View Full Version : HMV go into administration tomorrow
PaulStewart
14-01-2013, 21:37
Sad news that what was once the worlds biggest music retailer is going into administration tomorrow:( I've put more info on musicosis.co.uk and will update it when the company puts out a statement.
Very sad indeed. Yet another example of the dying high street. I guess the Internet has a lot to answer for........
dantheman91
14-01-2013, 21:47
Its was on the cards
Not a surprise.
There internet buying was awful.
Beechwoods
14-01-2013, 21:59
I guess this means that Fopp will be spun back into a standalone business, or is that at risk too?
Fopp is the only decent high street brand selling records these days. It would be a shame to see it affected too.
isuckedmandelsonslemons
14-01-2013, 22:00
Good riddance. Bloody awful shops.
Beechwoods
14-01-2013, 22:06
I seriously miss 'flicking' through music in shops. In 10 years time it will be impossible, unless you work in a warehouse selling music online.
Haselsh1
14-01-2013, 22:06
Good riddance. Bloody awful shops.
I second that but think it is sad to see. We shall soon have no high street businesses at all but then if they adapted they would survive.
Sad sad day indeed. Not good to see business going bust and people losing their jobs and I bet it the number of people impacted will run in the thousands. I went to HMV Westfield a week before to Christmas and I thought they were doing rather well.
I second that but think it is sad to see. We shall soon have no high street businesses at all but then if they adapted they would survive.
They varied. Leeds used to have a wonderful Jazz/Folk/Classical department that was isolated from the rest of the chaos and had staff that knew what they were doing. The day a couple of years ago I went in and found they had pulled it down and were selling tee shirts was the last day I went into HMV Leeds.
PaulStewart
14-01-2013, 22:09
Just posted the company statement as an update to the post on musicosis.co.uk
Yes they could be crap, but I've been going to HMV Oxford Street since the 60s.... Really sad day:(
Cheers
Paul S
aquapiranha
14-01-2013, 22:13
Cant say I am surprised really, the prices were a bit if a joke though it is still a crying shame.
Beechwoods
14-01-2013, 22:15
Really sad. We are all sleepwalking into a future where there is a duopoly consisting of eBay and Amazon. All grand now, but when the competition elsewhere really does falter, free market balances will fail and we will pay the price. Maybe we're just a dying breed and physical music retail just doesn't have any money in it anymore.
Thing Fish
14-01-2013, 22:18
Their vinyl prices were always too high and they never included them in the sales.
Why would I pay £36 for a neil young album when I can buy the same one online (and did) for £18.99
I don't mind paying a bit more but bloody hell...!!!
This decade may see the demise of the chain store. But quite possibly the rise of the individually owned specialist stores, dedicated to customer service, loyalty and quality.
Haselsh1
14-01-2013, 22:27
This decade may see the demise of the chain store. But quite possibly the rise of the individually owned specialist stores, dedicated to customer service, loyalty and quality.
We can certainly hope so...!
Yes they could be crap, but I've been going to HMV Oxford Street since the 60s.... Really sad day:(
Cheers
Paul S
A very sad time :( spent half my youth outside that shop.
hope the staff get paid up properly.
regards Paul
This decade may see the demise of the chain store. But quite possibly the rise of the individually owned specialist stores, dedicated to customer service, loyalty and quality.
I agree.
Kind of ironic that i reckon all cd type shops will go yet the small vinyl shops may prosper.
I guess this means that Fopp will be spun back into a standalone business, or is that at risk too?
Fopp is the only decent high street brand selling records these days. It would be a shame to see it affected too.
I don't know about that, was in their Bristol branch recently and they had a very good selection and competitively priced compared to internet sellers. They also have enough other products so its not just music. I think where HMV went wrong was that they forgot they were a music shop and seemed more keen on DVDs and video games, as if music was secondary. Fopp will do OK as long as they keep a good variety of music and not just the latest releases.
Audioman
14-01-2013, 22:53
They actualy devoted most of their space to DVD's and gimmicks. The music sections got smaller. None of the stores I visited in recent months sold vinyl. They went for the wrong market (DVD has shrunk more than physical music I believe) and realy have themselves to blame. Have had plenty of opportuniities to revise this business model as well as pricing. May leave a gap in the market that can be filled by independents.
Richard which Bristol Store did you visit? - The one at Cribbs Causeway (ex virgin) was pretty atrocious as far as music is concerned.
samjmann
14-01-2013, 23:02
It seems that the Tv/audio retailing side is terminal decline. Comet (The shop you never wanted to go in), HMV - we were all waiting for it to happen. Sony centres are now being closed across the country. I've heard that 50% of all electrical retailing is now on-line. What the 'High Street' will look like in ten years - I can't guess.
SJM.
Spectral Morn
14-01-2013, 23:04
I am sad to hear this - just on the local news - but HMV are in part architects of their own demise once they scaled back their music departments (I struggled to find much to buy) and tried to be Dixons/Currys. I feel for the staff losing your job is a terrible thing :(
Luckily Head are back trading in Belfast and I can find plenty to buy in there so I hope they go from strength to strength.
Regards Neil
Spectral Morn
14-01-2013, 23:06
It seems that the Tv/audio retailing side is terminal decline. Comet (The shop you never wanted to go in), HMV - we were all waiting for it to happen. Sony centres are now being closed across the country. I've heard that 50% of all electrical retailing is now on-line. What the 'High Street' will look like in ten years - I can't guess.
SJM.
There won't be one :(
Westyman
14-01-2013, 23:21
They may have changed now, but the Fnac stores in France were/are? different to anything in UK and they had a good music section. However must be years since I went in one; I frequented the one in La Defense quite a few times when I was working around there for a few months. It had a much nicer ambience than any HMV store.
The last fnac store I found was in Ghent! Still quite a long queue over there but they were the only major electronics shop over there.
PPR has been trying to sell fnac for some time now but no buyers. Doesn't bode well.
Floyddroid
15-01-2013, 07:50
I agree with Harry, I personally won't miss HMV. I always found it vastly overpriced and full of trinkets rather than things i wanted. I do feel for the many hard working employees who will now find it hard to find work. The small amount of outlets which may spring up in HMV's demise will in no way be large enough to absorb their workforce.
Yet another huge retail outlet asigned to the history books. Sad for many of us audiophiles because many of us by our very nature are holding onto the past with white knuckes, clinging onto our hifi equipment like a sinking ocean liner in the sea of time. I remember buying my first proper hifi from Comet and look what happened to them? The internet and mobile phones eh? They really f....d us up. What next?:steam:
istari_knight
15-01-2013, 08:00
Can only echo what others have said, certainly unfortunate for the staff but there are plenty of independent music shops around with larger ranges & better prices... I haven't bought anything from HMV in 3 years.
I used to go to HMV in Oxford street every weekend to buy records its part my early memories of getting into music. Times change and they are no longer able to make a profit I will miss them.
http://goldenageofgaia.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/His-Masters-Voice.jpg
RIP HMV :(
Westyman
15-01-2013, 08:08
The last fnac store I found was in Ghent! Still quite a long queue over there but they were the only major electronics shop over there.
PPR has been trying to sell fnac for some time now but no buyers. Doesn't bode well.
Ah yes! I've been to that one too, more recently than the Paris one I mentioned. Thank for update on status. Nothing is more certain than change is there?
The Black Adder
15-01-2013, 08:30
One word... Amazon! - HMV missed the boat because they had their head up their arses... I weep when I see a cd with a HMV price tag of £18.99... I just think how much they profited.
So, from me it's good bloody riddance. It ended up being a bargain bin shop anyway, it stopped being a record shop when they took vinyl out and I never liked it after that.
And hey.. I'm sure the board of directors won't be hard up.
A friend of mine used to work in HMV Sheffield and said that it wasn't about selling music to people, it was about stopping people nicking music.. HMV had the largest percentage of shop lifting and they had 5 - 7 undercover staff in the stores keeping an eye out.
I will say this too... Tesco's have a lot to answer for. For one I NEVER shop there, I would rather pay a little more than go to Tesco's.
I'd rather buy my CD's from the market.
It's the staff that are the most important thing to any business and 'hopefully' have secured positions elsewhere...
It's not as if we didn't predict it. A shame, but HMV died a long time ago when they turned to video and computer 'white goods' (spit). Their recent foray back into vinyl was too little too late, although admirable.
I too lament the demise of the huge Oxford Street store, which I used to frequent a lot when younger. The Classical department really was special.
The Virgin Megastore in Paris has just closed too. A real sign of the times.
The Black Adder
15-01-2013, 09:06
FYI:
HMV has confirmed it will not be accepting gift cards or vouchers from customers as the retailer prepared to collapse into administration.
The company confirmed its intentions following a board meeting last night, as exclusively revealed by Sky's City Editor Mark Kleinman .
In its statement, HMV - which employs 4,350 people - said its 238 stores would remain open while administrators Deloitte sought a buyer.
morris_minor
15-01-2013, 09:10
I too lament the demise of the huge Oxford Street store, which I used to frequent a lot when younger. The Classical department really was special.
I'd have lived in the Classical Dept if they'd have let me; it was an oasis of calm . . .
The High Street will soon be nothing but Pound Shops selling crap and Mobile Phone stores.
The Black Adder
15-01-2013, 09:14
I'd have lived in the Classical Dept if they'd have let me; it was an oasis of calm . . .
The High Street will soon be nothing but Pound Shops selling crap and Mobile Phone stores.
...and Ladies nail bars. They seem to be doing well... apparently.
jollyfix
15-01-2013, 09:32
Yes some prices over the top etc, and yes there is Amazon and the like, but i regularly pop into HMV oxford st on my record shop crawl (soho etc). Some of my most played cds of the past few months were bought at HMV, bought on a whim down stairs in the world music section, for me and i assume many others its the physical looking, i do not get that from buying online.
Wakefield Turntables
15-01-2013, 09:38
Had a browse through this thread with some interest. It is rather stupid of them to charge such high prices and they failed to evolve, consequently they to some extent put themselves in this situation. They do have an online presence and perhaps they can do what dixons did years ago and become purely an online entity. I seriously can't see any people buying Hmv it's just another competitor to eBay and amazon. The company is run utilising a poor business model and is riddled with debt. I don't think the situation looks good at all.. :(
They failed to move with the times and are now history.
Not only are CDs and DVDs dying out, but digital downloads are themselves under threat from streaming companies, such as Spotify, LoveFilm, Netflix etc.
When you've got a fast internet connection (at home and on your mobile) why bother buying, downloading and storing media, when you can stream whatever you like, on demand? Of course, the music and film companies are trying to fight this, but it is the future.
If you buy a Smart TV and a £20 monthly subscription to Netflix and Spotify plus BBC iplayer, you have everything that the average punter could possibly want :eek:
Exciting times...
I guess this means that Fopp will be spun back into a standalone business, or is that at risk too?
Fopp is the only decent high street brand selling records these days. It would be a shame to see it affected too.
Not in my opinion - I found the staff most unhelpful.
why bother buying, downloading and storing media, when you can stream whatever you like, on demand?
Stuff that. I want a physical collection in my house. To look at, browse through and read the booklets.
Streaming is merely a convenience but it won't replace proper media for me.
It's not as if we didn't predict it. A shame, but HMV died a long time ago when they turned to video and computer 'white goods' (spit). Their recent foray back into vinyl was too little too late, although admirable.
I too lament the demise of the huge Oxford Street store, which I used to frequent a lot when younger. The Classical department really was special.
The Virgin Megastore in Paris has just closed too. A real sign of the times.
HMV in Oxford street was one of the worse! They never accepted LPs returned due to poor pressing without quibbling or argument.
HMV haven't improved. Soon as they are gone the better.
We are not terribly far away from the world Ray Bradbury describes in his short story, The Pedestrian... :eyebrows:
freefallrob
15-01-2013, 12:25
A feel sorry for the people that work there, but I never have liked HMV stores I'm afraid, generally quite expensive, difficult to find what you want and I don't like the 'feel' of the shops.
The Black Adder
15-01-2013, 12:41
They were just boring... Supposed to be in the entertainment business but just didn't bring it off.
Racks upon racks of plastic boxes. SALE! plastered on every spare inch of anything.. Screwfix was more entertaining.
We are not terribly far away from the world Ray Bradbury describes in his short story, The Pedestrian... :eyebrows:
Just read it...
...great stuff Dave, and a scarily accurate picture of the present future.
Unfortunately, it didn't predict the travesty that was Adele's "21" album overtaking DSOM as the best selling album of all time though :lol:
Cheers,
No, Bradbury came up a bit short on that one... :D
.
Richard which Bristol Store did you visit? - The one at Cribbs Causeway (ex virgin) was pretty atrocious as far as music is concerned.
It was the one on College Green, opposite the Cathederal. Dont get me wrong I'm not saying it was fantastic (and I dont buy vinyl so never looked) but it was better than the HMV we have in Newcastle by a long stretch. Classic CD albums were under a 5er and I got two reasonably new release CDs for £9.
Newcastle still has a few independent shops and decent second hand places so its not much of a loss. I for one have only bought a handful of new CDs in the last 12 months with my money going towards buying second hand CDs on ebay and browsing charity shops. I like that my music buying often supports good causes, is within the law (i think:scratch:) and allows me to build a large collection for very little money. On the download side I pay a sub to a premium streaming site and have a membership to an audiophile download club so I'm still 'investing' in artists and labels (the issue of how much streaming sites pay artists is contentious I know but not my fault).
I'll sorely miss going in on Monday for new releases. I have only one independent store nearby and since well before Xmas it's been shite. HMV did overprice and did sometimes not even stock new releases which made me angry. However it is the last man standing and by the end of the week will be dead.
Haselsh1
15-01-2013, 14:35
If you buy a Smart TV and a £20 monthly subscription to Netflix and Spotify plus BBC iplayer, you have everything that the average punter could possibly want :eek:
Exciting times...
If I were to put twenty pounds a month into anything, it would be a new piece of vinyl from Diverse. I am not interested in putting my precious money into anything that is not 'real' and merely 'virtual'.
Haselsh1
15-01-2013, 14:37
I agree.
Kind of ironic that i reckon all cd type shops will go yet the small vinyl shops may prosper.
I so hope so. That would be near heaven.
Any type of business on the high street needs to add value that the online shops cannot offer I.e. expertise, advice, guarantees, speciallist products etc. More of a personal service.
As far as I can see, HMV offered no added value over and above the online boys, but charged more for the "experience". Guaranteed failure...
Is it realistic to expect a high street retailer to match internet prices when their overheads are far higher?
tommy6206
15-01-2013, 16:42
Why if they are open as usual are they not be accepting gift cards or vouchers from customers.And I bet there are many as loads will have been given as Christmas gifts.Robing bastards if you ask me and deserve to go to the wall
Is it realistic to expect a high street retailer to match internet prices when their overheads are far higher?
No, that is why they need to offer that intangible quality like expertise and enthusiasm, which some HMV staff had at one time. You could ask a lad of 20 about Gram Parsons and expect at least a working knowledge, main albums produced etc.
When living near to Witney, I used to spend my hard earned in Rapture records, who were enthusiastic, knowledgeable, and able to suggest alternatives to expand the musical taste. They are very good, even started selling Pro-Ject TTs for a reasonable price 9just as a trial run when I was last there).
I will keep mentioning them on the off chance that at least one other person spends a few quid there, they are a pound or two more expensive than HMV were, but deserve the chance to thrive and even expand.
Alan Sircom
15-01-2013, 18:07
Why if they are open as usual are they not be accepting gift cards or vouchers from customers.And I bet there are many as loads will have been given as Christmas gifts.Robing bastards if you ask me and deserve to go to the wall
Because the voucher was a transaction performed prior to calling in the administrators, making the voucher holder effectively a creditor of the former company. What is trading now is a different company; it's the administrators attempting to keep the company in semi-working order in the hope of a rescue plan. If no such plan emerges, the stores close, the live stock is returned to one set of creditors and the rest of the creditors are paid through sales of assets. If there are enough assets in the company when it goes into liquidation, those gift cards or vouchers will be refunded to creditors. However, as an unsecured creditor, don't hold your breath.
If it's any consolation, I had amassed £40 worth of vouchers from transactions on my HMV loyalty card, which HMV finally transferred over to my card last week while I was in Nevada. The chances of me getting those are practically zero.
My best hope is that there is some kind of rescue plan and a stripped down HMV reappears, which will then honour the vouchers. Unlikely, but not impossible.
Techno Commander
15-01-2013, 18:09
What the 'High Street' will look like in ten years - I can't guess.
SJM.
http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4145/4982055932_22b64c6fdb_z.jpg
Alan Sircom
15-01-2013, 18:17
No, that is why they need to offer that intangible quality like expertise and enthusiasm, which some HMV staff had at one time. You could ask a lad of 20 about Gram Parsons and expect at least a working knowledge, main albums produced etc.
When living near to Witney, I used to spend my hard earned in Rapture records, who were enthusiastic, knowledgeable, and able to suggest alternatives to expand the musical taste. They are very good, even started selling Pro-Ject TTs for a reasonable price 9just as a trial run when I was last there).
I will keep mentioning them on the off chance that at least one other person spends a few quid there, they are a pound or two more expensive than HMV were, but deserve the chance to thrive and even expand.
Unfortunately for HMV, that's also what the internet is for today. If you are browsing for music in a store, you might ask the experts. If you are browsing iTunes, you can get user, music biz reviews and a Wiki page at the same time.
As the active music buyers in their teens and 20s mostly moved from CD to Napster to iTunes to MySpace to Spotify and now to YouTube over the last 15 years, HMV increasingly had no place left to go in music.
The end was staved off by DVD and Blu-ray sales, but Netflix is taking care of that sector of the market now, and that's caused sales of discs and players alike to tumble. Even games are no longer the force to be reckoned with, especially as people move to App-based gaming and Amazon to buy physical discs.
HMV basically ran out of road.
Hi Alan,
Good to see you popping in again. Hope you're not too knackered with all that jetting around the world you've been doing recently!
Anyway, if you haven't read this thread yet, you should:
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=23034
Your thoughts on the constructive criticism, therein, aimed at your magazine would be welcome :)
Marco.
Thing Fish
15-01-2013, 19:31
HMV in Oxford street was open for business as usual as of 18:00 this evening when I walked past going to work.
The staff weren't crying and looked happy enough...:)
The Black Adder
15-01-2013, 19:35
Just watched C4 news... Don't you just hate people saying 'physical product is dead' - It just isn't... Sure Downloads are big but there will always be a decent percentage who would like something to hold. Marketing physical product is expensive for sure but it certainly isn't dead.
Anyways, It looks like they are going to try and come back with a 'leaner' retail experience. C4 News then cut to Rough Trade to which I can imagine HMV copying.
If they do come back I wish they would change their street sinage, the singular HMV logo is utter cack!
According to the BBC the CEO of HMV is very confident a buyer will be forthcoming. It may all be bluster of course, but judging by the big cheesy grin on his face I'd say he is a man who has something in the bag already...
?... judging by the big cheesy grin on his face I'd say he is a man who has something in the bag already...
Probably thinking about his golden 'reward for failure' handshake and how he's going to spend it...:eyebrows:
DanJennings
15-01-2013, 19:54
I still can't believe they recently told all staff they would have to cut long hair and cover up tattoos!
What do a large majority of young serious music fans look like? Hmmmm.
Bad for the 'corporate image' maybe, that worked well for them.
The Black Adder
16-01-2013, 11:15
I still can't believe they recently told all staff they would have to cut long hair and cover up tattoos!
What do a large majority of young serious music fans look like? Hmmmm.
Bad for the 'corporate image' maybe, that worked well for them.
Yeah but some of the kids in HMV just looked like they wanted to go home rather than help. And with that and an untidy appearance it would only rub people up the wrong way.
Nothing worse than getting grunted at and seeing Biro marks on their hands if you ask me. You feel like asking for his dad rather than where is the Blueray section is.
Mr Kipling
16-01-2013, 12:28
I haven't read all that's been posted, but the simple fact is people aren't buying music the way they used to. 15 years ago cd albums sales we about 162 million. Last year, even taking into account illegal and legal downlnads, the figure was less than half that. The only growth area in music entainment is in live events.
There are two types of companies, quick ones (quick to change and adapt) and dead ones.
Guess what type HMV and Jessops are?
Alan Sircom
16-01-2013, 13:12
I haven't read all that's been posted, but the simple fact is people aren't buying music the way they used to. 15 years ago cd albums sales we about 162 million. Last year, even taking into account illegal and legal downlnads, the figure was less than half that. The only growth area in music entainment is in live events.
Agreed... but HMV Group also owned the MAMA Group until the end of last year. That included the Mean Fiddler group, The Forum in Kentish Town and the Apollo in Hammersmith, a couple of club chains, Heaven, and more than 100 acts internationally.
So it also had the live events part of the business on its books too.
While the situation is dreadful both for the staff and for physical music sales in general, I reckon the words 'piss up' and 'brewery' need to be rolled out here.
The worry is what it does for physical sales of music. The UK is already something of an exception in the West. Our sales of CD in particular are still far stronger than most other countries. As we learned from the demise of Woolworths (and with it Entertainment UK and a as a consequence Zavvi), those CD and DVD sales lost with the group just didn't come back, and sales of physical media dropped 15% in a month... and stayed there. HMV currently sells around 30% of physical media in the UK and close to 15% of LP sales. Some of this will go to Amazon, some more to specialists, but many will simply sleepwalk into iTunes.
iTunes ... The spawn of the devil. "I hates it my precious..." :eyebrows:
Blockbusters have gone into administration today...
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