View Full Version : tdl transmission line speakers with the super tweeter
oceanobsession
14-08-2013, 21:18
Anyone heard a pair of these .
No but they look rather impressive... I take it they are hand modified because TDL never made a pair with a Super Tweeter?... Also note that they are being run by an Audiolab 8000c and Audiolab 8000p pre/power combo from what looks to be an Exposure CD player...
southall-1998
14-08-2013, 21:43
I've always wanted to hear the TDL Reference Standard's !!!!! They are bigger than the TDL's shown in that pic :eek:
My Dad had a pair of IMF TSL-40 Loudspeakers which eventually died and went to Hifi heaven and they were the precursor to TDL which were also good speakers... I have harked after a pair of TDL RTL 4 or something like that for a number of years and you can pick them up for buttons on ebay.. but I just concern myself whether they will be as good as the Epos...
Beobloke
15-08-2013, 09:41
I take it they are hand modified because TDL never made a pair with a Super Tweeter?...
Yes they did. Both the TDL Reference Standard and the TDL Monitor (the latter are the speakers pictured) came with super tweeters as standard.
1970's IMF's used the famous HF1300 plus HF2000 as standard in all of their bigger models. I don't know this pair of TDL's, but should mention that the similar looking bass driver Linn used in the Keltik is NOT the same, since the latter was Japanese sourced I understand.
In some rooms, IMF and TDL's models can sound incredible, but you don't get all this bass extension without a penalty in the mid to upper bass region, as the PMC FB1 (to name a modern once popular model) showed.
I did sell a couple of pairs of the final version of this speaker (around £2k in the late 90's IIRC), with different tweeter line-up (can't remember their name now) and they sounded excellent, the bass being pretty well controlled I remember.
had a pair of imf studio 50s a few years back.
a four way system using kef b200 at one end and coles supertweeters at the other.
as they had been stored for many years in the last owners garage they were in poor shape and only the bass units were working.
I undertook an extensive rebuild, removing and replacing the baffle and converting them to a twoway system with the aid of a new crossover and 1'' audax cloth dome tweeters.
after many hours stripping the cabs, varnishing, painting AND replacing the poor quality terminals with all singing gold plated multiway types I fired them up and feverishly sat down, cd remote in hand and pressed play.
after all my planning and hard work I have to say they sounded.........bloody crap!!!!
sometimes the projects just don't pay off!!!!!
istari_knight
15-08-2013, 21:13
Transmission line done well is hard to beat [in the right room as Dave says] I have fond memories of my old TLS50's driven by a Harman Kardon Citation 12 Deluxe...
walpurgis
15-08-2013, 21:58
Transmission line done well is hard to beat [in the right room as Dave says] I have fond memories of my old TLS50's driven by a Harman Kardon Citation 12 Deluxe...
That sounds a nice combination. I would have killed for that setup thirty five years ago!
Yes they did. Both the TDL Reference Standard and the TDL Monitor (the latter are the speakers pictured) came with super tweeters as standard.
Did they really Adam.. sorry my mistake I didn't think they did... was the ones you are mentioning when TDL were TDL as apposed to TDL the brand (that isn't the true TDL) that is / was owned by Richer Sounds?
My Dad had a pair of IMF TSL-40 Loudspeakers which eventually died and went to Hifi heaven and they were the precursor to TDL which were also good speakers... I have harked after a pair of TDL RTL 4 or something like that for a number of years and you can pick them up for buttons on ebay.. but I just concern myself whether they will be as good as the Epos...
No the RTL range will not be a patch on 14's. The refrance or studio range are another matter though.
Beobloke
16-08-2013, 08:20
Did they really Adam.. sorry my mistake I didn't think they did... was the ones you are mentioning when TDL were TDL as apposed to TDL the brand (that isn't the true TDL) that is / was owned by Richer Sounds?
Yes, they were indeed 'proper' TDL. The way to tell between them is that the badge on a 'proper' TDL says "TDL Electronics" whereas the Richer Sounds versions just say "TDL"
The way to tell between them is that the badge on a 'proper' TDL says "TDL Electronics" whereas the Richer Sounds versions just say "TDL"
Worth knowing.
Cheers. Guy.
istari_knight
16-08-2013, 10:46
That sounds a nice combination. I would have killed for that setup thirty five years ago!
It was just a bit special... A sound I've been unable to recreate since !
Amazing how cheap those Citations sell for on eBay.com - $100 isnt uncommon... :eek:
Yes, they were indeed 'proper' TDL. The way to tell between them is that the badge on a 'proper' TDL says "TDL Electronics" whereas the Richer Sounds versions just say "TDL"
Thanks Adam, as guy says below... Very useful... :)
No the RTL range will not be a patch on 14's. The refrance or studio range are another matter though.
I didn't think the RTL's would be anywhere near to the ES-14's which is why i've not bought a pair off of Fleabay... even though I kept being tempted!... Will have to look out for the Reference or Studio ranges though :)
istari_knight
16-08-2013, 21:43
I didn't think the RTL's would be anywhere near to the ES-14's which is why i've not bought a pair off of Fleabay... even though I kept being tempted!... Will have to look out for the Reference or Studio ranges though :)
Sounds like a plan :thumbsup: I had a pair of RTL2's here relatively recently & they were awful.
A friend of mine had a pair of the RTL2's and you're totally right, they are awful!
Here we go again... :)
The RTL main drivers were designed (and made? certainly repaired at one time) by the same chap who designed the later TDL drivers. I believe there was a manufacturing tie-up in the early days with Elac, who also made some MA metal cone drivers IIRC. All lost in ancient history now, although TDL started out making drivers for IMF and then started making speakers when IMF folded, hence the direct tie-up/continuation.
The FIRST SERIES RTL2 speakers are stunningly good and very cheap. Bubbly plastic 'veneer' aside, the lively sound responds so well to the system used and like ES14's, can deeply involve the listener in a way measurements can't really identify. The better finished (and looking) Series 2 'SE' models had a massive tweeter level-duck to match the then popular AE109's and these needed crossover surgery to even begin to sound properly balanced (resistor change to bring level up and possibly a cap change too - I can't remember the full details).
My favourite IMF's were the TLS80 II and the RSPM IV from the mid to late 70's. sadly, the foam in the lines will be crumbling away now and crossover caps will have gone off, so a major revamp will be necessary to bring 'em up to standard. These were regarded as fairly big speakers, but now, they'd be unacceptable in many homes sadly..
istari_knight
17-08-2013, 01:16
The FIRST SERIES RTL2 speakers are stunningly good and very cheap. Bubbly plastic 'veneer' aside, the lively sound responds so well to the system used and like ES14's, can deeply involve the listener in a way measurements can't really identify. The better finished (and looking) Series 2 'SE' models had a massive tweeter level-duck to match the then popular AE109's and these needed crossover surgery to even begin to sound properly balanced (resistor change to bring level up and possibly a cap change too - I can't remember the full details).
Mine were mk.1's.
As with everything its a matter of taste. The chap I sold them to had a listen when collecting & was over the moon with them... He did plug his iPod in & play ABBA though so I don't know if his opinion counts :lol:
Rakoribs
28-02-2014, 13:26
No but they look rather impressive... I take it they are hand modified because TDL never made a pair with a Super Tweeter?... Also note that they are being run by an Audiolab 8000c and Audiolab 8000p pre/power combo from what looks to be an Exposure CD player...
Hi there, this picture is of my stereo set-up, temporarily sited while my new build house was being put in order.
You are quite correct in your list of equipment, slowly accumulated with my meagre means from ebay & similar sources over the years.
I mentioned some other details regarding them on this forum thread, containing links to brochure specs & cutaways:
http://www.avforums.com/threads/tdl-monitor-worth-buying.493019/
The same picture has also been used here on these sites, so I guess there aren't many pictures of these online:
http://www.imf-electronics.com/Home/tdl/tdl-monitor
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=505002
But here's a few others for anyone interest:-
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=529950
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=216420
http://www.solaris.no/electronics/speaker/tdl.html
http://www.hifiengine.com/gallery/images/tdl-monitor.shtml
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?p=1937238
http://audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?p=3823301
http://www.aktives-hoeren.de/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1656&start=45
http://www.syraha.de/foren/usrposts.php?f=audiotreff_selbstbau&page=8&name=markusred&color=6633FF&full=1&
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=187996&page=6
As already mentioned these are very similar to the Studio 4, but with a (very delicate) super tweeter.
I looked out for a pair of the range topping Reference Standard's for many years but had to give up - they are too rare, too expensive, too difficult to ship (with their size & weight) and realistically I don't really have space for them, i'm strugglng with the monitors ;-)
I found this site through the already mentioned google and have posted in the welcome thread to be able to post here ;-)
I really love speakers (too much...) and the TDL transmission lines in particular, the Studio series are a bargain second hand compared to the price for an equivalent quality from a new mid to high end brand.
If you get a chance, audition some.
Obsessed? Maybe :-)
I'll lurk about and have a good look through this site, it looks very informative and interesting.
Cheers, Mark.
Rakoribs
28-02-2014, 13:31
I'd never noticed the "TDL" vs "TDL Electronics" before, well spotted.
The Studio range consisted of (from memory, so please forgive omissions & mistakes):-
"Studio 0.5" (tweeter & bass/mid driver).
"Studio 0.75" (later addition I think, tweeter & bass/mid driver).
"Studio 1" (tweeter & bass/mid driver).
"Studio 1M" (metal bass driver with black tweeter - later addition, later still with fully veneered front).
"Studio 2" (tweeter & 2 bass drivers).
"Studio 3" (tweeter & 3 bass drivers).
"Studio 4" (tweeter & mid & oval bass).
"Monitor" (super tweeter & tweeter & mid & oval bass, similar to Studio 4).
"Reference Standard" (the beast - super tweeter & x2 tweeters & x2 mid's & x2 oval bass, 3 sided front cabinet).
RTL range:-
I've seen a few hundred of the RTL's (Reflex, Transmission Lines) speakers go on fleabay, they seem good value for the money, but they are cheaply made with thin chipboard cabinets.
I bought (2nd hand) the passive sub that TDL released around the same are as the RTL's, it arrived smashed to bits - partly because the thin chipboard was only about 6mm thick, but also because the seller had couriered it in a cardboard box with NO padding whatsoever.
The RTL 3's in Rosewood fablon/film/veneer look nice, but i'm glad I held out for Studio's - they are SOLID.
You see a lot of the RTL's ("RTL2", "RTL2SE", "RTL3", "RTL3 MK2" and very very occasionally a pair of "RTL1"'s), there was also the "G30-RTL" which i believe came later.
I also believe the following all came later than the RTL range, possibly to a slightly lower quality - but I wasn't aware at the time, so its just from what i've gathered after the fact:-
The AV passive sub (name?), "Nucleus KV1", "Nucleus 2", AV "Nucleus CCS" centre speaker, "Near Field Monitor", "Nucleus KV6" and similar models from that era.
Haven't looked at my research notes for years.
The next lot of models, mainly with the 90's "beech" coloured film are the Richer Sounds 'counterfeits', which by all accounts are cheap and nasty.
"Studio 10", "Studio 5", "Saturn 10".
Cheers, Mark.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.