View Full Version : Cheap mini active monitors
Rather than pee all over someone's welcome thread, I thought I'd start a new one out of the way...
There's a whole market away from the hifi shops and high-profit/low turnover distribution model that seems common still in our dying industry. This one caters for desktop small monitors for commercial studios and numerous "bedroom studios" which have all but killed off the big boys, the giant monitors soffit mounted into the studio walls being there to impress the acts apparently these days :(
First up, the middle model in Yamaha's current smaller range, apparently this one is the NS10 replacement -
http://www.studiospares.com/studio-monitors/yamaha-hs50m-monitor-each/invt/425880?VBMST=*
Chinese made by the zillion and sold at low (by hifi shop) margins, they may not look like mini Sonus Faber, but they stand a good chance of sounding really good
These powered passives are well liked for peanuts -
http://www.studiospares.com/studio-monitors/studiospares-seiwin-powered-monitors-pair/invt/248030/#
KRK's are quite ballsy apparently -
http://www.studiospares.com/studio-monitors/krk-rokit-rp8-g2/invt/390120
Hundreds of models on the Studiospares site and the better known ones must be worth a look - many all ready for a line source to be fed them for under £500pr....
morris_minor
29-05-2013, 12:57
Though not cheap-as-chips, I bought a pair of Harbeth DPM1 Pro active monitors a while back for £600 from a Liverpool pro-audio retailer via eBay for my study system and these have proved to be a fantastic buy. Obviously having built in amps restricts the amp-swapping activities beloved of so many, but when you just want to listen to the music this route has a lot to commend it . . .
Knowing Harbeth's Alan Shaw as I do, I think he might have run a bit scared of out-sourcing the amps, since he prefers to be in total control of his products from design to mass production, including the bass-mid drivers.. I believe he can still service the HHB Circle drivers though, despite them being a few years old now.
Yamaha do have a good multi-faceted reputation and they have LOADS of dosh to sink into research, so anyone interested should look out for their current actives.
You know chaps, I don't think many of us realise how low the ex-works costs of Chinese gear can be, even today, a £300pr of actives probably leaving the gates for £60pr or less.
freefallrob
29-05-2013, 13:41
Regarding the active monitors, In my darker days of despair I've often thought of saying 'sod all this malarkey' and just having a cd player and some active speakers.....make alot of sense to me.
I'd miss my LP's though!
stupinder
29-05-2013, 14:52
Heard these at Munich and thought they were very good for small desktop speakers http://www.kef.com/html/gb/showroom/digital_music_solutions/X300A/overview/ Price is about 600 squids
I'm told that KEF have quietly got their budget-end act together at last and models with the tangerine waveguide are really very good indeed. Thanks for the link :)
Haselsh1
29-05-2013, 18:22
I'm told that KEF have quietly got their budget-end act together at last and models with the tangerine waveguide are really very good indeed. Thanks for the link :)
Hmmm... my Kef Q500's use the tangerine waveguide and are very good indeed, especially now that they are run in.
stupinder
30-05-2013, 06:47
Not heard these particular monitors (http://www.gear4music.com/Recording-and-Computers/Behringer-MS16-Studio-Monitors/3KS) but they're 57 squids
Keith R Klawitter of aforementioned KRK fame has had a hand in designing these nearfields from Behringer (http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/K8.aspx) Again i've not heard them so can't comment on their SQ. I can't find a price for them and they're not in stock yet but if I was looking for a cheap desktop i'd be waiting to see how much these are going to sell for. There's also a smaller K5
I use these for a kitchen and holiday system. They're not half bad either. I wouldn't use them for my main speakers but for chilled listening they could be better than more expensive pro monitors meant for a recording studio. I'm not referring to the Behringers BTW, they just say Studio for marketing reasons.....
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Creative-Gigaworks-Series-Multimedia-Speakers/dp/B001IZZ2PO
Sand Dancin Donkey Walker
30-05-2013, 16:55
David
I used a pair of the Jamo CS5 actives for a lot of years.
Blooming great they were, and the ones below are very well priced.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/POWERFUL-JAMO-CS5-MULTIMEDIA-AMPLIFIER-SPEAKERS-WITH-INBUILT-AMPLIFIER-/251208098252?pt=UK_AudioVideoElectronics_HomeAudio HiFi_HiFiSpeakers&hash=item3a7d2b61cc (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/POWERFUL-JAMO-CS5-MULTIMEDIA-AMPLIFIER-SPEAKERS-WITH-INBUILT-AMPLIFIER-/251208098252?pt=UK_AudioVideoElectronics_HomeAudio HiFi_HiFiSpeakers&hash=item3a7d2b61cc)
Andy - SDDW
Werner Berghofer
31-05-2013, 07:59
David,
KRK's are quite ballsy apparently
yes, they are; but I wouldn’t call them exactly “mini”:
http://www.berghofer.com/photos/gear/desk_december_2011.jpg
As shown on the photo above from my desk the iMac between the two KRK Rokit 5 active speakers is a 27 inch model, the Rokit 5 are the smallest of the current KRK RPG2 line. None of them are the size of floor-standing speakers, but even the smallest KRKs aren’t “mini”.
I think the new Yamaha HS 5/7/8 models also are quite interesting.
Werner.
Isn't there a bit of confusion in this thread between the terms powered and active? Active suggests that each drive unit has its own power amp with the crossover being implemented before the amplification. A lot of these budget monitors seem to be 'powered' which usually just means a two channel amplifier is built in to one of them.
Isn't there a bit of confusion in this thread between the terms powered and active? Active suggests that each drive unit has its own power amp with the crossover being implemented before the amplification. A lot of these budget monitors seem to be 'powered' which usually just means a two channel amplifier is built in to one of them.
That's a good point, we need Dave to clarify what he meant by "cheap mini active monitors". There is a tendency to call powered speakers active, which in crossover terms is not correct but speakers with amps inside are active devices as opposed to passive devices. Yes, it's a source of confusion.
That's a good point, we need Dave to clarify what he meant by "cheap mini active monitors". There is a tendency to call powered speakers active, which in crossover terms is not correct but speakers with amps inside are active devices as opposed to passive devices. Yes, it's a source of confusion.
And there I was thinking Active Speakers had a gym subscription and performed aerobics whilst playing music... :D
OK!
Active to me, is a speaker with individual amps for each driver and an electronic filter network/crossover BEFORE the amps..
Powered speakers are passive models with built in amps, the amp driving the crossover in the traditional way...
As for mini - any stand/desk mounted speaker with 6" drivers or smaller is what I'd regard as a *mini* speaker.
Leaving the used market alone for a minute, if you want a good quality of sound for under £500 for amp and speakers, the choice may be limited to Richer Sounds fare, which I'm sure is fine (Q Acoustics and Cambridge Audio etc). I just have a feeling that some of the better (admittedly Chinese made so cheaper) desktop/stand mounted fully active speakers for less than £500 the pair may give traditional budget priced separates a huge run for their money.
This is NOT a subtle way to get some of you to buy AVI ADM9's, but the basic technology is sound, hideously expensive done in domestic separate systems (Linn, Meridian and Naim) and ATC charge enough too these days, but I wonder if these smaller 'monitors' might just bring a great sound for little dosh to the party for small systems? Got to be better than a crappy old Nait and Kans surely??? :lol:
Some, if not all, of those speakers in your original post are not true active designs then Dave (but then they don't claim to be).
Got to be better than a crappy old Nait and Kans surely??? :lol:
That is certainly not a given by any means (mind you, there is nothing budget about the second hand price that Naits seem able to achieve).
A couple of years ago Andrew demonstrated a system at Scalford that used a Mk1 Nait and Kans - people absolutely loved it!
Alex didn't when he heard it!
The Nait is gutless into such screamers and the Kans are one of the worst speakers ever to have been conceived - the wayward and unequalised KEF B110 drivers see to that and they got worse as time went on. I like pianos to sound like pianos and bass to have some weight, rather than no bass at all ;)
umm...with respect, Alex didn't like it, so what? I didn't say everyone liked it - but lots of people went out of their way to express surprise and comment positively (to Andrew) - more than I expected.
Both items have their limitations, as you say, the Nait is very low powered and the frequency response is anything but flat. I'm not saying that I want to use a Nait and Kans, but the fact remains that lots of people did (and still do) like this combination. You want to make a sweeping generalisation that a budget powered monitor is bound to sound better; I just don't agree that it is a given in the way you suggest.
_____________
I like pianos to sound like pianos and bass to have some weight, rather than no bass at all ;)
Well so do I, but no speaker of that size is going to produce much bass weight or extension. At the end of the day, all speakers have to adhere to the laws of physics, even if they amplifiers built in to them!
It's not long ago that I read a pfm member raving about the bass quality of his Naim IBL's - as you know, they have so little bass weight and extension they make Kans sound like bass monsters!
I obviously didn't hear Andrew's particular setup, but I do know both products rather too well, individually and together in very many environments :) If you ever see some Kan III's for sale (Chinese made Tukan's I believe, but with no aktiv option and £320pr new), these are on a different plane of existance...
Having heard how amazing a tatty pair of old £8 Wharfedale Diamond IV's can sound, I do know how good tiny speakers can sound, despite losing the bottom octave or two of bass, and these Diamond IV's are surprising on the end of a half decent low cost system, although they'd have been judged on price at the time.. The compromises are huge and separate the men from the boys when setting tonal balance etc, but they can still entertain and involve.
I'm not looking to promote Kans and a Nait as some kind of small speaker panacea, far from it. I just disagree that a pair of small powered speakers is 'bound to sound better' -they might do, they might not (depending on the tastes of those listening).
the Kans are one of the worst speakers ever to have been conceived
I thought this for many years, as a result of hi-fi dealers' demos. Simply horrible.
Then I heard a pair of Kans at last year's Scalford show and they were a revelation. I can't be sure about the amp but I think it was an Exposure.
Was it being demonstrated by a bald bloke?
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/ancient8/1.htmlhttp://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/ancient8/02.jpg
Not cheap but beautiful.
I think the Genelec 6010A is pretty popular but doesn't look like hifi. The new Yamaha HS5 is gaining popularity on the AVI forum and it's cheap too.
Was it being demonstrated by a bald bloke?
Go on...?
Well that would be Andrew - he was using his laptop playing files mostly ripped from vinyl, playing through an Audiolab MDAC in to a Mk1 Nait and Linn Kans.
A Nait was it? Well, I never. It sounded very good for a small speaker system.
OK, I respectfully bow to others' recent experiences :respect: :cool:
Dave - I have heard Kans sound shit on many occasions in the past, especially when dealers like Grahams Hi-Fi and The Cornflake Shop demo'd them. The sales assistants behaved exactly as if I was mad not to appreciate their quality. Well, I didn't and said so and made myself almost persona non grata with them. It was like a religion and I didn't feel like 'believing' their crap.
I have also NEVER heard a Naim demo sound good. In fact, they seem to specialise in making their own equipment sound terrible.
So your experience is equally valid.
Thanks Martin. I just find that the more wayward the speakers are, the harder it becomes to get anything remotely good out of them. I should add that with conventional speakers as well as Kans (I vivdly remember a dem at the Naim factory back in 1985 where I queered my pitch big time with Julian and his then 'little boy' Paul, who now runs the company....), in the CB range, the Nait mk1 and 135's were head and shoulders above the rest of them....... oops!
I'm not personally a big fan of Kans - well, I have mixed feelings. Whilst they can do some things well, they do other things very badly. However, I do know that some people love them - despite their shortcomings.
Martin, I appreciate you feel you have never heard a good Naim demo; but somewhat ironically, the best I have ever heard a Chord (amplifier) demo was bearable and the majority have been downright painful :).
Oh yes, I quite agree with you Mark. Chord demos are notoriously bad - not helped by them using Wilson Benesch speakers which I don't like and think are a very poor match.
I only fell on Chord when I borrowed an SPM-1200C from Audio T in Reading some 14 or so years ago, not expecting much. When I got it home and tried it with my JM Lab Mezzo Utopias (my speakers at the time), it was a revelation: potent, great soundstage, fine detail and just totally honest to the signal. That was the start of my love affair with Chord power amps that remains to this day. But it's no thanks to Chord's own demos :)
technobear
01-06-2013, 20:11
The ESI uniK range offer very good bang for buck:
http://www.esi-audio.com/images/products/unik08.jpg
http://www.esi-audio.com/products/unik08/
My uniK 08 exceed Dave's size requirement but the uniK 04 and uniK 05 are also very good if not quite as versatile.
I prefer speakers that can do more justice to the bottom two octaves. An 8" active pair would just about serve.
I look at these Mackies from time to time
http://www.mackie.com/products/hrmk2series/
This are about as domestically civilised as studio monitors get. I do wish there were products at reasonably prices that would fit in a conservative lounge.
They would be cheap compared to the alternatives on the HiFi market.
There is one firm making better looking and basically great quality small domestic active monitors, but their latest version of the popular one is now £1400 or so, so very expensive for many people. These Mackies are around a third of the price aren't they?
The Mackie HR624Mk2 £350 each and the HR825Mk2 £440 each.
So £700 for a pair of of 6.5 inchers and £880 for a pair of (nearly) 9 inchers, and a DAC not included.
But the MR range is considerably cheaper.
technobear
06-06-2013, 10:03
These Mackies are around a third of the price aren't they?
No, the HR824mkII are around £1100 a pair.The ESI uniK 08 is around £500 - £550 a pair and they are living room friendly:
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8340/8247360762_4f44027a10_o.jpg
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8198/8246293165_92a7cf70bc_o.jpg
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8061/8246293229_6f22252a38_o.jpg
The ESI uniK . . . a pair . . . are living room friendly:
Not in my living room, thank you.
technobear
06-06-2013, 11:13
The Mackie HR624Mk2 £350 each and the HR825Mk2 £440 each.
So £700 for a pair of of 6.5 inchers and £880 for a pair of (nearly) 9 inchers, and a DAC not included.
But the MR range is considerably cheaper.
I think you are looking at 'ex. VAT' prices there.
Thanks for suggestions :)
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.