Norah Jones--24/192

[nieji]

Good Afternoon.

I am listening to Norah Jones in 24/192 through the Bushmaster MKII connected to my Naim Nait XS2 and B&W 805 (older generation). The difference between this and the CD version is just.... It is my hope that we begin to educate our listeners to good quality sound. The enjoyment of hearing the clarity of each instrument--its placement and the attacks--along with the beauty of the recorded voice is so pleasing. I am now very spoiled and cannot listen to CD's.

Thanks for listening to me.

Ian

p.s. I have now begun to listen to Karajan, Klemperer, Furtwangler, Richter, Oistrach and others in 24/96. After all, I am a classically trained pianist/conductor. As I expand my fields of musical listening, I still come back to where I started. Cheers!:)

[synsei]

+1 :) I also own a 24/192 copy of this album and it is quite simply the finest rendition of it that I have heard to date ;)

[Markiii]

Sacd or download?

[Audioman]

Which Nora Jones album is under discussion here :scratch:

BTW Mark 24/196 is PCM - SACD is DSD.

[magiccarpetride]

Good Afternoon.

I am listening to Norah Jones in 24/192 through the Bushmaster MKII connected to my Naim Nait XS2 and B&W 805 (older generation). The difference between this and the CD version is just.... It is my hope that we begin to educate our listeners to good quality sound. The enjoyment of hearing the clarity of each instrument--its placement and the attacks--along with the beauty of the recorded voice is so pleasing. I am now very spoiled and cannot listen to CD's.

Thanks for listening to me.

Ian

p.s. I have now begun to listen to Karajan, Klemperer, Furtwangler, Richter, Oistrach and others in 24/96. After all, I am a classically trained pianist/conductor. As I expand my fields of musical listening, I still come back to where I started. Cheers!:)

I too find that some 24/96 formats sound superior to the 16/44.1 formats. However, I've subsequently learned that many of those hi-rez issues are actually remasters, some of them even remixes. That being the case, I don't think we can compare two different remasters/remixes side by side. Actually, we can, but it's the same as comparing apples and oranges.

There's also been cases where the hi rez formats sound inferior to the red book 16/44.1 (your CD format).

The only way to be fair in comparing these formats is to make sure that both the red book format, and the hi rez format, have been sourced from the exact same source material (i.e. from the same master tape).

Anyone has any comparisons governed by such parameters?

[daytona600]

Never heard the 24/192 or DSD downloads myself but have the Sacd & 200g Versions. I find most times cheaper to buy the Sacd than the PCM or DSD Download

Sacd/LP both sourced from the same digital master , thought these where recorded in 24/96 pro-tools normal bit rate on modern DAW digital audio workstations
200g Vinyl sounds better

best thing she did was the little willies project + like her on her half-sisters new album

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kEJSWIftX98

[StanleyB]

Good Afternoon.

I am listening to Norah Jones in 24/192 through the Bushmaster MKII connected to my Naim Nait XS2 and B&W 805 (older generation). The difference between this and the CD version is just.... It is my hope that we begin to educate our listeners to good quality sound. The enjoyment of hearing the clarity of each instrument--its placement and the attacks--along with the beauty of the recorded voice is so pleasing. I am now very spoiled and cannot listen to CD's.

I use quite a few albums from Norah Jones for testing purposes. I got many of them in just about every bitrate and sample rate they were ever released in. If you use certain points in a track as the basis of a "normal" volume level reference (i.e. 2 minutes and 5 seconds into track 11 ), and the volume control dial on your amp at a similar reference point then it becomes a lot easier to detect if two similar sounding recordings are in fact from the same master, or have been reworked. So it is then a case of using only the recordings of the same master.
After that it is then very easy to detect any differences between different bit and sampling rates. The 192KHz version is indeed very good for showing up additional info. But the 96KHz version is also a cracking choice.

Another good album to get in hires is What's Going On by Marvin Gaye. You can pick out the master tape noise floor in even the 16/44.1KHz files. At 192KHz you can hear quite deep inside the noise floor, which is a bit of a shock.
But there is more to this album... I used to wonder why the voice from Marvin sometimes seemed to have a bit of a flutter and float about. I always assumed it was the wow and flutter from the recording machine. But I was watching a recent tribute video on the BBC about Marvin Gaye and they showed a clip of him and his musician recording one of the tracks from What's Going On. It turns out Marvin used to lie in a sofa in the studio whilst singing. He would get up occasionally and move about with a microphone in his hand. But the reflections off the wall from his changes in position was being picked up by the other mics in the room. I reckon is this variation in time lag between the mics and his vocals that is causing the wow and flutter type impression.

[Theadmans]

Another god album to get in hires is What's Going On by Marvin Gaye. You cna pick out the master tape noise floor in even the 16/44.1KHz files. At 192KHz you can hear quite deep inside the noise floor, which is a bit of a shock.
But there is more to this album... I used to wonder why the voice from Marvin sometimes seemed to have a bit of a flutter and float about. I always assumed it was the wow and flutter from the recording machine. But I was watching a recent tribute video on the BBC about Marvin Gaye and they showed a clip of him and his musician recording one of the tracks from What's Going On. It turns out Marvin used to lie in a sofa in the studio whilst singing. He would get up occasionally and move about with a microphone in his hand. But the reflections off the wall from his changes in position was being picked up by the other mics in the room. I reckon is this variation in time lag between the mics and his vocals that is causing the wow and flutter type impression.

Yes Stan funny you should mention WGO - I was listening to the 40th Anniversary Super Duluxe Edition last on my new Bushmaster MKII. I really digged the instrumental jams on CD2 - what a funky band Marvin had at that time. At your suggestion I also listened again tonight to the HDTracks 24-192 release which as you does indeed sound superb through the MKII. I think you are right about the vocals - I remember the scenes in the BBC doc.

Slightly off topic - with the headphone amp on the MK II I was imagining that I would have to set the volume control much further round than with the MKI (I use HD650s). But in fact I am tending to keep the volume control around the same mark as the MKI or even lower. I rarely seem to get beyond 9 o'clock on the volume control. I use a Squeezebox Touch with the EDO mod which sets volume to 100%. Is it perhaps the increased dynamic range that I am reacting to? I know the volume control is now a log type - what does this mean in terms of how the controls reacts to your movements?

[nieji]

Download from HDtracks in USA.

Ian

[nieji]

Oops! The album is: "Never Too Late"

Ian

[StanleyB]

Slightly off topic - with the headphone amp on the MK II I was imagining that I would have to set the volume control much further round than with the MKI (I use HD650s). But in fact I am tending to keep the volume control around the same mark as the MKI or even lower. I rarely seem to get beyond 9 o'clock on the volume control. I use a Squeezebox Touch with the EDO mod which sets volume to 100%. Is it perhaps the increased dynamic range that I am reacting to? I know the volume control is now a log type - what does this mean in terms of how the controls reacts to your movements?
With the availability of an increased headroom, loud can sound louder before the waveform starts to clip if the headphone amp is driven past its maximum voltage swing ability. Headphone listeners like me, and I assume you as well, tend to set the volume dial according to the maximum listening threshold we are comfortable with at that moment in time. It's the identical scenario that the first owners of CD players faced when switching from vinyl. That extra CD playback headroom took a while to get used to. Playing CD required a different position of the volume control compared to vinyl, with respect to the average listening volume level.

The problem with many stereo headphone circuits is that they were originally conceived for FM radio and vinyl playback. So a lot of them don't have the kind of headroom required for CD and higher bits music. So the difference between the quietest and loudest noticeable musical passage is not as great on headphones as it would be through speakers. What these headphone circuits can do is go and very loud. That's the kind of circuit even I used in my DACs up to the BM MKI. It suited the kind of noise floor that the DAC itself was capable of. But the far quieter BM2 could take in a far wider headroom before noise would be too obvious in the headphone when no music is playing. Keep in mind that the BM does not use muting relays or transistors. So you can't hide the noise in the headphone circuit. It has to be kept as low as possible through careful circuit design. Otherwise all those extra detail that you can hear through speakers, might not be audible with headphones.

[Audioman]

Oops! The album is: "Never Too Late"

Ian

You mean 'Not Too Late' ??

[Theadmans]

With the availability of an increased headroom, loud can sound louder before the waveform starts to clip if the headphone amp is driven past its maximum voltage swing ability. Headphone listeners like me, and I assume you as well, tend to set the volume dial according to the maximum listening threshold we are comfortable with at that moment in time. It's the identical scenario that the first owners of CD players faced when switching from vinyl. That extra CD playback headroom took a while to get used to. Playing CD required a different position of the volume control compared to vinyl, with respect to the average listening volume level.

The problem with many stereo headphone circuits is that they were originally conceived for FM radio and vinyl playback. So a lot of them don't have the kind of headroom required for CD and higher bits music. So the difference between the quietest and loudest noticeable musical passage is not as great on headphones as it would be through speakers. What these headphone circuits can do is go and very loud. That's the kind of circuit even I used in my DACs up to the BM MKI. It suited the kind of noise floor that the DAC itself was capable of. But the far quieter BM2 could take in a far wider headroom before noise would be too obvious in the headphone when no music is playing. Keep in mind that the BM does not use muting relays or transistors. So you can't hide the noise in the headphone circuit. It has to be kept as low as possible through careful circuit design. Otherwise all those extra detail that you can hear through speakers, might not be audible with headphones.

Thanks for the explanation Stan

[Jabberwocky]

This is all most interesting (especially about the music) but what are you all using to get the hires files into the BM?
I know that Stanley has upped the capability (bandwidth) of his inputs.
Are you sure that you're delivering what you think into them?
I thought that most SPDIF was throttled in both speed and bits?

What's the best way to do this?

Anybody using HDMI?
There are HDMI switches appearing that can extract the digital audio, but their resolution is unclear.

How about an HDMI input into the BM2a Stanley??? :scratch:

[StanleyB]

You can use a SB Touch with EDO installed, or a Yamaha CD-N500. Some PC sound cards can also manage 192KHz. Then there are USB to SPDIF adapters like the M2Tech.

192KHz can be difficult to play via TOSLINK if it is a 15MHz or lower type of TOSLINK socket. I use a far more expensive 25MHz socket, which hasn't got that limitation.