Despair

[Audio Al]

Despair ! :doh:

Spent a good few hours today attempting to get my 1210 sorted and running

Its the one with the Mike New bearing , Timestep power supply and a Origin Live encounter MK3c arm

Fitted a MM cartridge ( nothing special ) to see how it all worked out

Fitted the cartridge template supplied by OL

Aligned the cartridge without too many problems

Checked the VTA and it was miles out , Had to lift the arm assembly quit some distance higher

Plugged it in, switched it on about to be overwhelmed , and disaster :eek:

when lowering the arm with the arm leaver , the arm wont go down onto the record , it drops as far as it can then sits on the arm rest leaving a 2mm gap between the needle and the record ( put the needle on the record track now springs to mind ) bollocks , I have obviously done something wrong :scratch:

Maybe I fitted the arm board upside down ( it is a OL board ) :mental:


http://www.originlive.com/tonearm-options-extras/armboards-adaptors-vta-adjusters/technics-armboard.html

Nope , rule that out as it has a makers name badge and cap head screws at the top

Hummmm what have I done wrong

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/bigboobs/IMG_2619.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/bigboobs/media/IMG_2619.jpg.html)
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I have the std rubber mat on the TT

ANY ideas ???????????????

[Oldpinkman]

I don't know the arm, but from the pics the arrangement looks similar to AK's funk ones - in which case lower the cueing mechanism by loosening the allen bolt so it drops lower. Again, with the Funk Arms, using essentially a rega base, AK had to produce a special lower ring with a cutout to allow the cueing mech pot to drop low enough, You may have to get your round file out :)

[Tarzan]

Does this T/T have a Mike New Bearing?


If not that is where your problem is....


On a more serious note that arm board does look on the low side........

[Audio Al]

Does this T/T have a Mike New Bearing?


O yes , does yours :D:lol:

I have sent a email to OL for advice

[Audio Al]

I don't know the arm, but from the pics the arrangement looks similar to AK's funk ones - in which case lower the cueing mechanism by loosening the allen bolt so it drops lower. Again, with the Funk Arms, using essentially a rega base, AK had to produce a special lower ring with a cutout to allow the cueing mech pot to drop low enough, You may have to get your round file out :)

Hi Richard , cant see any way of lowering the lift , Have emailed OL cheers

[Spectral Morn]

That's weird as I have exactly the same arm and arm board on a non MN bearinged 1210 with no issues re VTA at all. Cart is a Benz MC Silver.

You have the armboard correctly orientated too :scratch: not sure what's wrong though the arm does look too high.


Regards Neil

[Spectral Morn]

Here is a few photos of mine, rooms dark so a bit of flash issues, plus decks not been cleaned but maybe seeing this will help.

http://i549.photobucket.com/albums/ii364/davros124/001_zps595e8335.jpg (http://s549.photobucket.com/user/davros124/media/001_zps595e8335.jpg.html)

http://i549.photobucket.com/albums/ii364/davros124/002_zpsc22284e2.jpg (http://s549.photobucket.com/user/davros124/media/002_zpsc22284e2.jpg.html)

http://i549.photobucket.com/albums/ii364/davros124/003_zps32fc250b.jpg (http://s549.photobucket.com/user/davros124/media/003_zps32fc250b.jpg.html)

http://i549.photobucket.com/albums/ii364/davros124/004_zps6344e0b0.jpg (http://s549.photobucket.com/user/davros124/media/004_zps6344e0b0.jpg.html)

http://i549.photobucket.com/albums/ii364/davros124/006_zps71cd5958.jpg (http://s549.photobucket.com/user/davros124/media/006_zps71cd5958.jpg.html)

http://i549.photobucket.com/albums/ii364/davros124/005_zpse689968e.jpg (http://s549.photobucket.com/user/davros124/media/005_zpse689968e.jpg.html)

http://i549.photobucket.com/albums/ii364/davros124/007_zps91dabde6.jpg (http://s549.photobucket.com/user/davros124/media/007_zps91dabde6.jpg.html)


Regards Neil

[Gordon Steadman]

How about dropping the arm 3mm and sod the VTA??

[Audio Al]

Neil
Thanks for the photos

Counld you do some measurements for me ?

If you can , could you measure the distance from the under side of the tonearm stand support plate down to the TT deck , This will give me an idea if my setup is to high ,

also the depth of your Benz cartridge and lastly the thickness of you platter mat

These measurements will help

Cheers

[Spectral Morn]

Daft question but the tightening nut is under the armboard not above it?, its just I can see cork and the cork should be underneath the armboard, with the tightening nut there.


Regards Neil

[Audio Al]

How about dropping the arm 3mm and sod the VTA??

That option will be a last resort for me , cant see the TT running properly with the arm pointing up

[Spectral Morn]

Neil
Thanks for the photos

Counld you do some measurements for me ?

If you can , could you measure the distance from the under side of the tonearm stand support plate down to the TT deck , This will give me an idea if my setup is to high ,

also the depth of your Benz cartridge and lastly the thickness of you platter mat

These measurements will help

Cheers

Yes I will do that now.


Regards Neil

[Audio Al]

Daft question but the tightening nut is under the armboard not above it?, its just I can see cork and the cork should be underneath the armboard, with the tightening nut there.


Regards Neil

Yes the big nut is underneath the arm board , but as you say the cork washer is above , its not ver clear in the instuction book where it should go , so I will remove the arm assembly and put the cork washer underneath

Cheers for that

[Spectral Morn]

Platter mat 5mm

Distance from bottom of adjuster disc to armboard 5mm

Cart from top to tip of stylus (not under pressure) is 16 mm


Regards Neil

[Gordon Steadman]

That option will be a last resort for me , cant see the TT running properly with the arm pointing up

Understood but yours looks hugely higher than the other pic. Hope you get it sorted.

[Spectral Morn]

Bottom of arm support base (plate everything is mounted to, armrest, bearing assembly, arm lift lower tower goes through) to top of armboard 23mm

[Spectral Morn]

Cork washer defo goes under the tightening nut.


Regards Neil

[Audio Al]

Bottom of arm support base (plate everything is mounted to, armrest, bearing assembly, arm lift lower tower goes through) to top of armboard 23mm

Neil you have lost me with this ?

Are you measuring from the deck of the turntable to the top of the arm stand board or from the Origin live arm board held into the TT with 3 set screws ?

[Audio Al]

Cork washer defo goes under the tightening nut.


Regards Neil

Neil , I have now re fitted the cork washer underneath with the tightening nut , Cheers

[Spectral Morn]

Neil you have lost me with this ?

Are you measuring from the deck of the turntable to the top of the arm stand board or from the Origin live arm board held into the TT with 3 set screws ?

No from the top of the armboard to the underside of the plate (part of the arm) that the bearing assembly, armrest etc is fixed.


regards Neil

[Oldpinkman]

Al
I may be being a king size plonker here - it wouldnt be the first time. I am probably going to be off air for 3 days after this post - and Mrs S is giving me the evil eye to get on the road, so its a bit rushed. Your problem I think is the pivot point, which is not the arm bearing, its the pivot on the cueing arm. So in principle, not the arm installation on the armboard, but the cueing mech installation on the arm.

If you raise the arm bearings by changing those bits you've been discussing with the Daleks (if I read right) you will change the VTA. If we blame Mike New and you fix the bearing and change the platter height you will change the VTA. If you adjust platter and arm together you will keep the VTA but keep the cueing mech problem.

2 Solutions work. Get the cueing mech lowered, or lower the cartridge tip relative to the headshell (packing in between the cartridge and headshell). You shouldnt have to do and wouldnt want to do the latter.

If you can't move the cueing pot on its mount platform in the way that you can for the mission and Funk arms, can you move the platform height relative to the arm pillar - ie move it down the arm pillar. The pillar looks threaded from the picks, and maybe you can wind that platform up and down. If you can do that, and you then foul the armboard, maybe there is a need to look at the arm mount again (and raise the record height with it)

But in the first instance, to maintain VTA you either need to make your cartridge taller, or your cueing platform lower. It does beg the question "how do you measure VTA" since I measure it with the stylus on the record at the correct tracking force (cos the thing squishes down a bit), but otherwise you have that basic lever / see-saw pivot problem to address

Like I said - I've suffered the same before, and moving the cueing mech (getting arthur to produce a cut-out arm pillar base for the techie) was the solution.

Best of luck - I shall look with interest when I have a connection again

[walpurgis]

First time I've looked at this thread. I'm not sure what Al's problem is with this, but I can see that there are ergonomic issues. Rega arms, and arms with Rega geometry as I believe this is, are a pain to use on the Technics as they have to sit low, almost in a 'well' and the use of the arm lifter for cueing becomes very awkward, as I've found from experience.

Looking at the problem in hand, I'd say the arm needs to be even lower in order to be parallel or near parallel to the record during playing. An alternative would be to use a spacer to bring the cartridge down a bit.

[Clive197]

Good morning
I have a Origin Live Silver arm fitted to my SL1210. As already posted the cork washer is fitted below the OL arm board and the nut is hand tightened then given a final twist to lock, it should not be torked down.
I also had a problem with the lift/lower but it was the opposite of your troubles. The arm lift would not raise the cartridge clear of the record. This was a resolved by phoning OL and speaking to the guy who builds the arms. He told me that they were having difficulties with the lift/lower and suggested that two small nylon spacers be placed below the lift bar, a pair along with a hex key arrived the following day and fitted in a matter of moments. Problem well and truly solved. It may be that you have too many spacers and removing one will solve the problem. They are very thin but seem to make a huge difference.
I think that instead of e-mailing, a quick phone call may well solve the issue.

[Audio Al]

I think that instead of e-mailing, a quick phone call may well solve the issue.

Tried phoning yesterday , The only person who could offer advice is away on holiday !

[Tarzan]

Tried phoning yesterday , The only person who could offer advice is away on holiday !



Where did they go?

[Audio Al]

Where did they go?


Butlins Blackpool

[Idlewithnodrive]

Butlins Blackpool

S'nice there

[Tarzan]

Nice.:eek:

[Audio Al]

This is becoming a PITA now

Reading the instructions it says " the threaded VTA adjuster should not be needed except in very rare instances " So I take it all apart again and remove the said item

Now the arm rattles around in the arm mounting board like Tarzans dick in a bucket ( mine would fill the bucket :lol: ) OK im telling fibs

And the big nut is now too big to fit the smaller diameter tube the vta adjuster was fixed to

Looks like I will be re fitting the VTA tube :steam:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/bigboobs/IMG_2631.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/bigboobs/media/IMG_2631.jpg.html)
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:scratch:

[Audio Al]

Just looked on OL live web site , they only do one arm board so different hole sizes are out :scratch:

[Audio Al]

Just had a reply email from OL

With this youtube link

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqFaen07ZMU&feature=youtu.be


Will put it all back together and try and lower the arm lift as in the video :)

[Audio Al]

Thanks everyone for you advice , Will get it sorted soon ;)

[Tarzan]

Just had a reply email from OL

With this youtube link

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqFaen07ZMU&feature=youtu.be


Will put it all back together and try and lower the arm lift as in the video :)



Where are the Redcoats?:scratch:

[Oldpinkman]

Just had a reply email from OL

With this youtube link

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqFaen07ZMU&feature=youtu.be


Will put it all back together and try and lower the arm lift as in the video :)

Ha! I have wifi!Look out! That seems to make sense. The problem had to be the lift/lower not the arm mount or bearing. As Geoff noted, and I recall, the don't like rega mounts on Techies! The Funk versions have an appropriate cutout on the pillar base now. Now, if you'd tried a decent arm...:)

(Don't worry - I shouldnt be so smug - my technics cartridge in its ready made P-mount adaptor doesn't fit the bloody arm either, and so I shall be getting Arthur to take a chain-saw to it when I get back) :doh:

[Oldpinkman]

So what's the news Al - is it fixed?

[Audio Al]

No not yet , no time , out all day and I have to visit a friend in hospital tonight

Hopefully tomorrow :rolleyes: time depending