have had time to fettle it a bit.
Ali Tait
09-01-2014, 16:11
AHEM! Speaking as the owner of one for two weeks now, could we stop with the digs at the Ford Focus, please?! :steam:
I've just replaced my beloved Range Rover with a 2005 Focus 2.0 Titanium and I have to say it's very nice. It drives well, is nice and perky, has ridiculously comfortable leather seats with great heating in them and the computery thingy says I'm doing 35mpg.
Yes, I miss my Rangey like crazy but, frankly, 15mpg was becoming a bit wearing and the use of the word "corrosion" in 5 out of the 7 advisories on the last MOT made me decide it was time to part with it whilst the going was good (as an aside, apart from the advisories, it flew through the MOT with no issues!). Yes it was far more characterful and made a fab noise but, on the other hand, even after the recent monsoons we've been experiencing, the Focus's carpets are still nice and dry!
The idea of something like a Morris Traveller may be nice in theory but I can assure you that I much more relish the though of jumping into the Focus at 3:30am on the morning of the 15th May when I head to Gatwick to board a plane to the Munich Show, than jumping into some old relic that doesn't like motorways and I won't have to worry about rust (or woodworm!) as MOT failure points for a good while yet. Cars like the Focus may be dull, but there's a time and place for them.
Finally, in case you're thinking I've turned into a boring old git, all the money I shall be saving on fuel will be going towards saving for a second car which will live in the garage and come out to play at weekends. I'm currently thinking British, two seats, V8 engine, fibreglass bodywork, no traction control and shoddy build quality! :eyebrows:
Have a look at S Type R Jags. 4.2 V8 supercharged, 400bhp. Good ones can be picked up for relative peanuts now.
Beobloke
09-01-2014, 16:30
Have a look at S Type R Jags. 4.2 V8 supercharged, 400bhp. Good ones can be picked up for relative peanuts now.
Meh.
Too many seats, too heavy, probably not manual and too much traction control/ABS. My chances of stuffing one up a tree the first time I take a corner too fast would be much too low.
No, I was thinking more of one of these:
http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa428/Beobloke/MarcosMantara.jpg (http://s1197.photobucket.com/user/Beobloke/media/MarcosMantara.jpg.html)
because at the end of the day that is mostly the difference between a £10,000 car and a £40,000 car in my experience
One of the key differences I think is when you buy a performance model further up the range. Yes, accepting that I will never use the 155mph+ capability, it means that the suspension is very well sorted, handling is sure-footed, brakes are over-sized for the job and the chassis doesn't flex through bends. The engine will respond very crisply to any throttle demand and everything is precise. Even if you then pootle around in it, the reserves of ability are still there on tap for when you need them. That makes it nicer to drive and safer.
Gordon Steadman
09-01-2014, 17:51
Like I said, what's happened to all the free-thinkers of our world??
Marco.
Elf and safety decided they were dangerous:doh:
Gordon Steadman
09-01-2014, 17:57
One of the key differences I think is when you buy a performance model further up the range. Yes, accepting that I will never use the 155mph+ capability, it means that the suspension is very well sorted, handling is sure-footed, brakes are over-sized for the job and the chassis doesn't flex through bends. The engine will respond very crisply to any throttle demand and everything is precise. Even if you then pootle around in it, the reserves of ability are still there on tap for when you need them. That makes it nicer to drive and safer.
Agreed. However, the space for any enjoyable driving has been eroded. When we were young, there was space enough and fewer cars. Like here in fact where there is still the open road, not that many cars, great views and mostly understanding police - at least around this area. I drive an old Sierra now but its proper rear wheel drive, well sorted - slow admittedly - but still fun when the weather allows.
Ali Tait
09-01-2014, 18:05
Meh.
Too many seats, too heavy, probably not manual and too much traction control/ABS. My chances of stuffing one up a tree the first time I take a corner too fast would be much too low.
No, I was thinking more of one of these:
http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa428/Beobloke/MarcosMantara.jpg (http://s1197.photobucket.com/user/Beobloke/media/MarcosMantara.jpg.html)
Marcos eh? Don't see many of those around. Very nice.
Toyota and Suburu's release of the GT86 and BRZ respectively has got to be applauded, neither car is bonkers fast (137mph top speed) nor will the acceleration tear your face off (0-60 in 7.2 seconds) and they don't cost a packet (a shade under 25k) however these two fabulous machines have been designed from the bottom up to be drivers cars and thus they induce huge cheesy grins on the ugly mugs of anyone who drives them ;)
http://pictures.topspeed.com/IMG/crop/201203/subaru-brz-and-toyot-3_800x0w.jpg
The Grand Wazoo
09-01-2014, 18:59
It's simply because 'Joe Public' just accepts what they're given! Most folk also lack any sort of desire to stand out from the herd. I’ve never understood that 'conforming to the norm' mentality.
It rather depends, does it not, how you wish to define yourself?
If I learnt that anyone had formed an opinion of me (good or bad) as a result of the car I drive, then I would hold them in extreme contempt and let them know what I thought of them!
Cars bore me in extremis, so as they are simply tools to me, as long as they perform their function to my requirements, that's fine.
Here's a thought - because, as in all things, context is rather important.
Some people like to define themselves by their choice of computer, but I bet in that respect, you don't stand out from the herd one little bit!
One of the key differences I think is when you buy a performance model further up the range. Yes, accepting that I will never use the 155mph+ capability, it means that the suspension is very well sorted, handling is sure-footed, brakes are over-sized for the job and the chassis doesn't flex through bends. The engine will respond very crisply to any throttle demand and everything is precise. Even if you then pootle around in it, the reserves of ability are still there on tap for when you need them. That makes it nicer to drive and safer.
An excellent argument for owning a performance car, providing that, if you buy it for those reasons, you can afford to run it - and I don't just mean the cost of filling up the tank (which on its own is considerable)! ;)
One of problems, for the unwary wanting to own a fast car 'on the cheap', and buying something such as Ali has outlined, is focussing too much on the 'peanuts price' it cost and not making sufficient allowances for the money needed to run it, particularly funding the costs of repairs, should anything go wrong...
Unfortunately, the parts for premium branded cars don't come cheap, so my advice would be to make sure you keep plenty of spare cash aside for any 'unforeseen eventualities', and if you can afford it, take out a good warranty plan.
I pay just under £600 a year for my plan with Warrantywise (which covers me for virtually everything), and trust me, in the first year of owning my Merc the policy was well used, sorting out problems, through wear and tear, which didn't initially show up when I first got the car.
Therefore, do bear that in mind when eyeing up what looks like a tempting bargain for a performance car!
Adam - I like it. That should be marginally more entertaining to drive than a Ford Focus! :respect:
Marco.
Gordon Steadman
09-01-2014, 19:36
Cars bore me in extremis, so as they are simply tools to me, as long as they perform their function to my requirements, that's fine.
Fine indeed. However, if I was faced with the choice of say, two electric drills which both did the same boring (ho ho) job, but one was easier to use, did a slightly better job and was, to someone that appreciates good tools, more enjoyable to use, I know which I would choose. It would probably be more expensive though.
I can appreciate not wanted to be judged by which I chose but then again, other tool appreciators might be impressed with my perspicacity in choosing the best tool for the job.
It rather depends, does it not, how you wish to define yourself?
If I learnt that anyone had formed an opinion of me (good or bad) as a result of the car I drive, then I would hold them in extreme contempt and let them know what I thought of them!
Absolutely, Chris - and I'd do the exact same! It's interesting, however, analysing what makes others 'tick', especially when it's reflected in their buying decisions.
Here's a thought - because, as in all things, context is rather important.
Some people like to define themselves by their choice of computer, but I bet in that respect, you don't stand out from the herd one little bit!
Lol - indeed. However, that still didn't stop me from researching (at great length) what type of laptop I wanted and ensuring that I ended up with the one that was best for my needs (at the time, a top of the range Sony Vaio), which has served me well since the inception of AoS, so you can imagine how much use it gets from posting on here! :eek:
In essence, even though I hate computers, I'm still interested in and care about what I buy. Most importantly, however, in terms of this discussion, my choice of computer wasn't dictated by what was considered at the time as 'trendy', nor did I allow my disdain of them in any way to affect my choice...
Had that been the case, I'd have simply bought the first one that came to hand at Maplins! ;)
Marco.
I can appreciate not wanted to be judged by which I chose but then again, other tool appreciators might be impressed with my perspicacity in choosing the best tool for the job.
HAHAHAHAHAAHA... That's *so* unintentionally funny! If I were you, Gordon, I wouldn't go around confessing that you're a 'tool appreciator' :lol: :lol:
Marco.
walpurgis
09-01-2014, 20:04
I'll stick with my elderly Golf estate. I've had it less than a year and done a fair bit of fettling to make it how I like it. It's a '97 the last of the 1.9D non turbo diesels, it's a simple design and I can maintain it myself, it has bags of room, it's comfy and will carry anything I need anywhere at sensible motorway speeds and still return around 60mpg. At 86k miles it's low mileage for its age and it will last donkeys years more (these do 250k no probs) and cost peanuts to run. Image? I couldn't give a toss.
Gordon Steadman
09-01-2014, 20:12
HAHAHAHAHAAHA... That's *so* unintentionally funny! If I were you, Gordon, I wouldn't go around confessing that you're a 'tool appreciator' :lol: :lol:
Marco.
Best not to be too sure about my intentions:eyebrows:
Ali Tait
09-01-2014, 20:24
An excellent argument for owning a performance car, providing that, if you buy it for those reasons, you can afford to run it - and I don't just mean the cost of filling up the tank (which on its own is considerable)! ;)
One of problems, for the unwary wanting to own a fast car 'on the cheap', and buying something such as Ali has outlined, is focussing too much on the 'peanuts price' it cost and not making sufficient allowances for the money needed to run it, particularly funding the costs of repairs, should anything go wrong...
Unfortunately, the parts for premium branded cars don't come cheap, so my advice would be to make sure you keep plenty of spare cash aside for any 'unforeseen eventualities', and if you can afford it, take out a good warranty plan.
I pay just under £600 a year for my plan with Warrantywise (which covers me for virtually everything), and trust me, in the first year of owning my Merc the policy was well used, sorting out problems, through wear and tear, which didn't initially show up when I first got the car.
Therefore, do bear that in mind when eyeing up what looks like a tempting bargain for a performance car!
Adam - I like it. That should be marginally more entertaining to drive than a Ford Focus! :respect:
Marco.
Well, I'm running two V6 Alfas, not the most economical!
Been very reliable though, especially considering one is 20 years old, the other 13.
My wife seems to be more interested in the colour than the make. I am starting to see the merit in that.
That said, I bought her a big car as she keeps on taking chunks out by impacting inanimate objects. Once took the roof off in a car park, and it wasn't a convertible. Took a big lump out of her CRV a few days ago in a petrol station, she said she was tired and it wasn't her fault. Apparently a large steel bollard moved.
My wife also crashes computers, but I love her to bits (bad pun, sigh ...)
Personal history is Metro, Fiesta, faster Fiesta, Golf, Beetle (poncy Golf), Lexus GS (stupidly expensive all around but got kids to school with sports kit), Golf 1.6D BlueMotion (love it like my other Golfs, saves the planet, £20 road tax, kids now go to school on the bus).
Well, I'm running two V6 Alfas, not the most economical!
Been very reliable though, especially considering one is 20 years old, the other 13.
Lovely engines those Alfa V6's and they sound bloody good too ;)
One of the key differences I think is when you buy a performance model further up the range. Yes, accepting that I will never use the 155mph+ capability, it means that the suspension is very well sorted, handling is sure-footed, brakes are over-sized for the job and the chassis doesn't flex through bends. The engine will respond very crisply to any throttle demand and everything is precise. Even if you then pootle around in it, the reserves of ability are still there on tap for when you need them. That makes it nicer to drive and safer.
I have no issues at all if folks own and enjoy the cars they drive Martin, but my quip about sheet metal being folded in different ways that creates "desirability" still holds true IMO. I also know that cars costing up to £40k have as many weaknesses as the the ones the mainstream manufacturers produce, they are just different sets of weaknesses.
I used to buy brand new high performance cars at one time and that last BMW taught me a painful lesson I have never forgotten. The car I have now is a Honda CR-V which is a simple reliable car that can tow a caravan with ease even on a muddy field, whereas the glam cars of yesteryear would be fooked attempting the same task :lol:
Meh.
Too many seats, too heavy, probably not manual and too much traction control/ABS. My chances of stuffing one up a tree the first time I take a corner too fast would be much too low.
No, I was thinking more of one of these:
http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa428/Beobloke/MarcosMantara.jpg (http://s1197.photobucket.com/user/Beobloke/media/MarcosMantara.jpg.html)
My late father knew Mr Marcos; at one time employing him as a design consultant. Nice cars - but not the last word in reliability. If I had the money I would buy a TVR - but then they aren't particularly reliable either.
So, it would have to be a Jaguar, either the XKR or the XK8. :)
The Grand Wazoo
09-01-2014, 20:46
Fine indeed. However, if I was faced with the choice of say, two electric drills which both did the same boring (ho ho) job, but one was easier to use, did a slightly better job and was, to someone that appreciates good tools, more enjoyable to use, I know which I would choose. It would probably be more expensive though.
I can appreciate not wanted to be judged by which I chose but then again, other tool appreciators might be impressed with my perspicacity in choosing the best tool for the job.
You misunderstand me slightly Gordon.
I said, as long as they perform their function to my requirements, that's fine. If one of the criteria that you have in a drill is for it to give you pride in the ownership of a nice object, then the better one will be performing it's function to your requirements.
This is the exact same thing as Marco selecting the best laptop for his requirements. And by the same token, I don't suppose the owner of a Ford Focus breezes into the car dealership and buys the first thing that comes to hand.
In the interests of full disclosure, I own a Focus C-Max!
However, I was of exactly the same opinion when I used to drive exceptionally expensive 4x4's - they were the most appropriate tool for the job in hand. A car dealer once made the mistake of judging me by the car I drove - he actually did it twice in the space of ten minutes, first when I pulled up in a brand new unmarked Fiesta hire car and secondly, when I told him that I actually owned a 3.2 litre, 5 door Isuzu Trooper. Before I left, I told him what I thought of him and now I admit that I do slightly regret bringing his mother into it.
You misunderstand me slightly Gordon.
I said, as long as they perform their function to my requirements, that's fine. If one of the criteria that you have in a drill is for it to give you pride in the ownership of a nice object, then the better one will be performing it's function to your requirements.
This is the exact same thing as Marco selecting the best laptop for his requirements. And by the same token, I don't suppose the owner of a Ford Focus breezes into the car dealership and buys the first thing that comes to hand.
In the interests of full disclosure, I own a Focus C-Max!
However, I was of exactly the same opinion when I used to drive exceptionally expensive 4x4's - they were the most appropriate tool for the job in hand. A car dealer once made the mistake of judging me by the car I drove - he actually did it twice in the space of ten minutes, first when I pulled up in a brand new unmarked Fiesta hire car and secondly, when I told him that I actually owned a 3.2 litre, 5 door Isuzu Trooper. Before I left, I told him what I thought of him and now I admit that I do slightly regret bringing his mother into it.
On the subject of appearances and power drills, years ago I went to Homebase Edgware Road to buy a power drill and some paint in my best decorating overalls and then went to the Volkswagen dealership over the road, having recently given up a company car. The first salesman escorted me off the premises. Not to be put off, I tried again and took pleasure in his pain as I wrote out a cheque to another salesman for my first Golf an hour later.
I taught myself a lesson about never judging a potential customer by appearances.
Ali Tait
09-01-2014, 21:21
Lovely engines those Alfa V6's and they sound bloody good too ;)
Aye, a great soundtrack. I often turn the radio off just to listen to the engine.
Well, I'm running two V6 Alfas, not the most economical!
Indeed, so you can see my point.
Been very reliable though, especially considering one is 20 years old, the other 13.
You've been lucky then, as Alfas are not particularly known for their reliability! I do love them, though.
The initial 'teething troubles' I had with the Merc were all fairly minor (although cumulatively added up, in terms of cost), and were simply to do with wear and tear catching up in some areas.
However, the car's going like a bomb now and I expect it to last me a long time :cool:
Marco.
Ali Tait
09-01-2014, 21:53
The people that say that don't know Alfas. They're just repeating old prejudices without any personal knowledge. I've had Fords, BMW's, Peugeots, and VW's. The Alfas have been by far the most reliable.
There is a chap on one of the Alfa forums I frequent who has been driving Alfas on a daily basis since the early eighties, and has not once been stuck at the side of the road because of a breakdown.
I own a Focus C-Max!
Oops! :rolleyes:
On the subject of appearances and power drills, years ago I went to Homebase Edgware Road to buy a power drill and some paint in my best decorating overalls and then went to the Volkswagen dealership over the road, having recently given up a company car. The first salesman escorted me off the premises. Not to be put off, I tried again and took pleasure in his pain as I wrote out a cheque to another salesman for my first Golf an hour later.
I taught myself a lesson about never judging a potential customer by appearances.
We like to kid ourselves that we are not judged by the clothes we wear, our watch, our car, how we speak and so forth. Of course we are and the trick is to manipulate that to best advantage. I spent a long time living in rough areas, soon found out that if I dressed like a chav I did not get hassled. A habit I keep up to this day, after all, you don't see Pirhanas eating each other, and people move aside for you as you walk along :)
Going to the bank in a £1000 tailored suit - hello Mr McCall what can we do for you today? ' Go in my chav kit, no respect shown whatsoever. Makes me laugh.
This is the exact same thing as Marco selecting the best laptop for his requirements.
The thing about me is that I care about everything I own, whether I'm passionate about using it or not. Therefore, every major buying decision I make is very carefully considered, and all products chosen are tailored to strictly meet specific requirements.
Most importantly, within that selection process I will always seek to own items different from those sought by the masses, as I enjoy expressing my individuality and detest being one of the sheep...
Marco.
.
Most importantly, within that selection process I will always seek to own items different from those sought by the masses, as I enjoy expressing my individuality and detest being one of the sheep...
Marco.
Financial considerations aside I just buy what I want or need. I couldn't care less if ten million people have one or nobody has one. I don't see personal possessions as an extension of myself, they are just stuff that does a job.
We like to kid ourselves that we are not judged by the clothes we wear, our watch, our car, how we speak and so forth. Of course we are and the trick is to manipulate that to best advantage. I spent a long time living in rough areas, soon found out that if I dressed like a chav I did not get hassled. A habit I keep up to this day, after all, you don't see Pirhanas eating each other, and people move aside for you as you walk along :)
Going to the bank in a £1000 tailored suit - hello Mr McCall what can we do for you today? ' Go in my chav kit, no respect shown whatsoever. Makes me laugh.
I used to drive round London on a Honda 80 bike. One rainy day I went to Bank Paribas headquarters to meet the Managing Director about a rather large loan (to buy a shopping centre). Turned up in full wetsuit and helmet. Very posh receptionist in pearls told me to go round to the side entrance for deliveries. By some miracle the MD I was due to meet came down the stairs, whipped off my helmet, warm handshake etc. ... I can still see her face cracking, over 20 years later.
Financial considerations aside I just buy what I want or need. I couldn't care less if ten million people have one or nobody has one. I don't see personal possessions as an extension of myself, they are just stuff that does a job.
In that respect then we are different. One of the reasons why, for example, I own the type of hi-fi system I do is because all the main components are in some way bespoke - and therefore unique.
Aside from the fact that it sounds superb, I get a lot of pleasure out of owning equipment that is totally divorced from the mainstream :)
Marco.
RobbieGong
09-01-2014, 22:27
Financial considerations aside I just buy what I want or need. I couldn't care less if ten million people have one or nobody has one. I don't see personal possessions as an extension of myself, they are just stuff that does a job.
I hear ya Macca. I once was passionate about cars, that was when it was just me myself and I to treat and indulge, past that now due to natural progression of life and other more important priorities ie: family, home etc. I need a car that fits the bill in the main respects (reliability, practicality, comfort, affordabilty etc AND looks quite nice) end of. I'm passionate and can be 'anal' for want of a better word about other things, music and hifi, family, my home and quality of life for my wife and girls, close friendships and relationships etc - These things may keep me up at night. Cars NO ! Not anymore. ;)
In that respect then we are different. One of the reasons why, for example, I own the type of hi-fi system I do is because all the main components are in some way bespoke - and therefore unique.
Aside from the fact that it sounds superb, I get a lot of pleasure out owning equipment that is totally divorced from the mainstream :)
Marco.
I get that, but if it sounded shit you wouldn't have it to begin with. My point is it is all ephemeral, just worldly goods. it doesn't make us better or superior. It is just a bit of fun and indulgence. Nothing wrong with that, but it doesn't change who we are one iota. For instance in business 'front' counts for a lot so you put up a good front but that is all it is. Give the impression you are successful people will accept it and that opens a lot of doors. Look and act like a loser and that is how they will treat you. It may rankle, it may be shallow, so what? It is how the world is and that will never change. The trick is not let yourself get swallowed up in the dream - just use it, work with it and laugh at it quietly and to yourself.
I used to drive round London on a Honda 80 bike. One rainy day I went to Bank Paribas headquarters to meet the Managing Director about a rather large loan (to buy a shopping centre). Turned up in full wetsuit and helmet. Very posh receptionist in pearls told me to go round to the side entrance for deliveries. By some miracle the MD I was due to meet came down the stairs, whipped off my helmet, warm handshake etc. ... I can still see her face cracking, over 20 years later.
That's brilliant. You have to wonder how much that rocked her world :)
I get that, but if it sounded shit you wouldn't have it to begin with. My point is it is all ephemeral, just worldly goods. it doesn't make us better or superior. It is just a bit of fun and indulgence. Nothing wrong with that, but it doesn't change who we are one iota. For instance in business 'front' counts for a lot so you put up a good front but that is all it is. Give the impression you are successful people will accept it and that opens a lot of doors. Look and act like a loser and that is how they will treat you. It may rankle, it may be shallow, so what? It is how the world is and that will never change. The trick is not let yourself get swallowed up in the dream - just use it, work with it and laugh at it quietly and to yourself.
Sure - I agree with all of that.
Incidentally, you're doing a sterling job 'away from home', as it were... ;)
The level of wishful thinking/delusion and sheer bullshit I've been reading there lately is beyond comical!! :mental:
Marco.
The Grand Wazoo
09-01-2014, 22:52
Oi you, you're banned!
Beobloke
10-01-2014, 16:08
I couldn't care less if ten million people have one or nobody has one. I don't see personal possessions as an extension of myself, they are just stuff that does a job.
Very true. One big problem with deliberately attempting to differentiate yourself from the masses is that, just occasionally, the reason something is popular is that it's best for the job, whatever that job may be!
RobbieGong
10-01-2014, 18:11
Very true. One big problem with deliberately attempting to differentiate yourself from the masses is that, just occasionally, the reason something is popular is that it's best for the job, whatever that job may be!
Word !! :thumbsup:
Ali Tait
10-01-2014, 18:12
Financial considerations aside I just buy what I want or need. I couldn't care less if ten million people have one or nobody has one. I don't see personal possessions as an extension of myself, they are just stuff that does a job.
Spot on. I don't drive Alfas because of the badge, I drive them because I love them, and have yet to drive a more modern car that will better the 166. But that's just me.
MikeMusic
11-01-2014, 12:19
Very true. One big problem with deliberately attempting to differentiate yourself from the masses is that, just occasionally, the reason something is popular is that it's best for the job, whatever that job may be!
Could well be a definition of a Focus !
:)
I remember when Top Gear tested the very first model and were knocked out how good it was.
Gordon Steadman
11-01-2014, 12:29
Whilst its hard to argue with all the comments about practicality, fit for purpose etc, I reckon that if you can have all that AND find the thing you are using (can't say 'tool' or Marco will have a field day) enjoyable, then I would seek out the stuff that gives that extra spark to life. If everything was just competent, efficient and a bit dull - like the Focus - then life would be too.
If I had the choice I would still drive old Alfas because they make getting from A to B more fun, even if its just going down to the shops.
Cars are a sore point at the mo. Our old Sierra failed its CT (French MOT) for the final time yesterday on emissions and it means it has to be scrapped. Running beautifully but its old technology see, so it has to go dammit.
Spot on. I don't drive Alfas because of the badge, I drive them because I love them, and have yet to drive a more modern car that will better the 166. But that's just me.
It's the same for me with BMWs. I'm on my fourth one, and it's nothing to do with badge and everything to do with the way they're built, the excellent engines and how they handle.
Our old Sierra failed its CT (French MOT) for the final time yesterday on emissions and it means it has to be scrapped. Running beautifully but its old technology see, so it has to go dammit.
Gosh, how do all the ancient Renaults and Citroens you see in French villages pass theirs, then?
Is there a maximum number of times you can submit a car for testing?
It's the same for me with BMWs. I'm on my fourth one, and it's nothing to do with badge and everything to do with the way they're built, the excellent engines and how they handle.
I bought the Merc for very similar reasons (most certainly the badge had nothing to do with it, as folk here should know by now where I stand in relation to badges).
However, in order to make it a bit more interesting and unique as an estate car, fulfilling my sensibilities in that respect, it had to be fast and come fitted with lots of toys, such as 18" AMG alloys...
What I'd really like, though, is something like an Aston Martin DB5, E-type Jag or a 1967 Alfa Romeo Spider! I will definitely be realising that ambition before I pop my clogs ;)
Marco.
Gordon Steadman
11-01-2014, 13:47
Gosh, how do all the ancient Renaults and Citroens you see in French villages pass theirs, then?
Is there a maximum number of times you can submit a car for testing?
Now that is a question we have been asking ourselves as the old bangers, chucking out noxious fumes chug by!!
You can try as often as you like during the two months you are given to fix the problem. Provided there is nothing dangerously wrong, you can continue using the car, which is a good system. The test is every two years.
The new Alfa Spider, designed in Italy, built in Japan in conjunction with Mazda on the new MX5 platform...
http://www.motorward.com/wp-content/images/2013/07/Alfa_Romeo-8C_Spider.jpg
...although they should have gone with this IMO.
http://www.motorward.com/wp-content/images/2013/07/Alfa-Duettotanta.jpg
The top one looks like a ten-a-penny boring Mazda, while the bottom one looks more like an Alfa!! It's still not a patch on the vintage ones, though, as you can clearly see the controlling/homogenising effect of CAD! ;)
Marco.
Ali Tait
11-01-2014, 16:43
Sounds pretty good for a 1.7l-
http://www.worldcarfans.com/113122767982/alfa-romeo-4c-plays-its-raspy-soundtrack-on-video
RobbieGong
11-01-2014, 16:51
The new Alfa Spider, designed in Italy, built in Japan in conjunction with Mazda on the new MX5 platform...
http://www.motorward.com/wp-content/images/2013/07/Alfa_Romeo-8C_Spider.jpg
...although they should have gone with this IMO.
http://www.motorward.com/wp-content/images/2013/07/Alfa-Duettotanta.jpg
Yeah, The bottom one is lovely. The top one looks like a Corvette scaled down to fit the MX5 platform :scratch:
The top one looks like a ten-a-penny boring Mazda, while the bottom one looks more like an Alfa!! It's still not a patch on the vintage ones, though, as you can clearly see the controlling/homogenising effect of CAD! ;)
Marco.
Unfortunately Marco the shape is determined by aerodynamics which in turn benefit fuel economy and performance, aspects that any self-respecting car manufacturer can't afford to ignore these days. When cars such as the original Spider were designed folks didn't give two hoots about economy because fuel was cheap and plentiful. I am sure Alfa and co would have given their right arms for the computing power which lends itself to designing cars with very low drag co-efficients just to eek out those last drops of performance. T'is still a thing of eye-popping beauty though ;)
The bottom one is gorgeous.
Don't be too quick to dismiss the MX-5 without driving one. It's a superb driver's car, guaranteed to put a smile on your face with the top down in summer. It corners on rails, too.
Sure, Dave, but when you drive a car like that, and you give two hoots about fuel economy, you're obviously the wrong type or you can't really afford it...! ;)
When (not if) I get a Spider, it'll be vintage one, and that'll be almost entirely because of its looks and the fact that it has more 'soul' than anything that's been designed with a computer. Ecomomy or practicality, muchacho, simply won't come into it.
Marco.
The bottom one is gorgeous.
Don't be too quick to dismiss the MX-5 without driving one. It's a superb driver's car, guaranteed to put a smile on your face with the top down in summer. It corners on rails, too.
Having driven a MK1 MX5 I can concur, a car with real character and also it was a lot of fun to drive. It certainly put a big grin on my face :)
Sure, Dave, but when you drive a car like that, and you give two hoots about fuel economy, you're obviously the wrong type or you can't really afford it...! ;)
When (not if) I get a Spider, it'll be vintage one, and that'll be almost entirely because of its looks and the fact that it has more 'soul' than anything that's been designed with a computer. Ecomomy or practicality, muchacho, simply won't come into it.
Marco.
I agree, the original Spider is a gorgeous car Marco however for those looking for a new sports car with soul and character and who also need the peace of mind of a warranty then cars such as these are just the ticket ;)
I can't disagree, dude. However, when it's my time for one, such things won't be a consideration. All that will matter is romance!
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/199/gbxr.jpg
Oh yes... :exactly:
Much softer, sleeker lines, and less 'butch' looking than its modern counterpart. That's my main criticism with the aesthetics of modern sports cars: they all tend to 'growl' at you. I prefer something subtler and less 'hard' looking, if you see what I mean? :)
Marco.
And Simon & Garfunkel on cassette, playing "Mrs Robinson" I hope. :)
(I bought a MK1 MX5 (an import Eunos, actually, with a few extra performance parts) for the previous girlfriend, and it was indeed a great drivers car.)
(And I've had the use of 3 company Focuses (Foci?) in the past, and they were all really good cars, but no real character.)
Gordon Steadman
11-01-2014, 19:08
they were all really good cars, but no real character.)
I believe there are some who don't understand how a car can have 'character' or why it would be desirable. I can't help feeling their lives may be lacking a little real excitement. perhaps they find it elsewhere, sherry, cards, skittles maybe.
Still, mustn't mock the afflicted - must we?
I believe there are some who don't understand how a car can have 'character' or why it would be desirable.
Hehehehe... Perhaps those who buy a car solely on its technical spec, much like the 'hi-fi measurists'?
Don't get me started on that! :eek:
I suspect that they would find a car, such as a Ford Focus, 'adequate'. For me, just like my hi-fi system, the car I drive must have FEEL GOOD FACTOR.
And that feeling, baby, has gotta be beautiful....
Marco.
I dread to think how much whingieng and griping there will be on threads such as this once legislation is passed stipulating that all new cars must either be hybrids or fully electrically powered, and trust me this will happen sometime in the near future... :lol:
Does anyone remember the general hubbub and gnashing of teeth when diesel engines began appearing in cars? Dirty, noisy, horrible things and about as desirable as a dead rat in your soup. These days some of the best engines are diesels which can be found in everything from small hatchbacks to performance cars, and some incarnations are even difficult to identify from their petrol brethren at idle. I have a particular soft spot for BMW's straight six diesel which sounds fabulously sporty under acceleration with hardly a hint of clatter when idling ;)
walpurgis
11-01-2014, 19:36
I always wanted one of these:
http://i43.tinypic.com/20kvpev.jpg
Alfa Sprint. I've driven one and loved it. I had an Alfa 33 1.5 and loved that too, it went like the clappers and sounded amazing. Don't know why I didn't get the Sprint, they were cheap enough back then, but instead I went through a phase of buying Opel Manta GTEs (great car).
walpurgis
11-01-2014, 19:45
Does anyone remember the general hubbub and gnashing of teeth when diesel engines began appearing in cars?
First diesel car I remember is the Morris Oxford/Austin Cambridge (Farina) versions with a BL diesel taxi engine from the sixties.
Gordon Steadman
11-01-2014, 19:46
I always wanted one of these:
http://i43.tinypic.com/20kvpev.jpg
Alfa Sprint. I've driven one and loved it. I had an Alfa 33 1.5 and loved that too, it went like the clappers and sounded amazing. Don't know why I didn't get the Sprint, they were cheap enough back then, but instead I went through a phase of buying Opel Manta GTEs (great car).
Lovely things. Sud and GTVs were my favourites. I started getting Alfas after a Triumph GT6. Now that was 'characterful':lol:... actually more like character building:eek:
I dread to think how much whingieng and griping there will be on threads such as this once legislation is passed stipulating that all new cars must either be hybrids or fully electrically powered, and trust me this will happen sometime in the near future... :lol:
That law won't affect the purchase of vintage/second-hand cars, will it? Anyway, only daftees buy brand new cars!
Marco.
I always wanted one of these:
http://i43.tinypic.com/20kvpev.jpg
Alfa Sprint. I've driven one and loved it. I had an Alfa 33 1.5 and loved that too, it went like the clappers and sounded amazing. Don't know why I didn't get the Sprint, they were cheap enough back then, but instead I went through a phase of buying Opel Manta GTEs (great car).
Nice!!! :smoking:
Marco.
RobbieGong
11-01-2014, 19:53
Lovely things. Sud and GTVs were my favourites. I started getting Alfas after a Triumph GT6. Now that was 'characterful':lol:... actually more like character building:eek:
Now you are taking me back, loved both of those but wasnt quite old enough. Ended up owning three Astra GTE's, two of which were immaculate 16 valvers, now they were mad fast hot hatches in the late 80's and early nineties. The things I did in those, I'm lucky to be alive - seriously :eek:
That law won't affect the purchase of vintage cars, will it?
Marco.
Not for a while I would think but at some point there is likely to be a high price to pay for the privilege of ownership. Time and progress marches on apace. The main thing holding back proliferation of electric vehicles is the lack of infrastructure to charge them. Tesla have proved with their model 'S' that the concept is feasible. A fifteen minute quick charge adds nearly 200 miles to the range of the vehicle, which is not a lot longer than your average punter spends in a petrol station filling up their motor with fossil fuel...
http://autoweek.com/storyimage/CW/20130513/CARNEWS/130519937/AR/0/2013-Tesla-Model-S_1.jpg&maxW=630
walpurgis
11-01-2014, 20:05
Have you noticed, nobody seems to mention Hydrogen Cell propulsion these days? That was supposed to be 'The Next Great Thing'.
Not for a while I would think but at some point there is likely to be a high price to pay for the privilege of ownership.
That's cool. I'll probably be pushing up daisies by then (and before that stage I'll be retired and rolling in it)! :eyebrows:
Marco.
walpurgis
11-01-2014, 20:07
That's cool. I'll probably be pushing up daisies by then (and before that stage I'll be retired and rolling in it)! :eyebrows:
Marco.
Well I'm retired, but it's my dog that keeps "rolling in it". Mucky lad he is. :eyebrows:
That's cool. I'll probably be pushing up daisies by then (and before that stage I'll be retired and rolling in it)! :eyebrows:
Marco.
I hear ya. I love classic and vintage cars as well and it will be a sad day when legislation forces them off our roads but we need to be realistic here, one day it will become uneconomic to extract what little oil is left. There are new battery technologies within a cats whisker from being market ready which will revolutionize the electric vehicle. Some of these can be fully charged in minutes and yet provide range matching that of the most fuel efficient internal combustion powered vehicles. You get instant max torque from standstill and fewer moving parts means reliability is much improved too, what's not to like? ;)
No soul, baby!
Hey, just think, with all you boring fannies driving about in your plastic electric cars, I'll *REALLY* stand out from the crowd in my vintage Alfa!! :D
:hotrod:
;)
Marco.
Had three of these one after the other best cars ever conceived imho finally had to give them up because my baby daughter threw up constantly in the back, Rally suspension churned her up:vomfest:
Paul
http://i1308.photobucket.com/albums/s612/loonieboo1/images_zps1bc71d3c.jpg (http://s1308.photobucket.com/user/loonieboo1/media/images_zps1bc71d3c.jpg.html)
No soul, baby!
Hey, just think, with all you boring fannies driving about in your plastic electric cars, I'll *REALLY* stand out from the crowd in my vintage Alfa!! :D
:hotrod:
;)
Marco.
Hehe :)
Ali Tait
11-01-2014, 20:41
Had three of these one after the other best cars ever conceived imho finally had to give them up because my baby daughter threw up constantly in the back, Rally suspension churned her up:vomfest:
Paul
http://i1308.photobucket.com/albums/s612/loonieboo1/images_zps1bc71d3c.jpg (http://s1308.photobucket.com/user/loonieboo1/media/images_zps1bc71d3c.jpg.html)
Very nice indeed. Agreed, one of the best.
Oh yes - those babies are pant-wettingly wonderful!!! :stalks: :stalks:
:drool: :drool: :drool:
Cool as fuck!
Marco.
Tesla have proved with their model 'S' that the concept is feasible.
I'd love one - but the cost is ridiculous - £50k for the base model before you start adding any options - (which is £11k more than you pay in the US) - still a lot cheaper than the BMW i8 though - but I bet that is a car with character
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-TBVR3WxTSEI/UjITj9SS4iI/AAAAAAAOKdQ/y9IkFy3ON04/s1600/2014-BMW-i8-.jpg
- like any new technology the cost will come down I guess, but as you said Dave, we need the charging infrastructure too.
anthonyTD
11-01-2014, 21:11
I have a passion for old cars, i have owned a few, and worked on plenty, its mainly the styling and history behind them, also the feeling you get driving something that is truly unique amongst the usual jelly mold, soul-less stuff that fills our roads today.However, i agree that we have to move on' and welcome with open arms new technologies within the transport industries that will eventually ween us off our dependency for fossil fuels, it will happen, and yes, we have had the alternative technologies for many years now...
Meanwhile'Here are a few of my pre-owned.
1133611337
As Porsches go I always preferred the 928 looks wise over the 911. Best rear end of any car IMO:
http://i903.photobucket.com/albums/ac233/Macca_photos_2009/928.jpg (http://s903.photobucket.com/user/Macca_photos_2009/media/928.jpg.html)
anthonyTD
11-01-2014, 21:29
The 928 was a great car, and good to drive too, but Not my cup of tea.I agree though, it did have a great rear end...
As Porsches go I always preferred the 928 looks wise over the 911. Best rear end of any car IMO:
http://i903.photobucket.com/albums/ac233/Macca_photos_2009/928.jpg (http://s903.photobucket.com/user/Macca_photos_2009/media/928.jpg.html)
Soz, dude, it's the 911 every time for me. That thing's way too bulky and looks more like an old Scimitar!
As the Big Man would say: "it's got a hun-end like a pregnant whoor!" :D
Mrco.
anthonyTD
11-01-2014, 21:35
Speaking of great rear ends, here is another of my pre-owned, notice no rear spoiler...11339
And what was wrong with the scimitar? Good looks and they didn' t rust up either.
Ali Tait
11-01-2014, 21:50
Aye, great cars. My mate's dad had one.
And what was wrong with the scimitar? Good looks and they didn' t rust up either.
I liked the Scimitar - I just wouldn't want my Porsche to look like one! ;)
Marco.
The 928 looks nothing like scimitar. Well maybe to a blind man ;)
Lol - well, we'll just have to 'agree to disagree' :eyebrows:
Aside from that, the back-end is too bulbous for me (hehehehe...can you hear 'fat-bottomed girls' playing?) I prefer something more streamlined!
Marco.
As Porsches go I always preferred the 928 looks wise over the 911. Best rear end of any car IMO:
http://i903.photobucket.com/albums/ac233/Macca_photos_2009/928.jpg (http://s903.photobucket.com/user/Macca_photos_2009/media/928.jpg.html)
I much prefer the rear end of the latter versions of the 928, the wider light clusters give it a more elegant bum IMO ;)
http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/autoreview/400x266/1990-95-Porsche-928-93605041990025.jpg
Yes, I much prefer that! More elegant, less bulbous (like an alcoholic's 'boozy' nose)... :eyebrows:
Marco.
The Grand Wazoo
11-01-2014, 23:45
The last thing this country needs is for every car on the road to be electric powered - we're going to run out of that sort of power too soon as it is. Where's it going to come from? Wind turbines? French owned, Chinese financed nuclear power stations?
I think not.
The last thing this country needs is for every car on the road to be electric powered - we're going to run out of that sort of power too soon as it is. Where's it going to come from? Wind turbines? French owned, Chinese financed nuclear power stations?
I think not.
We'll have to invest in petrol generators to charge our cars up :eyebrows:
walpurgis
12-01-2014, 00:10
Where's it going to come from?
Coal! We've still got mountains of it (figuratively). Enough to distill/refine fuel from for vehicles for a hundred years or more, let alone keep power stations going. We have better technology now and the redundant coal mines could be got going again (with major expense) and new harder to access fields opened.
The Grand Wazoo
12-01-2014, 00:17
I agree, but we both just know that ain't gonna happen Geoff!
The last thing this country needs is for every car on the road to be electric powered - we're going to run out of that sort of power too soon as it is. Where's it going to come from? Wind turbines? French owned, Chinese financed nuclear power stations?
I think not.
That is exactly where it will come from Chris, they are planning to build more nuclear power stations because we need a fall back position for when the oil runs out. Coal will see a resurgence for a short while as they dig the last of it out of the mines which are still accessible, however fissionable nuclear energy is the future whether we like it or not, or at least it will be until the French get to grips with fusion, which is what ITER is all about...
http://www.iter.org/
http://lenergeek.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/Maquette-ITER.jpg
The Grand Wazoo
12-01-2014, 00:40
Yes, I'm well aware of the impending energy crisis Dave (I worked for 3 years as resident independent consultant on the biomass project for the largest coal fired power station in Europe) but what the Govt. thinks it has planned ain't gonna cover it, I'm afraid.
anthonyTD
12-01-2014, 12:12
The next generation of electric cars will not use conventional battery power as we know it, ultra low leakage, high voltage capacitor technology is the future for electric cars, and they can be charged in minutes' rather than hours for conventional old technology batteries, they will have hundreds of miles reserve capacity, not the piddly 25, to 100 miles you get from the crap that's being sold at the moment...
But i agree, the power still has to come from somewhere,and i feel the next few years will be very interesting on that front ;)
Anthony,TD...
walpurgis
12-01-2014, 12:40
I agree, but we both just know that ain't gonna happen Geoff!
I reckon it'll have to one day. It's too valuable a resource to be ignored. I expect renewable energy will run alongside though.
Ali Tait
12-01-2014, 12:50
More money needs to be thrown at fusion. Only long term viable solution IMHO.
anthonyTD
12-01-2014, 13:04
I also agree about coal, there are hundreds of years of reserves left here in wales alone, but, unless we can clean up the pollution significantly, and find easier ways of mining it, i fear we will never go back there, which on one hand is a real shame as we could have been self sufficient as far as energy is concerned in the uk for many many years to come, instead of relying on cheap imported stuff from china and elsewhere.:(
A...
Nuclear always was the best solution for us, but Fukushima set the industry back ten years.
As for cars, current Li-Po technology isn't going to do it. Perhaps Anthony is right about capacitors? Meanwhile, some hybrid cars seem to be going the right way, although I can't understand why there aren't more diesel hybrids rather than petrol hybrids.
anthonyTD
12-01-2014, 13:36
Another interesting product is the Bloom box, [look it up] although it still needs a supply of some form of fuel, the way it converts that fuel into energy is the key.
Don't be surprised if the big companies jump on this idea in the near future.
A...
walpurgis
12-01-2014, 19:56
Anyway, here's something to cheer you all up:
http://i44.tinypic.com/125g80h.jpg
The original Maserati Ghibli SS, circa 1970. One of the most beautiful cars ever made. It was the fastest car you could buy back then, even quicker than the Ferrari Super America.
Love it - oozes character... Would've been nice to have seen the interior :)
Marco.
Ali Tait
12-01-2014, 20:17
Lovely.
walpurgis
12-01-2014, 20:37
As you guys like the Maserati, here's a shot of the interior and one from the rear/above:
http://i40.tinypic.com/2prfom0.jpg
http://i43.tinypic.com/2enow0w.jpg
Isn't that just gorgeous?
Oh dear, I've just had a wee accident in my knickers......
Marco.
anthonyTD
12-01-2014, 21:59
Yep, a cracker of a car! :)
A...
An arsehole is still an arsehole no matter what car they drive
"Don't try to impress me with your manner of dress
For a monkey in silk is a monkey no less." - Rodriguez in my favourite Album: Cold Fact
I trust that people can appreciate the sheer individuality and soul these cars have over their modern counterparts? That black Maserati is just pure sex. You can tell that it's been designed and built with LOVE! That's something that a computer is intrinsically incapable of.
It's the sheer sense of occasion and thrill such classic cars evoke, which makes them special - and that's just looking at them in a photograph!! :eek:
For me, given some nice wide open roads and beautiful scenery, driving should always be an engaging and emotive experience, which should appeal as much to the heart as to the head - and that is precisely the feeling you get that when behind the wheel of a stunningly gorgeous engineering masterpiece like that...
Marco.
Ali Tait
12-01-2014, 22:12
Till they break down.. :lol:
Lol - nah, that's just part of the charm! :D
Marco.
anthonyTD
12-01-2014, 23:04
Ohh, i quite agree, they all do that from time to time, and usually in the most embarrassing way, and places :doh:
Till they break down.. :lol:
Ali Tait
12-01-2014, 23:14
Still, at least you can stand and admire it till the nice man turns up..
More modern, but almost as sexy as the Maserati - gentlemen, I give you the achingly gorgeous Pininfarina Lancia Stratos:
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/30/w0yw.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/404/ksqo.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/9/2b6c.jpg
Marco.
Beobloke
13-01-2014, 13:01
Well, it's not quite as hideous as the original, I'll give you that, but it's not one of these now is it? (still the best looking car ever made IMHO!)
http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa428/Beobloke/Interceptor1_zps6735829e.jpg (http://s1197.photobucket.com/user/Beobloke/media/Interceptor1_zps6735829e.jpg.html)
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 13:10
Oh Yes !! Loved these to bits ! Even the name - Jensen Interceptor, brilliant !
walpurgis
13-01-2014, 13:10
I'll raise you one E Type! :)
http://i41.tinypic.com/2lvzdqx.png
Gordon Steadman
13-01-2014, 13:19
More modern, but almost as sexy as the Maserati - gentlemen, I give you the achingly gorgeous Pininfarina Lancia Stratos:
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/30/w0yw.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/404/ksqo.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/9/2b6c.jpg
Marco.
Nope, don't like that at all. Looks like a Tonka toy and the headlights have no style at all. Give me a Fulvia any day.
Well, it's not quite as hideous as the original, I'll give you that, but it's not one of these now is it? (still the best looking car ever made IMHO!)
http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa428/Beobloke/Interceptor1_zps6735829e.jpg (http://s1197.photobucket.com/user/Beobloke/media/Interceptor1_zps6735829e.jpg.html)
Sorry, another fat, bulbous back-end! :nono:
The rest is quite nice in a Jason King 70s-esque kind of way.....
I do know what you like about it, though, old chap. However, you do rather have 'quintessentially British' on the brain! ;)
Marco.
I'll raise you one E Type! :)
http://i41.tinypic.com/2lvzdqx.png
Now real style and class has returned!!
Marco.
I do have a wry chuckle to myself when the rose-tinted spectacle brigade get the wind in their sails. It is worth remembering that back in their period of manufacture there were people just like you guys creaming their pants over similarly aged cars and spouting the same, "Tha dinny mek 'em liek tha used ta" rubbish. Truth be told the vast majority of automotive eye-candy from that era needed to look beautiful because a lot of the time your prized motor would be sat on your driveway, broken, a victim of the cutting edge technology employed in the design and manufacturing process.
Another thing, computers are just a tool, like a draughtsmans easel or a sheet of paper and a pencil. CAD software allows designers to be more creative and thus play with the design in virtual reality avoiding any embarrassing mistakes down the line. I think talented modern car designers such as Ian Callum would take issue with some of the comments here, computers don't design cars, people do....for now. It is interesting to note that Ferrari now employ robots to build their vehicle shells, as do Bentley, Aston Martin, Jaguar and even Rolls Royce I believe, whilst talented craftsmen remain in the process to tweak and finalise assembly and trimming. Heavy investment in modern manufacturing tech was absolutely essential to the long term survival of these brands, it is just a shame that this investment needed to come from overseas.
It is the nature of the beast that our minds resonate with memories of things from our past, filling us with a warm glow of satisfaction and familiarity when we recall them. Some people take this a step further and seek to acquire that which gives them pleasure. The danger with complex items such as cars is that something that wasn't all that reliable when it was new is likely to be even less so forty to fifty years later. It is worth remembering that indulging our memories can be a very expensive and time consuming pastime but as long as one is comfortable with this state of affairs then the rewards can be priceless... :)
walpurgis
13-01-2014, 13:33
Well you did mention Ferrari Dave:
http://i43.tinypic.com/262vc5y.jpg
275 GTB4 my favourite Ferrari! RWD, inline DOHC V12, very fast and sounds incredible.
Nope, don't like that at all. Looks like a Tonka toy and the headlights have no style at all. Give me a Fulvia any day.
Lol - We'll have to disagree, then. Fulvias were nice too, but for me somewhat ordinary, if we're showing pictures of cars that worry our pant-wetness indicators! :eyebrows:
Marco.
Audio Al
13-01-2014, 13:35
I have a liking of these
I owned one as a lad , had great fun with it , Velvet lined tool draw , A radio with vales :D
It would take 5 minutes to warm up before you achieved any audio
Flick out indicator arms in the door pillars
Suicide rear doors
Nice smelly leather sears Etc Etc :D
Gordon Steadman
13-01-2014, 13:44
I think I'll have one of these please. The owner kindly gave me a lift home when my reliable, computer designed, robot assembled modern car let me down:eyebrows:
Another thing, computers are just a tool, like a draughtsmans easel or a sheet of paper and a pencil. CAD software allows designers to be more creative and thus play with the design in virtual reality avoiding any embarrassing mistakes down the line.
Well, if that's the case why are there so many "shapeless blobs" (Martin's terminology) on the road today? Let's leave 'supercars' out of it, for a minute, and compare the general generic shape of your average family car, compared with what was available in, say, the 60s?
I'm not talking about how intrinsically good they are as functioning automobiles, or how reliable they are; I'm talking about physical proof of car designers being able to express themselves and create genuinely different and individual looking designs. Take a photo from your average high street during the 1960s and observe how different most cars looked from one another then, compared to these days.....
If your argument is that computers are just a tool and allow car designers today as much freedom of expression to design and style cars as they wish, as used to be the case, then I'm afraid that I see little evidence of that, outside of the supercar arena. Ordinary cars these days have never looked more boring! Granted, they are safer and more reliable than ever, but that’s a totally different argument.
Marco.
I have a liking of these
I owned on as a lad , had great fun with it , Velvet lined tool draw , I radio with vales :D
It would take 5 minutes to warm up before you achieved any audio
Flick out indicator arms in the door pillars
Suicide rear doors
Nice smelly leather sears Etc Etc :D
That's precisely an example of what I'm talking about - and yet, look how other cars from the same era were similarly as individually styled and characterful.
*Yet* they still looked totally different, quite simply because, unlike today, they were devoid of being molded from same generic shape - and that soulless, generic shape was born from the influence of computers.
Why? Because they make us lazy, thus stifling our natural flair and creativity - and you can clearly see the results!!
Marco.
Beobloke
13-01-2014, 13:57
Now real style and class has returned!!
Marco.
Noooo - ugly and poorly proportioned!
I know where you're coming from, but for me it is still an iconic car and a design classic. Observe also how radically different it looks from your Jensen, which confirms the point I'm making! I could hardly think of two better examples of cars that illustrate the results of free-thinking (there are those words again) and freedom of expression...
Do today's sports cars look so radically different? I don't think so!
Furthermore how many of today's cars do you think will achieve similar iconic status to that of an E-type Jag or Jensen Interceptor? How many of them will be similarly recognised and celebrated in years to come??
Nah, we'll all be driving about like robots in our indentical, plastic, electric cars - and that will be viewed as 'progress'. Well, not in my world it isn't! :nono:
Marco.
Well, if that's the case why are there so many "shapeless blobs" (Martin's terminology) on the road today? Let's leave 'supercars' out of it, for a minute, and compare the general generic shape of your average family car, compared with what was available in, say, the 60s?
I'm not talking about how intrinsically good they are as functioning automobiles, or how reliable they are; I'm talking about physical proof of car designers being able to express themselves and create genuinely different and individual looking designs. Take a photo from your average high street during the 1960s and observe how different most cars looked from one another then, compared to these days.....
If your argument is that computers are just a tool and allow car designers today as much freedom of expression to design and style cars as they wish, as used to be the case, then I'm afraid that I see little evidence of that, outside of the supercar arena. Ordinary cars these days have never looked more boring! Granted, they are safer and more reliable than ever, but thats a totally different argument.
Marco.
It is impossible to remove the supercar and sportscar sector from this debate in reality for technological advances filter down from motor racing into these sectors and thus on down into the everyday cars people purchase and drive. The reason many cars looked so different back then is due to the necessary expense of putting a design through wind tunnel testing, which would have been prohibitive for a design destined for volume mass production. Secondly British consumers hankered after the space age designs prevalent in the US market of the 1950's on into the early 60's which were hardly aerodynamic but were considered 'stylish' at the time.
Arguably the vehicle which paved the way for the general public's acceptance of a design styled with better aerodynamics in mind would be the humble Ford Sierra which wasn't introduced until the early 1980's. Ford sat on the design for some eight years before the company eventually pulled the trigger on it as it was deemed too radical. During that period Ford showed off various prototypes based on the initial blueprint at car shows around the world keeping tabs on the public reaction as they did so and eventually moved on it when they considered the time was right.
I'd find it hard to get dewy eye'd over an Austin Cambridge, Ford Anglia or Hillman Minx these days, however just like today, there was the odd looker on the market, for example the Consul Capri or Volvo P1800 come immediately to mind ;)
Gordon Steadman
13-01-2014, 14:36
That's precisely an example of what I'm talking about - and yet, look how other cars from the same era were similarly as individually styled and characterful.
*Yet* they still looked totally different, quite simply because, unlike today, they were devoid of being molded from same generic shape - and that soulless, generic shape was born from the influence of computers.
Why? Because they make us lazy, thus stifling our natural flair and creativity - and you can clearly see the results!!
Marco.
To a degree its about regulations. The fronts are all designed to be 'body friendly' so have to be a certain height and shape. I mean, how daft can you get?? As if anyone cares about that sort of stuff!! Its my bit of road, get your damned body out of my way.
I'd find it hard to get dewy eye'd over an Austin Cambridge, Ford Anglia or Hillman Minx these days...
Indeed, and that's because they were shite! :D
There will always be crap cars around, but I defy anyone to show me two examples of cars today that look so radically different (obviously not made from the same generic 'shapeless blob' mold), and which could also turn into style icons in future, such as the aforementioned E-type Jag and Jensen, thus proving to me that the influence of computers hasn't homogenised car design and that flair and freedom of expression are still producing, visually, uniquely different designs today....
Let's see some pictorial evidence!
Marco.
To a degree its about regulations. The fronts are all designed to be 'body friendly' so have to be a certain height and shape. I mean, how daft can you get?? As if anyone cares about that sort of stuff!! Its my bit of road, get your damned body out of my way.
Hehehe... Indeed! :eyebrows:
More seriously, as our existence has become more and more controlled by such legislations (and the increasing influence of computers), so has the fun been slowly squeezed from many aspect of our lives - and to an extent that most of us aren't even aware of it (or perhaps just accept it, apathetically?) :rolleyes:
That's why I divorce myself as much as possible from that which seeks to control me, and shun the accepted norm. While I'm on this earth, I intend to retain my individuality, keep the fun-factor alive and do what *I* want to do (within legal constraints), not conforming to how 'Big Brother' seeks to shape me...
And one of those choices will be the type of car I drive. I refuse become simply another member of the masses.
Marco (free spirit/non-conformist forever).
Indeed, and that's because they were shite! :D
There will always be crap cars around, but I defy anyone to show me two examples of cars today that look so radically different (obviously not made from the same generic 'blob' mold), and which could also turn into style icons in future, such as the aforementioned E-type Jag and Jensen, thus proving to me that the influence of computers hasn't homogenised car design and that flair and freedom of expression are still producing uniquely different car designs today....
Let's see the pictorial evidence!
Marco.
I'm not sure you are going to like these Marco but here goes... hehe
http://www.motorward.com/wp-content/images/2013/11/jaguar-f-type-coupe-rs-render.jpg
http://motoburg.com/images/kia-soul-05.jpg
http://r56mini.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/4065663406_50b65cce5c_b.jpg
http://worldcarslist.com/images/ariel/ariel-atom-wrightspeed-x1/ariel-atom-wrightspeed-x1-06.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-6c__B7iNRco/Uler5pmttjI/AAAAAAAAZqI/nommT4jSmMA/s1600/Morgan-Three-Wheeler-01.jpg
There ya go, all the above have bags of character and don't sit in the 'Euroblob' catagory, neither do they cost a King's ransom. I am sure I could find more given time... :D
Only the last two look as if their design hasn't been fundamentally controlled by CAD... The rest, whilst superficially different, still look as if they were born from the same generic mold :)
Marco.
Only the last two look as if their design hasn't been fundamentally controlled by CAD... The rest, whilst superficially different, still look as if they were born from the same generic mold :)
Marco.
Man you're a lost cause, I give up... :ner: :lol:
Hehehehe... Surely, you can see where I'm coming from? I really don't think I'm stating anything that isn't already immediately obvious!
Marco.
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 18:35
Hehehe... Indeed! :eyebrows:
More seriously, as our existence has become more and more controlled by such legislations (and the increasing influence of computers), so has the fun been slowly squeezed from many aspect of our lives - and to an extent that most of us aren't even aware of it (or perhaps just accept it, apathetically?) :rolleyes:
That's why I divorce myself as much as possible from that which seeks to control me, and shun the accepted norm. While I'm on this earth, I intend to retain my individuality, keep the fun-factor alive and do what *I* want to do (within legal constraints), not conforming to how 'Big Brother' seeks to shape me...
And one of those choices will be the type of car I drive. I refuse become simply another member of the masses.
Marco (free spirit/non-conformist forever).
Could it be you see yourself as an individual and non conformist by any chance Marco ? :whistle:
Lol... What would you see yourself as then, Robert?
Marco.
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 19:50
Lol... What would you see yourself as then, Robert?
Marco.
Lol - Now that's a question. Lets just say I've noticed we have a lot in common. You're a passionate guy, like myself. Again like you I know what I like and hate having to compromise ie: settling for the 'lesser' option. I think we're having what is known as a bromance Marco :eek: :lol:
http://www.motorward.com/wp-content/images/2013/11/jaguar-f-type-coupe-rs-render.jpg
The Jaguar F-Type is quite exceptionally gorgeous. So are some of the Aston Martin models. There is nothing among Italian cars that I would prefer to these, from now or the past.
Hehehehe... Surely, you can see where I'm coming from? I really don't think I'm stating anything that isn't already immediately obvious!
Marco.
To an extent Marco, there are classic cars I have a huge soft spot for, the Alfa Spider being one of them incidentally, but I am also aware that tomorrows classics are being made today and these vehicles will be as fondly remembered as any of those by our generation, probably more so because in forty years time I doubt very much there will be a single manufacturer producing vehicles with infernal combustion engines...
Incidentally, I would dearly love to own one of these...
http://media.turbosport.co.uk/2005/10/6755066200510070110.gif
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 20:24
The Jaguar F-Type is quite exceptionally gorgeous. So are some of the Aston Martin models. There is nothing among Italian cars that I would prefer to these, from now or the past.
Sweet !!!! Would have to be in some sort of metallic gun metal, graphite or black though.
The Jaguar F-Type is quite exceptionally gorgeous. So are some of the Aston Martin models. There is nothing among Italian cars that I would prefer to these, from now or the past.
For me the coupι is even more desirable than the roadster and Ian Callum has cleverly incorporated styling cues from the E-Type into the design whilst keeping the overall look sharply modern. More than most this car is destined to be a future classic I feel ;)
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 20:29
To an extent Marco, there are classic cars I have a huge soft spot for, the Alfa Spider being one of them incidentally, but I am also aware that tomorrows classics are being made today and these vehicles will be as fondly remembered as any of those by our generation, probably more so because in forty years time I doubt very much there will be a single manufacturer producing vehicles with infernal combustion engines...
Incidentally, I would dearly love to own one of these...
http://media.turbosport.co.uk/2005/10/6755066200510070110.gif
Yep remember these early '70's, often in yellow with orange stripe - that is one fine example though. The original RS 2000 which followed was a beaut too.
Ali Tait
13-01-2014, 20:30
Yep, the F Type is gorgeous.
walpurgis
13-01-2014, 20:33
Ho Hum, I think I'll just bung a bit more automotive eye candy on.
Bizzarrini 5300GT
http://i41.tinypic.com/2aev692.jpg
Iso Grifo
http://i44.tinypic.com/2ed1qo6.jpg
Lola T70
http://i41.tinypic.com/2njx7iu.jpg
Don't like the last one, Geoff, but the other two are peaches (especially the Iso, which is as pant-wetting as your earlier Maserati). You and I have rather similar tastes in these matters! :)
Marco.
Yep, the F Type is gorgeous.
Soz, it's just too hard-looking for me. Why do modern sports cars always looks so 'angry'?
Marco.
Yep remember these early '70's, often in yellow with orange stripe - that is one fine example though. The original RS 2000 which followed was a beaut too.
Ironically this Mexico image was crafted by a computer graphics artist ;)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/db/Mazda_mx-5_na_europe.jpg
Future classic? I think so :)
Ironically this Mexico image was crafted by a computer graphics artist...
Well, the Ford you posted is certainly more interesting than anything they make now! ;)
walpurgis
13-01-2014, 20:46
I guess the aesthetics have to appeal in an artistic way for me. I just like beautiful cars. The F type jag has nice enough proportions, but the whole thing is cocked up by the fiddly/fussy bits and pieces. That's modern cars for you, angular stuff everywhere, little sense of flow in the styling.
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 20:49
Soz, it's just too hard-looking for me. Why do modern sports cars always looks so 'angry'?
Marco.
I'd say the look is potent, testosterone, maybe a tad hairy chested with a medallion on show I guess. Maybe the wheels are a bit dominant too, hence ?
http://home.freeuk.com/lincoln.lodge/zender7.jpg
Possibly one of the finest looking, affordable saloon cars ever made... ;)
Lol - Now that's a question. Lets just say I've noticed we have a lot in common. You're a passionate guy, like myself. Again like you I know what I like and hate having to compromise ie: settling for the 'lesser' option. I think we're having what is known as a bromance Marco :eek: :lol:
Lol... Incidentally, you're right on all counts! Essentially, also, I hate anything that erodes the 'humanness' of life.
Marco.
Ali Tait
13-01-2014, 20:57
http://home.freeuk.com/lincoln.lodge/zender7.jpg
Possibly one of the finest looking, affordable saloon cars ever made... ;)
Apart from the 166!
Apart from the 166!
Oh god no, the proportions are all over the shop... :eyebrows:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/61/Alfa_Romeo_166.jpg
I'd say the look is potent, testosterone, maybe a tad hairy chested with a medallion on show I guess. Maybe the wheels are a bit dominant too, hence ?
I think they've probably got rather too much testosterone. I prefer something softer and less 'square-jawed', as it were. Geoff's got his finger on the pulse in that respect :)
Marco.
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 21:05
Lol... Incidentally, you're right on all counts! Essentially, also, I hate anything that erodes the 'humanness' of life.
Marco.
Amen to that Marco :thumbsup:
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 21:06
Oh god no, the proportions are all over the shop... :eyebrows:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/61/Alfa_Romeo_166.jpg
:lol:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/db/Mazda_mx-5_na_europe.jpg
Future classic? I think so :)
Nah - generic and boring, dude. I'm really not much into Jap sports cars (or Jap cars in general). For me, it's either German, Italian, British or American.
Marco.
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 21:15
I think they've probably got rather too much testosterone. I prefer something softer and less 'square-jawed', as it were. Geoff's got his finger on the pulse in that respect :)
Marco.
Lol, I think your saying it's more Arnie than a young Tony Curtis :)
walpurgis
13-01-2014, 21:20
If we're mentioning Alfa's. The Montreal was nice enough looking. Decent quad cam V8 too.
http://i43.tinypic.com/w9zjp0.jpg
Lol, I think your saying it's more Arnie than a young Tony Curtis :)
Indeed - that nails it rather succinctly!
Also, on the subject of Tony Curtis, give me the cars him and Roger Moore used to drive in The Persuaders, any day, over the likes of that Jag! It's a soul thing, baby....
:exactly:
Marco.
Aston Martin DB9. Another gorgeous British car.
http://www.autoweek.com/storyimage/CW/20120918/CARNEWS/120919824/AR/0/2013-Aston-Martin-DB9.jpg
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 21:33
gu-VHMZkRoI
;)
Marco.
You know it Marky boy lol. Ferrari Dino 246GT and Aston Martin DBS - Someone may have a few nice pics of them to upload :)
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 21:35
Aston Martin DB9. Another gorgeous British car.
http://www.autoweek.com/storyimage/CW/20120918/CARNEWS/120919824/AR/0/2013-Aston-Martin-DB9.jpg
Astons have always been sporty and classy in equal measure Martin.
walpurgis
13-01-2014, 21:38
Aston Martin DB9. Another gorgeous British car.
But is it as charismatic and just plain pretty as the DB6 Volante?
http://i40.tinypic.com/95ueyu.jpg
Astons have always been sporty and classy in equal measure Martin.
I think that's it. It's the classy bit I need as well as the sporty. When the latter dominates too much, it turns me off! That's also probably why, in general, I prefer (sporty) Mercs to (sporty) Beemers, as the former, for me, have more class.
I watched a series of Top Gear recently, where a new Bentley Continental (something or other, can't remember the model number) was being tested, but it was somewhat bizarrely entered into rally race [and strangely did rather well]! :eek:
That, for me, is probably my perfect modern car :)
Did anyone else see that episode of TG?
Marco.
But is it as charismatic and just plain pretty as the DB6 Volante?
No chance, but it would do!! :eyebrows:
I think that's it, too: I much prefer pretty to butch (same as with women) ;)
Marco.
Ali Tait
13-01-2014, 21:47
Oh god no, the proportions are all over the shop... :eyebrows:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/61/Alfa_Romeo_166.jpg
Sure about that? (top pic is mine BTW)
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/1280x1024q90/194/7lws.jpg (https://imageshack.com/i/5e7lwsj)
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/1600x1200q90/801/cty9.jpg (https://imageshack.com/i/m9cty9j)
My 164-
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/1280x1024q90/855/rsqc.jpg (https://imageshack.com/i/nrrsqcj)
Btw, this video illustrates rather nicely the point I was making earlier to Dave (great car chase, too!)
Observe how all the cars, shown on the streets during the chase (some are now also recognised classics), are totally different styles from one another - a situation that would be rather different today, if filmed on the same streets!
Check it out:
UpOEGh7_BdY
Sorry, but nothing will change my mind that computers have got a lot to answer for, in terms of dehumanising our lives!
Marco.
I think that's it. It's the classy bit I need as well as the sporty. When the latter dominates too much, it turns me off!
I watched a series of Top Gear recently, where a new Bentley Continental (something or other, can't remember the model number) was being tested, but it was somewhat bizarrely entered into rally race [and strangely did rather well]! :eek:
That, for me, is probably my perfect modern car :)
Did anyone else see that episode of TG?
Marco.
LOL, yes I can absolutely imagine you in a Bentley GT. There is a downside to ownership though, you'd have to move to Cheshire... :D
I did see that episode of TG and I was suitably impressed, the big Bentley bus handled the stage very well indeed, no doubt due to its excellent 4WD system ;)
I'd go for some American Muscle, liked Bullitt's Stang but preferred the baddies car (& if it's good enough for Vin Diesel) -
http://static.cargurus.com/images/site/2011/01/31/09/05/1971_dodge_charger-pic-3566584124795013120.jpeg
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 21:56
I'd go for some American Muscle, liked Bullitt's Stang but preferred the baddies car (& if it's good enough for Vin Diesel) -
http://static.cargurus.com/images/site/2011/01/31/09/05/1971_dodge_charger-pic-3566584124795013120.jpeg
If ya talking american muscle Roy then it has to be the Mustang Mach 1, gosh I used to love those as a kid ! Anyone got a shot of one for me ? - Please :)
LOL, yes I can absolutely imagine you in a Bentley GT. There is a downside to ownership though, you'd have to move to Cheshire... :D
I did see that episode of TG and I was suitably impressed, the big Bentley bus handled the stage very well indeed, no doubt due to its excellent 4WD system..
Cheshire? That's easy enough - I'm about 5 miles from a CH postcode! ;)
Yes, there are too many twats who buy those types of cars - namely footballers :doh: However, the GT does tick rather many of the right boxes for me.
Marco.
Btw, this video illustrates rather nicely the point I was making earlier to Dave (great car chase, too!)
Observe how all the cars, shown on the streets during the chase (some are now also recognised classics), are totally different styles from one another - a situation that would be rather different today, if filmed on the same streets!
Check it out:
UpOEGh7_BdY
Sorry, but nothing will change my mind that computers have got a lot to answer for, in terms of dehumanising our lives!
Marco.
Nothing to do with the registration on the MK3 Capri then? SPU...... :lol:
I'd go for some American Muscle, liked Bullitt's Stang but preferred the baddies car (& if it's good enough for Vin Diesel) -
http://static.cargurus.com/images/site/2011/01/31/09/05/1971_dodge_charger-pic-3566584124795013120.jpeg
Now, you can't much more 'macho' than that... BUT - I like it because it's different!! [and I also like OTT American cars] :)
It also doesn't look like a victim of CAD!
Marco.
If ya talking american muscle Roy then it has to be the Mustang Mach 1, gosh I used to love those as a kid ! Anyone got a shot of one for me ? - Please :)
As driven by Saxondale?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e1/Saxondale_DVD.JPG
http://www.tagmag.info/images/saxondale_mustang2.jpg
Nothing to do with the registration on the MK3 Capri then? SPU...... :lol:
Never noticed that, lol - quality!
Can you see what I'm getting at, though? If you watched the whole vid, I doubt you'll hardly have seen two cars that looked the same - and that was 1975!
Marco.
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 22:02
As driven by Saxondale?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e1/Saxondale_DVD.JPG
Ha Ha, dont spoil it Roy :lol:
walpurgis
13-01-2014, 22:04
[QUOTE=Roy S;517463]I'd go for some American Muscle, liked Bullitt's Stang but preferred the baddies car (& if it's good enough for Vin Diesel) -
I have to admit I love the early Dodge Chargers. 426 Hemi for me please. I used to watch these at Santa Pod in the seventies and they could clock a sub 13 sec 1/4 mile at around 120mph in standard trim. Still pretty damn quick today!
Just for you Robbie...
http://www.7173mustangs.com/xthreads_attach.php/678_1334515419_b6aef220/b1fe393310ce7e9b78975d2bc2b58590/My%201973%20Mach%201%20Neffsville%20Show.jpg
Utterly gorgeous of course :)
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 22:08
Just for you Robbie...
http://www.7173mustangs.com/xthreads_attach.php/678_1334515419_b6aef220/b1fe393310ce7e9b78975d2bc2b58590/My%201973%20Mach%201%20Neffsville%20Show.jpg
Utterly gorgeous of course :)
Oh Yes ! Even with the rear slightly too raised IMO, still a stunner. Cheers Dave :thumbsup:
As far as modern sports cars go, the AM that Martin posted earlier is lovely, as is the Bentley Continental GT we've discussed. There's also a rather lovely top-of-the-range Audi sports car I like (and which I've seen on the road a few times), but I don't know what the model is...
Anyone know the one I'm talking about? It's rather low-slung and quite square-ish?
It's not the TT, btw.
Marco.
Never noticed that, lol - quality!
Can you see what I'm getting at, though? If you watched the whole vid, I doubt you'll hardly have seen two cars that looked the same - and that was 1975!
Marco.
My period, my manor. I spent much of the time saying things like, "I used to walk down there every day" and "Oh, I know that shop".... LOL
I do get it Marco, I'm just playing devils advocate... :D
Ali Tait
13-01-2014, 22:28
As far as modern sports cars go, the AM that Martin posted earlier is lovely, as is the Bentley Continental GT we've discussed. There's also a rather lovely top-of-the-range Audi sports car I like (and which I've seen on the road a few times), but I don't know what the model is...
Anyone know the one I'm talking about? It's rather low-slung and quite square-ish?
It's not the TT, btw.
Marco.
RX-8 dude.
RX-8 dude.
http://www.dieselstation.com/wallpapers/albums/Mazda/RX8/Mazda-RX8-018.jpg
;)
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 22:34
RX-8 dude.
I think you mean Audi RS8 Ali. Very classy sports car of taste, one of my current day faves and highly regarded by drivers and the motoring hieracy alike. 10 out of 10 to Audi for getting it's first attempt at a proper sports care spot on - more thumb to that one I say :thumbsup:
RX-8 dude.
Is it? It's the red one shown at the top of this link, but it doesn't say the model number: http://www.fanpop.com/clubs/sports-cars/images/27297428/title/audi-photo
Marco.
Ali Tait
13-01-2014, 22:36
http://www.dieselstation.com/wallpapers/albums/Mazda/RX8/Mazda-RX8-018.jpg
;)
Ok ok ok R8 smart arse!
My period, my manor. I spent much of the time saying things like, "I used to walk down there every day" and "Oh, I know that shop".... LOL
I do get it Marco, I'm just playing devils advocate... :D
You could've said, lol! So you admit my point is valid?
Marco.
Ali Tait
13-01-2014, 22:38
Is it? It's the red one shown at the top of this link, but it doesn't say the model number: http://www.fanpop.com/clubs/sports-cars/images/27297428/title/audi-photo
Marco.
That looks like a concept car mate, though based on the 8. The white one to the right is the one you'll see on the road, unless there's a new version out I don't know about.
Ok ok ok R8 smart arse!
Is the one I've linked to an R8? The R8s I've seen look rounder and rather different...
Marco.
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 22:39
Ok ok ok R8 smart arse!
Lol !! Audi RS8 not Mazda RX8 :) Someone put up a nice pic of an Audi RS8 for Marco please (and Ali lol !!)
Ali Tait
13-01-2014, 22:40
See post above mate.
That looks like a concept car mate, though based on the 8. The white one to the right is the one you'll see on the road, unless there's a new version out I don't know about.
Soz, never saw your previous post. I seen a black one (almost identical to the one I linked to) on the road the other day. I nearly crashed drooling at it!!
But yes, even the 'stock' R8 is gorgeous.
Marco.
Lol !! Audi RS8 not Mazda RX8 :) Someone put up a nice pic of an Audi RS8 for Marco please (and Ali lol !!)
Indeed - I wondered why someone was posting up that piece of pish (the Mazda, that is)! :D
Marco.
That RX8 has got the 1300cc rotary engine where you have to change the oil every 10 miles :lol:
walpurgis
13-01-2014, 22:43
Just for you Robbie... Utterly gorgeous of course :)
The Mach 1 was really just a toy compared to the limited production 1969 Mustang 'Boss' 429. It came with 600bhp and a guaranteed 200mph top speed and sub 11sec 1/4 mile!!! :eyebrows:
http://i39.tinypic.com/24fikx4.jpg
Note the huge OHC 429 (seven litre) injected V8 that only just fit under the bonnet.
http://i40.tinypic.com/28splz5.jpg
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 22:44
Indeed - I wondered why someone was posting up that piece of pish! :D
Marco.
:lol:
A few Jap classics from the 70's...
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4a/1971_Datsun_240-Z_coupe_-_green_-_fvl.jpg
Nissan 240Z
http://images.hemmings.com/wp-content/uploads//2013/03/1967Toyota2000GT_01_2000.jpg
Toyota 2000GT
http://www.aeu86.org/download/ae86/id/7878.jpg
Toyota Celica mk1
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 22:49
2000 GT, rare as hens teeth and serious wonga IF you find one.
The gorgeous Audi R8:
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/203/rojc.jpg
If we're talking about modern sports cars, then *that* has got it going on, BIGTIME!
:exactly: :drool:
Marco.
RobbieGong
13-01-2014, 22:52
The gorgeous Audi R8:
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/203/rojc.jpg
If we're talking about modern sports cars, then *that* has got it going on, BIGTIME!
:exactly:
Marco.
Class, class and more class, One of the best of the 'today' crew and will most definately be a future classic - beautiful !!
http://www.aeu86.org/download/ae86/id/7878.jpg
Toyota Celica mk1
That I like! Looks more American than Japanese (which is probably why I like it) :)
Marco.
Still got a soft spot for the MR2, this was mine -
http://i562.photobucket.com/albums/ss68/Lodger56/DSCF0037_zps018d67d4.jpg
(pig to park, no power steering)
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