Pink Triangle Integral Amp wanted [Archive]

Oldpinkman

10-07-2013, 06:36

Bit of a long shot this - but if you don't ask...

Does anybody know anybody with a PT integral? Especially a broken one. Only 12 were made - I can account for 4. 2 of those are broken. The man who designed them cant work out how to open the case to mend his, but I know a man who can :)

Chances are half the other 8 are broken and unmendable "normally" and I am very much in the market for one of those, cos although I could build the power amp (who am I kidding, I could ask Owen to build the power amp), I fancy the pretty case (Ok Ok Mrs S fancies the pretty case). Here's hoping;)

A picture to remind you in case (and you are forgiven for this) you don't know what I'm talking about

Must sort out one of these web photo site jobbies so I can put big pictures in my posts.... (I'm an accountant remember, not IT consultant, graphic designer, product photo professional - nor Funks marketing department:ner:)

Audioman

10-07-2013, 09:01

There was an integrated amp and CD player under the PT brand. I think this is the later revived company though and different to the model you are talking about? I'm sure these bombed with the resulting end of PT. They also produced an updated DAC board for the Dacapo.

Oldpinkman

10-07-2013, 09:37

Interesting. I've been catching up on my history. Immediately prior to the final demise of Pink they launched this Integral and a revised DaCapo 2. Integral was a an integrated amp (although I am using it just as a poweramp, since it has no phono stage, and the PIP is such an awesome preamp. I've just come off the phone from talking to Owen the designer of Pip, Pip 2 and the power amp in Integral, so I know a bit more now - although he still just chuckles when I ask "why does it sound like a valve amp")

Integral made 12 units only. DaCapo 2, which I have seen, and has the same styling as this Integral, I don't believe launched or got reviewed and the unit I saw in Newhaven may be the only one in existence. It's supposed to be even better than DaCapo. I was offered a loan, but I am too busy to review 2 technics, a new arm, a fabulous amp and a bloody Dac before I go on holiday. So I am saving that as a treat for another day.

Integral was basically a power amp designed by Owen Jones with the productionisation, case work, logic circuits, power supply and protection dealt with by others. They forgot to do the protection, so it is easy to blow them if shorting the speaker terminals, and the logic circuits fail. But working, it is a terribly good amp, and I would like to try to pick up a non-runner to get it repaired from the 8 that are not with my friends.

So if you know anyone with one - I have cash waiting.

Jag

10-07-2013, 13:58

I have a Pink Triangle Integral amplifier and absolutely love the sound it makes, more like a powerful valve amp with many subtle layers to the sound but balsy too.

Bought mine a few years ago and was manufactured in 2004 so might be the last one produced, sitting in a box as the logic circuit went funny after a strand of speaker cable touched the other teminal. After trying to find someone to fix the problem and nearly giving up I found a chap who not only fixed the problem but improved the pre-amp section by adding a dedicated separate power supply to it inside the original case.

I have tried to find the matching cd player Dacapo 2 without any luck and will keep an eye open just in case. The Intgral amplifier is a superb sounding unit and I know my friends tried buying it from me making some good offers but it's a thing of beauty to look at but sounds even better. I compared it to my then other system: Naim 52/135's etc and the Integral was more 3 dimensional sounding with suberb midrange, bass etc and plenty of sparkle to the sound but sweet with it.

Keeping mine but if I see another I will let you know, now where can I find the matching Dacapo 2 cd player?

Oldpinkman

10-07-2013, 14:44

So frustrating that these gems didn't survive. AK needs to have other priorities at the minute, but when the time is right, maybe I can get him to relaunch these if Owen and JW will play ball. Exactly matching casework may be a tall order

You have a beautiful amp. I want one. I may have to settle for building the circuit, but that needs Owen to have some time to take his part-finished design and finish it. And he has plans for improving it further, which will be wonderful but one day.

Which leaves me needing something to listen to in the meantime. It is so good, I am even wondering whether I will bother changing speakers now. And nothing should be this good in the rubbish listening room I have

Will keep looking

Firebottle

10-07-2013, 15:30

Audioman

10-07-2013, 15:37

Oldpinkman

10-07-2013, 16:07

Reliability issues aside I read somewhere these failed as they were too expensive for the market at the time. (IIRC about £3K each for amp and CD player). Daft really considering the outrageous prices being asked for hi-end product today. Maybe if they had a Krell badge they would have taken off?

Reliability was so often a PT thing. I think AK has got it now - and offers 3 year warranties. But at the time it would have been hand to mouth, half finished. They still have no protection circuit. And whilst pricing may have been an issue, I think it wasn't. The company was just caught up with by creditors, before the new, very different, product had a chance to get in the market and save them. Ak is pacing himself this time - cos I keep nagging him :)

Oldpinkman

10-07-2013, 16:15

Sounds as if they are stunners.
See if you can find two..............gimee gimee :eyebrows:

As an aside if you do have trouble finding someone to fix things I'd love to. I've only had one thing beat me in 40 years, that was a handheld two way radio - or as they say in France a 'talky walky' :lol:

:cool:Alan

Thanks for the offer Alan. Always good to have friends - and I look forward to joining you in France. PT stuff - oh dear. Beautifully made this time, but as ever with Neil the visual design took precedence over practical service issues. So the Integral has a fabulously engineered case, which appears to be cast as a one piece unit. Not at all obvious how you get at the electronics to service them. At least if we could, the circuit is sufficiently "normal" on this one for you to service it. But I guess Owen would fix it quickly enough if he could get at the boards

The Pip. Don't ask. To be fair to the last guy who had a go, I forgot I had schematics which would have helped him (although not exactly the circuit in my amp). 2 fragile boards mounted one above the other don't help - especially since they are held in place by ribbon cable and a flaky switch board. But then - its a DC armed transconductance device. There is a voltage at the input, and a voltage at the output, but no signal voltage to trace between the 2 - just current. Now I've told you that, you're in with a prayer. Otherwise, like the last guy, you start creating needless bridges on the circuit board. You should have heard Owen mutter when he finally got his hands on it. Good job he's such a good mate.

If, as one day (maybe even in the next 12 months - he's coming round) I can persuade him to get back to hifi audio amp design, I'll count you in :)

Audioman

10-07-2013, 20:39

Reliability was so often a PT thing. I think AK has got it now - and offers 3 year warranties. But at the time it would have been hand to mouth, half finished. They still have no protection circuit. And whilst pricing may have been an issue, I think it wasn't. The company was just caught up with by creditors, before the new, very different, product had a chance to get in the market and save them. Ak is pacing himself this time - cos I keep nagging him :)

I'm sure the amp did get a review and there were adverts for the new amp/cd in magazines, so surprised they were totally stillborn.

rubber duck

10-07-2013, 21:05

I'm sure the amp did get a review and there were adverts for the new amp/cd in magazines, so surprised they were totally stillborn.

http://hometheaterreview.com/pink-triangle-inergral-integrated-amp-reviewed/

Oldpinkman

10-07-2013, 21:25

12 made. 5 accounted for. Im looking for one of the 7...

Frankyc2003

10-07-2013, 21:38

12 made. 5 accounted for. Im looking for one of the 7...

Sounds like something from 'Lords of the Ring'
:lol:

Oldpinkman

10-07-2013, 21:51

My precious gollum gollum :)

Spectral Morn

10-07-2013, 21:56

http://hometheaterreview.com/pink-triangle-inergral-integrated-amp-reviewed/

I think HiFi News reviewed it too if I recall right.

Regards Neil

Oldpinkman

10-07-2013, 22:38

http://home.tele2.at/alohka/pip2.htm

Hifi news reviewed the pip

The Grand Wazoo

10-07-2013, 23:57

I think HiFi News reviewed it too if I recall right.

Regards Neil
I can confirm that you do recall correctly - I've a
copy on a shelf here.

Oldpinkman

11-07-2013, 05:28

I can confirm that you do recall correctly - I've a
copy on a shelf here.

Well, even though i listen with my ears not a reviewers I'd love to see it if you could scan it

Spectral Morn

11-07-2013, 07:07

I can confirm that you do recall correctly - I've a
copy on a shelf here.

I had a wee look last night and was unable to find it, what issue was it Chris?

Regards Neil

The Grand Wazoo

11-07-2013, 07:24

I haven't had a chance to look for it yet - a bit busy at the mo'. Actually a lot busy at the mo'!
But I do know there was one and I almost certainly have it. I may have a chance for a quick look in a second. Otherwise it'll be tonight.

The Grand Wazoo

11-07-2013, 07:52

Here we go chaps:
February 2002: Definitive Test - Pretty in Pink. It's on the front cover and the review was by KK, which is quite funny, because he utterly loathed the PT turntable!
However, after trying it into the usual speaker suspects - LS3/5a's, WATT/Puppies, Scintillas - he loved the Integral. The only weakness he identified was a slightly underdeveloped stage depth.
It doesn't include any test bench results but there is a sidebar on the technical details.

His summary:

At £3995, the Integral is near to the top of the scale in my run of high end integrateds. But because it's worth every penny, it does a number of things.

It serves as a prime British contender in this area; the Musical Fidelity M3 must be sold out by now.
It will sell bucketloads on looks and user-friendliness alone.
It announces the return of Pink Triangle with something so utterly professional, slick, cool and sonically delightful that I still don't quite believe who made it.

Oldpinkman

11-07-2013, 09:16

Thanks Chris

Tell him not to give up his day job for prophecy! It sold less than 10 and the return of Pink Triangle was the return of the liquidator! However, the amp I have in my living room is every bit that good, and I am not at all happy at the prospect of giving it back (although a little happier because my dear old Quad should be back in time for me to stick the Arcam on ebay). And Owen should have done a couple of further mods which he reckons will further improve it. Who knows - might run the Integral close.

Who am I kidding?

Spectral Morn

11-07-2013, 09:52

Here we go chaps:
February 2002: Definitive Test - Pretty in Pink. It's on the front cover and the review was by KK, which is quite funny, because he utterly loathed the PT turntable!
However, after trying it into the usual speaker suspects - LS3/5a's, WATT/Puppies, Scintillas - he loved the Integral. The only weakness he identified was a slightly underdeveloped stage depth.
It doesn't include any test bench results but there is a sidebar on the technical details.

His summary:

Thank Chris I was looking later than that. I remember KK being on a mega integrated quest back in those days (I was more interested in integrated amplifiers back then too, no room for pre-powers though I ened up making room) but he did get it wrong in my opinion re two he reviewed The Pathos Logos and the T+A V10 both of which he gave glowing reviews to, but both had flaws , lack of transparency in the V10 + noisy fan and a very heavy almost soggy bass with the Logos.

I owned both at one time and passed them on fairly quickly because of those flaws, though I do regret parting with the V10 and I still hanker after it but purely because it looks stunning.

The PT amp subject of this thread would interest me but finding one sounds near impossible and I dare say might cost an arm and a leg if one turned up.

Regards Neil

2020000

09-11-2013, 21:33

hi

I have a dacapo II cdp. The original prototype, repaired by audio synthesis and tweaked past the original spec or so the prior owner led me to beleive

Sounded about 5% better than my dacapo DC dac 24 bit but allows you to run direct into a power amp which offers quite a big step up

Open to offers but it wont be cheap!

Regards,

Nick.

WishfulAudio

15-10-2014, 08:18

Hello.
.
Are you still offering for sale the Pink Triangle da Capo 2 DAC?

Thanks

WishfulAudio

Oldpinkman

15-10-2014, 13:36

Blimey

I thought you meant me for a minute. I was sure I hadn't offered a Dacapo anywhere. I didn't think any had made it out of PT - Arthur has the only other one I know of, although presumably Westlake had one once. Definitely hens teeth! Much prettier than the Mk 1 - much, much prettier.

WishfulAudio

19-10-2014, 07:43

Sorry.

I had a PT da Capo I with a battery pack and sent it off for new capacitors and OpAmps. I thought it sounded better than John Westlakes Audiolab M-DAC but it had a problem. Red Hill Audio are offering a recovery service for da Capos with new boards. I am tempted.....

I also bought a new record deck and asked Audio Origami to set it up. He then set up my PT Too with an Alphason arm, this pleased me more.

My son likes the M-DAC so the effort was not wasted.

The last generation of Pink Triangle components seem worth seeking out..

tim_bissell

04-12-2014, 10:37

There's an Integral just popped up on eB*y -- £3K or offers (ouch! I should have gone for the one advertised in Cambridge for £1200 a few years back)

-- Tim

Oldpinkman

04-12-2014, 11:01

There's an Integral just popped up on eB*y -- £3K or offers (ouch! I should have gone for the one advertised in Cambridge for £1200 a few years back)

-- Tim

£3000 is a bit rich for me, when I have another source. Be interesting to see if it sells. It's a paradox - a great amp worth that money, but not a known commodity - so no established market price. If you take the old rule of thumb for 2nd hand kit of that age at about 1/3 original retail then £1000 would be more typical. But, whilst I know Sovereign has an amp he is keen for me to hear, I don't think I've heard better. Just sent Owen an email!

The Barbarian

04-12-2014, 13:31

Rich can i ask what all this PT, PT, PT is about?

2020000

30-05-2016, 12:22

I have a dacapo II dac - does anyone know how many were made?

It sounds exceptional. I have a Chord Hugo right next to it and to me the Dacapo II sounds much better and far superior to the original dacapo

I may keep the hugo as I can use it for portable use as well - if so I am open to offers but they should be well ine xzcess of the original asking price given rarity and performance. I have compared with top DCS setups and the Dacapo II is clearly superior

Spectral Morn

30-05-2016, 13:00

Rush2112

30-05-2016, 18:34

I had DaCapo 24bit, DC and Cardinal back in the day and regarded it at the time as the best I had heard and I had the chance to listen to some seriously expensive gear none of which made me feel it was worth the difference in cost although the Audio Research was a particular favourite. Problems with the DC lead to it being rebuilt in non battery form, quite successfully, I might add then problems with DaCapo meant it was time to say good bye.

Oldpinkman

30-05-2016, 20:01

Da capo II was after my time. I have seen Arthur's. It is built and styled like the integral. And died the same death. If a dozen were made, that is all. It may be "watch this space". Arthur and j westlake were talking seriously at Munich

Rush2112

02-06-2016, 15:03

As a foot note Pink also made the Ordinal a one box DAC my Dad still has his and still sounds dam fine after all these years !

2020000

07-06-2016, 08:32

I have just read only 3 were ever made - so if I have one and Arthur has one who has the other? When I spoke with Westlake he hadn't heard one or that was my impression at least though it was many years ago

WishfulAudio

11-09-2016, 02:29

Rush2112

07-11-2017, 15:01

Hello,

I have a PT PIP2 which does not sound happy. It has been at a repairer in thr East of England for some time and am looking for specialist attention. Is Owen approachable? No urgency but it it an interesting preamplifier and I should not like to lose it.

Thanks

Alistair p.Hi

If you have no luck contact Nigel at Iota Design he is very familiar with all things PT and I am sure will be able to help.

He has done repairs on my Anniversary SE PSU and rebuilt the DC power supply for my DaCapo in the past.

He was a long time dealer of PT products when he owned Chantry Audio in Tuxford.

I can recommend Nigel and his products unreservedly. I own his Signature Balanced Phonostage which is outstanding.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

2020000

24-08-2018, 18:10

How do you get the case lids off? A special tool?

Vrajbasi

01-09-2018, 07:58

I have had lot s of pink bits over the years I owned a Pip 1 and 2 also had full Vishay Version, which was worse sounding and cost me £1000 to get done in 1992, I heard a pop power amp which did sound good. I used to visit audio T west hampstead when Martin Colloms used to work there, it was a fantastic shop as was KJ back then the industry was alive and buzzing. I owned a pink triangle pt too and there was a gentle man john smith who had one two and another John who oakman who owned a alphason sonata the debate was always there which was better. I liked the alphason. I had a Dacapo which was great I loved visiting camberwell, loved talking Alan, Bret Authur etc also remember Trilogy were next door.