Clairvoyant evening

[Audio Al]

I am attending a Clairvoyant evening at the boat club tonight :lol:

Just trying to dream up some questions ;)

Any suggestions

And no it will not be cancelled due to unforeseen circumstances :D

[Tarzan]

Will Andy buy a Mike New Bearing?

[Tarzan]

Will Al ever get his phono stage back?

[Audio Al]

Will Al ever get his phono stage back?


Now THAT'S a question :D

[Audio Al]

Will Andy buy a Mike New Bearing?


See my other post :ner:

[Rare Bird]

Will my Car boot hoarding turn my house into something that resembles Steptoe & son's gaff by the end of the year?

[Ali Tait]

What's next week's lottery numbers?

[johnB]

When will thre an Elkie Brooks come-back?

[Audio Al]

Some great questions :D

Keep them coming ;)

[chelsea]

When are the smiths going to reform?

[Rare Bird]

When will thre an Elkie Brooks come-back?

Elaine Bookbinder was very sexy lady back when she was in Dada band {Pre Vinegar Joe}

[chelsea]

Whats the little thing behind her ear?

[Roy S]

How long's a piece of string?

[Tarzan]

What are next weeks winning lottery numbers?

[chelsea]

Does she believe in foo?

[Audio Al]

What are next weeks winning lottery numbers?

Wake up DSD see post 7 :ner:

[Tarzan]

Wake up DSD see post 7 :ner:


Ok the following weeks numbers- l can wait a week:lol:

[Gordon Steadman]

When are the smiths going to reform?

Oh please, the world is bad enough already. I would rather armageddon happened:eek:

[Tarzan]

Oh please, the world is bad enough already. I would rather armageddon happened:eek:?



When is the apocalypse happening?

[John]

?



When is the apocalypse happening?

When the Smiths reform;)

[Tarzan]

When the Smiths reform;):D

[Gordon Steadman]

When the Smiths reform;)

Armageddon my ear plugs ready:lol:

[Spectral Morn]

My advice for what its worth is don't go, you are opening a potentially massive can of worms getting involved in that sort of thing.


Regards Neil

[Gordon Steadman]

I suppose it depends if you believe there is anything to it. I thinks its all bollocks so what can of worms could possibly be opened.

Before I married my first wife, I was trying to get in touch with her but there was no answer when I rang her door bell. She and some friends were gathered around a ouija board and as one does, she asked "is anyone there?'. Even as she said it, I banged hard on the window and scared them all shitless.

I should have known it wouldn't work out well in the end as she really did believe in fate, magic and the supernatural whereas I thought, and still think, that this 'ere is all there is and we should make the most of it without trying get help from any spirits other than the imbibable kind.:cool:

[Thing Fish]

Before I married my first wife, I was trying to get in touch with her but there was no answer when I rang her door bell. She and some friends were gathered around a ouija board and as one does, she asked "is anyone there?'. Even as she said it, I banged hard on the window and scared them all shitless.

:lol:

[walpurgis]

I suppose it depends if you believe there is anything to it. I thinks its all bollocks so what can of worms could possibly be opened.

Right on Gordon! I think "bollocks" is too polite a word for mindless 'mumbo jumbo'!

As far as I'm concerned, there ain't no gods, ghosts, ghouls or little green men. Any body who believes in the mystical, supernatural, paranormal, the afterlife, extra terrestrials, needs to get a grip on reality. Some may say 'is nothing sacred'? Well, the answer in my case is NO.

[southall-1998]

Right on Gordon! I think "bollocks" is too polite a word for mindless 'mumbo jumbo'!

As far as I'm concerned, there ain't no gods, ghosts, ghouls or little green men. Any body who believes in the mystical, supernatural, paranormal, the afterlife, extra terrestrials, needs to get a grip on reality. Some may say 'is nothing sacred'? Well, the answer in my case is NO.

Looks like you are going to burn in hell then :)

[Audio Al]

I will be on my was to the event soon

Or did you ALREADY know :eek:

[Tarzan]

Will you be carbooting in the morning?

[Roy S]

I will be on my was to the event soon

Or did you ALREADY know :eek:

Glad it didn't get called off due to unforeseen circumstances...

[The Black Adder]

Right on Gordon! I think "bollocks" is too polite a word for mindless 'mumbo jumbo'!

As far as I'm concerned, there ain't no gods, ghosts, ghouls or little green men. Any body who believes in the mystical, supernatural, paranormal, the afterlife, extra terrestrials, needs to get a grip on reality. Some may say 'is nothing sacred'? Well, the answer in my case is NO.


Ah come on you olde stick... Ghosts are something to believe in, just for shits n giggles. :lol:

[Tarzan]

Will the tide be in or out at the boat club?

[Rare Bird]

Ghosts! Um.. If some says they have seen a ghost say a deceased member of the family for example, i believe it's only a unconscious memory they are having of em..

[Cotlake]

My advice for what its worth is don't go, you are opening a potentially massive can of worms getting involved in that sort of thing.


Regards Neil

seconded.

[walpurgis]

Looks like you are going to burn in hell then :)

No fears on my part, I'm the original sainted atheist! :eyebrows:

[Gordon Steadman]

He's already gorn, I thought you knew:eyebrows:

[Audio Al]

Will you be carbooting in the morning?

If its not raining yes

[Audio Al]

Will the tide be in or out at the boat club?

Both

[Audio Al]

Update on the evening

WHAT A LOAD OF OLD TOSH :doh:

How could he stand in out clubhouse after seeing the age group and say

" Has someone lost a relative ? "

It was little more than a con man show

[Roy S]

How are the crystal balls these days Al? :D

[Gordon Steadman]

Update on the evening

WHAT A LOAD OF OLD TOSH :doh:

How could he stand in out clubhouse after seeing the age group and say

" Has someone lost a relative ? "

It was little more than a con man show

Surprise surprise!! I remember being dragged to one of these do's and it was exactly the same. Total generalisations and open questions. Someone in the room is bound to fit and be carried along with all the crap. I wonder why it is that some people are so desperate to believe in something beyond this mortal coil. I know I find it hard to contemplate not 'being' any more but in spite of not wanting to go, nothing will make me believe there is anything else, it just makes no sense or logic.

[Oldpinkman]

Surprise surprise!! I remember being dragged to one of these do's and it was exactly the same. Total generalisations and open questions. Someone in the room is bound to fit and be carried along with all the crap. I wonder why it is that some people are so desperate to believe in something beyond this mortal coil. I know I find it hard to contemplate not 'being' any more but in spite of not wanting to go, nothing will make me believe there is anything else, it just makes no sense or logic.

Hmm. I'm not sure questions about "faith" are welcome on this forum, but until advised otherwise...
I take your point on the specifics of this charlatan but yours, and geoffs onward generalisations about souls and afterlife are kore open to rational challenge. You refer to "not being". So presumably you acknowledge "being". Shorthand labels sometimes offend but could we cal that which you are aware of a "soul" for as long as this is allowed to run. A few quickies
You are implying it is real (for me it is the most real experience i have)
You imply it is inextricably linked to physical life.
Could you physically remove it?
Could you start it?
Or stop it?
Has it grown?
How different is it to when you were 40?
30?
10?

They'll do for now ;)

[Gordon Steadman]

Hmm. I'm not sure questions about "faith" are welcome on this forum, but until advised otherwise...
I take your point on the specifics of this charlatan but yours, and geoffs onward generalisations about souls and afterlife are kore open to rational challenge. You refer to "not being". So presumably you acknowledge "being". Shorthand labels sometimes offend but could we cal that which you are aware of a "soul" for as long as this is allowed to run. A few quickies
You are implying it is real (for me it is the most real experience i have)
You imply it is inextricably linked to physical life.
Could you physically remove it?
Could you start it?
Or stop it?
Has it grown?
How different is it to when you were 40?
30?
10?

They'll do for now ;)

Well, apart from not understanding the question...............

'Being' is just experiencing what i am aware of.

Not being presumably means the opposite

I can't start or stop anything, that was just the luck of the draw when my parents did the rumpy pumpy bit.

My awareness is the same plus experience as it was as soon as I achieved it.

When my awareness stops then so do you as far as I'm concerned. Don't spose that will worry anyone though:rolleyes:

And yes, I do imply that my consciousness is inextricably linked to physical life. This belief is exactly the same as refusing to accept 'faith' in any other area of life - such as hifi perhaps?

As there, we would be wrong to say that other people's experiences are total nonsense, even if we think that. I can only speak for myself and I require proof. I can say with some confidence though, that the average 'medium' is a total charlatan, whose reason for living is to con the gullible.

I'm not sure this rates as a religious subject, just life, the universe and everything.

[Macca]

I used to scoff at the whole 'supernatural' thing until I experienced it myself. Not sure that made me a believer but I am not a sceptic any more. Although people do make things up and 99% or possibly 100% of 'mediums' are fakes (although they may genuinely believe otherwise). I think it is an area that we, as whatever we are, should not be involved in - that's why it either scares people or prompts them to ridicule it. Sometimes though it crosses over into our experience for whatever reasons we don't understand. It makes you realise what a strange and wonderful universe this is. Or it's just glitches in The Matrix ;)

[Gordon Steadman]

Well, I almost believed once.

Back in middle earth (again) my bedroom was on the top floor of a large Victorian house. The stairs wound round, flight, landing, flight etc. As always happened, my parents 'suggested' that I have a tidy up and so I gathered together a load of junk and started down the stairs.

My arms were too full to switch the lights on, but knowing the stairs fairly well (!) I started down the first flight. As I turned right at the bottom, something tugged on my shoulder and there was this strange rustling sound. I went a bit cold........ but hurried along the landing only for the tug to be repeated. I then hurried quite seriously, reached the bottom, dropped the bundle and grabbed the light switch. The piece of string had somehow become attached at the top of the house, draped over my shoulder so that every time I turned, it pulled and unravelled a bit.

Once I had proof that it was a physical event, I told myself that it might be worth checking out reality in future. Never wavered since and never seen anything that couldn't be explained.

[Macca]

and never seen anything that couldn't be explained.

That's really the key to it. I've had a few strange experiences but nothing that couldn't be rationalised or explained. It was the experience that I could not rationalise in any way that changed my outlook. I was with three other people at the time and we all agreed on what we saw.

[Gordon Steadman]

That's really the key to it. I've had a few strange experiences but nothing that couldn't be rationalised or explained. It was the experience that I could not rationalise in any way that changed my outlook. I was with three other people at the time and we all agreed on what we saw.

How was the beer??:eyebrows:

I guess it would be quite interesting to find there is something that can't be explained. I'm still waiting and hope there is yet time enough. Not holding my breath though, that might hurry the state of non-being.

[lurcher]

I know I find it hard to contemplate not 'being' any more

Its not an original thought, but its odd. Many people find it hard to imagine that there will be a time when they don’t exist any more, but they have no problem imagining a time before they existed.

[Macca]

The beer was excellent as it happens, John Smith's cask conditioned. Lovely drop but you don't see it around much these days. I'd only had 2 pints but two of my companions were completely sober.





. Not holding my breath though, that might hurry the state of non-being.

LOL :)

[Rare Bird]

Ghost are about as believable as most audio upgrades :lol:

[walpurgis]

Nice one Andr'e! :)

As for "being"? Well, one IS! Before birth there was nothing of you and you weren't there to experience anything. When you die, the neural circuitry that composes your mind (and experience, memory and perception of everything), ceases to be and so do you. Why worry now? You won't then! Being blessed with life is an unbelievably chance event. Make the most of it and try not to justify it. It just IS! And, does not require rationalisation in any mystical or 'religious' or bizarre other terms.

[Gordon Steadman]

Its not an original thought, but its odd. Many people find it hard to imagine that there will be a time when they don’t exist any more, but they have no problem imagining a time before they existed.

'Tis init?

[Gordon Steadman]

Nice one Andr'e! :)

As for "being"? Well, one IS! Before birth there was nothing of you and you weren't there to experience anything. When you die, the neural circuitry that composes your mind (and experience, memory and perception of everything), ceases to be and so do you. Why worry now? You won't then! Being blessed with life is an unbelievably chance event. Make the most of it and try not to justify it. It just IS! And, does not require rationalisation in any mystical or 'religious' or bizarre other terms.

I agree that it doesn't require it but humans, including me, require explanations for stuff. Before science, what seemed a quite reasonable explanation was formulated and has carried on almost unmolested by time.

Touching upon religion, when I looked up the Wiki definition of Armageddon, it struck me yet again that all the major religions use exactly the same original texts. How they have become so diversified and how they are used to justify what they say and do, is a fascinating study of human nature. Thankfully, I am not smart enough to make such a study.

[walpurgis]

I won't get into what I think of religion or 'faith', as no doubt I'd step on somebody's toes and get an indignant response. Other than to say I have no time for 'collective superstition'.

[Oldpinkman]

Nice one Andr'e! :)

As for "being"? Well, one IS! Before birth there was nothing of you and you weren't there to experience anything. When you die, the neural circuitry that composes your mind (and experience, memory and perception of everything), ceases to be and so do you. Why worry now? You won't then! Being blessed with life is an unbelievably chance event. Make the most of it and try not to justify it. It just IS! And, does not require rationalisation in any mystical or 'religious' or bizarre other terms.

You're quite sure of that are you? Rational blind A:B carried out? I always find atheism one of the least persuasive and most arrogant of the religious faiths - in the face of some stiff opposition. :)

[Oldpinkman]

And yes, I do imply that my consciousness is inextricably linked to physical life. This belief is exactly the same as refusing to accept 'faith' in any other area of life - such as hifi perhaps?



No Gordon. They are quite different. Sue's sisters husband (my brother in law) Tim leads a free church in Torquay. We have had some interesting discussions. I initially maintained faith was just that - necessary in the absence of proof. Tim feels he can prove his faith - it is not a leap in the dark blind faith - but a rational conclusion. However, as he points out, that is still ultimately a faith about God for him, since however much he believes his conclusions are rational, he is never going to be able to bring God or Jesus to the pub to prove it.

HiFi is quite different. If I maintain the F5 sounds different from the FX3 - that is not a matter of faith. It may be a matter disputed by those without common experience, but it is not a matter of faith. I can prove it by getting you there with me to listen to both arms. No faith required. If you maintain you cannot hear a difference (highly unlikely, but..) then I can still prove it by getting you to change between them without me knowing which is playing and correctly identifying them.

If I fail to do that - we have effectively proved there is no difference. But there is never any question of faith or "open mindedness" being required. It may be that there are practical issues about the bother involved with proving HiFi differences, but they are capable of proof, in a way that God or other religious beliefs (including atheism) are not :)

[Oldpinkman]

Ghost are about as believable as most audio upgrades :lol:

Now pay attention in class please. See my reply to Gordon :doh:

[Oldpinkman]

Well, apart from not understanding the question...............

I'm not sure this rates as a religious subject, just life, the universe and everything.

I think you understood the question Gordon - you ducked it

And life the universe and everything IS what religion is about. If you don't just accept the answer is 42, religion is the various attempts by man to answer those fundamental questions. They are legitimate questions, even if personally you find them dull. They are also real tuffies! As I noted elsewhere, I find atheism a particularly unconvincing and arrogant faith. I should note I have no particular faith I am trying to sell, but I find the business of evaluating the one I want to buy endlessly fascinating.

I think the point about the soul is that "it just stops" is a belief you are entitled to, but doesn't fit my experience of my soul to me. Let me try another angle. The questions about age were to do with my Dad saying to me whilst wheezing playing football in the garden with me as a kid "I still think of myself as 18".

I thought "daft old goat" and told him so. But now, rather older than he was then, I still have the same feeling. And everyone of my friends has stayed 18 too. Older people still look older. Younger people look younger. And I am the same as I've always been. So I asked my dad whether he now felt old (He's 79) - but no -it appears his soul hasn't aged yet. I can only really properly remember back to when I was 7 - everything before then I think I remember from photos, cine film and anecdotes. But my 18 year old son was there, and he claims (persuasively) to remember back to when he was 3. And he thinks his soul feels the same.

Its real. More real than anything else I experience. I am troubled by your suggestion it is linked to the flesh and bones inextricably, because of the obvious fact that it is not physical. you can't cut it out like a heart or a kidney. To describe it as electrical pulses in the brain still doesnt really address why and how they start, and why the have their individuality.

MUCH more interesting than HiFi. - I'll do ghosts later (and no I haven't seen any!) :eek:

[Gordon Steadman]

As I noted elsewhere, I find atheism a particularly unconvincing and arrogant faith.

But atheism isn't a religion, that the oldest get out chestnut in the world.

All the rest of your statement is a matter of faith, unprovable and therefore not admissable as evidence. The mere fact that the consciousness can be changed with chemicals should suggest that its all chemistry, just as all the rest is physics. I just don't believe in the word 'soul'. Its just a state of mind. No I have no idea what 'mind' is either.

This is what happens as soon as you insert the word 'god' into any discussion. To some its too serious for my usual style. I really don't think this is the place, so this 'ere is my last post on this thread.

No doubt there will be those that think that's a cop out, well tough tittie:ner:

[Rare Bird]

Now pay attention in class please. See my reply to Gordon :doh:

What does that have anything to do with it?

[Oldpinkman]

What does that have anything to do with it?

You don't need to believe in an audio upgrade. you can demonstrate it. Or not. But belief isn't part of the equation. It is , or it isn't

[Oldpinkman]

But atheism isn't a religion, that the oldest get out chestnut in the world.

:

RTFQ Steadman, as I coached my kids for their exams. I didn't say Atheism was a religion - that implies an organised system of beliefs. I said it was a faith. And it is. Pure and simple. Atheists BELIEVE God doesn't exist. Or are you telling me that you KNOW God doesn't exist, in an attempt to up the stakes on the arrogance claim? ;)

[Rare Bird]

You don't need to believe in an audio upgrade. you can demonstrate it. Or not. But belief isn't part of the equation. It is , or it isn't

I think i come from another planet, as not a single bit of that computes in my lonely brain cell..

[lurcher]

Atheists BELIEVE God doesn't exist

No, they don't, they don’t believe that god(s) exist.

Not believing in the existence of something is not the same as believing in the non existence of something.

Also depends on how strict you mean.

Strong atheism asserts that no gods exist

Weak atheism asserts that they do not believe in the existence of any gods, but they do not state that there are no god(s).

Neither is a belief, they are the absence of a belief.

[Oldpinkman]

I think i come from another planet, as not a single bit of that computes in my lonely brain cell..

If we are discussing God - I can't bring him to the pub to prove he exists (as my brother in law has pointed out to me). Our positions about his existence (even if in agreement) are necessarily matters of faith. We believe in God or we do not believe in God (nobody bring up agnostics for the minute eh?)

If I tell you an F5 tonearm sounds different from an FX3 tonearm there is no faith involved. Either we both sit and listen to them and agree they sound different, or if one of us can't hear a difference, the other one proves he can by identifying it reliably in blind testing. As a question of fact, not belief, there is, or is not a difference which at least ONE person can demonstrate they can hear without knowing the answer first.

Is that so complicated? :scratch:

[Rare Bird]

Yes im thick see :eyebrows:

[Audio Al]

:scratch:

How did we get to GOD

The clairvoyant gent was standing saying things like

" I am getting pain has someone had a accident or operation " several hands went up :doh:

" I can see someone in uniform "

" 27 I am getting 27 , age, ( pause ) ( no one bites ) maybe a door number "

I was going to stand up and say " some one has had a birthday " :lol:

If he was getting nowhere he would crack a joke , Some of the comments were bordering on rude and arrogant

And the biggest joke of the evening was the collection glass tankard , It was given to him empty but somehow when it reached the first table it was lined with £5 and £10 notes all neatly placed around the tankard


I wont go again , better things to do with my time :)

[Rare Bird]

The GOD thing also puzzles me too :scratch:

[Oldpinkman]

OK lets leave God. It can get dodgy. I am fortunate to have close school friends of widely differing beliefs who all feel comfortable debating our differences without taking offence. For me, my interest in the subject, and beliefs started with a sense of urgency when I turned 50, and are centred on this very real thing that is not physical - "the me in me". At least potentially, that is related to the possibility of spirits, ghosts and the like.

But a fraud is a fraud - and I guess this all got too serious. I'll let it get back to taking the piss out of dodgy cabaret's (We had a much better night out Al at my mates wifes 40th birthday. Brazilian dancers. If you buy me a virtual beer I might post the video Sue took (there were bloke dancers too, but I think you'll appreciate the ladies).

It is on my mind. For my 50th birthday Sue organised a surprise reunion of my school mates from around the world. They travelled in from Hong Kong, Japan, Switzerland, France, Holland, Ireland, and even bloody Wales and were just there for an evening at the old pub. It was like walking out of a tardis. Sublime. She had done it in secret via facebook, and I knew nothing about it till I walked in the door.

One of them has just this week been diagnosed with lung cancer which has spread to the bone. He leads his local church in Leicestershire. Somehow HiFi doesn't seem to matter very much.

Life - how transitory it is, and what it's all really about do seem important. But probably not appropriate here. Sorry - lets leave it :cool:

[walpurgis]

I always find atheism one of the least persuasive and most arrogant of the religious faiths

Strange thing to say Richard. Atheism is not a religion, it is not a belief or faith of any kind. It is the acknowledgement of 'nothing'.

[Rare Bird]

I am an Atheist so there that's that..

[Oldpinkman]

Strange thing to say Richard. Atheism is not a religion, it is not a belief or faith of any kind. It is the acknowledgement of 'nothing'.

My apologies. I thought you believed. I didn't realise you knew. I acknowledge you are right on all matters you assert regardless of the complete lack of evidence for your assertion. Happy? ;)

[walpurgis]

The "complete lack of evidence" is enough!

[southall-1998]

The "complete lack of evidence" is enough!

+1

[SteveTheShadow]

How long's a piece of string?

Twice the distance from one end to the middle.