usb cable upgrade

[wee tee cee]

I need about 4m length usb cable. At present I run a supra 5m which is a noticeable improvement over a couple of belkins I have. Just wondered if any one has tried and would recommend something within a £100 budget---maybe the furatech?
Would love to splash out on a TQ having heard one, but cant stretch that far.
I know the subject is contentious, just looking to benefit from members experience.

[kenworthy100]

One thing as I know to my cost if you damage a Chord USB cable (dropped laptop with cable attached) Chord cannot re-terminate as they don't apparently have the "tooling" in the UK.

[wee tee cee]

One thing as I know to my cost if you damage a Chord USB cable (dropped laptop with cable attached) Chord cannot re-terminate as they don't apparently have the "tooling" in the UK.

looks like my supra cable has suffered some damage in my absence but know one is owning up....still working but the shielding is showing at the lap top end!!!!

[MCRU]

You mentioned Furutech which does sound better than the supra (I use both off and on) and due to the Furutech ADL range being reduced as of today it will cost you a bit less for the 5 metre version, here it is. (http://www.mains-cables-r-us.co.uk/hifi-cables/129-furutech-formula-2-usb-cable-4582237533910.html#/length-5_metres)

Reckon chord usb cables will be made in china (IMO of course)

5 metres does bump the price up quite a bit but still under £100 for the Furutech which fared well in last months hifi news test!

[wee tee cee]

Ordered the 3.6m furatech, having heard another members during one of the Scottish get together s .I know it is good.Will provide my findings against the supra when I have gave it a good test drive.
Utilised the discount code from a previous purchase...thanks Dave.

[MCRU]

discount code, what's one of those :lol:

no problem, 2 free sets of oak cone feet as well

what a bargain! :)

[wee tee cee]

thanks very much....but what do i do with them?

[Gazjam]

Result!

Do cables make a difference Dave? :)

[Gazjam]

thanks very much....but what do i do with them?

Give em to me!

[MCRU]

oak cone feet can be used under speakers, under cd players, amps, all over the place in fact

you get 1 set of large and 1 set of small so experiment

http://i622.photobucket.com/albums/tt309/themainsman/Logos/MCRUbristolbadge_zpsdf307d03.jpg

[wee tee cee]

mmmm....something else to play with!!! cant hurt to try.

[RichB]

Considering an upgrade myself and the supra 2.0 looks like decent vfm. I don't like spending too much for what might be marginal gains. I'm currently using some of Maplin's gold plated ones and keen to know if anyone has tried the supra and what improvements they noticed. Tend to take WTF 5 star reviews with a pinch of salt and would rather hear from users.

[wee tee cee]

switching back to a couple of belkin cables the supra is noticeably better in respect of bass and soundstaging...the belkins both sound a little brighter and more susceptible to sibilance on female voices which is a bugbear of mine. the supra was a good value upgrade that once installed i never really considered to change. my cable still works perfectly but has suffered some trauma at the laptop end which knowone is owning up to.
my son will inherit the supra for his set up replacing another belkin....i can get his feedback and post his findings, his 19 year old ears are a bit sharper than mine.
the two belkins a pro with orange insert on the plugs and a black and blue one are both very good but do both sound slightly different.....both very good and reasonable money on amazon. the supra is very good imo looking forward to hearing what the furatech does when it arrives.

[RichB]

switching back to a couple of belkin cables the supra is noticeably better in respect of bass and soundstaging...the belkins both sound a little brighter and more susceptible to sibilance on female voices which is a bugbear of mine. the supra was a good value upgrade that once installed i never really considered to change. my cable still works perfectly but has suffered some trauma at the laptop end which knowone is owning up to.
my son will inherit the supra for his set up replacing another belkin....i can get his feedback and post his findings, his 19 year old ears are a bit sharper than mine.
the two belkins a pro with orange insert on the plugs and a black and blue one are both very good but do both sound slightly different.....both very good and reasonable money on amazon. the supra is very good imo looking forward to hearing what the furatech does when it arrives.

Thanks for that advice, its good to know that people can discern differences when switching between usb cables. The change is also prompted by the fact that we'll shortly be having a major decoration at home and I'm having cupboards and shelves put in which finally bring all my hifi my music collection together in one space so, other than a reasonable length toslink for my tivo box, long cable lengths as I have at the moment between Laptop and DAC will no longer be required. This will get the laptop up off the floor and onto its own shelf where it will be primarily used as a stereo component. My turntable will also be getting a dedicated shelf and the current rats nest of cables will be hidden from view. The furutech also looks interesting and I think i'll hold off from making a purchase until I've seen what people make of it here.

[realysm42]

I might have a Furutech Formula 2 (1.2m, I think) for sale shortly if anyone's interested.

[wee tee cee]

Martin your thoughts on the furatech would be useful.
having heard the TQ black usb i know there are gains to be made in this link in the chain alas my budget is more "champagne mouth, lemonade pockets!"

[realysm42]

For the price (given that it's actually dropped recently as well), it's a great cable (HFN did a round up recently, it was included and recommended).

It does nothing wrong in my eyes. TQ Graphite sounds better, but then it bloody well ought to lol!

It's got a clean and natural sound to it; for the money you really can't go wrong!

[wee tee cee]

Thanks Martin look forward to hearing mine when it arrives......the tq stuff is worth its money,having heard it in my own set up----when my numbers come up!!!!

[realysm42]

Good stuff :)

Tony, I heartily recommend an ifi USB power unit to really up the quality of your audio :eyebrows:

[Tim]

Tony, I heartily recommend an ifi USB power unit to really up the quality of your audio
This is good advice, isolating the 5V rail between PC USB port and DAC is going to give you far more gain than an exotic USB cable. There are also many options to DIY as well, just Google it and see what's out there.

Keep your USB cables as short as you can, if possible plug them directly into the motherboard header and provide clean, alternative power close to the DAC end, linear is good, battery is better. Do these things and you will be surprised how well a quality, low cost cable performs, like a Belkin Gold. For well under 100 quid you would be amazed what you can do if you put a bit of thought into it and do some research . . . and that's all I'm saying ;)

[RichB]

I'm assuming that by using something like a v-link, which takes its power from the USB input and the sends coax to my DAC problems on the 5v rail are eliminated and adding a separate power supply for USB would be pointless. Not that I'm at all cynical about this as I use a galvanic isolator to very good effect to silence a noisy PC input to my hot audio DAC. Incidentally this cost much less than one of those ifi things and I'd highly recommend them http://electronicsshop.dk/?id=900

[MCRU]

I'm assuming that by using something like a v-link, which takes its power from the USB input and the sends coax to my DAC problems on the 5v rail are eliminated and adding a separate power supply for USB would be pointless. Not that I'm at all cynical about this as I use a galvanic isolator to very good effect to silence a noisy PC input to my hot audio DAC. Incidentally this cost much less than one of those ifi things and I'd highly recommend them http://electronicsshop.dk/?id=900

hi not a plug for ifi audio more an effort to help you increase your enjoyment of music but these easily outperform the v-link

can lend you one for a while if interested

[realysm42]

Funnily enough, plugging the ifi USB into my schuko mains conditioner yielded a big gain in sq again.

[wee tee cee]

my usb runs between a v-link mk1 and a lap top. then co-ax out of the v-link to the dac.......cant quite get my head round the ifi concept. does it take the co-ax and v-link out the chain and go directly to the dac?
the usb implementation on my mf m1 is noticeably inferior to the combo in place. like wise the usb dac built into my mf m1hpa isnt very good in comparison.

[Tim]

cant quite get my head round the ifi concept.
Tony, iFi is for USB, in simple terms it isolates the PC from the DAC and injects its own 'clean' power. A USB cable has 4 wires, two data wires, a + 5V and - Ground. Many of the popular DAC chipsets are powered by the 5V rail coming from the host computers USB connection, along the USB cable, which is why length is important. This, under normal conditions, manifests itself as a 'noisy' electrical signal powering the DAC chipset, which is obviously not ideal. Isolate the computers 5V supply and provide the DAC chipset with a clean, regulated supply and the SQ improves.

That's it in simple terms and my understanding of what's going on. I'm sure someone will be along to enlarge on it, if I have not explained it correctly ;)

[wee tee cee]

Thanks Tim,
I had a look at the IFI site and can appreciate the thinking behind it. The v-link is powered by the usb from the lap top so I suppose any electrical noise could be transfered to the co-ax?
I need a long usb as the lap top sits next to me about 3m from the hi fi.....may well be scope for some independent power supply/battery or otherwise to power the v-link?

[RichB]

Thanks Tim,
I had a look at the IFI site and can appreciate the thinking behind it. The v-link is powered by the usb from the lap top so I suppose any electrical noise could be transfered to the co-ax?
I need a long usb as the lap top sits next to me about 3m from the hi fi.....may well be scope for some independent power supply/battery or otherwise to power the v-link?

I'm with Tony on not really getting my head around the ifi device. Whilst i get no noticable noise from the laptop into the usb on the Rega dac, the v-link just makes everything a bit more live sounding and allows for higher def files. I'm struggling to understand what an ifi might bring to the party, other than another box to contend with... does it need its own psu as well or is it usb powered itself?:scratch:

Moreover, i dealt with the issue of a noisy pc into a badly isolated dac in my second system by adding a galvanic isolator dongle (for around £30). This killed all of the noise and notably improved the sound of the dac. There is now absolute silence where there should be.

Dave (MCRU) mentioned that the ifi would be an improvement over the v-link, I'm not really following this as the v-link does a different job, converting the usb signal to toslink/spdif and enabling me to use the full 24bit capability of my DAC (usb on the rega is limited to 16bit). I'd be quite happy to try one if theres no obligation to see if any improvements can be discerned but at £175 cost I'm be more inclined to spend this much on other components before I addressed usb power.

As an aside, at a recent bake off a chap brought his own DIY dac and cables which did not contain any power rails, his set up certainly sounded very nice and open, is this not the way forward for those who dont need usb power to their devices?

[MCRU]

I'm with Tony on not really getting my head around the ifi device. Whilst i get no noticable noise from the laptop into the usb on the Rega dac, the v-link just makes everything a bit more live sounding and allows for higher def files. I'm struggling to understand what an ifi might bring to the party, other than another box to contend with... does it need its own psu as well or is it usb powered itself?:scratch:

Moreover, i dealt with the issue of a noisy pc into a badly isolated dac in my second system by adding a galvanic isolator dongle (for around £30). This killed all of the noise and notably improved the sound of the dac. There is now absolute silence where there should be.

Dave (MCRU) mentioned that the ifi would be an improvement over the v-link, I'm not really following this as the v-link does a different job, converting the usb signal to toslink/spdif and enabling me to use the full 24bit capability of my DAC (usb on the rega is limited to 16bit). I'd be quite happy to try one if theres no obligation to see if any improvements can be discerned but at £175 cost I'm be more inclined to spend this much on other components before I addressed usb power.

As an aside, at a recent bake off a chap brought his own DIY dac and cables which did not contain any power rails, his set up certainly sounded very nice and open, is this not the way forward for those who dont need usb power to their devices?

ifi make an i-link, just got my stocks today, usb to spdif converter, that is what I was referring to

[Tim]

As an aside, at a recent bake off a chap brought his own DIY dac and cables which did not contain any power rails, his set up certainly sounded very nice and open, is this not the way forward for those who dont need usb power to their devices?
Depends on the DAC chipset Rich and how its powered and how the DAC and PC handshake ;)

[RichB]

ifi make an i-link, just got my stocks today, usb to spdif converter, that is what I was referring to

Aah, I see... What's the spec on these?

[wee tee cee]

having compared my v-link mk 1 with a members mk 2 and also a 192 there was a small but noticeable improvement as we moved up the chain. would be interesting to hear a comparison with a few including the hi face?

[MCRU]

having compared my v-link mk 1 with a members mk 2 and also a 192 there was a small but noticeable improvement as we moved up the chain. would be interesting to hear a comparison with a few including the hi face?

are you in with the scottish mafiosa :) then as I can send gaz some ifi bits for a play if you are having a sesh anytime soon?

[Gazjam]

Everything you wanted to know about USB isolation but were too afraid to ask...
http://jplay.eu/forum/computer-audio/clean-usb-out-of-pc/

[wee tee cee]

Ill take the fifth on that.....gaz!!!! Never heard of him.

[Gazjam]

Detecting a home erotic subtext here.....
Down Shep.

[wee tee cee]

Just had the furatech formula 2 delivered. Plumbed it in and started playing, noticeably different to the supra it has replaced. The supra as I have said previously didn't do anything wrong and improved upon the couple of belkins I had. The furatech seems to be far cleaner/clearer. Live recordings, the acoustics of the venue are far more noticeable. It just seems more musical and foot tapping-first impression was it sounds more like listening to headphones in the way that it has separated the two channels. Its more honest in that it flatters good recordings and exposes the poor stuff.
An excellent value for money upgrade over the supra which I regard highly.

[Gazjam]

Nice one mate, glad its doing the business.

[realysm42]

:)

It might be worth bunging on a clip on ferrite core as well Tony, they're only a coup,e of quid and can clean things up nicely.

[NRG]

A clip on ferrite ring will screw up the impedance of the USB cable, probably the last thing you want put on...unless the impedance is already screwed up! :D

[Gazjam]

Use a green pen on it.. :)

[realysm42]

A green pen on the ferrite ring, which is connected to the impedancanator?

[Gazjam]

thats a bingo...

[RichB]

thats a bingo...

House!
http://www.lessloss.com/blackbody-p-200.html

[realysm42]

A clip on ferrite ring will screw up the impedance of the USB cable, probably the last thing you want put on...unless the impedance is already screwed up! :D

Not saying your wrong, or pretending to know better but I've seen some 'high end' brands like kimber use them.

[NRG]

Not saying your wrong, or pretending to know better but I've seen some 'high end' brands like kimber use them.

Then best to avoid buying one! ;) :D

[wee tee cee]

Got a bit of feedback from my son regards inheriting the supra usb and replacing the belkin that had been in place. He feels it is more refined overall, the most noticeable improvements have been in the midrange and bass. He felt the belkin had been artificially bloated the bass. He hasn't noticed any change in the treble nothing added or taken away. He runs the usb straight into a dac magic utilising the laptop to alter the volume.....a thumbs up from 19 year old ears.

[realysm42]

Win win :D