Is it possible to mount tonearms such as the Morch DP-6 on a Technics SL-1210?

[nikonf]

I am new to direct drive turntables and I was very impressed with a Technics SL-1210 I heard at a local dealer's shop.
This turntable sounded amazing on a horn speaker/vacuum tube system.
Is it possible to easily have the stock tonearm replaced? Which tonearms do you recommend with the SL-1210?
Audiophile snobs would probably say this is "Too Affordable" to sound good, but I am very interested in modding the Technics.
Many thanks!
Mike

[6L6]

Audiophile snobs would probably say this is "Too Affordable" to sound good, but I am very interested in modding the Technics.

Audiophile snobs have a ugly habit of choosing items by how many dollar signs there are in the price, not by sound. :doh::doh::doh:

I am a steadfast believer in the opinion that any detractor of the SL-1200 hasn't actually listened to one.

It accepts modifications with gusto! You can hot-rod to your heart's desire and it gets better and better. :)

Here's what I've done to mine -

http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?26620-SL-1200-DC-Power-Supply-DIY

http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?26652-Rewiring-SL-1200-Tonearm

As well as changed the mat to the superb Acromat. I will also change the feet once some house modifications are complete and can get it back on a wall rack.

As for mounting other tonearms, there are a few places that sell "SL-1200 armboards", just google it and you will find a few options.

[Clive197]

Audiophile snobs have a ugly habit of choosing items by how many dollar signs there are in the price, not by sound. :doh::doh::doh:

I am a steadfast believer in the opinion that any detractor of the SL-1200 hasn't actually listened to one.

It accepts modifications with gusto! You can hot-rod to your heart's desire and it gets better and better. :)

Here's what I've done to mine -

http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?26620-SL-1200-DC-Power-Supply-DIY

http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?26652-Rewiring-SL-1200-Tonearm

As well as changed the mat to the superb Acromat. I will also change the feet once some house modifications are complete and can get it back on a wall rack.

As for mounting other tonearms, there are a few places that sell "SL-1200 armboards", just google it and you will find a few options.

Try Origin Live, they do a range of arms starting from £300 and ending at £4500. They also produce a suitable arm board for the 1200/1210 which will accept other manufacturers arms.

www.originlive.com

[Oldpinkman]

Audiophile snobs have a ugly habit of choosing items by how many dollar signs there are in the price, not by sound. :doh::doh::doh:



I've listened to one - two, a few times now. I had a stock one on loan for about 5 weeks while waiting for the mission 774 arm on my PT to be fixed (in the end I got an F5 back instead - lucky boy :D). I don't think I'm a snob. The standard SL1200 was very ordinary (I had an achromat on it, and on the PT). Actually dull, to the point I hardly listened to records, although I'd been bought a brand new record for my birthday during that period. It can be "modded" - but most of the fully modded sl1210's I have seen on here end up with a cost, before arm upgrade of around £2,000 (Mike New bearing £500, Funk or New platter about £500, external PSU (if not home made like yours) £350, suspension mods, achromat. I haven't heard one of these yet but £2000 is $3000 so we're back with the snobs looking at $ signs again. (In truth it's barely a Technics turntable by this stage - just the motor ripped out of one). The arm is very ordinary. I have tried a funk F5 on there and its a big improvement. My guess would be most "proper" arms rather than standard loose head-shell "S" japanese arms are going to be an improvement, although I know Dave (DSJR) gets very excited about matching components - so the F5 is the only arm I've actually tried. It works well - (sounds like an F5 - in my limited experience of the F5's implementation (My Pink Triangle, a Funk LSD, and the Technics SL1210) it is very distinctive. It's an F5 you are listening to, regardless of the TT it is on (it's that bass)

Like all Rega mounts, the F5 struggles a bit with the Technics armboard, but it just needs a crescent cut-out on the mounting pillar doo-dah to accomodate lowering of the cueing mechanism, and I think Arthur is now supplying that as standard on his Funk arms, and it's a pretty low-tech mod on other rega mounts. Standard rega's have no VTA adjust facility which is probably a bit limiting on this TT. (Actually, it wasn't a Technics armboard with the F5, it was a custom made carbon-fibre one. The rega arms mounts appear to suffer with the arm board position because it is sunk into the turntable and it interferes with the ability to lower the cueing mechanism hydraulic pot enough to get the right VTA - see audio Al's post with his Origen)

I much preferred the Funk LSD to the standard technics, and preferred the LSD to the Technics with F5 fitted. With the new (maybe still prototype) Funk platter on the SL1210, F5 arm, it is a much closer thing between LSD and Technics. My PT is much preferred (imaging - detail) but I have to concede a lightness to the bass (until the new platter arrives) and some stability issues on piano and violin (vector needed). But there's no substitute for a decent suspended subchassis to provide isolation, and energy dispersal imao :). That's not $ - my PT cost me £350 :mental:

[WOStantonCS100]

I am new to direct drive turntables and I was very impressed with a Technics SL-1210 I heard at a local dealer's shop.
This turntable sounded amazing on a horn speaker/vacuum tube system.
Is it possible to easily have the stock tonearm replaced? Which tonearms do you recommend with the SL-1210?
Audiophile snobs would probably say this is "Too Affordable" to sound good, but I am very interested in modding the Technics.
Many thanks!
Mike

...used to live in NJ... ...something like 20 years...

If you stick around you'll see that folks on this forum have fitted the following to their SL-12xx... and then some:

Origin Live
SME
Dynavector
Ortofon
Jelco
Rega
Trans-Fi (me)
etc.

Elsewhere, I've seen:

Clearaudio
Graham Engineering
Audiomods

...so on...

:)

No experience with the DP-6. I'd be a little leery of the counterweight setup, from the looks of it.

[Gordon Steadman]

But there's no substitute for a decent suspended subchassis to provide isolation, and energy dispersal imao :). That's not $ - my PT cost me £350 :mental:

I remain unconvinced about this. Every suspended deck I have listened to just didn't do it for me (before you mention PT...... no I haven't:)) All my favourite TTs have been as solid as possible, either using mass or just being built by our local genius (:eyebrows:)

My present TT just has stick on felt pads, apart from that its just solid and heavy.

[Clive197]

I remain unconvinced about this. Every suspended deck I have listened to just didn't do it for me (before you mention PT...... no I haven't:)) All my favourite TTs have been as solid as possible, either using mass or just being built by our local genius (:eyebrows:)

My present TT just has stick on felt pads, apart from that its just solid and heavy.

Having gone from bouncy bouncy to solid (well fairly solid due to Isonoe feet) I absolutely agree

[Oldpinkman]

I am a bit rusty on all this. The only solids I know reliably at first hand recently are the infamous SL1210 and Arthur's LSD. In the past I have had various "ordinaries". Not sure where we count the Goldring GL75. It has springs, but not really a sub-chassis. Now, as those who follow me closely will know, I am no special friend of the LP12, and if that, or its Thorens / Systemdeck derivations are where you're coming from I can maybe see why. The LP12 (I am in the early days, say up to Valhalla Nirvana - I believe they have signficantly improved since then, but beyond holding a new sub-chassis, which looked a damn site better, have no direct experience) - The LP12 was very obviously coloured - the felt mat and the boinging sub-chassis being the main culprits. Because it was a complete git to set-up, I suspect many suffered from poor suspension isolation and freedom, although, when properly done, with suitable gallic incantations, genuflecting and praying to Glasgow, it was capable of being stable. I lacked the patience, but I've seen the job done.

But what is a solid deck bringing to the party? No belt drag, and what exactly? A direct coupling with the environment, and in the case of a standard technics, a thin ringing platter, and just heavy board in which to mount it.

In addition to a warbling soprano (lay off the fat Gordon - not if you value your teeth) I will bring you out a beautiful bouncing turntable. What the PT offered was "detail" - and I wonder if somehow, like many on here , you have managed to enjoy some really great music, but never experienced the "Oh my God" magic of the veils you didn't realise were there being lifted. (It is not impossible I have missed out - something surely has changed in the 20 years since I last took this seriously - and I am on the case for exciting new experiences). The only positive I can see for a solid - particularly the Technics - is the awesome solidity of that f***ing great torquey motor. I just love the way it stops dead. And this is not a strength for belt drives - and my PT , I confess, is weak in that department. Arthur's vector convincingly tackles that (I've only so far heard it on LSD - a solid, but it should mount on the sub-chassis of the PT)

Which brings us back to what you notice. On most music, I don't notice the instability. There is some music where it is much more apparant, but that isn't clearly what my ear locks on to. Specifically with the PT, there is also the bass issue. Bass on a PT is very obviously "fast" and tuneful. More than anything, what people comment is they can hear tunes in the bass where previously they were only aware of rythmn. Against that, it is definitely not "heavy" (the F5 arm balances that somewhat) and I can understand why others miss the bass extension. But I notice the tunefulness. However, in the mid-band and treble, there is a real "lifting of the veil". All those horrible hi-fi terms like imaging, sound-stage depth, positioning of instruments, "space" around the instruments, sweetness, clarity.

Now I done fort that was the acrylic platter, and it is a bit. But it's also clearly both the suspension, and the sub-chassis. It's designer had switched big-time solid due to market pressures (apparantly nobody has a steady hand any more - I blame the booze). And he was a tiny weeny bit surprised when we were fooling round with his precious Sony cartridge to listen to the PT with an FX3 on it, expecting to show me how much better his heavily modded technics was. And it was in some areas (bass extension / solidity). But it took a sore whipping from the PT in that imaging / mid/treble area - and he's always been a softy for that sound. So he's back on project "bouncy turntables". And a good thing too! As long as he does mine first :cool:

[Gordon Steadman]

Basically, I suppose I don't give a flying er.......fig for hi-fi and the ins and outs and this and that that seem to take up so much of people's time. I want to sit in front of whatever is making the noises and get totally lost in whatever I am listening to.

All the impressive specs, all the 'imaging' 'phasing' 'soundstage' etc etc, all meaningless jargon to me. If I can hear what all the instruments are doing, that they sound like the real thing tonally and the intention of the composer is being bought out by the musicians (or sometimes improved upon!!) thats all that matters. If I start listening to the equipment, its a different hobby and I'm just not into it.

I have now changed the amp and the TT. Two changes in 25 years and subtle ones at that. If I had needed to shell out for either, I wouldn't have bothered as what I had was extremely enjoyable. The Firebottle OTL doesn't scream "listen to me" it just sings away happily although I can sense it goes deeper. The new TT just gets rid of that slight belt drive waver.

I do play around with stuff but just for interest and to pass the time. Always in the 2nd. 3rd and 4th systems not in the main one.

Oh, and I saw a thin warbling woman the other day, so I'll change the insult:ner:

[Oldpinkman]

It's alright Gordon, I'm not trying to sell you a PT - just defend her honour (apologies if our banter is thread hi-jacking . I sometimes wonder if we shouldn't have a little private site, Gordon, except the fan-mail I get suggests otherwise)

And I am as bad as you really - I had my perfect system and no plans to change it until a babysitter ripped the cantilever off my cartridge, the worlds best pre-amp started making noises like the start of the sea-bombardment in the Iraq war, everytime I adjusted the volume, and then disintegrated before my eyes as I tried to apply a bit of judicious switch cleaner to the pot, the poweramp started humming, and Mrs S called my speakers "ugly" (before she ever saw a pair of 57's!)

But it needed fixing, so I'm trying to get it perfect for all time again, like my Dad with the English language, after which I will probably leave it alone for another 20 years. In saying "I enjoy my music on it more" I get drawn into all these "why how?" descriptions like imaging and guff, but what I really mean is it allows music to sound so awesome, that when my Dad comes to a barbeque, nominally to see his grand-children, and I play him a recently "Marco-cleaned" record of Bach's double violin concerto, he cries at the music, and asks if the kids will mind if he stays inside to listen to the end of the piece, and spends the rest of the evening saying that every time he opened his eyes he expected to see the musicians there in the room. That sort of hifi equipment.

As for thin warblers, well-done you. Mrs S fancies herself as a Katherine Jenkins manquee, although as I have mentioned before, this ignores a couple of obvious points . (Pun intended) namely KJ is a mezzo, and the small matter of a handful of bra sizes. BUT DON'T TELL HER I SAID that.:doh:

And NikonF - sorry -its that Steadmans fault. At least I told you you can mount an F5, and as some other nice chap mentioned - all those other arms he listed. And in my arrogant opinion, the deck is a lot better for a new arm :)

[Clive197]

:cool:Sorry Richard your warbling again, time for a sit down a nice pint of cold beer.:cool:

[WOStantonCS100]

:lol: A.I.T.D (AoS Infamous Thread Drift)

The Morch looks like it needs a bit more clearance for the counterweight than the 12x0 has to offer. I could be wrong. Of course, if a taller bearing/platter was used... ...maybe? It certainly would be a first, for all I know. It would make for an interesting combo just like Martin's Dynavector.

[Gordon Steadman]

It's alright Gordon, I'm not trying to sell you a PT - just defend her honour (apologies if our banter is thread hi-jacking . I sometimes wonder if we shouldn't have a little private site, Gordon, except the fan-mail I get suggests otherwise)


Fan mail!!! I'm jealous and I feel rejected of man.

I'm lucky if I get any hate mail. I can't even annoy people enough to get that:(

[walpurgis]

I'm lucky if I get any hate mail. I can't even annoy people enough to get that:(

If you're really desperate I'll send you some Gordon.:D

[Gordon Steadman]

If you're really desperate I'll send you some Gordon.:D
Aw shucks ta:cool: