Power amp for Croft Micro 25

[Canetoad]

Hi guys,

I've just sourced a Croft Micro 25 preamp (thanks Darren - Kininigan) and was wondering (besides the obvious of a Croft) what power amps would work well with the Croft? My preference is for solid state at the moment and 2nd hand, which seems to be better value for money these days.

In the interum I'm going to use the power amp module in my NAD C372 integrated amp. I haven't connected it all up but will get to it tomorrow. If it works well I might try and pick up an NAD C270 or C272 power amp, which is basically the same circuit as the 372 (272) without the preamp.

[DSJR]

Anything you like guv'nor, as long as the input impedance isn't silly low (10K?) and you stick to sensible-length interconnects (not several metres to remote amps) with low capacitance at least.. My particular Croft preamp was never happy driving the ATC SCM20ASL Pro's, sounding a bit too vsalvey and soft I remember.....

I've used with my old 4PP, Glenn rebuilt Quad II's, Quad 303 (before and after sensitivity change), 405-2, 606, Crown D series, Amptastic Mini-T (which showed a slight blurring in my Croft, now minimised after the valve regulator change) and currently, a pensioned off HH VX300, which is startklingly good, inline electrolytics and all :

P.S. In my visits to hifi dave, we've also used the lovely Albarry mono's with his demo 25, a Leak Stereo 20 (cheeky little beggar, this one :lol:), the aforementioned Quad II's and 303 and had loads of fun one memorable afternoon with a 25 driving a Crown DC300A and into Harbeth 40.1's (you cannot beat a BIGGER SPEAKER - what a shame most of us can't enjoy the thrill.....)

[kininigin]

Hi Bernie,

I've changed my mind,give it back :lol: Glad it got to you in one piece :)

Just remember,to connect the Nad power section to the rca's labeled out,rather than the line out's.

Hope you enjoy it,i'm sure you will ;)

[worrasf]

I used a Quad 303 with my previous Croft Vitale with good results. But I guess most power amps will be happy.

I note your thread but unless you have a really good reason for not getting a Croft power amp I suggest you try to get a listen to one or two before parting with your hard earned dollar. Personally, I think the S4s is just brilliant (I would wouldnt I) especially now I'm running KT120's.

Steve

[DSJR]

Any Croft power amp will be a good few hundred notes I think, since they don't come up very often and get snapped up when they do - one excellent reason why I'm DELIGHTED to recommend Glenns products most vociferously! A Quad 303 in good order can still be got for not too much dosh and, if properly fettled, it will give a most delightful if "comfortable" sound balance into most reasonable speakers. Watch absolute phase though for best audible results.

[Macca]

Will the power amp drive your speakers? - that is by far the more important consideration IMO.

[Canetoad]

Hi Bernie,

I've changed my mind,give it back :lol: Glad it got to you in one piece :)

Just remember,to connect the Nad power section to the rca's labeled out,rather than the line out's.

Hope you enjoy it,i'm sure you will ;)

Don't think I could part with it. :lol:

I must admit one of the main reasons I wanted to get one was for the phono stage. Looking forward to listening to some music over the weekend.

[Elephantears]

I would reject the any power amp you like idea. For instance I just don't agree with Dave's idea that they work well with Albarry mono blocks. I have tried this and it is simply not a great match; you lose the benefits of both parties. Much better with any Croft power amp. I really think you are unlikely to hear how good the Croft pre is until you hear it in this context. Also beware of using a very sensitive amp like a Leak 20 unless you are comfortable with very high gain. I'm not saying that from personal experience but from reading about someone else's experience recently. All very contextual as ever.

[hifi_dave]

No problem using Croft pres with Albarry - I've been selling such combos for many years. As for "very high gain" with the Stereo 20 - Croft pres can be ordered with lower gain. Once again, I've lost count of the number of Croft pres sold with or for use with Leak amps.

[kininigin]

The 25 i sold Bernie,is currently fitted with 5751 valves,so the gain has been reduced abit already!

[The Black Adder]

If it's transistor I bet a Karan would sound nice with it... But they are quite a bit.

[DSJR]

I would reject the any power amp you like idea. For instance I just don't agree with Dave's idea that they work well with Albarry mono blocks. I have tried this and it is simply not a great match; you lose the benefits of both parties. Much better with any Croft power amp. I really think you are unlikely to hear how good the Croft pre is until you hear it in this context. Also beware of using a very sensitive amp like a Leak 20 unless you are comfortable with very high gain. I'm not saying that from personal experience but from reading about someone else's experience recently. All very contextual as ever.

Well, I disagree! The Albarry amps are extremely dry and controlled sonically. Add their preamp (up to recently anyway) and all the air and space evaporates, the sound being so tightly held the music fails to "breathe" - IMO. Used with a Croft 25R, the Albarry power amps retain their excellent sense of grip, but regain the air and space and tunefulness that's otherwise missing - in my opinion after listening for an hour or three. The Croft Series 7 in comparison is brighter, "looser" in feel and possibly a touch more diffused depending on speakers used..

We've used a serviced Stereo 20 several times with the 25 and 25R with no volume difficulties, nor hum and noise. I admit the Leak could have had its input gain adjusted (as is best with Quad 303's and 405's these days), but it works a treat for me anyway. I don't think Dave has changed his demo preamps recently, but there seemed to be plenty of volume control, although the control "law" is like everyone elses - two thirds gain adjustment in the first third to half the control range.

Croft preamps are very quiet on the whole, the distortion and signal/noise being up to most solid state products here. The output impedance is low enough for all but the most demanding situations these days (and the phono stage is now all but immune to loading on the record output which mine isn't as yet).

Seriously, give the combo a try. If you don't like the sound, then at least you can say you don't like it from personal experience :lol: And hearing it for yourself is always better than reading what idiots like me say online...

I do still maintain that the current range of Glenn's preamps can be readily used with most power amps out there. Whether you'd want to is of course, another matter and this is where personal tastes come in of course. I have to say that the look and feel of the Albarry preamp is first class and I think the internal build ain't bad either, so if the latest tweaks have allowed the music source to "breathe" as it should, then more power to Neil IMO :)

[Canetoad]

I was listening to the new preamp today and my Bushmaster DAC seems to have packed it in. :steam:

The sounds coming from the Croft up to that point were very nice indeed. :eyebrows:

[Elephantears]

Seriously, give the combo a try. If you don't like the sound, then at least you can say you don't like it from personal experience :lol: And hearing it for yourself is always better than reading what idiots like me say online...

Dave you've not read my posts. I have a pair of Albarry M608's. I've got two different Croft Pre-amps, one is a Micro 25 and the other is a unique modded one that is similar to a 25R. I bought the Albarry's hoping that they would work well with a Croft pre but they simply don't match well - the sound is just too thin. What you call open and spacious is in this case simply a lack of body, and there is no reason why a listener should accept this mismatch since both Croft and Albarry amps by themselves excel in having depth, body, and tone.

I accept you've heard this combination, but I've heard it at home a good few times so I'd urge you to try it again and compare with other options. All my listening has been with Harbeth C7's. There is nothing thin about the sound coming from my sources I can promise.

As I made clear in my post, what I said about the Albarry's is from personal experience. As I also made clear, what I said about gain with the LK20 was NOT from my experience, just what I heard from one case, so I withdraw that comment.

The Albarry's work better with an Albarry passive pre than with the Crofts, and they work considerably better with my Audio Synthesis DAX Discrete used as pre, but I still haven't found the ideal. With my Unison Research Unico Pre there is too much gain, although I do hear a tantalising sense of what the Albarry's could do. Certainly no lack of body there.

I can't afford the AP11, and have no way of hearing one without buying it. Your comments about the AP11 put me off initially, so I would urge you to double check and listen to a properly warmed up combination again before you reiterate the criticism.

[DSJR]

Thin, THIN??????? Compact 7's are hardly lacking in warmth and mid bass "fruit," especially the current ones, which I don't like overmuch (the M30.1's are in a different league for me, but that's taste for you :))

I have to offer some defence and this time politely suggest that the current Croft preamps are generally accurate mirrors of the input signal, any slight abberation (and it is ONLY very very slight) being tamed by tube rolling and maybe a better version (25 to R and R to RS). All I can do here is beg to differ and still urge the OP to try the combo if he can. As has been suggested to me, the tweaks to the Albarry preamp may make all this null and void anyway.

Just for the record, we also used MG HD1000 interconnects as well as Dave's usual custom star-quad jobbies. The MG cables were ever so slightly "sparklier" but not so much different I could reliably tell them blind. Things have moved on now and one would normally use the likes of the MG HD2000's with a setup like this. If you fancy some DIY, get some Klotz AC110 wires from Studiospares and some suitable plugs and make a set up. I'm convinced the sound changed on mine after a few weeks use and the over-damped sonics opened up nicely after this. Cheap enough if you can make your own anyway...

Since you have the Croft preamps now, may I suggest some tube rolling? Glenn told me in an email he still likes Mullards, which have a warmer tone I think than the valves he supplies. Not sure when I'll be venturing over Dave's way (probably the Christmas hols if that's ok with Alex), but I promise to get this combo going again to confirm both our viewpoints. happy to apologise if I've shot my mouth off yet again - gulp-.....

[Elephantears]

I have tube rolled with interesting results. I love Croft pre-amps and hope to always have one (or two) in my house for the rest of my years. They sound great with all the Croft power amps I've tried, and I'm sure there are plenty of other power amps they will suit nicely, but sorry, not the Albarrys if you want to get the best from both parties.

The one time I heard a decent match of this kind was with a 25RS and the Albarry's and a pair of Auidonote ANJ's. That was pretty good.

[Canetoad]

I'm currently listening to it as delivered from Darren (Kininigin) with a set of JAN GE 5751's in it. I have it playing through the power amp stage of my NAD C372 using an MG HD1000 cable.

Dave, I have a Klotz cable using Neutrik profi plugs around somewhere. I might try that at some point.I would also like to fit a set of Eichman silver bullets to the MG cable and try that.

Initial impressions? Well, I can honestly say it's the best I've ever heard my system sound! The bass is just so deep and tight with the Croft! I had a problem with boom in my system. I tried to solve it by placing granite chopping boards under the speakers (suspended floor covered with carpet) but, while this tightened up the bass, it made the mids a bit shouty. I thought the problem was with the speakers but with the Croft a lot of it has disappeared now.

I also love what the Croft does with piano and acoustic guitar. Wow! So much detail and yet the music is still so fluid. I'm not very good at describing what I hear but the best way I can put it is the Croft reproduces the music just like any other pre but it somehow manages to add emotion to it, which brings the sound to a whole new level for me!

Of course, now I have a real dilemma. I want more! I'm still not sure what to do about a power amp so I'll continue using the NAD and relistening to my music collection and contemplate what to replace it with.

I can't wait to get my turntable back into my system and listen to some vinyl through the Croft phono stage. :)

[kininigin]

Glad you are enjoying it bernie!!

What tt do you have and what speakers are you using,if you don't mind me asking?

Have you got your bushmaster working?

[Canetoad]

I have an SL-1210 and a Pioneer PL-71.

The speakers are an MTM style kit using Vifa drivers I built back in '98. I still have to update the crossovers in them, which should bring further improvements.

I'm sending the Bushmaster off to Stan for a checkup. I'm spoilt for choice, I'm currently using an AN DAC Zero, which does seem to go well with the Croft. :)

[DSJR]

I have no idea on this, but gut instinct tells me that a copper based cable such as the MG one, really ought to have copper based plugs on the end (?) I'm really not sure about all these different materials being used, but since I'm not an engineer, I don't know what kind of electrical situations are created with silver plating vs. solid silver terminating cartridges and speakers with hundreds of feet of annealed? COPPER wire.. I know some people love to play around and try these things, as I once did, but I prefer the easy route these days..

[kininigin]

I have an SL-1210 and a Pioneer PL-71.

The speakers are an MTM style kit using Vifa drivers I built back in '98. I still have to update the crossovers in them, which should bring further improvements.

I'm sending the Bushmaster off to Stan for a checkup. I'm spoilt for choice, I'm currently using an AN DAC Zero, which does seem to go well with the Croft. :)

Ahh nice :)

I don't know if your technics is modded or not,but when i went from the standard upto where i am now,the croft kept on amazing me with its abilitys.Just when you think you've heard what it can do,it gives you a little wink and says there's more yet.

I don't half talk bollocks sometimes :lol:

[Canetoad]

MN bearing, home brew external PSU with Paul Hynes regulator, Isonoes. Still need to fit the Jelco 750 tonearm and Yannis 223.5 cable. I've been spending too much time tinkering with the speakers in the bedroom system to get it sorted and back into my main system. :doh:

[kininigin]

MN bearing, home brew external PSU with Paul Hynes regulator, Isonoes. Still need to fit the Jelco 750 tonearm and Yannis 223.5 cable. I've been spending too much time tinkering with the speakers in the bedroom system to get it sorted and back into my main system. :doh:

There's always something :D

I've only been without a tt and the croft for a week or so and it's driving me mad already :lol: Especially since just getting the MNB!!

[Canetoad]

I've just sent my Croft away to Glenn for an upgrade to R spec. I be waiting for a couple of weeks for it to return. :doh:

Sold off a few bits and pieces I had round the place to fund the upgrade. NAD amp was one of the items to go. I replaced it with a Sony TA-N55ES power amp, which sounds rather nice with the Croft. Slightly on the darker side of neutral is how I would describe it.

[Reffc]

I use a Croft micro25 with my VAC amps (PA60 monoblocks) and it's a superb match. I had Glenn reduce the gain on the Croft pre and many will find that the trend for high input sensitivity on most of today's power amps may require some lessening of preamp gain to get a more useful spread of volume control.

The other thing that can be an issue (I have had several croft preamp owners contact me requesting assistance with system issues created by earth loops which were traced back to the preamp) is that the Croft pre does not come as standard with an earth lift circuit (although the Croft power amps do) and this seems to have been the cause of a few "humming" systems. Again, easily rectified and I know that Glenn can carry out this work very cheaply if needed. Croft preamps are not alone in this respect as many preamps are missing an earth lift which is a very handy little circuit if your system is prone to earth loops.

I have to say that the current crop of Croft Micro25 preamps are my favourite preamps. You do have to spend seriously silly money to better them, and seen in that light, they are something of a bargain IMHO.

In terms of cabling, I have to differ with some of the advice that has been given in previous posts. You can make the pre to power amp cables fairly long as long as the capacitance isn't earth shatteringly high. Most screened coax ICs are between 65 and 80pF/m and you could happily run 4m lengths with no serious issues at all. Screened cables are highly recommended over unscreened cables and use good quality connectors. You don't need to worry about the materials used for the connectors and cables being different either. That doesn't matter much as long as they are good quality and well designed/made.

[Covenant]

Is upgrading to R spec cheaper than replacing the standard unit?

[DSJR]

Is upgrading to R spec cheaper than replacing the standard unit?

I think it costs the same, so no fiscal benefit in buying a cheaper one and paying less for the upgrade later...

Re screened cable capacitance - paul, are you sure that it's correct that many/most cables are "only" 60 - 80pF/m? I thought the average was double this or more, but obviously I don't have your experience here and I don't have a means of measuring this for myself either..

[Reffc]

I think it costs the same, so no fiscal benefit in buying a cheaper one and paying less for the upgrade later...

Re screened cable capacitance - paul, are you sure that it's correct that many/most cables are "only" 60 - 80pF/m? I thought the average was double this or more, but obviously I don't have your experience here and I don't have a means of measuring this for myself either..

Quite sure David. Most standard type coax cables (75 Ohm) which are about 6.5mm O/D by geometry should be between 65 and 80pF/m.

Twin core cables are higher capacitance, as they have capacitance between cores as well as between core and shield bringing the total to around £120 to 140pf/m for the typical balanced cable.

Litz type constructions of unshielded woven type cables are much higher, the total capacitance depending on core diameter, spacing and number of cores, but I've seen 5 braid litz cables which are upwards of 250pF/m!

[DSJR]

Thanks for the info, shall log it away safely :)

I think I'm on the right lines here in saying that longer interconnect runs from a Croft preamp will be even more effective if the power amp has around 47K input impedance or more, although mine drives a 1m run into 15 - 20k with seemingly little difficulty - it definitely didn't like 7m into active ATC's at 10 - 20k, going all soft and squishy I remember, but maybe the R or RS will cope better here?.

[Reffc]

Thanks for the info, shall log it away safely :)

I think I'm on the right lines here in saying that longer interconnect runs from a Croft preamp will be even more effective if the power amp has around 47K input impedance or more, although mine drives a 1m run into 15 - 20k with seemingly little difficulty - it definitely didn't like 7m into active ATC's at 10 - 20k, going all soft and squishy I remember, but maybe the R or RS will cope better here?.

You are David.

Generally, a power amp's input impedance needs to be at least 10 times the output impedance of the preamp if you're not to suffer roll-off and difficulty driving the signal properly. I would suggest that an input impedance of 10 to 20KOhms is pretty low really and longer IC lengths combined with either high output impedance from a preamp OR low input impedance for a power amp OR both will mean trouble, and any IC in the path will simply act as a low pass filter.

The Croft Micro25 has a specified output impedance lower than 300 Ohms so it should be fined into a load of 3KOhms in theory, but in practice you need to go much higher to account for cables/connections and other circuit/frequency related oddities. To be safe, I would have said 20KOhms or higher was fine. The Croft power amps have a very high input impedance of 470KOhms so you could run interconnects between pre and power of 10m if you wanted and without any low pass issues providing a sensible cable geometry was used. I'm unsure if the output impedance from the "R" is any different to the standard amp, and if not, then in theory, exactly the same issues apply.

[Jimbo]

Any Croft power amp will be a good few hundred notes I think, since they don't come up very often and get snapped up when they do - one excellent reason why I'm DELIGHTED to recommend Glenns products most vociferously! A Quad 303 in good order can still be got for not too much dosh and, if properly fettled, it will give a most delightful if "comfortable" sound balance into most reasonable speakers. Watch absolute phase though for best audible results.


I have used Croft 25R pre with both Quad 606 and Croft series 7 power amp and it works great with both. The Quad is a more laid back amp whilst if you partner it with a croft power amp you will get a more dynamic live sound, slightly more transparent.

[Bluedroog]

I use my 25 with a Quad 909 and am very happy with the results. As some have mentioned I needed the gain reduced but once I did wow, the bass I get now has so much authority without feeling bloated.

Someone mentioned the pleasure they get from acoustic guitars and pianos and I have to agree.

There is a track called Chuck E's in Love by Rickie Lee Jones which sounds superb through the Croft. Also try Leonard Cohen's Old Ideas which is so well recored and sounds immense. His voice has so much texture.

[Canetoad]

Is upgrading to R spec cheaper than replacing the standard unit?

R spec is £1400, which is £700 more than the the standard Micro 25. Glenn quoted me £500 for the upgrade so it's definitely value for money if you already have one!

[walpurgis]

The Croft works well with solid state power amps.

I tried one for a short while and found it a bit too much of a good thing with my valve power amps. But its soft nature allows it to combat the often harder presentation of transistor amps producing a nice compromise.

As has been suggested, probably any one of the post model 2 Quads would sound good. Just pick one with your power output requirement.

[trio leo]

I can understand DSJR saying the Albarry didn't "breathe", I suspect that was with the original AP11.
I had the original and I thought it was as good as many pre-amps I had heard but TBH it wasn't a fantastic pre-amp,
however it has recently been upgraded with several modifications and now I find it is absolutely superb, everything has opened up and relaxed but still retaining an articulate control of the music.

IMO the Albarry M608's are a stunning amplifier and fantastic vfm, if HiFi Dave says they work well with the Croft pre-amp then I believe him, he knows what he is doing.
I don't understand why Elephantears is getting an unsatsfactory result with similar equipment, that must be frustrating.
I haven't heard any Croft amplifiers, but many here speak highly of them.

I hope you find a good result

enjoy your music

regards Al

[kininigin]

I've just sent my Croft away to Glenn for an upgrade to R spec. I be waiting for a couple of weeks for it to return. :doh:


So was the upgrade to the 'R' spec worth the outlay in your eyes? What improvements did you hear?

When i get back from france,i will need a new pre,so the Micro 25 is the obvious choice for me.I'm just not sure whether saving for the 'R' version is the best move for me,as i'll be back out in france at christmas!

This will give me limited time to save up,but if it's a case of 'do it,you will not regret it' then i might just bite the bullet :D

[DSJR]

I can understand DSJR saying the Albarry didn't "breathe", I suspect that was with the original AP11.
I had the original and I thought it was as good as many pre-amps I had heard but TBH it wasn't a fantastic pre-amp,
however it has recently been upgraded with several modifications and now I find it is absolutely superb, everything has opened up and relaxed but still retaining an articulate control of the music.

enjoy your music

regards Al

I'm so glad Neil has tweaked the preamp so well and very much look forward to hearing it again in new form.

I have also heard good things from the Croft/Albarry combo, but again, it's a personal thing. The Albarry preamp has always looked well made and it does have a different operational vibe to it. I still think that emotions as well as sonics come into it when expensive stereo kit is considered and the Albarry pre and power do look distinctive yet subtle with it. It's such a shame that the prices are so high these days, since this deprives the UK market of sales and many music lovers of the pleasure these products give...

[Canetoad]

So was the upgrade to the 'R' spec worth the outlay in your eyes? What improvements did you hear?

When i get back from france,i will need a new pre,so the Micro 25 is the obvious choice for me.I'm just not sure whether saving for the 'R' version is the best move for me,as i'll be back out in france at christmas!

This will give me limited time to save up,but if it's a case of 'do it,you will not regret it' then i might just bite the bullet :D

Can't say yet Darren. I'm in Germany till tomorrow. I told Glenn not to sent it back till after that. Still have to pay for it yet. :lol:

[kininigin]

Can't say yet Darren. I'm in Germany till tomorrow. I told Glenn not to sent it back till after that. Still have to pay for it yet. :lol:

Ahh right.Looks like i've got a bit of a wait then :lol:

[Thing Fish]

R spec is £1400, which is £700 more than the the standard Micro 25. Glenn quoted me £500 for the upgrade so it's definitely value for money if you already have one!

I'll be interested to hear the results of this upgrade as well Bernie as I also have a Micro 25.

Please keep us posted when you do get the time to hook it up...:)

[Elephantears]

IMO the Albarry M608's are a stunning amplifier and fantastic vfm, if HiFi Dave says they work well with the Croft pre-amp then I believe him, he knows what he is doing.
I don't understand why Elephantears is getting an unsatsfactory result with similar equipment, that must be frustrating.
I haven't heard any Croft amplifiers, but many here speak highly of them.


I always speak very highly of Croft amplifiers, and I speak very highly of Albarry power amplifiers. I still haven't hear the pre-amp.

I actually tried the Croft/ Albarry combination again recently - after moving house I set up my Croft modded Tekni-fi pre with the M608s. It sounded really good; tonally beautiful and very clear. The only problem was that I was getting very little gain from my DAX Discrete, which only puts out 1.5V. With my vinyl source I didn't have such a problem because my phono stage has about 70dB of gain.
Nevertheless there was something very sweet about the combination and I wondered if on my initial tests with this combination I might have been listening out of phase, or doing something else wrong. I also wondered if it was simply the huge difference a room makes. However, I ultimately felt that the lack of gain was resulting in a lack of dynamics, and that whilst very sweet in some ways, the combination was not going to be workable in the long run. I enquired about whether the pre could be tweeked but I was told that ultimately no Croft pre-amp is going to be able to properly control the Albarry's because they have such a low input impedance.

So to conclude, the match can have many good qualities, and will be great on certain types of music, but there are technical limits which will become apparent with more large scale dynamic music. Of course you should trust DSJR's judgement, but remember that he has just had a listening session with this combination, with no doubt a limited musical selection, whereas I have lived with them.

What is apparent to me from trying various combinations is that the Albarry's could be quite fantastic in the right combination, which is why I've held on to them. I hope I'll be able to hear such a combination at some point in the future, but I'm not sure how.

[Elephantears]

To go back to Croft power amps; I would recommend a late Series 5 to anyone with efficient speakers. Beautiful amp. I'm currently running a Series 7 in my second system with a Telefunken ECC83 and it sounds superb. Another one I'd really recommend is a one-off that Adrian Parsons (Audioflair) has for sale; an old Luxman 3600 that has been Croft modded to use EL34's. With a straightforward Micro 25 this sounded stunningly good - no need for the regulation in the pre with this one.

[DSJR]

Echo the late Series 5, as it has the magic of the Quad II's but the more modern design allows more usable power into modern speaker designs. To be honest, a brand new WARRANTED Series 7 isn't hugely more than twenty year old 5's fetch these days.

I'll also suggest the loading thing may ultimately effect use of low-input-impedance amps with the more basic Croft preamps at least. The interconnects we used were a metre long tops, the internals a star-quad configuration, outer screen connected at one end.

[Elephantears]

I'll also suggest the loading thing may ultimately effect use of low-input-impedance amps with the more basic Croft preamps at least. The interconnects we used were a metre long tops, the internals a star-quad configuration, outer screen connected at one end.

I used Van den Hul the Seconds between the Croft pre and the Albarrys; shielded, half a meter long. The Croft/Teknifi pre I used is far from a basic Croft. Glenn rates it above a 25R.

[DSJR]

I obviously don't know your version of the Croft product any more than I know Marco's heavily tuned one. I was just trying to make sense of commercially available products..

[Elephantears]

I have a standard Micro 25 too and have tried that. The Tekni-fi Pre was rebuilt by Glenn so has the same properties as his pre-amps.

[Canetoad]

Ooh! Just received an e-mail from Glenn and my updated pre will be sent on Monday. :eek: :cool:

[DSJR]

:worthless:

[Canetoad]

You mean I have to waste time taking a photo before I can connect it back in the system and start listening? :(

[DSJR]

Oh absolutely :lol: Also you can take some while it's warming up.....

[jon1]

You mean I have to waste time taking a photo before I can connect it back in the system and start listening? :(



Yes&yes;)



jon

[Canetoad]

Received the Micro 25 "R" back yesterday afternoon. Just running it in currently.

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[dgolh]

Hi Bernie,

did it come back with Ediwan in place of JJ ?

[Canetoad]

No, the JJ label is on the underside. :) Checked that myself.

[dgolh]

I've just made the jump for a 25RS after 9 months with a 25R.

Not the quieter units of their kind but very nice sound with perhaps some "additional air" for the 25RS.

The 25R is pretty good anyway, enjoy it !!!:mex:

[DSJR]

I've just made the jump for a 25RS after 9 months with a 25R.

Not the quieter units of their kind but very nice sound with perhaps some "additional air" for the 25RS.

The 25R is pretty good anyway, enjoy it !!!:mex:

Exactly :) :cool: