View Full Version : What CD Player?
There must be better CD Players out there than my NAD C541?
So im asking - what are your favorite CD players? What would you buy again? What do you wish you had not sold?
I looking for something that can 1)feed a DAC, and 2) have low jitter/listening fatigue since i have been suffering from that lately...
You ask, what will it go with? An Exposure XXV and Ushers X708 are on the way.
Thanks for your ideas!!
A Pioneer DV-717 or DV-737 will blow away most CD transports, and you can pick them up for £50, but retailed over £600 in to 90s. Unlike CD players they re-read discs on error, and buffer data into memory. Sort of like the PS Audio Memory Player without the bling and marketing. ;)
Compared to every new transport I have tried, USB/SPDIF transports such as the Musical Fidelity V-Link 192, the Pioneers are far more analogue and natural sounding. I find a lot of CD transports add a digital 'sheen' to the table.
Wait for the new kit.
Still getting fatigue? Might be the Beresford or the NAD or the combo. Try the Yomanze solution. Still got a problem? Change the DAC.
The Jolida Glass FX DAC reviewed in this section is very good for the money. I listened to it for hours with no fatigue issues even though it is quite lively and entertaining.
Andrew B
07-08-2013, 18:10
A Pioneer DV-717 or DV-737 will blow away most CD transports, and you can pick them up for £50, but retailed over £600 in to 90s. Unlike CD players they re-read discs on error, and buffer data into memory. Sort of like the PS Audio Memory Player without the bling and marketing. ;)
Compared to every new transport I have tried, USB/SPDIF transports such as the Musical Fidelity V-Link 192, the Pioneers are far more analogue and natural sounding. I find a lot of CD transports add a digital 'sheen' to the table.
I've actually got one of these (717) in the bedroom as a DVD player. Lovely thing. It was just far too relaxed as a CD player but I've never even thought of trying it as a transport. Thanks or the tip.
I got it when I went with a mate to buy an amp. The seller just gave it to my mate free gratis because he'd got a new one! I offered my mate twenty quid and it was mine. It's such a beauty, I really hope it is good as a transport :)
Just had a nosey on Google and the Pioneer DVD players you mention look like mighty meaty beasts. I suspect they weigh a good old whack!
Andrew B
07-08-2013, 18:38
The remote is a thing of beauty too. There's a button on the side that lights up the buttons in the dark, so you can see what you are doing.
I'm not into the whole AV side so I was lucky to get one. I knew nothing about them tbh.
OMG Andrew - Jason is right.
You do have everything!!
Its nice to hear you appreciate your equipment so much, you seem to have scoured the planet and kept the best stuff! Wife jealous? a bit? ;)
I've actually got one of these (717) in the bedroom as a DVD player. Lovely thing. It was just far too relaxed as a CD player but I've never even thought of trying it as a transport. Thanks or the tip.
I got it when I went with a mate to buy an amp. The seller just gave it to my mate free gratis because he'd got a new one! I offered my mate twenty quid and it was mine. It's such a beauty, I really hope it is good as a transport :)
John R Leddy
07-08-2013, 19:09
.
Stuart,
One of my favourite CD players was a Linn Ikemi. These CD players are currently increasing in value in the secondhand market faster than just about anything else normally described as an investment. While I do not see myself ever buying a CD player again, the Ikemi certainly was, and still is, an outstanding player. An integrated player, with a huge fan base, and an increasing resale value, I really enjoyed owning this HDCD and red book CD player. I only replaced it with another Linn player, a 2.1 Unidisk, when I thought it would be a good idea to try DVD-A and SACD, which ultimately gave way to streaming. I can understand why some enthusiasts see the Ikemi as being a last-buy CD player. A great piece of kit in my opinion.
John.
.
Stuart,
One of my favourite CD players was a Linn Ikemi. These CD players are currently increasing in value in the secondhand market faster than just about anything else normally described as an investment. While I do not see myself ever buying a CD player again, the Ikemi certainly was, and still is, an outstanding player. An integrated player, with a huge fan base, and an increasing resale value, I really enjoyed owning this HDCD and red book CD player. I only replaced it with another Linn player, a 2.1 Unidisk, when I thought it would be a good idea to try DVD-A and SACD, which ultimately gave way to streaming. I can understand why some enthusiasts see the Ikemi as being a last-buy CD player. A great piece of kit in my opinion.
John.
Good point John but I'm afraid the CDI or CDS would eat it for breakfast!
Justin
Thanks for the tip!
I have considered that, and tried direct source from the CD, or from a denon micro player i have too - all have fatique. Using the Bushmaster as a Dac reduces it (in this case i also use ALAC files from Ipod as a source)
It is possible that all of these are creating fatigue - as well as the speakers... in any case the new speakers and amp have not arrived yet, so when they do - we will know more!!
If an opportunity comes up i would gladly add a new cd to the pile, and try it out too :)
Wait for the new kit.
Still getting fatigue? Might be the Beresford or the NAD or the combo. Try the Yomanze solution. Still got a problem? Change the DAC.
The Jolida Glass FX DAC reviewed in this section is very good for the money. I listened to it for hours with no fatigue issues even though it is quite lively and entertaining.
Stuart,
You worry too much! Once you have the new amp and speakers you'll probably love your Hifi and even more, music collection all over again :)
Interesting John!
And stunning prices too. They dont go cheap! here is one for 1k+
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Linn-Ikemi-CD-Player-in-black-immaculate-from-NaimlyLinn-/161080573924?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item2581267fe4
and the last one sold for 680
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Linn-Ikemi-CD-player-in-MINT-condition-/190875813860?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item2c7115c7e4
Not sure i can imagine putting that to a cd player, even though it looks very sweet!
.
Stuart,
One of my favourite CD players was a Linn Ikemi. These CD players are currently increasing in value in the secondhand market faster than just about anything else normally described as an investment. While I do not see myself ever buying a CD player again, the Ikemi certainly was, and still is, an outstanding player. An integrated player, with a huge fan base, and an increasing resale value, I really enjoyed owning this HDCD and red book CD player. I only replaced it with another Linn player, a 2.1 Unidisk, when I thought it would be a good idea to try DVD-A and SACD, which ultimately gave way to streaming. I can understand why some enthusiasts see the Ikemi as being a last-buy CD player. A great piece of kit in my opinion.
John.
Being blunt. No really? Lol
I've never liked any Linn CD Player's or digital replay. Naim works for me as does Audiolab (Pre-Sale), as does Marantz as does.
Their turntables on the other hand is a different ball game but I guess I'd get told off for tht one for going off topic lol
Naim cd5 or exposure or rega planet.
Actually thinking about it, the Naim CD3 was pretty good and can be had for around £3-400 max :)
John R Leddy
07-08-2013, 20:16
Good point John but I'm afraid the CDI or CDS would eat it for breakfast!
Paul,
I was a great fan of Naim Audio in the chrome bumper and olive days and went to purchase a new CDI / 82 / 180.
An hour later I could buy anything I wanted, from anywhere in the world, and at any cost, with the proviso I swore never to support the dealer or Naim Audio.
To this day, I simply refuse to consider anything manufactured by Naim Audio as a potential purchase, and to be honest life has been just fine without them, and I certainly do not feel I have missed out in any way whatsoever.
Naim Audio finally lost all credibility in my eyes with the introduction of their silly mains cable.
John.
Paul,
I was a great fan of Naim Audio in the chrome bumper and olive days and went to purchase a new CDI / 82 / 180.
An hour later I could buy anything I wanted, from anywhere in the world, and at any cost, with the proviso I swore never to support the dealer or Naim Audio.
To this day, I simply refuse to consider anything manufactured by Naim Audio as a potential purchase, and to be honest life has been just fine without them, and I certainly do not feel I have missed out in any way whatsoever.
Naim Audio finally lost all credibility in my eyes with the introduction of their silly mains cable.
John.
Fair enough John and not far from my opinion of Linn and Linn dealers but here ho
Good point John but I'm afraid the CDI or CDS would eat it for breakfast!
The CDI might, but a CDS mk1 was hopelessly coloured and artificial sounding, even though it has cult status... The Ikemi is a bit two dimensional I found and not as good in this area as the KarikIII/NumerikIII we had to compare it with, although it does reproduce reverb nicely. perhaps the 'Silver' Linn interconnect sorts it for true 3-D, but since few cheaper Linn systems do this it probably didn't matter..
The CDI might, but a CDS mk1 was hopelessly coloured and artificial sounding, even though it has cult status... The Ikemi is a bit two dimensional I found and not as good in this area as the KarikIII/NumerikIII we had to compare it with, although it does reproduce reverb nicely. perhaps the 'Silver' Linn interconnect sorts it for true 3-D, but since few cheaper Linn systems do this it probably didn't matter..
Really the CDI was entirely conceived and based on the CDS (1). The CDSII was somewhat of a let down!
Stu
How does this one look for an exposure cd player? would one be recommended?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Exposure-CD-Player-2010-S2-/321180333467?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item4ac7d6f59b
Naim cd5 or exposure or rega planet.
That's the right vintage and definitely worth a punt!!
P.S. The OP will hate me for this, but I'd look at alternative speakers. The CM2's are dry and rather tight a*sed at the very least in tone, with a sligt screech in the upper mid to crossover point in my admittedly limited experience of them. i really think music would be better served by, say, some good used Spendor S6e's, which you should be able to get for well under a grand by now... Smooth, clear and no stodge, these should sort the harshness out and allow more of the source to come through, as would the replacement A6r (I think it's called).
P.S. The OP will hate me for this, but I'd look at alternative speakers. The CM2's are dry and rather tight a*sed at the very least in tone, with a sligt screech in the upper mid to crossover point in my admittedly limited experience of them. i really think music would be better served by, say, some good used Spendor S6e's, which you should be able to get for well under a grand by now... Smooth, clear and no stodge, these should sort the harshness out and allow more of the source to come through, as would the replacement A6r (I think it's called).
How do Spendors compare to Epos ES14s?
Never heard the mk2 version.
Heard the 2010 with same amp into vandersteens many years ago and really liked the sound.
Stu
How does this one look for an exposure cd player? would one be recommended?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Exposure-CD-Player-2010-S2-/321180333467?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item4ac7d6f59b
Never heard the mk2 version.
Heard the 2010 with same amp into vandersteens many years ago and really liked the sound.
Stu,
I'd suspect the mk2 should be better even than the 2010 :)
Less of a nasal 'eh' quality that comes through on some samples (a possible box issue I believe), more extended bass and a whole half octave or so over ES14's used without bungs, which honk at 80Hz if used this way and a delightful tweeter, that is only heard if there's treble there. The ES14 is a twenty five year old design now and Robin was prevented from taking it further - and he learned a lot in this time about simple speakers unladen with complex crossovers.
The Spendor S series was beautifully and expensively presented, using good drive units and well specified crossovers. The Se models tightened the bass further, but to call them 'bright' sounding would do them a diservice IMO. Had I not inherited my tatty old BC2's and had them done up, the S6 or S8 would have been on my shopping list since Harbeth, even at trade prices, is way beyond me now :)
Andrew B
07-08-2013, 20:46
I must admit to being completely clueless when it comes to Exposure CD players. I'm sure others here will know more.
I'm not sure if he frequents here, but a guy called Cliff, ("cliffyboy" on PFM) is a real Exposure buff. He's also a gent and very willing to share his extensive knowledge. If you ever draw a blank here, it might be worth seeking him out.
Less of a nasal 'eh' quality that comes through on some samples (a possible box issue I believe), more extended bass and a whole half octave or so over ES14's used without bungs, which honk at 80Hz if used this way and a delightful tweeter, that is only heard if there's treble there. The ES14 is a twenty five year old design now and Robin was prevented from taking it further - and he learned a lot in this time about simple speakers unladen with complex crossovers.
The Spendor S series was beautifully and expensively presented, using good drive units and well specified crossovers. The Se models tightened the bass further, but to call them 'bright' sounding would do them a diservice IMO. Had I not inherited my tatty old BC2's and had them done up, the S6 or S8 would have been on my shopping list since Harbeth, even at trade prices, is way beyond me now :)
Interesting. I'm confused about the 80Hz though. I can assure you with my amp combos they are going a darn sight deeper than that, but, I'd quite like a bit more space :)
Andrew B
07-08-2013, 21:00
I've never heard the Spendors but I did have a pair of ES14s about a year ago. I still find them an evergreen design and they sounded better than I remembered, which surprised me. They benefit from being an essentially crossover-less design.
I've had a few pairs in different homes over the years and I did experience the honk problem in my first home, if used without bungs. I always preferred them with the bungs in though.
They often sell for as little as £150 with stands, so they are wallet-friendly. Oh, and if you ever see a pair of Epos with Origin Live stands, snap them up! They look "unusual" but boy are they good! The biggest difference I've heard from changing stands.
If you can afford to go higher, albeit not perhaps as high as the Spendors, you might like Naim SBLs. i love the things, but not everyone does :) £400 should get you a decent black pair. Walnut fetch more usually. Mk1 or mk2? Have a listen. I like both.
John R Leddy
07-08-2013, 21:03
Being blunt. No really? Lol
I've never liked any Linn CD Player's or digital replay. Naim works for me as does Audiolab (Pre-Sale), as does Marantz as does.
Their turntables on the other hand is a different ball game but I guess I'd get told off for tht one for going off topic lol
Paul,
Having owned an 8000CDM and 8000DAC myself, I honestly believe you need to reassess their comparison with any Naim CD player. The wonderfully enthusiastic and overblown American presentation of olive Naim CD players, surely cannot bear comparison with their similarly aged Audiolab counterparts. Audiolab products sound so different this is simply an insult to Naim.
Likewise, whilst acknowledging your preferences, there are some who think Linn's LP12 was from the very beginning, and still is to this day, the biggest load of overrated garbage ever made; and yet find it easy to accept Linn's digital components as being the company's best ever manufactured products.
John.
Dave
Actually the OP agrees ;)
The CM2s are on the sale board now, Ushers are on the way by post. Its a midlife crisis i guess, its all got to go!
You are right about the CM2s - for me they were too sharp, generally im sensitive to listening fatique (always was),i kept these speakers too long for my tastes.
I have been looking at the spendors - and if i can get a chance at a good pair they will be part of the bake off!
Here is an S6 for 300 GBP! But its a bit beat up...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Spendor-S6e-Speakers-Home-Audio-Floor-Standing-8-Ohms-Rare-/141026244795?pt=UK_AudioVideoElectronics_HomeAudio HiFi_HiFiSpeakers&hash=item20d5d1b8bb
Thanks for the advice!
P.S. The OP will hate me for this, but I'd look at alternative speakers. The CM2's are dry and rather tight a*sed at the very least in tone, with a sligt screech in the upper mid to crossover point in my admittedly limited experience of them. i really think music would be better served by, say, some good used Spendor S6e's, which you should be able to get for well under a grand by now... Smooth, clear and no stodge, these should sort the harshness out and allow more of the source to come through, as would the replacement A6r (I think it's called).
might like Naim SBLs. i love the things, but not everyone does :) £400 should get you a decent black pair. Walnut fetch more usually. Mk1 or mk2? Have a listen. I like both.
Sorry Andrew, can't agree with you on this one. Naim speaker are utter tripe!
Paul,
Having owned an 8000CDM and 8000DAC myself, I honestly believe you need to reassess their comparison with any Naim CD player. The wonderfully enthusiastic and overblown American presentation of olive Naim CD players, surely cannot bear comparison with their similarly aged Audiolab counterparts. Audiolab products sound so different this is simply an insult to Naim.
Likewise, whilst acknowledging your preferences, there are some who think Linn's LP12 was from the very beginning, and still is to this day, the biggest load of overrated garbage ever made; and yet find it easy to accept Linn's digital components as being the company's best ever manufactured products.
John.
John,
Can't agree with you. The Audiolab combo you mention is good but not a patch on the CDI.
I also agree about Linn LP12 but I suppose it's all about personal taste. I don't like Techies but I know there are many a person on here who'd kick me for that!
John R Leddy
07-08-2013, 21:45
John,
Can't agree with you. The Audiolab combo you mention is good but not a patch on the CDI.
That is what I just said Paul.
I enjoyed listening to Naim CD players, and did not like Audiolab players one bit. So much so, I suggested a reassessment on your part; Audiolab and Naim in the same breath or sentence, so to speak.
I also agree about Linn LP12 but I suppose it's all about personal taste. I don't like Techies but I know there are many a person on here who'd kick me for that!
I do not understand the Technics following either. Most people I knew went with Thorens, and would not dream of buying gaudy DJ equipment.
John.
I replaced my beautiful Thorens TD160mkII with a Technics SL1210 John. Why? Because even in standard form the Techie outperformed the TD160 considerably with the same arm and cart fitted. Now it has been mildly fettled that gap is even greater ;)
http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af316/Sgtgrash/Hifi%20Stuff/IMAG0074.jpg (http://s1019.photobucket.com/user/Sgtgrash/media/Hifi%20Stuff/IMAG0074.jpg.html)http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af316/Sgtgrash/Hifi%20Stuff/AoSComp1-1.jpg (http://s1019.photobucket.com/user/Sgtgrash/media/Hifi%20Stuff/AoSComp1-1.jpg.html)
I've actually got one of these (717) in the bedroom as a DVD player. Lovely thing. It was just far too relaxed as a CD player but I've never even thought of trying it as a transport. Thanks or the tip.
I got it when I went with a mate to buy an amp. The seller just gave it to my mate free gratis because he'd got a new one! I offered my mate twenty quid and it was mine. It's such a beauty, I really hope it is good as a transport :)
Hopefully we'll get to hear your report of using it as a transport!
John R Leddy
07-08-2013, 22:37
The CDI might, but a CDS mk1 was hopelessly coloured and artificial sounding, even though it has cult status... The Ikemi is a bit two dimensional I found and not as good in this area as the KarikIII/NumerikIII we had to compare it with, although it does reproduce reverb nicely. perhaps the 'Silver' Linn interconnect sorts it for true 3-D, but since few cheaper Linn systems do this it probably didn't matter..
Dave,
Ikemi vs Karik-Numerik preferences seem to be accommodated within Linn circles without any great animosity, being readily accepted as a personal choice. Never understood pairing a 20-bit Numerik with a 24-bit Ikemi though. I was lucky enough to hear both players prior to purchase, and chose the Ikemi on the day.
I have owned both Black and Silver Linn Interconnect Cables and preferred the fit of the Black connectors. Not as terrifying a fit as the connectors used on Denis Morecroft's cables, but tight enough.
There have been wild claims of owners fitting one pair of Linn Silver Interconnect Cables between their source component and pre-amplifier, and this somehow being responsible for improving the quality of the thousands of components which followed in line to their loudspeakers.
Truth be known, Linn Silver Interconnect Cables were manufactured to match the silver anodised coating on Linn's Klimax components, not to outperform their Black Interconnect Cables, and as such, they do not.
John.
Does the home team like any of these?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-DCD-610-CD-Player-Boxed-with-Remote-Manual-Leads-MINT-/111134410910?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item19e020889e
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rotel-RCD-965BX-CD-Player-/370868707663?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item56597f614f
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-DCD-1100-CD-Player-/130962561704?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item1e7dfa1aa8
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Marantz-CD-63SE-Special-Edition-CD-player-/200948960070?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item2ec97dcb46
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/B-O-Bang-Olufsen-Beogram-CD6500-CD-Player-/130963587851?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item1e7e09c30b
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CAMBRIDGE-AUDIO-AZUR-550C-CD-PLAYER-/181190505574?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item2a2fcbb466
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pioneer-DV-646A-DVD-Player-/281147564272?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_Video_DVDPla yers_Recorders&hash=item4175b360f0
andhere is a 737.. not cheap though considering the age..
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PIONEER-DV-737-DVD-PLAYER-CD-TRANSPORT-/121154149956?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item1c35599e44
Im still waiting on the Exposure one for the mo, but if you have any great things to say about these, please do! :)
John R Leddy
07-08-2013, 23:06
I replaced my beautiful Thorens TD160mkII with a Technics SL1210 John. Why? Because even in standard form the Techie outperformed the TD160 considerably with the same arm and cart fitted. Now it has been mildly fettled that gap is even greater. ;)
Cannot argue with that Dave.
I never travelled very far along the turntable chain before changing over to CD replay.
It is such a long time ago for my memory, but I seem to remember the magazines having me think Pink Triangle would be the way to go.
As I say, it was a long time ago, so do not hold me to that.
As a matter of interest though, in your opinion, how would a PTA compare to an SL1210 or TD160?
In fact, it would be good to know where a PTA appears in the scheme of things today.
John.
Andrew B
07-08-2013, 23:13
Does the home team like any of these?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-DCD-610-CD-Player-Boxed-with-Remote-Manual-Leads-MINT-/111134410910?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item19e020889e
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rotel-RCD-965BX-CD-Player-/370868707663?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item56597f614f
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Denon-DCD-1100-CD-Player-/130962561704?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item1e7dfa1aa8
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Marantz-CD-63SE-Special-Edition-CD-player-/200948960070?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item2ec97dcb46
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/B-O-Bang-Olufsen-Beogram-CD6500-CD-Player-/130963587851?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item1e7e09c30b
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CAMBRIDGE-AUDIO-AZUR-550C-CD-PLAYER-/181190505574?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item2a2fcbb466
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pioneer-DV-646A-DVD-Player-/281147564272?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_Video_DVDPla yers_Recorders&hash=item4175b360f0
andhere is a 737.. not cheap though considering the age..
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PIONEER-DV-737-DVD-PLAYER-CD-TRANSPORT-/121154149956?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item1c35599e44
Im still waiting on the Exposure one for the mo, but if you have any great things to say about these, please do! :)
There seem to be a few fans of the Rotel in hifi circles. I had one a long time ago, but only briefly and I can't remember much about it. There's one for sale on here I think. Shane (Southall 1998) is selling it.
I've had one or two Denons over the years. 1520 was probably the best. Great as a transport too. Not sure if it would still hold up today, but I'd bet it probably would.
southall-1998
08-08-2013, 01:06
Yup, I'm selling a nice Rotel RCD-965BX in very good condition. The one on ebay looks scorned to my eyes !!
Anyway, I like the Meridian 206 CD Player, very musical communicative sounding machine. At the moment I'm using a Sony BDP-S1E as a CD Player and sounds very good to my ears!!!
walpurgis
08-08-2013, 09:20
I never travelled very far along the turntable chain before changing over to CD replay.
Perhaps further investigation would have brought satisfactory results.
I must say, I've generally been happy with the results I get from vinyl (apart from when I had an Ittok), but it took me years to find a CD setup that did music right.
machtman
08-08-2013, 10:12
I went through a major upgrade cycle a couple of years ago, which ended up with me selling my tuned Chinese MHZS CD88 CD transport because it sounded so much worse then the sound I was getting from a Linn Renew DS. With time I also kept suffering from listening fatigue and shifted back to vinyl which remains my primary music source and a continuous joy.
However, I do have many ripped CDs and downloaded files that are not available on vinyl and have continued to use the Renew on occasion, and have also tried to improve the sound. For those who don't know, this has an inbuilt DAC and yields 2V RMS output. As a result, a preamp only acts as an attenuator. I've tried using a TVC-based passive, which improved the sound over my prior Klyne preamp and have now shifted to a DIY valve (5687) based active pre, which improved the sound even more even though I only need attenuation. Putting the Renew on isolation supports (Gingko Audio cloud) helped and changing to some new Yannis Tome interconnects has resulted in further improvements. I still prefer vinyl but no longer by the enormous margin as before. There is still a trace of listening fatigue after longer time periods on some tracks of Alison Krauss New Favorite, which can be extremely grating when components don't match well but depending on the day I can also find those grating on vinyl.
The MHZS CD88 was the best sounding CD transport in a chain of various brands I owned over about 15 years. However, it still sounded fairly dead compared to even lower quality streamers I tried before settling on the Renew. I have heard from HiFi dealers that CD transports can sound as good as vinyl but the prices for those are comparable to the prices for high end streamers. So I wonder just how good some of the recommended CD transports in this thread really are.
Sorry John, I clearly misread your post! Clearly we do agree on some things :) my point really was that the Audiolab isn't bad but nowhere near as good as the Naim!
Yup, I'm selling a nice Rotel RCD-965BX in very good condition. The one on ebay looks scorned to my eyes !!
Anyway, I like the Meridian 206 CD Player, very musical communicative sounding machine. At the moment I'm using a Sony BDP-S1E as a CD Player and sounds very good to my ears!!!
I'd for for Shane's Rotel as a starter-for-ten and then let the new speakers and amp bed in... Once your happy and maybe want a little more think about something a little more up market!
John R Leddy
08-08-2013, 11:24
Perhaps further investigation would have brought satisfactory results.
I must say, I've generally been happy with the results I get from vinyl (apart from when I had an Ittok), but it took me years to find a CD setup that did music right.
Geoff,
It is all relative, and the route would still have been the same:
Turntable to CD Player to Network Player.
Each player has their pros and cons.
I embraced the new technology for its potential improvements, and did not allow myself to get bogged down with its limitations during development.
It is far too easy to allow these trinkets to possess more importance than they really deserve.
I simply see renderers as tools for audio reproduction; nothing more, nothing less.
Whilst respecting another's choice to allocate gender to these inanimate objects and allowing them to become representative of achievement and personality, I am just so much not that guy!
I am a great respecter of deeds and works rather than petty ownership, and see myself as living proof that any old fool can have an opinion!
I am genuinely happy for people enjoying their hi-fi systems and try my best not to fractionalise our ever decreasing numbers.
However, clinging to the past and travelling backwards are two very different sets of circumstances.
Nothing even remotely sinister in this opinion, and no hidden agenda either.
John.
Geoff,
It is all relative, and the route would still have been the same:
Turntable to CD Player to Network Player.
Each player has their pros and cons.
I embraced the new technology for its potential improvements, and did not allow myself to get bogged down with its limitations during development.
It is far too easy to allow these trinkets to possess more importance than they really deserve.
I simply see renderers as tools for audio reproduction; nothing more, nothing less.
Whilst respecting another's choice to allocate gender to these inanimate objects and allowing them to become representative of achievement and personality, I am just so much not that guy!
I am a great respecter of deeds and works rather than petty ownership, and see myself as living proof that any old fool can have an opinion!
I am genuinely happy for people enjoying their hi-fi systems and try my best not to fractionalise our ever decreasing numbers.
However, clinging to the past and travelling backwards are two very different sets of circumstances.
Nothing even remotely sinister in this opinion, and no hidden agenda either.
John.
Great post John!
Sorry John, I clearly misread your post! Clearly we do agree on some things :) my point really was that the Audiolab isn't bad but nowhere near as good as the Naim!
Paul, where the FCUK do you get your opinions from?????? You've obviously never heard the Audiolab range, especially the UK made ones from LX to Q/M's, and obviously haven't heard where Naim are these days, with their band limited punchbag PA presentation - all mid bass to grainy treble with little proper depth perspective, which is better than the harsh and fatiguing mid level CB models (I'm excluding the CB135's and Nait 1 as these were exceptions when new at any rate). Your old Farlowe era Exposure amps weren't regarded as being as good at the time, because they sounded different, but I reckon they were actually better..
John R Leddy
08-08-2013, 13:08
Sorry John, I clearly misread your post! Clearly we do agree on some things :) my point really was that the Audiolab isn't bad but nowhere near as good as the Naim!
Paul,
Agreed, though I notice Dave has expressed strong feelings to the contrary.
Here are a couple of observations I made during my time owing:
Audiolab 8000CDM > Audiolab 8000DAC > Audiolab 8000S > Monitor Audio (long forgotten model of floorstanders).
I am guessing you already know I am not a cable enthusiast, but for those who are:
Bugger! (Cannot remember. Who had top of the range interconnect cables with the model designation "Reference III" and a rust-brown coloured sheath?) and loudspeaker cables were Rotel Supra 4 (4mm sq with over a thousand stands of copper in each side of the cable).
Anyway, my friends and I all experienced "the grass is always greener," for the want of a better description.
I really enjoyed listening to their olive Naim systems.
Similarly, one of my pals on first hearing my Audiolab system immediately stated, "I want one!" We all laughed, but lo and behold did he not go out and purchase his very first CD player and replace his record deck.
Hi-Fi Twit magazine could not heap enough praise upon Audiolab equipment at the time, but I could not live with it. The system was way too shrill for my tastes.
I now know I prefer a Bryston type of sound presentation which allows, for me anyway, agreement with Dave's thoughts on Naim Audio products. Thinking of Bryston's 20-year warranty period always makes me chuckle. Simple things please simple minds, I guess.
As a people, we Brits certainly seem to punish ourselves and each other with the strength of our beliefs and convictions.
Definitely nothing wrong with a bit of passion in my opinion, but this whole dualistic good or bad and right or wrong proselytisation appears to generate more confusion rather than solutions to our enquiries.
I plead guilty m'lord.
John.
MikeMusic
08-08-2013, 14:22
There must be better CD Players out there than my NAD C541?
So im asking - what are your favorite CD players? What would you buy again? What do you wish you had not sold?
I looking for something that can 1)feed a DAC, and 2) have low jitter/listening fatigue since i have been suffering from that lately...
You ask, what will it go with? An Exposure XXV and Ushers X708 are on the way.
Thanks for your ideas!!
There's a Rega Isis on Ebay right now
John R Leddy
08-08-2013, 14:47
I went through a major upgrade cycle a couple of years ago, which ended up with me selling my tuned Chinese MHZS CD88 CD transport because it sounded so much worse then the sound I was getting from a Linn Renew DS. With time I also kept suffering from listening fatigue and shifted back to vinyl which remains my primary music source and a continuous joy.
However, I do have many ripped CDs and downloaded files that are not available on vinyl and have continued to use the Renew on occasion, and have also tried to improve the sound. For those who don't know, this has an inbuilt DAC and yields 2V RMS output. As a result, a preamp only acts as an attenuator. I've tried using a TVC-based passive, which improved the sound over my prior Klyne preamp and have now shifted to a DIY valve (5687) based active pre, which improved the sound even more even though I only need attenuation. Putting the Renew on isolation supports (Gingko Audio cloud) helped and changing to some new Yannis Tome interconnects has resulted in further improvements. I still prefer vinyl but no longer by the enormous margin as before. There is still a trace of listening fatigue after longer time periods on some tracks of Alison Krauss New Favorite, which can be extremely grating when components don't match well but depending on the day I can also find those grating on vinyl.
The MHZS CD88 was the best sounding CD transport in a chain of various brands I owned over about 15 years. However, it still sounded fairly dead compared to even lower quality streamers I tried before settling on the Renew. I have heard from HiFi dealers that CD transports can sound as good as vinyl but the prices for those are comparable to the prices for high end streamers. So I wonder just how good some of the recommended CD transports in this thread really are.
Mark,
If you had your time again, and without wishing to know anything of your personal business or circumstances, would you really spend Linn Renew money on a streamer? Tell you why. I have £2K in my hi-fi stash at the moment, and I still could not bring myself to buy a Cyrus streamer at this stage in streaming development. Maybe I am being too cautious, or perhaps I am just too plain miserable; the second reason probably.
Active and passive pre-amplification seems to illustrate a priority for subjective preference over objective requirement. For some reason I always thought, and still do, the pre-amplifier deserved the greatest expenditure. This was in the face of the loudspeaker brigade, and the source-first characters who followed. I really have no idea where I got this from, but I adopted the idea from someone along the way. Drop a good ARC or BAT valve pre-amplifier into just about any system, and it is as if you never really knew the capabilities of your source component and loudspeakers.
While I can see a poorly designed or indifferently manufactured component being effected by cabling, surely this does not include the likes of Linn's Renew DS? Maybe no amount of billet aluminium can make up for those cheap and nasty surface mount devices? Hmm, that came out wrong, but I will leave it in anyway as I am not intentionally being rude, no matter how it sounds. No cable trolls please; at some point the quality of player must, at least I hope so, overcome any effects of what is a simple connection or extension of the PCBs within two components. I wonder how much money we need to spend to achieve this?
The CD player recommendations in this thread are suggestions to achieve an improvement over Stuart's current NAD C541, and I am guessing he would prefer it if we did not set his debit card on fire! He more than likely has plans for streaming as well as, rather than instead of, CD replay.
All the best,
John.
Mark,
If you had your time again, and without wishing to know anything of your personal business or circumstances, would you really spend Linn Renew money on a streamer? Tell you why. I have £2K in my hi-fi stash at the moment, and I still could not bring myself to buy a Cyrus streamer at this stage in streaming development. Maybe I am being too cautious, or perhaps I am just too plain miserable; the second reason probably.
Active and passive pre-amplification seems to illustrate a priority for subjective preference over objective requirement. For some reason I always thought, and still do, the pre-amplifier deserved the greatest expenditure. This was in the face of the loudspeaker brigade, and the source-first characters who followed. I really have no idea where I got this from, but I adopted the idea from someone along the way. Drop a good ARC or BAT valve pre-amplifier into just about any system, and it is as if you never really knew the capabilities of your source component and loudspeakers.
While I can see a poorly designed or indifferently manufactured component being effected by cabling, surely this does not include the likes of Linn's Renew DS? Maybe no amount of billet aluminium can make up for those cheap and nasty surface mount devices? Hmm, that came out wrong, but I will leave it in anyway as I am not intentionally being rude, no matter how it sounds. No cable trolls please; at some point the quality of player must, at least I hope so, overcome any effects of what is a simple connection or extension of the PCBs within two components. I wonder how much money we need to spend to achieve this?
The CD player recommendations in this thread are suggestions to achieve an improvement over Stuart's current NAD C541, and I am guessing he would prefer it if we did not set his debit card on fire! He more than likely has plans for streaming as well as, rather than instead of, CD replay.
All the best,
John.
Whilst I know this was meant for Mark, I thought I'd put my two pence in... If I had the money I'd buy the Naim ND5 XS and that is over a £1000 but wifey would kill me...
There's a Rega Isis on Ebay right now
hmm, just cant spend that on a cd player... maybe one day i can, but not now. Thanks for the heads up though ;)
Mark,
The CD player recommendations in this thread are suggestions to achieve an improvement over Stuart's current NAD C541, and I am guessing he would prefer it if we did not set his debit card on fire! He more than likely has plans for streaming as well as, rather than instead of, CD replay.
All the best,
John.
ah ha! someone who finally understands me! :clapclapclap:
Great post too! :rfl:
And exactly on target John!! I dont want to overspend on the CD - if i could have it all, i would have a 'good source' and a 'great transport' (which means low jitter - if it is available...(not sure it is). And it would be not too expensive since i think there are other things to put the money toward (like speakers and eventually a streamer)
The experiment just now is to minimize/kill the listening fatigue in my system generally, including when using a digital source - if that cant be done for a reasonable price then i will hike back up the vinyl ladder - but not just yet... as i want to 'believe there is fatigue free digital listening out there', and without selling the house to get it ;)
walpurgis
08-08-2013, 17:26
Has anybody mentioned Meridian yet?
Some of the nicest sounding CD players this side of a Wadia. The 506 and 507 (which I use) sound superb, even the now elderly 206 is a very sweet sounding player. Use them as transports and their true ability really shines through. They are lovely units to use and beautifully made.
Has anybody mentioned Meridian yet?
Some of the nicest sounding CD players this side of a Wadia. The 506 and 507 (which I use) sound superb, even the now elderly 206 is a very sweet sounding player. Use them as transports and their true ability really shines through. They are lovely units to use and beautifully made.
Yep, I recommended the 206B, 206 Delta Sigma and 200/203 combo :)
Paul.
walpurgis
08-08-2013, 18:27
Yep, I recommended the 206B, 206 Delta Sigma and 200/203 combo :) Paul.
Ah well, I wasn't about to read six pages of posts to check.
At their current used prices the Meridians are amazing value soundwise. When I bought my 507 from Acoustic Arts in High Wycombe about ten years ago, it was the best sounding player they had (damn well ought to be good, £1250 back then) and I heard it against the then top of the range Cyrus and Arcam players and it wiped the floor with them.
I'm not surprised Geoff, they're in a completely different league :)
walpurgis
08-08-2013, 18:39
I'm not surprised Geoff, they're in a completely different league :)
Maybe, but the prices were not far apart. I think the Cyrus was about £950 and the Arcam £1100.
machtman
08-08-2013, 19:07
Mark,
If you had your time again, and without wishing to know anything of your personal business or circumstances, would you really spend Linn Renew money on a streamer? Tell you why. I have £2K in my hi-fi stash at the moment, and I still could not bring myself to buy a Cyrus streamer at this stage in streaming development. Maybe I am being too cautious, or perhaps I am just too plain miserable; the second reason probably.
Given a choice of the CD players I had and streaming, I would definitely go for streaming today. The sound is so much better. But more important, I have all my old CDs ripped and stored as FLAC with a WAV backup on a NAS. This is silent and uses little electricity and is on all the time except 24:00-08:00 when both of us are asleep. I choose music to stream with a DLNA control point on any of my iPod, iPhone or iPad. This lets me search for the music I want, set up Playlists and never have to leave my chair. In contrast, I could never readily find more than a very few CDs and had more or less given up listening to music in the 5 years before I started streaming. So CD vs. streamer is not listening versus a couple of hours per day or more, which is what I've gotten back to.
Would I buy a Renew again? In my current abysmal state of ignorance I would, but only because I'm not willing to buy a Klimax 1, which costs four times as much. I started trying to listen with cheaper streamers about 3 years ago. My first was a WD HD, which I use to stream to the kitchen. Limited to 96 KHz. Lousy DLNA. i tried a Dune, which I now use for streaming ripped DVDs to the TV. Also lousy DLNA interface. I then tried a Popcorn Hour, which was better but still lousy DLNA. I sold that and bit the bullet and bought a Linn Sneaky with a Rega DAC. the DAC had a minor glitch at 176 KHz but otherwise was great and sounded better than the internal DAC in the Sneaky. And then after poring over the Linn forum, I bit the bullet, bought a Renew (3400 GBP) when they became available. It sounds much more musical than the Sneaky. (For the non-aficionados, a Renew is a reboxed Linn Klimax 0, which was their top of the line streamer till they brought out the Klimax 1). And although I still dislike MP3, the SQ differences between Spotify/MP3, 44 KHz 16 bit (CD), 96 KHz 24 bit, and 192 KHz 24 bit are not as dramatic as they used to be.
I haven't compared the Renew with other people's favorites such as a Touch, and would be very enthused if anybody who wanted to make comparisons visited me with their streamer and DAC here in Warwickshire. But I have heard a Klimax 1 with top of the line Linn gear and a Touch with HiEnd gear at friends houses and much preferred the sound of the Renew to the remembered sound of the Touch, and couldn't decide whether I preferred the Klimax 1 or the Renew because the whole systems were so different. And I have heard an AudioNote CD transport at a dealer's which blew me away so much that I could conceive of wanting one.
If anybody is interested I can also comment on cables, supports etc. but this answer is already too long.
Mark
John R Leddy
08-08-2013, 21:47
.
Hi Mark,
Sounds like streaming saved the day for you listening to music. I like streaming due to its convenience and ease of use. I can have my music shuffling away in the background like a radio all day if I please, or use my streamer like a CD player if I wish to listen to a particular album. Like you mention, I can also create playlists similar to the days when I recorded various artists cassettes, and of course I can carry a considerable amount of music on the smallest of media players for listening to music on the move or elsewhere. Why people grumble about streaming with this type of convenience and freedom is beyond me. I love it; the best thing since sliced bread, as they say. That, and my music now sounds better than CDs played on my 2.1 Unidisk.
Blimey, you have been busy with streamers. Something I have always wanted to know about Linn DS players; are you able to navigate to Folders on a Twonky server, choose All Tracks, hit Shuffle, and walk away, or must you create a playlist using a third party control application on a tablet? I considered buying a Majik or Akurate DS in the past, but bottled out for fear of the Japs coming along shortly afterwards and outperforming them at less cost.
I have John Coltrane's "Blue Train" (1957) as 24-bit/192kHz FLAC. One of my friends purchased a Wyred 4 Sound DAC-2 (24-bit/192kHz Asynchronous USB 2 DAC), so I sent him the "Blue Train" track from the album in 24-bit/192kHz, with 24-bit/96kHz and 16-bit/44.1kHz versions reduced from the original 24-bit/192kHz track. Neither he nor his pal who was also listening could hear differences between the tracks using his new DAC.
I am not a great worrier myself concerning bit depths and sampling rates, which is a good job really when I consider the rubbish music I listen to. However, if you have tried this experiment on your Linn Renew DS, I for one would be most grateful to be informed of your findings. Does your Renew display the bit depth and sampling rate of the track it is playing?
Glad to hear you prefer your set-up to others you have heard. I am a great believer in an individual system for an individual person, and view with suspicion claims of absolute and universally applicable components for everyone. That said, I am a complete hypocrite when it comes to interconnect cables, as I view their job as being pretty basic with minimal requirements. Denis Morecroft's DNM Reson cables illustrate perfectly the over-engineered and over-priced cables on offer today are not a compulsory requirement for playing music on a hi-fi system.
Look forward to seeing your future posts on cables and streamers.
All the best,
John.
I'm now well over 5 years without a CD player and have been streaming via a PC and or a Squeezebox since. I've spent over £3k on standalone CD players in the past but would never go back to one, much better quality and connivence can be had by going the PC / streaming / NAS route.
Over 2 years without a CDP here and I have never been happier with my music playback, or played as much either :)
machtman
09-08-2013, 07:33
.
Hi Mark,
Sounds like streaming saved the day for you listening to music.
Hi John
Streaming definitely saved the day for me. It exposed me to new music and brought back the fascination that I had when I started in the mid-60s. However, I do listen mostly to vinyl now because it still sounds better. That upgrade path has been even more expensive and more involving and most of what I now buy are records.
Look forward to seeing your future posts on cables and streamers.
John.
I never used to believe that minor tweaks could make a difference until about 10 years ago when I learned that using better mains cables and worrying about their polarity was crucial. (I use Shuko European plugs such that I avoid the additional fuses in the mains plug and can check which polarity gives more depth readily). At the time, my HiFi dealer persuaded me to spend what seemed like a fortune, over 100 Euro for Linn interconnects, which I used and thought I was happy with. After my experiences of the last 3 years, I wouldn't let them into the house. I was also using DIY speaker cables with large dimensions and alloy pyramids as supports on an MDF board on plywood.
Part of the improvements due to streaming were due to changing all of this through extensive comparisons.
Mains cables: I have bought a Black Rhodium 8 gang mains block and Black Rhodium mains cables terminated with Oyaide Shuko-IEC plugs on the recommendation of David Brook from MCRU. The difference to the DIY cables was absolutely dramatic on every device I compared. Stronger and clearer bass, Generally much more musical. I also bought a used Furutech power cable from Germany and am happy with that as well. I wouldn't even think of using a standard cable supplied with a component any more.
Speaker cables: I was using thick electrical wiring and didn't believe that more expensive cables could make a difference. My speakers are far from the amp and I need 5 m cables. On David Brook's recommendations I auditioned high-end Black Rhodium cables, which I disliked because they darkened the music as well as Furutech Reference III cables, which sounded magnificent. I bought the Furutechs (and sold them later). I was also using thick electrical wiring as jumpers to connect the bass and treble drivers on the ProAc Tablette 2000 speakers I was using at the time. Out of curiosity I tried MIT jumpers (which I later returned) and the trebles suddenly came to life. Electrical wiring was blocking the sound! I subsequently shifted to Black Cat Morpheus jumpers from the US which were cheaper and much better. And I later shifted to Black Cat neo-Morpheus speaker cables, which revealed that the Furutechs were muddy and cost a fraction of the price. If I had my choice today, I would probably buy some Yannis Tome silver litz speaker cables but would rather spend the money on vinyl at the moment.
Ethernet cables: This is where most people will stop reading. I tried to get the streaming to work with a WiFi dongle. It worked. No dropouts. Music. No visible wires. But it didn't sound as good as with an ethernet cable from the router.Very clear difference. FWIW Linn also recommends ethernet cables with a network switch just before the streamer. Through researching tweaks on the internet I saw reports from Germany that different ethernet cables could make a difference and I bought a pair of MeiCord cables from Germany. The difference to the standard ethernet cables was day and night, and they brought even more music in. I suspect that this reflects the different ethernet plugs they use rather than anything else but haven't tested that suspicion. I recommended them to David who has now become the UK distributor and has been selling huge numbers of them. My system consists of a QNAP NAS connected by Meicords to a router connected by Meicords to the network switch and connected to the Renew by MeiCords. I suspect the only critical point is the last part between the switch and the Renew but haven't bothered to make the comparisons.
The standard arguments are that TCP/IP has error correction and that cables can't make a difference. However, multiple afficiandos have tried and agree with me that the difference in sound can be highly dramatic. And skeptics are welcome to come visit and hear for themselves.
I'll stop here again but am happy to go on in detail about interconnects and supports if anybody is interested.
Mark
MikeMusic
09-08-2013, 07:46
hmm, just cant spend that on a cd player... maybe one day i can, but not now. Thanks for the heads up though ;)
You'll never have to buy another !
:)
Here is a Meridian, but it does not work...
would it be easy to fix?? Or give it a pass?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/290955788726?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649
Here is a Meridian, but it does not work...
would it be easy to fix?? Or give it a pass?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/290955788726?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649
Personally Stuart I've never liked the 500 series from Meridian preferring the sound of their 200 series!
I'm sure someone on here could provide you with support / guidance reference repairing this one if you decide :)
Andrew B
09-08-2013, 17:51
I really like my Meridian 200/203 but I've heard a few of them previously in other people's systems and never liked them. At home, it's a different story and its been a bit of a lesson for me.
I only bought them because they were on a cheap BIN (£150 the pair) but I'm really happy with them.
Back in the day, I demoed a 203 against a DPA PdM1 series 2 and it was night and day in favour of the DPA. I even bought one. Today I have both of them and the differences are really just presentational. Oddly if forced to choose, I'd probably take the Meridian. Mind you, the Micromega Leader is every bit as good too. I'm puzzled tbh but am just telling it like it is. So I'd have to say I'd happily recommend Meridian based on my ears and my system as they are today. If you can get a 200/203 for £150 it's a steal.
I only bought them because they were on a cheap BIN (£150 the pair) but I'm really happy with them.
£150 - that's stupid cheap. I'd have bitten the person's hand off!!!
Andrew B
09-08-2013, 18:35
The price was really the deciding factor, but I'm sure others will pop up at similar prices if the OP keeps an eye out. Considering the sound, build and aesthetics it's hard to beat, really. Well done to whoever recommended Meridian in this thread.
That were me Andrew :) ... Seriously, if you ever decide to sell that magnificent player, let me know and I'll be on the first train / motorway / plane to get it :)
Andrew B
09-08-2013, 19:01
If I spot another I'll PM you. My mate has had a couple at that price too. To the OP I'd say to consider Micromega too. The Stages can be a bit temperamental, but I had a T Drive and T DAC a home for a bit and really fell for it. Had a Duo as well. Very nice. IMO you are often better scouring the dealer ads for a decent Micromega because their "sexiness" tends to keep prices high on places like EBay. Often dealers can sell cheaper and you get a guarantee.
The CD player I would recommend is not generally on anyone's "hit list".
A few months ago I bought a scruffy Parasound CDP-1000 for just over £30. WOW! What a sound! Smooth and detailed, full of refinement. Knocks spots of a good many exotic (expensive) players and transport/DAC combos that I have owned in the past too. It came without a remote but a universal one does the job nicely after a lot of grief getting the codes.
A really nice example went on ebay a while back complete with remote for less than £60 if memory serves me well.
The CDP-2000 has a top loading belt drive (CEC?) mechanism and sounds even better.
Andrew B
09-08-2013, 19:51
I followed your recommendation and intended to buy the last one on EBay. Sadly I missed the auction end and it went cheaply too, doh!
I've heard/read other people say similar things about it, so I figure it must have a certain something.
If you get hold of one Andrew I'd be interested in your comparison to say the Meridian!
something like this?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MICROMEGA-JUNIOR-CD-Player-with-Tube-Output-Stage-/281147625906?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item4175b451b2
I guess i live in the boonies, as ive neverheard of them....
If I spot another I'll PM you. My mate has had a couple at that price too. To the OP I'd say to consider Micromega too. The Stages can be a bit temperamental, but I had a T Drive and T DAC a home for a bit and really fell for it. Had a Duo as well. Very nice. IMO you are often better scouring the dealer ads for a decent Micromega because their "sexiness" tends to keep prices high on places like EBay. Often dealers can sell cheaper and you get a guarantee.
Andrew et al,
Several of you have mentioned its good to look at used dealers... what dealers to you like? Please share a few links? where shall i look??
I dont have experience with any of them, but ihave 3 links i can share:
http://www.centralaudio.co.uk/index.php
http://www.2ndhandhifi.co.uk/
https://www.emporiumhifi.com/
Andrew B
09-08-2013, 21:12
I've dealt with loads of dealers over the years and it largely depends on what item you want. If its Linn/Naim, I and my friends have had a lot of bargains from the Sound Organisation in York. It it's a Naim CDI you are after, go no further than Tom Tom Audio. They normally sell them for £399 and give a 3 month guarantee. Forums like PFM have a dealer ads section too with many items constantly being updated.
Others I have dealt with successfully are Retro Reproduction and 2nd hand hifi. Audio Gold gave me a stupendous deal on Exposure too, because they don't really deal with the stuff. Amongst other bits, I got a gargantuan 9 (IX) PSU from them for £200! I guess what I'm saying is that it pays to look around and snap up anything that appeals at the right price. Dealers often sell bits on for far less than you'd buy from some unknown person on EBay. You usually get a guarantee too and the item often comes from a trusted customer who has dealt with said dealer for many years. You have to pick the right deals, but it can really reap rewards.
walpurgis
09-08-2013, 21:14
Many dealers have a selection of used Hi-Fi, it's worth phoning around to see what's available.
Steve at Hi-Fi Hangar in Bordon, Hampshire is a friendly chap and keeps a fair stock of interesting bits of kit.
http://www.hifihangar.co.uk/
(I must drop by myself and see what he's got as it goes)
something like this?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MICROMEGA-JUNIOR-CD-Player-with-Tube-Output-Stage-/281147625906?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item4175b451b2
I guess i live in the boonies, as ive neverheard of them....
A good but not great player... If you can get it cheap I'd consider taking a punt. If not walk away, you'll get something better!
I've dealt with loads of dealers over the years and it largely depends on what item you want. If its Linn/Naim, I and my friends have had a lot of bargains from the Sound Organisation in York. It it's a Naim CDI you are after, go no further than Tom Tom Audio. They normally sell them for £399 and give a 3 month guarantee. Forums like PFM have a dealer ads section too with many items constantly being updated.
Others I have dealt with successfully are Retro Reproduction and 2nd hand hifi. Audio Gold gave me a stupendous deal on Exposure too, because they don't really deal with the stuff. Amongst other bits, I got a gargantuan 9 (IX) PSU from them for £200! I guess what I'm saying is that it pays to look around and snap up anything that appeals at the right price. Dealers often sell bits on for far less than you'd buy from some unknown person on EBay. You usually get a guarantee too and the item often comes from a trusted customer who has dealt with said dealer for many years. You have to pick the right deals, but it can really reap rewards.
I'd rate Tom Tom Audio too. My Dad got the majority of his Naim kit there for silly prices and thy are good guys who know there stuff.
there are quite a few marantz KI cds available, all around 160:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_odkw=marantz+cd+player&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR1.TRC0.A0.Xmarantz+c d+player+KI&_nkw=marantz+cd+player+KI&_sacat=0
thanks for the advice!!
there is an exposure cd at audiogold:
http://audiogold.co.uk/products-page/cd-players/exposure-cd-player/
A good but not great player... If you can get it cheap I'd consider taking a punt. If not walk away, you'll get something better!
Not a bad player. I quite like Marantz but they're not everyone's cup of tea. Personally with that Amp and speakers it'd be a good buy but might leave wanting a little more!
take a look at these!
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/290959507460?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649
I would have gladdly bought them, if ship-able... no boxes and only local pickup... they looked nice!
These might be the stands you mentioned too.
I've never heard the Spendors but I did have a pair of ES14s about a year ago. I still find them an evergreen design and they sounded better than I remembered, which surprised me. They benefit from being an essentially crossover-less design.
I've had a few pairs in different homes over the years and I did experience the honk problem in my first home, if used without bungs. I always preferred them with the bungs in though.
They often sell for as little as £150 with stands, so they are wallet-friendly. Oh, and if you ever see a pair of Epos with Origin Live stands, snap them up! They look "unusual" but boy are they good! The biggest difference I've heard from changing stands.
If you can afford to go higher, albeit not perhaps as high as the Spendors, you might like Naim SBLs. i love the things, but not everyone does :) £400 should get you a decent black pair. Walnut fetch more usually. Mk1 or mk2? Have a listen. I like both.
MikeMusic
15-08-2013, 08:00
Andrew et al,
Several of you have mentioned its good to look at used dealers... what dealers to you like? Please share a few links? where shall i look??
I dont have experience with any of them, but ihave 3 links i can share:
http://www.centralaudio.co.uk/index.php
http://www.2ndhandhifi.co.uk/
https://www.emporiumhifi.com/
2ndhandhifi good guys
Don't know the others
There are also deals available from dealers here with demo and trade in models
Anyone know if the drawer sticking is a common fault with the 207 Meridian cd players?
Any how to fix it?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Meridian-207-CD-Player-Meridian-209-Master-Control-/380696417132?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiF i_CDPlayerSeparates&hash=item58a346536c#viTabs_0
walpurgis
16-08-2013, 23:09
The 206 and 207 players are a bit slow closing and opening, but they don't usually stick. Sounds like the tray mechanism wants a clean.
Thanks Geoff, Thats encouraging, perhaps its worth a punt! :)
I would like to know from you guys, what's your opinion about Roksan Caspian M2 CD player?
Thanks
southall-1998
18-08-2013, 13:34
I would like to know from you guys, what's your opinion about Roksan Caspian M2 CD player?
Thanks
I think your best starting your own thread on that!!
Thanks Geoff, Thats encouraging, perhaps its worth a punt! :)
Stuart, might be worth it :)
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