View Full Version : Nice pair of Tannoys
r4tFrs4Bex0
I like these a lot. Anyone we know btw?
I really want a pair... :(
It's hard to tell from a video, but they sound pretty good. Nice system he's got, although it's difficult to recognise most of it...
Marco.
Rare Bird
20-03-2013, 21:43
Nice 'TD160'
walpurgis
20-03-2013, 22:21
Yes, they look the part.
Cabinets are about the size of Tannoy York enclosures. Unusually the bass cones look as though they have inverted roll surrounds, not standard, but if it works so what. QED Genesis speaker cables by the look of it, they works well with Tannoys, very revealing.
Yes they look like york copies.
the cabs look home made to me out of ply
I am never going to be able to afford a pair of Golds, so what would I be needing to look at to get close to the classic Tannoy sound without breaking the bank?
jollyfix
20-03-2013, 22:29
I was looking at this vid the other day, very nice sound, but i don't like the finish on the cab's. All that effort to build but looks like no thought on a good finish. I know not important to many, and of course it's the sound that counts, but seeing the lamination of a ply edge for me is a big no-no. Just pop some nice trim etc on there and turn the cabs into something special .
walpurgis
20-03-2013, 23:16
I am never going to be able to afford a pair of Golds, so what would I be needing to look at to get close to the classic Tannoy sound without breaking the bank?
Tannoy Eaton or Tannoy System 800 speakers, they are different, but both sound lovely.
Just sold my Eatons after many years, simply because I had no room for those and the Chatsworths. Still got my 800s though, they're compact and sound marvellous, best 'tulip waveguide' model I've heard.
Tannoy Eaton or Tannoy System 800 speakers, they are different, but both sound lovely.
Just sold my Eatons after many years, simply because I had no room for those and the Chatsworths. Still got my 800s though, they're compact and sound marvellous, best 'tulip waveguide' model I've heard.
Personally, I think there's currently no better way into vintage Tannoys for reasonabel money at present than Chatsworths, Cheviots or Ardens using HPD units (which are technically the better unit anyway although many prefer the Golds).
julesd68
21-03-2013, 10:15
Let me cheekily edit what Paul just wrote -
there's no better Tannoys than Chatsworths
For the money, that is! :D
Mine are giving me just huge amounts of pleasure ...
Personally, I think there's currently no better way into vintage Tannoys for reasonabel money at present than Chatsworths, Cheviots or Ardens using HPD units (which are technically the better unit anyway although many prefer the Golds).
{COUGH}! ;)
Who cares about the technicalities, Paul? Ultimately, it's how the final result sounds with your system in your room, to your ears, that matters. I agree with the rest of your post and the others here, though :)
Marco.
walpurgis
21-03-2013, 11:42
I think Dave on a budget.
The Eatons can be bought for around £400 and the System 800s go for £200 to £250, both these give a proper Tannoy sound (I wouldn't have had them otherwise).
Looking elsewhere gets pricier. Good Cheviots start from around £750 upwards, 12" MG Chatsworths or 15" HPD Berkleys, a grand upwards, 15" MG lancasters two to three grand these days and all these prices are rising (god knows what a pair of original GRF Autographs are worth now).
{COUGH}! ;)
Who cares about the technicalities? Ultimately, it's how the final result sounds with your system in your room, to your ears, that matters. I agree with the rest of the posts here, though :)
Marco.
Sorry...will re-phrase that....I think that the HPDs are the better sounding units (by far) having heard both on many occasions but others will prefer the golds. Depends a lot on the partnering kit and the cabinets used too. HPDs (for now) far far better VFM.
Yup, Paul I agree with all of that and would also add into the mix, crossovers, in respect of Golds, that if you've only heard them with the old and knackered components inside original Tannoy crossovers, then quite simply, you haven't heard *really* them! :nono:
The original crossovers need completely redone, judiciously (using the best modern components), in order for the full sonic potential of MGs to be realised and also to prevent them from sounding 'tubby' and distinctly old-fashioned.
As you say, cabinets are also absolutely crucial. I've yet to hear 15" Golds sound right in any anything other than original Lockwood cabinets, or in some circumstances, Tannoy's own. The majority of DIYers, to my ears, just don't get the cabinets right. The DIY Westminsters, for example, demonstrated at the Scalford show, which has just passed, looked amazing but just sounded wrong.
However, I disagree about HPDs, much as I like them. For me, they just don't have the same infectious 'musicality' (not that I like that term, as it's bit vague, but it'll do now for the sake of brevity), as the best of the vintage units, especially when partnered with a top-notch valve amp :)
Marco.
julesd68
21-03-2013, 14:55
I think there is only one gentlemanly way to settle this boys -
MG v HPD BAKE-OFF!! :gig:
:lolsign:
Actually, I'd be up for that. We could do it at the forthcoming AoS show!
Marco.
julesd68
21-03-2013, 15:17
Capital. Front row seat for me coz it's my idea innit.
Now all we need is young Paul to sign up for it ???
If there is no clear winner, it will be Marquess of Queensberry's rules in the car park … :punch:
Just taking it ever-so-slightly off topic......are the System 800s that good? They might have to be my next target!
Any things to watch out for?
Churz
I think Dave on a budget.
The Eatons can be bought for around £400 and the System 800s go for £200 to £250, both these give a proper Tannoy sound (I wouldn't have had them otherwise).
Looking elsewhere gets pricier. Good Cheviots start from around £750 upwards, 12" MG Chatsworths or 15" HPD Berkleys, a grand upwards, 15" MG lancasters two to three grand these days and all these prices are rising (god knows what a pair of original GRF Autographs are worth now).
Cheers Geoff I will do some research ;)
Audio Al
21-03-2013, 15:48
We could do it at the forthcoming AoS show!
:eyebrows:
Any information re this :D:D:D
I'm all up for that and tickled pink that I've been referred to as "young" :lol:
One issue:
My cabs when completed will be way to large and heavy for transporting unless vans and sack trolleys are used. They come in (on paper) at around 70 to 75kg at present (each) but may be a little more when completed.
Would prefer to open up an offer of whoever wants to come and listen to them is welcome to. They'll be ready in 2 to 3 weeks.
ps...these are not your "typical" DIY Tannoy cabinets. Over 200 hours of detailed design and construction work has gone into them. Whilst I won't be selling the design plans as such (there'll no doubt be tinkering to do on the originals before I get that far), I will be offering to make these for people to their own choice of finishes and will be offering a similar design for 15 inch units.
Thing Fish
21-03-2013, 16:12
:lolsign:
Actually, I'd be up for that. We could do it at the forthcoming AoS show!
Marco.
It's nice that you are going to do this in South London this year...:eyebrows:
steviej233
21-03-2013, 18:28
Where and when will the show be guys?
:eyebrows:
Any information re this :D:D:D
4th Sticky thread down in Blank Canvas, daftee, right in front of your nose. Honestly, some of you guys need to start opening yer peepers! ;)
Exact date and venue is still to be confirmed, but it's looking like it will be on 3/11/13, and held in one of the big hotels we've been looking at in Derby.
Where and when will the show be guys?
See above, Steve :)
Marco.
Hi Paul,
My cabs when completed will be way to large and heavy for transporting unless vans and sack trolleys are used. They come in (on paper) at around 70 to 75kg at present (each) but may be a little more when completed.
My Lockwoods are about the same weight. When I took them to the Scalford show a couple of years back, I hired a van to get them there, which is what I'll be doing again for the AoS show :)
ps...these are not your "typical" DIY Tannoy cabinets. Over 200 hours of detailed design and construction work has gone into them. Whilst I won't be selling the design plans as such (there'll no doubt be tinkering to do on the originals before I get that far), I will be offering to make these for people to their own choice of finishes and will be offering a similar design for 15 inch units.
Sounds good, Paul. Incidentally, I know that your cabinets are a bit special, so my earlier comments in that respect were not aimed at you ;)
Marco.
dantheman91
21-03-2013, 20:49
Well someone got lucky last night with some lancasters on gumtree for £15..
southall-1998
21-03-2013, 21:30
Well someone got lucky last night with some lancasters on gumtree for £15..
Congrats!!!!!
dantheman91
21-03-2013, 21:31
Congrats!!!!!
Unfortunatly it was not me buddy i wish haha:rolleyes:
walpurgis
22-03-2013, 11:24
Just taking it ever-so-slightly off topic......are the System 800s that good? They might have to be my next target!
Any things to watch out for?
Churz
I've used my System 800s alongside my Eatons and 3128 Cheviot II speakers and in no way are they inferior. Obviously they sound different, but the tonality, imaging and sheer impact of the sound has to be heard to be believed from such a small enclosure, they are more neutral than most other Tannoys too. The 94db sensitivity and 200 watt power handling means they can be used with any amplifier and they will produce huge levels.
Anybody wanting to hear them is welcome to pop by and compare them to my Cheviots. Shane (southall-1998) has heard these several times and can confirm what I've said about the 800s. They are outstanding.
I've used my System 800s alongside my Eatons and 3128 Cheviot II speakers and in no way are they inferior. Obviously they sound different, but the tonality, imaging and sheer impact of the sound has to be heard to be believed from such a small enclosure, they are more neutral than most other Tannoys too. The 94db sensitivity and 200 watt power handling means they can be used with any amplifier and they will produce huge levels.
Anybody wanting to hear them is welcome to pop by and compare them to my Cheviots. Shane (southall-1998) has heard these several times and can confirm what I've said about the 800s. They are outstanding.
Thanks for the reply, I'll keep my eyes out!
southall-1998
22-03-2013, 15:00
Indeed, those System 800s are bloody good monitors!
Yup, Paul I agree with all of that and would also add into the mix, crossovers, in respect of Golds, that if you've only heard them with the old and knackered components inside original Tannoy crossovers, then quite simply, you haven't heard *really* them! :nono:
The original crossovers need completely redone, judiciously (using the best modern components), in order for the full sonic potential of MGs to be realised and also to prevent them from sounding 'tubby' and distinctly old-fashioned.
As you say, cabinets are also absolutely crucial. I've yet to hear 15" Golds sound right in any anything other than original Lockwood cabinets, or in some circumstances, Tannoy's own. The majority of DIYers, to my ears, just don't get the cabinets right. The DIY Westminsters, for example, demonstrated at the Scalford show, which has just passed, looked amazing but just sounded wrong.
However, I disagree about HPDs, much as I like them. For me, they just don't have the same infectious 'musicality' (not that I like that term, as it's bit vague, but it'll do now for the sake of brevity), as the best of the vintage units, especially when partnered with a top-notch valve amp :)
Marco.
Just reading through this thread and in defense of the DIY route it takes a lot of hard work to get these things right but if you do it properly then its easily possible to get a fine sounding speaker for a fraction of the cost which is the point for me any way. For what it's worth i agree entirely about the Scalford set up but what you are hearing is a pair of 385's with original cross overs in these cabinets that sound great in my smaller listening space as testified by the many people of have been here. It might be wise to mention i am 37 and only been into HIFi for a couple of years.
The cross over is (among a few other bits and pieces) the trick, its almost starting from scratch with all the variables, as far as i can see these speakers are not the same as original Westminsters, the back loaded horn is different for starters so you are really up against it to the drivers to sound "right" in these cabinets and obviously the originals use 3839W units. The Scalford pair were MDF and i have now built some from ply and the comparison is very distinct but as the cross overs develop and the coherence of the sound gels then you begin to get into the right ball park. Building your own stuff is very rewarding if you are prepared to do it properly, its never just one pair and done.
The Autographs should be a very interesting comparison but as it stands I have a pair of Gold's (I agree with the comparison with the HPD's there too) in the ply cabinets with the new cross overs and I'm afraid they still sounded odd after hearing the problems more clearly at Scalford, so all i could do was fiddle with the back loaded horn area which is the only differing area that i can see.
Now on the thread there is a slanting panel (part W) that channels the bass down behind the driver and this has now been changed to a sort of down firing letter box (best way i can describe it) more a kin to the originals i think as i have never seen detailed enough pictures to really see but with lots of trial and error with positioning it is much more coherent in the bass/upper mid with cross overs now giving more at the top end.
Anyhow just a few points in favor of the DIY er here (me and i'm sure a few others) as its tough and time consuming to see these things through to match up with other serious contenders and so it goes on.
Some of Tannoy's cabinets are really funny, i spoke with a fellow who built Autograph's and he basically said that some of the tops and bottoms are different thicknesses of timber, just used what they had sometimes....some ropey cabinets out there.
Si.
Ninanina
06-04-2013, 20:58
I'm sure a pair of Klipschorns would hold their own against a top of the range Tannoy DC
I've not heard a Klipschorn but have heard the lesser La Scala...... oooooooo my word they are just superb; I heard them with a 300b amp that was falling to bits and a nasty old cd player but they still shone.....
Just my 2p worth........ :eek:
I'm sure a pair of Klipschorns would hold their own against a top of the range Tannoy DC
I've not heard a Klipschorn but have heard the lesser La Scala...... oooooooo my word they are just superb; I heard them with a 300b amp that was falling to bits and a nasty old cd player but they still shone.....
Just my 2p worth........ :eek:
I have some Klipsch Belles, very nice speakers but there are a few incarnations of the Khorn and LaScala all with nasty mid horns, even my DIY tannoys sound better...nah they just sound different..in your room...with your amps...with your source...and how many glasses of wine you've had etc.
There are people who can help them sound even beter-Fastlane Audio and Al Klappenberger (DIY'ers) but its true check the Klipsch Forum.
Si....come and have a listen I'm in Brighton:) I have Dave's(Fastlane's) mid horns and Al's Crossovers.
walpurgis
06-04-2013, 21:57
The Klipschorns are very impressive Bev. I've heard them a couple of times and also heard some of the equally impressive very big Altecs with similar driver arrays.
But, and it's a big but! None of them image like the Tannoys and I don't think they achieve quite the same seamless integration and transparency.
Just to add to what Simon's already said; Whilst many DIY efforts which aim to replicate the original and more simple Tannoy boxes may fall flat, build's such as Simon's do not. As he says, anyone contemplating doing the job properly (and here, I humbly submit that I've tried to with mine) is in for a bit of a shock with the time and effort plus range of skills that will be needed. You'll almost certainly under estimate these things for the first pair you ever make.
The other thing to say is that Simon has hit the nail on the head, in that when you do the job properly, you tune the cabs and crossovers for your own space. There's little point for example, having the response 9dB down by 50 Hz because your room loads bass by 9dB from here downwards, if you then demonstrate the cabs in much larger show event rooms. It's impossible to compare loudspeakers properly except for the space they're intended to work in.
You can still however get a very good comparison as its primarily the bass that is tuned as you tend to look for anechoic response (ie flat) further up the frequency range, from perhaps 200Hz upwards, but more typically from the baffle step point upwards.
I am a champion of the DIY route for Tannoy DC's simply because Tannoy didn't do cabinets very well, and there's still lots of room for improvement with the prestige series today. Ironically, their Definition and DC range have had what appears to be much more attention lavished on them, at least in design terms, although having heard them, it doesn't seem to have paid off as well as would be expected.
Attention to detail is everything!
The Klipschorns are very impressive Bev. I've heard them a couple of times and also heard some of the equally impressive very big Altecs with similar driver arrays.
But, and it's a big but! None of them image like the Tannoys and I don't think they achieve quite the same seamless integration and transparency.
This is my experience with Klipsch too, i read PK's book and hold a huge amount of respect for him, I have just copied a design with my DIY ventures but one thing that this process does give you is a great respect for the designer's of these big speakers and the Autograph's are no exception which is why i am building two pairs, the first being a dry run to understand the design and how to process all the panels in the best possible way, the front horn for example has to meet mm perfect with the front of the cabinet so the bevels on the individual panels have to be right, if you cut them even slightly out the horn shrinks/grows by 2 or 3mm. The way to do it after making this mistake is run long lengths through the table saw set to precisely the correct angle so all panels are exactly the same.
Paul is absolutely right, attention to detail is everything and with big cabinets is an expensive lesson to learn but you must expect that really, there is always something else that you think might better things too so is just an almost baffling process until the thing works. With the Westminster build its was, in hind sight, a very tough task to voice these things and its been years of work and i'm still not there so i would certainly recommend using accurate/tried and tested plans before buying timber otherwise you will quickly realize your in no mans land...look at Steve's journey with his horn's, i am sure he will end up with some of the finest sounding speakers on the planet and would say he's close to achieving that but it has taken time.....you must engage on this level to be successful, everything starts somewhere but as many painter's suffer from "when are you finished" syndrome and there is a lesson to learn i suspect with regards to realizing that finishing is possible before you start:)... Rembrandt was a fool :)
NB There are some great sites for Klipsch DIY'ers, certainly Greg at Volti Audio is making exceptional speakers, things of real beauty, but years of work to get there and also John Warren at North Reading Engineering built some very good Khorns. One speaker i would like to hear is the Jubilee, PK's last design but never heard of a pair here in the UK.
Cheers Si.
steviej233
09-04-2013, 07:53
4th Sticky thread down in Blank Canvas, daftee, right in front of your nose. Honestly, some of you guys need to start opening yer peepers! ;)
Exact date and venue is still to be confirmed, but it's looking like it will be on 3/11/13, and held in one of the big hotels we've been looking at in Derby.
See above, Steve :)
Marco.
Sorry Marco.... :)
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