mains cable

[johnsteer]

i am looking at mains cable one from mark grant and the other from mains cable r us they are both about £55 but the difference is mcru has furutech iec connector and is cryro treated does anyone have any views which is the better way to go Thanks John

[AlanS]

Both allow free trial so
Try both IF one sounds better.....
If not get your money back

You have to live with them

[Gazjam]

Something to bear in mind too is that brand new mains cables don't have their "final" sound right away?
It can take some time before the cable settles down and sounds as good as it can.

30 days is plenty of time to make your mind up.
Think both MCRU and Mark Grant do home trials.

[Oldpinkman]

Both allow free trial so
Try both IF one sounds better.....
If not get your money back

You have to live with them
Love it ;)

[johnsteer]

thanks for the info i will do just that

[alan47]

Just use the one off your electric kettle,i would be amazed if you can hear a difference,i never have!.:rolleyes:Plus it will have burnt in nicely.

[Mark Grant]

i am looking at mains cable one from mark grant and the other from mains cable r us they are both about £55 but the difference is mcru has furutech iec connector and is cryro treated does anyone have any views which is the better way to go Thanks John

The main difference is that the cable is different on the inside, my cable is a custom build with regards to twists per foot of the conductors and distance of the screening from the conductors. It's not off the reel bought in cable :)

[doodoos]

The main difference is that the cable is different on the inside, my cable is a custom build with regards to twists per foot of the conductors and distance of the screening from the conductors. It's not off the reel bought in cable :)

And very good it is too.

[StanleyB]

Just use the one off your electric kettle,i would be amazed if you can hear a difference,i never have!.:rolleyes:Plus it will have burnt in nicely.
I haven't had much look with the one from the kettle. But the one from the rice cooker is ace.

[chris@panteg]

Dio
And very good it is too.

It is very good !! And is miles better than lap or belden cable which I also have , the best that can be said of these is they work well with my kettle .

[jasonC]

try both and return the one you like less
i bought this guys cable.
i can never tell difference with most cables sound wise but this cable looks the business and is very well made and very cheap.
top guy who sells it and makes it.
he is a brit who live in thailand
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Quality-Mains-Power-Cable-IEC-C13-connector-UK-3-pin-mains-plug-1-5-Metres-/231006312436?pt=UK_Sound_Vision_Other&hash=item35c90c97f4

[Jimbo]

Funny I posted a Mains cable question some time back and received all sorts of interesting comments. In fact the post did generate quite a heated debate and indeed I was sceptical myself. However recently I have purchased a couple of cable from MCR US and found noticably improvements. The cable that gave me the biggest improvement was the No11 (MCRUS) mains cable that I have plugged into my power amp. It was so noticeable that my girlfriend commented on the difference. I wont go it detail what the differences were but they were definitely an improvement and as such have me convinced as to the ability Mains cable can have on sound.

[SquireC]

I tried a few - not the mcrus cable - and I use the Mark Grant's. Excellent cable. Recommended.

[Clive197]

Mains Cable posts have always caused heated discussion between believers and non-believers. In my own case I decided to build my own using SUPRA LoRad 1.5 Mains Cable with a MK Toughplug on one end and a standard Wattgate at the other and much to my surprise soundstage and dynamics improved. Total cost came to £35 for 1m. Have now built 4 and am thinking of building one for my Technics TT, cutting the fixed cable and putting a male/female IEC then the Supra LoRad 1.5 ending on the MK plug. Any thoughts from you Techies?

[AlanS]

Funny I posted a Mains cable question some time back and received all sorts of interesting comments. In fact the post did generate quite a heated debate and indeed I was sceptical myself. However recently I have purchased a couple of cable from MCR US and found noticably improvements. The cable that gave me the biggest improvement was the No11 (MCRUS) mains cable that I have plugged into my power amp. It was so noticeable that my girlfriend commented on the difference. I wont go it detail what the differences were but they were definitely an improvement and as such have me convinced as to the ability Mains cable can have on sound.

I saw a post like yours and bought a No 14 MCRU on spec. Forgot it was there.

[Tarzan]

l myself am a strong mains cable believer ( but do not understand how they work) a case in point is my Nordost Shiva, with correctly mated components can sound superb, but get the matching wrong and oh my god, it can make your ears bleed.

[Jimbo]

The biggest improvements come from screened cable and cable construction, not so sure about plugs,fuses and connectors although they probably all have a bearing on the overall sonic improvements. I was so convinced by the benefits I found I am slowly replacing all my mains cables.

[wee tee cee]

Mains Cable posts have always caused heated discussion between believers and non-believers. In my own case I decided to build my own using SUPRA LoRad 1.5 Mains Cable with a MK Toughplug on one end and a standard Wattgate at the other and much to my surprise soundstage and dynamics improved. Total cost came to £35 for 1m. Have now built 4 and am thinking of building one for my Technics TT, cutting the fixed cable and putting a male/female IEC then the Supra LoRad 1.5 ending on the MK plug. Any thoughts from you Techies?

the supra 2.5 is excellent just a bit like wrestling a python when assembling it, never tried the 1.5 but they're cables are good value for money.....the USB is also very good IMHO.

Cant answer your specific question, but you trust your ears which is the most important fact.......best of luck.
Quite sure the techie guys will be able to help.

[Oldpinkman]

I know I'm going to regret this. What does a mains cable do? It's not like it connects your equipment to the generator. All that mains runs down standard household wiring, to say nothing of the national grid and its substations, before it gets to the bit of wire going from the plug to the bit of kit. How does a mains cable change that?

[Wakefield Turntables]

:sofa: oh dear :doh: This could get really sticky.

[realysm42]

Richard, I don't know the science, but in my experience, it has a large impact on sound quality.

[Oldpinkman]

I don't doubt folk on here are quite genuine, and experience what they experience, but I was scarred way back when by "just listen". Anyone of the believers up for a challenge? I need

A believer, who lives with another adult, and watched blue peter as a child. Blue Peter first. Take some old cereal packets, maybe a washing up liquid bottle with the Advertising hidden by felt pen, and some sticky-backed plastic, and make a construction which can hide the mains cable in question completely.
Get the adult friend to produce a (pseudo) random list of 30 A's and B's. A is "super cable". B is kettle lead.
Listen for a reference day to the super cable and then start the experiment. Every night, the assistant plugs in the appropriate cable according to the list and conceals it. The next day you just listen to your music as normal, and at the end of the day pick "A", "B" or "don't know". After 30 days, when I should have returned bronzed and fit from the South of France, publish your results. If they are anywhere near a good correlation with the actual cables used each day, let me know which cable you use because I'd love to try them. Please don't tell me the effect isn't the same in all situations, and there's something funny about the electricity in Kent, or the way my house is wired.:doh:

I am prepared to be amazed. If its true, the science will be challenging (not for me - I'm too thick - for someone else). But it doesn't need science to remove subjective factors. If its real - it should easily pass that test. If its not - enjoy the illusion!

[John R Leddy]

i am looking at mains cable one from mark grant and the other from mains cable r us they are both about £55 but the difference is mcru has furutech iec connector and is cryro treated does anyone have any views which is the better way to go Thanks John

Hi John,

Current arguments concerning cables possess a similarity to the disagreements in the early '70s, when Ivor Tiefenbrun came along with his cribbed Ariston RD80 turntable and told everyone they were wrong for thinking loudspeakers were the most important component for initial upgrade, and they should buy his Linn LP12 first.

As the hi-fi rags promoted Tiefenbrun's front-end first policy, along with a direct signal path philosophy which no longer accepted balance and tone controls in pre-amplifiers, a whole generation of new purchasers adopted these changes ipso facto, so to speak. I was lucky as I did not believe either party, knowing full well the most important component is the pre-amplifier.

Mains cable only has to be of the correct gauge to avoid overheating due to the current being drawn by the component. All else is of little practical use in our application. That said, if you want a slick cable so be it; it is your hobby and your money. Ultimately you will make up your own mind, in your own time, concerning these things no matter what other people advise.

One thing I will say though, cryogenic treatment is simply sales guff, and along with never really being able to tell if the treatment has actually been carried out, is not required for any part of a high fidelity system. Human nature being what it is, we all wish to become expert in our fields of interest, no matter the hobby. Unfortunately, there are those promoting themselves as being authoritative in this field, like any other, whose sole purpose is relieve people of their money at any cost. With seemingly complete disregard to their own credibility, they promote the wildest of ideas to the most gullible within our hobby simply in order to generate profitable income.

Cables only need to be of relative quality when compared to the components they are connecting. A mains cable may want to be of applicable quality to the cable leading to the wall socket and the cables entering the transformer within the component. No amount of tweakery will upgrade the cables either side of the mains cable. At this point, switching-mode power supplies aside, the quality of the step-down transformer within the component is king, and all else is of minor importance, relatively speaking. A poor power supply layout utilising high quality components is likely to generate more noise than a PSU of superior design using components of lesser quality.

Likewise with interconnect cables attention should be drawn to the tuppence ha'penny gold plated connectors universally used in audio manufacture. The quality of the input and output connectors simply nullify the justification for spending silly money on upmarket interconnect cables. Loudspeaker cables also suffer from over the top sales patter which never addresses the box-standard output sockets used in power amplifiers, and certainly avoids any mention of the quality of the wire, which is way longer than the average pair of loudspeaker cables, used in the voice coils of loudspeaker drive units.

In my opinion, and it is just one bloke's opinion, it is important to avoid both the scientific and pseudo-scientific arguments in these matters. Far more important is to customise your stereo so it looks slick to you, and bugger everyone else. If you have a look at how well Andrew looks after his possessions (http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?25845-My-odds-n-sods), you will see what I mean.

John.

[Oldpinkman]

John
Is this a competition to see who can be first to expose the emperor's new clothes, and who can make the most outrageous authoritative statements? I like your style! You will have gathered by now that Ivor Titforbrains was a thorn in my side (but a rich vein of humour).
"Knowing full well the most important component is the pre-amplifier". If nobody else will - I'll challenge the provenance of that comment. I have a very good preamplifier, and think its very important, but that demands a "call" from this poker player. In my own humble opinion, the room is the most important component, but "balance" might be my most important.

On the subject of the Emperor's new clothes, see my Englishman abroad thread, and I think I will try a polite considerate post on MikeMusics thread too. But broadly, my experiences, and such technical advice as I have so far managed to obtain from those I trust, accords with your views.

BTW - what qualifications / experience do you have in audio?

Richard

[realysm42]

So after all of that John, you think its most important how slick your stereo looks :scratch:

[John R Leddy]

So after all of that John, you think its most important how slick your stereo looks :scratch:

That is about the depth of it Martin.

Boy-racer hi-fi, besides being a valuable resource for the industry, is just another aspect to our hobby with equal validity as any other part of it.

While I may choose to leave my stereo in standard trim, so to speak, and no matter my opinion of go-faster type accessories and their actual effectiveness, I certainly advocate and respect freedom of choice for others.

To me, the minority within the populace actually willing to spend, what can only be described as silly, money on reproducing pre-recorded music should not be fractionalised.

As there is no enforcement to acquire a shell-suit, I feel buying glitter, no matter how gaudy, is a harmless and innocent pastime which most will grow out of sooner or later anyway.

Likewise, I suspect the industrial, plain black, and if I am honest, downright ugly appearance of my components, while suiting me fine, are hardly likely to appeal to the vast majority of hi-fi enthusiasts.

So be it. Takes all sorts, as they say.

John.

[realysm42]

Fair enough :cool:

My system consists only of black boxes and is pick that purposeful style over some of the ridiculous going I've seen. Chord, I'm looking at you.

[Yomanze]

Richard, I don't know the science, but in my experience, it has a large impact on sound quality.

Nowhere near as much as something like balanced mains though. I would say that power cables have a subtle impact, not night and day or large.

[Oldpinkman]

Nowhere near as much as something like balanced mains though. I would say that power cables have a subtle impact, not night and day or large.
I hear that a lot. But I encountered a lot of wishful thinking and believing your own propoganda when I was doing this stuff properly. I have read comments on here like "the heart of my system is" and "complete improvement in dynamics" from people describing mains products. If there is an audible difference, I might be interested. Nobody seems prepared to stick their neck out either offering a demonstration, or a "banker" product to try. Obviously it is really tricky doing a 30 day A:B comparison for a complete house rewire, with new sockets etc, but if a mains cable ("designer kettle lead") is worth changing, then it must be better enough for it to be demonstrated and proved with a 30 day blind evaluation. (10 days is enough if its real). Any takers?

[realysm42]

Nowhere near as much as something like balanced mains though. I would say that power cables have a subtle impact, not night and day or large.

I've not heard that upgrade myself, but I trust the words and experiences of enough people on here to believe that statement.

That's one of the final things I'd like to try, obviously when I've got my own place.

[realysm42]

Richard, there's at least two sales people on here I can think of that if you asked, I'm sure they would oblige.

[Oldpinkman]

Richard, there's at least two sales people on here I can think of that if you asked, I'm sure they would oblige.

Thanks. I can probably guess at least one! Nobody has popped their head over the parapet to offer - which I can understand because I have been flippantly skeptical, and I have no wish to mess with anybody's business. It would be quite nice if one of the "believer buyers" who have been so adamant about the benefits quoted a product which I would definitely hear the benefit with, or was prepared to dem it to me (preferably in the South East)

Whilst it is possible others hear differences I miss, my system is in pretty good order ATM, and I have a good independent listener in Sue. If a product works, I would expect to hear it. There seems to be great variability amongst the faithful. Unchallenged there are hyperbolic claims like "fundamental" and "heart of the system". When I ask for proof or some simple home blind tests, everyone runs for cover, or claims the differences are very subtle (implying a heathen like me would never hear them - but they are there for those with eyes that see)

I am used to being one of the Hoi Polloi - but not when it comes to listening to hifi. Nothing I can do hear in Frejus! A September distraction I think. :cool: